On Fri, 26 Nov 2010 18:27:59 -0600, Damaeus
> wrote:

> Making the parchment the same size as the springform base would defeat the
> purpose. The problem is getting something under the cheesecake to hoist
> it off the pan.

Parchment is the easiest way. You must have a pancake turner/spatula.
Slide it under your cheesecake and slip the cheesecake onto your
serving plate. It's not that hard.

--

Never trust a dog to watch your food.

On Fri, 26 Nov 2010 18:38:03 -0600, Damaeus
> wrote:

> In news:rec.food.cooking, Janet Wilder > posted on
> Fri, 26 Nov 2010 09:21:58 -0600 the following:
>
> > If the cheesecake has a crust, which mine did, letting it sit in the
> > holder outside of the fridge for 15 minutes or so, the butter in the
> > crust softens enough to make the slices slide off the bottom of the pan.
>
> The crust I use only had two tablespoons of butter for the crumbs from 15
> graham crackers, so the crust never even hardened after baking and sitting
> in the fridge overnight. It was actually a crust that was a little bit
> soft without being mushy.
>
Use more butter or fewer graham crackers next time. I'd ease up on
the graham crackers and make the crust thinner and not as high. You
don't need a hard crust when you're making cheesecake in a spring
form. You don't even need it to go all the way up. Butter the spring
form and scatter crumbs on it so there's just a hint of crust (you can
make the bottom thicker if you wish).

--

Never trust a dog to watch your food.

Damaeus wrote:
>
> In news:rec.food.cooking, "Pete C." > posted on Thu,
> 25 Nov 2010 19:48:55 -0600 the following:
>
> > Water bath??? For a cheesecake??? I've never heard of that in any
> > cheesecake recipe, even the screwy ones that use a crust. Are you baking
> > cheesecake or a creme brulee???
>
> Does a creme brulee have a crust?

I've certainly never heard of a creme brulee with a crust, normally it
is cooked and served in a ramekin and of course had the caramelized
sugar crust added to the top before serving.

> I've never had a cheesecake without a
> crust, or I'd call it cheesecake pudding.

I'm not sure why you'd call it that, pretty much any cheesecake recipe
has a relatively firm texture, vs. puddings which have a very soft
texture.

> And I'm not talking about some
> Keebler pie crust in a pan. I'm talking about the layer of graham cracker
> crumbs and butter that is pressed into the bottom of the springform pan
> that gives the cheesecake some kind of base to sit on.

Cheesecake doesn't need a base to sit on, it has a firm enough texture
to stand on it's own.

> I would probably
> like a cheesecake without a crust,

I expect you would, it lets you focus on the flavor of the cheesecake
without a crust to distract.

> however, but just because the one I
> made has a crust, I don't consider it screwy, bad, wrong, evil or sinful.

I do

>
> The cheesecake I baked for Thanksgiving was my second using this recipe.
> It didn't call for a water bath, but some of the comments under the recipe
> did call for one. Plus a discussion I had over instant messaging has
> become clearer now. A water bath will keep the sides of the springform
> pan from exceeding 212 degrees. That will result in a cheesecake which
> has the same creaminess on the sides as it has in the center.

That would be the theory for a water bath, and is why one is used for
creme brulee.

> And while
> the cheesecake I brought to dinner made everyone moan in ecstasy like no
> other food that was on the table, I noticed a difference in texture as I
> ate toward the outside edge of the cheesecake. The center was so creamy
> that it had no texture at all that my tongue could detect, but the outside
> edge did have a texture.

It sounds like it didn't quite get evenly done. What was the oven temp,
and what temp was the water bath? Usually you use boiling or close to
boiling water to start the water bath, possibly you could have used a
bit cooler water to delay the outside cooking to give the center a
chance to catch up.

> It wasn't gross or inedible or anything, but
> there *was* a texture and I didn't like the mouth feel of the outside inch
> of cheesecake as much as the center.

The cheesecake I bake has a definite texture and "crumb" to it since it
contains ricotta cheese. That texture is one of the features I like
about the recipe vs. something like NY style which I find is often
rather "gluey".

Since I don't use a water bath, the outside gets a bit more done which
intensifies the "crumb" and flavor, something I find very appealing.

> A water bath is supposed to keep the
> outside edge as creamy as the center where it was absolutely perfect.

Sounds like you just need to adjust the balance between water bath
starting temp and oven temp to find the point where everything is baked
to the same point when it's done.

Stu wrote:
>
> This it??
> http://allrecipes.com//Recipe/italia...ke/Detail.aspx
>
> Italian Cream Cheese and Ricotta Cheesecake
>
> Prep Time: 15 Min
> Cook Time: 2 Hrs
> Ready In: 6 Hrs 15 Min
>
> Ingredients
>
> 2 (8 ounce) packages cream cheese, softened
> 1 (16 ounce) container ricotta cheese
> 1 1/2 cups white sugar
> 4 eggs
> 1 tablespoon lemon juice
> 1 teaspoon vanilla extract
> 3 tablespoons cornstarch
> 3 tablespoons flour
> 1/2 cup butter, melted and cooled
> 1 pint sour cream
>
> Directions
>
> 1.Preheat oven to 350 degrees F (175 degrees C). Lightly grease a
> springform pan.
>
> 2.Mix the cream cheese and ricotta cheese together in a mixing bowl
> until well combined. Stir in the sugar, eggs, lemon juice, vanilla,
> cornstarch, flour, and butter. Add the sour cream last and stir. Pour
> the mixture into the prepared spring form pan.
>
> 3.Bake in the preheated oven 1 hour; turn oven off and leave in oven 1
> hour more. Allow to cool completely in refrigerator before serving.
>
> Nutritional Information
> Amount Per Serving Calories: 703, Fat: 50.1g, Cholesterol: 241mg
>
> --
>
> Stu

That's pretty much it. My recipe has "juice of half a lemon" which is
probably closer to 3 tablespoons, bakes at 325 for 1:10, then continues
in the cooling oven for at least 2 hours. It also "matures" if you
refrigerate it for a couple days before eating and is even better.

In news:rec.food.cooking, sf > posted on Fri, 26 Nov 2010
17:07:10 -0800 the following:

> On Fri, 26 Nov 2010 18:38:03 -0600, Damaeus
> > wrote:
>
> > The crust I use only had two tablespoons of butter for the crumbs from
> > 15 graham crackers, so the crust never even hardened after baking and
> > sitting in the fridge overnight. It was actually a crust that was a
> > little bit soft without being mushy.
>
> Use more butter or fewer graham crackers next time. I'd ease up on
> the graham crackers and make the crust thinner and not as high. You
> don't need a hard crust when you're making cheesecake in a spring
> form. You don't even need it to go all the way up. Butter the spring
> form and scatter crumbs on it so there's just a hint of crust (you can
> make the bottom thicker if you wish).

Actually the crust was fine the way it was. I wasn't complaining about
it. A harder crust might have required more force to cut through it. The
crust was like a soft-baked cookie. It was pleasant.

One thing I've noticed about some pie if the crust is too hard -- the
force required to cut through the crust creates a chance that your fork
could slip and send the rest of your cheesecake or pie flying off the
plate and onto the floor. It's happened to me before.

Damaeus

In news:rec.food.cooking, "Pete C." > posted on Fri,
26 Nov 2010 19:21:22 -0600 the following:

> Damaeus wrote:
>
> > In news:rec.food.cooking, "Pete C." > posted on Thu,
> > 25 Nov 2010 19:48:55 -0600 the following:
> >
> > > Water bath??? For a cheesecake??? I've never heard of that in any
> > > cheesecake recipe, even the screwy ones that use a crust. Are you baking
> > > cheesecake or a creme brulee???
> >
> > Does a creme brulee have a crust?
>
> I've certainly never heard of a creme brulee with a crust, normally it
> is cooked and served in a ramekin and of course had the caramelized
> sugar crust added to the top before serving.

I wasn't asking that question seriously. I just found it odd that you'd
ask me if I was making creme brulee since I already said I was making a
cheesecake with a crust.

This reminds me of that movie, The Million Dollar Duck. Sandy Duncan's
character was cooking something out of a cookbook, and every time she
turned her back to add more ingredients to the food, a fan nearby would
blow the cookbook to a different page, messing up the recipe.

> > I've never had a cheesecake without a
> > crust, or I'd call it cheesecake pudding.
>
> I'm not sure why you'd call it that, pretty much any cheesecake recipe
> has a relatively firm texture, vs. puddings which have a very soft
> texture.

/sigh, yes I know that. Maybe it's a custard-style pudding. If Yoplait
can get away with making a yogurt you can slice with a knife, can't I make
cheesecake pudding you can slice with a knife?

> > And I'm not talking about some Keebler pie crust in a pan. I'm
> > talking about the layer of graham cracker crumbs and butter that is
> > pressed into the bottom of the springform pan that gives the
> > cheesecake some kind of base to sit on.
>
> Cheesecake doesn't need a base to sit on, it has a firm enough texture
> to stand on it's own.

I know. I just thought maybe a crust, while optional, was accepted as
part of cheesecake.

> > I would probably like a cheesecake without a crust,
>
> I expect you would, it lets you focus on the flavor of the cheesecake
> without a crust to distract.

Sometimes I like pizza without crust so I can focus on the taste of the
toppings without a crust to distract, but I'm not sure I'd call it pizza
if it didn't have a crust. I think that might be a casserole. Still, I'm
not offended by the idea of cheesecake still being called "cheesecake"
even without a crust.

Hmmm... I wonder what it would be like if I used 3/4 cup of heavy cream
instead of 3/4 cup of milk in the cheesecake.

> > however, but just because the one I
> > made has a crust, I don't consider it screwy, bad, wrong, evil or sinful.
>
> I do

I'm tempted to surprise them with a crustless cheesecake. Honestly when I
eat cheesecake, sometimes I like to slice away the crust and eat just the
cream cheese part. I noticed my friend's mom... She had an amount toward
the end of her slice that would make two bites. She sliced away the
crust, ate that, then saved a crustless hunk for her last bite. If she
thinks like I do, she wanted her last bite to be the best one. I think a
crustless cheesecake might go over quite well.

> > The cheesecake I baked for Thanksgiving was my second using this
> > recipe. It didn't call for a water bath, but some of the comments
> > under the recipe did call for one. Plus a discussion I had over
> > instant messaging has become clearer now. A water bath will keep the
> > sides of the springform pan from exceeding 212 degrees. That will
> > result in a cheesecake which has the same creaminess on the sides as
> > it has in the center.
>
> That would be the theory for a water bath, and is why one is used for
> creme brulee.

I'm going to make creme brulee tonight.

> > And while the cheesecake I brought to dinner made everyone moan in
> > ecstasy like no other food that was on the table, I noticed a
> > difference in texture as I ate toward the outside edge of the
> > cheesecake. The center was so creamy that it had no texture at all
> > that my tongue could detect, but the outside edge did have a texture.
>
> It sounds like it didn't quite get evenly done. What was the oven temp,
> and what temp was the water bath?

I didn't use a water bath, and that's why I posted about the difference in
texture between the center and the outside edge. My third cheesecake will
be made in a water bath. My friend's mom put in an order for a cheesecake
for Christmas. Anyway, I baked it at 350 degrees for an hour, then turned
the oven off without closing the door and left it there for eight hours. I
then took it out of the oven and chilled it in the fridge for the next
fourteen hours.

I took a picture of it after it had been setting up for five hours in the
cooling oven. Notice there are no cracks in it. There were no cracks
after eight hours, and no cracks after chilling for fourteen hours:

http://home.earthlink.net/~damaeus/i...cheesecake.jpg

I did put a pan of water in the oven on the bottom rack. I used the same
method for the first attempt at this cheesecake and had a very small crack
on each side. I think the added moisture from the steam of the lower pan
kept the cracks from forming at all this time. Next time I'll put the pan
directly into the water bath.

> > It wasn't gross or inedible or anything, but there *was* a texture and
> > I didn't like the mouth feel of the outside inch of cheesecake as much
> > as the center.
>
> The cheesecake I bake has a definite texture and "crumb" to it since it
> contains ricotta cheese. That texture is one of the features I like
> about the recipe vs. something like NY style which I find is often
> rather "gluey".

Gluey is the adjective I'd use to describe the cheesecake made with a
Jell-O cheesecake kit.

> Since I don't use a water bath, the outside gets a bit more done which
> intensifies the "crumb" and flavor, something I find very appealing.

I found that the outside inch of mine made me think it was about 80%
cheesecake, 20% bread pudding. I don't find that texture appealing. I
want the edge to be exactly like the center; the water bath should
accomplish that.

> > A water bath is supposed to keep the outside edge as creamy as the
> > center where it was absolutely perfect.
>
> Sounds like you just need to adjust the balance between water bath
> starting temp and oven temp to find the point where everything is baked
> to the same point when it's done.

Yes, on my third attempt, I should get cheesecake perfection because (a) I
will use a water bath, and (b) I already planned to pour the water boiling
hot, straight off the pot on the stove into the pan holding the springform
pan. I may need to get another pan, come to think of it, because I don't
think I have one deep enough to hold a springform pan unless I use one of
the big soup-type pots I'd use on the stove.

Damaeus

Damaeus wrote:
>
> In news:rec.food.cooking, "Pete C." > posted on Fri,
> 26 Nov 2010 19:21:22 -0600 the following:
>
> > Damaeus wrote:
> >
> > > In news:rec.food.cooking, "Pete C." > posted on Thu,
> > > 25 Nov 2010 19:48:55 -0600 the following:
> > >
> > > > Water bath??? For a cheesecake??? I've never heard of that in any
> > > > cheesecake recipe, even the screwy ones that use a crust. Are you baking
> > > > cheesecake or a creme brulee???
> > >
> > > Does a creme brulee have a crust?
> >
> > I've certainly never heard of a creme brulee with a crust, normally it
> > is cooked and served in a ramekin and of course had the caramelized
> > sugar crust added to the top before serving.
>
> I wasn't asking that question seriously. I just found it odd that you'd
> ask me if I was making creme brulee since I already said I was making a
> cheesecake with a crust.

I'd never heard of using a water bath with cheesecake before, and creme
brulee always uses a water bath.

>
> This reminds me of that movie, The Million Dollar Duck. Sandy Duncan's
> character was cooking something out of a cookbook, and every time she
> turned her back to add more ingredients to the food, a fan nearby would
> blow the cookbook to a different page, messing up the recipe.

No fans or cookbooks here, modern technology - I print a copy of just
the recipe I'm using.

>
> > > I've never had a cheesecake without a
> > > crust, or I'd call it cheesecake pudding.
> >
> > I'm not sure why you'd call it that, pretty much any cheesecake recipe
> > has a relatively firm texture, vs. puddings which have a very soft
> > texture.
>
> /sigh, yes I know that. Maybe it's a custard-style pudding. If Yoplait
> can get away with making a yogurt you can slice with a knife, can't I make
> cheesecake pudding you can slice with a knife?

I'll have a slice of that gravy please...

>
> > > And I'm not talking about some Keebler pie crust in a pan. I'm
> > > talking about the layer of graham cracker crumbs and butter that is
> > > pressed into the bottom of the springform pan that gives the
> > > cheesecake some kind of base to sit on.
> >
> > Cheesecake doesn't need a base to sit on, it has a firm enough texture
> > to stand on it's own.
>
> I know. I just thought maybe a crust, while optional, was accepted as
> part of cheesecake.

It's not accepted as part of a cheesecake in my kitchen.

>
> > > I would probably like a cheesecake without a crust,
> >
> > I expect you would, it lets you focus on the flavor of the cheesecake
> > without a crust to distract.
>
> Sometimes I like pizza without crust so I can focus on the taste of the
> toppings without a crust to distract, but I'm not sure I'd call it pizza
> if it didn't have a crust. I think that might be a casserole. Still, I'm
> not offended by the idea of cheesecake still being called "cheesecake"
> even without a crust.

Bad analogy, a cheesecake doesn't require a crust to hold it together,
while pizza toppings do.

>
> Hmmm... I wonder what it would be like if I used 3/4 cup of heavy cream
> instead of 3/4 cup of milk in the cheesecake.

Richer no doubt. My recipe doesn't use any milk or cream, sour cream is
the closest match.

>
> > > however, but just because the one I
> > > made has a crust, I don't consider it screwy, bad, wrong, evil or sinful.
> >
> > I do
>
> I'm tempted to surprise them with a crustless cheesecake. Honestly when I
> eat cheesecake, sometimes I like to slice away the crust and eat just the
> cream cheese part. I noticed my friend's mom... She had an amount toward
> the end of her slice that would make two bites. She sliced away the
> crust, ate that, then saved a crustless hunk for her last bite. If she
> thinks like I do, she wanted her last bite to be the best one. I think a
> crustless cheesecake might go over quite well.

They always go over well when I make them.

>
> > > The cheesecake I baked for Thanksgiving was my second using this
> > > recipe. It didn't call for a water bath, but some of the comments
> > > under the recipe did call for one. Plus a discussion I had over
> > > instant messaging has become clearer now. A water bath will keep the
> > > sides of the springform pan from exceeding 212 degrees. That will
> > > result in a cheesecake which has the same creaminess on the sides as
> > > it has in the center.
> >
> > That would be the theory for a water bath, and is why one is used for
> > creme brulee.
>
> I'm going to make creme brulee tonight.

I just made pumpkin creme brulee here, part of my T-Day menu (my T-Day
is Sunday).

>
> > > And while the cheesecake I brought to dinner made everyone moan in
> > > ecstasy like no other food that was on the table, I noticed a
> > > difference in texture as I ate toward the outside edge of the
> > > cheesecake. The center was so creamy that it had no texture at all
> > > that my tongue could detect, but the outside edge did have a texture.
> >
> > It sounds like it didn't quite get evenly done. What was the oven temp,
> > and what temp was the water bath?
>
> I didn't use a water bath, and that's why I posted about the difference in
> texture between the center and the outside edge.

Ok, that makes more sense. Whether that difference in texture is
desirable or not would depend on the recipe I guess. With the recipe I
use and without a crust in the way, the more-baked outside has a nice
character.

> My third cheesecake will
> be made in a water bath. My friend's mom put in an order for a cheesecake
> for Christmas. Anyway, I baked it at 350 degrees for an hour, then turned
> the oven off without closing the door and left it there for eight hours. I
> then took it out of the oven and chilled it in the fridge for the next
> fourteen hours.

Presume you mean without opening the door. That long cooling down
extended bake is essential, but a bit of a pain when you have other
items competing to get into the oven.

>
> I took a picture of it after it had been setting up for five hours in the
> cooling oven. Notice there are no cracks in it. There were no cracks
> after eight hours, and no cracks after chilling for fourteen hours:
>
> http://home.earthlink.net/~damaeus/i...cheesecake.jpg
>
> I did put a pan of water in the oven on the bottom rack. I used the same
> method for the first attempt at this cheesecake and had a very small crack
> on each side. I think the added moisture from the steam of the lower pan
> kept the cracks from forming at all this time. Next time I'll put the pan
> directly into the water bath.

I'm not sure that's really it, sometimes I get cracks and sometimes I
don't, with no changes in recipe or technique. The cracks may be related
to the phase of the moon or something.

>
> > > It wasn't gross or inedible or anything, but there *was* a texture and
> > > I didn't like the mouth feel of the outside inch of cheesecake as much
> > > as the center.
> >
> > The cheesecake I bake has a definite texture and "crumb" to it since it
> > contains ricotta cheese. That texture is one of the features I like
> > about the recipe vs. something like NY style which I find is often
> > rather "gluey".
>
> Gluey is the adjective I'd use to describe the cheesecake made with a
> Jell-O cheesecake kit.

I'll take your word for it, since I try to avoid those.

>
> > Since I don't use a water bath, the outside gets a bit more done which
> > intensifies the "crumb" and flavor, something I find very appealing.
>
> I found that the outside inch of mine made me think it was about 80%
> cheesecake, 20% bread pudding. I don't find that texture appealing. I
> want the edge to be exactly like the center; the water bath should
> accomplish that.

Mmmm, bread pudding, that's on my production schedule for tomorrow...

>
> > > A water bath is supposed to keep the outside edge as creamy as the
> > > center where it was absolutely perfect.
> >
> > Sounds like you just need to adjust the balance between water bath
> > starting temp and oven temp to find the point where everything is baked
> > to the same point when it's done.
>
> Yes, on my third attempt, I should get cheesecake perfection because (a) I
> will use a water bath, and (b) I already planned to pour the water boiling
> hot, straight off the pot on the stove into the pan holding the springform
> pan. I may need to get another pan, come to think of it, because I don't
> think I have one deep enough to hold a springform pan unless I use one of
> the big soup-type pots I'd use on the stove.

I use a big Calphalon roasting pan when I make creme brulee, it's around
4" deep, so it should work for a water bath for most any pan.

On Fri, 26 Nov 2010 20:25:51 -0600, Damaeus
> wrote:

> Yes, on my third attempt, I should get cheesecake perfection because (a) I
> will use a water bath, and (b) I already planned to pour the water boiling
> hot, straight off the pot on the stove into the pan holding the springform
> pan. I may need to get another pan, come to think of it, because I don't
> think I have one deep enough to hold a springform pan unless I use one of
> the big soup-type pots I'd use on the stove.

We discussed cheesecakes and water baths yesterday. I don't do water
baths, period. Others do and say their cheesecake will crack anyway.
Not during baking, but during the cooling down process. The tip was
to loosen your cheesecake from the pan ASAP. If you do that, then no
cracked crust.

--

Never trust a dog to watch your food.

On Fri, 26 Nov 2010 18:46:44 -0600, Damaeus
> wrote:

> It made a perfect cut,
> indeed. I just want to get a fresh stretch of floss after each cut.

Why? You just pulled it straight out and not back up, right? It's a
capital L motion, straight down and then out.

--

Never trust a dog to watch your food.

"Pete C." > wrote in message
ster.com...
>
> Paco wrote:
>>

>> > Pie = crust
>> > Cake = no crust
>>
>> "Boston Cream PIE"?
>
> What does an incorrectly named cake have to do with things?
>

You know exactly what my point was.

>>
>> You're just being persnickety because the recipe title refers to "that
>> festering cesspool of humanity", New York City.
>
> Nope, it doesn't matter where it's from, cheesecake does not have a
> crust. Indeed I just baked a proper crust free cheesecake last night.

Just because you say it is so, does not make it so, Sheldon. Good day.

"merryb" > wrote in message
...
> On Nov 25, 5:48 pm, "Pete C." > wrote:
>> Damaeus wrote:
>>
>> > In news:rec.food.cooking, "Pete C." > posted on
>> > Wed,
>> > 24 Nov 2010 20:02:42 -0600 the following:
>>
>> > > Cheesecake doesn't have a crust, that's why you use a springform pan.
>> > > Parchment on the bottom helps a lot, but even with it I've had
>> > > difficulties. Two layers of parchment and/or making the parchment
>> > > come
>> > > up the side of the pan slightly helps.
>>
>> > I would see if I could get the parchment to extend outside the
>> > springform
>> > pan, then when I remove the tube, I would hopefully have one sheet.
>> > The
>> > only problem is that the springform pan makes a pretty tight seal as it
>> > is, and I'm not sure if it would seat properly if parchment paper was
>> > set
>> > up that way. Plus there's the water bath to consider, and wrapping the
>> > whole assembly in foil could just turn out to make a big mess.
>>
>> Water bath??? For a cheesecake??? I've never heard of that in any
>> cheesecake recipe, even the screwy ones that use a crust. Are you baking
>> cheesecake or a creme brulee???- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
> You must be reading something other than recipes. It is a fact that
> cheesecake bakes much better in a water bath than not. Also, less
> chance of cracking...

I do agree with Pete's point of a "stronger" texture on the sides, sans a
water bath. My method uses a pan of boiling water on the rack below the one
the cheesecake is on. This adds moisture to the oven's interior, thus
reducing the risk of cracking.

In news:rec.food.cooking, "Pete C." > posted on Fri,
26 Nov 2010 20:53:31 -0600 the following:

> Damaeus wrote:
>
> > Sometimes I like pizza without crust so I can focus on the taste of
> > the toppings without a crust to distract, but I'm not sure I'd call it
> > pizza if it didn't have a crust. I think that might be a casserole.
> > Still, I'm not offended by the idea of cheesecake still being called
> > "cheesecake" even without a crust.
>
> Bad analogy, a cheesecake doesn't require a crust to hold it together,
> while pizza toppings do.

LOL

> > Hmmm... I wonder what it would be like if I used 3/4 cup of heavy cream
> > instead of 3/4 cup of milk in the cheesecake.
>
> Richer no doubt. My recipe doesn't use any milk or cream, sour cream is
> the closest match.

The one I use has a cup of sour cream, as well as 32 ounces of cream
cheese, 3/4 cup of milk, four eggs, vanilla and sugar.

> > My third cheesecake will be made in a water bath. My friend's mom put
> > in an order for a cheesecake for Christmas. Anyway, I baked it at 350
> > degrees for an hour, then turned the oven off without closing the door
> > and left it there for eight hours. I then took it out of the oven and
> > chilled it in the fridge for the next fourteen hours.
>
> Presume you mean without opening the door. That long cooling down
> extended bake is essential, but a bit of a pain when you have other
> items competing to get into the oven.

That's what's nice about having two ovens.

> > I took a picture of it after it had been setting up for five hours in
> > the cooling oven. Notice there are no cracks in it. There were no
> > cracks after eight hours, and no cracks after chilling for fourteen
> > hours:
> >
> > http://home.earthlink.net/~damaeus/i...cheesecake.jpg
> >
> > I did put a pan of water in the oven on the bottom rack. I used the
> > same method for the first attempt at this cheesecake and had a very
> > small crack on each side. I think the added moisture from the steam
> > of the lower pan kept the cracks from forming at all this time. Next
> > time I'll put the pan directly into the water bath.
>
> I'm not sure that's really it, sometimes I get cracks and sometimes I
> don't, with no changes in recipe or technique. The cracks may be related
> to the phase of the moon or something.

From what I've researched, overbeating, overbaking, and cooling too
quickly will all cause a cheesecake to crack. And I imagine if you don't
grease the sides with something, as the cheesecake shrinks, the sticking
to the side while shrinking toward the middle will also cause cracks.
Cracks don't taste bad, but I like the way it looks without them.

> > The cheesecake I bake has a definite texture and "crumb" to it since
> > it contains ricotta cheese. That texture is one of the features I
> > like about the recipe vs. something like NY style which I find is
> > often rather "gluey".
> >
> > Gluey is the adjective I'd use to describe the cheesecake made with a
> > Jell-O cheesecake kit.
>
> I'll take your word for it, since I try to avoid those.

I don't have to try to avoid them. I nearly hiss like a vampire when I
see them. I've had them before, years ago before I made my first
cheesecake, but I don't think I could eat one today without a lot of
dissatisfaction. I would only eat something like that at someone else's
house, and just to be nice.

Anyway, I didn't use ricotta in mine, but I think if I had, the whole
thing would have had the same texture as the edges.

> > Yes, on my third attempt, I should get cheesecake perfection because
> > (a) I will use a water bath, and (b) I already planned to pour the
> > water boiling hot, straight off the pot on the stove into the pan
> > holding the springform pan. I may need to get another pan, come to
> > think of it, because I don't think I have one deep enough to hold a
> > springform pan unless I use one of the big soup-type pots I'd use on
> > the stove.
>
> I use a big Calphalon roasting pan when I make creme brulee, it's around
> 4" deep, so it should work for a water bath for most any pan.

I made creme brulee tonight. I've only had creme brulee once before and
it was made by the "executive chef" at an Italian restaurant where I used
to work. It wasn't on the menu, but he made it for the staff. Anyway his
creme brulee left me thinking creme brulee was something other than what
most recipes seem to produce. His had a very sweet, brown syrup of some
type on the top of it that was very tasty. His creme brulee was more
"custardy" than what I ended up with. Mine turned out to be creamier like
a pudding. It was still pretty jiggly when I took it out of the oven,
leaving me wondering if it had cooked properly.

I used Alton Brown's recipe here with a few modifications.

http://www.foodnetwork.com/recipes/a...ipe/index.html

Since I didn't have a vanilla bean, I used a teaspoon of Mexican vanilla.
I probably should have used a little bit more. And I added two
tablespoons of rum. And I was about 1/3 cup short on heavy cream so I
made up for it with 1/3 cup of whole milk. And I didn't have "vanilla
sugar" so I used plain old sugar. And my ramekins are smaller than his so
I was able to get eight servings instead of six. I did use a water bath,
too, though I think I got the water a bit higher than halfway up the
ramekin.

Well, I can't really say all this was a failure. I was a little squeamish
thinking I might not have gotten the egg yolks in it cooked completely. I
wanted to give a couple of these to an elderly couple across the highway,
but if the eggs aren't cooked completely, I'd hate to be the one that
makes them sick.

And finally I have to say that these might "custardize" some more, I
suppose. I admit not being able to help myself. I went and got one and
ate it an hour before the chilling time was complete, and without
scorching the sugar on top. I may be able to reply later and say they
actually turned out great.

I don't have a torch so I'll have to use the broiler to scorch the sugar.
Hopefully the 30 minutes they sit out before being scorched will give the
glass time to warm up so they won't crack under the broiler. I don't know
how much ambient heat glass can stand when it's been chilled in a fridge.
I'm probably worried over nothing.

Damaeus

In news:rec.food.cooking, sf > posted on Fri, 26 Nov 2010
19:03:13 -0800 the following:

> On Fri, 26 Nov 2010 20:25:51 -0600, Damaeus
> > wrote:
>
> > Yes, on my third attempt, I should get cheesecake perfection because
> > (a) I will use a water bath, and (b) I already planned to pour the
> > water boiling hot, straight off the pot on the stove into the pan
> > holding the springform pan. I may need to get another pan, come to
> > think of it, because I don't think I have one deep enough to hold a
> > springform pan unless I use one of the big soup-type pots I'd use on
> > the stove.
>
> We discussed cheesecakes and water baths yesterday. I don't do water
> baths, period. Others do and say their cheesecake will crack anyway.
> Not during baking, but during the cooling down process. The tip was
> to loosen your cheesecake from the pan ASAP. If you do that, then no
> cracked crust.

I didn't loosen my cheesecake from the pan ASAP and it developed no
cracks. I did that eight hours after it recuperated in the oven and there
were no cracks in it when I loosened it, and no cracks after sitting for
14 hours in the fridge. The edges of the pan were sprayed with food
release and the cheesecake shrank away from the edges of the pan. I
imagine if I hadn't used food release, it might have cracked. And my
springform pan is nonstick on top of that.

Research shows that cracks in cheesecakes are caused by overbeating,
overbaking, or cooling too quickly.

Damaeus

In news:rec.food.cooking, sf > posted on Fri, 26 Nov 2010
19:05:53 -0800 the following:

> On Fri, 26 Nov 2010 18:46:44 -0600, Damaeus
> > wrote:
>
> > It made a perfect cut, indeed. I just want to get a fresh stretch of
> > floss after each cut.
>
> Why? You just pulled it straight out and not back up, right? It's a
> capital L motion, straight down and then out.

Right, I pulled it straight out, not back up. I just didn't want to get
cheesecake all over my fingers.

Damaeus

In news:rec.food.cooking, Wayne Boatwright >
posted on 26 Nov 2010 18:39:00 GMT the following:

> On Fri 26 Nov 2010 11:04:51a, Goomba told us...
>
> > I prefer mine crustless also.
> > I dislike graham cracker crusts.
>
> There are yeast based crusts, shortbread crusts, ginger snap crumb
> crusts, ground hazelnut or pecan crusts, etc.

Ooooo, a pecan crust sounds good. In fact, a crust made from finely
ground pecans, almonds and walnuts sounds good. Seems like it would need
something to bind it together, like some flour. Perhaps the oils from the
nuts are enough to replace the butter. I want to try something like that,
but the recipes for "pecan crusts" have lots of varieties on the internet.

One thing that bugs me about recipes on the web is the variance. Naturally
I stay away from recipes calling for Cool Whip, canned fruit cocktail,
canned biscuits or Minute Rice. I actually WANT recipes that get things
going from scratch.

Cooks.com is a disappointing website. I have found a few things there
that look pretty good, but there's a lot of garbage there, too. I would
like to find a website that actually has some chef(s) who actually review
the recipes for certain standards.

Damaeus

In news:rec.food.cooking, "Pete C." > posted on Fri,
26 Nov 2010 13:58:00 -0600 the following:

> If you haven't had a crust-free cheesecake, you don't know what you're
> missing in terms of texture and flavor, it's much better than any crust.

I definitely know what you mean there. Sometimes I make cream cheese
icing out of cream cheese and powdered sugar, maybe a little vanilla or
lemon juice. Then I keep it in the fridge. Every now and then when I get
a sweet tooth, I'll get a teaspoon and swipe a dip of it, then enjoy it
like a spoon of peanut butter. Fantastic flavor.

I've got some more cream cheese I need to use. I've got some avocados,
sour cream, the cream cheese (about 4 ounces for three avocados), some
fresh cilantro, salt, a little garlic powder and lime juice. Dump it all
in a food processor and there's a fantastic dip for chips. I don't have
any measurements. I just start with three avocados and keep adding the
other ingredients until it tastes right. I think the lime juice keeps the
color from turning dark too quickly. I don't know for sure it works. I've
never made this stuff without lime or lemon juice and I didn't have a
recipe to go by. I just assumed I should do it since guacamole looks very
nasty at Mexican restaurants if it sits on a plate too long.

Damaeus

On 11/26/2010 9:48 PM, Paco wrote:

> I do agree with Pete's point of a "stronger" texture on the sides, sans
> a water bath. My method uses a pan of boiling water on the rack below
> the one the cheesecake is on. This adds moisture to the oven's interior,
> thus reducing the risk of cracking.

That's a good idea!
--
Janet Wilder
Way-the-heck-south Texas
Spelling doesn't count. Cooking does.

Damaeus wrote:
>
> In news:rec.food.cooking, "Pete C." > posted on Fri,
> 26 Nov 2010 20:53:31 -0600 the following:
>
> > Damaeus wrote:
> >
> > > Sometimes I like pizza without crust so I can focus on the taste of
> > > the toppings without a crust to distract, but I'm not sure I'd call it
> > > pizza if it didn't have a crust. I think that might be a casserole.
> > > Still, I'm not offended by the idea of cheesecake still being called
> > > "cheesecake" even without a crust.
> >
> > Bad analogy, a cheesecake doesn't require a crust to hold it together,
> > while pizza toppings do.
>
> LOL
>
> > > Hmmm... I wonder what it would be like if I used 3/4 cup of heavy cream
> > > instead of 3/4 cup of milk in the cheesecake.
> >
> > Richer no doubt. My recipe doesn't use any milk or cream, sour cream is
> > the closest match.
>
> The one I use has a cup of sour cream, as well as 32 ounces of cream
> cheese, 3/4 cup of milk, four eggs, vanilla and sugar.
>
> > > My third cheesecake will be made in a water bath. My friend's mom put
> > > in an order for a cheesecake for Christmas. Anyway, I baked it at 350
> > > degrees for an hour, then turned the oven off without closing the door
> > > and left it there for eight hours. I then took it out of the oven and
> > > chilled it in the fridge for the next fourteen hours.
> >
> > Presume you mean without opening the door. That long cooling down
> > extended bake is essential, but a bit of a pain when you have other
> > items competing to get into the oven.
>
> That's what's nice about having two ovens.

I have two, I need more The stove has a large main convection oven
and a smaller regular side oven, but when I do a big dinner like my
T-Day I could really use an additional double wall oven... also an
additional refrigerator, but I can use coolers and ice for that.

>
> > > I took a picture of it after it had been setting up for five hours in
> > > the cooling oven. Notice there are no cracks in it. There were no
> > > cracks after eight hours, and no cracks after chilling for fourteen
> > > hours:
> > >
> > > http://home.earthlink.net/~damaeus/i...cheesecake.jpg
> > >
> > > I did put a pan of water in the oven on the bottom rack. I used the
> > > same method for the first attempt at this cheesecake and had a very
> > > small crack on each side. I think the added moisture from the steam
> > > of the lower pan kept the cracks from forming at all this time. Next
> > > time I'll put the pan directly into the water bath.
> >
> > I'm not sure that's really it, sometimes I get cracks and sometimes I
> > don't, with no changes in recipe or technique. The cracks may be related
> > to the phase of the moon or something.
>
> From what I've researched, overbeating, overbaking, and cooling too
> quickly will all cause a cheesecake to crack. And I imagine if you don't
> grease the sides with something, as the cheesecake shrinks, the sticking
> to the side while shrinking toward the middle will also cause cracks.
> Cracks don't taste bad, but I like the way it looks without them.

Yea, they are also a pain if you want to decorate the top. Of course a
nice fruit glaze can smooth out the top.

>
> > > The cheesecake I bake has a definite texture and "crumb" to it since
> > > it contains ricotta cheese. That texture is one of the features I
> > > like about the recipe vs. something like NY style which I find is
> > > often rather "gluey".
> > >
> > > Gluey is the adjective I'd use to describe the cheesecake made with a
> > > Jell-O cheesecake kit.
> >
> > I'll take your word for it, since I try to avoid those.
>
> I don't have to try to avoid them. I nearly hiss like a vampire when I
> see them. I've had them before, years ago before I made my first
> cheesecake, but I don't think I could eat one today without a lot of
> dissatisfaction. I would only eat something like that at someone else's
> house, and just to be nice.

Yep.

>
> Anyway, I didn't use ricotta in mine, but I think if I had, the whole
> thing would have had the same texture as the edges.

Possibly, it definitely has a different texture, and interesting
combination of "cream" and "crumb" that I really like.

>
> > > Yes, on my third attempt, I should get cheesecake perfection because
> > > (a) I will use a water bath, and (b) I already planned to pour the
> > > water boiling hot, straight off the pot on the stove into the pan
> > > holding the springform pan. I may need to get another pan, come to
> > > think of it, because I don't think I have one deep enough to hold a
> > > springform pan unless I use one of the big soup-type pots I'd use on
> > > the stove.
> >
> > I use a big Calphalon roasting pan when I make creme brulee, it's around
> > 4" deep, so it should work for a water bath for most any pan.
>
> I made creme brulee tonight. I've only had creme brulee once before and
> it was made by the "executive chef" at an Italian restaurant where I used
> to work. It wasn't on the menu, but he made it for the staff. Anyway his
> creme brulee left me thinking creme brulee was something other than what
> most recipes seem to produce. His had a very sweet, brown syrup of some
> type on the top of it that was very tasty. His creme brulee was more
> "custardy" than what I ended up with. Mine turned out to be creamier like
> a pudding. It was still pretty jiggly when I took it out of the oven,
> leaving me wondering if it had cooked properly.

Odd, every creme brulee I've had or made has been very soft and creamy
and the caramelized sugar crust on top crunchy. The one you describe
sounds more like creme caramel.

>
> I used Alton Brown's recipe here with a few modifications.
>
> http://www.foodnetwork.com/recipes/a...ipe/index.html
>
> Since I didn't have a vanilla bean, I used a teaspoon of Mexican vanilla.
> I probably should have used a little bit more.

I nearly always add more vanilla than a recipe calls for. It's mostly
alcohol so it will cook off any not really affect consistency.

> And I added two
> tablespoons of rum. And I was about 1/3 cup short on heavy cream so I
> made up for it with 1/3 cup of whole milk. And I didn't have "vanilla
> sugar" so I used plain old sugar. And my ramekins are smaller than his so
> I was able to get eight servings instead of six. I did use a water bath,
> too, though I think I got the water a bit higher than halfway up the
> ramekin.

I frequently make banana creme brulee with some banana liquor, and
garnish with some fresh banana slices and a dab of whipped cream.

>
> Well, I can't really say all this was a failure. I was a little squeamish
> thinking I might not have gotten the egg yolks in it cooked completely. I
> wanted to give a couple of these to an elderly couple across the highway,
> but if the eggs aren't cooked completely, I'd hate to be the one that
> makes them sick.
>
> And finally I have to say that these might "custardize" some more, I
> suppose. I admit not being able to help myself. I went and got one and
> ate it an hour before the chilling time was complete, and without
> scorching the sugar on top. I may be able to reply later and say they
> actually turned out great.

It does continue to cook as it cools. Mine normally come out looking not
quite set and end up fine after cooling and chilling. You can always use
Pasteurized eggs to make it if you're worried.

>
> I don't have a torch so I'll have to use the broiler to scorch the sugar.
> Hopefully the 30 minutes they sit out before being scorched will give the
> glass time to warm up so they won't crack under the broiler. I don't know
> how much ambient heat glass can stand when it's been chilled in a fridge.
> I'm probably worried over nothing.

I use ceramic ramekins and haven't cracked any yet. I also use a
Bernz-o-Matic TS4000 trigger start torch with a MAPP gas cylinder, don't
bother with the little "creme brulee torches", get the big 'un at Depot
or Lowe's for the same price and more power and flexibility.

sf wrote:
> On Thu, 25 Nov 2010 11:28:28 -0800, Dan > wrote:
>
>> No cakes in the past.
>
> I had Boston Cream cheesecake today... I have no idea if this is the
> recipe or not, but it looked pretty much like this (and it was yummy)
> http://hubpages.com/hub/Boston-Cream-Cheesecake
>

Hmmmm. I can imagine such a thing.... If I make cheesecake, I'll
wait until one of my daughter's friends is back from college. She
LOVES cheesecake. I basically like cheesecake that is low-carb.

--
Jean B.

On Sat, 27 Nov 2010 02:18:21 -0600, Damaeus
> wrote:

> Ooooo, a pecan crust sounds good. In fact, a crust made from finely
> ground pecans, almonds and walnuts sounds good. Seems like it would need
> something to bind it together, like some flour. Perhaps the oils from the
> nuts are enough to replace the butter. I want to try something like that,
> but the recipes for "pecan crusts" have lots of varieties on the internet.

Nut crusts are good. In fact you can find ground nuts to use as
"flour" at Trader Joe's (if it's in your area) for a decent price.
Don't expect it to mimic a flour crust and your expectations will be
met. Resist adding any flour and it will be a gluten free.

--

Never trust a dog to watch your food.

On 27 Nov 2010 06:33:42 GMT, Wayne Boatwright
> wrote:

> On Fri 26 Nov 2010 01:40:32p, Goomba told us...
>
> > Jim Elbrecht wrote:
> >
> >> Flavor or texture? I remember a cheesecake that took crushed
> >> Oreo cookies & butter for a crust.
> >>
> >> Jim
> >
> > Sweetness actually. Sometimes people make things so unnecessarily
> > sweet that you lose the other flavor components (dairy; lemon or
> > vanilla; fruit, etc).
> > Oreos would pretty much ruin it for me, I imagine? It would
> > overtake any subtle flavors.
> >
>
> When I want a chocolate crumb crust for a cheesecake or some type of
> pie, I use Famous Chocolate Wafers. They are not particularly sweet,
> if fact the crust recipe on the box has additional sugar in it, but I
> either use none or just a bit. The wafers are harder to find these
> days, but I can still get them in one of our suparmarkets. They are
> intensely chocolatey.
>
> <http://www.amazon.com/Famous-Chocolate-Wafers-9-Ounce-
> Boxes/dp/B000FA38ZE>

I like those too! I'll never understand the reasoning behind Oreo
cookie crusts. I don't want the filling in my chocolate crumb crust
and I'm not going to stand there and scrape it off every cookie - one
by one. Have you ever made the dessert pictured on the box. It was a
teenaged favorite of mine... I ate it, I didn't make it. I always
think about making one, but end up using the cookies for something
else.

--

Never trust a dog to watch your food.

On Sat, 27 Nov 2010 08:52:25 -0700, "Jean B." > wrote:

> sf wrote:
> >
> > I had Boston Cream cheesecake today... I have no idea if this is the
> > recipe or not, but it looked pretty much like this (and it was yummy)
> > http://hubpages.com/hub/Boston-Cream-Cheesecake
> >
>
> Hmmmm. I can imagine such a thing.... If I make cheesecake, I'll
> wait until one of my daughter's friends is back from college. She
> LOVES cheesecake. I basically like cheesecake that is low-carb.

I was thinking last night that the recipe would make nice cupcakes
(party food) too. Of course the timing would need to be adjusted.

--

Never trust a dog to watch your food.

In article >,
Damaeus > wrote:

> In news:rec.food.cooking, "Pete C." > posted on Fri,
> 26 Nov 2010 20:53:31 -0600 the following:
>
> > Damaeus wrote:

> > > I took a picture of it after it had been setting up for five hours in
> > > the cooling oven. Notice there are no cracks in it. There were no
> > > cracks after eight hours, and no cracks after chilling for fourteen
> > > hours:
> > >
> > > http://home.earthlink.net/~damaeus/i...cheesecake.jpg
> > >
> > > I did put a pan of water in the oven on the bottom rack. I used the
> > > same method for the first attempt at this cheesecake and had a very
> > > small crack on each side. I think the added moisture from the steam
> > > of the lower pan kept the cracks from forming at all this time. Next
> > > time I'll put the pan directly into the water bath.
> >
> > I'm not sure that's really it, sometimes I get cracks and sometimes I
> > don't, with no changes in recipe or technique. The cracks may be related
> > to the phase of the moon or something.
>
> From what I've researched, overbeating, overbaking, and cooling too
> quickly will all cause a cheesecake to crack. And I imagine if you don't
> grease the sides with something, as the cheesecake shrinks, the sticking
> to the side while shrinking toward the middle will also cause cracks.
> Cracks don't taste bad, but I like the way it looks without them.

That's why my wife claims that God invented sour cream. She mixes up
sour cream with something (probably sugar), and then fills in all the
cracks. Then she puts a thin layer over the top of the cheesecake.
Makes it nice and white.

--
Dan Abel
Petaluma, California USA

sf wrote:
> On 27 Nov 2010 06:33:42 GMT, Wayne Boatwright
> > wrote:
>
>> On Fri 26 Nov 2010 01:40:32p, Goomba told us...
>>
>>> Jim Elbrecht wrote:
>>>
>>>> Flavor or texture? I remember a cheesecake that took crushed
>>>> Oreo cookies& butter for a crust.
>>>>
>>>> Jim
>>>
>>> Sweetness actually. Sometimes people make things so unnecessarily
>>> sweet that you lose the other flavor components (dairy; lemon or
>>> vanilla; fruit, etc).
>>> Oreos would pretty much ruin it for me, I imagine? It would
>>> overtake any subtle flavors.
>>>
>>
>> When I want a chocolate crumb crust for a cheesecake or some type of
>> pie, I use Famous Chocolate Wafers. They are not particularly sweet,
>> if fact the crust recipe on the box has additional sugar in it, but I
>> either use none or just a bit. The wafers are harder to find these
>> days, but I can still get them in one of our suparmarkets. They are
>> intensely chocolatey.
>>
>> <http://www.amazon.com/Famous-Chocolate-Wafers-9-Ounce-
>> Boxes/dp/B000FA38ZE>
>
> I like those too! I'll never understand the reasoning behind Oreo
> cookie crusts. I don't want the filling in my chocolate crumb crust
> and I'm not going to stand there and scrape it off every cookie - one
> by one. Have you ever made the dessert pictured on the box. It was a
> teenaged favorite of mine... I ate it, I didn't make it. I always
> think about making one, but end up using the cookies for something
> else.
>

They do (or did?) sell just the wafers without the filling. That
being said, I am not partial to chocolate cheesecake.

--
Jean B.

In article >,
Damaeus > wrote:


> Cooks.com is a disappointing website. I have found a few things there
> that look pretty good, but there's a lot of garbage there, too. I would
> like to find a website that actually has some chef(s) who actually review
> the recipes for certain standards.

Everybody wants something for nothing. Then when they find it, it's
worth what they paid for it. Nothing.

That's why I like cookbooks. Generally, the recipes are tested.

--
Dan Abel
Petaluma, California USA

Dan Abel wrote:
> In >,
> > wrote:
>
>> In news:rec.food.cooking, "Pete > posted on Fri,
>> 26 Nov 2010 20:53:31 -0600 the following:
>>
>>> Damaeus wrote:
>
>>>> I took a picture of it after it had been setting up for five hours in
>>>> the cooling oven. Notice there are no cracks in it. There were no
>>>> cracks after eight hours, and no cracks after chilling for fourteen
>>>> hours:
>>>>
>>>> http://home.earthlink.net/~damaeus/i...cheesecake.jpg
>>>>
>>>> I did put a pan of water in the oven on the bottom rack. I used the
>>>> same method for the first attempt at this cheesecake and had a very
>>>> small crack on each side. I think the added moisture from the steam
>>>> of the lower pan kept the cracks from forming at all this time. Next
>>>> time I'll put the pan directly into the water bath.
>>>
>>> I'm not sure that's really it, sometimes I get cracks and sometimes I
>>> don't, with no changes in recipe or technique. The cracks may be related
>>> to the phase of the moon or something.
>>
>> From what I've researched, overbeating, overbaking, and cooling too
>> quickly will all cause a cheesecake to crack. And I imagine if you don't
>> grease the sides with something, as the cheesecake shrinks, the sticking
>> to the side while shrinking toward the middle will also cause cracks.
>> Cracks don't taste bad, but I like the way it looks without them.
>
> That's why my wife claims that God invented sour cream. She mixes up
> sour cream with something (probably sugar), and then fills in all the
> cracks. Then she puts a thin layer over the top of the cheesecake.
> Makes it nice and white.
>
Hmmm. Or mascarpone. Thanks for that idea. I suppose one could
make the cracks delectable enough that they would be sought-out
treasures in a piece.

--
Jean B.

Wayne Boatwright wrote:
> On Sat 27 Nov 2010 09:14:52a, sf told us...
>
>> On 27 Nov 2010 06:33:42 GMT, Wayne Boatwright
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> On Fri 26 Nov 2010 01:40:32p, Goomba told us...
>>>
>>>> Jim Elbrecht wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Flavor or texture? I remember a cheesecake that took
>>>>> crushed Oreo cookies& butter for a crust.
>>>>>
>>>>> Jim
>>>>
>>>> Sweetness actually. Sometimes people make things so
>>>> unnecessarily sweet that you lose the other flavor components
>>>> (dairy; lemon or vanilla; fruit, etc).
>>>> Oreos would pretty much ruin it for me, I imagine? It would
>>>> overtake any subtle flavors.
>>>>
>>>
>>> When I want a chocolate crumb crust for a cheesecake or some type
>>> of pie, I use Famous Chocolate Wafers. They are not particularly
>>> sweet, if fact the crust recipe on the box has additional sugar
>>> in it, but I either use none or just a bit. The wafers are
>>> harder to find these days, but I can still get them in one of our
>>> suparmarkets. They are intensely chocolatey.
>>>
>>> <http://www.amazon.com/Famous-Chocolate-Wafers-9-Ounce-
>>> Boxes/dp/B000FA38ZE>
>>
>> I like those too! I'll never understand the reasoning behind Oreo
>> cookie crusts. I don't want the filling in my chocolate crumb
>> crust and I'm not going to stand there and scrape it off every
>> cookie - one by one. Have you ever made the dessert pictured on
>> the box. It was a teenaged favorite of mine... I ate it, I didn't
>> make it. I always think about making one, but end up using the
>> cookies for something else.
>>
>
>
>
> Yes, I have made the chocolate wafer and whipped cream roll, but not
> for a long time. My mother used to make it, too.

Oooops. Can one GET those wafers now? Seems to me I have read
about folks not finding them. I was alluding to Oreo wafers Maybe
called something else--I see them in those 100-calorie packages.

Current thought: an icebox cake made with gingersnaps (maybe thin
ones) with a filling based on candied ginger.

Jean B., who has somehow misplaced her huge container of Williams
Sonoma ginger...

On Sat, 27 Nov 2010 08:44:46 -0800, Dan Abel > wrote:

> That's why my wife claims that God invented sour cream. She mixes up
> sour cream with something (probably sugar), and then fills in all the
> cracks. Then she puts a thin layer over the top of the cheesecake.
> Makes it nice and white.

Your wife graduated from the same school of cheesecake I did! Creamy
cheesecakes are naked if they don't have a sour cream topping and on
the off chance there's a crack (usually due to testing with a knife,
in my case) - it covers all imperfections.

--

Never trust a dog to watch your food.

On Sat, 27 Nov 2010 09:57:39 -0700, "Jean B." > wrote:

> Dan Abel wrote:
> >
> >
> > That's why my wife claims that God invented sour cream. She mixes up
> > sour cream with something (probably sugar), and then fills in all the
> > cracks. Then she puts a thin layer over the top of the cheesecake.
> > Makes it nice and white.
> >
> Hmmm. Or mascarpone. Thanks for that idea. I suppose one could
> make the cracks delectable enough that they would be sought-out
> treasures in a piece.

Don't cook your cheesecake so long that a crack turns into a crevasse.

--

Never trust a dog to watch your food.

On Sat, 27 Nov 2010 10:00:24 -0700, "Jean B." > wrote:

> Oooops. Can one GET those wafers now? Seems to me I have read
> about folks not finding them. I was alluding to Oreo wafers Maybe
> called something else--I see them in those 100-calorie packages.

Yes, you can... but they're continually finding new places to hide it.
Sometimes even the employees don't know where it is, but I've managed
to stumble across it anyway when I need some. I have a sneaking
suspicion they want it off the shelves to make room for something
else, but customers are just loyal enough that they haven't gotten
away with their dirty tactics.... yet.
>
> Current thought: an icebox cake made with gingersnaps (maybe thin
> ones) with a filling based on candied ginger.
>
> Jean B., who has somehow misplaced her huge container of Williams
> Sonoma ginger...

Do you like gingerbread? I got a recipe email yesterday that calls
for candied ginger. Here's the link
http://noblepig.com/2010/11/26/ginge...nge-icing.aspx


--

Never trust a dog to watch your food.

On Sat, 27 Nov 2010 09:52:51 -0700, "Jean B." > wrote:

> sf wrote:
> >>
> >> When I want a chocolate crumb crust for a cheesecake or some type of
> >> pie, I use Famous Chocolate Wafers. They are not particularly sweet,
> >> if fact the crust recipe on the box has additional sugar in it, but I
> >> either use none or just a bit. The wafers are harder to find these
> >> days, but I can still get them in one of our suparmarkets. They are
> >> intensely chocolatey.
> >>
> >> <http://www.amazon.com/Famous-Chocolate-Wafers-9-Ounce-
> >> Boxes/dp/B000FA38ZE>
> >
> > I like those too! I'll never understand the reasoning behind Oreo
> > cookie crusts. I don't want the filling in my chocolate crumb crust
> > and I'm not going to stand there and scrape it off every cookie - one
> > by one. Have you ever made the dessert pictured on the box. It was a
> > teenaged favorite of mine... I ate it, I didn't make it. I always
> > think about making one, but end up using the cookies for something
> > else.
> >
>
> They do (or did?) sell just the wafers without the filling. That
> being said, I am not partial to chocolate cheesecake.

Not chocolate cheesecake. Chocolate crust... goes with grasshopper
pie, for instance.

--

Never trust a dog to watch your food.

Dan Abel wrote:
>
> In article >,
> Damaeus > wrote:
>
> > Cooks.com is a disappointing website. I have found a few things there
> > that look pretty good, but there's a lot of garbage there, too. I would
> > like to find a website that actually has some chef(s) who actually review
> > the recipes for certain standards.
>
> Everybody wants something for nothing. Then when they find it, it's
> worth what they paid for it. Nothing.
>
> That's why I like cookbooks. Generally, the recipes are tested.

Epicurious.com and Allrecipes.com are pretty good sites, I use them a
lot.

On 27 Nov 2010 16:49:54 GMT, Wayne Boatwright
> wrote:

>On Sat 27 Nov 2010 09:14:52a, sf told us...
>
>> On 27 Nov 2010 06:33:42 GMT, Wayne Boatwright
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> On Fri 26 Nov 2010 01:40:32p, Goomba told us...
>>>
>>> > Jim Elbrecht wrote:
>>> >
>>> >> Flavor or texture? I remember a cheesecake that took
>>> >> crushed Oreo cookies & butter for a crust.
>>> >>
>>> >> Jim
>>> >
>>> > Sweetness actually. Sometimes people make things so
>>> > unnecessarily sweet that you lose the other flavor components
>>> > (dairy; lemon or vanilla; fruit, etc).
>>> > Oreos would pretty much ruin it for me, I imagine? It would
>>> > overtake any subtle flavors.
>>> >
>>>
>>> When I want a chocolate crumb crust for a cheesecake or some type
>>> of pie, I use Famous Chocolate Wafers. They are not particularly
>>> sweet, if fact the crust recipe on the box has additional sugar
>>> in it, but I either use none or just a bit. The wafers are
>>> harder to find these days, but I can still get them in one of our
>>> suparmarkets. They are intensely chocolatey.
>>>
>>> <http://www.amazon.com/Famous-Chocolate-Wafers-9-Ounce-
>>> Boxes/dp/B000FA38ZE>
>>
>> I like those too! I'll never understand the reasoning behind Oreo
>> cookie crusts. I don't want the filling in my chocolate crumb
>> crust and I'm not going to stand there and scrape it off every
>> cookie - one by one. Have you ever made the dessert pictured on
>> the box. It was a teenaged favorite of mine... I ate it, I didn't
>> make it. I always think about making one, but end up using the
>> cookies for something else.
>>
>
>
>
>Yes, I have made the chocolate wafer and whipped cream roll, but not
>for a long time. My mother used to make it, too.

I remember making it one time for my mother's bridge group. I was in
my teens. They praised me so much you would have thought I had made
something really complicated.

Maybe I will look for the cookies again. Maybe if I am having company
to eat it so I won't pig out.
--
Susan N.

"Moral indignation is in most cases two percent moral,
48 percent indignation, and 50 percent envy."
Vittorio De Sica, Italian movie director (1901-1974)

Wayne Boatwright wrote:
> On Sat 27 Nov 2010 09:52:51a, Jean B. told us...
>
>> sf wrote:
>>> On 27 Nov 2010 06:33:42 GMT, Wayne Boatwright
>>> > wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Fri 26 Nov 2010 01:40:32p, Goomba told us...
>>>>
>>>>> Jim Elbrecht wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Flavor or texture? I remember a cheesecake that took
>>>>>> crushed Oreo cookies& butter for a crust.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Jim
>>>>>
>>>>> Sweetness actually. Sometimes people make things so
>>>>> unnecessarily sweet that you lose the other flavor components
>>>>> (dairy; lemon or vanilla; fruit, etc).
>>>>> Oreos would pretty much ruin it for me, I imagine? It would
>>>>> overtake any subtle flavors.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> When I want a chocolate crumb crust for a cheesecake or some
>>>> type of pie, I use Famous Chocolate Wafers. They are not
>>>> particularly sweet, if fact the crust recipe on the box has
>>>> additional sugar in it, but I either use none or just a bit.
>>>> The wafers are harder to find these days, but I can still get
>>>> them in one of our suparmarkets. They are intensely chocolatey.
>>>>
>>>> <http://www.amazon.com/Famous-Chocolate-Wafers-9-Ounce-
>>>> Boxes/dp/B000FA38ZE>
>>>
>>> I like those too! I'll never understand the reasoning behind
>>> Oreo cookie crusts. I don't want the filling in my chocolate
>>> crumb crust and I'm not going to stand there and scrape it off
>>> every cookie - one by one. Have you ever made the dessert
>>> pictured on the box. It was a teenaged favorite of mine... I ate
>>> it, I didn't make it. I always think about making one, but end
>>> up using the cookies for something else.
>>>
>>
>> They do (or did?) sell just the wafers without the filling. That
>> being said, I am not partial to chocolate cheesecake.
>>
>
> I'm not fond of chocolate cheesecake, either, but I do sometimes like
> to have a chocolate crust with a vanilla flavored cheesecake.
>

yes, I can see that. I just don't like my cheese and chocolate
mixed. Actually, as I type this, I can see a cheesecake made from
a very clean-tasting (not cheesy) mascarpone. BUT there are so
many other nice cheesecake combos that I doubt I will get to this.

--
Jean B.

On Sat, 27 Nov 2010 02:18:21 -0600, Damaeus
> wrote:

>In news:rec.food.cooking, Wayne Boatwright >
>posted on 26 Nov 2010 18:39:00 GMT the following:
>
>> On Fri 26 Nov 2010 11:04:51a, Goomba told us...
>>
>> > I prefer mine crustless also.
>> > I dislike graham cracker crusts.
>>
>> There are yeast based crusts, shortbread crusts, ginger snap crumb
>> crusts, ground hazelnut or pecan crusts, etc.
>
>Ooooo, a pecan crust sounds good. In fact, a crust made from finely
>ground pecans, almonds and walnuts sounds good. Seems like it would need
>something to bind it together, like some flour. Perhaps the oils from the
>nuts are enough to replace the butter. I want to try something like that,
>but the recipes for "pecan crusts" have lots of varieties on the internet.

I just took a cheesecake out of the oven that has a pecan shortbread
crust.
The recipe for the crust is
1 1/2 cups flour
1/2 cup pecans, finely ground
1/3 cup sugar
1 egg separated
1/2 cup butter softened.

For me, it needed much more than the 1/2 cup butter to bring it all
together.


koko
--
Food is our common ground, a universal experience
James Beard

www.kokoscornerblog.com
Updated 11/21/10

Natural Watkins Spices
www.apinchofspices.com

On 11/27/2010 10:52 AM, Jean B. wrote:
> sf wrote:
>> On Thu, 25 Nov 2010 11:28:28 -0800, Dan > wrote:
>>
>>> No cakes in the past.
>>
>> I had Boston Cream cheesecake today... I have no idea if this is the
>> recipe or not, but it looked pretty much like this (and it was yummy)
>> http://hubpages.com/hub/Boston-Cream-Cheesecake
>>
>
> Hmmmm. I can imagine such a thing.... If I make cheesecake, I'll wait
> until one of my daughter's friends is back from college. She LOVES
> cheesecake. I basically like cheesecake that is low-carb.
>

Splenda and no crust?

I've made boston cream cheesecake before...don't for the life of me
remember where the recipe is. It was delish...

--
Currently reading: The Chalice by Phil Rickman and The Walking Dead vol 3

On Sat, 27 Nov 2010 17:47:10 -0500, ravenlynne
> wrote:

> I've made boston cream cheesecake before...don't for the life of me
> remember where the recipe is. It was delish...

All the recipes seem to be the same one in different formats, so
unless yours was significantly different - you can just choose one.
Not trying to insinuate It's a bad thing either.

--

Never trust a dog to watch your food.

Damaeus > wrote in
:

> In news:rec.food.cooking, Aussie >
> posted on Thu, 25 Nov 2010 03:09:06 GMT the following:
>
>> "Paco" > wrote in
>> :
>>
>> > He is concerned about damaging the non stick surface.
>>
>> Well, he should have thought of that before he made it.
>
> If my name was God, I probably would have.
>
> Damaeus



LOL!!

It's called the 7 P's.


--
Peter Lucas
Hobart
Tasmania

The act of feeding someone is an act of beauty,
whether it's a full Sunday roast or a jam sandwich,
but only when done with love.

In news:rec.food.cooking, Dan Abel > posted on Sat, 27 Nov
2010 08:54:18 -0800 the following:

> In article >,
> Damaeus > wrote:
>
> > Cooks.com is a disappointing website. I have found a few things there
> > that look pretty good, but there's a lot of garbage there, too. I would
> > like to find a website that actually has some chef(s) who actually review
> > the recipes for certain standards.
>
> Everybody wants something for nothing.

And then they whine that they don't want communism. How ironic.

Damaeus

In news:rec.food.cooking, "Pete C." > posted on Sat,
27 Nov 2010 09:31:52 -0600 the following:

> Odd, every creme brulee I've had or made has been very soft and creamy
> and the caramelized sugar crust on top crunchy. The one you describe
> sounds more like creme caramel.

After they sat in the fridge a while longer after I carmelized the sugar
on top, they did firm up some more, but they never became a custard. They
are VERY soft and creamy. But Alton Brown's recipe only called for a half
cup of sugar in a whole quart of cream. I think I'd double that, though
really, with enough carmelized sugar on top, the combined hint of
sweetness in the creme is a nice contrast to the carmelized sugar.

Damaeus