My new W10 computer is GREAT. Unfortunately, it comes with the
crappiest keyboard ever created (HP). It and the mouse are paired and
USB 'RC' devices. When I'm on it, I can barely type. It's even worse
than my ancient Asus XP eee Netbook keyboard (which is smaller). I
gotta look when I 'touch-type', ferchrysakes!

Maybe I'm jes getting old, but the split MS 'Natural' keyboard on my
old Linux machine is waaaay better. It's literally easier to swap
cables on thw newer W10 box to my old Linux box, than to type on that
newer W10 box with its crappy keyboard and that insufferable Xananews
(yes, Xananews SUCKS!!).

Easier to use slrn on my old Linux box than the insanely faster W10
box. Plus, I'll NEVER access my financial institution on an MS
machine. Geez, MS is in my face, constantly. I even unplug it
(pwr/ethernet) when I shut it off. M$ is even trying to get me to
sign a 'Terms of Service'(TOS) agreement. As if!

And the ads!! Every choice I make on that stupifyingly fast W10 box
elicits an ad that wants me to pay more $$! Screw M$ and their crappy
OS!!

</rant=off>

nb

On 15 May 2018 22:46:54 GMT, notbob > wrote:

>My new W10 computer is GREAT. Unfortunately, it comes with the
>crappiest keyboard ever created (HP). It and the mouse are paired and
>USB 'RC' devices. When I'm on it, I can barely type. It's even worse
>than my ancient Asus XP eee Netbook keyboard (which is smaller). I
>gotta look when I 'touch-type', ferchrysakes!
>
>Maybe I'm jes getting old, but the split MS 'Natural' keyboard on my
>old Linux machine is waaaay better. It's literally easier to swap
>cables on thw newer W10 box to my old Linux box, than to type on that
>newer W10 box with its crappy keyboard and that insufferable Xananews
>(yes, Xananews SUCKS!!).
>
>Easier to use slrn on my old Linux box than the insanely faster W10
>box. Plus, I'll NEVER access my financial institution on an MS
>machine. Geez, MS is in my face, constantly. I even unplug it
>(pwr/ethernet) when I shut it off. M$ is even trying to get me to
>sign a 'Terms of Service'(TOS) agreement. As if!
>
>And the ads!! Every choice I make on that stupifyingly fast W10 box
>elicits an ad that wants me to pay more $$! Screw M$ and their crappy
>OS!!
>
></rant=off>
>
>nb

Don't know exactly what you have but I have a Dell puter that came
with keyboard but I bought a Logitech wireless keyboard to put with
it. Just great, you can dedicate keys to websites, so if for
instance, I press the key that has a musical symbol on it, it opens
Agent for me. They are less than $100 here.

As to the ads, put Adbloc plus on your Win 10! I don't see ads.

On 15 May 2018 22:46:54 GMT, notbob wrote:

> My new W10 computer is GREAT. Unfortunately, it comes with the
> crappiest keyboard ever created (HP). It and the mouse are paired and
> USB 'RC' devices. When I'm on it, I can barely type. It's even worse
> than my ancient Asus XP eee Netbook keyboard (which is smaller). I
> gotta look when I 'touch-type', ferchrysakes!
>
> Maybe I'm jes getting old, but the split MS 'Natural' keyboard on my
> old Linux machine is waaaay better. It's literally easier to swap
> cables on thw newer W10 box to my old Linux box, than to type on that
> newer W10 box with its crappy keyboard and that insufferable Xananews
> (yes, Xananews SUCKS!!).
>
> Easier to use slrn on my old Linux box than the insanely faster W10
> box. Plus, I'll NEVER access my financial institution on an MS
> machine. Geez, MS is in my face, constantly. I even unplug it
> (pwr/ethernet) when I shut it off. M$ is even trying to get me to
> sign a 'Terms of Service'(TOS) agreement. As if!
>
> And the ads!! Every choice I make on that stupifyingly fast W10 box
> elicits an ad that wants me to pay more $$! Screw M$ and their crappy
> OS!!
>
> </rant=off>

Take whatever medication it is U need to take and calm your sweet
little rambling ass down fer chritsakes.

Unplugging network and power cords from a computer that isn't turned
on is a sign that you need your head examined. Everyone knows you
just need to wrap it in foil.

On Tuesday, May 15, 2018 at 12:46:58 PM UTC-10, notbob wrote:
> My new W10 computer is GREAT. Unfortunately, it comes with the
> crappiest keyboard ever created (HP). It and the mouse are paired and
> USB 'RC' devices. When I'm on it, I can barely type. It's even worse
> than my ancient Asus XP eee Netbook keyboard (which is smaller). I
> gotta look when I 'touch-type', ferchrysakes!
>
> Maybe I'm jes getting old, but the split MS 'Natural' keyboard on my
> old Linux machine is waaaay better. It's literally easier to swap
> cables on thw newer W10 box to my old Linux box, than to type on that
> newer W10 box with its crappy keyboard and that insufferable Xananews
> (yes, Xananews SUCKS!!).
>
> Easier to use slrn on my old Linux box than the insanely faster W10
> box. Plus, I'll NEVER access my financial institution on an MS
> machine. Geez, MS is in my face, constantly. I even unplug it
> (pwr/ethernet) when I shut it off. M$ is even trying to get me to
> sign a 'Terms of Service'(TOS) agreement. As if!
>
> And the ads!! Every choice I make on that stupifyingly fast W10 box
> elicits an ad that wants me to pay more $$! Screw M$ and their crappy
> OS!!
>
> </rant=off>
>
> nb

I got one of these keyboards. What a steal.

https://www.amazon.com/Plugable-Perf...50/ref=sr_1_17

On Tue, 15 May 2018 18:37:11 -0500, Atticus Finch
> wrote:

>On 15 May 2018 22:46:54 GMT, notbob wrote:
>
>> My new W10 computer is GREAT. Unfortunately, it comes with the
>> crappiest keyboard ever created (HP). It and the mouse are paired and
>> USB 'RC' devices. When I'm on it, I can barely type. It's even worse
>> than my ancient Asus XP eee Netbook keyboard (which is smaller). I
>> gotta look when I 'touch-type', ferchrysakes!
>>
>> Maybe I'm jes getting old, but the split MS 'Natural' keyboard on my
>> old Linux machine is waaaay better. It's literally easier to swap
>> cables on thw newer W10 box to my old Linux box, than to type on that
>> newer W10 box with its crappy keyboard and that insufferable Xananews
>> (yes, Xananews SUCKS!!).
>>
>> Easier to use slrn on my old Linux box than the insanely faster W10
>> box. Plus, I'll NEVER access my financial institution on an MS
>> machine. Geez, MS is in my face, constantly. I even unplug it
>> (pwr/ethernet) when I shut it off. M$ is even trying to get me to
>> sign a 'Terms of Service'(TOS) agreement. As if!
>>
>> And the ads!! Every choice I make on that stupifyingly fast W10 box
>> elicits an ad that wants me to pay more $$! Screw M$ and their crappy
>> OS!!
>>
>> </rant=off>
>
>Take whatever medication it is U need to take and calm your sweet
>little rambling ass down fer chritsakes.
>
>Unplugging network and power cords from a computer that isn't turned
>on is a sign that you need your head examined. Everyone knows you
>just need to wrap it in foil.

Lol, like so:
<http://tpo.nl/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/pvvalu2-530x397.jpg>

On Tuesday, May 15, 2018 at 5:46:58 PM UTC-5, notbob wrote:
>
> And the ads!! Every choice I make on that stupifyingly fast W10 box
> elicits an ad that wants me to pay more $$! Screw M$ and their crappy
> OS!!
>
> </rant=off>
>
> nb
>
>
Install an ad blocker, it will help restore your sanity.

On 5/15/2018 6:46 PM, notbob wrote:
> My new W10 computer is GREAT. Unfortunately, it comes with the
> crappiest keyboard ever created (HP). It and the mouse are paired and
> USB 'RC' devices. When I'm on it, I can barely type.

I had Logitech Wave keyboards at home and work. Really like them.
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B003VAHYNC

On 2018-05-16, Ed Pawlowski > wrote:

> I had Logitech Wave keyboards at home and work. Really like them.
> https://www.amazon.com/dp/B003VAHYNC

Thnx Ed, but I've been down that Logitech road.

I usta have Logitech's split ergonomic keyboard. In fact, I bought 3
of them. Damn things only last a little over one yr, then fall apart.
All three Logitech keyboards were dead within 3-1/2 yrs. I no longer
buy Logitech for anything.

My M$ Natural split keyboard is over 15 yrs old. It's got keyboard
'plaque' all over it and it still works better'n any Logi-crap
keyboard ever did. Trouble is, my M$ mouse (optical trackball) is a
PS2 conn and the W10 box is strictly USB and an adapter (PS2>USB) must
be an 'active' adapter (whatever the heck that is!). I'm still
workin' on it.

nb

In article >, notbob
> wrote:

> My M$ Natural split keyboard is over 15 yrs old. It's got keyboard
> 'plaque' all over it and it still works better'n any Logi-crap
> keyboard ever did. Trouble is, my M$ mouse (optical trackball) is a
> PS2 conn and the W10 box is strictly USB and an adapter (PS2>USB) must
> be an 'active' adapter (whatever the heck that is!). I'm still
> workin' on it.

I know absolutely nothing about Windows computers, but with W10, surely
you can connect a wireless Bluetooth mouse and keyboard, no? It's
really convenient if you can. Battery consumption increases though.

[OBFood] Thin sliced corned beef and mozzarella on mustayo(tm) spread
toast and then open faced, meat on one toast side and cheese on the
other under the broiler, smooshed together and served with a pickle and
potato chips. My wife had hers on white bread. I'm having mine on dill
rye.

leo

On 2018-05-16, Leonard Blaisdell > wrote:

> I know absolutely nothing about Windows computers.....

I wish I didn't. I been using Linux fer about 15 yrs, but started
with PC-DOS.

> but with W10, surely you can connect a wireless Bluetooth mouse and
> keyboard, no?

Sure, if I wanna spend even more $$. I'm retired amd on a fixed
income. The W10 box was a gift from my younger brother. I'd normally
jes toss the Windows operating system and use Linux, but it's a UEFI
box. I'm working on it.

Thnx fer the tip.

nb

In article >, Sqwertz
> wrote:

> I have a Logitech keyboard and mouse, both wireless. They're not
> bluetooth (that I know of), but the AA batteries have lasted over 2
> years now. I used to have a cordless mouse, some other brand, it
> wouldn't last 2 months without replacing the battery.

I only surmised. They're Bluetooth on a Mac. I get about three or four
months per mouse and keyboard. Both take two AA batteries. So that's
sixteen AA batteries a year at worst. That sounds about right.
There was a time when I thought AAA through D cell batteries would
become obsolete. Boy, was I wrong.

leo

On 16 May 2018 01:40:24 GMT, notbob > wrote:

>On 2018-05-16, Ed Pawlowski > wrote:
>
>> I had Logitech Wave keyboards at home and work. Really like them.
>> https://www.amazon.com/dp/B003VAHYNC
>
>Thnx Ed, but I've been down that Logitech road.
>
>I usta have Logitech's split ergonomic keyboard. In fact, I bought 3
>of them. Damn things only last a little over one yr, then fall apart.
>All three Logitech keyboards were dead within 3-1/2 yrs. I no longer
>buy Logitech for anything.
>
>My M$ Natural split keyboard is over 15 yrs old. It's got keyboard
>'plaque' all over it and it still works better'n any Logi-crap
>keyboard ever did. Trouble is, my M$ mouse (optical trackball) is a
>PS2 conn and the W10 box is strictly USB and an adapter (PS2>USB) must
>be an 'active' adapter (whatever the heck that is!). I'm still
>workin' on it.
>
>nb

You must abuse them! The Logitech wireless keyboard for my old laptop
must be around 10+ years old now and still works, I bought this new
one with the new computer last year as an extra. I don't have a wave
style one like Ed's, but I think they suit a mans larger hands better,
I don't need it.

On Tue, 15 May 2018 20:50:16 -0700, Leonard Blaisdell
> wrote:

>In article >, Sqwertz
> wrote:
>
>> I have a Logitech keyboard and mouse, both wireless. They're not
>> bluetooth (that I know of), but the AA batteries have lasted over 2
>> years now. I used to have a cordless mouse, some other brand, it
>> wouldn't last 2 months without replacing the battery.
>
>I only surmised. They're Bluetooth on a Mac. I get about three or four
>months per mouse and keyboard. Both take two AA batteries. So that's
>sixteen AA batteries a year at worst. That sounds about right.
>There was a time when I thought AAA through D cell batteries would
>become obsolete. Boy, was I wrong.
>
>leo

Something must be wrong in the mix, don't think I ever replaced the
keyboard batteries, only the mouse occasionally.

On Tuesday, May 15, 2018 at 6:46:58 PM UTC-4, notbob wrote:
> My new W10 computer is GREAT. Unfortunately, it comes with the
> crappiest keyboard ever created (HP). It and the mouse are paired and
> USB 'RC' devices. When I'm on it, I can barely type. It's even worse
> than my ancient Asus XP eee Netbook keyboard (which is smaller). I
> gotta look when I 'touch-type', ferchrysakes!
>
> Maybe I'm jes getting old, but the split MS 'Natural' keyboard on my
> old Linux machine is waaaay better. It's literally easier to swap
> cables on thw newer W10 box to my old Linux box, than to type on that
> newer W10 box with its crappy keyboard and that insufferable Xananews
> (yes, Xananews SUCKS!!).
>
> Easier to use slrn on my old Linux box than the insanely faster W10
> box. Plus, I'll NEVER access my financial institution on an MS
> machine. Geez, MS is in my face, constantly. I even unplug it
> (pwr/ethernet) when I shut it off. M$ is even trying to get me to
> sign a 'Terms of Service'(TOS) agreement. As if!
>
> And the ads!! Every choice I make on that stupifyingly fast W10 box
> elicits an ad that wants me to pay more $$! Screw M$ and their crappy
> OS!!
>
> </rant=off>
>
> nb

Stop using the Windows box and just use the Linux box.

Cindy Hamilton

notbob wrote:
....
> income. The W10 box was a gift from my younger brother. I'd normally
> jes toss the Windows operating system and use Linux, but it's a UEFI
> box. I'm working on it.

when you boot the machine and go to install make sure
the installer is running in UEFI mode and not bios mode
otherwise you may be installing without getting the
UEFI stuff and then it is a PITA to get it changed to
UEFI again.

i just went through this on this machine and since i
didn't know anything about UEFI i didn't know about the
different modes and ended up having to figure it all out
and fix it.

refind is a very helpful utility and the configuration
file in /boot/efi/EFI/BOOT/refind.conf can be easily edited
(see the samples at the end if you want something specific).
your final destination may be different than mine so the
above path is only a guess for your system.


songbird

notbob wrote:

> My new W10 computer is GREAT. Unfortunately, it comes with the
> crappiest keyboard ever created (HP). It and the mouse are paired and
> USB 'RC' devices. When I'm on it, I can barely type. It's even worse
> than my ancient Asus XP eee Netbook keyboard (which is smaller). I
> gotta look when I 'touch-type', ferchrysakes!
....
></rant=off>
>
> nb

i bought a cheap HP keyboard and mouse combination
and the keyboard lasted less than a year and the mouse
barely two years (it needs a special screwdriver to
open it, what a PITA). i replaced the keyboard with
a clicky type and i like it, but linux is currently
dropping it for some reason i've not figured out why
yet. i got a cheapie mouse to replace and it barely
lasted two months before i had to take it apart and
give the springs a tweak and now it's doing it again.

it doesn't help that i drop the mouses once in a
while on a hard floor... oops...


songbird

On 2018-05-16, songbird > wrote:

> i bought a cheap HP keyboard and mouse combination

Sounds like my "combo". Two input devices, one 'RC' USB unit. My
mouse works jes fine, despite being so cheap the R/L buttons are jes
flexible plastic. Must be the screws are under the PTFE strips. All
I see is an 'on/off' slider switch. Apparently fer the battery.

> a clicky type and i like it, but linux is currently
> dropping it for some reason i've not figured out why
> yet.

You must be using a systemd variation of Linux. Slackware prolly has
the drivers you need. I don't know, as this W10 box (i3) is my
first 64-bit unit (w/ UEFI).

> it doesn't help that i drop the mouses once in a while on a hard
> floor... oops...

Izzat a "flaw" or a "feature"?

nb

On 2018-05-16, songbird > wrote:

> the installer is running in UEFI mode and not bios mode

I finally figured out how to get to my BIOS. I thought I wanted
'legacy' mode. ????

> otherwise you may be installing without getting the
> UEFI stuff and then it is a PITA to get it changed to
> UEFI again.
>
> i just went through this on this machine and since i
> didn't know anything about UEFI i didn't know about the
> different modes and ended up having to figure it all out
> and fix it.

Sounds like I may be headed down that same road. I'll take all the
help I can, as I am getting old and am set in my lazy ways. You mean
I gotta learn this crap all over, again!?

> refind is a very helpful utility and the configuration
> file in /boot/efi/EFI/BOOT/refind.conf can be easily edited
> (see the samples at the end if you want something specific).
> your final destination may be different than mine so the
> above path is only a guess for your system.

Thnx, songbird.

nb

On 2018-05-16, > wrote:
>
> You must abuse them!

Heck, I "babied" the 3rd one fer a yr and a half! They were seriously
cheaply made (yet retailed for over $100 ea). Inner workings were
carbon traces on a Mylar sheet. Get one spec of crud across the
traces and it was all over. 8|

> The Logitech wireless keyboard for my old laptop must be around 10+
> years old now and still works,

Mine was not "wireless". I still have a box fulla Logitech
'asymetrical' serial mice (Mouseman?). Pre-PS2 (don't know if I'll
ever be able to use 'em, again). Best damn mouse ever made. So yes,
I know all I need to know about Logitech.

Microsoft hardware (mouses, keyboards) is amazingly robust. How they
made such good hardware and such a crappy operating system is beyond
me. Even Dell used 'em. All of it was hard-wired. This new
'wireless' stuff seems to be mostly junk.

nb

On 16 May 2018 13:47:06 GMT, notbob > wrote:

>On 2018-05-16, > wrote:
>>
>> You must abuse them!
>
>Heck, I "babied" the 3rd one fer a yr and a half! They were seriously
>cheaply made (yet retailed for over $100 ea). Inner workings were
>carbon traces on a Mylar sheet. Get one spec of crud across the
>traces and it was all over. 8|
>
>> The Logitech wireless keyboard for my old laptop must be around 10+
>> years old now and still works,
>
>Mine was not "wireless". I still have a box fulla Logitech
>'asymetrical' serial mice (Mouseman?). Pre-PS2 (don't know if I'll
>ever be able to use 'em, again). Best damn mouse ever made. So yes,
>I know all I need to know about Logitech.
>
>Microsoft hardware (mouses, keyboards) is amazingly robust. How they
>made such good hardware and such a crappy operating system is beyond
>me. Even Dell used 'em. All of it was hard-wired. This new
>'wireless' stuff seems to be mostly junk.
>
>nb
I am using a Dell, it came with a MS junk keyboard which is sitting in
the closet currently. If you pay the shipping, I will ship to you, I
much prefer my wireless Logitech. I'm serious, I am trying at this
stage not to keep junk thinking of my kids having to clean up after I
croak

notbob wrote:
> On 2018-05-16, songbird > wrote:
>
>> the installer is running in UEFI mode and not bios mode
>
> I finally figured out how to get to my BIOS. I thought I wanted
> 'legacy' mode. ????

well if it works for you you can keep it.

with fairly new hardware i wanted to see
how this new stuff worked. the breaking of it
made me learn a bit more quickly than i'd
planned.

i was trying to get some things set up on a USB
stick so i could boot from there if i wanted
and i also have a separate partition for booting
a more stable version than what i usually run in
case something goes very wrong.


>> otherwise you may be installing without getting the
>> UEFI stuff and then it is a PITA to get it changed to
>> UEFI again.
>>
>> i just went through this on this machine and since i
>> didn't know anything about UEFI i didn't know about the
>> different modes and ended up having to figure it all out
>> and fix it.
>
> Sounds like I may be headed down that same road. I'll take all the
> help I can, as I am getting old and am set in my lazy ways. You mean
> I gotta learn this crap all over, again!?

no, just go legacy mode and ignore the rest of it.
if it works don't break it.


>> refind is a very helpful utility and the configuration
>> file in /boot/efi/EFI/BOOT/refind.conf can be easily edited
>> (see the samples at the end if you want something specific).
>> your final destination may be different than mine so the
>> above path is only a guess for your system.
>
> Thnx, songbird.

y.w.


songbird

notbob wrote:
> On 2018-05-16, songbird > wrote:
>
>> i bought a cheap HP keyboard and mouse combination
>
> Sounds like my "combo". Two input devices, one 'RC' USB unit. My
> mouse works jes fine, despite being so cheap the R/L buttons are jes
> flexible plastic. Must be the screws are under the PTFE strips. All
> I see is an 'on/off' slider switch. Apparently fer the battery.

yes, screws under those in most cases.
i turn off the switch when i'm not using the mouse
as i don't like changing the batteries very often.

one thing nice about the current cheapie mouse is
that it doesn't use batteries nearly as fast as the
other mices i've had.


>> a clicky type and i like it, but linux is currently
>> dropping it for some reason i've not figured out why
>> yet.
>
> You must be using a systemd variation of Linux. Slackware prolly has
> the drivers you need. I don't know, as this W10 box (i3) is my
> first 64-bit unit (w/ UEFI).

not a driver issue, somewhere else, it worked fine
before, something changed and i haven't narrowed it
down yet to what. in the meantime i'm trying work-
arounds. getting too busy with outdoor things so not
much time spent on bug hunting.


>> it doesn't help that i drop the mouses once in a while on a hard
>> floor... oops...
>
> Izzat a "flaw" or a "feature"?

a feature would be if i throw it.


songbird

On 2018-05-16, > wrote:

> I am using a Dell, it came with a MS junk keyboard which is sitting in
> the closet currently. If you pay the shipping, I will ship to you, I
> much prefer my wireless Logitech. I'm serious, I am trying at this
> stage not to keep junk thinking of my kids having to clean up after I
> croak

LOL!.......

Thnx lucretia, but I got a couple Dell/M$ keyboards in my closet,
also. I may hafta look into Logitech's latest.

nb

On 17 May 2018 16:59:49 GMT, notbob > wrote:

>On 2018-05-16, > wrote:
>
>> I am using a Dell, it came with a MS junk keyboard which is sitting in
>> the closet currently. If you pay the shipping, I will ship to you, I
>> much prefer my wireless Logitech. I'm serious, I am trying at this
>> stage not to keep junk thinking of my kids having to clean up after I
>> croak
>
>LOL!.......
>
>Thnx lucretia, but I got a couple Dell/M$ keyboards in my closet,
>also. I may hafta look into Logitech's latest.
>
>nb

I didn't buy their most expensive, rather the middle of the road one.
What I really like is being able to make it so if I press a dedicated
key, it opens the site I want - i.e. I want to look at Agent and
usenet, I have keyed the music key to open it. That is endlessly
convenient, so I looked for the first model that had keyboard
directives. My last one, which still works with the old laptop, can
only be operated by me as the white paint has gone from all the keys
so I would argue they don't give up the ghost easily

OK I checked on Best Buy in the US and this is the one I have

https://www.bestbuy.com/site/logitec...?skuId=1294039

On 2018-05-17, > wrote:

> OK I checked on Best Buy in the US and this is the one I have

> https://www.bestbuy.com/site/logitec...?skuId=1294039

Again, thnx lucretia, but I don't even know where a Bestbuy might be.
I know it's at least 100 mi from where I live. Besides, I seem to be
hooked on my 'split-keyboard' M$ unit (although it IS USB).

Turns out I AM jes getting too old. I mess up on my 'split-keyboard'
as often as the "crappy" HP k/b. Fortunately, I'm much faster at
correcting my mistakes on the more familiar M$ unit (plus, the HP k/b
is jes plain crummy).

nb

On 18 May 2018 15:53:03 GMT, notbob > wrote:

>On 2018-05-17, > wrote:
>
>> OK I checked on Best Buy in the US and this is the one I have
>
>> https://www.bestbuy.com/site/logitec...?skuId=1294039
>
>Again, thnx lucretia, but I don't even know where a Bestbuy might be.
>I know it's at least 100 mi from where I live.

Nowadays no one shops for keyboards at a brick n' mortar.... see that
yellow rectangle that says 'Add To Cart'?

On 18 May 2018 15:53:03 GMT, notbob > wrote:

>On 2018-05-17, > wrote:
>
>> OK I checked on Best Buy in the US and this is the one I have
>
>> https://www.bestbuy.com/site/logitec...?skuId=1294039
>
>Again, thnx lucretia, but I don't even know where a Bestbuy might be.
>I know it's at least 100 mi from where I live. Besides, I seem to be
>hooked on my 'split-keyboard' M$ unit (although it IS USB).
>
>Turns out I AM jes getting too old. I mess up on my 'split-keyboard'
>as often as the "crappy" HP k/b. Fortunately, I'm much faster at
>correcting my mistakes on the more familiar M$ unit (plus, the HP k/b
>is jes plain crummy).
>
>nb
Best Buy will ship to you and Logitech has a split keyboard. There!
that's as much help as I can give.

On Wednesday, May 16, 2018 at 3:47:11 AM UTC-10, notbob wrote:
>
> Microsoft hardware (mouses, keyboards) is amazingly robust. How they
> made such good hardware and such a crappy operating system is beyond
> me. Even Dell used 'em. All of it was hard-wired. This new
> 'wireless' stuff seems to be mostly junk.
>
> nb

I had a MS natural split keyboard and was as happy as a clam. The layout didn't work any better than a standard keyboard nor did feel any better than a cheap, generic, one. That didn't bother me - I just liked the concept. After a month the thing crapped out on me so that was the end of that.

I used to use a MS Trackball Explorer and loved that piece of hardware. I used that for years but the bearing surfaces wore down and I was not able to replace the three bearings the optical ball rested on. These things have a cult following and prices on the used market run around 80 to 700 bucks. These days I use a Logitech M570 wireless trackball. I'm as happy as a clam.