Quiche Again
 

On Mon, 5 Apr 2021 17:07:38 -0600, Graham > wrote:

>On 2021-04-05 2:51 p.m., S Viemeister wrote:
>> On 05/04/2021 21:47, Dave Smith wrote:
>>> On 2021-04-05 2:25 p.m., S Viemeister wrote:
>>>> On 05/04/2021 16:14, Lucretia Borgia wrote:
>>>>> I make my own, effortless with a food processor and make double what I
>>>>> need.* Put half away in freezer for next time.
>>>>>
>>>> As do I. The food processor method works really well.
>>>>
>>> You just have to be careful not to process it too long. Pastry is
>>> better when there are little chunks of shortening in it rather than
>>> having it completely pulverized. You need the chunks in there to
>>> expand and steam to make the pastry flaky.
>>
>> Yes. I add the fat in two batches. First the lard, then the butter. That
>> way, the lard has smaller particles, and the butter (which contains
>> water) has pea-sized lumps. It works well.
>
>I'll have to try that. I have always added them together.

Me too.

Quiche Again
 

On 2021 Apr 3, , GM wrote
(in >):

> She's not a real man so she can eat quiche...

I read the book. It was in paperback, so it´s not in my library. I just
looked.

leo

Quiche Again
 

On 2021 Apr 4, , jmcquown wrote
(in article >):

> Marshmallows never ever played a part in anything in "cooking" in my
> life. When I was a kid we'd sometimes toast marshmallows on sticks over
> a fire. I don't think it ever occurred to anyone in my family to put
> mini-marshmallows on what I'm guessing is a pumpkin pie.

While it´s not "cooking", ambrosia wouldn´t be the same without
them.

leo

Quiche Again
 

On 2021 Apr 4, , Lucretia Borgia wrote
(in >):

> Yes, used to make it with fruit for my kids when little but it was the
> veggie jello salads that made us want to puke :)

I never cared for the lime jello/cottage cheese blend. In fact, it was so bad
that I still remember it.

Quiche Again
 

On 2021-04-05 6:42 p.m., wrote:
> On Monday, April 5, 2021 at 3:19:47 PM UTC-5, Dave Smith wrote:
>>
>> On 2021-04-05 1:13 p.m., wrote:
thickness.
>>>
>> Pshaw. I am dextrous enough to be able to change the angle without
>> having to turn the dough around. Alton's show is interesting, but he is
>> just too damned anal about too many things. It can't be much fun to cook
>> the way he does.
>>
> Go to the 19:15 time mark view until the 19:37 time mark and you'll see what
> I was trying to describe what he said not to do. It's a bad video, it looks like
> someone recorded it right off the TV.
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qbshuKu11so
>

I did not doubt that Alton would say and do that. He is like that. He
gave no valid reason for rotating the dough. He just said that if you do
it the way I do you will end up with an amoeba. I don't end up with an
amoeba. Heck, I usually get a better circle than he did with his anal
method.

Quiche Again
 

On 2021-04-05 7:42 p.m., Lucretia Borgia wrote:
> On Mon, 5 Apr 2021 16:43:35 -0400, Dave Smith


>>
>> One of the heritage apples is the snow apple. They are few and far
>> between. We had an apple orchard beside us when we first moved here.
>> The front part was owned by a farmer from down the road and the back
>> part was owned by the Jockey Club. The farmer tended and harvested the
>> trees on the Jockey Club property. In the far corner was one snow apple
>> tree. He never bothered harvesting that one. I sure helped myself to
>> lots of them. They are always better harvested late.
>
> The reason cider is made is because the best cider is made from
> windfalls and on the rotten side even better.
>


They use windfall apples for cider because they are usually not suitable
for market. They gather them up, cut out the bad spots and bruises and
crush them to extract the juices. They also make cider with excess
apples because it is easier to store. Some of it is used for cider vinegar.

Quiche Again
 

On 2021-04-05 8:02 p.m., Leo wrote:
> On 2021 Apr 4, , Lucretia Borgia wrote
> (in >):
>
>> Yes, used to make it with fruit for my kids when little but it was the
>> veggie jello salads that made us want to puke :)
>
> I never cared for the lime jello/cottage cheese blend. In fact, it was so bad
> that I still remember it.
>
>

I liked it.

Quiche Again
 

On Mon, 5 Apr 2021 16:43:35 -0400, Dave Smith
> wrote:

>On 2021-04-05 1:31 p.m., US Janet wrote:
>> On Mon, 5 Apr 2021 11:21:50 -0400, Dave Smith
>
>>>
>>> We have lots of apple orchards around here and I can usually get a wide
>>> range of locally grown varieties. There used to be close to 20 acres of
>>> apple orchard next door to us and the farmer had a variety of apple
>>> types. They all got pruned and sprayed at the same time, but harvest
>>> times were different, so he could deal with one variety at a time. FWIW,
>>> one of the varieties he grew was Mitsui, which were from Japanese stock.
>>
>> When Lucretia said that, something tickled my brain. I faintly
>> remember reading something like that but I don't remember that it was
>> only apples, or apples for the US or varieties of vegetables at the
>> beginning of the last century. Maybe it applies to all.
>> However in the U.S., there is currently a group of men traveling the
>> (West or all U.S.?) traveling the back roads looking for abandoned
>> farms and the like, seeking out forgotten apples. They collect what
>> they find and send them off to be tested for unique DNA. There is
>> another grooup operating out of the East. Thousands of apples have
>> been rediscovered.
>> See Lost Apple Project and Apple Search. At one time there were
>> 17,000 named varieties of apples in the U.S. Now we are down to
>> 4,500.
>> Sorry for getting on a hobby horse. This is just a pet project that I
>> follow. I'm all for broadening our scope of edible foods and
>> protecting them.
>
>You should check out the book The Botany of Desire. The author tells
>about the relationship between humans and plants. Apples are one of the
>major topics in the book. He noted that it is only relatively recently
>that apples became the type of fruit that we think of today. They had
>previously been used as a sweetener in cooking, and were even more
>commonly used to make cider... hard cider. In colder climates the used
>fractional freezing to increase the alcohol content of cider turning it
>into apple jack.
>
>
>One of the heritage apples is the snow apple. They are few and far
>between. We had an apple orchard beside us when we first moved here.
>The front part was owned by a farmer from down the road and the back
>part was owned by the Jockey Club. The farmer tended and harvested the
>trees on the Jockey Club property. In the far corner was one snow apple
>tree. He never bothered harvesting that one. I sure helped myself to
>lots of them. They are always better harvested late.

You mean snow apples are no longer found in the mid-west. That was
the top apple of my childhood. So sweet and juicy and really white
flesh.
Janet US

Quiche Again
 

On 06/04/2021 00:07, Graham wrote:
> On 2021-04-05 2:51 p.m., S Viemeister wrote:
>> On 05/04/2021 21:47, Dave Smith wrote:
>>> On 2021-04-05 2:25 p.m., S Viemeister wrote:
>>>> On 05/04/2021 16:14, Lucretia Borgia wrote:
>>>>> I make my own, effortless with a food processor and make double what I
>>>>> need.Â* Put half away in freezer for next time.
>>>>>
>>>> As do I. The food processor method works really well.
>>>>
>>> You just have to be careful not to process it too long. Pastry is
>>> better when there are little chunks of shortening in it rather than
>>> having it completely pulverized. You need the chunks in there to
>>> expand and steam to make the pastry flaky.
>>
>> Yes. I add the fat in two batches. First the lard, then the butter.
>> That way, the lard has smaller particles, and the butter (which
>> contains water) has pea-sized lumps. It works well.
>
> I'll have to try that. I have always added them together.

I think you'll like the results. Only takes a few seconds longer.

Quiche Again
 

On 05/04/2021 20:46, J. Stewart wrote:
> On Mon, 5 Apr 2021 12:38:37 -0400, Dave Smith
> > wrote:
>
>> On 2021-04-05 12:19 p.m., wrote:
>>> On Monday, April 5, 2021 at 10:54:57 AM UTC-5, Dave Smith wrote:
>>>>
>>>> We will give you full marks for honesty ;-)
>>>>
>>> Thank you, thank you (takes a small bow in gratitude). You know it's always
>>> been said "honesty is the best policy" and it's true.
>>>
>> It is an especially good policy to follow in a group where there are a
>> few people who are quick to call you liars. As I have said in the past,
>> there are some people lie so often that they assume that everyone else
>> does too. I was accused of lying here a couple weeks ago when I posted
>> about Ohfeelme emailing me. She was upset and call me a liar, but
>> everyone with a mail reader was able to view the source of the post and
>> see that it had been sent to me and to the group.
>
> You were too dumb to realise that a) they were not intentionally sent
> emails, but automated copies of newsgroup posts and that b) she wasn't
> doing it on purpose.
>
> So I wouldn't be too proud of the drama that you made of this.
>


====

Thank you.

Quiche Again
 

On Monday, April 5, 2021 at 4:19:47 PM UTC-4, Dave Smith wrote:
> Alton's show is interesting, but he is
> just too damned anal about too many things. It can't be much fun to cook
> the way he does.

Everybody approaches cooking differently. For example, I don't have the
patience to make stuff like individual canapes, but a lot of people enjoy
that sort of thing.

Cindy Hamilton

Quiche Again
 

In article >,
says...
>
> On 2021-04-05 7:42 p.m., Lucretia Borgia wrote:
> > On Mon, 5 Apr 2021 16:43:35 -0400, Dave Smith
>
>
> >>
> >> One of the heritage apples is the snow apple. They are few and far
> >> between. We had an apple orchard beside us when we first moved here.
> >> The front part was owned by a farmer from down the road and the back
> >> part was owned by the Jockey Club. The farmer tended and harvested the
> >> trees on the Jockey Club property. In the far corner was one snow apple
> >> tree. He never bothered harvesting that one. I sure helped myself to
> >> lots of them. They are always better harvested late.
> >
> > The reason cider is made is because the best cider is made from
> > windfalls and on the rotten side even better.
> >
>
>
> They use windfall apples for cider because they are usually not suitable
> for market. They gather them up, cut out the bad spots and bruises and
> crush them to extract the juices. They also make cider with excess
> apples because it is easier to store. Some of it is used for cider vinegar.


You are confusing hard cider (a fermented alcoholic drink) with
non-alcoholic apple juice. North Americans call non-alcoholic apple
juice "apple cider". In UK and Europe, cider always means the
alcoholic drink made from fermented cider apples.

Cider apples are grown purely for making alcohol cider, they are
far too sour and acid for any other purpose.

https://www.utne.com/arts/history-of...g-ze0z1306zpit

Janet UK

Quiche Again
 

Graham wrote:
> Since I use pastry flour rather than AP, which here is a decent bread
> flour, I can leave out the fridge time.
> Iuse butter and/or lard NEVER Crisco.

Just curious about why never. My mom always used Crisco but I've never
so far. I was thinking about using that for a pie crust rather than oil.

Quiche Again
 

On Tuesday, April 6, 2021 at 7:18:04 AM UTC-4, Janet wrote:
> In article >,
> says...
> >
> > On 2021-04-05 7:42 p.m., Lucretia Borgia wrote:
> > > On Mon, 5 Apr 2021 16:43:35 -0400, Dave Smith
> >
> >
> > >>
> > >> One of the heritage apples is the snow apple. They are few and far
> > >> between. We had an apple orchard beside us when we first moved here.
> > >> The front part was owned by a farmer from down the road and the back
> > >> part was owned by the Jockey Club. The farmer tended and harvested the
> > >> trees on the Jockey Club property. In the far corner was one snow apple
> > >> tree. He never bothered harvesting that one. I sure helped myself to
> > >> lots of them. They are always better harvested late.
> > >
> > > The reason cider is made is because the best cider is made from
> > > windfalls and on the rotten side even better.
> > >
> >
> >
> > They use windfall apples for cider because they are usually not suitable
> > for market. They gather them up, cut out the bad spots and bruises and
> > crush them to extract the juices. They also make cider with excess
> > apples because it is easier to store. Some of it is used for cider vinegar.
> You are confusing hard cider (a fermented alcoholic drink) with
> non-alcoholic apple juice. North Americans call non-alcoholic apple
> juice "apple cider".

Close. We generally call unfiltered, raw, apple juice "cider":

<https://www.kingsoopers.com/p/kroger-sweet-delicious-apple-cider/0001111048625>

If it's been filtered and bottled so it's shelf stable, it's usually called "apple juice":

<https://www.amazon.com/Motts-100-Juice-Original-Apple/dp/B00N4QEK4Y/ref=asc_df_B00N4QEK4Y/>

There are exceptions, of course. I've seen filtered, shelf-stable stuff labeled "cider".
At least here in Michigan, they've started pasteurizing cider (to prevent E. coli
infections), although it's not cooked as hard as apple juice.

Cindy Hamilton

Quiche Again
 

On Tuesday, April 6, 2021 at 7:25:40 AM UTC-4, Gary wrote:
> Graham wrote:
> > Since I use pastry flour rather than AP, which here is a decent bread
> > flour, I can leave out the fridge time.
> > Iuse butter and/or lard NEVER Crisco.
>
> Just curious about why never. My mom always used Crisco but I've never
> so far. I was thinking about using that for a pie crust rather than oil.

Because butter and lard taste better. And butter gives a particularly flaky
result because of the water in it.

Cindy Hamilton

Quiche Again
 

On Tue, 6 Apr 2021 05:43:16 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> wrote:

>On Tuesday, April 6, 2021 at 7:18:04 AM UTC-4, Janet wrote:
>> In article >,
>> says...
>> >
>> > On 2021-04-05 7:42 p.m., Lucretia Borgia wrote:
>> > > On Mon, 5 Apr 2021 16:43:35 -0400, Dave Smith
>> >
>> >
>> > >>
>> > >> One of the heritage apples is the snow apple. They are few and far
>> > >> between. We had an apple orchard beside us when we first moved here.
>> > >> The front part was owned by a farmer from down the road and the back
>> > >> part was owned by the Jockey Club. The farmer tended and harvested the
>> > >> trees on the Jockey Club property. In the far corner was one snow apple
>> > >> tree. He never bothered harvesting that one. I sure helped myself to
>> > >> lots of them. They are always better harvested late.
>> > >
>> > > The reason cider is made is because the best cider is made from
>> > > windfalls and on the rotten side even better.
>> > >
>> >
>> >
>> > They use windfall apples for cider because they are usually not suitable
>> > for market. They gather them up, cut out the bad spots and bruises and
>> > crush them to extract the juices. They also make cider with excess
>> > apples because it is easier to store. Some of it is used for cider vinegar.
>> You are confusing hard cider (a fermented alcoholic drink) with
>> non-alcoholic apple juice. North Americans call non-alcoholic apple
>> juice "apple cider".
>
>Close. We generally call unfiltered, raw, apple juice "cider":
>
><https://www.kingsoopers.com/p/kroger-sweet-delicious-apple-cider/0001111048625>
>
>If it's been filtered and bottled so it's shelf stable, it's usually called "apple juice":
>
><https://www.amazon.com/Motts-100-Juice-Original-Apple/dp/B00N4QEK4Y/ref=asc_df_B00N4QEK4Y/>
>
>There are exceptions, of course. I've seen filtered, shelf-stable stuff labeled "cider".
>At least here in Michigan, they've started pasteurizing cider (to prevent E. coli
>infections), although it's not cooked as hard as apple juice.
>
>Cindy Hamilton

Cider is always alcohol to me, anything else is plain old apple juice
that I don't care for very much. My favourite cider is
https://www.noboatscider.com/ really good.

Quiche Again
 

On 4/6/2021 4:44 AM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
> On Monday, April 5, 2021 at 4:19:47 PM UTC-4, Dave Smith wrote:
>> Alton's show is interesting, but he is
>> just too damned anal about too many things. It can't be much fun to cook
>> the way he does.
>
> Everybody approaches cooking differently. For example, I don't have the
> patience to make stuff like individual canapes, but a lot of people enjoy
> that sort of thing.
>
> Cindy Hamilton
>

Well, that changes thing. I was going to stop by your house Saturday
but if I'm not getting hand made canapes, why bother.

Sorry, but I have an image to maintain.

Quiche Again
 

On 2021-04-06 4:44 a.m., Cindy Hamilton wrote:
> On Monday, April 5, 2021 at 4:19:47 PM UTC-4, Dave Smith wrote:
>> Alton's show is interesting, but he is
>> just too damned anal about too many things. It can't be much fun to cook
>> the way he does.
>
> Everybody approaches cooking differently. For example, I don't have the
> patience to make stuff like individual canapes, but a lot of people enjoy
> that sort of thing.
>


I limit my canape making to cream cheese and smoked salmon and dark
bread. I found devilled eggs to be a real PITA because of all the
fiddly work, peeling the eggs, slicing them without breaking the skinny
edge, spooning out the yolks and then piping the salad back into the
whites and then having to arrange them so they don't slide all over. I
think that is why I was so irked by the BN pigging out on them at a
family party here. She shoved those things into her maw faster than it
took me to make them.

Quiche Again
 

On 4/4/2021 7:31 PM, wrote:
> On Sunday, April 4, 2021 at 8:37:56 PM UTC-5, US Janet wrote:
>>
>> On Sun, 4 Apr 2021 16:35:40 -0700 (PDT), "
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> On Sunday, April 4, 2021 at 8:53:41 AM UTC-5, gary wrote:
>>>>>
>>>> It's a store made crust. Jill can't be bothered to make her own. She's a
>>>> half-ass cook.
>>>>
>>> So are all of mine, whether for a pie or a pot pie; they're all store-bought.
>>> I guess that makes me a half-assed cook, too.
>>>
>> me too
>> Janet US
>>
> You reckon if we stand side by side or even if we were to cook in the same
> kitchen we'd be full asses???
>
> :o))
>


I think you are each giving yourselves too much (or too little?) credit.

Quiche Again
 

On 2021-04-06 7:18 a.m., Janet wrote:
> In article >,

>>> The reason cider is made is because the best cider is made from
>>> windfalls and on the rotten side even better.
>>>
>>
>>
>> They use windfall apples for cider because they are usually not suitable
>> for market. They gather them up, cut out the bad spots and bruises and
>> crush them to extract the juices. They also make cider with excess
>> apples because it is easier to store. Some of it is used for cider vinegar.
>
>
> You are confusing hard cider (a fermented alcoholic drink) with
> non-alcoholic apple juice. North Americans call non-alcoholic apple
> juice "apple cider". In UK and Europe, cider always means the
> alcoholic drink made from fermented cider apples.
>
> Cider apples are grown purely for making alcohol cider, they are
> far too sour and acid for any other purpose.
>
> https://www.utne.com/arts/history-of...g-ze0z1306zpit
>

Are you disputing me or Lucretia?
I know a few apple farmers. In fact I used to work with one. One day he
was quite upset with another guy I knew because he had hired him to help
with the harvest. The guy was driving the tractor hauling the bins of
apples up to the barn and storage unit. He had been told which route to
take but ignored that and was driving up and down the rows from which
the windfalls had not been picked up. He used the windfalls for
cider..... because he could not sell them at his stand.

FWIW, hard cider has always been available here and is starting to
become more popular here.

Quiche Again
 

On 2021-04-06 7:25 a.m., Gary wrote:
> Graham wrote:
>> Since I use pastry flour rather than AP, which here is a decent bread
>> flour, I can leave out the fridge time.
>> Iuse butter and/or lard NEVER Crisco.
>
> Just curious about why never. My mom always used Crisco but I've never
> so far. I was thinking about using that for a pie crust rather than oil.
>
>

I usually use Crisco and I get excellent results.

Quiche Again
 

On 2021-04-06 9:06 a.m., Lucretia Borgia wrote:
> On Tue, 6 Apr 2021 05:43:16 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> > wrote:

>> There are exceptions, of course. I've seen filtered, shelf-stable stuff labeled "cider".
>> At least here in Michigan, they've started pasteurizing cider (to prevent E. coli
>> infections), although it's not cooked as hard as apple juice.
>>
>> Cindy Hamilton
>
> Cider is always alcohol to me, anything else is plain old apple juice
> that I don't care for very much. My favourite cider is
> https://www.noboatscider.com/ really good.
>


I rarely drink the alcoholic cider. I used to drink sweet cider only
occasionally, but this year I developed a real taste for it. There are
several local prodcuce stands that sell locally made cider and this
year's product is way tastier than usual.

Quiche Again
 

On 2021-04-06 9:41 a.m., Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> On 4/6/2021 4:44 AM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
>> On Monday, April 5, 2021 at 4:19:47 PM UTC-4, Dave Smith wrote:
>>> Alton's show is interesting, but he is
>>> just too damned anal about too many things. It can't be much fun to cook
>>> the way he does.
>>
>> Everybody approaches cooking differently.Â* For example, I don't have the
>> patience to make stuff like individual canapes, but a lot of people enjoy
>> that sort of thing.
>>
>> Cindy Hamilton
>>
>
> Well, that changes thing.Â* I was going to stop by your house Saturday
> but if I'm not getting hand made canapes, why bother.
>
> Sorry, but I have an image to maintain.



How about a 5 layer bean dip and a bowl of nacho chips. You can slap one
of those together faster than you can devil one egg.

Quiche Again
 

On Tue, 6 Apr 2021 10:05:17 -0400, Dave Smith
> wrote:

>On 2021-04-06 9:06 a.m., Lucretia Borgia wrote:
>> On Tue, 6 Apr 2021 05:43:16 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
>> > wrote:
>
>>> There are exceptions, of course. I've seen filtered, shelf-stable stuff labeled "cider".
>>> At least here in Michigan, they've started pasteurizing cider (to prevent E. coli
>>> infections), although it's not cooked as hard as apple juice.
>>>
>>> Cindy Hamilton
>>
>> Cider is always alcohol to me, anything else is plain old apple juice
>> that I don't care for very much. My favourite cider is
>> https://www.noboatscider.com/ really good.
>>
>
>
>I rarely drink the alcoholic cider. I used to drink sweet cider only
>occasionally, but this year I developed a real taste for it. There are
>several local prodcuce stands that sell locally made cider and this
>year's product is way tastier than usual.

'Sweet cider' is I presume apple juice.

Quiche Again
 

On 2021-04-06 10:17 a.m., Lucretia Borgia wrote:
>
> On Tue, 6 Apr 2021 10:05:17 -0400, Dave Smith

>>
>> I rarely drink the alcoholic cider. I used to drink sweet cider only
>> occasionally, but this year I developed a real taste for it. There are
>> several local prodcuce stands that sell locally made cider and this
>> year's product is way tastier than usual.
>
> 'Sweet cider' is I presume apple juice.
>

It is cider that has not fermented.

Quiche Again
 

On 2021-04-06 8:20 a.m., Dave Smith wrote:
> On 2021-04-06 10:17 a.m., Lucretia Borgia wrote:
>>
>> On Tue, 6 Apr 2021 10:05:17 -0400, Dave Smith
>
>>>
>>> I rarely drink the alcoholic cider. I used to drink sweet cider only
>>> occasionally, but this year I developed a real taste for it.Â* There are
>>> several local prodcuce stands that sell locally made cider and this
>>> year's product is way tastier than usual.
>>
>> 'Sweet cider' is I presume apple juice.
>>
>
> It is cider that has not fermented.
Then it isn't cider/cyder.

Quiche Again
 

On 2021-04-06 5:25 a.m., Gary wrote:
> Graham wrote:
>> Since I use pastry flour rather than AP, which here is a decent bread
>> flour, I can leave out the fridge time.
>> Iuse butter and/or lard NEVER Crisco.
>
> Just curious about why never. My mom always used Crisco but I've never
> so far. I was thinking about using that for a pie crust rather than oil.
>
>
>
>
Why not use crisco? I might as well buy ready made pastry. Screw that!

Quiche Again
 

On Tuesday, April 6, 2021 at 10:25:38 AM UTC-4, Graham wrote:
> On 2021-04-06 8:20 a.m., Dave Smith wrote:
> > On 2021-04-06 10:17 a.m., Lucretia Borgia wrote:
> >>
> >> On Tue, 6 Apr 2021 10:05:17 -0400, Dave Smith
> >
> >>>
> >>> I rarely drink the alcoholic cider. I used to drink sweet cider only
> >>> occasionally, but this year I developed a real taste for it. There are
> >>> several local prodcuce stands that sell locally made cider and this
> >>> year's product is way tastier than usual.
> >>
> >> 'Sweet cider' is I presume apple juice.
> >>
> >
> > It is cider that has not fermented.
> Then it isn't cider/cyder.

Dogmatic much?

Consider the effect of the Temperance movement on American
drinking habits.

Cindy Hamilton

Quiche Again
 

On 2021-04-06 7:06 a.m., Lucretia Borgia wrote:
> On Tue, 6 Apr 2021 05:43:16 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> > wrote:
>
>> On Tuesday, April 6, 2021 at 7:18:04 AM UTC-4, Janet wrote:
>>> In article >,
>>> says...
>>>>
>>>> On 2021-04-05 7:42 p.m., Lucretia Borgia wrote:
>>>>> On Mon, 5 Apr 2021 16:43:35 -0400, Dave Smith
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> One of the heritage apples is the snow apple. They are few and far
>>>>>> between. We had an apple orchard beside us when we first moved here.
>>>>>> The front part was owned by a farmer from down the road and the back
>>>>>> part was owned by the Jockey Club. The farmer tended and harvested the
>>>>>> trees on the Jockey Club property. In the far corner was one snow apple
>>>>>> tree. He never bothered harvesting that one. I sure helped myself to
>>>>>> lots of them. They are always better harvested late.
>>>>>
>>>>> The reason cider is made is because the best cider is made from
>>>>> windfalls and on the rotten side even better.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> They use windfall apples for cider because they are usually not suitable
>>>> for market. They gather them up, cut out the bad spots and bruises and
>>>> crush them to extract the juices. They also make cider with excess
>>>> apples because it is easier to store. Some of it is used for cider vinegar.
>>> You are confusing hard cider (a fermented alcoholic drink) with
>>> non-alcoholic apple juice. North Americans call non-alcoholic apple
>>> juice "apple cider".
>>
>> Close. We generally call unfiltered, raw, apple juice "cider":
>>
>> <https://www.kingsoopers.com/p/kroger-sweet-delicious-apple-cider/0001111048625>
>>
>> If it's been filtered and bottled so it's shelf stable, it's usually called "apple juice":
>>
>> <https://www.amazon.com/Motts-100-Juice-Original-Apple/dp/B00N4QEK4Y/ref=asc_df_B00N4QEK4Y/>
>>
>> There are exceptions, of course. I've seen filtered, shelf-stable stuff labeled "cider".
>> At least here in Michigan, they've started pasteurizing cider (to prevent E. coli
>> infections), although it's not cooked as hard as apple juice.
>>
>> Cindy Hamilton
>
> Cider is always alcohol to me, anything else is plain old apple juice
> that I don't care for very much. My favourite cider is
> https://www.noboatscider.com/ really good.
>
Mine is: https://www.aspall.co.uk/
Aspall is a hamlet neighbouring my home village.
As a teen, I used walk there with a friend to buy their cyder for 1s8d
per quart! Mr Ship was in charge of the cyder house and made you taste
the 3 varieties they made back then. After the 3rd he would suggest
re-trying #1, then #2. Of course he was trying to get us ****ed! The
stuff was strong.
John Guild, whose mother was the last of the Chevalliers, greatly
expanded the company when he retired from the RN - he was a Lt on the
Royal Yacht. His sons hyphenate the name now.

Quiche Again
 

On 4/6/2021 10:43 AM, Graham wrote:
> Aspall is a hamlet neighbouring my home village.
>
It should be *asshole* if *you* have anything
to do with it.
--
The real Bruce is an Aussie wankstain

Quiche Again
 

On 06/04/2021 13:44, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
> On Tuesday, April 6, 2021 at 7:25:40 AM UTC-4, Gary wrote:
>> Graham wrote:
>>> Since I use pastry flour rather than AP, which here is a decent bread
>>> flour, I can leave out the fridge time.
>>> I use butter and/or lard NEVER Crisco.
>>
>> Just curious about why never. My mom always used Crisco but I've never
>> so far. I was thinking about using that for a pie crust rather than oil.
>
> Because butter and lard taste better. And butter gives a particularly flaky
> result because of the water in it.
>
Yes.

Quiche Again
 

On 06/04/2021 15:28, Graham wrote:
> On 2021-04-06 5:25 a.m., Gary wrote:
>> Graham wrote:
>>> Since I use pastry flour rather than AP, which here is a decent bread
>>> flour, I can leave out the fridge time.
>>> Iuse butter and/or lard NEVER Crisco.
>>
>> Just curious about why never. My mom always used Crisco but I've never
>> so far. I was thinking about using that for a pie crust rather than oil.
>>
>>
>>
>>
> Why not use crisco? I might as well buy ready made pastry. Screw that!

Indeed.

Quiche Again
 

On 4/6/2021 10:25 AM, Graham wrote:
> On 2021-04-06 8:20 a.m., Dave Smith wrote:
>> On 2021-04-06 10:17 a.m., Lucretia Borgia wrote:
>>>
>>> On Tue, 6 Apr 2021 10:05:17 -0400, Dave Smith
>>
>>>>
>>>> I rarely drink the alcoholic cider. I used to drink sweet cider only
>>>> occasionally, but this year I developed a real taste for it.Â* There are
>>>> several local prodcuce stands that sell locally made cider and this
>>>> year's product is way tastier than usual.
>>>
>>> 'Sweet cider' is I presume apple juice.
>>>
>>
>> It is cider that has not fermented.
> Then it isn't cider/cyder.

It is in the US. Many gallons of it sold every year.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cider_..._United_States

In the United States, the definition of cider is usually more broad than
in Europe. There are two types: one being the traditional fermented
product, called hard cider, and the second sweet or soft cider. However,
in some regions, cider is the alcoholic version, whether made from
apples or pears, and apple cider is the non-alcoholic version.

Quiche Again
 

On 2021-04-06 10:25 a.m., Graham wrote:
> On 2021-04-06 8:20 a.m., Dave Smith wrote:
>> On 2021-04-06 10:17 a.m., Lucretia Borgia wrote:
>>>
>>> On Tue, 6 Apr 2021 10:05:17 -0400, Dave Smith
>>
>>>>
>>>> I rarely drink the alcoholic cider. I used to drink sweet cider only
>>>> occasionally, but this year I developed a real taste for it.Â* There are
>>>> several local prodcuce stands that sell locally made cider and this
>>>> year's product is way tastier than usual.
>>>
>>> 'Sweet cider' is I presume apple juice.
>>>
>>
>> It is cider that has not fermented.
> Then it isn't cider/cyder.

Wikipedia says :
Apple cider (also called sweet cider or soft cider or simply cider) is
the name used in the United States and Canada for an unfiltered,
unsweetened, non-alcoholic beverage made from apples. Though typically
referred to simply as "cider" in the United States, it is not to be
confused with the alcoholic beverage known as cider in other places,
which is called "hard cider" in the US.

Quiche Again
 

On Tue, 6 Apr 2021 08:25:31 -0600, Graham > wrote:

>On 2021-04-06 8:20 a.m., Dave Smith wrote:
>> On 2021-04-06 10:17 a.m., Lucretia Borgia wrote:
>>>
>>> On Tue, 6 Apr 2021 10:05:17 -0400, Dave Smith
>>
>>>>
>>>> I rarely drink the alcoholic cider. I used to drink sweet cider only
>>>> occasionally, but this year I developed a real taste for it.* There are
>>>> several local prodcuce stands that sell locally made cider and this
>>>> year's product is way tastier than usual.
>>>
>>> 'Sweet cider' is I presume apple juice.
>>>
>>
>> It is cider that has not fermented.
>Then it isn't cider/cyder.

Quite, it's apple juice lol

Quiche Again
 

On Tue, 6 Apr 2021 08:28:48 -0600, Graham > wrote:

>On 2021-04-06 5:25 a.m., Gary wrote:
>> Graham wrote:
>>> Since I use pastry flour rather than AP, which here is a decent bread
>>> flour, I can leave out the fridge time.
>>> Iuse butter and/or lard NEVER Crisco.
>>
>> Just curious about why never. My mom always used Crisco but I've never
>> so far. I was thinking about using that for a pie crust rather than oil.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>Why not use crisco? I might as well buy ready made pastry. Screw that!

Quite, I use Tenderflake (pure lard) and butter, works beautifully,
tastes great. I will try the adding butter last touch though, makes
sense.

Quiche Again
 

On 4/6/2021 4:14 AM, Ophelia wrote:
> On 05/04/2021 20:46, J. Stewart wrote:
>> On Mon, 5 Apr 2021 12:38:37 -0400, Dave Smith
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> On 2021-04-05 12:19 p.m., wrote:
>>>> On Monday, April 5, 2021 at 10:54:57 AM UTC-5, Dave Smith wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> We will give you full marks for honesty ;-)
>>>>>
>>>> Thank you, thank you (takes a small bow in gratitude).Â* You know
>>>> it's always
>>>> been said "honesty is the best policy" and it's true.
>>>>
>>> It is an especially good policy to follow in a group where there are a
>>> few people who are quick to call you liars. As I have said in the past,
>>> there are some people lie so often that they assume that everyone else
>>> does too.Â* I was accused of lying here a couple weeks ago when I posted
>>> about Ohfeelme emailing me. She was upset and call me a liar, but
>>> everyone with a mail reader was able to view the source of the post and
>>> see that it had been sent to me and to the group.
>>
>> You were too dumb to realise that a) they were not intentionally sent
>> emails, but automated copies of newsgroup posts and that b) she wasn't
>> doing it on purpose.
>>
>> So I wouldn't be too proud of the drama that you made of this.
>>
>
>
> ====
>
> Thank you.
>
Why didn't you ever apologize to Dave Smith for calling
him a liar?

Quiche Again
 

On Tue, 6 Apr 2021 08:43:03 -0600, Graham > wrote:

>On 2021-04-06 7:06 a.m., Lucretia Borgia wrote:
>> On Tue, 6 Apr 2021 05:43:16 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> On Tuesday, April 6, 2021 at 7:18:04 AM UTC-4, Janet wrote:
>>>> In article >,
>>>> says...
>>>>>
>>>>> On 2021-04-05 7:42 p.m., Lucretia Borgia wrote:
>>>>>> On Mon, 5 Apr 2021 16:43:35 -0400, Dave Smith
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> One of the heritage apples is the snow apple. They are few and far
>>>>>>> between. We had an apple orchard beside us when we first moved here.
>>>>>>> The front part was owned by a farmer from down the road and the back
>>>>>>> part was owned by the Jockey Club. The farmer tended and harvested the
>>>>>>> trees on the Jockey Club property. In the far corner was one snow apple
>>>>>>> tree. He never bothered harvesting that one. I sure helped myself to
>>>>>>> lots of them. They are always better harvested late.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The reason cider is made is because the best cider is made from
>>>>>> windfalls and on the rotten side even better.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> They use windfall apples for cider because they are usually not suitable
>>>>> for market. They gather them up, cut out the bad spots and bruises and
>>>>> crush them to extract the juices. They also make cider with excess
>>>>> apples because it is easier to store. Some of it is used for cider vinegar.
>>>> You are confusing hard cider (a fermented alcoholic drink) with
>>>> non-alcoholic apple juice. North Americans call non-alcoholic apple
>>>> juice "apple cider".
>>>
>>> Close. We generally call unfiltered, raw, apple juice "cider":
>>>
>>> <https://www.kingsoopers.com/p/kroger-sweet-delicious-apple-cider/0001111048625>
>>>
>>> If it's been filtered and bottled so it's shelf stable, it's usually called "apple juice":
>>>
>>> <https://www.amazon.com/Motts-100-Juice-Original-Apple/dp/B00N4QEK4Y/ref=asc_df_B00N4QEK4Y/>
>>>
>>> There are exceptions, of course. I've seen filtered, shelf-stable stuff labeled "cider".
>>> At least here in Michigan, they've started pasteurizing cider (to prevent E. coli
>>> infections), although it's not cooked as hard as apple juice.
>>>
>>> Cindy Hamilton
>>
>> Cider is always alcohol to me, anything else is plain old apple juice
>> that I don't care for very much. My favourite cider is
>> https://www.noboatscider.com/ really good.
>>
>Mine is: https://www.aspall.co.uk/
>Aspall is a hamlet neighbouring my home village.
>As a teen, I used walk there with a friend to buy their cyder for 1s8d
>per quart! Mr Ship was in charge of the cyder house and made you taste
>the 3 varieties they made back then. After the 3rd he would suggest
>re-trying #1, then #2. Of course he was trying to get us ****ed!

Nice guy!
The
>stuff was strong.
>John Guild, whose mother was the last of the Chevalliers, greatly
>expanded the company when he retired from the RN - he was a Lt on the
>Royal Yacht. His sons hyphenate the name now.

Might have met him, often did cocktail parties on the Royal Yacht.

Quiche Again
 

On Tuesday, April 6, 2021 at 1:25:40 AM UTC-10, Gary wrote:
> Graham wrote:
> > Since I use pastry flour rather than AP, which here is a decent bread
> > flour, I can leave out the fridge time.
> > Iuse butter and/or lard NEVER Crisco.
>
> Just curious about why never. My mom always used Crisco but I've never
> so far. I was thinking about using that for a pie crust rather than oil.

I have a pound of lard in the refrigerator. I'd try it but the idea of using pig fat in a pie is kind of repulsive to me. Back when I was growing up, vegetable oils were the healthy, cheaper, fats of choice. These days, most Americans are not real keen with cooking with animal fats. I expect this tread to continue. My guess is that in a future with no animal farming, pig fat will be worth it's weight in copper. OTOH, hydrogenated cottonseed oil works just fine in pie crust.

https://photos.app.goo.gl/8yE6EJAGV1G9G5Fx7

Quiche Again
 

On Tuesday, April 6, 2021 at 10:39:51 AM UTC-5, Lucretia Borgia wrote:
>
> On Tue, 6 Apr 2021 08:25:31 -0600, Graham > wrote:
>
> >On 2021-04-06 8:20 a.m., Dave Smith wrote:
> >>
> >> It is cider that has not fermented.
> >>
> >Then it isn't cider/cyder.
> >
> Quite, it's apple juice lol
>
Apple juice, cider, and hard cider all have distinctively different tastes.