I've been doing a lot of reading about home canning and come across Botulism
quite a few times in my readings.

The thought of it is scary, but at the same time I look at it as being like
the lottery. There have been a reported 110 cases of botulism in the US last
year. Only 25% of those were attributed to food borne botulism, the rest
being infant and infection botulism.

That amounts to about 25 incidents. How many resulted in death I do not
know. How many of those resulted from commercially packed food products I do
not know.

It would seem that your odds of winning the lottery are better.

Any had any personal experiences with botulism and canned products,
commercial or homecanned? I would like to hear your stories.

I take it that there is so many warning signs about botulism to make red
flags go off in your head just to make you extra aware about what it is and
how to prevent it. Otherwise it would simply be overlooked. Not the case
that it is so commen that they dont want you to do home canning at all.

Like others have said, people have been doing home canning for centuries,
and the methods back then are less stringent than they are nowadays.

I'd love to hear your general feedback as well

Jason

For anyone interested. I just found a technical document published by the
CDC regarding all types of Botulism, including food borne botulism. This
eased my concerns and answered my questions regarding botulism intoxication.

http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dbmd/diseaseinfo/botulism.pdf


"rogers news" > wrote in message
...
> I've been doing a lot of reading about home canning and come across
> Botulism quite a few times in my readings.
>
> The thought of it is scary, but at the same time I look at it as being
> like the lottery. There have been a reported 110 cases of botulism in the
> US last year. Only 25% of those were attributed to food borne botulism,
> the rest being infant and infection botulism.
>
> That amounts to about 25 incidents. How many resulted in death I do not
> know. How many of those resulted from commercially packed food products I
> do not know.
>
> It would seem that your odds of winning the lottery are better.
>
> Any had any personal experiences with botulism and canned products,
> commercial or homecanned? I would like to hear your stories.
>
> I take it that there is so many warning signs about botulism to make red
> flags go off in your head just to make you extra aware about what it is
> and how to prevent it. Otherwise it would simply be overlooked. Not the
> case that it is so commen that they dont want you to do home canning at
> all.
>
> Like others have said, people have been doing home canning for centuries,
> and the methods back then are less stringent than they are nowadays.
>
> I'd love to hear your general feedback as well
>
> Jason
>

I don't know where you live Jason but, if you follow the USDA procedures
for processing foods you shouldn't have to worry about botulism.
Non-acidic foods are to be processed in a pressure canner and for
specific times, acidic foods can mostly be processed in a boiling water
bath canner and that's where the uncertainty about acidity comes into
play. As Bob said in his post pH meters are finicky machinery not to
mention pretty expensive for home use. In another life I ran samples in
a small chem lab on a daily basis for about 15 years and the machinery
required constant recalibration with known samples. Of course that was
nearly 30 years ago and the machines may have changed somewhat but I
doubt if they changed that much.

Do a Google search on this newsgroup and you will find lots of posts on
botulism and the dangers thereof. All of the regulars on here rely on
the USDA guidelines posted at many US land grant universities. HTH

George

Jason wrote:
> For anyone interested. I just found a technical document published by the
> CDC regarding all types of Botulism, including food borne botulism. This
> eased my concerns and answered my questions regarding botulism intoxication.
>
> http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dbmd/diseaseinfo/botulism.pdf
>
>
> "rogers news" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>I've been doing a lot of reading about home canning and come across
>>Botulism quite a few times in my readings.
>>
>>The thought of it is scary, but at the same time I look at it as being
>>like the lottery. There have been a reported 110 cases of botulism in the
>>US last year. Only 25% of those were attributed to food borne botulism,
>>the rest being infant and infection botulism.
>>
>>That amounts to about 25 incidents. How many resulted in death I do not
>>know. How many of those resulted from commercially packed food products I
>>do not know.
>>
>>It would seem that your odds of winning the lottery are better.
>>
>>Any had any personal experiences with botulism and canned products,
>>commercial or homecanned? I would like to hear your stories.
>>
>>I take it that there is so many warning signs about botulism to make red
>>flags go off in your head just to make you extra aware about what it is
>>and how to prevent it. Otherwise it would simply be overlooked. Not the
>>case that it is so commen that they dont want you to do home canning at
>>all.
>>
>>Like others have said, people have been doing home canning for centuries,
>>and the methods back then are less stringent than they are nowadays.
>>
>>I'd love to hear your general feedback as well
>>
>>Jason
>>
>
>
>

(various comments snipped) George Shirley wrote:

> I don't know where you live Jason but, if you follow the USDA procedures
> for processing foods you shouldn't have to worry about botulism.
> George
>
> Jason wrote:
> > For anyone interested. I just found a technical document published by the
> > CDC regarding all types of Botulism, including food borne botulism. This
> > eased my concerns and answered my questions regarding botulism intoxication.
> > http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dbmd/diseaseinfo/botulism.pdf
> >
> > "rogers news" > wrote in message
> > ...
> >
> >>I've been doing a lot of reading about home canning and come across
> >>Botulism quite a few times in my readings.
> >>Any had any personal experiences with botulism and canned products,
> >>commercial or homecanned? I would like to hear your stories.
> >>Jason

I worried about food borne illnesses, too, until, like you, I read up on the
subject. Since then I've trained myself to be a bit quirky about the cleanliness
thing and a bit obsessive about the boiling water bath processing. (I don't have a
pressure canner yet). I sold products at the farmer's market and had a real reason
to worry. But keeping everything clean as possible, if necessary erring on the
side of a bit too much vinegar rather than less, and counting them minutes in the
bath *after* it comes back to a boil. I tried to use a soil pH tester but was
better off tasting - it read 6 for regular white vinegar, 6 for tap water, 6 for
commercial pickles. Read 6 for mouth. Litmus paper better bet & lots cheaper.
We had a case of botulism here a few years back - a restaurant worker left boiled
potatoes out overnight and made a sort of uncooked dip the next day. Many people
sick, a few died and a few crippled/paralyzed for life. Truly awful.
Edrena

In article >, The Joneses
> wrote:

>(snip)We had a case of
> botulism here a few years back - a restaurant worker left boiled
> potatoes out overnight and made a sort of uncooked dip the next day.
> Many people sick, a few died and a few crippled/paralyzed for life.
> Truly awful. Edrena

I've no doubt it was truly awful and it's tragic that some folks died,
but are you sure it was botulism? I'm thinking about the anerobic
environment requirement for the toxin to develop and it doesn't seem
like that requirement was met. Just curious.
--
-Barb, <www.jamlady.eboard.com> Updated 10-04-04; Sam I Am!.
"Peace will come when the power of love overcomes the love of power."
-Jimi Hendrix, and Lt. Joe Corcoran, Retired; St. Paul PD, Homicide Divn.

Melba's Jammin' wrote:

> In article >, The Joneses
> > wrote:
> >(snip)We had a case of
> > botulism here a few years back - a restaurant worker left boiled
> > potatoes out overnight and made a sort of uncooked dip the next day.
> > Many people sick, a few died and a few crippled/paralyzed for life.
> > Truly awful. Edrena
> I've no doubt it was truly awful and it's tragic that some folks died,
> but are you sure it was botulism? I'm thinking about the anerobic
> environment requirement for the toxin to develop and it doesn't seem
> like that requirement was met. Just curious.
> -Barb,

I'm thinking the bugs grew inside the potatoes. I'm sure as i worked for the
lawyer who handled the lawsuits following.
Edrena

Melba's Jammin' wrote:

> In article >, The Joneses
> > wrote:
> >(snip)We had a case of
> > botulism here a few years back - a restaurant worker left boiled
> > potatoes out overnight and made a sort of uncooked dip the next day.
> > Many people sick, a few died and a few crippled/paralyzed for life.
> > Truly awful. Edrena
> I've no doubt it was truly awful and it's tragic that some folks died,
> but are you sure it was botulism? I'm thinking about the anerobic
> environment requirement for the toxin to develop and it doesn't seem
> like that requirement was met. Just curious.
> -Barb,

I'm thinking the bugs grew inside the potatoes. I'm sure as i worked for the
lawyer who handled the lawsuits following.
Edrena

The Joneses wrote:

> Melba's Jammin' wrote:
>
>> In article >, The Joneses
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> (snip)We had a case of botulism here a few years back - a
>>> restaurant worker left boiled potatoes out overnight and made a
>>> sort of uncooked dip the next day. Many people sick, a few died
>>> and a few crippled/paralyzed for life. Truly awful. Edrena
>>
>> I've no doubt it was truly awful and it's tragic that some folks
>> died, but are you sure it was botulism? I'm thinking about the
>> anerobic environment requirement for the toxin to develop and it
>> doesn't seem like that requirement was met. Just curious.
>> -Barb,
>>
> I'm thinking the bugs grew inside the potatoes. I'm sure as i
> worked for the lawyer who handled the lawsuits following.

I'd really like to see the science on that. I can't imagine how the
critters got inside the spuds and, if they did, how they developed
thereafter. Was the dip made with potatoes? What kind of dip is that?

I'm not trying to hassle you, but this flies in the face of what I
think I know, and if I'm wrong, I'd like to fix that.

Pastorio

Bob (this one) wrote:
> The Joneses wrote:
>
>> Melba's Jammin' wrote:
>>
>>> In article >, The Joneses
>>> > wrote:
>>>
>>>> (snip)We had a case of botulism here a few years back - a
>>>> restaurant worker left boiled potatoes out overnight and made a
>>>> sort of uncooked dip the next day. Many people sick, a few died
>>>> and a few crippled/paralyzed for life. Truly awful. Edrena
>>>
>>>
>>> I've no doubt it was truly awful and it's tragic that some folks
>>> died, but are you sure it was botulism? I'm thinking about the
>>> anerobic environment requirement for the toxin to develop and it
>>> doesn't seem like that requirement was met. Just curious.
>
> >> -Barb,
>
>>>
>> I'm thinking the bugs grew inside the potatoes. I'm sure as i
>> worked for the lawyer who handled the lawsuits following.
>
>
> I'd really like to see the science on that. I can't imagine how the
> critters got inside the spuds and, if they did, how they developed
> thereafter. Was the dip made with potatoes? What kind of dip is that?
>
> I'm not trying to hassle you, but this flies in the face of what I think
> I know, and if I'm wrong, I'd like to fix that.
>
> Pastorio
>

I've read of a case where some old guy (no offense intended) got
botulism poisoning after eating some home-canned green beans and some
beef stew. When they investigated, the problem wasn't the green beans,
it was the pot of stew that was left sitting out tightly covered for a
day or two. He would reheat it and thought that would disinfect it.
The tightly fitting lid created the anaerobic conditions sufficient for
a clostridium infection.

It sounds far-fetched to me, but this was an official CDC report that I
stumbled across on the web a few years ago.

Bob

zxcvbob wrote:

> Bob (this one) wrote:
> > The Joneses wrote:
> >> Melba's Jammin' wrote:
> >>> In article >, The Joneses
> >>> > wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> (snip)We had a case of botulism here a few years back - a
> >>>> restaurant worker left boiled potatoes out overnight and made a
> >>>> sort of uncooked dip the next day. Many people sick, a few died
> >>>> and a few crippled/paralyzed for life. Truly awful. Edrena
> >>>
> >>> I've no doubt it was truly awful and it's tragic that some folks
> >>> died, but are you sure it was botulism? I'm thinking about the
> >>> anerobic environment requirement for the toxin to develop and it
> >>> doesn't seem like that requirement was met. Just curious.
> > >> -Barb,
> >
> >> I'm thinking the bugs grew inside the potatoes. I'm sure as i
> >> worked for the lawyer who handled the lawsuits following.
> >
> > I'd really like to see the science on that. I can't imagine how the
> > critters got inside the spuds and, if they did, how they developed
> > thereafter. Was the dip made with potatoes? What kind of dip is that?
> > I'm not trying to hassle you, but this flies in the face of what I think
> > I know, and if I'm wrong, I'd like to fix that.
> > Pastorio
> >
> I've read of a case where some old guy (no offense intended) got
> botulism poisoning after eating some home-canned green beans and some
> beef stew. When they investigated, the problem wasn't the green beans,
> it was the pot of stew that was left sitting out tightly covered for a
> day or two. He would reheat it and thought that would disinfect it.
> The tightly fitting lid created the anaerobic conditions sufficient for
> a clostridium infection.
> It sounds far-fetched to me, but this was an official CDC report that I
> stumbled across on the web a few years ago. Bob

I really can't remember all the details, it's been sseveral years since that
case. I'm less likely to eat food that's been sitting out more than an hour or
two.
Edrena

"zxcvbob" wrote:
> I've read of a case where some old guy (no offense intended) got
> botulism poisoning after eating some home-canned green beans and some
> beef stew. When they investigated, the problem wasn't the green beans,
> it was the pot of stew that was left sitting out tightly covered for a
> day or two. He would reheat it and thought that would disinfect it.
> The tightly fitting lid created the anaerobic conditions sufficient for
> a clostridium infection.
>
> It sounds far-fetched to me, but this was an official CDC report that I
> stumbled across on the web a few years ago.

If you mean this one:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...PubMed&list_ui
ds=320672&dopt=Abstract

it was canned beef stew.

pennyaline wrote:

> If you mean this one:
> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...PubMed&list_ui
> ds=320672&dopt=Abstract
>
> it was canned beef stew.

Suggestion: When you're posting a long URL, enclose it in < and > so
it won't get broken and make people copy and paste. Like this:
<http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=320672 &dopt=Abstract>

And/or use a link-shortening program like tinyurl.com or
makeashorterlink.com to provide this sort of thing to go to the same
place: <http://tinyurl.com/4y3tn>

Pastorio

Bob (this one) wrote:

> pennyaline wrote:
>> If you mean this one:
>>
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...PubMed&list_ui
>> ds=320672&dopt=Abstract
>>
>> it was canned beef stew.
>
> Suggestion: When you're posting a long URL, enclose it in < and > so
> it won't get broken and make people copy and paste. Like this:
>
<http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...=PubMed&list_u
ids=320672&dopt=Abstract>
>
> And/or use a link-shortening program like tinyurl.com or
> makeashorterlink.com to provide this sort of thing to go to the same
> place: <http://tinyurl.com/4y3tn>
>
> Pastorio

A thousand pardons, mein Herr, however I usually do use TinyURL but this
time I was having trouble connecting to it. So if it's how you want it, I
confess. I f-d up. Is there anything else you want to complain about?

Now, back to the point: If that was the article in question, it was canned
beef stew.

pennyaline wrote:
> Bob (this one) wrote:
>
>
>>pennyaline wrote:
>>
>>>If you mean this one:
>>>
>
> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...PubMed&list_ui
>
>>>ds=320672&dopt=Abstract
>>>
>>>it was canned beef stew.
>>
>>Suggestion: When you're posting a long URL, enclose it in < and > so
>>it won't get broken and make people copy and paste. Like this:
>>
>
> <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...=PubMed&list_u
> ids=320672&dopt=Abstract>
>
>>And/or use a link-shortening program like tinyurl.com or
>>makeashorterlink.com to provide this sort of thing to go to the same
>>place: <http://tinyurl.com/4y3tn>
>>
>>Pastorio
>
>
> A thousand pardons, mein Herr, however I usually do use TinyURL but this
> time I was having trouble connecting to it. So if it's how you want it, I
> confess. I f-d up. Is there anything else you want to complain about?
>
> Now, back to the point: If that was the article in question, it was canned
> beef stew.
>
>


I don't think that's the same case.

Best regards,
Bob

pennyaline wrote:

> I confess. I f-d up. Is there anything else you want to complain about?

Yes, the older I get the more I sound like my parents.

B/

In article >,
Brian Mailman > wrote:

> Yes, the older I get the more I sound like my parents.


GET OFF THE GRASS!! damn kids...

--
to respond, change "spamless.invalid" with "optonline.net"
please mail OT responses only

"Scott" added:
> Brian Mailman wrote:
>
> > Yes, the older I get the more I sound like my parents.
>
>
> GET OFF THE GRASS!! damn kids...


Okay, okay! Uncle!

<"you're heating the whole outdoors!">

pennyaline wrote:

> Bob (this one) wrote:
>
>>pennyaline wrote:
>>
>>>If you mean this one:
>>>
> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...PubMed&list_ui
>
>>>ds=320672&dopt=Abstract
>>>
>>>it was canned beef stew.
>>
>>Suggestion: When you're posting a long URL, enclose it in < and > so
>>it won't get broken and make people copy and paste. Like this:
>>
> <http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...=PubMed&list_u
> ids=320672&dopt=Abstract>
>
>>And/or use a link-shortening program like tinyurl.com or
>>makeashorterlink.com to provide this sort of thing to go to the same
>>place: <http://tinyurl.com/4y3tn>
>>
>>Pastorio
>
> A thousand pardons, mein Herr, however I usually do use TinyURL but this
> time I was having trouble connecting to it. So if it's how you want it, I
> confess. I f-d up. Is there anything else you want to complain about?

That outfit. It makes your butt look big.

FYI, I offered a suggestion, not a complaint. You know, to be helpful.

Pastorio

> Now, back to the point: If that was the article in question, it was canned
> beef stew.

Scott wrote:

> In article >,
> Brian Mailman > wrote:
>
>> Yes, the older I get the more I sound like my parents.
>
>
> GET OFF THE GRASS!! damn kids...
>
They talk funny, dress funny, listen to weird music.....

B/

On Sat, 9 Oct 2004 18:02:47 -0400, Brian Mailman wrote
(in article >):

> Scott wrote:
>
>> In article >,
>> Brian Mailman > wrote:
>>
>>> Yes, the older I get the more I sound like my parents.
>>
>>
>> GET OFF THE GRASS!! damn kids...
>>
> They talk funny, dress funny, listen to weird music.....
>

That's not music, that's just *noise*!!

Laurel

Laurel wrote:

> On Sat, 9 Oct 2004 18:02:47 -0400, Brian Mailman wrote
> (in article >):
>
>>Scott wrote:
>>
>>>In article >,
>>>Brian Mailman > wrote:
>>>
>>>>Yes, the older I get the more I sound like my parents.
>>>
>>>GET OFF THE GRASS!! damn kids...
>>>
>>They talk funny, dress funny, listen to weird music.....
>>
> That's not music, that's just *noise*!!

Pull up your pants

Laurel wrote:

> On Sat, 9 Oct 2004 18:02:47 -0400, Brian Mailman wrote
> (in article >):
>
>>Scott wrote:
>>
>>>In article >,
>>>Brian Mailman > wrote:
>>>
>>>>Yes, the older I get the more I sound like my parents.
>>>
>>>GET OFF THE GRASS!! damn kids...
>>>
>>They talk funny, dress funny, listen to weird music.....
>>
> That's not music, that's just *noise*!!

Pull up your pants

"Bob (this one)" wrote:
>
> Laurel wrote:
>
> > On Sat, 9 Oct 2004 18:02:47 -0400, Brian Mailman wrote
> > (in article >):
> >
> >>Scott wrote:
> >>
> >>>In article >,
> >>>Brian Mailman > wrote:
> >>>
> >>>>Yes, the older I get the more I sound like my parents.
> >>>
> >>>GET OFF THE GRASS!! damn kids...
> >>>
> >>They talk funny, dress funny, listen to weird music.....
> >>
> > That's not music, that's just *noise*!!
>
> Pull up your pants


Tuck in your shirt!

"Bob (this one)" wrote:
>
> Laurel wrote:
>
> > On Sat, 9 Oct 2004 18:02:47 -0400, Brian Mailman wrote
> > (in article >):
> >
> >>Scott wrote:
> >>
> >>>In article >,
> >>>Brian Mailman > wrote:
> >>>
> >>>>Yes, the older I get the more I sound like my parents.
> >>>
> >>>GET OFF THE GRASS!! damn kids...
> >>>
> >>They talk funny, dress funny, listen to weird music.....
> >>
> > That's not music, that's just *noise*!!
>
> Pull up your pants


Tuck in your shirt!

Puester wrote:

> "Bob (this one)" wrote:
> > Laurel wrote:
> > > On Sat, 9 Oct 2004 18:02:47 -0400, Brian Mailman wrote
> > > (in article >):
> > >>Scott wrote:
> > >>>In article >,
> > >>>Brian Mailman > wrote:
> > >>>>Yes, the older I get the more I sound like my parents.
> > >>>GET OFF THE GRASS!! damn kids...
> > >>They talk funny, dress funny, listen to weird music.....
> > > That's not music, that's just *noise*!!
> > Pull up your pants
> Tuck in your shirt!

Omigod, only *girls* have earrings!

Puester wrote:

> "Bob (this one)" wrote:
> > Laurel wrote:
> > > On Sat, 9 Oct 2004 18:02:47 -0400, Brian Mailman wrote
> > > (in article >):
> > >>Scott wrote:
> > >>>In article >,
> > >>>Brian Mailman > wrote:
> > >>>>Yes, the older I get the more I sound like my parents.
> > >>>GET OFF THE GRASS!! damn kids...
> > >>They talk funny, dress funny, listen to weird music.....
> > > That's not music, that's just *noise*!!
> > Pull up your pants
> Tuck in your shirt!

Omigod, only *girls* have earrings!

The Joneses wrote:

> Puester wrote:
>
>
>>"Bob (this one)" wrote:
>>
>>>Laurel wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Sat, 9 Oct 2004 18:02:47 -0400, Brian Mailman wrote
>>>>(in article >):
>>>>
>>>>>Scott wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>In article >,
>>>>>>Brian Mailman > wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Yes, the older I get the more I sound like my parents.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>GET OFF THE GRASS!! damn kids...
>>>>>
>>>>>They talk funny, dress funny, listen to weird music.....
>>>>
>>>>That's not music, that's just *noise*!!
>>>
>>>Pull up your pants
>>
>>Tuck in your shirt!
>
>
> Omigod, only *girls* have earrings!
>
>
And only bulls have rings through their noses!

The Joneses wrote:

> Puester wrote:
>
>
>>"Bob (this one)" wrote:
>>
>>>Laurel wrote:
>>>
>>>>On Sat, 9 Oct 2004 18:02:47 -0400, Brian Mailman wrote
>>>>(in article >):
>>>>
>>>>>Scott wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>In article >,
>>>>>>Brian Mailman > wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Yes, the older I get the more I sound like my parents.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>GET OFF THE GRASS!! damn kids...
>>>>>
>>>>>They talk funny, dress funny, listen to weird music.....
>>>>
>>>>That's not music, that's just *noise*!!
>>>
>>>Pull up your pants
>>
>>Tuck in your shirt!
>
>
> Omigod, only *girls* have earrings!
>
>
And only bulls have rings through their noses!

>"Bob (this one)" wrote:
>>
>> Laurel wrote:
>>
>> > On Sat, 9 Oct 2004 18:02:47 -0400, Brian Mailman wrote
>> > (in article >):
>> >
>> >>Scott wrote:
>> >>
>> >>>In article >,
>> >>>Brian Mailman > wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>>>Yes, the older I get the more I sound like my parents.
>> >>>
>> >>>GET OFF THE GRASS!! damn kids...
>> >>>
>> >>They talk funny, dress funny, listen to weird music.....
>> >>
>> > That's not music, that's just *noise*!!
>>
>> Pull up your pants
>
>
>Tuck in your shirt!

SLOW DOWN you crazy driver!

"The Joneses" > wrote in message
...
>
> I really can't remember all the details, it's been sseveral years since that
> case. I'm less likely to eat food that's been sitting out more than an hour
or
> two.
> Edrena
>
>
I thought it took a long time for botulism toxins to develop. How long does
it actually take, minimally?

there was also a case of a teen boy reheating a pot pie and developing botulism
a few years back.doesn't take long for spores to vegitate, that was what the
old staggered system relied on some commercial canneries used prior to the
famous 1920's NATIONAL CANNERS ASSN. study

there was also a case of a teen boy reheating a pot pie and developing botulism
a few years back.doesn't take long for spores to vegitate, that was what the
old staggered system relied on some commercial canneries used prior to the
famous 1920's NATIONAL CANNERS ASSN. study

"Ken Anderson" wrote:
> "pennyaline" wrote:.
> >
> >Is there anything else you want to complain about?
> >
> >
> Yes. Thin skinned newsgroup posters.

SNORT! GUFFAW!! If you only knew!

Do you have anything informed and/or constructive to add?

"pennyaline" > wrote in
message ...
> "Ken Anderson" wrote:
> > "pennyaline" wrote:.
> > >
> > >Is there anything else you want to complain about?
> > >
> > >
> > Yes. Thin skinned newsgroup posters.
>
> SNORT! GUFFAW!! If you only knew!
>
> Do you have anything informed and/or constructive to add?
>
>
WELL I HAVE NEVER IN MY LIFE . . .
Ok, I'm over it.
As far as the state-by-state botulism data found on the link given earlier in
this thread, it would be more useful to know the percentage of home canners
that have been afflicted. When you put the number against the whole
population (Ohio here) you are 60 times more likely to be killed or injured by
lightning.

"Ken Anderson" wrote:
> WELL I HAVE NEVER IN MY LIFE . . .
> Ok, I'm over it.
> As far as the state-by-state botulism data found on the link given earlier
in
> this thread, it would be more useful to know the percentage of home
canners
> that have been afflicted. When you put the number against the whole
> population (Ohio here) you are 60 times more likely to be killed or
injured by
> lightning.

Which may well be accurate for the whole of a nation's population, but
results may be skewed in relation not only to better canning methods, but to
lessened reliance on canned foods than in eras gone by.

<fortunately for science, people are still relatively stupid>

"Brian Mailman" > blathered...
>
> And if you happen to be that one in 60 (or whatever number it is) in
> your case it's 100%.
>
> B/
>
>
And if I won the state lottery, it would be 100% too.

You can check with NATIONAL FOOD PROCESSORS(fomerly CANNERS) ASSN but I believe
that less than 10 people have died of botulism from commercially canned
products since the 1920's study ( most famous was guy in NY named Cochrane by
BON VIVANT soup in late 60's , apparently BON VIVANT's retort operator was not
very skilled) ( no one died but a couple years later a restaurant used peppers
they canned themselves and sickened several people it was a technicality but
the powers that be try to claim that they weren't canned in a commercial
kitchen but IMHO the exact location that a commercial kitchen operator used is
not of vital importance as the person that would be doing the sterilization
would be same)

For those interested in exact botulism statistics (2002) here's the info I
found doing a little digging right on the CDC.gov website!!

Very reassuring to see the stats.

You'll note that the majority of cases have been in Alaska and California
(interesting)

Technical Information
http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dbmd/disea...botulism_t.htm

Additional Information (most useful)
http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dbmd/disea..._CSTE_2002.pdf

Enjoy


"Jason" > wrote in message
...
> For anyone interested. I just found a technical document published by the
> CDC regarding all types of Botulism, including food borne botulism. This
> eased my concerns and answered my questions regarding botulism
> intoxication.
>
> http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/dbmd/diseaseinfo/botulism.pdf
>
>
> "rogers news" > wrote in message
> ...
>> I've been doing a lot of reading about home canning and come across
>> Botulism quite a few times in my readings.
>>
>> The thought of it is scary, but at the same time I look at it as being
>> like the lottery. There have been a reported 110 cases of botulism in the
>> US last year. Only 25% of those were attributed to food borne botulism,
>> the rest being infant and infection botulism.
>>
>> That amounts to about 25 incidents. How many resulted in death I do not
>> know. How many of those resulted from commercially packed food products I
>> do not know.
>>
>> It would seem that your odds of winning the lottery are better.
>>
>> Any had any personal experiences with botulism and canned products,
>> commercial or homecanned? I would like to hear your stories.
>>
>> I take it that there is so many warning signs about botulism to make red
>> flags go off in your head just to make you extra aware about what it is
>> and how to prevent it. Otherwise it would simply be overlooked. Not the
>> case that it is so commen that they dont want you to do home canning at
>> all.
>>
>> Like others have said, people have been doing home canning for centuries,
>> and the methods back then are less stringent than they are nowadays.
>>
>> I'd love to hear your general feedback as well
>>
>> Jason
>>
>
>