Sourdough (rec.food.sourdough) Discussing the hobby or craft of baking with sourdough. We are not just a recipe group, Our charter is to discuss the care, feeding, and breeding of yeasts and lactobacilli that make up sourdough cultures.

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Old 14-02-2016, 12:27 AM posted to rec.food.sourdough
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Default Sourdough with an automatic bread maker?

Since there has been some posts here from real sourdough enthusiasts,
I thought I'd try posting this question.

Has anyone here found a way to use an automatic breadmaker to make
sourdough bread?

I see them at thrift stores for less than $10 on almost every visit,
and some are complete with instructions and even unused!

The problem I see is the rise time of sourdough being way longer than
what can be set in a bread maker. I;m not sure how to get around that
limitation so I've always made my sourdough bread using my stand mixer
for the basic mixing and hand kneading for working the dough between
rises, then the oven for the final part of it.

If there isn't enough activity here I can try the Fresh Loaf site and
the Facebook group someone mentioned here (I joined it).

Donald

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Old 14-02-2016, 10:54 PM posted to rec.food.sourdough
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Default Sourdough with an automatic bread maker?

Go search over he
http://www.thefreshloaf.com/
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Old 15-02-2016, 02:17 PM posted to rec.food.sourdough
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Default Sourdough with an automatic bread maker?

On Sat, 13 Feb 2016 18:27:58 -0500, Donald
wrote:

Since there has been some posts here from real sourdough enthusiasts,
I thought I'd try posting this question.

Has anyone here found a way to use an automatic breadmaker to make
sourdough bread?

I see them at thrift stores for less than $10 on almost every visit,
and some are complete with instructions and even unused!

The problem I see is the rise time of sourdough being way longer than
what can be set in a bread maker. I;m not sure how to get around that
limitation so I've always made my sourdough bread using my stand mixer
for the basic mixing and hand kneading for working the dough between
rises, then the oven for the final part of it.

If there isn't enough activity here I can try the Fresh Loaf site and
the Facebook group someone mentioned here (I joined it).


Facekook ? You must be crazy. Only kooks use Facekook.
My mother pauses her bread maker, then un-pauses it when the
sourdough rises, but I can't remember what brand she uses. All I know
it that it's very old and was expensive.
I prefer hand kneading, and I never allow the dough to rise
twice, because it loses some of it's "spring". Probably due to the
Lactobacilli eating up the gluten.
I mix, knead well, let stand an hour, shape, slash, let rise
(up to 10 hours, depends on temp) and bake.
[]'s
--
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We have a new policy - Google 2012
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Old 15-02-2016, 03:08 PM posted to rec.food.sourdough
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Default Sourdough with an automatic bread maker?

On Mon, 15 Feb 2016 11:17:33 -0200, Shadow wrote:

On Sat, 13 Feb 2016 18:27:58 -0500, Donald
wrote:

Since there has been some posts here from real sourdough enthusiasts,
I thought I'd try posting this question.

Has anyone here found a way to use an automatic breadmaker to make
sourdough bread?

I see them at thrift stores for less than $10 on almost every visit,
and some are complete with instructions and even unused!

The problem I see is the rise time of sourdough being way longer than
what can be set in a bread maker. I;m not sure how to get around that
limitation so I've always made my sourdough bread using my stand mixer
for the basic mixing and hand kneading for working the dough between
rises, then the oven for the final part of it.

If there isn't enough activity here I can try the Fresh Loaf site and
the Facebook group someone mentioned here (I joined it).


Facekook ? You must be crazy. Only kooks use Facekook.


Actually, the sourdough and bread baking groups on FB are quite
interesting and heaven knows, much more active than this Usenet group.

As a full participant in each of these groups over quite a long time
- here, the Fresh Loaf and on the various bread groups in FB, there is
lots of info out there about many topics.

I did not weigh in on the OP's question, as I think the work-around
needed for a bread machine sourdough are not worth the effort.



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Old 15-02-2016, 06:37 PM posted to rec.food.sourdough
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Default Sourdough with an automatic bread maker?

In article ,
Donald wrote:
Since there has been some posts here from real sourdough enthusiasts,
I thought I'd try posting this question.

Has anyone here found a way to use an automatic breadmaker to make
sourdough bread?

I see them at thrift stores for less than $10 on almost every visit,
and some are complete with instructions and even unused!

The problem I see is the rise time of sourdough being way longer than
what can be set in a bread maker. I;m not sure how to get around that
limitation so I've always made my sourdough bread using my stand mixer
for the basic mixing and hand kneading for working the dough between
rises, then the oven for the final part of it.


A conventional ABM won't be enough for you - however it might be good
for the initial mixing and kneading phase, then remove for a longer
ferment, etc.

However, Panasonic recently released a new one that does have a sourdough program.

http://www.panasonic.com/uk/consumer...sd-zb2512.html

I've no idea how good/bad/indifferent it is though, but it's a start.

Gordon


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Old 15-02-2016, 07:45 PM posted to rec.food.sourdough
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Default Sourdough with an automatic bread maker?

On Mon, 15 Feb 2016 17:37:42 -0000 (UTC), Gordon Henderson
wrote:

In article ,
Donald wrote:
Since there has been some posts here from real sourdough enthusiasts,
I thought I'd try posting this question.

Has anyone here found a way to use an automatic breadmaker to make
sourdough bread?

I see them at thrift stores for less than $10 on almost every visit,
and some are complete with instructions and even unused!

The problem I see is the rise time of sourdough being way longer than
what can be set in a bread maker. I;m not sure how to get around that
limitation so I've always made my sourdough bread using my stand mixer
for the basic mixing and hand kneading for working the dough between
rises, then the oven for the final part of it.


A conventional ABM won't be enough for you - however it might be good
for the initial mixing and kneading phase, then remove for a longer
ferment, etc.

However, Panasonic recently released a new one that does have a sourdough program.

http://www.panasonic.com/uk/consumer...sd-zb2512.html

I've no idea how good/bad/indifferent it is though, but it's a start.


Under the "French" setting, it rests for 2 hours, kneads
quickly (10 minutes), then allows to rise for another 4 hours, which
would be fine.
Funny, the "Rustic Sourdough" setting kneads much longer and
has quite a short rise.
When my Mom's burns out, I'll get her one. She's too old to
knead. 90 + arthritis etc.
A search on Amazon USA came up nihil, and it's announced as
"European". Any idea of cost ?
[]'s
--
Don't be evil - Google 2004
We have a new policy - Google 2012
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Old 16-02-2016, 04:35 PM posted to rec.food.sourdough
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Default Sourdough with an automatic bread maker?

In article ,
Shadow wrote:
On Mon, 15 Feb 2016 17:37:42 -0000 (UTC), Gordon Henderson
wrote:

In article ,
Donald wrote:
Since there has been some posts here from real sourdough enthusiasts,
I thought I'd try posting this question.

Has anyone here found a way to use an automatic breadmaker to make
sourdough bread?

I see them at thrift stores for less than $10 on almost every visit,
and some are complete with instructions and even unused!

The problem I see is the rise time of sourdough being way longer than
what can be set in a bread maker. I;m not sure how to get around that
limitation so I've always made my sourdough bread using my stand mixer
for the basic mixing and hand kneading for working the dough between
rises, then the oven for the final part of it.


A conventional ABM won't be enough for you - however it might be good
for the initial mixing and kneading phase, then remove for a longer
ferment, etc.

However, Panasonic recently released a new one that does have a sourdough program.

http://www.panasonic.com/uk/consumer...sd-zb2512.html

I've no idea how good/bad/indifferent it is though, but it's a start.


Under the "French" setting, it rests for 2 hours, kneads
quickly (10 minutes), then allows to rise for another 4 hours, which
would be fine.
Funny, the "Rustic Sourdough" setting kneads much longer and
has quite a short rise.
When my Mom's burns out, I'll get her one. She's too old to
knead. 90 + arthritis etc.
A search on Amazon USA came up nihil, and it's announced as
"European". Any idea of cost ?


Not cheap:
http://www.johnlewis.com/panasonic-s...steel/p2029308
and £189.95 ...

Gordon
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Old 18-02-2016, 12:43 AM posted to rec.food.sourdough
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Default Sourdough with an automatic bread maker?

On Tue, 16 Feb 2016 15:35:06 -0000 (UTC), Gordon Henderson
wrote:

In article ,
Shadow wrote:
On Mon, 15 Feb 2016 17:37:42 -0000 (UTC), Gordon Henderson
wrote:

In article ,
Donald wrote:
Since there has been some posts here from real sourdough enthusiasts,
I thought I'd try posting this question.

Has anyone here found a way to use an automatic breadmaker to make
sourdough bread?

I see them at thrift stores for less than $10 on almost every visit,
and some are complete with instructions and even unused!

The problem I see is the rise time of sourdough being way longer than
what can be set in a bread maker. I;m not sure how to get around that
limitation so I've always made my sourdough bread using my stand mixer
for the basic mixing and hand kneading for working the dough between
rises, then the oven for the final part of it.

A conventional ABM won't be enough for you - however it might be good
for the initial mixing and kneading phase, then remove for a longer
ferment, etc.

However, Panasonic recently released a new one that does have a sourdough program.

http://www.panasonic.com/uk/consumer...sd-zb2512.html

I've no idea how good/bad/indifferent it is though, but it's a start.


Under the "French" setting, it rests for 2 hours, kneads
quickly (10 minutes), then allows to rise for another 4 hours, which
would be fine.
Funny, the "Rustic Sourdough" setting kneads much longer and
has quite a short rise.
When my Mom's burns out, I'll get her one. She's too old to
knead. 90 + arthritis etc.
A search on Amazon USA came up nihil, and it's announced as
"European". Any idea of cost ?


Not cheap:
http://www.johnlewis.com/panasonic-s...steel/p2029308
and £189.95 ...


Thanks. But that is England only.

US$ 275. Very expensive, probably not many being manufactured,
a niche **product.
Postage and taxes would be absurd, but I could have someone
bring one out from the US.
[]'s

** Probably means spare parts will be hard to find.

PS I live in Brazil
--
Don't be evil - Google 2004
We have a new policy - Google 2012
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Old 13-03-2016, 06:09 PM posted to rec.food.sourdough
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Default Sourdough with an automatic bread maker?

On 13-Feb-16 15:27, Donald wrote:
Since there has been some posts here from real sourdough enthusiasts,
I thought I'd try posting this question.

Has anyone here found a way to use an automatic breadmaker to make
sourdough bread?

I see them at thrift stores for less than $10 on almost every visit,
and some are complete with instructions and even unused!

The problem I see is the rise time of sourdough being way longer than
what can be set in a bread maker. I;m not sure how to get around that
limitation so I've always made my sourdough bread using my stand mixer
for the basic mixing and hand kneading for working the dough between
rises, then the oven for the final part of it.

If there isn't enough activity here I can try the Fresh Loaf site and
the Facebook group someone mentioned here (I joined it).

Donald

Dang! No traffic for so long...so I don't visit for a few weeks, and
the wheels fall off !
I know of folks that have used a bread-maker to make sourdough. But, as
others have pointed out, the tomfoolery you have to do to make it do so
is probably not worth the effort. Still, as another poster pointed out,
an aging parent (which I've learned is creeping up on me) would probably
be a good candidate for such a gadget.
Since I used to be involved in embedded systems, I had, over the years,
considered making something specifically for sourdough--both for the
culturing, as well as the mixing and making. But the thoughts and dreams
always faded as I experienced the simple joy of making my dough "by
hand". The years have left me with a simple system of steps that I use,
and I couldn't find a good reason to change that just to do so.
I too have stooped to using the FB groups. I'm probably too old to ever
learn to like using that sewer...but I do so because today I must, and
have no clue what tomorrow will bring.
Oh well. I was delighted to see some traffic in here...it would be
great if more would make an appearance.

Have fun folks--always enjoy your baking,
Dusty
--
"To learn who rules over you, simply find out whom you are not allowed
to criticize." -- Voltaire
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Old 14-03-2016, 04:12 PM posted to rec.food.sourdough
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Default Sourdough "simple system of steps".. Yes, please?

Dang! No traffic for so long...so I don't visit for a few weeks, and
the wheels fall off !
I know of folks that have used a bread-maker to make sourdough. But, as
others have pointed out, the tomfoolery you have to do to make it do so
is probably not worth the effort. Still, as another poster pointed out,
an aging parent (which I've learned is creeping up on me) would probably
be a good candidate for such a gadget.
Since I used to be involved in embedded systems, I had, over the years,
considered making something specifically for sourdough--both for the
culturing, as well as the mixing and making. But the thoughts and dreams
always faded as I experienced the simple joy of making my dough "by
hand". The years have left me with a simple system of steps that I use,
and I couldn't find a good reason to change that just to do so.
I too have stooped to using the FB groups. I'm probably too old to ever
learn to like using that sewer...but I do so because today I must, and
have no clue what tomorrow will bring.
Oh well. I was delighted to see some traffic in here...it would be
great if more would make an appearance.

Have fun folks--always enjoy your baking,
Dusty
--
"To learn who rules over you, simply find out whom you are not allowed
to criticize." -- Voltaire


Dusty, is your simple system of steps, posted here or in Facebook? I could definitely use and would very much appreciate having a simple system. My poor culture is sitting in the fridge, abused and unused.

Thank you.
Lisa


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Old 15-03-2016, 01:08 AM posted to rec.food.sourdough
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Default Sourdough "simple system of steps".. Yes, please?

On 14-Mar-16 08:12, Lisa Lingo wrote:
Dang! No traffic for so long...so I don't visit for a few weeks, and
the wheels fall off !

....snippage...
The years have left me with a simple system of steps that I use,
and I couldn't find a good reason to change that just to do so.

....snippage...

Dusty, is your simple system of steps, posted here or in Facebook? I could definitely use and would very much appreciate having a simple system. My poor culture is sitting in the fridge, abused and unused.

Sadly, my lady, I do not have it in print somewhere (at least not where
I looked on short notice). I have many such instructions, I just
couldn't find the one I used most often. Since our kids & grand-kids
have taken over the making of our bread, I've not had an occasion to use
that in some years. Done too many other, similar things in the interim
to have a clear recollection of that process. Worked out many of the
details, many, many years ago with the help of some of the folks that
used to be in this group (I think--there used to be several active
groups). But, what I will do is browse some of my older archives and
see if I can find it. And, since I'm want to 'make stuff up
as-I-go-along, I'll probably have to try it out a few times to make sure
I got the right process.
At the moment I'm entangled in the process of making some sourdough,
rye, cranberry-walnut bread. Still not coming out the way I want it to
(i.e. it still doesn't look & taste like the stuff I used to get from a
place that used to make it). But this time, once I "get" it, I'll be
sure to write it down in an easy-to-find place.

Take care and be well all,
Dusty
--
"Belief is the blissful twilight that those without the courage of true
convictions cling to in order to escape the sometimes harsh
understanding of reality that comes with truth." -- Dusty 2006
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Old 03-10-2016, 04:19 PM posted to rec.food.sourdough
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Default Sourdough with an automatic bread maker?

On Saturday, February 13, 2016 at 5:27:55 PM UTC-6, Donald wrote:
Since there has been some posts here from real sourdough enthusiasts,
I thought I'd try posting this question.

Has anyone here found a way to use an automatic breadmaker to make
sourdough bread?

I see them at thrift stores for less than $10 on almost every visit,
and some are complete with instructions and even unused!

The problem I see is the rise time of sourdough being way longer than
what can be set in a bread maker. I;m not sure how to get around that
limitation so I've always made my sourdough bread using my stand mixer
for the basic mixing and hand kneading for working the dough between
rises, then the oven for the final part of it.

If there isn't enough activity here I can try the Fresh Loaf site and
the Facebook group someone mentioned here (I joined it).

Donald


I use the Kneading cycle for the first rise. Then, take out the dough, remove the paddle blade, return the dough to the machine. the set to cook. It will go thru the entire cycle; but since the paddle is removed, the knead cycle is just the spindle spinning, the dough is undisturbed. Works good.
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Old 27-11-2016, 04:31 PM posted to rec.food.sourdough
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Default Sourdough with an automatic bread maker?

The original poster added "If there isn't enough activity here I can try the Fresh Loaf site". I unfortunately do the same when activity slows to a crawl here, but have found that there are much less serious sourdough enthusiasts there, more like a plethora of wannabes that believe Peter Reinhart is the god of all things made from flour, and that sugar, honey, grapes, sawdust, or shredded bird cage underlayments are the best way to coax sourdough starter to bubble. You have come to the right place by visiting here, even though the postings of the true sourdough gods (who's teachings have kept my starter crock bubbling over, and my breadbox forever full) are now few and far between, there is a wealth of their knowledge that can be gleaned from archived posts or the sourdough faq. Yes, you will find your bread machine advice at the Fresh Loaf, and no doubt there will be those touting the virtues of it's use. This is actually the same type of thing I was looking for when I first found rec.food.sourdough newsgroup. Within a few short weeks I totally abandoned this path and gave my bread machine away, and am very glad I did. By the way, that 10$ you thought was such a good deal could go a long way with simple sourdough bread making, you don't really need allot of fancy toys or ingredients to make great bread for pennies a loaf. Whatever you do, happy baking!

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Old 05-12-2016, 09:15 PM posted to rec.food.sourdough
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Default Sourdough with an automatic bread maker?

On Saturday, February 13, 2016 at 6:27:55 PM UTC-5, Donald wrote:
Since there has been some posts here from real sourdough enthusiasts,
I thought I'd try posting this question.

Has anyone here found a way to use an automatic breadmaker to make
sourdough bread?

I see them at thrift stores for less than $10 on almost every visit,
and some are complete with instructions and even unused!

The problem I see is the rise time of sourdough being way longer than
what can be set in a bread maker. I;m not sure how to get around that
limitation so I've always made my sourdough bread using my stand mixer
for the basic mixing and hand kneading for working the dough between
rises, then the oven for the final part of it.

If there isn't enough activity here I can try the Fresh Loaf site and
the Facebook group someone mentioned here (I joined it).

Donald


yes I have three of them including the original 1968 Japanese version I make sourdough in them all the time. The recipes are the same for regular breads except the liquid is from the sour dough. recipesource.org is a good place to get sour dough ABM recipes.
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Old 12-12-2016, 03:07 AM posted to rec.food.sourdough
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Default Sourdough with an automatic bread maker?

Thanks!!!

For now I've chosen to stick with my Kitchen Aid stand mixer to do the
kneading and a manual process for the rest of it. This gives me the
flexibility of adjusting the time for the rise to punch-down and the
second rise in case the starter isn't as active as it should be.

The only automatic bread maker that has a long enough resting time
seems to be that expensive Panasonic one a few shared a link to here.
I'm not spending that much on something that still probably would need
some regular yeast to make thigns rise fast enough to use the
appliance to make sourdough bread. Otherwise, it looks to be a fine
machine. I almost bought a Panasonic breadmaker at a thrift store, one
much like that one but not stainless steel. But it will take up yet
more counter space that I don't have, and I already have to move some
things from our back room to the kitchen and back to use them when
they aren't used regularly.

I'll be posting my liquid starter read making process and how to make
a liquid starter from dried starter culture or a "wet dough" type.
That's the only type I"ve even used and I like how it is forgiving in
that you can switch the amounts of warm water and starter to get more
liquid starter into the bread dough and get it going faster if it's
not as active as it should be.

Donald


On Sun, 27 Nov 2016 07:31:10 -0800 (PST), hutchndi
wrote:

Within a few short weeks I totally abandoned this path and gave my bread machine away, and am very glad I did. By the way, that 10$ you thought was such a good deal could go a long way with simple sourdough bread making, you don't really need allot of fancy toys or ingredients to make great bread for pennies a loaf. Whatever you do, happy baking!



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