I don't think there is anything wrong with your recipe, I'd disagree
with the previous poster about reducing the oil, but that is strictly a
matter of taste.

If the dough is too sticky knead in more flour. Because flours vary a
lot in their exact composition and moisture content (the same lot of
flour will vary a little with seasonal changes in humidity) you need to
do this by feel rather than by a strict recipe. It's usually most
convenient to set the moisture content and then knead flour in until it
feels right. I think pizza dough should be on the wet side--flour your
hands and board to keep from sticking too much.

When it is too elastic let it rest, per the other response. You want to
be gentle when pulling the dough out into shape. I thought tossing was
only in the cartoons--seems like a hard way to go about it :-).

Roger


Sridhar Sathya wrote:
> When I make pizza dough it raises well, around double the size in about
> 45 minutes. The problem with my dough is it is too gooie and I'm not
> able to toss it. Even when I try to knead it it is too elastic and
> shrinks as I knead the dough.
>
>
> I follow the following recipe (I use a bread machine for making the dough).
> 1 tablespoon sugar
> 1 1/4 cup water
> 1 teaspoon yeast
> 3 cups bread flour
> 1 teaspoon salt
> 1/4 cup oil.
>
>
> Any suggestions?

On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 16:54:50 -0500
Sridhar Sathya > wrote:

> When I make pizza dough it raises well, around double the size in about
> 45 minutes. The problem with my dough is it is too gooie and I'm not
> able to toss it. Even when I try to knead it it is too elastic and
> shrinks as I knead the dough.
>
>
> I follow the following recipe (I use a bread machine for making the
> dough). 1 tablespoon sugar
> 1 1/4 cup water
> 1 teaspoon yeast
> 3 cups bread flour
> 1 teaspoon salt
> 1/4 cup oil.


I agree with Vox that your pizza dough sounds really heavy on the oil. A
tablespoon at the most.

It's hard to know how you define gooey. tossing is overrated and mostly
theater. Sounds like perhaps it's too dense?

Like Vox said, if it's too springy it may just need to rest, but i agree
with Roger that maybe it's too dry. I do find that i get the best
performance out of my pizza dough when the hydration level is high enough
that the dough is a little sticky. just have flour handy to sprinkle with
while you work it.

It's Really Easy to get more than '1 cup' of flour into that cup. Try
again and stop adding flour when the dough is just a little sticky.

"Eric Jorgensen" > wrote in message
news:20050322161219.132f873a@wafer...
> On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 16:54:50 -0500
> Sridhar Sathya > wrote:
>
> > When I make pizza dough it raises well, around double the size in about
> > 45 minutes. The problem with my dough is it is too gooie and I'm not
> > able to toss it. Even when I try to knead it it is too elastic and
> > shrinks as I knead the dough.
> >
> >
> > I follow the following recipe (I use a bread machine for making the
> > dough). 1 tablespoon sugar
> > 1 1/4 cup water
> > 1 teaspoon yeast
> > 3 cups bread flour
> > 1 teaspoon salt
> > 1/4 cup oil.
>
>
> I agree with Vox that your pizza dough sounds really heavy on the oil.
A
> tablespoon at the most.
>
> It's hard to know how you define gooey. tossing is overrated and mostly
> theater. Sounds like perhaps it's too dense?
>
> Like Vox said, if it's too springy it may just need to rest, but i
agree
> with Roger that maybe it's too dry. I do find that i get the best
> performance out of my pizza dough when the hydration level is high enough
> that the dough is a little sticky. just have flour handy to sprinkle with
> while you work it.
>
> It's Really Easy to get more than '1 cup' of flour into that cup. Try
> again and stop adding flour when the dough is just a little sticky.
>

I don't really measure the flour or the water. I just put enough flour to
come up the shoulder on my food processor's bade, put in about a tablespoon
of oil, a teaspoon of salt, and a scant tablespoon of instant yeast. I turn
on the machine and add very hot tap water in a slow stream until the dough
forms a ball that tends to stick to the sides of the bowl. I let that knead
for about a minute, and then remove it. The important thing is that you
have the proper ratio of liquid to flour.

I think that four tablespoons of oil to a pound of flour is pretty high. I
have looked at a lot of recipes, and I don't ever recall seeing that much
oil for a scant pound (3 cups) of flour. But, if it works for the OP and he
likes it, then I say go for it.

On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 00:03:13 GMT
"Vox Humana" > wrote:

>
> "Eric Jorgensen" > wrote in message
> news:20050322161219.132f873a@wafer...
> > On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 16:54:50 -0500
> > Sridhar Sathya > wrote:
> >
> > > When I make pizza dough it raises well, around double the size in
> > > about 45 minutes. The problem with my dough is it is too gooie and
> > > I'm not able to toss it. Even when I try to knead it it is too
> > > elastic and shrinks as I knead the dough.
> > >
> > >
> > > I follow the following recipe (I use a bread machine for making the
> > > dough). 1 tablespoon sugar
> > > 1 1/4 cup water
> > > 1 teaspoon yeast
> > > 3 cups bread flour
> > > 1 teaspoon salt
> > > 1/4 cup oil.
> >
> >
> > I agree with Vox that your pizza dough sounds really heavy on the
> > oil.
> A
> > tablespoon at the most.
> >
> > It's hard to know how you define gooey. tossing is overrated and
> > mostly
> > theater. Sounds like perhaps it's too dense?
> >
> > Like Vox said, if it's too springy it may just need to rest, but i
> agree
> > with Roger that maybe it's too dry. I do find that i get the best
> > performance out of my pizza dough when the hydration level is high
> > enough that the dough is a little sticky. just have flour handy to
> > sprinkle with while you work it.
> >
> > It's Really Easy to get more than '1 cup' of flour into that cup.
> > Try
> > again and stop adding flour when the dough is just a little sticky.
> >
>
> I don't really measure the flour or the water. I just put enough flour
> to come up the shoulder on my food processor's bade, put in about a
> tablespoon of oil, a teaspoon of salt, and a scant tablespoon of instant
> yeast. I turn on the machine and add very hot tap water in a slow stream
> until the dough forms a ball that tends to stick to the sides of the
> bowl. I let that knead for about a minute, and then remove it. The
> important thing is that you have the proper ratio of liquid to flour.


It's my guess that most people blindly follow a recipe without paying
any attention to ratios. That would work ok if it told them which method to
use when measuring flour.

Some people get a 1c scoop and shove it into an open bag, and get
considerably more in 1 cup than they would had they poured the contents of
the bag into a container and then used a regular measuring cup and the
scoop & sweep method, for example.


> I think that four tablespoons of oil to a pound of flour is pretty high.
> I have looked at a lot of recipes, and I don't ever recall seeing that
> much oil for a scant pound (3 cups) of flour. But, if it works for the
> OP and he likes it, then I say go for it.


I start to think my pizza dough is way too greasy when i hit about 2
tablespoons of oil per pound of flour. I don't want to think about what
four would be like. But yeah, if it's what he's going for, whatever.

My Fibrament stone arrived this morning. May be making pizza tonight . .
..

"Eric Jorgensen" > wrote in message
news:20050322172853.1268aa31@wafer...
> On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 00:03:13 GMT

>
> My Fibrament stone arrived this morning. May be making pizza tonight .
..

The food network was big on pizza this weekend and it got me motivated to
make one. I whiped out at big one (pizza that is) on Sunday. I have been
lazy and have baked most of the recent pizzas in my small microwave
convection oven in a pizza pan. On Sunday, I heated up the main oven with my
stone and baked the pizza the right way for a change. I kept is simple with
a minimum of sauce and a minimumof toppings. It was wonderful. Nothing
beats the basics.

On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 01:13:47 GMT
"Vox Humana" > wrote:

>
> "Eric Jorgensen" > wrote in message
> news:20050322172853.1268aa31@wafer...
> > On Wed, 23 Mar 2005 00:03:13 GMT
>
> >
> > My Fibrament stone arrived this morning. May be making pizza tonight
> > .
> .
>
> The food network was big on pizza this weekend and it got me motivated to
> make one. I whiped out at big one (pizza that is) on Sunday. I have
> been lazy and have baked most of the recent pizzas in my small microwave
> convection oven in a pizza pan. On Sunday, I heated up the main oven with
> my stone and baked the pizza the right way for a change. I kept is
> simple with a minimum of sauce and a minimumof toppings. It was
> wonderful. Nothing beats the basics.


Well, the joke was on me - a new fibrament stone requires a 6 hour
drying cycle in the oven before use. increment 100 degrees per hour,
standing at 500 degrees for two hours.

So, I'll be staying up late to turn off the oven at the end of the
cycle, perhaps I'll get to take the thing for a spin tomorrow night.

You're right about simplicity - one of the tougher lessons in home pizza
making is when "lots of cheese" becomes too much. It doesn't matter how
much you like cheese (and I have at least 7 kinds in my fridge), you
rapidly reach a point where the pizza and indeed the cheese on it is less
enjoyable for there being so much of it.

Two weeks ago I got roped into baking 14 calzones for my twin nephews
13th birthday party. It started out being "How the heck did this happen!?"
and "Why are you looking at me? I like my toppings *browned!" and ended up
being a pretty enjoyable experience. Also made me again jealous of the inch
thick ceramic stone in my parents oven.

Hi: Try all-purpose flour. Bread flour requires a good amount of kneading.
I would also reduce the oil to 1 tb. of olive oil.

Joe
"Sridhar Sathya" > wrote in message
...
> When I make pizza dough it raises well, around double the size in about 45
> minutes. The problem with my dough is it is too gooie and I'm not able to
> toss it. Even when I try to knead it it is too elastic and shrinks as I
> knead the dough.
>
>
> I follow the following recipe (I use a bread machine for making the
> dough).
> 1 tablespoon sugar
> 1 1/4 cup water
> 1 teaspoon yeast
> 3 cups bread flour
> 1 teaspoon salt
> 1/4 cup oil.
>
>
> Any suggestions?

Hi: Try all-purpose flour. Bread flour requires a good amount of kneading.
I would also reduce the oil to 1 tb. of olive oil.

Joe
"Sridhar Sathya" > wrote in message
...
> When I make pizza dough it raises well, around double the size in about 45
> minutes. The problem with my dough is it is too gooie and I'm not able to
> toss it. Even when I try to knead it it is too elastic and shrinks as I
> knead the dough.
>
>
> I follow the following recipe (I use a bread machine for making the
> dough).
> 1 tablespoon sugar
> 1 1/4 cup water
> 1 teaspoon yeast
> 3 cups bread flour
> 1 teaspoon salt
> 1/4 cup oil.
>
>
> Any suggestions?

On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 16:12:19 -0700, Eric Jorgensen
> wrote:

>> When I make pizza dough it raises well, around double the size in about
>> 45 minutes. The problem with my dough is it is too gooie

When you continue with the same recipe and get the same results...it
might be time to change the recipe.

This is from Fine Cooking and works perfectly every time......

@@@@@ Now You're Cooking! Export Format

Pizza Dough/Fine Cooking

breads, italian

2 1/4 ts yeast
1 1/2 c warm water; 110F
18 oz bread flour
plus more for dusting
1 1/2 ts salt
2 ts olive oil

Dissolve the yeast in the warm water and set aside.

Meanwhile, put the flour and salt in a food processor fitted with the
steel
blade. Process briefly to mix. With the machine runni8ng, add the
water-yeast mixture in a steady stream. Turn the processor off and add
the
oil. Pulse a few times to mix in the oil.

Divide the dough. Scrape the soft doughty out of the processor and
onto a
lightly floured surface. With lightly floured hands, quickly knead the
doughty in a mass incorporating any bits of flour or doughty from the
processor bowl that wasn't mixed in.

Cut dough into four equal pieces with a dough scrapper. Roll each
piece
into a tight smooth ball, kneading to push out all the air.

Proceed as usual.

Extra pieces of doughty will freeze very well. Cover with extra flour
and
seal and freeze in a quart zip lock bag for future use.


** Exported from Now You're Cooking! v5.66 **



The Fine Art of Cooking involves personal choice.
Many preferences, ingredients, and procedures may not
be consistent with what you know to be true.
As with any recipe, you may find your personal
intervention will be necessary. Bon Appetit!

On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 16:12:19 -0700, Eric Jorgensen
> wrote:

>> When I make pizza dough it raises well, around double the size in about
>> 45 minutes. The problem with my dough is it is too gooie

When you continue with the same recipe and get the same results...it
might be time to change the recipe.

This is from Fine Cooking and works perfectly every time......

@@@@@ Now You're Cooking! Export Format

Pizza Dough/Fine Cooking

breads, italian

2 1/4 ts yeast
1 1/2 c warm water; 110F
18 oz bread flour
plus more for dusting
1 1/2 ts salt
2 ts olive oil

Dissolve the yeast in the warm water and set aside.

Meanwhile, put the flour and salt in a food processor fitted with the
steel
blade. Process briefly to mix. With the machine runni8ng, add the
water-yeast mixture in a steady stream. Turn the processor off and add
the
oil. Pulse a few times to mix in the oil.

Divide the dough. Scrape the soft doughty out of the processor and
onto a
lightly floured surface. With lightly floured hands, quickly knead the
doughty in a mass incorporating any bits of flour or doughty from the
processor bowl that wasn't mixed in.

Cut dough into four equal pieces with a dough scrapper. Roll each
piece
into a tight smooth ball, kneading to push out all the air.

Proceed as usual.

Extra pieces of doughty will freeze very well. Cover with extra flour
and
seal and freeze in a quart zip lock bag for future use.


** Exported from Now You're Cooking! v5.66 **



The Fine Art of Cooking involves personal choice.
Many preferences, ingredients, and procedures may not
be consistent with what you know to be true.
As with any recipe, you may find your personal
intervention will be necessary. Bon Appetit!

"Ida Slapter" > wrote in message
...
> On Tue, 22 Mar 2005 16:12:19 -0700, Eric Jorgensen
> > wrote:
>
> >> When I make pizza dough it raises well, around double the size in about
> >> 45 minutes. The problem with my dough is it is too gooie
>
> When you continue with the same recipe and get the same results...it
> might be time to change the recipe.
>
> This is from Fine Cooking and works perfectly every time......
>
> @@@@@ Now You're Cooking! Export Format
>
> Pizza Dough/Fine Cooking
>
> breads, italian
>
> 2 1/4 ts yeast
> 1 1/2 c warm water; 110F
> 18 oz bread flour
> plus more for dusting
> 1 1/2 ts salt
> 2 ts olive oil
>
> Dissolve the yeast in the warm water and set aside.
>
> Meanwhile, put the flour and salt in a food processor fitted with the
> steel
> blade. Process briefly to mix. With the machine runni8ng, add the
> water-yeast mixture in a steady stream. Turn the processor off and add
> the
> oil. Pulse a few times to mix in the oil.
>
> Divide the dough. Scrape the soft doughty out of the processor and
> onto a
> lightly floured surface. With lightly floured hands, quickly knead the
> doughty in a mass incorporating any bits of flour or doughty from the
> processor bowl that wasn't mixed in.
>
> Cut dough into four equal pieces with a dough scrapper. Roll each
> piece
> into a tight smooth ball, kneading to push out all the air.
>
> Proceed as usual.
>
> Extra pieces of doughty will freeze very well. Cover with extra flour
> and
> seal and freeze in a quart zip lock bag for future use.
>

That is basically my recipe and technique. It works well.

Yeah, I'd cut way back on the oil and not worry about tossing. You
don't need to toss to make good pizza. Stretch the dough gently and
when it won't give any more without tearing, let it rest for 10 or 15.
Then stretch some more.

A piece I wrote on pizza dough, with a recipe and shaping info is at:

http://www.thefreshloaf.com/modules/...php?storyid=21

-F

>When I make pizza dough it raises well, around double the size in
about
>45 minutes. The problem with my dough is it is too gooie and I'm not
>able to toss it. Even when I try to knead it it is too elastic and
>shrinks as I knead the dough.
>I follow the following recipe (I use a bread machine for making the
dough).
>1 tablespoon sugar
>1 1/4 cup water
>1 teaspoon yeast
>3 cups bread flour
>1 teaspoon salt
>1/4 cup oil
..
>Any suggestions?
Hmmnn....
Calculating your ingredient ratios....

Flour 100%
Sugar 3%
Water 69%
Yeast 0.8%
Salt 1.2
Oil 14%

Your recipe is wet...you should slightly increase your flour if that is
easier for you to do.... Or reduce the water to make it easier to
handle.
Do not try to reduce the amount of oil as you are using a very strong
flour and you had problems with excessive elasticity and shrinkage.And
you had no problem with that..
To ,minimize elasticity and shrinkage: (1) that do not overmix the
dough but just halfway and not more than two thirds developed and
that;s it. Pizzas with really strong flour when overmixed tends to be
too tough to handle and manipulate.
(2) Do not add the oil immediately at the start of mixing rather As
that will slow down the water absoprtion rate. But latter when it has
attained integrity or start to develop then gradually add the oil.
(3)When done take it out from the mixer and bulk ferment it then
divide into requires sizes and round,
(4) Rest for sufficient time or chill for several hours so that the
dough will be really extensible.
Be sure to watch dough temperature. If the dough comes out warm its
tends to be tough to manipulate than when its cool. That is why its
recommendable to chill the pizza dough before using it and it will come
out fine.
Roy

Thanks for your suggestions. As suggested I reduced the oil &
water(little less); also I let the dough stand in the refrigerator for
about 10 hours. Now I'm able to handle the dough very well.


Sridhar Sathya wrote:
> When I make pizza dough it raises well, around double the size in about
> 45 minutes. The problem with my dough is it is too gooie and I'm not
> able to toss it. Even when I try to knead it it is too elastic and
> shrinks as I knead the dough.
>
>
> I follow the following recipe (I use a bread machine for making the dough).
> 1 tablespoon sugar
> 1 1/4 cup water
> 1 teaspoon yeast
> 3 cups bread flour
> 1 teaspoon salt
> 1/4 cup oil.
>
>
> Any suggestions?

"Sridhar Sathya" > wrote in message
...
> Thanks for your suggestions. As suggested I reduced the oil &
> water(little less); also I let the dough stand in the refrigerator for
> about 10 hours. Now I'm able to handle the dough very well.
>


Good to hear! Also, you may notice an improvment in the flavor and texture
of the dough from retarding the fermentation. I think that letting the
dough rise in the refrigerator allows you to make pizzas in a more impromptu
manner. The dough will keep for a few days before becoming too sour, so you
have flexibility to make the dough when you have a few minutes and then make
up the pizza when you are ready to eat.

"Sridhar Sathya" > wrote in message
...
> Thanks for your suggestions. As suggested I reduced the oil &
> water(little less); also I let the dough stand in the refrigerator for
> about 10 hours. Now I'm able to handle the dough very well.
>


Good to hear! Also, you may notice an improvment in the flavor and texture
of the dough from retarding the fermentation. I think that letting the
dough rise in the refrigerator allows you to make pizzas in a more impromptu
manner. The dough will keep for a few days before becoming too sour, so you
have flexibility to make the dough when you have a few minutes and then make
up the pizza when you are ready to eat.

Hello

You have certainly been given a great deal of useful information already
relative to the problem you posed. Should you want more information,
try the pizza dough recipes on The Artisan.

These can be accessed from http://www.theartisan.net/bredfrm.htm. This
is the menu for all the breads and flatbreads on the site. The pizze
recipes links are near the bottom of the left hand menu.

If you want the specific recipe for pizza dough, use this link:
http://www.theartisan.net/pizzabas.htm

Hope this helps

Regards

Jerry @ The Artisan
http://www.theartisan.net



"Sridhar Sathya" > wrote in message
...
> When I make pizza dough it raises well, around double the size in
> about 45 minutes. The problem with my dough is it is too gooie and I'm
> not able to toss it. Even when I try to knead it it is too elastic and
> shrinks as I knead the dough.
>
>
> I follow the following recipe (I use a bread machine for making the
> dough).
> 1 tablespoon sugar
> 1 1/4 cup water
> 1 teaspoon yeast
> 3 cups bread flour
> 1 teaspoon salt
> 1/4 cup oil.
>
>
> Any suggestions?

"Jerry DeAngelis" > wrote in message
nk.net...
> Hello
>
> You have certainly been given a great deal of useful information already
> relative to the problem you posed. Should you want more information,
> try the pizza dough recipes on The Artisan.
>
> These can be accessed from http://www.theartisan.net/bredfrm.htm. This
> is the menu for all the breads and flatbreads on the site. The pizze
> recipes links are near the bottom of the left hand menu.
>
> If you want the specific recipe for pizza dough, use this link:
> http://www.theartisan.net/pizzabas.htm
>
> Hope this helps
>
> Regards
>
> Jerry @ The Artisan
> http://www.theartisan.net
>

I just wanted to tell you how much I have enjoyed your site. It always has
good recipes and great, in-depth information.

"Jerry DeAngelis" > wrote in message
nk.net...
> Hello
>
> You have certainly been given a great deal of useful information already
> relative to the problem you posed. Should you want more information,
> try the pizza dough recipes on The Artisan.
>
> These can be accessed from http://www.theartisan.net/bredfrm.htm. This
> is the menu for all the breads and flatbreads on the site. The pizze
> recipes links are near the bottom of the left hand menu.
>
> If you want the specific recipe for pizza dough, use this link:
> http://www.theartisan.net/pizzabas.htm
>
> Hope this helps
>
> Regards
>
> Jerry @ The Artisan
> http://www.theartisan.net
>

I just wanted to tell you how much I have enjoyed your site. It always has
good recipes and great, in-depth information.

Vox

Thank you! We really enjoy the work, and wish we could do more. Now
that we are making wine and olive oil, time is at a premium, and we
cannot do as much as we once could.

Regards

Jerry @ the Artisan
http://www.theartisan.net



"Vox Humana" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Jerry DeAngelis" > wrote in message
> nk.net...
>> Hello
>>
>> You have certainly been given a great deal of useful information
>> already
>> relative to the problem you posed. Should you want more information,
>> try the pizza dough recipes on The Artisan.
>>
>> These can be accessed from http://www.theartisan.net/bredfrm.htm.
>> This
>> is the menu for all the breads and flatbreads on the site. The pizze
>> recipes links are near the bottom of the left hand menu.
>>
>> If you want the specific recipe for pizza dough, use this link:
>> http://www.theartisan.net/pizzabas.htm
>>
>> Hope this helps
>>
>> Regards
>>
>> Jerry @ The Artisan
>> http://www.theartisan.net
>>
>
> I just wanted to tell you how much I have enjoyed your site. It
> always has
> good recipes and great, in-depth information.
>
>

Vox

Thank you! We really enjoy the work, and wish we could do more. Now
that we are making wine and olive oil, time is at a premium, and we
cannot do as much as we once could.

Regards

Jerry @ the Artisan
http://www.theartisan.net



"Vox Humana" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Jerry DeAngelis" > wrote in message
> nk.net...
>> Hello
>>
>> You have certainly been given a great deal of useful information
>> already
>> relative to the problem you posed. Should you want more information,
>> try the pizza dough recipes on The Artisan.
>>
>> These can be accessed from http://www.theartisan.net/bredfrm.htm.
>> This
>> is the menu for all the breads and flatbreads on the site. The pizze
>> recipes links are near the bottom of the left hand menu.
>>
>> If you want the specific recipe for pizza dough, use this link:
>> http://www.theartisan.net/pizzabas.htm
>>
>> Hope this helps
>>
>> Regards
>>
>> Jerry @ The Artisan
>> http://www.theartisan.net
>>
>
> I just wanted to tell you how much I have enjoyed your site. It
> always has
> good recipes and great, in-depth information.
>
>

MY recipe is exactly yhe same as yours except I use 2 tbls of olive oil...
It works perfect every time. I'd dump it out of the bread machine hopper(?)
and flour the board... push the bubbles out (a little kneeding) form it into
a ball spray a glass bowl put the ball into the bowl spray w/spray oil turn
it over and cover it w/a dishtowel for 30 min I used to just roll it from
the center... then one day I decided to try "tossing" the dough... It
worked out real well... I did that for a while and noticed no difference.
so, now, I just roll it from the center. let it rise another 20 min. or
not if I'm really hungry
I don't use a "Pizza Stone" ( they're really just for frozen pizzas) and I
cook the pizza @ around 500° for about 12 - 13 min
"Sridhar Sathya" > wrote in message
...
> When I make pizza dough it raises well, around double the size in about
> 45 minutes. The problem with my dough is it is too gooie and I'm not
> able to toss it. Even when I try to knead it it is too elastic and
> shrinks as I knead the dough.
>
>
> I follow the following recipe (I use a bread machine for making the
dough).
> 1 tablespoon sugar
> 1 1/4 cup water
> 1 teaspoon yeast
> 3 cups bread flour
> 1 teaspoon salt
> 1/4 cup oil.
>
>
> Any suggestions?

"jimmyjames" > wrote in message
ink.net...

> I don't use a "Pizza Stone" ( they're really just for frozen pizzas)


WHAT!

On Thu, 24 Mar 2005 23:20:21 GMT
"jimmyjames" > wrote:


> I don't use a "Pizza Stone" ( they're really just for frozen pizzas)


Where did you get that idea? From your Pampered Chef rep?

Quarter inch thick ceramic baking stones the likes of which PC sells are
for . . . . . skeet shooting. They have very little thermal mass and have
no place in any oven, imho.

Real baking stones - or even makeshift baking stones like slabs of
soapstone, unglazed ceramic tiles, or as Alton Brown recently demonstrated,
heavy unglazed ceramic planter trays, are for anyone who wants a fast bake
time and a crisp crust.

On Thu, 24 Mar 2005 23:20:21 GMT, "jimmyjames"
> wrote:

>I don't use a "Pizza Stone" ( they're really just for frozen pizzas)

Howdy,

I don't know why you believe that, but disagree in any case.
A massive stone can make a very significant difference in a
pizza, and in lots of other baked goods as well.

All the best,

--
Kenneth

If you email... Please remove the "SPAMLESS."

I have an "unglazed ceramic tile" 5/8ths 14x14 (Sq.)
It works every bit as good as my 18" round pizza pan with the "holes".
Except when I use the stone, I have to not only have to heat up the oven,
I have to heat up the stinkin stone. The people at "bed, bath and beyond"
really wanted me to buy a pizza stone... I asked what the advantage was and
they said " well, alls ya gotta do is heat the stone, take the pizza out of
the box, and slide the pizza on to the stone"
I'll put my pizza up to anyones! Stinkin' "pizza stone snobs"!

"Kenneth" > wrote in message
...
> On Thu, 24 Mar 2005 23:20:21 GMT, "jimmyjames"
> > wrote:
>
> >I don't use a "Pizza Stone" ( they're really just for frozen pizzas)
>
> Howdy,
>
> I don't know why you believe that, but disagree in any case.
> A massive stone can make a very significant difference in a
> pizza, and in lots of other baked goods as well.
>
> All the best,
>
> --
> Kenneth
>
> If you email... Please remove the "SPAMLESS."

I have an "unglazed ceramic tile" 5/8ths 14x14 (Sq.)
It works every bit as good as my 18" round pizza pan with the "holes".
Except when I use the stone, I have to not only have to heat up the oven,
I have to heat up the stinkin stone. The people at "bed, bath and beyond"
really wanted me to buy a pizza stone... I asked what the advantage was and
they said " well, alls ya gotta do is heat the stone, take the pizza out of
the box, and slide the pizza on to the stone"
I'll put my pizza up to anyones! Stinkin' "pizza stone snobs"!

"Kenneth" > wrote in message
...
> On Thu, 24 Mar 2005 23:20:21 GMT, "jimmyjames"
> > wrote:
>
> >I don't use a "Pizza Stone" ( they're really just for frozen pizzas)
>
> Howdy,
>
> I don't know why you believe that, but disagree in any case.
> A massive stone can make a very significant difference in a
> pizza, and in lots of other baked goods as well.
>
> All the best,
>
> --
> Kenneth
>
> If you email... Please remove the "SPAMLESS."

On Sat, 26 Mar 2005 04:25:09 GMT
"jimmyjames" > wrote:

> I have an "unglazed ceramic tile" 5/8ths 14x14 (Sq.)
> It works every bit as good as my 18" round pizza pan with the "holes".
> Except when I use the stone, I have to not only have to heat up the
> oven, I have to heat up the stinkin stone. The people at "bed, bath and
> beyond" really wanted me to buy a pizza stone... I asked what the
> advantage was and they said " well, alls ya gotta do is heat the stone,
> take the pizza out of the box, and slide the pizza on to the stone"
> I'll put my pizza up to anyones! Stinkin' "pizza stone snobs"!


Aight. You're on. Come on over any time.

I upgraded from five 7" unglazed ceramic tiles to a 20x15x.75 Fibrament
stone this week. I have one of those perforated pans, too.

The difference is more than noticeable.

The perforated pans trap too much moisture, and the bottom of the crust
ends up being slightly gelled by the steam. Also, cheese gets stuck in the
holes and i hate cleaning it.

The ceramic tile transfers heat very quickly, and the bottom of the
crust is very well seared, but then it's pretty much done. The bottom of
the pizza ends up being over-hard and the quality of the crumb suffers
because of the drop in the rate of thermal transfer. The only way to
compensate is to use a lower oven temperature, and then the quality of the
browning on the top side suffers.

I get a more uniform bake with the fibrament stone. With the oven at
500f the bottom of the crust is not over hard, the crumb is well developed,
and if i use the old tiles to lower the ceiling over the pizza, the top is
very well browned.

I'm still experimenting with it. Made my third pizza tonight. I'm sure
i'll get sick of pizza at some point and have to start making breads on it.

Do i have to preheat it? You betcha. It takes like an hour for my 70's
vintage crappy Whirlpool oven to get it to 500f. But it's worth it.

As for BB&B, I've seen their pizza stone, and it's best used as a clay
pigeon.

Someone here mentioned having a great deal of success with a slab of
soapstone, and i imagine that works quite well. More likely to break than
the fibrament stone, but way cheaper if you buy it as a scrap -- stone
vendors often have likely shaped chunks left over after cutting out a hole
for a sink in a counter top, for example.

On Sat, 26 Mar 2005 04:25:09 GMT
"jimmyjames" > wrote:

> I have an "unglazed ceramic tile" 5/8ths 14x14 (Sq.)
> It works every bit as good as my 18" round pizza pan with the "holes".
> Except when I use the stone, I have to not only have to heat up the
> oven, I have to heat up the stinkin stone. The people at "bed, bath and
> beyond" really wanted me to buy a pizza stone... I asked what the
> advantage was and they said " well, alls ya gotta do is heat the stone,
> take the pizza out of the box, and slide the pizza on to the stone"
> I'll put my pizza up to anyones! Stinkin' "pizza stone snobs"!


Aight. You're on. Come on over any time.

I upgraded from five 7" unglazed ceramic tiles to a 20x15x.75 Fibrament
stone this week. I have one of those perforated pans, too.

The difference is more than noticeable.

The perforated pans trap too much moisture, and the bottom of the crust
ends up being slightly gelled by the steam. Also, cheese gets stuck in the
holes and i hate cleaning it.

The ceramic tile transfers heat very quickly, and the bottom of the
crust is very well seared, but then it's pretty much done. The bottom of
the pizza ends up being over-hard and the quality of the crumb suffers
because of the drop in the rate of thermal transfer. The only way to
compensate is to use a lower oven temperature, and then the quality of the
browning on the top side suffers.

I get a more uniform bake with the fibrament stone. With the oven at
500f the bottom of the crust is not over hard, the crumb is well developed,
and if i use the old tiles to lower the ceiling over the pizza, the top is
very well browned.

I'm still experimenting with it. Made my third pizza tonight. I'm sure
i'll get sick of pizza at some point and have to start making breads on it.

Do i have to preheat it? You betcha. It takes like an hour for my 70's
vintage crappy Whirlpool oven to get it to 500f. But it's worth it.

As for BB&B, I've seen their pizza stone, and it's best used as a clay
pigeon.

Someone here mentioned having a great deal of success with a slab of
soapstone, and i imagine that works quite well. More likely to break than
the fibrament stone, but way cheaper if you buy it as a scrap -- stone
vendors often have likely shaped chunks left over after cutting out a hole
for a sink in a counter top, for example.

Eric Jorgensen wrote:
SNIP
> The ceramic tile transfers heat very quickly, and the bottom of the
> crust is very well seared, but then it's pretty much done. The bottom of
> the pizza ends up being over-hard and the quality of the crumb suffers
> because of the drop in the rate of thermal transfer. The only way to
> compensate is to use a lower oven temperature, and then the quality of the
> browning on the top side suffers.
>
> I get a more uniform bake with the fibrament stone. With the oven at
> 500f the bottom of the crust is not over hard, the crumb is well
> developed,
> and if i use the old tiles to lower the ceiling over the pizza, the top is
> very well browned.
SNIP

I'm curious, what is there about the fibrament stone that allows it to cook
more uniformly than the ceramic tiles, the thickness? My old Saltilo tiles
were about 3/4 inch thick and made the el cheapo Sears oven we used at that
time fairly usable. They cracked, but I used them for almost 20 years that
way with no problems.

The oven of the local pizza joint, Fuzzy's, is set to almost 600 degrees and
has what looks like a thick brick-like floor. Since it is constantly being
opened I assume it probably stays around 500 degrees. Excellent pizza BTW.

Raj V

On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 03:35:49 GMT
"Raj V" > wrote:

> Eric Jorgensen wrote:
> SNIP
> > The ceramic tile transfers heat very quickly, and the bottom of the
> > crust is very well seared, but then it's pretty much done. The bottom
> > of the pizza ends up being over-hard and the quality of the crumb
> > suffers because of the drop in the rate of thermal transfer. The only
> > way to compensate is to use a lower oven temperature, and then the
> > quality of the browning on the top side suffers.
> >
> > I get a more uniform bake with the fibrament stone. With the oven at
> > 500f the bottom of the crust is not over hard, the crumb is well
> > developed,
> > and if i use the old tiles to lower the ceiling over the pizza, the top
> > is very well browned.
> SNIP
>
> I'm curious, what is there about the fibrament stone that allows it to
> cook more uniformly than the ceramic tiles, the thickness? My old
> Saltilo tiles were about 3/4 inch thick and made the el cheapo Sears
> oven we used at that time fairly usable. They cracked, but I used them
> for almost 20 years that way with no problems.


I've never used saltillo in an oven, so I can't compare it directly.

The fibrament cement is a mixture of heat conductive materials and
insulating materials that ensure a more steady rate of thermal transfer.
Certainly more steady than my old ceramic tiles, which are admittedly
denser than saltillo.


> The oven of the local pizza joint, Fuzzy's, is set to almost 600 degrees
> and has what looks like a thick brick-like floor. Since it is constantly
> being opened I assume it probably stays around 500 degrees. Excellent
> pizza BTW.


The pizza fascists from Naples mandate an oven temperature in excess of
700 degrees. At least if you want to call it Neapolitan Pizza (tm). At
these temperatures, the bake time is less than 2 minutes.

There are probably a lot of good commercial oven floor materials.
Fibrament is the only one that I know of available in a home oven product
that can be ordered online and arrive at your door inside of a week, with a
10 year warranty.

With my ceramic tiles, I had this problem. The accepted wisdom is "as
hot as possible" but at 500f the ceramic tiles were turning my crust into a
cracker. I had to back it down to 425, and then the outer crust still came
out crunchy.

With the fibrament slab, it takes a lot longer to get it up to 500f
than it took with the ceramic tiles. My bake time is shorter than it was at
500f with the ceramic tiles.

There's a distinctive acrid stench of searing dough when the stone
starts to dump heat into the pizza. With the fibrament stone, it's not as
strong, and it doesn't last as long. I suspect that this means that the
peak thermal transfer rate rapidly drops off after the initial contact.

But, the crust is cooked through faster, which has to mean that the
curve flattens out and i get more heat over time than i did with the
ceramic tiles.

The other great thing, the outer ring of the crust is crisp and browned
on the outside, soft, fluffy, and chewey on the inside. This was a
surprise. I did not expect this at all. It's also very nice.

It looks like the secret to bubbling cheese and browned toppings
WITHOUT an overcooked crust at home is lowering the ceiling over the pizza.

If you go to Lowes or Home Depot you can get five 7" unglazed quarry
tiles for about a dollar each, and if you *ask, they will grudgingly admit
that they can cut one of them for free. Have them cut one of them squarely
in half, perpendicular to the ridges on the underside of the tile. This
will give you a 14x17.5 ceramic shelf on one of your oven racks. Assuming
you can fit that on your racks. This is what i used to bake my pizza on.

With this 6" above the pizza, by the time the outer ring of the crust is
browned, the cheese in the center is bubbling and the pepperoni has started
to curl upward. This is probably true even if you're baking a frozen pizza
on the bare rack.

You'd think that all the open air space above this suspended ceiling
would kill the effect, but it doesn't. I should experiment with putting, I
don't know, a pan of bread sticks up there.

It might be possible to get some of the same effect by putting a half
sheet pan (cookie sheet? what's that?) on the rack above whatever you're
baking your pizza on, but I'm not going to experiment with that until the
next time i get roped into baking pizza at my parents house.

On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 03:35:49 GMT
"Raj V" > wrote:

> Eric Jorgensen wrote:
> SNIP
> > The ceramic tile transfers heat very quickly, and the bottom of the
> > crust is very well seared, but then it's pretty much done. The bottom
> > of the pizza ends up being over-hard and the quality of the crumb
> > suffers because of the drop in the rate of thermal transfer. The only
> > way to compensate is to use a lower oven temperature, and then the
> > quality of the browning on the top side suffers.
> >
> > I get a more uniform bake with the fibrament stone. With the oven at
> > 500f the bottom of the crust is not over hard, the crumb is well
> > developed,
> > and if i use the old tiles to lower the ceiling over the pizza, the top
> > is very well browned.
> SNIP
>
> I'm curious, what is there about the fibrament stone that allows it to
> cook more uniformly than the ceramic tiles, the thickness? My old
> Saltilo tiles were about 3/4 inch thick and made the el cheapo Sears
> oven we used at that time fairly usable. They cracked, but I used them
> for almost 20 years that way with no problems.


I've never used saltillo in an oven, so I can't compare it directly.

The fibrament cement is a mixture of heat conductive materials and
insulating materials that ensure a more steady rate of thermal transfer.
Certainly more steady than my old ceramic tiles, which are admittedly
denser than saltillo.


> The oven of the local pizza joint, Fuzzy's, is set to almost 600 degrees
> and has what looks like a thick brick-like floor. Since it is constantly
> being opened I assume it probably stays around 500 degrees. Excellent
> pizza BTW.


The pizza fascists from Naples mandate an oven temperature in excess of
700 degrees. At least if you want to call it Neapolitan Pizza (tm). At
these temperatures, the bake time is less than 2 minutes.

There are probably a lot of good commercial oven floor materials.
Fibrament is the only one that I know of available in a home oven product
that can be ordered online and arrive at your door inside of a week, with a
10 year warranty.

With my ceramic tiles, I had this problem. The accepted wisdom is "as
hot as possible" but at 500f the ceramic tiles were turning my crust into a
cracker. I had to back it down to 425, and then the outer crust still came
out crunchy.

With the fibrament slab, it takes a lot longer to get it up to 500f
than it took with the ceramic tiles. My bake time is shorter than it was at
500f with the ceramic tiles.

There's a distinctive acrid stench of searing dough when the stone
starts to dump heat into the pizza. With the fibrament stone, it's not as
strong, and it doesn't last as long. I suspect that this means that the
peak thermal transfer rate rapidly drops off after the initial contact.

But, the crust is cooked through faster, which has to mean that the
curve flattens out and i get more heat over time than i did with the
ceramic tiles.

The other great thing, the outer ring of the crust is crisp and browned
on the outside, soft, fluffy, and chewey on the inside. This was a
surprise. I did not expect this at all. It's also very nice.

It looks like the secret to bubbling cheese and browned toppings
WITHOUT an overcooked crust at home is lowering the ceiling over the pizza.

If you go to Lowes or Home Depot you can get five 7" unglazed quarry
tiles for about a dollar each, and if you *ask, they will grudgingly admit
that they can cut one of them for free. Have them cut one of them squarely
in half, perpendicular to the ridges on the underside of the tile. This
will give you a 14x17.5 ceramic shelf on one of your oven racks. Assuming
you can fit that on your racks. This is what i used to bake my pizza on.

With this 6" above the pizza, by the time the outer ring of the crust is
browned, the cheese in the center is bubbling and the pepperoni has started
to curl upward. This is probably true even if you're baking a frozen pizza
on the bare rack.

You'd think that all the open air space above this suspended ceiling
would kill the effect, but it doesn't. I should experiment with putting, I
don't know, a pan of bread sticks up there.

It might be possible to get some of the same effect by putting a half
sheet pan (cookie sheet? what's that?) on the rack above whatever you're
baking your pizza on, but I'm not going to experiment with that until the
next time i get roped into baking pizza at my parents house.

On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 03:35:49 GMT
"Raj V" > wrote:

> Eric Jorgensen wrote:
> SNIP
> > The ceramic tile transfers heat very quickly, and the bottom of the
> > crust is very well seared, but then it's pretty much done. The bottom
> > of the pizza ends up being over-hard and the quality of the crumb
> > suffers because of the drop in the rate of thermal transfer. The only
> > way to compensate is to use a lower oven temperature, and then the
> > quality of the browning on the top side suffers.
> >
> > I get a more uniform bake with the fibrament stone. With the oven at
> > 500f the bottom of the crust is not over hard, the crumb is well
> > developed,
> > and if i use the old tiles to lower the ceiling over the pizza, the top
> > is very well browned.
> SNIP
>
> I'm curious, what is there about the fibrament stone that allows it to
> cook more uniformly than the ceramic tiles, the thickness? My old
> Saltilo tiles were about 3/4 inch thick and made the el cheapo Sears
> oven we used at that time fairly usable. They cracked, but I used them
> for almost 20 years that way with no problems.


I've never used saltillo in an oven, so I can't compare it directly.

The fibrament cement is a mixture of heat conductive materials and
insulating materials that ensure a more steady rate of thermal transfer.
Certainly more steady than my old ceramic tiles, which are admittedly
denser than saltillo.


> The oven of the local pizza joint, Fuzzy's, is set to almost 600 degrees
> and has what looks like a thick brick-like floor. Since it is constantly
> being opened I assume it probably stays around 500 degrees. Excellent
> pizza BTW.


The pizza fascists from Naples mandate an oven temperature in excess of
700 degrees. At least if you want to call it Neapolitan Pizza (tm). At
these temperatures, the bake time is less than 2 minutes.

There are probably a lot of good commercial oven floor materials.
Fibrament is the only one that I know of available in a home oven product
that can be ordered online and arrive at your door inside of a week, with a
10 year warranty.

With my ceramic tiles, I had this problem. The accepted wisdom is "as
hot as possible" but at 500f the ceramic tiles were turning my crust into a
cracker. I had to back it down to 425, and then the outer crust still came
out crunchy.

With the fibrament slab, it takes a lot longer to get it up to 500f
than it took with the ceramic tiles. My bake time is shorter than it was at
500f with the ceramic tiles.

There's a distinctive acrid stench of searing dough when the stone
starts to dump heat into the pizza. With the fibrament stone, it's not as
strong, and it doesn't last as long. I suspect that this means that the
peak thermal transfer rate rapidly drops off after the initial contact.

But, the crust is cooked through faster, which has to mean that the
curve flattens out and i get more heat over time than i did with the
ceramic tiles.

The other great thing, the outer ring of the crust is crisp and browned
on the outside, soft, fluffy, and chewey on the inside. This was a
surprise. I did not expect this at all. It's also very nice.

It looks like the secret to bubbling cheese and browned toppings
WITHOUT an overcooked crust at home is lowering the ceiling over the pizza.

If you go to Lowes or Home Depot you can get five 7" unglazed quarry
tiles for about a dollar each, and if you *ask, they will grudgingly admit
that they can cut one of them for free. Have them cut one of them squarely
in half, perpendicular to the ridges on the underside of the tile. This
will give you a 14x17.5 ceramic shelf on one of your oven racks. Assuming
you can fit that on your racks. This is what i used to bake my pizza on.

With this 6" above the pizza, by the time the outer ring of the crust is
browned, the cheese in the center is bubbling and the pepperoni has started
to curl upward. This is probably true even if you're baking a frozen pizza
on the bare rack.

You'd think that all the open air space above this suspended ceiling
would kill the effect, but it doesn't. I should experiment with putting, I
don't know, a pan of bread sticks up there.

It might be possible to get some of the same effect by putting a half
sheet pan (cookie sheet? what's that?) on the rack above whatever you're
baking your pizza on, but I'm not going to experiment with that until the
next time i get roped into baking pizza at my parents house.

Try Charles Van Over's "The Best Bread Ever" for THE WAY in your food
processor. Also highly recommended are Peter Rineharts's fine works
on breads.

Three cheers for thick stones. The only way to go.

Run your over up as HIGH as it will go; typically this will be only
about 550 but with a thick stone and at least an hour preheat you will
get closer to the real thing found in the brick ovens.

Weigh your ingredients, stick to maybe 68% hydration on pizza dough.
Skip the oil. Go easy on the yeast, and no sugar. Forget about
tossing.

We spent 3 weeks in Italy last fall and I was pleased to visit quite a
few pizzerias. I talked my way into the back room of several just to
witness exactly how they do it. The best pizza we had there came from
a place in Tuscany where I watched the guys grab balls of dough, slam
'em down on the counter, give 'em about 6 or 7 quick rolls in several
directions with the french pin, and whip out a ready to go pizza in
about 20 seconds. Into the hearth oven and no more than about 3
minutes later out comes a smoking hot beautifully cooked pizza.

Nirvana.

By the way, is there a general consensus that the Fibraments are pretty
much the way to go? This stuff is actually in many commercial ovens as
the decking, I believe, yes?

pizza stone snob
"Eric Jorgensen" > wrote in message
news:20050325220743.63989d18@wafer...
> On Sat, 26 Mar 2005 04:25:09 GMT
> "jimmyjames" > wrote:
>
> > I have an "unglazed ceramic tile" 5/8ths 14x14 (Sq.)
> > It works every bit as good as my 18" round pizza pan with the "holes".
> > Except when I use the stone, I have to not only have to heat up the
> > oven, I have to heat up the stinkin stone. The people at "bed, bath and
> > beyond" really wanted me to buy a pizza stone... I asked what the
> > advantage was and they said " well, alls ya gotta do is heat the stone,
> > take the pizza out of the box, and slide the pizza on to the stone"
> > I'll put my pizza up to anyones! Stinkin' "pizza stone snobs"!
>
>
> Aight. You're on. Come on over any time.
>
> I upgraded from five 7" unglazed ceramic tiles to a 20x15x.75 Fibrament
> stone this week. I have one of those perforated pans, too.
>
> The difference is more than noticeable.
>
> The perforated pans trap too much moisture, and the bottom of the crust
> ends up being slightly gelled by the steam. Also, cheese gets stuck in the
> holes and i hate cleaning it.
>
> The ceramic tile transfers heat very quickly, and the bottom of the
> crust is very well seared, but then it's pretty much done. The bottom of
> the pizza ends up being over-hard and the quality of the crumb suffers
> because of the drop in the rate of thermal transfer. The only way to
> compensate is to use a lower oven temperature, and then the quality of the
> browning on the top side suffers.
>
> I get a more uniform bake with the fibrament stone. With the oven at
> 500f the bottom of the crust is not over hard, the crumb is well
developed,
> and if i use the old tiles to lower the ceiling over the pizza, the top is
> very well browned.
>
> I'm still experimenting with it. Made my third pizza tonight. I'm sure
> i'll get sick of pizza at some point and have to start making breads on
it.
>
> Do i have to preheat it? You betcha. It takes like an hour for my 70's
> vintage crappy Whirlpool oven to get it to 500f. But it's worth it.
>
> As for BB&B, I've seen their pizza stone, and it's best used as a clay
> pigeon.
>
> Someone here mentioned having a great deal of success with a slab of
> soapstone, and i imagine that works quite well. More likely to break than
> the fibrament stone, but way cheaper if you buy it as a scrap -- stone
> vendors often have likely shaped chunks left over after cutting out a hole
> for a sink in a counter top, for example.
>

pizza stone snob
"Eric Jorgensen" > wrote in message
news:20050325220743.63989d18@wafer...
> On Sat, 26 Mar 2005 04:25:09 GMT
> "jimmyjames" > wrote:
>
> > I have an "unglazed ceramic tile" 5/8ths 14x14 (Sq.)
> > It works every bit as good as my 18" round pizza pan with the "holes".
> > Except when I use the stone, I have to not only have to heat up the
> > oven, I have to heat up the stinkin stone. The people at "bed, bath and
> > beyond" really wanted me to buy a pizza stone... I asked what the
> > advantage was and they said " well, alls ya gotta do is heat the stone,
> > take the pizza out of the box, and slide the pizza on to the stone"
> > I'll put my pizza up to anyones! Stinkin' "pizza stone snobs"!
>
>
> Aight. You're on. Come on over any time.
>
> I upgraded from five 7" unglazed ceramic tiles to a 20x15x.75 Fibrament
> stone this week. I have one of those perforated pans, too.
>
> The difference is more than noticeable.
>
> The perforated pans trap too much moisture, and the bottom of the crust
> ends up being slightly gelled by the steam. Also, cheese gets stuck in the
> holes and i hate cleaning it.
>
> The ceramic tile transfers heat very quickly, and the bottom of the
> crust is very well seared, but then it's pretty much done. The bottom of
> the pizza ends up being over-hard and the quality of the crumb suffers
> because of the drop in the rate of thermal transfer. The only way to
> compensate is to use a lower oven temperature, and then the quality of the
> browning on the top side suffers.
>
> I get a more uniform bake with the fibrament stone. With the oven at
> 500f the bottom of the crust is not over hard, the crumb is well
developed,
> and if i use the old tiles to lower the ceiling over the pizza, the top is
> very well browned.
>
> I'm still experimenting with it. Made my third pizza tonight. I'm sure
> i'll get sick of pizza at some point and have to start making breads on
it.
>
> Do i have to preheat it? You betcha. It takes like an hour for my 70's
> vintage crappy Whirlpool oven to get it to 500f. But it's worth it.
>
> As for BB&B, I've seen their pizza stone, and it's best used as a clay
> pigeon.
>
> Someone here mentioned having a great deal of success with a slab of
> soapstone, and i imagine that works quite well. More likely to break than
> the fibrament stone, but way cheaper if you buy it as a scrap -- stone
> vendors often have likely shaped chunks left over after cutting out a hole
> for a sink in a counter top, for example.
>

On Wed, 27 Apr 2005 03:35:02 GMT
"jimmyjames" > wrote:

> pizza stone snob


I'm also a tea snob, and an unrepentant arguer that volkswagens are
superior to hondas. I also believe that it's entirely appropriate for a
convicted felon such as Martha Stewart to have to wear a cumbersome
tracking device while under house arrest - just to remind 'em that they're
still being punished.

Wanna make something of it? I question your right to use the name of a
Stephen Root character, and challenge you to a bake-off, provided you can
pay my nominal travel and hosting fees . . .

On Wed, 27 Apr 2005 03:35:02 GMT
"jimmyjames" > wrote:

> pizza stone snob


I'm also a tea snob, and an unrepentant arguer that volkswagens are
superior to hondas. I also believe that it's entirely appropriate for a
convicted felon such as Martha Stewart to have to wear a cumbersome
tracking device while under house arrest - just to remind 'em that they're
still being punished.

Wanna make something of it? I question your right to use the name of a
Stephen Root character, and challenge you to a bake-off, provided you can
pay my nominal travel and hosting fees . . .

Tea... That's a Chinese drink isn't it? Aren't they a seven or eight
thousand year old society that still use sticks to eat with? And the VW and
Honda thing? We fought both Japan and Germany in the last "Big One" and now
If you're driving an American made car, "Yer sum kinda idiot!" I DRIVE A
TOYOTA! MADE RIGHT HERE IN THE GOOD OL' USA!
Martha Stewart?!?! I alllllwaaaayzz hated her... ("Hate?... That's some
mighty strong language there, "BIG BOY"...) But that's plenty to fill
volumes and volumes on another day.... Anyway... I think that both OJ and
Michael Jackson are completely INNOCENT!
And the name? It's my "given" last name... My full name is James J
Jimmyjames.
James James Jimmyjames IV

> I'm also a tea snob, and an unrepentant arguer that volkswagens are
> superior to hondas. I also believe that it's entirely appropriate for a
> convicted felon such as Martha Stewart to have to wear a cumbersome
> tracking device while under house arrest - just to remind 'em that they're
> still being punished.
>
> Wanna make something of it? I question your right to use the name of a
> Stephen Root character, and challenge you to a bake-off, provided you can
> pay my nominal travel and hosting fees . . .

Oh yea... As an experiment, Last night, I made a pizza using "Pillsbury
Pizza Dough" I even used the stinkin' Pizza Stone. I used Italian Sausage,
Manzinilla olive slices, Sauteed Onions and Mushrooms, pepperoni and a
little more than a lb. of mozerla...
It was better than frozen, better than boboli... but not nearly as good as
Good ol' homade crust on my perforated pan...

"Eric Jorgensen" > wrote in message
news:20050427085609.4f9e381f@wafer...
> On Wed, 27 Apr 2005 03:35:02 GMT
> "jimmyjames" > wrote:
>
> > pizza stone snob
>
>
> I'm also a tea snob, and an unrepentant arguer that volkswagens are
> superior to hondas. I also believe that it's entirely appropriate for a
> convicted felon such as Martha Stewart to have to wear a cumbersome
> tracking device while under house arrest - just to remind 'em that they're
> still being punished.
>
> Wanna make something of it? I question your right to use the name of a
> Stephen Root character, and challenge you to a bake-off, provided you can
> pay my nominal travel and hosting fees . . .