About 20 years ago, I started experimenting with making my own yeast
for making bread. The bread never turned out well but I think it did
rise. For example, I took some grape skins and left them in water or
grape juice for a few days, and then used it instead of yeast to make
bread. I also tried it with barley in water, on the theory that hops
are like barely and are fermented to make beer. I don't remember whether
I made bread out of it but I did taste it and wasn't too grossed out.

I'd like to know, since I'm thinking of trying again, whether this
is something people actually do to get leavening for bread and, if
so what are some ways to do it right.

Ignorantly,
Allan Adler


************************************************** **************************
* *
* Disclaimer: I am a guest and *not* a member of the MIT Artificial *
* Intelligence Lab. My actions and comments do not reflect *
* in any way on MIT. Moreover, I am nowhere near the Boston *
* metropolitan area. *
* *
************************************************** **************************

On 19 Apr 2004 08:57:36 -0400
Allan Adler > wrote:

> bread. I also tried it with barley in water, on the theory that hops
> are like barely and are fermented to make beer. I don't remember


Hops are little flowers that taste good with fermented grains. They
don't really resemble barley at all.

"Allan Adler" > wrote in message
...
>
> About 20 years ago, I started experimenting with making my own yeast
> for making bread. The bread never turned out well but I think it did
> rise. For example, I took some grape skins and left them in water or
> grape juice for a few days, and then used it instead of yeast to make
> bread. I also tried it with barley in water, on the theory that hops
> are like barely and are fermented to make beer. I don't remember whether
> I made bread out of it but I did taste it and wasn't too grossed out.
>
> I'd like to know, since I'm thinking of trying again, whether this
> is something people actually do to get leavening for bread and, if
> so what are some ways to do it right.
>
> Ignorantly,
> Allan Adler
>

I would ask over at rec.food.sourdough.

On 19 Apr 2004 08:57:36 -0400, Allan Adler >
wrote:

>
>About 20 years ago, I started experimenting with making my own yeast
>for making bread. The bread never turned out well but I think it did
>rise. For example, I took some grape skins and left them in water or
>grape juice for a few days, and then used it instead of yeast to make
>bread. I also tried it with barley in water, on the theory that hops
>are like barely and are fermented to make beer. I don't remember whether
>I made bread out of it but I did taste it and wasn't too grossed out.
>
>I'd like to know, since I'm thinking of trying again, whether this
>is something people actually do to get leavening for bread and, if
>so what are some ways to do it right.
>
>Ignorantly,
>Allan Adler

>

Hi Allan,

Yes, lots of folks make their own cultures to raise bread. It is
rather easy.

First, a few thoughts:

There are many suggestions out there that involve grapes, raisins, and
all manner of other fruit etc.

The culture that you want is a symbiotic mix of wild yeasts and
lactobacilli. The yeasts occur naturally on the grain (and thus are in
the flour. The lacto critters occur naturally (are you ready for
this?) on, and in, the baker (that would be you...)

Here's the process:

You will need flour, water, and time. Organic flour is likely to be
best, though I have succeeded many times with regular ol' flour off
the super market shelf.

One other thought: There are billions of appropriate critters in every
gram of flour. Many descriptions of this process have one doubling the
amount of material until having oceans of culture. That is hard to
manage, and is also wasteful. Instead, think in terms of teaspoons of
flour and water...

And here is the method:

Take a small amount of flour (say two teaspoons) and mix it into a
rather thick batter with clean, unchlorinated, water. Put the mix
aside in a place (ideally) at about 80F for 24 hours. Put a cover on
the container (and no, it will not explode if the lid is air tight.)

After 24 hours, discard half of it, and then add a teaspoon of flour,
and enough water to get back to the "thick batter" consistency. Put it
aside for another 24 hours.

After a few cycles of this process, you are likely to notice some
changes: You may see some bubbles, or even an increase in volume of
the mixture. (BTW, observing volume increases is extremely difficult
in round bottomed bowls. I would suggest using a container of
cylindrical shape if you have one.)

After about a week, it is very likely that when you add the flour to
the mix you will see a gradual increase in volume over a few hours. If
you do, you have a culture that you can use for baking.

At that point, get back to me here, or at rec.food.sourdough.

Have fun, and keep me posted,

--
Kenneth

If you email... Please remove the "SPAMLESS."

On Mon, 19 Apr 2004 18:21:55 GMT, Kenneth
> wrote:

>The culture that you want is a symbiotic mix of wild yeasts and
>lactobacilli. The yeasts occur naturally on the grain (and thus are in
>the flour. The lacto critters occur naturally (are you ready for
>this?) on, and in, the baker (that would be you...)

Hi again,

I just re-read my post, and realized that I left something out:

Yeasts do, indeed, grow on grapes and other things, but they cannot
live when fed flour. As a result, if you want to use grapes or some
such, it is best to simply eat them while you prepare your starter
with flour and water only...

All the best,

--
Kenneth

If you email... Please remove the "SPAMLESS."

Thanks to Kenneth > for tellling me how
to make my own culture for making bread.

> Take a small amount of flour (say two teaspoons) and mix it into a
> rather thick batter with clean, unchlorinated, water.

Is it doomed if the water is chlorinated?

I think the water here is chlorinated. I could try to get bottled water
but I think that a lot of bottled water is just someone else's tap water.

Ignorantly,
Allan Adler


************************************************** **************************
* *
* Disclaimer: I am a guest and *not* a member of the MIT Artificial *
* Intelligence Lab. My actions and comments do not reflect *
* in any way on MIT. Moreover, I am nowhere near the Boston *
* metropolitan area. *
* *
************************************************** **************************

On 19 Apr 2004 23:35:24 -0400, Allan Adler >
wrote:

>
>Thanks to Kenneth > for tellling me how
>to make my own culture for making bread.
>
>> Take a small amount of flour (say two teaspoons) and mix it into a
>> rather thick batter with clean, unchlorinated, water.
>
>Is it doomed if the water is chlorinated?
>
>I think the water here is chlorinated. I could try to get bottled water
>but I think that a lot of bottled water is just someone else's tap water.
>
>Ignorantly,
>Allan Adler

>
>************************************************* ***************************
>* *
>* Disclaimer: I am a guest and *not* a member of the MIT Artificial *
>* Intelligence Lab. My actions and comments do not reflect *
>* in any way on MIT. Moreover, I am nowhere near the Boston *
>* metropolitan area. *
>* *
>************************************************* ***************************

Hi Allan,

Water is chlorinated to kill off just the sort of critters that, for
this purpose, we want to grow.

Indeed, bottled water is often just "someone else's" tap water, but
the label will surely tell you if it is chlorinated.

Have fun,

--
Kenneth

If you email... Please remove the "SPAMLESS."

On Tue, 20 Apr 2004 11:24:58 GMT, Kenneth
> wrote:

>On 19 Apr 2004 23:35:24 -0400, Allan Adler >
>wrote:
>
>>
>>Thanks to Kenneth > for tellling me how
>>to make my own culture for making bread.
>>
>>> Take a small amount of flour (say two teaspoons) and mix it into a
>>> rather thick batter with clean, unchlorinated, water.
>>
>>Is it doomed if the water is chlorinated?
>>
>>I think the water here is chlorinated. I could try to get bottled water
>>but I think that a lot of bottled water is just someone else's tap water.
>>
>>Ignorantly,
>>Allan Adler

>>
>>************************************************ ****************************
>>* *
>>* Disclaimer: I am a guest and *not* a member of the MIT Artificial *
>>* Intelligence Lab. My actions and comments do not reflect *
>>* in any way on MIT. Moreover, I am nowhere near the Boston *
>>* metropolitan area. *
>>* *
>>************************************************ ****************************
>
>Hi Allan,
>
>Water is chlorinated to kill off just the sort of critters that, for
>this purpose, we want to grow.
>
>Indeed, bottled water is often just "someone else's" tap water, but
>the label will surely tell you if it is chlorinated.
>
>Have fun,

Hi again,

Let's continue this at rec.food.sourdough,

--
Kenneth

If you email... Please remove the "SPAMLESS."

Almost all water from the tap has a bit of chlorine. However, if you
let water sit for 24 hours the chlorine dissipates. This is "aged"
water that serious aquarium-keepers keep on hand.

> Thanks to Kenneth > for tellling me how
> to make my own culture for making bread.
>
> > Take a small amount of flour (say two teaspoons) and mix it into a
> > rather thick batter with clean, unchlorinated, water.
>
> Is it doomed if the water is chlorinated?
>
> I think the water here is chlorinated. I could try to get bottled water
> but I think that a lot of bottled water is just someone else's tap water.
>
> Ignorantly,
> Allan Adler
>
>
> ************************************************** **************************
> * *
> * Disclaimer: I am a guest and *not* a member of the MIT Artificial *
> * Intelligence Lab. My actions and comments do not reflect *
> * in any way on MIT. Moreover, I am nowhere near the Boston *
> * metropolitan area. *
> * *
> ************************************************** **************************