Winemaking (rec.crafts.winemaking) Discussion of the process, recipes, tips, techniques and general exchange of lore on the process, methods and history of wine making. Includes traditional grape wines, sparkling wines & champagnes.

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Old 19-08-2007, 12:36 PM posted to rec.crafts.winemaking
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Default What effect does "time on skins and seeds" produce ? (Concord Grapes)

Another question from the "no yeast nutrient" wine project.
Last years Concord wine project was with juice only. We stemmed,
crushed and strained the pulp in one day and fermented the juice only.
Wine turned out to our satisfaction.
This year we are experimenting with the whole grape.
The crush and Campden tab dump was on Friday afternoon. Pectic enzyme
on Saturday morning. Yeast dump on Saturday night. Now (Sunday
morning) I punched the cap (about 2 inches and semi dry) and have an
active fermenation underway.
The SG at yeast dump was 1.120 (unadjusted) at 75 F.
I have read the wine can be "smoothed out some" by removing the seeds
and skins early in the fermentation.
What does the group think about this practice ?
What impact would this have on the wine ?
Thnaks to earlier responders for the yeast and sweetening tips and
info.


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Old 19-08-2007, 04:56 PM posted to rec.crafts.winemaking
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Default What effect does "time on skins and seeds" produce ? (Concord Grapes)

Well, for the most part it adds color and tannins; tannins give it
astringency. Concord is black with color so I don't know whether you
need more time or not. I wouldn't think astringency in a Concord is
needed.

If you liked last years you may want to consider making this in two
stages; one where you pull off some free run early like last year,
another where you leave a portion on the skins. (This assumes you
liked the color last year.) To be honest, Concord is usually made
sweet for a reason, it's not especially well liked as a dry wine due
to its foxiness.

If you only left a small portion on the skins you do have a few
options left even if you hate it. You can fine and filter to remove
some astringency, you could blend some back in to the original batch
or you could add some sugar and vodka to make it into a port style
wine. (I don't know if adding vodka is legal in the US; I do think
you are supposed to get the higher alcohol via fermentation which can
be done too. This is an international newsgroup so...)

The long and short of this is if you like the color I doubt you need
extended skin contact. Concord truly is a wine unto itself, it does
not behave European grapes.

Joe

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Old 19-08-2007, 06:39 PM posted to rec.crafts.winemaking
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Default What effect does "time on skins and seeds" produce ? (Concord Grapes)

On Aug 19, 11:56 am, Joe Sallustio wrote:
Well, for the most part it adds color and tannins; tannins give it
astringency. Concord is black with color so I don't know whether you
need more time or not. I wouldn't think astringency in a Concord is
needed.

If you liked last years you may want to consider making this in two
stages; one where you pull off some free run early like last year,
another where you leave a portion on the skins. (This assumes you
liked the color last year.) To be honest, Concord is usually made
sweet for a reason, it's not especially well liked as a dry wine due
to its foxiness.

If you only left a small portion on the skins you do have a few
options left even if you hate it. You can fine and filter to remove
some astringency, you could blend some back in to the original batch
or you could add some sugar and vodka to make it into a port style
wine. (I don't know if adding vodka is legal in the US; I do think
you are supposed to get the higher alcohol via fermentation which can
be done too. This is an international newsgroup so...)

The long and short of this is if you like the color I doubt you need
extended skin contact. Concord truly is a wine unto itself, it does
not behave European grapes.

Joe


Thanks for the info.
Just pushed down the cap again.
Wow, after just 18 hours that Lalvin K1 V1116 yeast is rockin and
rollin in there.
As I understand things then,
1. longer time the skins and seeds stay in the game the more color and
astringency I get,
2. dry Concord is not a good thing,
3. the yeast will control the dryness as I won't try to stop its work
(I wouldn't know how to anyway (smile,,,)
Since color is nice already after a day, I think I will strain out the
seeds and skins Tuesday afternoon.
All I have invested is a little sugar, yeast and my time so I won't
expend a lot of effort to get all the juice.
As I don't have the equipment to split into 2 batches (one with seeds
and skins) (and one without) I will shoot for a
sweet fruity wine without a lot of astringency (no skins no seeds).
That leaves me with one final (I promise) question for the group on my
project,
In light of the above, how far should I let the batch go before
putting in a 5 gal carboy with an air lock ?
I jumped the gun last year and the carboy puked out the air lock and
thanks to this groups help and info I got past that crisis with a
rigged up 2 liter pop bottle air lock.
Again, thanks for your help and patience.



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