"Wayne Boatwright" > wrote in message
3.184...
> On Mon 21 Apr 2008 02:39:07p, Paul M. Cook told us...
>
>>
>> "Wayne Boatwright" > wrote in message
>> 3.184...
>>> On Mon 21 Apr 2008 09:53:45a, Paul M. Cook told us...
>>>
>>>>
>>>> "blake murphy" > wrote in message
>>>> ...
>>>>> On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 02:18:41 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Like I said, polls show most people don't care. Who ever would have
>>>>>>thought that your credit rating would affect your car insurance? It
>>>>>>does. Whoever
>>>>>>would have thought that your credit rating is used to deny medical
>>>>>>insurance? It is. Whoever would have thought banks would raise your
>>>>>>CC rates because you have no life insurance? They do. And on and on
>>>>>>and on. How do they do it? They all share their databases.
>>>>>
>>>>> again, i'd like to see a cite for the groceries sharing this
>>>>> information.
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Once you see how data mining works, you can't ignore what they can do
>>>>>>with this information. Take stores they already have electronic POS
>>>>>>systems and they know what sells and what does not and can tell you
>>>>>>to the unit how many cans of tomato soup they sold yesterday. So
>>>>>>why do they want your name attached to that purchase? Why do they
>>>>>>want a DL number? Why do they want a SSN? What you have to think
>>>>>>about is not what they will do with it today, but tomorrow.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> again, i say paranoia.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Paranoia, paranoia, WRACK WRACK - poly want a cracker - poly is a
>>>> cracker - WRACK, tweet.
>>>>
>>>> Have a happy and safe like, little sheep.
>>
>>
>> Wayne, you can only assume emotional states on a newsgroup. If I am
>> paranoid because I guard my personal information then Blake can be a
>> parrot.
>>
>> Paul
>>
>>
>
> It's true, one can only assume. I don't think you're parannoid, but I do
> think the topic has gone far beyond necessity.
>
> In my area one can obtain a card at any of the stores without giving any
> personal information. I give my phone number (actually, it is now an
> inactive phone number) just so that I can key it into the terminal if I
> forget the card. No one requires SSN, address, or other peronal data.

They do not require because they may not legally but they do ask for it. I
am a privacy nut after I did the data mining field for a while.

Paul

"blake murphy" > wrote in message
...
> On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 02:00:49 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
> wrote:
>
>>
>>"George Shirley" > wrote in message
...
>
>>> Well Blake, Loosyanna requires picture ID when you show up at the polls
>>> and your voter registration says which polling place you're entitled to
>>> vote at. Of course being a state with the finest politicians money can
>>> buy
>>> we have to do that to ensure the dead aren't still voting.
>>
>>
>>Here is an account of Georgia's experiment.
>>
>>http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...091901382.html
>>
>>Paul
>>
>
> note especially this part from the above cite:
>
> Perdue and other proponents of the law said it is needed to curtail
> fraud. They cited an Atlanta Journal-Constitution article that said
> 5,000 dead people were listed as having voted in the eight elections
> preceding 2000.
>
> But the fraud happened primarily in absentee balloting, Barnes said.
> Under the new law, absentee voters are not required to show
> identification.
>
> "This is the most sinister scheme I've ever seen," Barnes said, "and
> it's going on nationwide."
>
> *
>
> the scheme is on the part of republicans to dissuade the poor and
> elderly and other shiftless folks who might vote democratic from
> voting. it really is as simple as that. ask karl rove.


Precisely. Don't forget elctronic voting. Georgia is famous from the 2002
election where more people voted in some counties than lived in those
counties. It wasa chalked up to a "math error" in the compuerized voting
systems - the hilarious excuse was "humidity." All the "math errors" handed
wins to republicans. So far, no machines have so erred on the side of the
left.

Paul

"Dan Abel" > wrote in message
...
> In article >,
> Becca > wrote:
>
>> Goomba38 wrote:
>
>> > I think it is stretch to imagine that someone doesn't have ONE piece
>> > of
>> > picture ID.
>
>> In Louisiana, if you do not have a photo ID, you can show them a copy of
>> a bill that has your name on it, and you have to sign a legal affidavit.
>> Who carries their bills around with them?
>
> ObWeirdIDStory: I went to visit my brother last month. He doesn't live
> far from Ontario, California, a little east of LA.
>
> The folks in Ontario wanted to help the homeless, so they found some
> unused property close to the airport for the homeless to live. Some
> agencies agreed to bring food there. There were portable bathrooms, and
> safe drinking water. Best of all, the homeless didn't have to worry
> about getting rousted in the middle of the night. They expected and
> planned for fifty people, living in tents. Some of the homeless managed
> to scrounge up an old RV (sometimes with no engine) or battered trailer,
> which they parked on the adjacent streets, illegally.
>
> It didn't take too long before there were 300 people living there. The
> neighbors complained. Something had to be done. Well, the camp was
> intended for the homeless of Ontario, so the city decreed that only
> Ontario residents could live there. I about fell over laughing! What
> are they going to do, ask for IDs? "Hey, do you have a utility bill in
> your name showing you live in Ontario?" "Hell, no. Do you think I'd be
> living in a homeless camp if I did?" "Do you live in Ontario?" "Yeah,
> that tent over there." "No, before then" "Yeah, I lived under the
> bridge on XYZ street" "Do you have any written proof of that?"
>
> I was there a couple of weeks and followed the story in the newspapers.
> I don't know what happened since (they towed some of the vehicles, over
> loud protests).


When was that? I live 8 miles from Ontario, CA. All of the property around
the airport is primo business zoned land. When did they have a tent city
there?

Paul

In article <nq9Pj.3002$pn4.2936@trnddc03>,
"Paul M. Cook" > wrote:

> "Dan Abel" > wrote in message
> ...

> > ObWeirdIDStory: I went to visit my brother last month. He doesn't live
> > far from Ontario, California, a little east of LA.
> >
> > The folks in Ontario wanted to help the homeless, so they found some
> > unused property close to the airport for the homeless to live. Some
> > agencies agreed to bring food there. There were portable bathrooms, and
> > safe drinking water. Best of all, the homeless didn't have to worry
> > about getting rousted in the middle of the night. They expected and
> > planned for fifty people, living in tents. Some of the homeless managed
> > to scrounge up an old RV (sometimes with no engine) or battered trailer,
> > which they parked on the adjacent streets, illegally.
> >
> > It didn't take too long before there were 300 people living there. The
> > neighbors complained. Something had to be done. Well, the camp was
> > intended for the homeless of Ontario, so the city decreed that only
> > Ontario residents could live there. I about fell over laughing! What
> > are they going to do, ask for IDs? "Hey, do you have a utility bill in
> > your name showing you live in Ontario?" "Hell, no. Do you think I'd be
> > living in a homeless camp if I did?" "Do you live in Ontario?" "Yeah,
> > that tent over there." "No, before then" "Yeah, I lived under the
> > bridge on XYZ street" "Do you have any written proof of that?"
> >
> > I was there a couple of weeks and followed the story in the newspapers.
> > I don't know what happened since (they towed some of the vehicles, over
> > loud protests).
>
>
> When was that? I live 8 miles from Ontario, CA. All of the property around
> the airport is primo business zoned land. When did they have a tent city
> there?

Last month. The property is zoned residential, but is vacant lots. It
is bounded on one side by the end of the airport runway and on another
side by a main train track.

Here is where it's at:

http://atlas.mapquest.com/maps/map.a...tohistory=&add
ress=%5b1000%2d1099%5d%20E%20Jefferson%20St&city=O ntario&state=CA&zipcode
=91761&country=US&location=IcSBMiHs7lg57K8Gz%2fe8I YYPbvy7MXuNckshqLyybFBf
3E05T7vIe5eUOSJp0aX5qGlmcd5ZRcdor%2bSxpDRUubPH4vwI 0bYt8e0xVODtXR%2fN7N44W
4ctBRl6mL7TDQUlaQhGRuVh9hmwcucRrUK1Tsz2UQJ9uprHsNR SQRMIGgk%3d&ambiguity=1

Here's an update from March 24, 2008:

http://www.scpr.org/news/stories/200...ictions_0.html

--
Dan Abel
Petaluma, California USA

Dan Abel wrote:
> In article >,
> "Giusi" > wrote:
>
>
>> I had a friend who was 100% blind who kept her license current
>> before the advent of photo licenses for just that reason. Now you
>> have to let them see you every few years, but then as long as you
>> paid, they sent new ones.
>
> Don't know about MD or your friend, but here in California, to renew
> your driver's license by mail, you have to sign a form, which states
> that you are certifying by your signature that you have had no visual
> impairments since your vision was last screened by them.
>
I've renewed my TN drivers license via the Internet the last two times.
They haven't actually *seen* me at the DMV for quite some time; they accept
an "electronic signature". They also extended the length of the license
from 4 to 5 years. I'm not sure at what point they'll figure out hmmm,
maybe she doesn't look the same as she did in 1996

Jill

On Tue 22 Apr 2008 06:30:14a, jmcquown told us...

> Dan Abel wrote:
>> In article >,
>> "Giusi" > wrote:
>>
>>
>>> I had a friend who was 100% blind who kept her license current
>>> before the advent of photo licenses for just that reason. Now you
>>> have to let them see you every few years, but then as long as you
>>> paid, they sent new ones.
>>
>> Don't know about MD or your friend, but here in California, to renew
>> your driver's license by mail, you have to sign a form, which states
>> that you are certifying by your signature that you have had no visual
>> impairments since your vision was last screened by them.
>>
> I've renewed my TN drivers license via the Internet the last two times.
> They haven't actually *seen* me at the DMV for quite some time; they
> accept an "electronic signature". They also extended the length of the
> license from 4 to 5 years. I'm not sure at what point they'll figure
> out hmmm, maybe she doesn't look the same as she did in 1996
>
> Jill
>
>

In Arizona licenses are good for 10 years, at which time one must go to the
license bureau for another vision exam and new photo.

--
Wayne Boatwright
-------------------------------------------
Tuesday, 04(IV)/22(XXII)/08(MMVIII)
-------------------------------------------
Today is: Earth Day
Countdown till Memorial Day
4wks 5dys 17hrs 20mins
-------------------------------------------
We learn from history that we do not
learn anything from history.
-------------------------------------------

kilikini wrote:
> Goomba38 wrote:
>>
>> I think more a problem is all the "dead" (yes!) people that seem to
>> be casting votes....
>
> Oh, my husband's vote might take then! LOL. He's considered dead by
> the three major credit companies in the U.S. The IRS doesn't agree,
> though. :~) Do you have any idea how many letters and phone calls
> I've made to try to "revive" him? It doesn't work! Even when I
> call, the customer service person laughs and says they'll fix it, but
> it never happens. Allan will go and apply for a checking account and
> get denied, of course, and we get a letter back saying, "this person
> is deceased". He's apparently been deceased since 2001! I kind of
> find it funny, but it causes some headaches. We have no idea how it
> happened, either.
> Soooooo, everything has to be in my name or his mother's name, 'cause
> he can't get squat.
>
> kili
>
I'm encountering the opposite problem since my father died. It seems it
will take an act of Congress to get his name off things. We've provided
certified death certificates and been assured only her name remains but
apparently not based on the things he gets in the mail from the bank, their
insurance company, etc.

Jill

Wayne Boatwright wrote:
> On Mon 21 Apr 2008 02:39:07p, Paul M. Cook told us...
>
>>
>> "Wayne Boatwright" > wrote in message
>> 3.184...
>>> On Mon 21 Apr 2008 09:53:45a, Paul M. Cook told us...
>>>
>>>>
>>>> "blake murphy" > wrote in message
>>>> ...
>>>>> On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 02:18:41 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> They do. And on and on and on. How do they do it? They all
>>>>>> share their databases.
>>>>>
>>>>> again, i'd like to see a cite for the groceries sharing this
>>>>> information.
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Once you see how data mining works, you can't ignore what they
>>>>>> can do with this information. Take stores they already have
>>>>>> electronic POS systems and they know what sells and what does
>>>>>> not and can tell you to the unit how many cans of tomato soup
>>>>>> they sold yesterday. So why do they want your name attached to
>>>>>> that purchase? Why do they want a DL number? Why do they want
>>>>>> a SSN? What you have to think about is not what they will do
>>>>>> with it today, but tomorrow.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> again, i say paranoia.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Paranoia, paranoia, WRACK WRACK - poly want a cracker - poly is a
>>>> cracker - WRACK, tweet.
>>>>
>>>> Have a happy and safe like, little sheep.
>>
>>
>> Wayne, you can only assume emotional states on a newsgroup. If I am
>> paranoid because I guard my personal information then Blake can be a
>> parrot.
>>
>
> It's true, one can only assume. I don't think you're parannoid, but
> I do think the topic has gone far beyond necessity.
>
> In my area one can obtain a card at any of the stores without giving
> any personal information. I give my phone number (actually, it is
> now an inactive phone number) just so that I can key it into the
> terminal if I forget the card. No one requires SSN, address, or
> other peronal data.
>
On one trip John and I took there was a VCR in the hotel room. So we
thought okay, we'll go to the Blockbuster, get a card and rent a couple of
movies. We explained to the clerk we were only in town for a week. The
application asks for your SSN. John told the clerk no way was he giving
them that information. They don't need it, they aren't going to be paying
him Social Security benefits. The kid didn't know what to say. He figured
it's on the app therefore they must need it. The kid was also instructed to
call the person's house to verify the address (or something). He wasn't
asked to but John showed him photo ID. The kid still insisted he had to
call. I have no idea who he thought would answer the phone; maybe his cat?
LOL

Jill

On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 11:17:14 -0500, Becca >
wrote:

>Goomba38 wrote:
>> Paul M. Cook wrote:
>>
>>>> A state issued ID with picture costs about $4.00 and is readily
>>>> available.
>>>>
>>>
>>> That 4.00 is the equivalent of a poll tax. Poll taxes are explicitly
>>> denied in the Constitution. That is one basis on which these things
>>> have been denied. Your state has simply not yet faced a legal
>>> challenge to its practice.
>>>
>>> Paul
>>
>> I think it is stretch to imagine that someone doesn't have ONE piece of
>> picture ID. And calling it a poll tax sounds like a cheap excuse to
>> excuse voter fraud, IMO.
>
>In Louisiana, if you do not have a photo ID, you can show them a copy of
>a bill that has your name on it, and you have to sign a legal affidavit.
>Who carries their bills around with them?
>
>Becca

people who want to vote but don't have a photo i.d., i guess.

your pal,
blake

On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 15:05:49 -0400, Goomba38 >
wrote:

>Becca wrote:
>
>> In Louisiana, if you do not have a photo ID, you can show them a copy of
>> a bill that has your name on it, and you have to sign a legal affidavit.
>> Who carries their bills around with them?
>>
>> Becca
>
>I imagine if you're specifically going out to vote that day, and you're
>aware of the requirements (from public notices or experience) you'll
>think to take one along with you?
>I don't think a bill with your name and address on it is very
>trustworthy though? My dead mother-in-law still gets plenty of them in
>the mail.

by god, let her vote then. do you know anyone desiccated enough to
pull off the impersonation?

your pal,
blake

On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 16:51:52 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
wrote:

>
>"blake murphy" > wrote in message
.. .
>> On Sun, 20 Apr 2008 16:15:41 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>"blake murphy" > wrote in message
...
>>>> On Sat, 19 Apr 2008 21:48:07 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>"Wayne Boatwright" > wrote in message
>>>>>news:Xns9A85635CA5957wayneboatwrightatari@69. 28.173.184...
>>>>>> On Sat 19 Apr 2008 09:28:11a, Ms P told us...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> They sent me a dry cat food sample today. It's close to the same
>>>>>>> kind
>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>> give her to keep the hairballs at bay.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Ms P
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I use my real address for all my store cards, as well as my internet
>>>>>> address.
>>>>>> Phone number is optional, and I don't give it. It's definitely had
>>>>>> its
>>>>>> benefits from time to time.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>I can assure you they keep those records. I know, I helped them do it.
>>>>>Now
>>>>>what they will do with that info I do not know but they most definitely
>>>>>keep
>>>>>a history of everything you buy and when and where too. It's hugely
>>>>>valuable information for advertisers who would pay a lot of money for
>>>>>it.
>>>>>
>>>>>I keep all my cards anonymous. You simply do not have to fill out the
>>>>>form
>>>>>to get the card. Just tell them you won't but you want the card anyway.
>>>>>They have to provide it.
>>>>>
>>>>>I've seen first hand the info they keep on people and it is pretty scary
>>>>>what they know about you.
>>>>>
>>>>>Paul
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> yes. god forbid they know i buy store-brand toilet paper.
>>>
>>>
>>>What if you smoked and your insurance company wanted to know if you lied
>>>on
>>>your application? What if you had diabetes and you bought a lot of candy?
>>>
>>>Regardless, if advertisers want demographic data on me, and they are
>>>willing
>>>to pay a fortune to a store to get it, they can just bloody well pay me.
>>>
>>>But your response is quite typical. Studies show most people do not value
>>>personal privacy. It is one reason nobody is stewing much about heir
>>>phones
>>>being tapped for the last 8 years.
>>>
>>>Paul
>>>
>>
>> if you can show me a cite for grocery stores sharing their information
>> with insurance companies, i would be very interested. otherwise, i'll
>> put it down to general paranoia.
>
>It's all just that, of course. What kind of kook would ever assume any
>personal info has ever been misused? Not like anyone today has ever had
>their privacy invaded by a bank because of something to do with their car
>insurance. It is the stuff of fools, not to be tolerated by those of your
>stature.
>
>Wipe your ass with whatever you want, big boy. I am sure when they drag
>mandatory implanted RFID chips out again you'll be first in line. So long
>as you feel safe.
>
>Paul
>

thanks for the insults, small fry, but you're changing the subject.
purchase records are not r.f.i.d. chips. jesus.

your pal,
blake

On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 21:42:54 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
wrote:

>
>"Dan Abel" > wrote in message
...
>> In article <IC3Pj.1577$Ks1.485@trnddc01>,
>> "Paul M. Cook" > wrote:
>>
>>
>>> personal info has ever been misused? Not like anyone today has ever had
>>> their privacy invaded by a bank because of something to do with their car
>>> insurance.
>>
>> If you financed your car through that bank, they own it. Just try to
>> find the title to the car. The bank has it. If you look at your
>> registration paper, it says you are the registered owner, and the spot
>> for the legal owner has the name of the bank.
>>
>And if you miss a payment your medical insurance should not be affected.
>However, it does. And that is my point. That being we are just losing all
>of our privacy so why make it so easy for them to know more about you than
>your own mother?
>
>> It's their car, they have a right to make sure there is insurance on it
>> (your sales contract must certainly have had a provision that requires
>> you to carry insurance, I've never seen one without it).
>
>Yes but that is not the point I am making.
>
>Paul
>

o.k., what is the point you're making? all you been doing is making
scare talk that has nothing to do with grocery store sales records.

your pal,
blake

On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 16:51:52 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
wrote:

>
>"blake murphy" > wrote in message
.. .
>> On Sun, 20 Apr 2008 16:15:41 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>"blake murphy" > wrote in message
...
>>>> On Sat, 19 Apr 2008 21:48:07 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>I've seen first hand the info they keep on people and it is pretty scary
>>>>>what they know about you.
>>>>>
>>>>>Paul
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> yes. god forbid they know i buy store-brand toilet paper.
>>>
>>>
>>>What if you smoked and your insurance company wanted to know if you lied
>>>on
>>>your application? What if you had diabetes and you bought a lot of candy?
>>>
>>>Regardless, if advertisers want demographic data on me, and they are
>>>willing
>>>to pay a fortune to a store to get it, they can just bloody well pay me.
>>>
>>>But your response is quite typical. Studies show most people do not value
>>>personal privacy. It is one reason nobody is stewing much about heir
>>>phones
>>>being tapped for the last 8 years.
>>>
>>>Paul
>>>
>>
>> if you can show me a cite for grocery stores sharing their information
>> with insurance companies, i would be very interested. otherwise, i'll
>> put it down to general paranoia.
>
>It's all just that, of course. What kind of kook would ever assume any
>personal info has ever been misused? Not like anyone today has ever had
>their privacy invaded by a bank because of something to do with their car
>insurance. It is the stuff of fools, not to be tolerated by those of your
>stature.
>
>Wipe your ass with whatever you want, big boy. I am sure when they drag
>mandatory implanted RFID chips out again you'll be first in line. So long
>as you feel safe.
>
>Paul
>

in other words, you can't show me a cite where grocery stores are
sharing their information with insurance companies or anyone else.

your pal,
blake

On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 21:46:46 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
wrote:

>
>"blake murphy" > wrote in message
>news
>> On Sun, 20 Apr 2008 19:11:11 -0700, Dan Abel > wrote:
>>
>>>In article <N_JOj.1599$pn4.1084@trnddc03>,
>>> "Paul M. Cook" > wrote:
>>>
>>>> "blake murphy" > wrote in message
>>>> ...
>>>
>>>> > yes. god forbid they know i buy store-brand toilet paper.
>>>>
>>>
>>>But they only know that you *bought* it. Maybe the toilet paper you
>>>actually use is stolen, and you just use the store brand for rolling
>>>joints.
>>>
>>>> What if you smoked and your insurance company wanted to know if you lied
>>>> on
>>>> your application?
>>>
>>>I used to buy sanitary napkins. Does that make me a woman? Or was I
>>>just a husband who bought things for the family? My sister buys
>>>sanitary napkins also. She is beyond the age of using them. She has a
>>>little strap that she puts on a male dog so when he pees while she is
>>>gone, it goes in the pad and not on the rug.
>>>
>>>> What if you had diabetes and you bought a lot of candy?
>>>
>>>What if I had small children who could have candy? Besides, the
>>>nutritionists say that sugar by itself is no longer relevant for
>>>diabetics.
>>>
>>
>> this is another flaw in the 'big brother at the grocery' theory. they
>> don't know who you're shopping for.
>
>
>You still have yet to offer an explaination of why they want so much info
>about you when they already know what is being sold. What possible
>advantage could they be seeking against their competition if they know who
>bought what, when and where and what that person's address, phine, DL and
>SSN numbers are?
>
>Paul
>

there is information valuable to markets just in the zip code. i
imagine more detailed information is valuable in the same way. i
don't recall being asked for my social security number, and i can't
imagine being refused a card for not supplying it. you need to calm
down a little bit.

your pal,
blake

"blake murphy" > wrote in message
...
> On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 21:42:54 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
> wrote:
>
>>
>>"Dan Abel" > wrote in message
...
>>> In article <IC3Pj.1577$Ks1.485@trnddc01>,
>>> "Paul M. Cook" > wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> personal info has ever been misused? Not like anyone today has ever
>>>> had
>>>> their privacy invaded by a bank because of something to do with their
>>>> car
>>>> insurance.
>>>
>>> If you financed your car through that bank, they own it. Just try to
>>> find the title to the car. The bank has it. If you look at your
>>> registration paper, it says you are the registered owner, and the spot
>>> for the legal owner has the name of the bank.
>>>
>>And if you miss a payment your medical insurance should not be affected.
>>However, it does. And that is my point. That being we are just losing
>>all
>>of our privacy so why make it so easy for them to know more about you than
>>your own mother?
>>
>>> It's their car, they have a right to make sure there is insurance on it
>>> (your sales contract must certainly have had a provision that requires
>>> you to carry insurance, I've never seen one without it).
>>
>>Yes but that is not the point I am making.
>>
>>Paul
>>
>
> o.k., what is the point you're making? all you been doing is making
> scare talk that has nothing to do with grocery store sales records.


When corporations want your personal information, even if it is how many
rolls of TP you buy every month, they want it for a reason. And that reason
has nothing to do with better serving you. Ask any PI, the easiest way to
get information from somebody is simply top ask for it. That info can and
is being abused every day and it gets worse all the time. Demographic data
with names, addresses and phone numbers attached is perhaps the most
valuable data there is and even if today they are just going to use it to
target advertisements, one has to wonder what tomorrow could bring. There
is no end to which personal data can be used and "profiling" is becoming a
very lucrative industry. There are compamies like Centerpointe which do
nothing but collect seemimgly mundane info on you and sell it to whoever is
willing to pay their price. This is *your* information BTW, and you have no
say in how it is used.

Why give it away so easily?

Paul

On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 16:53:45 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
wrote:

>
>"blake murphy" > wrote in message
.. .
>> On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 02:18:41 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>Like I said, polls show most people don't care. Who ever would have
>>>thought
>>>that your credit rating would affect your car insurance? It does.
>>>Whoever
>>>would have thought that your credit rating is used to deny medical
>>>insurance? It is. Whoever would have thought banks would raise your CC
>>>rates because you have no life insurance? They do. And on and on and on.
>>>How do they do it? They all share their databases.
>>
>> again, i'd like to see a cite for the groceries sharing this
>> information.
>>
>>>
>>>Once you see how data mining works, you can't ignore what they can do with
>>>this information. Take stores they already have electronic POS systems
>>>and
>>>they know what sells and what does not and can tell you to the unit how
>>>many
>>>cans of tomato soup they sold yesterday. So why do they want your name
>>>attached to that purchase? Why do they want a DL number? Why do they
>>>want
>>>a SSN? What you have to think about is not what they will do with it
>>>today,
>>>but tomorrow.
>>>
>>
>> again, i say paranoia.
>
>
>Paranoia, paranoia, WRACK WRACK - poly want a cracker - poly is a
>cracker - WRACK, tweet.
>
>Have a happy and safe like, little sheep.
>
>Paul
>

again, you can't provide the information to back your assertions, so
you insult me (not very effectively). typical.

your pal,
blake

On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 21:39:07 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
wrote:

>
>"Wayne Boatwright" > wrote in message
73.184...
>> On Mon 21 Apr 2008 09:53:45a, Paul M. Cook told us...
>>
>>>
>>> "blake murphy" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>> On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 02:18:41 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" > wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Like I said, polls show most people don't care. Who ever would have
>>>>>thought that your credit rating would affect your car insurance? It
>> does.
>>>>>Whoever
>>>>>would have thought that your credit rating is used to deny medical
>>>>>insurance? It is. Whoever would have thought banks would raise your CC
>>>>>rates because you have no life insurance? They do. And on and on and
>> on.
>>>>>How do they do it? They all share their databases.
>>>>
>>>> again, i'd like to see a cite for the groceries sharing this
>> information.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Once you see how data mining works, you can't ignore what they can do
>> with
>>>>>this information. Take stores they already have electronic POS systems
>>>>>and they know what sells and what does not and can tell you to the unit
>>>>>how many cans of tomato soup they sold yesterday. So why do they want
>>>>>your name attached to that purchase? Why do they want a DL number? Why
>>>>>do they want a SSN? What you have to think about is not what they will
>>>>>do with it today, but tomorrow.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> again, i say paranoia.
>>>
>>>
>>> Paranoia, paranoia, WRACK WRACK - poly want a cracker - poly is a
>>> cracker - WRACK, tweet.
>>>
>>> Have a happy and safe like, little sheep.
>
>
>Wayne, you can only assume emotional states on a newsgroup. If I am
>paranoid because I guard my personal information then Blake can be a parrot.
>
>Paul
>

o.k., how's this for different? i think you're full of shit because
you can't back up what you're saying, and since you can't back it up,
you insult me. pussy.

your pal,
blake

On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 22:23:28 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
wrote:

>
>"Wayne Boatwright" > wrote in message
73.184...
>> On Mon 21 Apr 2008 02:39:07p, Paul M. Cook told us...
>>
>>>
>>> "Wayne Boatwright" > wrote in message
>>> 3.184...
>>>> On Mon 21 Apr 2008 09:53:45a, Paul M. Cook told us...
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "blake murphy" > wrote in message
>>>>> ...
>>>>>> On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 02:18:41 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Like I said, polls show most people don't care. Who ever would have
>>>>>>>thought that your credit rating would affect your car insurance? It
>>>>>>>does. Whoever
>>>>>>>would have thought that your credit rating is used to deny medical
>>>>>>>insurance? It is. Whoever would have thought banks would raise your
>>>>>>>CC rates because you have no life insurance? They do. And on and on
>>>>>>>and on. How do they do it? They all share their databases.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> again, i'd like to see a cite for the groceries sharing this
>>>>>> information.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Once you see how data mining works, you can't ignore what they can do
>>>>>>>with this information. Take stores they already have electronic POS
>>>>>>>systems and they know what sells and what does not and can tell you
>>>>>>>to the unit how many cans of tomato soup they sold yesterday. So
>>>>>>>why do they want your name attached to that purchase? Why do they
>>>>>>>want a DL number? Why do they want a SSN? What you have to think
>>>>>>>about is not what they will do with it today, but tomorrow.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> again, i say paranoia.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Paranoia, paranoia, WRACK WRACK - poly want a cracker - poly is a
>>>>> cracker - WRACK, tweet.
>>>>>
>>>>> Have a happy and safe like, little sheep.
>>>
>>>
>>> Wayne, you can only assume emotional states on a newsgroup. If I am
>>> paranoid because I guard my personal information then Blake can be a
>>> parrot.
>>>
>>> Paul
>>>
>>>
>>
>> It's true, one can only assume. I don't think you're parannoid, but I do
>> think the topic has gone far beyond necessity.
>>
>> In my area one can obtain a card at any of the stores without giving any
>> personal information. I give my phone number (actually, it is now an
>> inactive phone number) just so that I can key it into the terminal if I
>> forget the card. No one requires SSN, address, or other peronal data.
>
>They do not require because they may not legally but they do ask for it. I
>am a privacy nut after I did the data mining field for a while.
>
>Paul
>

they ask for it, you say no. problem solved.

your pal,
blake

On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 17:17:09 GMT, "James Silverton"
> wrote:

> blake wrote on Mon, 21 Apr 2008 17:06:22 GMT:
>
> ??>> A state issued ID with picture costs about $4.00 and is
> ??>> readily available.
> ??>>
> ??>> George
>
> bm> *you* find it readily available. if you have no car and
> bm> live 50 miles from the registrar, with public
> bm> transportation spotty or unavailable, suddenly it's not.
>
>Hi Blake! I think you may live in Montgomery County and, if so,
>there are quite a number of places that could be convenient for
>ID cards.
>http://www.marylandmva.com/LOCATION/...merycounty.htm
>Variations on this URL might work for other counties or try a
>Google search.
>
>
>James Silverton

um, i have a non-driver's i.d. issued by the state of maryland. as
many have pointed out, it's needed for many transactions in modern
life. what i'm saying is that it should not be required *for voting*,
because not everyone has or wants one or finds it easy to get.

your pal,
blake

On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 20:55:48 GMT, "James Silverton"
> wrote:

> Goomba38 wrote on Mon, 21 Apr 2008 16:42:19 -0400:
>
> ??>> Don't know about MD or your friend, but here in
> ??>> California, to renew your driver's license by mail, you
> ??>> have to sign a form, which states that you are certifying
> ??>> by your signature that you have had no visual impairments
> ??>> since your vision was last screened by them.
> ??>>
>
>They seem to insist on a personal appearance in MD and have done
>so for a long time. As I mentioned responding to Blake,
>Montgomery, tho' not the rest of the MD counties, has a number
>of sub-stations where you can renew permits and get IDs. For
>driver's permits, they do the photographs and eye tests.
>
>
>James Silverton

the non-driver's i.d. has a photo, and you must appear to get one.

your pal,
blake

jmcquown wrote on Tue, 22 Apr 2008 10:04:32 -0400:

j> Wayne Boatwright wrote:
??>> On Mon 21 Apr 2008 02:39:07p, Paul M. Cook told us...
??>>
??>>> "Wayne Boatwright" >
??>>> wrote in
??>>> message
??>>> 73.184...
??>>>> On Mon 21 Apr 2008 09:53:45a, Paul M. Cook told us...
??>>>>
??>>>>> "blake murphy" > wrote in message
??>>>>> ...
??>>>>>> On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 02:18:41 GMT, "Paul M. Cook"
??>>>>>> > wrote:
??>>>>>>
??>>>>>>> They do. And on and on and on. How do they do it?
??>>>>>>> They all share their databases.
??>>>>>>
??>>>>>> again, i'd like to see a cite for the groceries
??>>>>>> sharing this information.
??>>>>>>
??>>>>>>> Once you see how data mining works, you can't ignore
??>>>>>>> what they can do with this information. Take stores
??>>>>>>> they already have electronic POS systems and they
??>>>>>>> know what sells and what does not and can tell you to
??>>>>>>> the unit how many cans of tomato soup they sold
??>>>>>>> yesterday. So why do they want your name attached to
??>>>>>>> that purchase? Why do they want a DL number? Why do
??>>>>>>> they want a SSN? What you have to think about is
??>>>>>>> not what they will do with it today, but tomorrow.
??>>>>>>>
??>>>>>> again, i say paranoia.
??>>>>>
??>>>>> Paranoia, paranoia, WRACK WRACK - poly want a cracker
??>>>>> - poly is a cracker - WRACK, tweet.
??>>>>>
??>>>>> Have a happy and safe like, little sheep.
??>>>
??>>> Wayne, you can only assume emotional states on a
??>>> newsgroup. If I am paranoid because I guard my personal
??>>> information then Blake can be a parrot.
??>>>
??>> It's true, one can only assume. I don't think you're
??>> parannoid, but I do think the topic has gone far beyond
??>> necessity.
??>>
??>> In my area one can obtain a card at any of the stores
??>> without giving any personal information. I give my phone
??>> number (actually, it is now an inactive phone number) just
??>> so that I can key it into the terminal if I forget the
??>> card. No one requires SSN, address, or other peronal
??>> data.
??>>
j> On one trip John and I took there was a VCR in the hotel
j> room. So we thought okay, we'll go to the Blockbuster, get
j> a card and rent a couple of movies. We explained to the
j> clerk we were only in town for a week. The application asks
j> for your SSN. John told the clerk no way was he giving them
j> that information. They don't need it, they aren't going to
j> be paying him Social Security benefits.

I suspect any reasonable number string would work. For many
years until I was threatened with dire penalties, my bank
thought my SS no. was 314-59-2653 (digits of PI) I have one of
the older SS cards marked "not to be used for idenification".

James Silverton
Potomac, Maryland

E-mail, with obvious alterations:
not.jim.silverton.at.verizon.not

On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 17:54:57 -0400, Goomba38 >
wrote:

>blake murphy wrote:
>
>> no one said they didn't. what i am saying is that one should not be
>> required *to vote*.
>>
>> your pal,
>> blake
>>
>And I disagree
>I don't think it is too much to ask or expect.

we'll have to wait until september, or whenever the supreme court
releases their decision. i think it imposes a burden that is not
justified by the 'problem' it allegedly solves.

your pal,
blake

On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 22:27:08 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
wrote:

>
>"blake murphy" > wrote in message
.. .
>> On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 02:00:49 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>"George Shirley" > wrote in message
t...
>>
>>>> Well Blake, Loosyanna requires picture ID when you show up at the polls
>>>> and your voter registration says which polling place you're entitled to
>>>> vote at. Of course being a state with the finest politicians money can
>>>> buy
>>>> we have to do that to ensure the dead aren't still voting.
>>>
>>>
>>>Here is an account of Georgia's experiment.
>>>
>>>http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...091901382.html
>>>
>>>Paul
>>>
>>
>> note especially this part from the above cite:
>>
>> Perdue and other proponents of the law said it is needed to curtail
>> fraud. They cited an Atlanta Journal-Constitution article that said
>> 5,000 dead people were listed as having voted in the eight elections
>> preceding 2000.
>>
>> But the fraud happened primarily in absentee balloting, Barnes said.
>> Under the new law, absentee voters are not required to show
>> identification.
>>
>> "This is the most sinister scheme I've ever seen," Barnes said, "and
>> it's going on nationwide."
>>
>> *
>>
>> the scheme is on the part of republicans to dissuade the poor and
>> elderly and other shiftless folks who might vote democratic from
>> voting. it really is as simple as that. ask karl rove.
>
>
>Precisely. Don't forget elctronic voting. Georgia is famous from the 2002
>election where more people voted in some counties than lived in those
>counties. It wasa chalked up to a "math error" in the compuerized voting
>systems - the hilarious excuse was "humidity." All the "math errors" handed
>wins to republicans. So far, no machines have so erred on the side of the
>left.
>
>Paul
>

exactly. if you're going to engineer voter fraud, you do it at the
wholesale, not the retail level by having people show up to
'impersonate' voters who may have already voted or will vote later,
leading to some unpleasantness. much easier to jigger the voting
machines.

your pal,
blake

"blake murphy" > wrote in message
...
> On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 16:51:52 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
> wrote:
>
>>
>>"blake murphy" > wrote in message
. ..
>>> On Sun, 20 Apr 2008 16:15:41 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>"blake murphy" > wrote in message
m...
>>>>> On Sat, 19 Apr 2008 21:48:07 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>"Wayne Boatwright" > wrote in message
>>>>>>news:Xns9A85635CA5957wayneboatwrightatari@69 .28.173.184...
>>>>>>> On Sat 19 Apr 2008 09:28:11a, Ms P told us...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> They sent me a dry cat food sample today. It's close to the same
>>>>>>>> kind
>>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>> give her to keep the hairballs at bay.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Ms P
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I use my real address for all my store cards, as well as my internet
>>>>>>> address.
>>>>>>> Phone number is optional, and I don't give it. It's definitely had
>>>>>>> its
>>>>>>> benefits from time to time.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I can assure you they keep those records. I know, I helped them do
>>>>>>it.
>>>>>>Now
>>>>>>what they will do with that info I do not know but they most
>>>>>>definitely
>>>>>>keep
>>>>>>a history of everything you buy and when and where too. It's hugely
>>>>>>valuable information for advertisers who would pay a lot of money for
>>>>>>it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I keep all my cards anonymous. You simply do not have to fill out the
>>>>>>form
>>>>>>to get the card. Just tell them you won't but you want the card
>>>>>>anyway.
>>>>>>They have to provide it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I've seen first hand the info they keep on people and it is pretty
>>>>>>scary
>>>>>>what they know about you.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Paul
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> yes. god forbid they know i buy store-brand toilet paper.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>What if you smoked and your insurance company wanted to know if you lied
>>>>on
>>>>your application? What if you had diabetes and you bought a lot of
>>>>candy?
>>>>
>>>>Regardless, if advertisers want demographic data on me, and they are
>>>>willing
>>>>to pay a fortune to a store to get it, they can just bloody well pay me.
>>>>
>>>>But your response is quite typical. Studies show most people do not
>>>>value
>>>>personal privacy. It is one reason nobody is stewing much about heir
>>>>phones
>>>>being tapped for the last 8 years.
>>>>
>>>>Paul
>>>>
>>>
>>> if you can show me a cite for grocery stores sharing their information
>>> with insurance companies, i would be very interested. otherwise, i'll
>>> put it down to general paranoia.
>>
>>It's all just that, of course. What kind of kook would ever assume any
>>personal info has ever been misused? Not like anyone today has ever had
>>their privacy invaded by a bank because of something to do with their car
>>insurance. It is the stuff of fools, not to be tolerated by those of your
>>stature.
>>
>>Wipe your ass with whatever you want, big boy. I am sure when they drag
>>mandatory implanted RFID chips out again you'll be first in line. So long
>>as you feel safe.
>>
>>Paul
>>
>
> thanks for the insults, small fry, but you're changing the subject.
> purchase records are not r.f.i.d. chips. jesus.


The point is made that "they" want to know a lot about you. And you do
remember the proposal to require everyone, starting with school children, to
be chipped, right? It exposes the agendas of some of those in power and I'm
not buying into the "safety" excuse. Knowledge is power, and knowledge is
easily abused.

Paul

"blake murphy" > wrote in message
...
> On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 16:51:52 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
> wrote:
>
>>
>>"blake murphy" > wrote in message
. ..
>>> On Sun, 20 Apr 2008 16:15:41 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>"blake murphy" > wrote in message
m...
>>>>> On Sat, 19 Apr 2008 21:48:07 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I've seen first hand the info they keep on people and it is pretty
>>>>>>scary
>>>>>>what they know about you.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Paul
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> yes. god forbid they know i buy store-brand toilet paper.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>What if you smoked and your insurance company wanted to know if you lied
>>>>on
>>>>your application? What if you had diabetes and you bought a lot of
>>>>candy?
>>>>
>>>>Regardless, if advertisers want demographic data on me, and they are
>>>>willing
>>>>to pay a fortune to a store to get it, they can just bloody well pay me.
>>>>
>>>>But your response is quite typical. Studies show most people do not
>>>>value
>>>>personal privacy. It is one reason nobody is stewing much about heir
>>>>phones
>>>>being tapped for the last 8 years.
>>>>
>>>>Paul
>>>>
>>>
>>> if you can show me a cite for grocery stores sharing their information
>>> with insurance companies, i would be very interested. otherwise, i'll
>>> put it down to general paranoia.
>>
>>It's all just that, of course. What kind of kook would ever assume any
>>personal info has ever been misused? Not like anyone today has ever had
>>their privacy invaded by a bank because of something to do with their car
>>insurance. It is the stuff of fools, not to be tolerated by those of your
>>stature.
>>
>>Wipe your ass with whatever you want, big boy. I am sure when they drag
>>mandatory implanted RFID chips out again you'll be first in line. So long
>>as you feel safe.
>>
>>Paul
>>
>
> in other words, you can't show me a cite where grocery stores are
> sharing their information with insurance companies or anyone else.


At this time they probably are not. That does not mean they won't be
tomorrow. They will probably do it at some point simply because they will
be able to do it. When Social Security was enacted they passed a law
forbidding the use of a person's;s number for any other purpose than SS>
Now look at what they do with that number.

Having been employed to help them install the mechanisms of data mining I
can assure you they didn't spend all that money for nothing.

Paul

"blake murphy" > wrote in message
...
> On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 22:23:28 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
> wrote:
>
>>
>>"Wayne Boatwright" > wrote in message
. 173.184...
>>> On Mon 21 Apr 2008 02:39:07p, Paul M. Cook told us...
>>>
>>>>
>>>> "Wayne Boatwright" > wrote in message
>>>> 3.184...
>>>>> On Mon 21 Apr 2008 09:53:45a, Paul M. Cook told us...
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "blake murphy" > wrote in message
>>>>>> ...
>>>>>>> On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 02:18:41 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Like I said, polls show most people don't care. Who ever would have
>>>>>>>>thought that your credit rating would affect your car insurance? It
>>>>>>>>does. Whoever
>>>>>>>>would have thought that your credit rating is used to deny medical
>>>>>>>>insurance? It is. Whoever would have thought banks would raise
>>>>>>>>your
>>>>>>>>CC rates because you have no life insurance? They do. And on and
>>>>>>>>on
>>>>>>>>and on. How do they do it? They all share their databases.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> again, i'd like to see a cite for the groceries sharing this
>>>>>>> information.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Once you see how data mining works, you can't ignore what they can
>>>>>>>>do
>>>>>>>>with this information. Take stores they already have electronic POS
>>>>>>>>systems and they know what sells and what does not and can tell you
>>>>>>>>to the unit how many cans of tomato soup they sold yesterday. So
>>>>>>>>why do they want your name attached to that purchase? Why do they
>>>>>>>>want a DL number? Why do they want a SSN? What you have to think
>>>>>>>>about is not what they will do with it today, but tomorrow.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> again, i say paranoia.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Paranoia, paranoia, WRACK WRACK - poly want a cracker - poly is a
>>>>>> cracker - WRACK, tweet.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Have a happy and safe like, little sheep.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Wayne, you can only assume emotional states on a newsgroup. If I am
>>>> paranoid because I guard my personal information then Blake can be a
>>>> parrot.
>>>>
>>>> Paul
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> It's true, one can only assume. I don't think you're parannoid, but I
>>> do
>>> think the topic has gone far beyond necessity.
>>>
>>> In my area one can obtain a card at any of the stores without giving any
>>> personal information. I give my phone number (actually, it is now an
>>> inactive phone number) just so that I can key it into the terminal if I
>>> forget the card. No one requires SSN, address, or other peronal data.
>>
>>They do not require because they may not legally but they do ask for it.
>>I
>>am a privacy nut after I did the data mining field for a while.
>>
>>Paul
>>
>
> they ask for it, you say no. problem solved.


Correct, which is what I have been advising people. Just don't go along. I
have 3 cards, neither of which has my name or any other true information on
it. And my phone number is 909-123-4567 on two of them and the third card
has exactly no information on it at all since I never gave them the
application form back.

Paul

"blake murphy" > wrote in message
...
> On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 21:39:07 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
> wrote:
>
>>
>>"Wayne Boatwright" > wrote in message
. 173.184...
>>> On Mon 21 Apr 2008 09:53:45a, Paul M. Cook told us...
>>>
>>>>
>>>> "blake murphy" > wrote in message
>>>> ...
>>>>> On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 02:18:41 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Like I said, polls show most people don't care. Who ever would have
>>>>>>thought that your credit rating would affect your car insurance? It
>>> does.
>>>>>>Whoever
>>>>>>would have thought that your credit rating is used to deny medical
>>>>>>insurance? It is. Whoever would have thought banks would raise your
>>>>>>CC
>>>>>>rates because you have no life insurance? They do. And on and on and
>>> on.
>>>>>>How do they do it? They all share their databases.
>>>>>
>>>>> again, i'd like to see a cite for the groceries sharing this
>>> information.
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Once you see how data mining works, you can't ignore what they can do
>>> with
>>>>>>this information. Take stores they already have electronic POS
>>>>>>systems
>>>>>>and they know what sells and what does not and can tell you to the
>>>>>>unit
>>>>>>how many cans of tomato soup they sold yesterday. So why do they
>>>>>>want
>>>>>>your name attached to that purchase? Why do they want a DL number?
>>>>>>Why
>>>>>>do they want a SSN? What you have to think about is not what they
>>>>>>will
>>>>>>do with it today, but tomorrow.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> again, i say paranoia.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Paranoia, paranoia, WRACK WRACK - poly want a cracker - poly is a
>>>> cracker - WRACK, tweet.
>>>>
>>>> Have a happy and safe like, little sheep.
>>
>>
>>Wayne, you can only assume emotional states on a newsgroup. If I am
>>paranoid because I guard my personal information then Blake can be a
>>parrot.
>>
>>Paul
>>
>
> o.k., how's this for different? i think you're full of shit because
> you can't back up what you're saying, and since you can't back it up,
> you insult me. pussy.


*I* worked on the POS systems that those stores use to collect YOUR
information. That is how I know.

Paul

"blake murphy" > wrote in message
...
> On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 16:53:45 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
> wrote:
>
>>
>>"blake murphy" > wrote in message
. ..
>>> On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 02:18:41 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>Like I said, polls show most people don't care. Who ever would have
>>>>thought
>>>>that your credit rating would affect your car insurance? It does.
>>>>Whoever
>>>>would have thought that your credit rating is used to deny medical
>>>>insurance? It is. Whoever would have thought banks would raise your CC
>>>>rates because you have no life insurance? They do. And on and on and
>>>>on.
>>>>How do they do it? They all share their databases.
>>>
>>> again, i'd like to see a cite for the groceries sharing this
>>> information.
>>>
>>>>
>>>>Once you see how data mining works, you can't ignore what they can do
>>>>with
>>>>this information. Take stores they already have electronic POS systems
>>>>and
>>>>they know what sells and what does not and can tell you to the unit how
>>>>many
>>>>cans of tomato soup they sold yesterday. So why do they want your name
>>>>attached to that purchase? Why do they want a DL number? Why do they
>>>>want
>>>>a SSN? What you have to think about is not what they will do with it
>>>>today,
>>>>but tomorrow.
>>>>
>>>
>>> again, i say paranoia.
>>
>>
>>Paranoia, paranoia, WRACK WRACK - poly want a cracker - poly is a
>>cracker - WRACK, tweet.
>>
>>Have a happy and safe like, little sheep.
>>
>>Paul
>>
>
> again, you can't provide the information to back your assertions, so
> you insult me (not very effectively). typical.
>

It's probably your bubbly personality that invites so much attention.

Paul

"blake murphy" > wrote in message
...
> On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 21:46:46 GMT, "Paul M. Cook" >
> wrote:
>
>>
>>"blake murphy" > wrote in message
>>news
>>> On Sun, 20 Apr 2008 19:11:11 -0700, Dan Abel > wrote:
>>>
>>>>In article <N_JOj.1599$pn4.1084@trnddc03>,
>>>> "Paul M. Cook" > wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> "blake murphy" > wrote in message
>>>>> ...
>>>>
>>>>> > yes. god forbid they know i buy store-brand toilet paper.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>But they only know that you *bought* it. Maybe the toilet paper you
>>>>actually use is stolen, and you just use the store brand for rolling
>>>>joints.
>>>>
>>>>> What if you smoked and your insurance company wanted to know if you
>>>>> lied
>>>>> on
>>>>> your application?
>>>>
>>>>I used to buy sanitary napkins. Does that make me a woman? Or was I
>>>>just a husband who bought things for the family? My sister buys
>>>>sanitary napkins also. She is beyond the age of using them. She has a
>>>>little strap that she puts on a male dog so when he pees while she is
>>>>gone, it goes in the pad and not on the rug.
>>>>
>>>>> What if you had diabetes and you bought a lot of candy?
>>>>
>>>>What if I had small children who could have candy? Besides, the
>>>>nutritionists say that sugar by itself is no longer relevant for
>>>>diabetics.
>>>>
>>>
>>> this is another flaw in the 'big brother at the grocery' theory. they
>>> don't know who you're shopping for.
>>
>>
>>You still have yet to offer an explaination of why they want so much info
>>about you when they already know what is being sold. What possible
>>advantage could they be seeking against their competition if they know who
>>bought what, when and where and what that person's address, phine, DL and
>>SSN numbers are?
>>
>>Paul
>>
>
> there is information valuable to markets just in the zip code. i
> imagine more detailed information is valuable in the same way. i
> don't recall being asked for my social security number, and i can't
> imagine being refused a card for not supplying it. you need to calm
> down a little bit.


And in case you missed it, well you did, I have been saying all along they
have no right to require that info prior to giving you a card. I have
stated they have no legal means to demand that information from you, so why
give it?

Paul

blake murphy > wrote:

> On Sun, 20 Apr 2008 22:30:45 -0500, Sqwertz >
> wrote:
>
>>Goomba38 > wrote:
>>
>>> Many (most?) states can provide a non-drivers type photo identification,
>>> which I've seen elderly have.
>>
>>*All* states offer an ID card as an alternative to a drivers
>>license.
>
> no one said they didn't.

And nobody has addressed you in the last 15 posts upwards in this
thread. So what's the problem?

-sw

blake murphy > wrote:

> On Sun, 20 Apr 2008 11:55:50 -0500, Sqwertz >
> wrote:
>
>>Don't show it, then don't get service. It's that simple, Paul.
>>You're an idiot. I've pointed out plenty of every day examples of
>>where you have to show your ID but you're like one of those monkeys
>>with his hands over his ears.
>
> people don't have a constitutional right to obtain store cards.

Which is why they can ask to see the pimples on your ass as a
condition of 'membership'.

-sw

blake murphy > wrote:

> On Sun, 20 Apr 2008 11:59:41 -0500, Sqwertz >
> wrote:
>
>>Wayne Boatwright > wrote:
>>
>>> On Sat 19 Apr 2008 07:00:43p, Sqwertz told us...
>>>
>>>> Wayne Boatwright > wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I have absolutely nothing to hide, especially my purchasing habits.
>>>>
>>>> It's attitudes like this that the government uses to gradually rip
>>>> away our personal freedoms.
>>>
>>> And exactly what does the governmen have to do with supermarket store
>>> cards?
>>
>>We're not talking about the grocery store. Were talking about
>>spineless, gullible, pushovers like yourself, that bow down, bend,
>>and act passive about everything they don't think affects them.
>>
>>>> How would you feel if They wanted to put cameras in your bedroom?
>>>> You have nothing to hide there, either. Where do you draw the line?
>>>
>>> Across your face!
>>
>>I'll take that as a refusal to verify your position.
>
> you haven't exactly been backing up your position with facts here.
> instead you change the subject or insult people. i don't think it's
> convincing anyone.

I'm expressing opinions above. It's kinda hard to prove those are
my opinions. I guess I just expected that people would believe
those were my opinions.

-sw

blake murphy > wrote:

> On Sun, 20 Apr 2008 21:25:11 -0500, Sqwertz >
> wrote:
>
>>There's a difference between knowing what you bought in a week, and
>>someone keeping track of everything you've ever purchased over the
>>course of your lifetime.
>
> yes. the lifetime information would be ever so much more boring.

You seem to be taking this kinda hard.

-sw

In article >, Ms P
> wrote:

> advantage to giving your real address to the store card
> They sent me...

I insisted on having a card without filling out a form. So far, I have
cards like this from three stores. The only trouble is about club
cards is it's so hard to get the store to say when the club meetings
are.

These cards have a hidden potential, though. Did anyone else see the
story yesterday about food rationing at a major chain. It seems
there's a shortage of rice and the store wanted to keep people from
stocking up (meaning cleaning them out of sacks of rice). When people
checked out with rice, the clerk could call up a list of their previous
rice purchases and limit them to no more than their usual amount.

This raises a number of possible scenarios. Use your imagination.

jmcquown wrote:

> I'm encountering the opposite problem since my father died. It seems it
> will take an act of Congress to get his name off things. We've provided
> certified death certificates and been assured only her name remains but
> apparently not based on the things he gets in the mail from the bank,
> their insurance company, etc.
>
> Jill

Well, to be blunt, it hasn't been all that long since your father
passed. I wouldn't exactly be expecting all mailing lists to be purged
of his name quite so fast? Anything computer generated (bills, even)
would obviously take a little longer to clear up.

Dan Abel > wrote:

> In article >,
> Sqwertz > wrote:
>
>> You must show valid identification to an officer any time they ask
>> for it, without reason or probable cause. A State or military ID
>> would work, but chances are you have a drivers license (and it would
>> be illegal to have both a state ID and a drivers license). The law
>> is called "Failure to identify" and "stop and identify" and is a law
>> in most states. And if not a state law, is more often than not a
>> municipal law.
>
> You wouldn't happen to have some cites on that? A quick Google doesn't
> show much:
>
> 1. A proposed law in Virginia failed:
>
> http://www.richmondsunlight.com/bill/2008/hb435/
>
> 2. The law in Ohio requires probable cause (suspected of committing a
> crime, or witnessed one), and you don't need id, you just need to
> furnish name, address and birthdate. If age is an element in the crime,
> you don't need to furnish age, either.

Generally the laws read that they can ask you for ID if they suspect
you have committed, witnessed, or may commit a crime.

"probably cause" doesn't really mean anything. An officer has
probable cause at all times. And if he doesn't, he/she will make
something up.

A little over half the states have Stop and Identify laws, and many
counties/city's also have the same clauses. I guess you don't
really have to show physical ID, but not having an ID or not being
in their system is enough reason to detain/arrest you for just being
in public. I was taken down to the station and fingerprinted and
given the third-degree once in Sunnyvale for not being able to prove
I was me.

-sw

"James Silverton" > wrote

> They seem to insist on a personal appearance in MD and have done so for a
> long time. As I mentioned responding to Blake, Montgomery, tho' not the
> rest of the MD counties, has a number of sub-stations where you can renew
> permits and get IDs. For driver's permits, they do the photographs and eye
> tests.

Funny, here only in very recent years were you required to appear to
renew your license, you just mailed it in with a check. Now we
have to show up every time with a full proof of ID, starting with
birth certificate and on up. But I have never been asked to take an
eye exam, maybe with the exception of first getting a license, and I don't
remember taking one then. Never since.

nancy

"Nancy Young" > wrote in
:

>
> "James Silverton" > wrote
>
>> They seem to insist on a personal appearance in MD and have done so
>> for a long time. As I mentioned responding to Blake, Montgomery, tho'
>> not the rest of the MD counties, has a number of sub-stations where
>> you can renew permits and get IDs. For driver's permits, they do the
>> photographs and eye tests.
>
> Funny, here only in very recent years were you required to appear to
> renew your license, you just mailed it in with a check. Now we
> have to show up every time with a full proof of ID, starting with
> birth certificate and on up. But I have never been asked to take an
> eye exam, maybe with the exception of first getting a license, and I
> don't remember taking one then. Never since.
>
> nancy
>
>
>

Every time I renew my handicapp sticker I get called in. I have to write
the written test, get a eye test and have a doctor's note for my driver
liscense renewal.

--

The house of the burning beet-Alan

A man in line at the bank kept falling over...when he got to a teller he
asked for his balance.

"hahabogus" > wrote

> "Nancy Young" > wrote

>> Funny, here only in very recent years were you required to appear to
>> renew your license, you just mailed it in with a check. Now we
>> have to show up every time with a full proof of ID, starting with
>> birth certificate and on up. But I have never been asked to take an
>> eye exam, maybe with the exception of first getting a license, and I
>> don't remember taking one then. Never since.

> Every time I renew my handicapp sticker I get called in. I have to write
> the written test, get a eye test and have a doctor's note for my driver
> liscense renewal.

No kidding. I guess I could see that with a handicapped sticker.
I'm not sure why they have you take the written test, who knows.

nancy

hahabogus wrote:
> "Nancy Young" > wrote in
> :
>
>> "James Silverton" > wrote
>>
>>> They seem to insist on a personal appearance in MD and have done so
>>> for a long time. As I mentioned responding to Blake, Montgomery, tho'
>>> not the rest of the MD counties, has a number of sub-stations where
>>> you can renew permits and get IDs. For driver's permits, they do the
>>> photographs and eye tests.
>> Funny, here only in very recent years were you required to appear to
>> renew your license, you just mailed it in with a check. Now we
>> have to show up every time with a full proof of ID, starting with
>> birth certificate and on up. But I have never been asked to take an
>> eye exam, maybe with the exception of first getting a license, and I
>> don't remember taking one then. Never since.
>>
>> nancy
>>
>>
>>
>
> Every time I renew my handicapp sticker I get called in. I have to write
> the written test, get a eye test and have a doctor's note for my driver
> liscense renewal.
>
It is a personal visit, eye exam, and new license every 5 years IIRC,
here in Louisiana. My handicap hang tag expires every ten years and I
have to go in, pay four bucks, get my picture taken and get a separate
handicap ID to go with the number on the hang tag. The police do check
them occasionally so I guess it's a good thing.