Winemaking (rec.crafts.winemaking) Discussion of the process, recipes, tips, techniques and general exchange of lore on the process, methods and history of wine making. Includes traditional grape wines, sparkling wines & champagnes.

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Old 23-10-2003, 07:06 AM
David Savige
 
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Default alternate yeast for kit?

I was wondering if anyone had successfully used any different yeasts
with the Brew King Selection Estate Columbia Valley Riesling kit, or if
it's more advisable to use the Lalvin EC 1118 that comes with it.
Thanks,

David Savige


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Old 23-10-2003, 07:40 AM
Negodki
 
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Default alternate yeast for kit?

"David Savige" wrote:
I was wondering if anyone had successfully used any different yeasts
with the Brew King Selection Estate Columbia Valley Riesling kit, or if
it's more advisable to use the Lalvin EC 1118 that comes with it.


Different yeasts have different (flavour and performance) characteristics.
The one that comes with the kit has been selected because it has the
characteristics that go with the wine being made. But most other yeasts will
work as well, and yield slightly different results. Whether they are better
or worse is more a matter of taste than empirical fact.


Lalvin EC-1118 has a temperature range of 45-95, an alcohol tolerance of
18%, low flocculation. It is a strong fermenter, low foamer, and has a
neutral sensory impact. Any yeast having these characteristics should work
well.

As long as the temperature range of the substitute matches YOUR fermentation
temperature, and the alcohol level matches YOUR p.a., another yeast should
also work.


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Old 23-10-2003, 04:07 PM
JEP
 
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Default alternate yeast for kit?

"Negodki" wrote in message ...
"David Savige" wrote:
I was wondering if anyone had successfully used any different yeasts
with the Brew King Selection Estate Columbia Valley Riesling kit, or if
it's more advisable to use the Lalvin EC 1118 that comes with it.


Different yeasts have different (flavour and performance) characteristics.
The one that comes with the kit has been selected because it has the
characteristics that go with the wine being made.


Sorry, but I disagree. EC-1118 is usually put in kits because it's
hard for someone to kill. It has a wide temperature range, higher
alcohol tolerance, is a killer strain. In short, it's used because
it's about as fool proof as you can get, not because it matches the
wine being made. It's one of the last I would pick for a Riesling.

I used ICV D-47 on a Riesling with good results, but it's a more
finicky yeast. 71B would probably also be a decent one to use.

Andy
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Old 23-10-2003, 05:37 PM
Negodki
 
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Default alternate yeast for kit?

"Negodki" wrote:
Different yeasts have different (flavour and performance)

characteristics.
The one that comes with the kit has been selected because it has the
characteristics that go with the wine being made.


"JEP" wrote:
Sorry, but I disagree. EC-1118 is usually put in kits because it's
hard for someone to kill. It has a wide temperature range, higher
alcohol tolerance, is a killer strain. In short, it's used because
it's about as fool proof as you can get, not because it matches the
wine being made. It's one of the last I would pick for a Riesling.

I used ICV D-47 on a Riesling with good results, but it's a more
finicky yeast. 71B would probably also be a decent one to use.


What you say makes sense. I don't work with kits (or make Riesling), but had
assumed they would select the optimal yeast for the wine. Regardless, the
poster should have equal success with another yeast of similar
characteristics, or any yeast which was rated for the applicable temperature
and potential alcohol.

I also believe the performance characteristics of the yeast (e.g. alcohol
tolerance, foaming, flocculation, etc.) to be more important than the
flavour characteristics, because (in my experience) after a few years of
aging there is virtually no perceptible difference between yeasts. For
example, I made identical batches of Sangiovese with Montrachet, Pasteur
Red, and Premier Cuvee. Although each yeast performed quite differently,
there were only subtle flavour differences after a few months, and none that
I can detect after 4 years of bulk aging.


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Old 23-10-2003, 11:32 PM
Alastair Thomson
 
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Default alternate yeast for kit?

David,
I made this kit earlier this year using a Wyeast Rudsheimer yeast. This
yeast was selected from German Riesling fermentations and the result was
very, very good. This yeast is a slow fermenter, especially when you ferment
it cold - I fermented mine at around 50 degrees, and it took a good month to
ferment.

As others have noted, most kits come with EC-1118 because it's hard to get
it wrong and it will ferment to dryness.

For fruity wines like the Riesling, I've also used Lalvin D-47 with
excellent results.

Alastair

On 10/23/03 2:06 AM, in article , "David
Savige" wrote:

I was wondering if anyone had successfully used any different yeasts
with the Brew King Selection Estate Columbia Valley Riesling kit, or if
it's more advisable to use the Lalvin EC 1118 that comes with it.
Thanks,

David Savige





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Old 25-10-2003, 08:19 AM
David Savige
 
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Default alternate yeast for kit?

Alastair,

Thanks, that sounds like a good way to go. Were you able to follow the kit
instructions as printed, or did you make any alterations? I appreciate your
comments,

David


Alastair Thomson wrote:

David,
I made this kit earlier this year using a Wyeast Rudsheimer yeast. This
yeast was selected from German Riesling fermentations and the result was
very, very good. This yeast is a slow fermenter, especially when you ferment
it cold - I fermented mine at around 50 degrees, and it took a good month to
ferment.

As others have noted, most kits come with EC-1118 because it's hard to get
it wrong and it will ferment to dryness.

For fruity wines like the Riesling, I've also used Lalvin D-47 with
excellent results.

Alastair

On 10/23/03 2:06 AM, in article , "David
Savige" wrote:

I was wondering if anyone had successfully used any different yeasts
with the Brew King Selection Estate Columbia Valley Riesling kit, or if
it's more advisable to use the Lalvin EC 1118 that comes with it.
Thanks,

David Savige


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Old 26-10-2003, 06:41 PM
Richard Kovach
 
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Default alternate yeast for kit?

I agree with you to some extent that the differences from various
yeasts diminishes with time, but not entirely. And I would certainly
say that my own experiments of using bayanus strains like Premier
Cuvee and EC-1118 versus cerivisiaie strains like Montrachet and
Pasteur Red revealed significant differences well past 4 months, even
14 months.

A lot of wineries go through a lot of trouble to select the best
strains to use for their wines, including many that are not meant to
be consumed for several years.

Perhaps you're just not as in tune with the differences as some people
are? I don't mean this as a personal slam! I think it's pretty
widely acknowledged that different people have varying sensitivies in
their organoleptic senses, just as some people have better vision or
hearing than others. My wife has been a wine drinker for longer than
I, and of the differences that I think are huge she often can barely
notice. Other friends of mine describe differences that I can't
detect.

Besides, it is unlikely that anyone will save much at all, let alone
the majority, of a white kit wine for as long as four years. I would
expect that in the timeframes that most of this wine will be consumed,
the differences could be very significant.

Cheers!
Richard

"Negodki" wrote in message ...
"Negodki" wrote:
Different yeasts have different (flavour and performance)

characteristics.
The one that comes with the kit has been selected because it has the
characteristics that go with the wine being made.


"JEP" wrote:
Sorry, but I disagree. EC-1118 is usually put in kits because it's
hard for someone to kill. It has a wide temperature range, higher
alcohol tolerance, is a killer strain. In short, it's used because
it's about as fool proof as you can get, not because it matches the
wine being made. It's one of the last I would pick for a Riesling.

I used ICV D-47 on a Riesling with good results, but it's a more
finicky yeast. 71B would probably also be a decent one to use.


What you say makes sense. I don't work with kits (or make Riesling), but had
assumed they would select the optimal yeast for the wine. Regardless, the
poster should have equal success with another yeast of similar
characteristics, or any yeast which was rated for the applicable temperature
and potential alcohol.

I also believe the performance characteristics of the yeast (e.g. alcohol
tolerance, foaming, flocculation, etc.) to be more important than the
flavour characteristics, because (in my experience) after a few years of
aging there is virtually no perceptible difference between yeasts. For
example, I made identical batches of Sangiovese with Montrachet, Pasteur
Red, and Premier Cuvee. Although each yeast performed quite differently,
there were only subtle flavour differences after a few months, and none that
I can detect after 4 years of bulk aging.



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