I decided to make the Old-school, Deli Rye bread from "The Rye Baker" by
Stanley Ginsberg, despite some glaring errors in the description.
I had to make the rye sour first, which took about a week. Then followed a
2 stage sponge and a final dough with the addition of white bread flour and
caraway seeds with a small amount of yeast.
Although the sour demanded whole grain rye flour, the recipe called for
white or light rye flour, neither of which was readily obtainable. I
therefore had to use Rogers dark rye, a widely available flour. Of course,
that meant that I had to fiddle with the hydration a bit.
I was expecting a smooth-crusted loaf with little oven spring like the deli
ryes produced by local bakeries. However, the spring was marked and the
result looked mor like conventional, wheat-based, artisan loaves.
Still, the flavour is good with a noticeable sour note and the crumb is
also OK.
https://postimg.cc/gallery/G1YmCrW

On 2021-02-23 1:01 p.m., Graham wrote:
> I decided to make the Old-school, Deli Rye bread from "The Rye Baker" by
> Stanley Ginsberg, despite some glaring errors in the description.
> I had to make the rye sour first, which took about a week. Then followed a
> 2 stage sponge and a final dough with the addition of white bread flour and
> caraway seeds with a small amount of yeast.
> Although the sour demanded whole grain rye flour, the recipe called for
> white or light rye flour, neither of which was readily obtainable. I
> therefore had to use Rogers dark rye, a widely available flour. Of course,
> that meant that I had to fiddle with the hydration a bit.
> I was expecting a smooth-crusted loaf with little oven spring like the deli
> ryes produced by local bakeries. However, the spring was marked and the
> result looked mor like conventional, wheat-based, artisan loaves.
> Still, the flavour is good with a noticeable sour note and the crumb is
> also OK.
> https://postimg.cc/gallery/G1YmCrW
>

I had to adjust the hydration a bit but the final bakers' % from the
recipe we
White bread flour 482g 60.71%
Rye flour 312g 39,29%
Water 554g 69.77%
salt 17g 2.14%
Instant yeast 4g 0.5%
Caraway 14g 1,79%
Rye sour culture 14g 1.79%

I haven't checked these figures and they may be incorrect judging by the
poor level of proof reading!

On Tue, 23 Feb 2021 13:01:28 -0700, Graham > wrote:

>I decided to make the Old-school, Deli Rye bread from "The Rye Baker" by
>Stanley Ginsberg, despite some glaring errors in the description.
>I had to make the rye sour first, which took about a week. Then followed a
>2 stage sponge and a final dough with the addition of white bread flour and
>caraway seeds with a small amount of yeast.
>Although the sour demanded whole grain rye flour, the recipe called for
>white or light rye flour, neither of which was readily obtainable. I
>therefore had to use Rogers dark rye, a widely available flour. Of course,
>that meant that I had to fiddle with the hydration a bit.
>I was expecting a smooth-crusted loaf with little oven spring like the deli
>ryes produced by local bakeries. However, the spring was marked and the
>result looked mor like conventional, wheat-based, artisan loaves.
>Still, the flavour is good with a noticeable sour note and the crumb is
>also OK.
>https://postimg.cc/gallery/G1YmCrW

Yummy, I bet.

My rye usually come out darker, but I think that is because I use
medium rye. I do get a decent spring if the rye sour seems to be
coming around actively before I start.

I have not made rye bread in ages, but back when I was doing it
regularly, I kept a separate rye starter. The other reason is that my
local market has a fabulous Jewish-style rye bread and why bother- it
is as good as I ever accomplished, though in a bullet shaped loaf.

On Tue, 23 Feb 2021 13:24:11 -0700, Graham > wrote:

>On 2021-02-23 1:01 p.m., Graham wrote:
>> I decided to make the Old-school, Deli Rye bread from "The Rye Baker" by
>> Stanley Ginsberg, despite some glaring errors in the description.
>> I had to make the rye sour first, which took about a week. Then followed a
>> 2 stage sponge and a final dough with the addition of white bread flour and
>> caraway seeds with a small amount of yeast.
>> Although the sour demanded whole grain rye flour, the recipe called for
>> white or light rye flour, neither of which was readily obtainable. I
>> therefore had to use Rogers dark rye, a widely available flour. Of course,
>> that meant that I had to fiddle with the hydration a bit.
>> I was expecting a smooth-crusted loaf with little oven spring like the deli
>> ryes produced by local bakeries. However, the spring was marked and the
>> result looked mor like conventional, wheat-based, artisan loaves.
>> Still, the flavour is good with a noticeable sour note and the crumb is
>> also OK.
>> https://postimg.cc/gallery/G1YmCrW
>>
>
>I had to adjust the hydration a bit but the final bakers' % from the
>recipe we
>White bread flour 482g 60.71%
>Rye flour 312g 39,29%
>Water 554g 69.77%
>salt 17g 2.14%
>Instant yeast 4g 0.5%
>Caraway 14g 1,79%
>Rye sour culture 14g 1.79%
>
>I haven't checked these figures and they may be incorrect judging by the
>poor level of proof reading!


Your rye flour is key to it all. As I recall, the final dough is
somewhat sticky. How was yours?

On 2021-02-23 1:58 p.m., Boron Elgar wrote:
> On Tue, 23 Feb 2021 13:01:28 -0700, Graham > wrote:
>
>> I decided to make the Old-school, Deli Rye bread from "The Rye Baker" by
>> Stanley Ginsberg, despite some glaring errors in the description.
>> I had to make the rye sour first, which took about a week. Then followed a
>> 2 stage sponge and a final dough with the addition of white bread flour and
>> caraway seeds with a small amount of yeast.
>> Although the sour demanded whole grain rye flour, the recipe called for
>> white or light rye flour, neither of which was readily obtainable. I
>> therefore had to use Rogers dark rye, a widely available flour. Of course,
>> that meant that I had to fiddle with the hydration a bit.
>> I was expecting a smooth-crusted loaf with little oven spring like the deli
>> ryes produced by local bakeries. However, the spring was marked and the
>> result looked mor like conventional, wheat-based, artisan loaves.
>> Still, the flavour is good with a noticeable sour note and the crumb is
>> also OK.
>> https://postimg.cc/gallery/G1YmCrW
>
> Yummy, I bet.
>
> My rye usually come out darker, but I think that is because I use
> medium rye. I do get a decent spring if the rye sour seems to be
> coming around actively before I start.
>
> I have not made rye bread in ages, but back when I was doing it
> regularly, I kept a separate rye starter. The other reason is that my
> local market has a fabulous Jewish-style rye bread and why bother- it
> is as good as I ever accomplished, though in a bullet shaped loaf.
>
I was going to do a bullet shape but decided to use my round bannetons
instead. The rye sour was strong and very active. With a bit more time,
I could have dispensed with the yeast but it was in the recipe.
There are 3 Finnish recipes in the book so I might try one now that we
have established contact with Alan.

On 2021-02-23 1:59 p.m., Boron Elgar wrote:
> On Tue, 23 Feb 2021 13:24:11 -0700, Graham > wrote:
>
>> On 2021-02-23 1:01 p.m., Graham wrote:
>>> I decided to make the Old-school, Deli Rye bread from "The Rye Baker" by
>>> Stanley Ginsberg, despite some glaring errors in the description.
>>> I had to make the rye sour first, which took about a week. Then followed a
>>> 2 stage sponge and a final dough with the addition of white bread flour and
>>> caraway seeds with a small amount of yeast.
>>> Although the sour demanded whole grain rye flour, the recipe called for
>>> white or light rye flour, neither of which was readily obtainable. I
>>> therefore had to use Rogers dark rye, a widely available flour. Of course,
>>> that meant that I had to fiddle with the hydration a bit.
>>> I was expecting a smooth-crusted loaf with little oven spring like the deli
>>> ryes produced by local bakeries. However, the spring was marked and the
>>> result looked mor like conventional, wheat-based, artisan loaves.
>>> Still, the flavour is good with a noticeable sour note and the crumb is
>>> also OK.
>>> https://postimg.cc/gallery/G1YmCrW
>>>
>>
>> I had to adjust the hydration a bit but the final bakers' % from the
>> recipe we
>> White bread flour 482g 60.71%
>> Rye flour 312g 39,29%
>> Water 554g 69.77%
>> salt 17g 2.14%
>> Instant yeast 4g 0.5%
>> Caraway 14g 1,79%
>> Rye sour culture 14g 1.79%
>>
>> I haven't checked these figures and they may be incorrect judging by the
>> poor level of proof reading!
>
>
> Your rye flour is key to it all. As I recall, the final dough is
> somewhat sticky. How was yours?
> The second sponge had the consistency of heavy clay!! It was supposed
to be looser so I added water at that stage - perhaps a bit too much as
I had to add 50g of white flour in the final mix.
It started out sticky but was quite smooth after kneading. That may have
been the result of my fiddling with the hydration and adding the small
amount of flour.
BTW, I just checked and the weights used to calculate the percentages
don't all match with those in the recipe! Another lapse in proof reading.

On Tue, 23 Feb 2021 15:48:21 -0700, Graham > wrote:

>On 2021-02-23 1:58 p.m., Boron Elgar wrote:
>
>The other reason is that my
>> local market has a fabulous Jewish-style rye bread and why bother- it
>> is as good as I ever accomplished, though in a bullet shaped loaf.
>>
>I was going to do a bullet shape but decided to use my round bannetons
>instead. The rye sour was strong and very active. With a bit more time,
>I could have dispensed with the yeast but it was in the recipe.
>There are 3 Finnish recipes in the book so I might try one now that we
>have established contact with Alan.

In years gone by, I was given a Finnish rye starter and recall making
a few loaves of ruisleipa, which is fabulous with gravlax.

Rye sours are terrific when they are in their prime.

On Tue, 23 Feb 2021 15:57:11 -0700, Graham > wrote:

>On 2021-02-23 1:59 p.m., Boron Elgar wrote:

>> Your rye flour is key to it all. As I recall, the final dough is
>> somewhat sticky. How was yours?

>The second sponge had the consistency of heavy clay!! It was supposed
>to be looser so I added water at that stage - perhaps a bit too much as
>I had to add 50g of white flour in the final mix.
>It started out sticky but was quite smooth after kneading. That may have
>been the result of my fiddling with the hydration and adding the small
>amount of flour.

>BTW, I just checked and the weights used to calculate the percentages
>don't all match with those in the recipe! Another lapse in proof reading.

Makes it hard to trust anything in the book.

On 2021-02-23 4:06 p.m., Boron Elgar wrote:
> On Tue, 23 Feb 2021 15:48:21 -0700, Graham > wrote:
>
>> On 2021-02-23 1:58 p.m., Boron Elgar wrote:
>>
>> The other reason is that my
>>> local market has a fabulous Jewish-style rye bread and why bother- it
>>> is as good as I ever accomplished, though in a bullet shaped loaf.
>>>
>> I was going to do a bullet shape but decided to use my round bannetons
>> instead. The rye sour was strong and very active. With a bit more time,
>> I could have dispensed with the yeast but it was in the recipe.
>> There are 3 Finnish recipes in the book so I might try one now that we
>> have established contact with Alan.
>
> In years gone by, I was given a Finnish rye starter and recall making
> a few loaves of ruisleipa, which is fabulous with gravlax.
>
> Rye sours are terrific when they are in their prime.
>
I had one in the back of the fridge that I had neglected. It was so
nasty that I pitched the mason jar container as well!
This new one developed pretty rapidly.

On Tue, 23 Feb 2021 16:14:53 -0700, Graham > wrote:

>On 2021-02-23 4:06 p.m., Boron Elgar wrote:
>> On Tue, 23 Feb 2021 15:48:21 -0700, Graham > wrote:
>>
>>> On 2021-02-23 1:58 p.m., Boron Elgar wrote:
>>>
>>> The other reason is that my
>>>> local market has a fabulous Jewish-style rye bread and why bother- it
>>>> is as good as I ever accomplished, though in a bullet shaped loaf.
>>>>
>>> I was going to do a bullet shape but decided to use my round bannetons
>>> instead. The rye sour was strong and very active. With a bit more time,
>>> I could have dispensed with the yeast but it was in the recipe.
>>> There are 3 Finnish recipes in the book so I might try one now that we
>>> have established contact with Alan.
>>
>> In years gone by, I was given a Finnish rye starter and recall making
>> a few loaves of ruisleipa, which is fabulous with gravlax.
>>
>> Rye sours are terrific when they are in their prime.
>>
>I had one in the back of the fridge that I had neglected. It was so
>nasty that I pitched the mason jar container as well!

Been there, done that.

>This new one developed pretty rapidly.