Baking (rec.food.baking) For bakers, would-be bakers, and fans and consumers of breads, pastries, cakes, pies, cookies, crackers, bagels, and other items commonly found in a bakery. Includes all methods of preparation, both conventional and not.

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  #16 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 24-03-2005, 03:29 AM
Vox Humana
 
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"Sridhar Sathya" wrote in message
...
Thanks for your suggestions. As suggested I reduced the oil &
water(little less); also I let the dough stand in the refrigerator for
about 10 hours. Now I'm able to handle the dough very well.



Good to hear! Also, you may notice an improvment in the flavor and texture
of the dough from retarding the fermentation. I think that letting the
dough rise in the refrigerator allows you to make pizzas in a more impromptu
manner. The dough will keep for a few days before becoming too sour, so you
have flexibility to make the dough when you have a few minutes and then make
up the pizza when you are ready to eat.



  #17 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 24-03-2005, 05:00 AM
Jerry DeAngelis
 
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Hello

You have certainly been given a great deal of useful information already
relative to the problem you posed. Should you want more information,
try the pizza dough recipes on The Artisan.

These can be accessed from http://www.theartisan.net/bredfrm.htm. This
is the menu for all the breads and flatbreads on the site. The pizze
recipes links are near the bottom of the left hand menu.

If you want the specific recipe for pizza dough, use this link:
http://www.theartisan.net/pizzabas.htm

Hope this helps

Regards

Jerry @ The Artisan
http://www.theartisan.net



"Sridhar Sathya" wrote in message
...
When I make pizza dough it raises well, around double the size in
about 45 minutes. The problem with my dough is it is too gooie and I'm
not able to toss it. Even when I try to knead it it is too elastic and
shrinks as I knead the dough.


I follow the following recipe (I use a bread machine for making the
dough).
1 tablespoon sugar
1 1/4 cup water
1 teaspoon yeast
3 cups bread flour
1 teaspoon salt
1/4 cup oil.


Any suggestions?



  #18 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 24-03-2005, 05:11 AM
Vox Humana
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Jerry DeAngelis" wrote in message
nk.net...
Hello

You have certainly been given a great deal of useful information already
relative to the problem you posed. Should you want more information,
try the pizza dough recipes on The Artisan.

These can be accessed from http://www.theartisan.net/bredfrm.htm. This
is the menu for all the breads and flatbreads on the site. The pizze
recipes links are near the bottom of the left hand menu.

If you want the specific recipe for pizza dough, use this link:
http://www.theartisan.net/pizzabas.htm

Hope this helps

Regards

Jerry @ The Artisan
http://www.theartisan.net


I just wanted to tell you how much I have enjoyed your site. It always has
good recipes and great, in-depth information.


  #19 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 24-03-2005, 05:11 AM
Vox Humana
 
Posts: n/a
Default


"Jerry DeAngelis" wrote in message
nk.net...
Hello

You have certainly been given a great deal of useful information already
relative to the problem you posed. Should you want more information,
try the pizza dough recipes on The Artisan.

These can be accessed from http://www.theartisan.net/bredfrm.htm. This
is the menu for all the breads and flatbreads on the site. The pizze
recipes links are near the bottom of the left hand menu.

If you want the specific recipe for pizza dough, use this link:
http://www.theartisan.net/pizzabas.htm

Hope this helps

Regards

Jerry @ The Artisan
http://www.theartisan.net


I just wanted to tell you how much I have enjoyed your site. It always has
good recipes and great, in-depth information.


  #20 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 24-03-2005, 05:32 AM
Jerry DeAngelis
 
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Vox

Thank you! We really enjoy the work, and wish we could do more. Now
that we are making wine and olive oil, time is at a premium, and we
cannot do as much as we once could.

Regards

Jerry @ the Artisan
http://www.theartisan.net



"Vox Humana" wrote in message
...

"Jerry DeAngelis" wrote in message
nk.net...
Hello

You have certainly been given a great deal of useful information
already
relative to the problem you posed. Should you want more information,
try the pizza dough recipes on The Artisan.

These can be accessed from http://www.theartisan.net/bredfrm.htm.
This
is the menu for all the breads and flatbreads on the site. The pizze
recipes links are near the bottom of the left hand menu.

If you want the specific recipe for pizza dough, use this link:
http://www.theartisan.net/pizzabas.htm

Hope this helps

Regards

Jerry @ The Artisan
http://www.theartisan.net


I just wanted to tell you how much I have enjoyed your site. It
always has
good recipes and great, in-depth information.






  #21 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 24-03-2005, 05:32 AM
Jerry DeAngelis
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Vox

Thank you! We really enjoy the work, and wish we could do more. Now
that we are making wine and olive oil, time is at a premium, and we
cannot do as much as we once could.

Regards

Jerry @ the Artisan
http://www.theartisan.net



"Vox Humana" wrote in message
...

"Jerry DeAngelis" wrote in message
nk.net...
Hello

You have certainly been given a great deal of useful information
already
relative to the problem you posed. Should you want more information,
try the pizza dough recipes on The Artisan.

These can be accessed from http://www.theartisan.net/bredfrm.htm.
This
is the menu for all the breads and flatbreads on the site. The pizze
recipes links are near the bottom of the left hand menu.

If you want the specific recipe for pizza dough, use this link:
http://www.theartisan.net/pizzabas.htm

Hope this helps

Regards

Jerry @ The Artisan
http://www.theartisan.net


I just wanted to tell you how much I have enjoyed your site. It
always has
good recipes and great, in-depth information.




  #22 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 25-03-2005, 12:20 AM
jimmyjames
 
Posts: n/a
Default

MY recipe is exactly yhe same as yours except I use 2 tbls of olive oil...
It works perfect every time. I'd dump it out of the bread machine hopper(?)
and flour the board... push the bubbles out (a little kneeding) form it into
a ball spray a glass bowl put the ball into the bowl spray w/spray oil turn
it over and cover it w/a dishtowel for 30 min I used to just roll it from
the center... then one day I decided to try "tossing" the dough... It
worked out real well... I did that for a while and noticed no difference.
so, now, I just roll it from the center. let it rise another 20 min. or
not if I'm really hungry
I don't use a "Pizza Stone" ( they're really just for frozen pizzas) and I
cook the pizza @ around 500 for about 12 - 13 min
"Sridhar Sathya" wrote in message
...
When I make pizza dough it raises well, around double the size in about
45 minutes. The problem with my dough is it is too gooie and I'm not
able to toss it. Even when I try to knead it it is too elastic and
shrinks as I knead the dough.


I follow the following recipe (I use a bread machine for making the

dough).
1 tablespoon sugar
1 1/4 cup water
1 teaspoon yeast
3 cups bread flour
1 teaspoon salt
1/4 cup oil.


Any suggestions?



  #23 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 25-03-2005, 12:23 AM
Vox Humana
 
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Default


"jimmyjames" wrote in message
ink.net...

I don't use a "Pizza Stone" ( they're really just for frozen pizzas)



WHAT!


  #24 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 25-03-2005, 12:34 AM
Eric Jorgensen
 
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On Thu, 24 Mar 2005 23:20:21 GMT
"jimmyjames" wrote:


I don't use a "Pizza Stone" ( they're really just for frozen pizzas)



Where did you get that idea? From your Pampered Chef rep?

Quarter inch thick ceramic baking stones the likes of which PC sells are
for . . . . . skeet shooting. They have very little thermal mass and have
no place in any oven, imho.

Real baking stones - or even makeshift baking stones like slabs of
soapstone, unglazed ceramic tiles, or as Alton Brown recently demonstrated,
heavy unglazed ceramic planter trays, are for anyone who wants a fast bake
time and a crisp crust.

  #25 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 25-03-2005, 12:49 AM
Kenneth
 
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Default

On Thu, 24 Mar 2005 23:20:21 GMT, "jimmyjames"
wrote:

I don't use a "Pizza Stone" ( they're really just for frozen pizzas)


Howdy,

I don't know why you believe that, but disagree in any case.
A massive stone can make a very significant difference in a
pizza, and in lots of other baked goods as well.

All the best,

--
Kenneth

If you email... Please remove the "SPAMLESS."


  #26 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 26-03-2005, 05:25 AM
jimmyjames
 
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I have an "unglazed ceramic tile" 5/8ths 14x14 (Sq.)
It works every bit as good as my 18" round pizza pan with the "holes".
Except when I use the stone, I have to not only have to heat up the oven,
I have to heat up the stinkin stone. The people at "bed, bath and beyond"
really wanted me to buy a pizza stone... I asked what the advantage was and
they said " well, alls ya gotta do is heat the stone, take the pizza out of
the box, and slide the pizza on to the stone"
I'll put my pizza up to anyones! Stinkin' "pizza stone snobs"!

"Kenneth" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 24 Mar 2005 23:20:21 GMT, "jimmyjames"
wrote:

I don't use a "Pizza Stone" ( they're really just for frozen pizzas)


Howdy,

I don't know why you believe that, but disagree in any case.
A massive stone can make a very significant difference in a
pizza, and in lots of other baked goods as well.

All the best,

--
Kenneth

If you email... Please remove the "SPAMLESS."



  #27 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 26-03-2005, 05:25 AM
jimmyjames
 
Posts: n/a
Default

I have an "unglazed ceramic tile" 5/8ths 14x14 (Sq.)
It works every bit as good as my 18" round pizza pan with the "holes".
Except when I use the stone, I have to not only have to heat up the oven,
I have to heat up the stinkin stone. The people at "bed, bath and beyond"
really wanted me to buy a pizza stone... I asked what the advantage was and
they said " well, alls ya gotta do is heat the stone, take the pizza out of
the box, and slide the pizza on to the stone"
I'll put my pizza up to anyones! Stinkin' "pizza stone snobs"!

"Kenneth" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 24 Mar 2005 23:20:21 GMT, "jimmyjames"
wrote:

I don't use a "Pizza Stone" ( they're really just for frozen pizzas)


Howdy,

I don't know why you believe that, but disagree in any case.
A massive stone can make a very significant difference in a
pizza, and in lots of other baked goods as well.

All the best,

--
Kenneth

If you email... Please remove the "SPAMLESS."



  #28 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 26-03-2005, 06:07 AM
Eric Jorgensen
 
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Default

On Sat, 26 Mar 2005 04:25:09 GMT
"jimmyjames" wrote:

I have an "unglazed ceramic tile" 5/8ths 14x14 (Sq.)
It works every bit as good as my 18" round pizza pan with the "holes".
Except when I use the stone, I have to not only have to heat up the
oven, I have to heat up the stinkin stone. The people at "bed, bath and
beyond" really wanted me to buy a pizza stone... I asked what the
advantage was and they said " well, alls ya gotta do is heat the stone,
take the pizza out of the box, and slide the pizza on to the stone"
I'll put my pizza up to anyones! Stinkin' "pizza stone snobs"!



Aight. You're on. Come on over any time.

I upgraded from five 7" unglazed ceramic tiles to a 20x15x.75 Fibrament
stone this week. I have one of those perforated pans, too.

The difference is more than noticeable.

The perforated pans trap too much moisture, and the bottom of the crust
ends up being slightly gelled by the steam. Also, cheese gets stuck in the
holes and i hate cleaning it.

The ceramic tile transfers heat very quickly, and the bottom of the
crust is very well seared, but then it's pretty much done. The bottom of
the pizza ends up being over-hard and the quality of the crumb suffers
because of the drop in the rate of thermal transfer. The only way to
compensate is to use a lower oven temperature, and then the quality of the
browning on the top side suffers.

I get a more uniform bake with the fibrament stone. With the oven at
500f the bottom of the crust is not over hard, the crumb is well developed,
and if i use the old tiles to lower the ceiling over the pizza, the top is
very well browned.

I'm still experimenting with it. Made my third pizza tonight. I'm sure
i'll get sick of pizza at some point and have to start making breads on it.

Do i have to preheat it? You betcha. It takes like an hour for my 70's
vintage crappy Whirlpool oven to get it to 500f. But it's worth it.

As for BB&B, I've seen their pizza stone, and it's best used as a clay
pigeon.

Someone here mentioned having a great deal of success with a slab of
soapstone, and i imagine that works quite well. More likely to break than
the fibrament stone, but way cheaper if you buy it as a scrap -- stone
vendors often have likely shaped chunks left over after cutting out a hole
for a sink in a counter top, for example.

  #29 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 26-03-2005, 06:07 AM
Eric Jorgensen
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Sat, 26 Mar 2005 04:25:09 GMT
"jimmyjames" wrote:

I have an "unglazed ceramic tile" 5/8ths 14x14 (Sq.)
It works every bit as good as my 18" round pizza pan with the "holes".
Except when I use the stone, I have to not only have to heat up the
oven, I have to heat up the stinkin stone. The people at "bed, bath and
beyond" really wanted me to buy a pizza stone... I asked what the
advantage was and they said " well, alls ya gotta do is heat the stone,
take the pizza out of the box, and slide the pizza on to the stone"
I'll put my pizza up to anyones! Stinkin' "pizza stone snobs"!



Aight. You're on. Come on over any time.

I upgraded from five 7" unglazed ceramic tiles to a 20x15x.75 Fibrament
stone this week. I have one of those perforated pans, too.

The difference is more than noticeable.

The perforated pans trap too much moisture, and the bottom of the crust
ends up being slightly gelled by the steam. Also, cheese gets stuck in the
holes and i hate cleaning it.

The ceramic tile transfers heat very quickly, and the bottom of the
crust is very well seared, but then it's pretty much done. The bottom of
the pizza ends up being over-hard and the quality of the crumb suffers
because of the drop in the rate of thermal transfer. The only way to
compensate is to use a lower oven temperature, and then the quality of the
browning on the top side suffers.

I get a more uniform bake with the fibrament stone. With the oven at
500f the bottom of the crust is not over hard, the crumb is well developed,
and if i use the old tiles to lower the ceiling over the pizza, the top is
very well browned.

I'm still experimenting with it. Made my third pizza tonight. I'm sure
i'll get sick of pizza at some point and have to start making breads on it.

Do i have to preheat it? You betcha. It takes like an hour for my 70's
vintage crappy Whirlpool oven to get it to 500f. But it's worth it.

As for BB&B, I've seen their pizza stone, and it's best used as a clay
pigeon.

Someone here mentioned having a great deal of success with a slab of
soapstone, and i imagine that works quite well. More likely to break than
the fibrament stone, but way cheaper if you buy it as a scrap -- stone
vendors often have likely shaped chunks left over after cutting out a hole
for a sink in a counter top, for example.

  #30 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 27-03-2005, 04:35 AM
Raj V
 
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Eric Jorgensen wrote:
SNIP
The ceramic tile transfers heat very quickly, and the bottom of the
crust is very well seared, but then it's pretty much done. The bottom of
the pizza ends up being over-hard and the quality of the crumb suffers
because of the drop in the rate of thermal transfer. The only way to
compensate is to use a lower oven temperature, and then the quality of the
browning on the top side suffers.

I get a more uniform bake with the fibrament stone. With the oven at
500f the bottom of the crust is not over hard, the crumb is well
developed,
and if i use the old tiles to lower the ceiling over the pizza, the top is
very well browned.

SNIP

I'm curious, what is there about the fibrament stone that allows it to cook
more uniformly than the ceramic tiles, the thickness? My old Saltilo tiles
were about 3/4 inch thick and made the el cheapo Sears oven we used at that
time fairly usable. They cracked, but I used them for almost 20 years that
way with no problems.

The oven of the local pizza joint, Fuzzy's, is set to almost 600 degrees and
has what looks like a thick brick-like floor. Since it is constantly being
opened I assume it probably stays around 500 degrees. Excellent pizza BTW.

Raj V




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