I have a patio that has and 8ft side then a 90 degree turn and a 14
ft side, is this enough space to grow grapes?

14 ft
------------+
| 8 ft
|

should I planr by the corner post? leaving a 14 ft run 1 way and an 8
ft run the other? or is better to plant by the end of the 8 ft run,
which buts up against the house? How many vines can this support?

Sportinus wrote:

> I have a patio that has and 8ft side then a 90
> degree turn and a 14
> ft side, is this enough space to grow grapes?
>
> 14 ft
> ------------+
> | 8 ft
> |
>
> should I planr by the corner post? leaving a 14
> ft run 1 way and an 8
> ft run the other? or is better to plant by the
> end of the 8 ft run,
> which buts up against the house? How many vines
> can this support?

Boy, you are going to get a lot of different
opinions on this one. Is your patio covered? Do
both sides have access to plenty of sun? Where
do you live? What variety do you want to plant?

Vine spacing varies a lot depending of personal
preference, variety vigor and other variables.

ONE possible scenerio that could work is the
following:

from the left end of the 14 foot diagram, go right
two feet and plant vine 1, go 4 feet and plant
vine 2, go another 4 feet and plant vine 3. This
will give you two feet to both ends of this row.
This will allow a total cordon length of 4 f per
vine. on the 8 foot section - come in from the
end 2 feet and plant a vine, go 4 feet and plant
another vine. This again would leave you with
two feet at each end and 4 foot of cordon.

This would be total of 6 vines.

I am sure you will get a lot of other suggestions

good luck

On Mar 1, 9:23 am, "Paul E. Lehmann" > wrote:
> Sportinus wrote:
> > I have a patio that has and 8ft side then a 90
> > degree turn and a 14
> > ft side, is this enough space to grow grapes?
>
> > 14 ft
> > ------------+
> > | 8 ft
> > |
>
> > should I planr by the corner post? leaving a 14
> > ft run 1 way and an 8
> > ft run the other? or is better to plant by the
> > end of the 8 ft run,
> > which buts up against the house? How many vines
> > can this support?
>
> Boy, you are going to get a lot of different
> opinions on this one. Is your patio covered? Do
> both sides have access to plenty of sun? Where
> do you live? What variety do you want to plant?
>
> Vine spacing varies a lot depending of personal
> preference, variety vigor and other variables.
>
> ONE possible scenerio that could work is the
> following:
>
> from the left end of the 14 foot diagram, go right
> two feet and plant vine 1, go 4 feet and plant
> vine 2, go another 4 feet and plant vine 3. This
> will give you two feet to both ends of this row.
> This will allow a total cordon length of 4 f per
> vine. on the 8 foot section - come in from the
> end 2 feet and plant a vine, go 4 feet and plant
> another vine. This again would leave you with
> two feet at each end and 4 foot of cordon.
>
> This would be total of 6 vines.
>
> I am sure you will get a lot of other suggestions
>
> good luck- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

Thanks for the info. no the patio is not covered it is on the side of
my house. It is a garage entrance. I live in a western burb of
Chicago. the area only gets about 1.5 hours of shade as the sun is
setting. I have just started delving into wine and not sure what
varieties to choose yet. I am in the trying to understand if it is
doable.

I think proper vine selection is going to be the most important part
of this.

Check out the viticulture FAQ at: http://vitfaq.vinic.com/gohome.html

You'll need to calculate your HSU in order to determine which
varieties are recommended. You should also ask around your area; find
out what varieties others have had luck with. I think vinifera is out
of the question, although you could try Cab Franc or Riesling if
you're daring. There are many French hybrids which should do well in
your area.

Greg G.

Paul E. Lehmann wrote:

> Sportinus wrote:
>
>> I have a patio that has and 8ft side then a 90
>> degree turn and a 14
>> ft side, is this enough space to grow grapes?
>>
>> 14 ft
>> ------------+
>> | 8 ft
>> |
>>
>> should I planr by the corner post? leaving a
>> 14 ft run 1 way and an 8
>> ft run the other? or is better to plant by the
>> end of the 8 ft run,
>> which buts up against the house? How many
>> vines can this support?
>
> Boy, you are going to get a lot of different
> opinions on this one. Is your patio covered?
> Do
> both sides have access to plenty of sun? Where
> do you live? What variety do you want to plant?
>
> Vine spacing varies a lot depending of personal
> preference, variety vigor and other variables.
>
> ONE possible scenerio that could work is the
> following:
>
> from the left end of the 14 foot diagram, go
> right two feet and plant vine 1, go 4 feet and
> plant
> vine 2, go another 4 feet and plant vine 3.
> This will give you two feet to both ends of this
> row. This will allow a total cordon length of 4
> f per
> vine. on the 8 foot section - come in from the
> end 2 feet and plant a vine, go 4 feet and plant
> another vine. This again would leave you with
> two feet at each end and 4 foot of cordon.
>
> This would be total of 6 vines.
>
> I am sure you will get a lot of other
> suggestions
>
> good luck

Ooops, I don't think my numbers don't add up to
14. They add up to 12, so you could space them
out tad wider or more end at the end of the row.
A four foot spaceing (or there abouts) would also
allow you to either go with cordon - spur pruning
or cane pruning.

I would talk to your extension agent about
variety. There also some very cold tolerant
hybrids such as Traminette for a white variety
(makes EXCELLENT wine) and Frontenac for red or
white. Others can give you better ideas on cold
weather varieties. You might even be able to
grow Cabernet Franc. I grew up and was raised in
Pontiac, Illinois - about 100 miles south of
Chicago and I know it can get VERY cold up there.

> I have a patio that has and 8ft side then a 90 degree turn and a 14
> ft side, is this enough space to grow grapes?

Jeff Chorniak grows Cabernet Franc vines in a suburban backyard in
Toronto. He began by growing them in pots and treating them like
bonsai trees. At some point he did away with the soil and his bonsai
vineyard became a hydroponic vineyard. I'm having trouble with the url
to his current site:

http://www.africusrex.com/

His old site, featuring his bonsai vineyard, is still up at:

http://www.outer-net.com/~jchorniak/page2.html

He inspired me to grow grape vines in pots in my backyard (a suburb of
Seattle, WA, USA). I can tell you that it does work, and it's worth
considering if you have limited space (or bad soil).

Erroll