Wine (alt.food.wine) Devoted to the discussion of wine and wine-related topics. A place to read and comment about wines, wine and food matching, storage systems, wine paraphernalia, etc. In general, any topic related to wine is valid fodder for the group.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
  #1 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 30-05-2008, 01:45 PM posted to alt.food.wine
external usenet poster
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 3
Default FYI..Wine drinkers of the world , unite...

Author and journalist Christopher Hitchens has launched a scathing attack on
restaurants and sommeliers,
calling them "barbaric','rude' and 'boors'. Is Hitchens beating the right
drum here?
Cheers,
Rick

http://www.slate.com/id/2191912/


  #2 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 30-05-2008, 06:05 PM posted to alt.food.wine
external usenet poster
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 4,554
Default FYI..Wine drinkers of the world , unite...

On May 30, 8:45�am, "Rick" wrote:
Author and journalist Christopher Hitchens has launched a scathing attack on
restaurants and sommeliers,
calling them "barbaric','rude' and 'boors'. Is Hitchens beating the right
drum here?
Cheers,
Rick

http://www.slate.com/id/2191912/


I agree with his general point, but he seems a little overwrought.
Just say "thanks, leave the bottle, I'll handle the pouring."
  #3 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 30-05-2008, 07:54 PM posted to alt.food.wine
external usenet poster
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 912
Default FYI..Wine drinkers of the world , unite...

On May 30, 7:45 am, "Rick" wrote:
Author and journalist Christopher Hitchens has launched a scathing attack on
restaurants and sommeliers,
calling them "barbaric','rude' and 'boors'. Is Hitchens beating the right
drum here?


Many restaurants and clubs seem to think part of their expensive
service is to do everything for you up to, but not including, pre-
chewing of your food :-). I do not see as much of this in the US as in
earlier times, likely because the added staff needed for such details
is too expensive except in the most expensive restaurants. Many years
ago it was a bit different and far more common. I well remember a club
in Houston that some friends took me to on a trip there over 30 years
ago. People still smoked cigarettes at the tables then. The club had
two "cigarette" waiters, dressed in tuxedos, that kept a close eye on
the room and would rush across the room to light a cigarette if they
saw anyone starting to remove a cigarette from a pack.





  #4 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 30-05-2008, 11:17 PM posted to alt.food.wine
external usenet poster
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 57
Default FYI..Wine drinkers of the world , unite...

"Rick" wrote in message
. ..
Author and journalist Christopher Hitchens has launched a scathing attack
on restaurants and sommeliers,
calling them "barbaric','rude' and 'boors'. Is Hitchens beating the right
drum here?
Cheers,
Rick

http://www.slate.com/id/2191912/


Hitchens makes some good points.

I've met sommeliers who know a lot more about wine than I do and can talk
knowledgeably about it and or those who don't know much about wine a good
sommelier can be really helpful.

For those who know what they like some sommeliers may appear intrusive and
arrogant.

The ones I detest are the intrusive ones described by Hitchens and those
typical dudes and dudines whose only job it seems is to flog the pricey
bottles and over pour to sell more wine - often with no regard to guests'
wallets or sobriety.

Have you ever noticed that sommeliers never recommend inexpensive wines?

PS as for intrusiveness - I've been to restaurants lately where you are
still interrupted by wait staff wielding giant pepper grinders and parmesan
pots. I though they'd gone out with avocado vinaigrette.

Cheers!
Martin


  #5 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 31-05-2008, 06:28 PM posted to alt.food.wine
external usenet poster
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 131
Default FYI..Wine drinkers of the world , unite...

On Fri, 30 May 2008 05:45:02 -0700, "Rick"
wrote:

Author and journalist Christopher Hitchens has launched a scathing attack on
restaurants and sommeliers,
calling them "barbaric','rude' and 'boors'. Is Hitchens beating the right
drum here?


I've not read the article, but I've never found a sommelier to be
barbaric rude or boorish. I have once crossed swords with a trainee
who didn't know as much as she thought she did, but that's all.

I don't know where Mr Hitchens eats, but we clearly don't move in the
same circles. I get just as much advice or help as I need, and have
never once had my glass over filled, refilled too much or too quickly
or received bad or self seeking advice (buy this 200 wine instead of
the 20 wine you were thinking of), not in 30 years of enthusiastic
eating out in many different countries.

As for restaurants... I have some criticisms, mainly because they
don't respect traditional names or dishes, and once or twice because
they haven't accepted constructive criticism "Oh no Monsieur, they
like risotto like this in Brive (half cooked with thin watery stock
surrounding hard chalky rice)".
--
All the best
Fatty from Forges


  #6 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 01-06-2008, 02:49 PM posted to alt.food.wine
external usenet poster
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 4,554
Default FYI..Wine drinkers of the world , unite...

On May 30, 9:45�am, "Rick" wrote:
Author and journalist Christopher Hitchens has launched a scathing attack on
restaurants and sommeliers,
calling them "barbaric','rude' and 'boors'. Is Hitchens beating the right
drum here?
Cheers,
Rick

http://www.slate.com/id/2191912/


http://www.nationalpost.com/story.html?id=553007
  #7 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 01-06-2008, 07:42 PM posted to alt.food.wine
external usenet poster
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 3,207
Default FYI..Wine drinkers of the world , unite...

IanH wrote on Sat, 31 May 2008 19:28:25 +0200:

Author and journalist Christopher Hitchens has launched a
scathing attack on restaurants and sommeliers, calling them
"barbaric','rude' and 'boors'. Is Hitchens beating the right
drum here?


I've not read the article, but I've never found a sommelier to
be barbaric rude or boorish. I have once crossed swords with a
trainee who didn't know as much as she thought she did, but
that's all.


As others have mentioned, my major objection is over-solicitous
waiters who refill glasses without asking. Sometimes you don't
notice in time stop them from pouring for people who do not wish
any more. It seems a bit crass or distasteful to pour from one
glass to another. I suppose a wine waiter or sommelier might
wish to bring attention to a noteworthy wine but I prefer not to
have advice unless I ask for it.

I guess the restaurants that I frequent are no longer the type
but I never really liked the custom of a sommelier trying the
wine using a little saucer hanging from a chain around their
neck. Has the custom died and if not, what is the correct name
for the little dish?

--

James Silverton
Potomac, Maryland

E-mail, with obvious alterations:
not.jim.silverton.at.verizon.not

  #8 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 01-06-2008, 09:10 PM posted to alt.food.wine
external usenet poster
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 651
Default FYI..Wine drinkers of the world , unite...

In article 14C0k.3518$%[email protected],
"James Silverton" wrote:

IanH wrote on Sat, 31 May 2008 19:28:25 +0200:

Author and journalist Christopher Hitchens has launched a
scathing attack on restaurants and sommeliers, calling them
"barbaric','rude' and 'boors'. Is Hitchens beating the right
drum here?


I've not read the article, but I've never found a sommelier to
be barbaric rude or boorish. I have once crossed swords with a
trainee who didn't know as much as she thought she did, but
that's all.


As others have mentioned, my major objection is over-solicitous
waiters who refill glasses without asking. Sometimes you don't
notice in time stop them from pouring for people who do not wish
any more. It seems a bit crass or distasteful to pour from one
glass to another. I suppose a wine waiter or sommelier might
wish to bring attention to a noteworthy wine but I prefer not to
have advice unless I ask for it.

I guess the restaurants that I frequent are no longer the type
but I never really liked the custom of a sommelier trying the
wine using a little saucer hanging from a chain around their
neck. Has the custom died and if not, what is the correct name
for the little dish?


We had the exact issue in Santa Fe. So we move the bottle from the edge
of the table. They also want to keep refilling the glasses so you will
end up drinking faster and buy another bottle.
  #9 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 01-06-2008, 10:40 PM posted to alt.food.wine
external usenet poster
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 567
Default FYI..Wine drinkers of the world , unite...

On Sun, 01 Jun 2008 18:42:05 GMT, "James Silverton"
wrote:


As others have mentioned, my major objection is over-solicitous
waiters who refill glasses without asking. Sometimes you don't
notice in time stop them from pouring for people who do not wish
any more.



It's not just that people may not want any more. We don't all drink at
the same rate. If my wife and I share a bottle and I drink faster than
she does, such a waiter will end up unfairly dividing the bottle so
that I get more than she does.

--
Ken Blake
Please Reply to the Newsgroup
  #10 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 01-06-2008, 10:53 PM posted to alt.food.wine
external usenet poster
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 3,207
Default FYI..Wine drinkers of the world , unite...

pavane wrote on Sun, 1 Jun 2008 17:41:19 -0400:


| I guess the restaurants that I frequent are no longer the
| type but I never really liked the custom of a sommelier
| trying the wine using a little saucer hanging from a chain
| around their neck. Has the custom died and if not, what is
| the correct name for the little dish?

The little dish is called a "tastevin," here is the Wikipedia
article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tastevin#Tastevin
And yes, it has pretty much died out for practical as well
as for sanitary reasons.


Well I'll be damned! So that's what is a Tastevin!

--

James Silverton
Potomac, Maryland

E-mail, with obvious alterations:
not.jim.silverton.at.verizon.not



  #11 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 02-06-2008, 03:24 AM posted to alt.food.wine
external usenet poster
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 65
Default FYI..Wine drinkers of the world , unite...

James Silverton wrote:

As others have mentioned, my major objection is over-solicitous
waiters who refill glasses without asking. Sometimes you don't
notice in time stop them from pouring for people who do not wish
any more. It seems a bit crass or distasteful to pour from one
glass to another. I suppose a wine waiter or sommelier might
wish to bring attention to a noteworthy wine but I prefer not to
have advice unless I ask for it.

snip

At the brew pubs in Cologne and Dusseldorf, they don't ask if you want
another beer, and will actually replace your glass with a fresh, full
one even if you still have a small amount of beer left. Solution? Place
the beer mat on top of your glass and they leave it alone. And yes,
until you suss this trick, you drink more and faster than you probably
intended to.

Dave

--
There's a fine line between stupid and clever.
  #12 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 03-06-2008, 01:28 PM posted to alt.food.wine
external usenet poster
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 17
Default FYI..Wine drinkers of the world , unite...

Rick wrote:

Author and journalist Christopher Hitchens has launched a scathing
attack on restaurants and sommeliers, calling them "barbaric','rude'
and 'boors'. Is Hitchens beating the right drum here?


Oh, yes. 100%.

http://www.slate.com/id/2191912/


Andrew.


Powered by vBulletin® Copyright ©2000 - 2022, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2004-2022 FoodBanter.com.
The comments are property of their posters.
 

About Us

"It's about Food and drink"

 

Copyright © 2017