Sourdough (rec.food.sourdough) Discussing the hobby or craft of baking with sourdough. We are not just a recipe group, Our charter is to discuss the care, feeding, and breeding of yeasts and lactobacilli that make up sourdough cultures.

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Old 31-01-2011, 07:31 PM posted to rec.food.sourdough
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Default Finally made some *real* sourdough bread

The starter was just flour and water that I've been feeding for a
while. Sometimes I use rye flour, but usually I use all purpose.

I put a pound of bread flour, and scant tsp of salt dissolved in a cup
of water in the bread machine. Added about a cup and a half of
starter, and ran the "dough" cycle. Two hours later, had a nice very
wet lump of dough that hadn't risen at all yet like it would've had I
used bakers yeast.

I turned it out into a greased Corningware casserole dish, then
flipped it over in the dish (so the top would be greased a little) and
put the lid on. Checked it an hour or two later and maybe it had
risen a little if I used my imagination...

So I let it sit out all night, and by this morning it has risen
nicely. I didn't dare punch it down. I put the lid on the casserole
dish and put it in a cold oven and turned the heat to 375. Checked at
about 35 minutes and it kind of looked done but not browned at all and
maybe a little moist in the center. I took the lid off and baked
another 10 minutes. It was nicely browned and sounded right when I
thumped it. I let it cool a little in the dish, then turned it out
and put it on a rack to finish cooling. I squeezed it a little and
the top crust was thin and had a nice crack to it. Hopefully there's
still some left when I get home :-)

Do you see any room for improvement in my "recipe"? Do the
proportions look about right? It doesn't need any fat or milk or
sugar, right?

-Bob

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Old 01-02-2011, 02:58 PM posted to rec.food.sourdough
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Default Finally made some *real* sourdough bread


"zxcvbob" wrote in message
...
The starter was just flour and water that I've been feeding for a while.
Sometimes I use rye flour, but usually I use all purpose.

I put a pound of bread flour, and scant tsp of salt dissolved in a cup of
water in the bread machine. Added about a cup and a half of starter, and
ran the "dough" cycle. Two hours later, had a nice very wet lump of dough
that hadn't risen at all yet like it would've had I used bakers yeast.

I turned it out into a greased Corningware casserole dish, then flipped it
over in the dish (so the top would be greased a little) and put the lid
on. Checked it an hour or two later and maybe it had risen a little if I
used my imagination...

So I let it sit out all night, and by this morning it has risen nicely. I
didn't dare punch it down. I put the lid on the casserole dish and put it
in a cold oven and turned the heat to 375. Checked at about 35 minutes
and it kind of looked done but not browned at all and maybe a little moist
in the center. I took the lid off and baked another 10 minutes. It was
nicely browned and sounded right when I thumped it. I let it cool a
little in the dish, then turned it out and put it on a rack to finish
cooling. I squeezed it a little and the top crust was thin and had a nice
crack to it. Hopefully there's still some left when I get home :-)

Do you see any room for improvement in my "recipe"? Do the proportions
look about right? It doesn't need any fat or milk or sugar, right?

-Bob

These days, for all my free-form loaves, I use the NYT baking method. I heat
up a Lodge cast iron dutch oven, and lid, in the oven to 450-500F. I then
tip the proofed dough into it, put on the lid and let it bake for
~30minutes. I then remove the lid and bake for another 15-20 minutes,
depending on the size of the loaf.
I've had too many failures baking from cold although I know it works for
some, DA for example.
Graham


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Old 01-02-2011, 03:52 PM posted to rec.food.sourdough
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Default Finally made some *real* sourdough bread

graham wrote:

These days, for all my free-form loaves, I use the NYT baking method. I heat
up a Lodge cast iron dutch oven, and lid, in the oven to 450-500F. I then
tip the proofed dough into it, put on the lid and let it bake for
~30minutes. I then remove the lid and bake for another 15-20 minutes,
depending on the size of the loaf.
I've had too many failures baking from cold although I know it works for
some, DA for example.
Graham


There's no way I could have transfered the dough to a hot pan without
collapsing it. But I could have put this in a preheated 500 degree
oven and then turned it down to 350. I may try that next time and
see what difference it makes if any. And I probably should slash the
top with a razor so the steam can escape.

The bread tastes wonderful. It's by far the best loaf of bread (any
kind of bread) that I've ever made. Maybe I shouldn't change anything :-)

-Bob
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Old 01-02-2011, 07:07 PM posted to rec.food.sourdough
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Default Finally made some *real* sourdough bread


"zxcvbob" wrote in message
...
graham wrote:

These days, for all my free-form loaves, I use the NYT baking method. I
heat up a Lodge cast iron dutch oven, and lid, in the oven to 450-500F.
I then tip the proofed dough into it, put on the lid and let it bake for
~30minutes. I then remove the lid and bake for another 15-20 minutes,
depending on the size of the loaf.
I've had too many failures baking from cold although I know it works for
some, DA for example.
Graham


There's no way I could have transfered the dough to a hot pan without
collapsing it. But I could have put this in a preheated 500 degree oven
and then turned it down to 350. I may try that next time and see what
difference it makes if any. And I probably should slash the top with a
razor so the steam can escape.

The bread tastes wonderful. It's by far the best loaf of bread (any kind
of bread) that I've ever made. Maybe I shouldn't change anything :-)

Regarding the collapse, you'd be surprised by the oven spring with this
method.
Graham


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Old 06-02-2011, 01:35 PM posted to rec.food.sourdough
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Default Finally made some *real* sourdough bread

I hear you on the collapse. I've been putting the bread out for the
final rise exactly as I plan to cook it. So If I'm making a crusty
round loaf, I'll lay it out on the pan to do it's rise for 8 hours or
so, generally in the oven with the light on. I'll pull the pan out
heat the oven and put it back in.

I've done the dutch oven with yeasted bread, but it seems safer to do
the following for a good hard crust. Take a corning ware bowl and
fill it with water. Nuke it so it's warm and put it in the oven on
the bottom rack for warming. Then take a metal 1/4 measuring cup and
pour the water on top of the bread as you put it in. The bowl of
water stays below it. After 10 minutes I re-ladel the hot water on
the loaf. You have to be careful not to burn yourself here. I get a
great crust, equal to that of the dutch oven method, and it feels
safer to me as I've had a few flat loaves.

Robert Zaleski

On Feb 1, 2:07*pm, "graham" wrote:
"zxcvbob" wrote in message

...

graham wrote:


These days, for all my free-form loaves, I use the NYT baking method. I
heat up a Lodge cast iron dutch oven, and lid, in the oven to 450-500F..
I then tip the proofed dough into it, put on the lid and let it bake for
~30minutes. *I then remove the lid and bake for another 15-20 minutes,
depending on the size of the loaf.
I've had too many failures baking from cold although I know it works for
some, DA for example.
Graham


There's no way I could have transfered the dough to a hot pan without
collapsing it. *But I could have put this in a preheated 500 degree oven
and then turned it down to 350. *I may try that next time and see what
difference it makes if any. *And I probably should slash the top with a
razor so the steam can escape.


The bread tastes wonderful. *It's by far the best loaf of bread (any kind
of bread) that I've ever made. *Maybe I shouldn't change anything :-)


Regarding the collapse, you'd be surprised by the oven spring with this
method.
Graham




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Old 21-02-2011, 04:04 PM posted to rec.food.sourdough
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Default Finally made some *real* sourdough bread

On Sun, 6 Feb 2011 05:35:51 -0800 (PST), Robert Zaleski
wrote:

I hear you on the collapse. I've been putting the bread out for the
final rise exactly as I plan to cook it. So If I'm making a crusty
round loaf, I'll lay it out on the pan to do it's rise for 8 hours or
so, generally in the oven with the light on. I'll pull the pan out
heat the oven and put it back in.

Sourdough lactobacilli feed on the gluten.
Gluten keeps the dough elastic and sticky.
So try to keep it to a single rise, you'll probably find it
no longer collapses.......
FWIW
[]'s
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Old 21-02-2011, 05:45 PM posted to rec.food.sourdough
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Default Finally made some *real* sourdough bread

Shadow wrote:
On Sun, 6 Feb 2011 05:35:51 -0800 (PST), Robert Zaleski
wrote:

I hear you on the collapse. I've been putting the bread out for the
final rise exactly as I plan to cook it. So If I'm making a crusty
round loaf, I'll lay it out on the pan to do it's rise for 8 hours or
so, generally in the oven with the light on. I'll pull the pan out
heat the oven and put it back in.

Sourdough lactobacilli feed on the gluten.
Gluten keeps the dough elastic and sticky.
So try to keep it to a single rise, you'll probably find it
no longer collapses.......


I'd like to add to Shadow's suggestion and point out that various SD
cultures behave differently. Some are faster rising than others, some get
more sour. Comparing Robert's process to mine, 8-hours in the oven rising,
with the light on, would be wa-a-ay too long for my culture. Try cutting
back to half of that or so.

As a guide to help you determine how active your culture is, along with
your loaf, put a batch of newly refreshed starter in the oven along with
your loaf during the rise period. By watching the starter rise until it
stops, will let you know when your bread is done rising, and you're
starting to make 'sour'. If it's warmer, it'll do that faster; cooler a
bit slower. But you'll at least get a metric on how fast your starter is
working.

When your starter starts to collapse, it's probably past time to fire up
your loaf. As for taking your loaf out to heat the oven, I wouldn't
bother. I know that's heresy to some reading here, but you don't need to
heat your oven to near the melting point of lead for hours on end, nor do
you need to have tons of stone in order to bake bread. Leave it in and do
a "cold start", and simply add 5-10 min to the baking time. It's quicker,
easier, and saves the cost of the wasted energy.

Um, do, however, remember to remove your starter from the oven BEFORE you
turn it on. Take that bit of advice from someone that's forgotten to do
that before...(:-o)!

But above all, HAVE FUN BAKING (and eating) YOUR BREAD!

L8r,
Dusty
--
"The ideals which have lighted my way, and time after time have given
me new courage to face life cheerfully, have been Kindness, Beauty, and
Truth." - Albert Einstein




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