On Friday, September 6, 2019 at 6:45:33 AM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
> On Fri, 6 Sep 2019 03:15:46 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> > wrote:
>
> >On Friday, September 6, 2019 at 12:13:32 AM UTC-4, graham wrote:
> >> On 2019-09-05 9:53 p.m., Je?us wrote:
> >>
> >> >
> >> > I'm not disagreeing. I think it is appalling, and an indication of her
> >> > character.
> >> >
> >>
> >> OH! FFS! She's lily-white compared to the current POTUS!!!!!!!!
> >
> >You're not wrong, but the fact that he's a massive liar doesn't make
> >the fact that she's a smaller liar acceptable.
>
> You'll never find a lesser liar than her as a candidate. Just be
> honest and admit you won't vote for her because she's too progressive
> for you.

She certainly isn't too progressive for me. I don't agree with her on
every particular point, but I consider her quite a viable candidate.
For quite a bit of what she wants to do, she'll have to work with
Congress. Even if the Senate flips in 2020, the more lefty stuff
she claims to want probably won't pass.

Cindy Hamilton

On Fri, 6 Sep 2019 06:20:00 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> wrote:

>On Friday, September 6, 2019 at 6:45:33 AM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
>> On Fri, 6 Sep 2019 03:15:46 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
>> > wrote:
>>
>> >On Friday, September 6, 2019 at 12:13:32 AM UTC-4, graham wrote:
>> >> On 2019-09-05 9:53 p.m., Je?us wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >
>> >> > I'm not disagreeing. I think it is appalling, and an indication of her
>> >> > character.
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >> OH! FFS! She's lily-white compared to the current POTUS!!!!!!!!
>> >
>> >You're not wrong, but the fact that he's a massive liar doesn't make
>> >the fact that she's a smaller liar acceptable.
>>
>> You'll never find a lesser liar than her as a candidate. Just be
>> honest and admit you won't vote for her because she's too progressive
>> for you.
>
>She certainly isn't too progressive for me. I don't agree with her on
>every particular point, but I consider her quite a viable candidate.
>For quite a bit of what she wants to do, she'll have to work with
>Congress. Even if the Senate flips in 2020, the more lefty stuff
>she claims to want probably won't pass.
>
>Cindy Hamilton

Let's face it, any candidate other than Trump looks good!

On Friday, September 6, 2019 at 9:34:50 AM UTC-4, wrote:
> On Fri, 6 Sep 2019 06:20:00 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> > wrote:
>
> >On Friday, September 6, 2019 at 6:45:33 AM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
> >> On Fri, 6 Sep 2019 03:15:46 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> >> > wrote:
> >>
> >> >On Friday, September 6, 2019 at 12:13:32 AM UTC-4, graham wrote:
> >> >> On 2019-09-05 9:53 p.m., Je?us wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> >
> >> >> > I'm not disagreeing. I think it is appalling, and an indication of her
> >> >> > character.
> >> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >> OH! FFS! She's lily-white compared to the current POTUS!!!!!!!!
> >> >
> >> >You're not wrong, but the fact that he's a massive liar doesn't make
> >> >the fact that she's a smaller liar acceptable.
> >>
> >> You'll never find a lesser liar than her as a candidate. Just be
> >> honest and admit you won't vote for her because she's too progressive
> >> for you.
> >
> >She certainly isn't too progressive for me. I don't agree with her on
> >every particular point, but I consider her quite a viable candidate.
> >For quite a bit of what she wants to do, she'll have to work with
> >Congress. Even if the Senate flips in 2020, the more lefty stuff
> >she claims to want probably won't pass.
> >
> >Cindy Hamilton
>
> Let's face it, any candidate other than Trump looks good!

Well... Ok. I'm not too sure about Marianne Williamson. As a private
citizen, she's a relatively harmless kook. As President, I think she'd
be very nearly as bad as Trump.

Cindy Hamilton

On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 13:27:49 +1000, Bruce >
wrote:

>On Thu, 05 Sep 2019 20:25:58 -0700, Leonard Blaisdell
> wrote:
>
>>In article >, Jeßus >
>>wrote:
>>
>>> She didn't benefit financially? I'll have to do some of my own
>>> checking if that's the case. I still have a big problem with people
>>> claiming some racial background, especially when it's one that's
>>> contemporarily politically sensitive. Why even say it when she's
>>> clearly white and has no personal connection in her daily life to that
>>> culture?
>>
>>Warren was anointed as the first Native American law professor at
>>Harvard. She probably didn't get a nickel or other emoluments from her
>>exalted fraud. Ya think! Not bad for a blue eyed blonde. It makes me
>>question the critical thinking ability at Harvard.
>><https://www.realclearpolitics.com/ar...vard_must_set_
>>the_record_straight_on_elizabeth_warren_140678.h tml>
>>If you don't like the link, believe the fact. It happened.
>
>realclearpolitics.com sounds like Fox News for Dummies.


I agree about RCP. Initially, they were decent and unbiased, but they
changed over the years.

The Boston Globe did an investigative piece about Warren and her
hiring at Harvard and at other schools.

Conclusion? Ethnicity never entered into it. Title of the article is:
Ethnicity not a factor in Elizabeth Warren’s rise in law

The BG is very well known and respected for its investigative
reporting.


https://tinyurl.com/y2kcrmhl

https://www.bostonglobe.com/news/nat...O0K/story.html

On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 10:12:48 -0400, Boron Elgar
> wrote:

>On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 13:27:49 +1000, Bruce >
>wrote:
>
>>On Thu, 05 Sep 2019 20:25:58 -0700, Leonard Blaisdell
> wrote:
>>
>>>In article >, Jeßus >
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>> She didn't benefit financially? I'll have to do some of my own
>>>> checking if that's the case. I still have a big problem with people
>>>> claiming some racial background, especially when it's one that's
>>>> contemporarily politically sensitive. Why even say it when she's
>>>> clearly white and has no personal connection in her daily life to that
>>>> culture?
>>>
>>>Warren was anointed as the first Native American law professor at
>>>Harvard. She probably didn't get a nickel or other emoluments from her
>>>exalted fraud. Ya think! Not bad for a blue eyed blonde. It makes me
>>>question the critical thinking ability at Harvard.
>>><https://www.realclearpolitics.com/ar...vard_must_set_
>>>the_record_straight_on_elizabeth_warren_140678. html>
>>>If you don't like the link, believe the fact. It happened.
>>
>>realclearpolitics.com sounds like Fox News for Dummies.
>
>
>I agree about RCP. Initially, they were decent and unbiased, but they
>changed over the years.
>
>The Boston Globe did an investigative piece about Warren and her
>hiring at Harvard and at other schools.
>
>Conclusion? Ethnicity never entered into it. Title of the article is:
>Ethnicity not a factor in Elizabeth Warrens rise in law
>
>The BG is very well known and respected for its investigative
>reporting.
>
>
>https://tinyurl.com/y2kcrmhl
>
>https://www.bostonglobe.com/news/nat...O0K/story.html

A shame this won't stop people from repeating the old story.

On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 19:16:50 +0700, Jeßus > wrote:

>On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 22:09:28 +1000, Bruce >
>wrote:
>
>>On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 18:55:45 +0700, Jeßus > wrote:
>>
>>>On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 20:45:28 +1000, Bruce >
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Fri, 6 Sep 2019 03:15:46 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>You're not wrong, but the fact that he's a massive liar doesn't make
>>>>>the fact that she's a smaller liar acceptable.
>>>>
>>>>You'll never find a lesser liar than her as a candidate.
>>>
>>>Dan Quayle, Bernie Sanders and Walter Mondale have never been caught
>>>out in a lie that I' aware of.
>>
>>Right wing spin always finds something, just wait. Maybe Quayle lied
>>about potatoes.
>>
>>>Why are you so invested in this woman, is it just because certain
>>>people you dislike in this group dislike her?
>>
>>Sanders, Warren, both are a breath of fresh air in the US. It's just
>>that Sanders is so old.
>>
>>>>Just be honest and admit you won't vote for her because she's too progressive
>>>>for you.
>>>
>>>LOL. Pathetic. Really.
>>
>>This is how it works. Joan's extreme right wing, so she picks up and
>>repeats everything negative that she hears about Democrats and never
>>says a bad word about Trump. Americans tend to be very black and
>>white. And I don't mean skin colour. No nuance or greys allowed.
>>
>>Cindy's middle of the road, so she doesn't like Warren or Trump. Same
>>mechanism at work.
>
>That also describes me. I would have thought middle of the road was
>the only sensible option at this time. Both contemporary left and
>right wing ideologies have lost their way. There is nothing
>'progressive' about the left at this time, quite the opposite, in
>fact.

I'm talking about repeating spin against people you disagree with.

On Sat, 07 Sep 2019 00:34:47 +1000, Bruce >
wrote:

>On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 10:12:48 -0400, Boron Elgar
> wrote:
>
>>On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 13:27:49 +1000, Bruce >
>>wrote:
>>
>>>On Thu, 05 Sep 2019 20:25:58 -0700, Leonard Blaisdell
> wrote:
>>>

>>>>Warren was anointed as the first Native American law professor at
>>>>Harvard. She probably didn't get a nickel or other emoluments from her
>>>>exalted fraud. Ya think! Not bad for a blue eyed blonde. It makes me
>>>>question the critical thinking ability at Harvard.
>>>><https://www.realclearpolitics.com/ar...vard_must_set_
>>>>the_record_straight_on_elizabeth_warren_140678 .html>
>>>>If you don't like the link, believe the fact. It happened.
>>>
>>>realclearpolitics.com sounds like Fox News for Dummies.
>>
>>
>>I agree about RCP. Initially, they were decent and unbiased, but they
>>changed over the years.
>>
>>The Boston Globe did an investigative piece about Warren and her
>>hiring at Harvard and at other schools.
>>
>>Conclusion? Ethnicity never entered into it. Title of the article is:
>>Ethnicity not a factor in Elizabeth Warren’s rise in law
>>
>>The BG is very well known and respected for its investigative
>>reporting.
>>
>>
>>https://tinyurl.com/y2kcrmhl
>>
>>https://www.bostonglobe.com/news/nat...O0K/story.html
>
>A shame this won't stop people from repeating the old story.

A lie gets halfway around the world before truth puts on its boots

On 9/6/2019 11:38 AM, Boron Elgar wrote:
> On Sat, 07 Sep 2019 00:34:47 +1000, Bruce >
> wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 10:12:48 -0400, Boron Elgar
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 13:27:49 +1000, Bruce >
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Thu, 05 Sep 2019 20:25:58 -0700, Leonard Blaisdell
>>>> > wrote:
>>>>
>
>>>>> Warren was anointed as the first Native American law professor at
>>>>> Harvard. She probably didn't get a nickel or other emoluments from her
>>>>> exalted fraud. Ya think! Not bad for a blue eyed blonde. It makes me
>>>>> question the critical thinking ability at Harvard.
>>>>> <https://www.realclearpolitics.com/ar...vard_must_set_
>>>>> the_record_straight_on_elizabeth_warren_140678.htm l>
>>>>> If you don't like the link, believe the fact. It happened.
>>>>
>>>> realclearpolitics.com sounds like Fox News for Dummies.
>>>
>>>
>>> I agree about RCP. Initially, they were decent and unbiased, but they
>>> changed over the years.
>>>
>>> The Boston Globe did an investigative piece about Warren and her
>>> hiring at Harvard and at other schools.
>>>
>>> Conclusion? Ethnicity never entered into it. Title of the article is:
>>> Ethnicity not a factor in Elizabeth Warrens rise in law
>>>
>>> The BG is very well known and respected for its investigative
>>> reporting.
>>>
>>>
>>> https://tinyurl.com/y2kcrmhl
>>>
>>> https://www.bostonglobe.com/news/nat...O0K/story.html
>>
>> A shame this won't stop people from repeating the old story.
>
> A lie gets halfway around the world before truth puts on its boots
>

Looks like she did not necessarily do it for personal gain but to make
the faculty look more diverse than it was Ethical? That will always
be debated.

From the web site:
Was Warren on the agenda because, as her critics say, she had decided to
self-identify as a Native American woman and Harvard saw a chance to
diversify the law faculty? Did she have an unearned edge in a hugely
competitive process? Or did she get there based on her own skill, hard
work, and sacrifice?

On Fri, 6 Sep 2019 13:44:20 -0400, Ed Pawlowski > wrote:

>On 9/6/2019 11:38 AM, Boron Elgar wrote:
>> On Sat, 07 Sep 2019 00:34:47 +1000, Bruce >
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 10:12:48 -0400, Boron Elgar
>>> > wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 13:27:49 +1000, Bruce >
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, 05 Sep 2019 20:25:58 -0700, Leonard Blaisdell
>>>>> > wrote:
>>>>>
>>
>>>>>> Warren was anointed as the first Native American law professor at
>>>>>> Harvard. She probably didn't get a nickel or other emoluments from her
>>>>>> exalted fraud. Ya think! Not bad for a blue eyed blonde. It makes me
>>>>>> question the critical thinking ability at Harvard.
>>>>>> <https://www.realclearpolitics.com/ar...vard_must_set_
>>>>>> the_record_straight_on_elizabeth_warren_140678.htm l>
>>>>>> If you don't like the link, believe the fact. It happened.
>>>>>
>>>>> realclearpolitics.com sounds like Fox News for Dummies.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I agree about RCP. Initially, they were decent and unbiased, but they
>>>> changed over the years.
>>>>
>>>> The Boston Globe did an investigative piece about Warren and her
>>>> hiring at Harvard and at other schools.
>>>>
>>>> Conclusion? Ethnicity never entered into it. Title of the article is:
>>>> Ethnicity not a factor in Elizabeth Warren’s rise in law
>>>>
>>>> The BG is very well known and respected for its investigative
>>>> reporting.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> https://tinyurl.com/y2kcrmhl
>>>>
>>>> https://www.bostonglobe.com/news/nat...O0K/story.html
>>>
>>> A shame this won't stop people from repeating the old story.
>>
>> A lie gets halfway around the world before truth puts on its boots
>>
>
>Looks like she did not necessarily do it for personal gain but to make
>the faculty look more diverse than it was Ethical? That will always
>be debated.
>
> From the web site:
>Was Warren on the agenda because, as her critics say, she had decided to
>self-identify as a Native American woman and Harvard saw a chance to
>diversify the law faculty? Did she have an unearned edge in a hugely
>competitive process? Or did she get there based on her own skill, hard
>work, and sacrifice?

That was the question to be answered by the investigation.The article
shows no one ever considered ethnicity and in many/most instances did
not even know any ethnicity had been indicated, which in some cases
had not been at all..

From the article:

"In the most exhaustive review undertaken of Elizabeth Warren’s
professional history, the Globe found clear evidence, in documents and
interviews, that her claim to Native American ethnicity was never
considered by the Harvard Law faculty, which voted resoundingly to
hire her, or by those who hired her to four prior positions at other
law schools. At every step of her remarkable rise in the legal
profession, the people responsible for hiring her saw her as a white
woman.

The Globe closely reviewed the records, verified them where possible,
and conducted more than 100 interviews with her colleagues and every
person who had a role in hiring decisions about Warren who could be
reached. In sum, it is clear that Warren was viewed as a white woman
by the hiring committees at every institution that employed her."

On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 18:17:43 -0400, Boron Elgar
> wrote:

>On Fri, 6 Sep 2019 13:44:20 -0400, Ed Pawlowski > wrote:
>
>>Looks like she did not necessarily do it for personal gain but to make
>>the faculty look more diverse than it was Ethical? That will always
>>be debated.
>>
>> From the web site:
>>Was Warren on the agenda because, as her critics say, she had decided to
>>self-identify as a Native American woman and Harvard saw a chance to
>>diversify the law faculty? Did she have an unearned edge in a hugely
>>competitive process? Or did she get there based on her own skill, hard
>>work, and sacrifice?
>
>That was the question to be answered by the investigation.The article
>shows no one ever considered ethnicity and in many/most instances did
>not even know any ethnicity had been indicated, which in some cases
>had not been at all..
>
>From the article:
>
>"In the most exhaustive review undertaken of Elizabeth Warrens
>professional history, the Globe found clear evidence, in documents and
>interviews, that her claim to Native American ethnicity was never
>considered by the Harvard Law faculty, which voted resoundingly to
>hire her, or by those who hired her to four prior positions at other
>law schools. At every step of her remarkable rise in the legal
>profession, the people responsible for hiring her saw her as a white
>woman.
>
>The Globe closely reviewed the records, verified them where possible,
>and conducted more than 100 interviews with her colleagues and every
>person who had a role in hiring decisions about Warren who could be
>reached. In sum, it is clear that Warren was viewed as a white woman
>by the hiring committees at every institution that employed her."

It doesn't get clearer than that. Now, anybody who still repeats the
right-wing spin, is deliberately lying.

On Sat, 07 Sep 2019 00:37:54 +1000, Bruce >
wrote:

>On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 19:16:50 +0700, Jeßus > wrote:
>
>>On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 22:09:28 +1000, Bruce >
>>wrote:
>>
>>>On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 18:55:45 +0700, Jeßus > wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 20:45:28 +1000, Bruce >
>>>>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On Fri, 6 Sep 2019 03:15:46 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>You're not wrong, but the fact that he's a massive liar doesn't make
>>>>>>the fact that she's a smaller liar acceptable.
>>>>>
>>>>>You'll never find a lesser liar than her as a candidate.
>>>>
>>>>Dan Quayle, Bernie Sanders and Walter Mondale have never been caught
>>>>out in a lie that I' aware of.
>>>
>>>Right wing spin always finds something, just wait. Maybe Quayle lied
>>>about potatoes.
>>>
>>>>Why are you so invested in this woman, is it just because certain
>>>>people you dislike in this group dislike her?
>>>
>>>Sanders, Warren, both are a breath of fresh air in the US. It's just
>>>that Sanders is so old.
>>>
>>>>>Just be honest and admit you won't vote for her because she's too progressive
>>>>>for you.
>>>>
>>>>LOL. Pathetic. Really.
>>>
>>>This is how it works. Joan's extreme right wing, so she picks up and
>>>repeats everything negative that she hears about Democrats and never
>>>says a bad word about Trump. Americans tend to be very black and
>>>white. And I don't mean skin colour. No nuance or greys allowed.
>>>
>>>Cindy's middle of the road, so she doesn't like Warren or Trump. Same
>>>mechanism at work.
>>
>>That also describes me. I would have thought middle of the road was
>>the only sensible option at this time. Both contemporary left and
>>right wing ideologies have lost their way. There is nothing
>>'progressive' about the left at this time, quite the opposite, in
>>fact.
>
>I'm talking about repeating spin against people you disagree with.

You're saying Warren's claims of native ancestry are valid? 95 percent
of her DNA is European. That is a fact. Not spin.

If you want unbiased facts without 'spin', go he
https://www.politifact.com/truth-o-m...-native-ameri/

"There is no dispute that Warren formally notified officials at the
University of Pennsylvania and then Harvard claiming Native American
heritage after she was hired"

Yes, AFTER she was hired. But why say that at all?

No direct proof she tried to gain benefit from her claim there.
However...

From CNN (you know, they're on your 'team'):

"On Tuesday, Warren's claims took a major hit: The Washington Post
reported on a Texas bar registration card from 1986 in which, clearly
and apparently in her own hand, the Massachusetts Democrat had written
"American Indian" when asked to identify her race.

Neither Warren nor her office denied either the authenticity of the
document nor that it was the senator's signature on it. "I can't go
back," Warren told the Post in an interview Tuesday. "But I am sorry
for furthering confusion on tribal sovereignty and tribal citizenship
and harm that resulted."

Here's why this all matters so much: Prior to the Post's report of
this bar registration card, Warren had maintained some level of
plausible deniability about claiming herself as a Native American. As
the Post wrote:
"The Texas bar registration card is significant, among other reasons,
because it removes any doubt that Warren directly claimed the
identity. In other instances Warren has declined to say whether she or
an assistant filled out forms."
When the story initially broke WAY back during Warren's 2012 Senate
campaign, it was reported that Warren had been listed as a minority in
a faculty directory at Harvard Law School -- and had been part of the
school's touting of its diversity"

Right there. If you think she didn't benefit from that, you're in
denial.

"At the time, Warren and her campaign insisted that she was unaware
that her background was being touted by Harvard -- and had never asked
them to do so"

Indeed. Because she didn't need to ask - and she knew it. In my view,
she did benefit from claiming Indian heritage.

On Sat, 07 Sep 2019 06:41:05 +0700, Jeßus > wrote:

>On Sat, 07 Sep 2019 00:37:54 +1000, Bruce >
>wrote:
>
>>On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 19:16:50 +0700, Jeßus > wrote:
>>
>>>On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 22:09:28 +1000, Bruce >
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 18:55:45 +0700, Jeßus > wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 20:45:28 +1000, Bruce >
>>>>>wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>On Fri, 6 Sep 2019 03:15:46 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>You're not wrong, but the fact that he's a massive liar doesn't make
>>>>>>>the fact that she's a smaller liar acceptable.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>You'll never find a lesser liar than her as a candidate.
>>>>>
>>>>>Dan Quayle, Bernie Sanders and Walter Mondale have never been caught
>>>>>out in a lie that I' aware of.
>>>>
>>>>Right wing spin always finds something, just wait. Maybe Quayle lied
>>>>about potatoes.
>>>>
>>>>>Why are you so invested in this woman, is it just because certain
>>>>>people you dislike in this group dislike her?
>>>>
>>>>Sanders, Warren, both are a breath of fresh air in the US. It's just
>>>>that Sanders is so old.
>>>>
>>>>>>Just be honest and admit you won't vote for her because she's too progressive
>>>>>>for you.
>>>>>
>>>>>LOL. Pathetic. Really.
>>>>
>>>>This is how it works. Joan's extreme right wing, so she picks up and
>>>>repeats everything negative that she hears about Democrats and never
>>>>says a bad word about Trump. Americans tend to be very black and
>>>>white. And I don't mean skin colour. No nuance or greys allowed.
>>>>
>>>>Cindy's middle of the road, so she doesn't like Warren or Trump. Same
>>>>mechanism at work.
>>>
>>>That also describes me. I would have thought middle of the road was
>>>the only sensible option at this time. Both contemporary left and
>>>right wing ideologies have lost their way. There is nothing
>>>'progressive' about the left at this time, quite the opposite, in
>>>fact.
>>
>>I'm talking about repeating spin against people you disagree with.
>
>You're saying Warren's claims of native ancestry are valid? 95 percent
>of her DNA is European. That is a fact. Not spin.
>
>If you want unbiased facts without 'spin', go he
>https://www.politifact.com/truth-o-m...-native-ameri/
>
>"There is no dispute that Warren formally notified officials at the
>University of Pennsylvania and then Harvard claiming Native American
>heritage after she was hired"
>
>Yes, AFTER she was hired. But why say that at all?
>
>No direct proof she tried to gain benefit from her claim there.
>However...

So she had less native American in her than her family stories had led
her to believe. It was exaggerated. Big deal. Why are we even talking
about this detail? A strange mix of right-wing spin and hysterical
political correctness and you're buying it

On Sat, 07 Sep 2019 09:51:30 +1000, Bruce >
wrote:

>On Sat, 07 Sep 2019 06:41:05 +0700, Jeßus > wrote:
>
>>On Sat, 07 Sep 2019 00:37:54 +1000, Bruce >
>>wrote:
>>
>>>On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 19:16:50 +0700, Jeßus > wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 22:09:28 +1000, Bruce >
>>>>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 18:55:45 +0700, Jeßus > wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 20:45:28 +1000, Bruce >
>>>>>>wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>On Fri, 6 Sep 2019 03:15:46 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>You're not wrong, but the fact that he's a massive liar doesn't make
>>>>>>>>the fact that she's a smaller liar acceptable.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>You'll never find a lesser liar than her as a candidate.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Dan Quayle, Bernie Sanders and Walter Mondale have never been caught
>>>>>>out in a lie that I' aware of.
>>>>>
>>>>>Right wing spin always finds something, just wait. Maybe Quayle lied
>>>>>about potatoes.
>>>>>
>>>>>>Why are you so invested in this woman, is it just because certain
>>>>>>people you dislike in this group dislike her?
>>>>>
>>>>>Sanders, Warren, both are a breath of fresh air in the US. It's just
>>>>>that Sanders is so old.
>>>>>
>>>>>>>Just be honest and admit you won't vote for her because she's too progressive
>>>>>>>for you.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>LOL. Pathetic. Really.
>>>>>
>>>>>This is how it works. Joan's extreme right wing, so she picks up and
>>>>>repeats everything negative that she hears about Democrats and never
>>>>>says a bad word about Trump. Americans tend to be very black and
>>>>>white. And I don't mean skin colour. No nuance or greys allowed.
>>>>>
>>>>>Cindy's middle of the road, so she doesn't like Warren or Trump. Same
>>>>>mechanism at work.
>>>>
>>>>That also describes me. I would have thought middle of the road was
>>>>the only sensible option at this time. Both contemporary left and
>>>>right wing ideologies have lost their way. There is nothing
>>>>'progressive' about the left at this time, quite the opposite, in
>>>>fact.
>>>
>>>I'm talking about repeating spin against people you disagree with.
>>
>>You're saying Warren's claims of native ancestry are valid? 95 percent
>>of her DNA is European. That is a fact. Not spin.
>>
>>If you want unbiased facts without 'spin', go he
>>https://www.politifact.com/truth-o-m...-native-ameri/
>>
>>"There is no dispute that Warren formally notified officials at the
>>University of Pennsylvania and then Harvard claiming Native American
>>heritage after she was hired"
>>
>>Yes, AFTER she was hired. But why say that at all?
>>
>>No direct proof she tried to gain benefit from her claim there.
>>However...
>
>So she had less native American in her than her family stories had led
>her to believe. It was exaggerated. Big deal. Why are we even talking
>about this detail? A strange mix of right-wing spin and hysterical
>political correctness and you're buying it

And you wonder why I ignore you for extended periods of time. What a
childish response. What I'm 'buying' is that I've always disliked
people exploiting their racial background, whether real, imagined or
falsified. Nothing to do with what anyone else thinks.

Apparently you forget that mere days ago you agreed with me that it is
morally wrong for Australians with minimal Aboriginal background (or
none at all) to gain welfare benefits purely based on that claim.
Oops.

On Sat, 07 Sep 2019 07:09:13 +0700, Jeßus > wrote:

>On Sat, 07 Sep 2019 09:51:30 +1000, Bruce >
>wrote:
>
>>On Sat, 07 Sep 2019 06:41:05 +0700, Jeßus > wrote:
>>
>>>On Sat, 07 Sep 2019 00:37:54 +1000, Bruce >
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 19:16:50 +0700, Jeßus > wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 22:09:28 +1000, Bruce >
>>>>>wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 18:55:45 +0700, Jeßus > wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>On Fri, 06 Sep 2019 20:45:28 +1000, Bruce >
>>>>>>>wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>On Fri, 6 Sep 2019 03:15:46 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>You're not wrong, but the fact that he's a massive liar doesn't make
>>>>>>>>>the fact that she's a smaller liar acceptable.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>You'll never find a lesser liar than her as a candidate.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Dan Quayle, Bernie Sanders and Walter Mondale have never been caught
>>>>>>>out in a lie that I' aware of.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Right wing spin always finds something, just wait. Maybe Quayle lied
>>>>>>about potatoes.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Why are you so invested in this woman, is it just because certain
>>>>>>>people you dislike in this group dislike her?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Sanders, Warren, both are a breath of fresh air in the US. It's just
>>>>>>that Sanders is so old.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Just be honest and admit you won't vote for her because she's too progressive
>>>>>>>>for you.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>LOL. Pathetic. Really.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>This is how it works. Joan's extreme right wing, so she picks up and
>>>>>>repeats everything negative that she hears about Democrats and never
>>>>>>says a bad word about Trump. Americans tend to be very black and
>>>>>>white. And I don't mean skin colour. No nuance or greys allowed.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Cindy's middle of the road, so she doesn't like Warren or Trump. Same
>>>>>>mechanism at work.
>>>>>
>>>>>That also describes me. I would have thought middle of the road was
>>>>>the only sensible option at this time. Both contemporary left and
>>>>>right wing ideologies have lost their way. There is nothing
>>>>>'progressive' about the left at this time, quite the opposite, in
>>>>>fact.
>>>>
>>>>I'm talking about repeating spin against people you disagree with.
>>>
>>>You're saying Warren's claims of native ancestry are valid? 95 percent
>>>of her DNA is European. That is a fact. Not spin.
>>>
>>>If you want unbiased facts without 'spin', go he
>>>https://www.politifact.com/truth-o-m...-native-ameri/
>>>
>>>"There is no dispute that Warren formally notified officials at the
>>>University of Pennsylvania and then Harvard claiming Native American
>>>heritage after she was hired"
>>>
>>>Yes, AFTER she was hired. But why say that at all?
>>>
>>>No direct proof she tried to gain benefit from her claim there.
>>>However...
>>
>>So she had less native American in her than her family stories had led
>>her to believe. It was exaggerated. Big deal. Why are we even talking
>>about this detail? A strange mix of right-wing spin and hysterical
>>political correctness and you're buying it
>
>And you wonder why I ignore you for extended periods of time. What a
>childish response. What I'm 'buying' is that I've always disliked
>people exploiting their racial background, whether real, imagined or
>falsified. Nothing to do with what anyone else thinks.
>
>Apparently you forget that mere days ago you agreed with me that it is
>morally wrong for Australians with minimal Aboriginal background (or
>none at all) to gain welfare benefits purely based on that claim.
>Oops.

Which Warren didn't. Just a little detail.

Please learn to allow people to disagree with you.

On Wednesday, September 4, 2019 at 8:02:38 AM UTC-10, graham wrote:
> On 2019-09-04 11:54 a.m., wrote:
> > On Wednesday, September 4, 2019 at 9:48:26 AM UTC-5, graham wrote:
> >>
> >> Funny how the Repuglicans were quite happy to accept Ted Cruz as a
> >> candidate when he was born in Calgary with a US mother and Cuban father.

On Fri, 6 Sep 2019 19:09:05 -0700 (PDT), dsi1 >
wrote:


>A lot of white folks just hate it when colored folks get ahead.

LOL, the racist is back in fine form again.

On Fri, 6 Sep 2019 19:25:15 -0700 (PDT), dsi1 >
wrote:

> My guess is that if the thirty meter telescope gets built, Pele will be displeased and the shit is going to hit the fan - with prejudice.

Lono will slap that bitch senseless if she gets uppity. He's not all
peace and happiness.

"dsi1" wrote in message
...

On Friday, September 6, 2019 at 4:10:57 PM UTC-10, Bruce wrote:

>
> Welcome back. You had people worried.

I'm not really back, I'll just post updates from this rock every once in a
while.


I am sorry to hear that. Hope all is well???


The good news is that the Kilauea volcano has stopped erupting and spewing
smoke and toxic gas for the first time since 1983. My guess is that if the
thirty meter telescope gets built, Pele will be displeased and the shit is
going to hit the fan - with prejudice.

On Friday, September 6, 2019 at 10:17:03 PM UTC-10, Ophelia wrote:
> "dsi1" wrote in message
> ...
>
> On Friday, September 6, 2019 at 4:10:57 PM UTC-10, Bruce wrote:
>
> >
> > Welcome back. You had people worried.
>
> I'm not really back, I'll just post updates from this rock every once in a
> while.
>
>
> I am sorry to hear that. Hope all is well???
>
>
> The good news is that the Kilauea volcano has stopped erupting and spewing
> smoke and toxic gas for the first time since 1983. My guess is that if the
> thirty meter telescope gets built, Pele will be displeased and the shit is
> going to hit the fan - with prejudice.

As far as Kilauea goes, the volcano no longer spewing tons of toxic gases every single day means that we'll be getting clearer skies and no longer will we be under the dark oppression of these irritating gases. It's going to be the first time in my kid's lives that they live vog free. That's a good thing.

All is well over here, my time will be limited because I feel the need to stop squandering my time. I'll be helping to collect teddy bears tomorrow. It's kind of a nutty thing to do but luckily, it only happens once a year. You might think I'm joking but...

https://www.amazon.com/photos/shared...w7YGTMI-bbeJ5h

"dsi1" wrote in message
...

On Friday, September 6, 2019 at 10:17:03 PM UTC-10, Ophelia wrote:
> "dsi1" wrote in message
> ...
>
> On Friday, September 6, 2019 at 4:10:57 PM UTC-10, Bruce wrote:
>
> >
> > Welcome back. You had people worried.
>
> I'm not really back, I'll just post updates from this rock every once in a
> while.
>
>
> I am sorry to hear that. Hope all is well???
>
>
> The good news is that the Kilauea volcano has stopped erupting and spewing
> smoke and toxic gas for the first time since 1983. My guess is that if the
> thirty meter telescope gets built, Pele will be displeased and the shit is
> going to hit the fan - with prejudice.

As far as Kilauea goes, the volcano no longer spewing tons of toxic gases
every single day means that we'll be getting clearer skies and no longer
will we be under the dark oppression of these irritating gases. It's going
to be the first time in my kid's lives that they live vog free. That's a
good thing.

All is well over here, my time will be limited because I feel the need to
stop squandering my time. I'll be helping to collect teddy bears tomorrow.
It's kind of a nutty thing to do but luckily, it only happens once a year.
You might think I'm joking but...

https://www.amazon.com/photos/shared...w7YGTMI-bbeJ5h

===

LOL Brilliant)) Good for you! Anyway stay well and and don't be a
stranger)

On Fri, 6 Sep 2019 19:25:15 -0700 (PDT), dsi1 >
wrote:


>I'm not really back, I'll just post updates from this rock every once in a while.
>
>The good news is that the Kilauea volcano has stopped erupting and spewing smoke and toxic gas for the first time since 1983. My guess is that if the thirty meter telescope gets built, Pele will be displeased and the shit is going to hit the fan - with prejudice.
>

Um...you might want to read up on it a bit before declaring complete
volcanic victory.

https://volcanoes.usgs.gov/volcanoes...ea/status.html

dsi1 wrote:
> All is well over here, my time will be limited because I feel
> the need to stop squandering my time. I'll be helping to
> collect teddy bears tomorrow. It's kind of a nutty thing to
> do but luckily, it only happens once a year.
> You might think I'm joking but...
>
> https://www.amazon.com/photos/shared...w7YGTMI-bbeJ5h

I'm almost afraid to ask but I will. Just WHY do y'all
collect teddy bears once a year? Is this a stockpile for
future death shrines? That seems to be the trending
use for them these days. This is Stephen King stuff, imo.

Maybe I'm wrong. Donating them to poor children at
Christmas time for presents would be so much better.

Remind me to invest my savings in teddy bear manufacturers,
florists, candle makers and balloon ppl.

"Gary" wrote in message ...

dsi1 wrote:
> All is well over here, my time will be limited because I feel
> the need to stop squandering my time. I'll be helping to
> collect teddy bears tomorrow. It's kind of a nutty thing to
> do but luckily, it only happens once a year.
> You might think I'm joking but...
>
> https://www.amazon.com/photos/shared...w7YGTMI-bbeJ5h

I'm almost afraid to ask but I will. Just WHY do y'all
collect teddy bears once a year? Is this a stockpile for
future death shrines? That seems to be the trending
use for them these days. This is Stephen King stuff, imo.

Maybe I'm wrong. Donating them to poor children at
Christmas time for presents would be so much better.

Remind me to invest my savings in teddy bear manufacturers,
florists, candle makers and balloon ppl.

====

I assumed it was for charity?

On Saturday, September 7, 2019 at 3:26:02 AM UTC-10, Boron Elgar wrote:
> On Fri, 6 Sep 2019 19:25:15 -0700 (PDT), dsi1 >
> wrote:
>
>
> >I'm not really back, I'll just post updates from this rock every once in a while.
> >
> >The good news is that the Kilauea volcano has stopped erupting and spewing smoke and toxic gas for the first time since 1983. My guess is that if the thirty meter telescope gets built, Pele will be displeased and the shit is going to hit the fan - with prejudice.
> >
>
> Um...you might want to read up on it a bit before declaring complete
> volcanic victory.
>
> https://volcanoes.usgs.gov/volcanoes...ea/status.html

If you're implying that I'm assuming/predicting what the gods will do, you got that wrong. My guess that the mountain will erupt again soon. My point was that Kilauea won't be spewing tons of toxic gas into the clean Hawaiian air and that we should enjoy it while we can. As I recall, this group has no concept of enjoying/appreciating this life - they live in a dark gloom.

On Saturday, September 7, 2019 at 3:43:26 AM UTC-10, Gary wrote:
> dsi1 wrote:
> > All is well over here, my time will be limited because I feel
> > the need to stop squandering my time. I'll be helping to
> > collect teddy bears tomorrow. It's kind of a nutty thing to
> > do but luckily, it only happens once a year.
> > You might think I'm joking but...
> >
> > https://www.amazon.com/photos/shared...w7YGTMI-bbeJ5h
>
> I'm almost afraid to ask but I will. Just WHY do y'all
> collect teddy bears once a year? Is this a stockpile for
> future death shrines? That seems to be the trending
> use for them these days. This is Stephen King stuff, imo.
>
> Maybe I'm wrong. Donating them to poor children at
> Christmas time for presents would be so much better.
>
> Remind me to invest my savings in teddy bear manufacturers,
> florists, candle makers and balloon ppl.

The bears get passed out to the kids of people, mostly women who seek refuge from an abusive spouse. Does it help? I cannot say. I just collect/tally the bears as they come in.

"dsi1" wrote in message
...

On Saturday, September 7, 2019 at 3:43:26 AM UTC-10, Gary wrote:
> dsi1 wrote:
> > All is well over here, my time will be limited because I feel
> > the need to stop squandering my time. I'll be helping to
> > collect teddy bears tomorrow. It's kind of a nutty thing to
> > do but luckily, it only happens once a year.
> > You might think I'm joking but...
> >
> > https://www.amazon.com/photos/shared...w7YGTMI-bbeJ5h
>
> I'm almost afraid to ask but I will. Just WHY do y'all
> collect teddy bears once a year? Is this a stockpile for
> future death shrines? That seems to be the trending
> use for them these days. This is Stephen King stuff, imo.
>
> Maybe I'm wrong. Donating them to poor children at
> Christmas time for presents would be so much better.
>
> Remind me to invest my savings in teddy bear manufacturers,
> florists, candle makers and balloon ppl.

The bears get passed out to the kids of people, mostly women who seek refuge
from an abusive spouse. Does it help? I cannot say. I just collect/tally the
bears as they come in.

===

If they are going to a good cause, then that is worthwhile !!

On Sat, 7 Sep 2019 11:25:51 -0700 (PDT), dsi1 >
wrote:

>On Saturday, September 7, 2019 at 3:26:02 AM UTC-10, Boron Elgar wrote:
>> On Fri, 6 Sep 2019 19:25:15 -0700 (PDT), dsi1 >
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>> >I'm not really back, I'll just post updates from this rock every once in a while.
>> >
>> >The good news is that the Kilauea volcano has stopped erupting and spewing smoke and toxic gas for the first time since 1983. My guess is that if the thirty meter telescope gets built, Pele will be displeased and the shit is going to hit the fan - with prejudice.
>> >
>>
>> Um...you might want to read up on it a bit before declaring complete
>> volcanic victory.
>>
>> https://volcanoes.usgs.gov/volcanoes...ea/status.html
>
>If you're implying that I'm assuming/predicting what the gods will do, you got that wrong. My guess that the mountain will erupt again soon. My point was that Kilauea won't be spewing tons of toxic gas into the clean Hawaiian air and that we should enjoy it while we can. As I recall, this group has no concept of enjoying/appreciating this life - they live in a dark gloom.

You implied there was no toxic gas for the first time in 26 years. I
am just telling you that thing is still putting out gasses, just not
with the volatility I saw while I stood on the crater edge last year
just before and after the floor dropped or what happened down the
flank into Leilani Estates.

And there are new fumaroles in Halema'uma'u.

What some consider the world's most active volcano is quieter than
last year, but never completely quiet.

And then there is this....a first.

https://gizmodo.com/hawaii-s-kilauea...gan-1837929131

In article >,
dsi1 > wrote:

> As I recall, this group has no
> concept of enjoying/appreciating this life - they live in a dark gloom.

Nah. For instance, I miss when you don't post. We need a Hawaiian
perspective. From you. And we don't live in a dark gloom. You know
that. I disagree politically with ninety percent of the people here. I
love this dysfunctional place with opinions, recipes and methods from
everywhere. It's always held magic for me.
I even get good cooking advice and new ideas from here. Sometimes

leo

On Sat, 07 Sep 2019 20:55:20 -0700, Leonard Blaisdell
> wrote:

>In article >,
>dsi1 > wrote:
>
>> As I recall, this group has no
>> concept of enjoying/appreciating this life - they live in a dark gloom.
>
>Nah. For instance, I miss when you don't post. We need a Hawaiian
>perspective. From you. And we don't live in a dark gloom. You know
>that. I disagree politically with ninety percent of the people here.

So do I. Does that mean we agree about everything?

In article >, Bruce
> wrote:

> So do I. Does that mean we agree about everything?

s/everything/something/g. Nuff sed.

leo

On Sat, 07 Sep 2019 23:53:05 -0700, Leonard Blaisdell
> wrote:

>In article >, Bruce
> wrote:
>
>> So do I. Does that mean we agree about everything?
>
>s/everything/something/g. Nuff sed.

¿Que?

In article >, Bruce
> wrote:

> On Sat, 07 Sep 2019 23:53:05 -0700, Leonard Blaisdell

> >s/everything/something/g. Nuff sed.
>
> ¿Que?

My remark
contains a clue
Which may be something
fun to do

I'm bored. My wife and SIL are gone to a class reunion. Check out this
picture of sweet corn muffins that I made today. There's not much color
to them.
<https://www.dropbox.com/s/9qf3djfdi4tlezy/corn%20muffins.jpg?dl=0>

leo

On Sun, 08 Sep 2019 00:32:12 -0700, Leonard Blaisdell
> wrote:

>In article >, Bruce
> wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 07 Sep 2019 23:53:05 -0700, Leonard Blaisdell
>
>> >s/everything/something/g. Nuff sed.
>>
>> ¿Que?
>
>My remark
>contains a clue
>Which may be something
>fun to do
>
>I'm bored. My wife and SIL are gone to a class reunion. Check out this
>picture of sweet corn muffins that I made today. There's not much color
>to them.
><https://www.dropbox.com/s/9qf3djfdi4tlezy/corn%20muffins.jpg?dl=0>

They look good enough to eat!

On Sunday, September 8, 2019 at 2:59:35 AM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
> On Sat, 07 Sep 2019 23:53:05 -0700, Leonard Blaisdell
> > wrote:
>
> >In article >, Bruce
> > wrote:
> >
> >> So do I. Does that mean we agree about everything?
> >
> >s/everything/something/g. Nuff sed.
>
> ¿Que?

Unix stuff. Look for every instance of "everything" and replace it with
"something".

Cindy Hamilton

On Sun, 8 Sep 2019 03:35:19 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> wrote:

>On Sunday, September 8, 2019 at 2:59:35 AM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
>> On Sat, 07 Sep 2019 23:53:05 -0700, Leonard Blaisdell
>> > wrote:
>>
>> >In article >, Bruce
>> > wrote:
>> >
>> >> So do I. Does that mean we agree about everything?
>> >
>> >s/everything/something/g. Nuff sed.
>>
>> ¿Que?
>
>Unix stuff. Look for every instance of "everything" and replace it with
>"something".

Oh thanks, that's before my time.

dsi1 wrote:
>
> > > I'll be helping to
> > > collect teddy bears tomorrow. It's kind of a nutty thing to
> > > do but luckily, it only happens once a year.
> > > You might think I'm joking but...
> > >
> > > https://www.amazon.com/photos/shared...w7YGTMI-bbeJ5h
>
> The bears get passed out to the kids of people, mostly women who seek refuge from an abusive spouse. Does it help? I cannot say. I just collect/tally the bears as they come in.

I'm sure it helps. That's a nice use of teddy bears for a change.
Good job!

On Sun, 08 Sep 2019 20:39:54 +1000, Bruce >
wrote:

>On Sun, 8 Sep 2019 03:35:19 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> wrote:
>
>>On Sunday, September 8, 2019 at 2:59:35 AM UTC-4, Bruce wrote:
>>> On Sat, 07 Sep 2019 23:53:05 -0700, Leonard Blaisdell
>>> > wrote:
>>>
>>> >In article >, Bruce
>>> > wrote:
>>> >
>>> >> So do I. Does that mean we agree about everything?
>>> >
>>> >s/everything/something/g. Nuff sed.
>>>
>>> ¿Que?
>>
>>Unix stuff. Look for every instance of "everything" and replace it with
>>"something".
>
>Oh thanks, that's before my time.

You're not born yet?

On 9/8/2019 3:32 AM, Leonard Blaisdell wrote:
> In article >, Bruce
> > wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 07 Sep 2019 23:53:05 -0700, Leonard Blaisdell
>
>>> s/everything/something/g. Nuff sed.
>>
>> ¿Que?
>
> My remark
> contains a clue
> Which may be something
> fun to do
>
> I'm bored. My wife and SIL are gone to a class reunion. Check out this
> picture of sweet corn muffins that I made today. There's not much color
> to them.
> <https://www.dropbox.com/s/9qf3djfdi4tlezy/corn%20muffins.jpg?dl=0>
>
> leo
>

Look good, for color you can just brush the top with ketchup.

On 2019-09-08 3:32 a.m., Leonard Blaisdell wrote:
> In article >, Bruce
> > wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 07 Sep 2019 23:53:05 -0700, Leonard Blaisdell
>
>>> s/everything/something/g. Nuff sed.
>>
>> ¿Que?
>
> My remark
> contains a clue
> Which may be something
> fun to do
>
> I'm bored. My wife and SIL are gone to a class reunion. Check out this
> picture of sweet corn muffins that I made today. There's not much color
> to them.
> <https://www.dropbox.com/s/9qf3djfdi4tlezy/corn%20muffins.jpg?dl=0>
>


I have not had cornmeal muffins. Do you always use the cupcake liners?
We make muffins frequently and just grease the pans. They come out
without problems.

Dave Smith wrote:
>
> I have not had cornmeal muffins. Do you always use the cupcake liners?
> We make muffins frequently and just grease the pans. They come out
> without problems.

I always make them in a shallow pyrex baking dish as a corn cake.
Once done and still hot, brush top with butter, then cut into
squares to eat.