A little off-topic I guess, but before everyone gets too busy preparing for
and anticipating "The Big Day", I'd like to ask all to please remember the
men and women who are serving in the military, when you give thanks for all
of the blessings you have. Regardless of politics and politicians. These
men and women are there for all of us, around the country and around the
world and many of them won't be able to be with their families during the
holiday season. Our son is a Seabee in the U.S. Navy and is preparing to go
to Iraq after the New Year. Please remember all of our service members.
Thanks and I hope everyone has a great T-Day!

No offense to non-U.S. readers, I know Thursday is just another Thursday to
you! :-)

Well said! I have a friend in Iraq and another waiting for it. We need
to be thankful to them.

Kris


Green Mtn. Griller wrote:
> A little off-topic I guess, but before everyone gets too busy preparing for
> and anticipating "The Big Day", I'd like to ask all to please remember the
> men and women who are serving in the military, when you give thanks for all
> of the blessings you have. Regardless of politics and politicians. These
> men and women are there for all of us, around the country and around the
> world and many of them won't be able to be with their families during the
> holiday season. Our son is a Seabee in the U.S. Navy and is preparing to go
> to Iraq after the New Year. Please remember all of our service members.
> Thanks and I hope everyone has a great T-Day!
>
> No offense to non-U.S. readers, I know Thursday is just another Thursday to
> you! :-)

"Green Mtn. Griller" > wrote in message
news:l2O8h.5683$7a2.3141@trndny06...

> Our son is a Seabee in the U.S. Navy and is preparing to go to Iraq after
> the New Year.

Good. You have 5-6 weeks to stop him, even if it means hiding him with
friends in another country. If you want him killed, be honest and tell him,
and then do it yourself, rather than delegate this awful thing to your
president, who doesn't give a damn about your son, or anyone else's.

In article .com>,
"Kris" > wrote:

> Well said! I have a friend in Iraq and another waiting for it. We need
> to be thankful to them.

If young men and women like your friends would stop volunteering to
fight in Iraq, what would the United States lose? Damned if I know! On
the other hand, if people would stop volunteering to kill or be killed
in Iraq, we would have fewer corpses being shipped to Dover, Delaware
and the United States' VA hospitals would be less crowded.

The war in Iraq is Bush's ego trip and failed oil grab. I see no reason
to thank anyone for enabling Bush to continue his disastrous foreign
policy. The truly patriotic thing for your friends to do is to stay out
of Iraq, get educated, and become productive citizens.

That's just my personal opinion, mind you!

Stan Horwitz wrote:

> In article .com>,
> "Kris" > wrote:
>
>> Well said! I have a friend in Iraq and another waiting for it. We
>> need to be thankful to them.
>
> If young men and women like your friends would stop volunteering to
> fight in Iraq, what would the United States lose? Damned if I know! On
> the other hand, if people would stop volunteering to kill or be killed
> in Iraq, we would have fewer corpses being shipped to Dover, Delaware
> and the United States' VA hospitals would be less crowded.

A backdoor method of blaming the soldiers. **** YOU!!!!

--
Dave
www.davebbq.com

> If young men and women like your friends would stop volunteering to
> fight in Iraq, what would the United States lose? Damned if I know!

Not that this is the appropriate forum for this discussion, but:

They'd just reinstitute the draft and force men to go. There is no
escape. Luckily my husband has been lucky so far.....He's a naval
musician and there's not much need for him over there yet.

"Dave Bugg" > wrote in message
...
> Stan Horwitz wrote:
>
>> In article .com>,
>> "Kris" > wrote:
>>
>>> Well said! I have a friend in Iraq and another waiting for it. We
>>> need to be thankful to them.
>>
>> If young men and women like your friends would stop volunteering to
>> fight in Iraq, what would the United States lose? Damned if I know! On
>> the other hand, if people would stop volunteering to kill or be killed
>> in Iraq, we would have fewer corpses being shipped to Dover, Delaware
>> and the United States' VA hospitals would be less crowded.
>
> A backdoor method of blaming the soldiers. **** YOU!!!!
> Dave
> www.davebbq.com


Ummm....here's another way to look at it: If a few hundred soldiers said
"We're not going, and you can throw us all in jail if you want", that could
be viewed as a form of democracy. In other countries, soldiers take over
governments with violence, so refusing to take part in a broken war would
actually be a mild reaction.

On Tue, 21 Nov 2006 21:39:00 -0800, "Dave Bugg" >
wrote:

>Stan Horwitz wrote:
>
>> In article .com>,
>> "Kris" > wrote:
>>
>>> Well said! I have a friend in Iraq and another waiting for it. We
>>> need to be thankful to them.
>>
>> If young men and women like your friends would stop volunteering to
>> fight in Iraq, what would the United States lose? Damned if I know! On
>> the other hand, if people would stop volunteering to kill or be killed
>> in Iraq, we would have fewer corpses being shipped to Dover, Delaware
>> and the United States' VA hospitals would be less crowded.
>
>A backdoor method of blaming the soldiers. **** YOU!!!!

Unfortunately, being a soldier is sometimes the only viable employment
option left for a young man (or woman) in certain parts of the
country. The US has been bleeding entry level white collar and
manufacturing jobs for years and it's time we recognized it.

Our manufacturing industries are almost non-existent these days (sure
we have small operations here and there, but nothing significant on a
world wide basis). We don't have the clothing, shoe or steel
industries anymore and the auto industry is a huge mess. Lumber is
harvested here, shipped to China for milling and shipped back to sell
for less than lumber that is milled here. They won't do anything
about Detroit because they can farm out their auto operations so
cheaply. I don't know if Detroit can't or won't, but it's not going
to happen. Farmers can grow huge crops, but we still need workers in
the field and where do they come from? We are crashing and burning
because we are expected to be a nation of white collar workers... but
where are those jobs going elsewhere and when the jobs don't leave,
who do they bring in on a temporary basis "because it's an area of
need" (read cheaper labor)?

We've crippled the athletic programs, eliminated most music programs
and all the shop classes from high school, so there is little
incentive for someone disinclined to go on to college to finish high
school anymore. Now, San Francisco has made a move to eliminate ROTC
from high school. We are creating such a chasm between the haves and
the have nots - it's scary.

--
See return address to reply by email

In article >,
Stan Horwitz > wrote:


> If young men and women like your friends would stop volunteering to
> fight in Iraq, what would the United States lose? Damned if I know! On
> the other hand, if people would stop volunteering to kill or be killed
> in Iraq, we would have fewer corpses being shipped to Dover, Delaware
> and the United States' VA hospitals would be less crowded.
>
> The war in Iraq is Bush's ego trip and failed oil grab. I see no reason
> to thank anyone for enabling Bush to continue his disastrous foreign
> policy. The truly patriotic thing for your friends to do is to stay out
> of Iraq, get educated, and become productive citizens.
>
> That's just my personal opinion, mind you!

I don't agree. I worked for the US Army for three years (as a
civilian), and it was very clear that decisions about who to go to war
with are always made by civilians. The people who voluntarily join the
military (or get drafted) are just following orders.

The people of the US elected GWB, and they are to blame for this, not
the soldiers.

--
Dan Abel

Petaluma, California, USA

JoeSpareBedroom wrote:

> Ummm....here's another way to look at it: If a few hundred soldiers
> said "We're not going, and you can throw us all in jail if you want",
> that could be viewed as a form of democracy. In other countries,
> soldiers take over governments with violence, so refusing to take
> part in a broken war would actually be a mild reaction.

Are you always so blatantly ignorant and absurd??? Every time you post
something, it's like you open your own personal sack of stupid and spill the
contents. <Plonk>
--
Dave
www.davebbq.com

"Dave Bugg" > wrote in message
...
> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>
>> Ummm....here's another way to look at it: If a few hundred soldiers
>> said "We're not going, and you can throw us all in jail if you want",
>> that could be viewed as a form of democracy. In other countries,
>> soldiers take over governments with violence, so refusing to take
>> part in a broken war would actually be a mild reaction.
>
> Are you always so blatantly ignorant and absurd??? Every time you post
> something, it's like you open your own personal sack of stupid and spill
> the contents. <Plonk>
> --
> Dave

Me stupid? You can't explain what you object to. Why don't you try that
before throwing stones?

sf wrote:

> Unfortunately, being a soldier is sometimes the only viable employment
> option left for a young man (or woman) in certain parts of the
> country. The US has been bleeding entry level white collar and
> manufacturing jobs for years and it's time we recognized it.

1. While some may choose to join the military because of the employment, it
is a small fraction of the total.
2. If someone wants to join the military for employment, so what? There is
not a damned thing wrong with that. Military service is a noble pursuit.
3. What has this to do with the the reason for my original reply?

--
Dave
www.davebbq.com

> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>
> Ummm....here's another way to look at it: If a few hundred soldiers
> said "We're not going, and you can throw us all in jail if you want",
> that could be viewed as a form of democracy. In other countries,
> soldiers take over governments with violence, so refusing to take
> part in a broken war would actually be a mild reaction.

Here's a side note for those who are just as clueless as this speck of
smegma.
Many a soldier -- including myself -- were approached in airports during
1969 - 1972 by protestors of Vietnam. The goal was to get us to desert.
Usually the tactic would be to use a nice looking hippie babe to engage a
soldier, waiting for a flight, into conversation. Then the conversation
would be joined by one or two other hippie guys. Promises of shangrila on a
commune would be made if we would just leave right then and there and follow
them.

Of course, that tactic wasn't successful. But it lead to a change in tactics
by the protestors. When I got home after my tour, I had to walk a gauntlet
of those maggots as I left Seatac Airport..... all screaming in the most
hateful rage one can imagine. I was easy to spot in my Class A uniform. And
it made a great target for one of 'em; something like a baggie was thrown
and hit me in the leg. It smelled like it had been filled with liquid feces.
Those protestors had no idea whether I had been drafted (yes, the draft
existed then. I had volunteered) or whether I had volunteered. It didn't
matter. We were hated irregardless: the draftee because he wouldn't desert,
and the volunteer because he just wanted to kill women, children and babies.

All but a few soldiers who serve nowadays are proud to have joined the
military to be of service to their country. The idea of deserting or doing
something to disgrace the military, as joesmegma suggests, is profoundly
distasteful to those who serve.

If y'all have frustrations with any politician regarding policy, KEEP YOUR
ANGER AND FRUSTRATION FOCUSED ON THEM. Don't you dare start twisting the
focus onto the soldiers who serve. That's what happened during Vietnam. And
the result was a generation of warriors who felt hated and despised when all
they did was serve their country.

Stan's remarks have a tragic historic ring to them.

--
Dave
www.davebbq.com

One time on Usenet, "Dave Bugg" > said:

<snip>

> If y'all have frustrations with any politician regarding policy, KEEP YOUR
> ANGER AND FRUSTRATION FOCUSED ON THEM. Don't you dare start twisting the
> focus onto the soldiers who serve. That's what happened during Vietnam. And
> the result was a generation of warriors who felt hated and despised when all
> they did was serve their country.

I was small child during the Vietnam war, so let me say now what
I couldn't say back then -- thank you for your service, Dave...

--
"Little Malice" is Jani in WA
~ mom, Trollop, novice cook ~

What an idiot you are. You are the poster boy for reading comprehension
problems. Nobody is blaming the soldiers for the existence of this
particular war, the reasons for which have ALL gone up in smoke, as you
know.

We can write letters to politicians all day long, but they do not listen.
Voting helps a little, but not much. Politicians don't give a **** about
your kids and mine. If they did, they wouldn't have voted almost unanimously
to back your stupid president on this war.

Three things might lead to the prevention of train wrecks like the current
one:

1) Tax strikes

2) Large numbers of soldiers refusing to go

3) Lower the maximum age at which politicians can serve. Why? To eliminate
men who are entering a time of life when their sexuality is fading in
frightening ways. Otherwise, they play these things out by trying to chalk
up other kinds of high-visibility achievments, which get people killed.

4) Raise the minimum age for the military to 21. Perhaps this would lessen
the number of kids who are still very impressionable, and will follow
reckless leaders and their twisted ideas.

5) Bring back the draft, but with an important rule: The moment a war is
imminent, all eligible people in politicians families must enlist within 7
days. If they don't show up, they are hunted down by federal marshalls and
brought to their basic training locations. And, they are assigned to only
the most dangerous jobs. Doesn't matter if they're in college, if they have
families, if they're in wheelchairs - no exemptions for them. Maybe that
would make these assholes in Washington think harder before murdering our
soldiers.

Little Malice wrote:

> I was small child during the Vietnam war, so let me say now what
> I couldn't say back then -- thank you for your service, Dave...

Your Welcome, I appreciate that. It was a long time ago, and has been long
dealt with. I really wasn't expecting anything when I returned. But no one
was expecting hostility and indifference either. I just don't want to see
this kind of history repeat itself.
--
Dave
www.davebbq.com

On Wed, 22 Nov 2006 17:47:55 GMT, unge (Little
Malice) wrote:

>One time on Usenet, "Dave Bugg" > said:
>
><snip>
>
>> If y'all have frustrations with any politician regarding policy, KEEP YOUR
>> ANGER AND FRUSTRATION FOCUSED ON THEM. Don't you dare start twisting the
>> focus onto the soldiers who serve. That's what happened during Vietnam. And
>> the result was a generation of warriors who felt hated and despised when all
>> they did was serve their country.
>
>I was small child during the Vietnam war, so let me say now what
>I couldn't say back then -- thank you for your service, Dave...
You have it exactly right Dave...and Jani beat me to it...Thank you
for your service! Our soldiers deserve our support and thanks.
Sue D.

On Wed, 22 Nov 2006 08:58:12 -0800, "Dave Bugg" >
wrote:

>sf wrote:
>
>> Unfortunately, being a soldier is sometimes the only viable employment
>> option left for a young man (or woman) in certain parts of the
>> country. The US has been bleeding entry level white collar and
>> manufacturing jobs for years and it's time we recognized it.
>
>1. While some may choose to join the military because of the employment, it
>is a small fraction of the total.

Oh? Maybe at the officer level, but not at the grunt level.

>2. If someone wants to join the military for employment, so what? There is
>not a damned thing wrong with that. Military service is a noble pursuit.

Certainly, but I don't advocate it as a default position - especially
in war time.... it has something to do with life, death and permanent
serious injuries.

>3. What has this to do with the the reason for my original reply?

What's wrong with you Dave? It's *not* the soliders' fault we're at
war and I didn't say it was.

--
See return address to reply by email

On Wed, 22 Nov 2006 00:24:00 -0500, Stan Horwitz >
wrote:

>If young men and women like your friends would stop volunteering to
>fight in Iraq, what would the United States lose? Damned if I know! On
>the other hand, if people would stop volunteering to kill or be killed
>in Iraq, we would have fewer corpses being shipped to Dover, Delaware
>and the United States' VA hospitals would be less crowded.

People aren't exactly flooding the military so they can fight in Iraq.
That's why some soldiers are doing their second, third or more tour of
duty over there.

http://www.zogby.com/NEWS/ReadNews.dbm?ID=1075
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14999341/#storyContinued
http://www.latimes.com/news/nationwo...eadlines-world
( http://tinylink.com/?tOoGSHOdIL )

--
See return address to reply by email

In article >,
"Dave Bugg" > wrote:


> Of course, that tactic wasn't successful. But it lead to a change in tactics
> by the protestors. When I got home after my tour, I had to walk a gauntlet
> of those maggots as I left Seatac Airport..... all screaming in the most
> hateful rage one can imagine.

That's horrible.

:-(


> All but a few soldiers who serve nowadays are proud to have joined the
> military to be of service to their country.

I haven't met many who were "proud" to have served during the Vietnam
non-war. They just did their job, for which they didn't get much
appreciation.


> If y'all have frustrations with any politician regarding policy, KEEP YOUR
> ANGER AND FRUSTRATION FOCUSED ON THEM.

Say it again!

--
Dan Abel

Petaluma, California, USA

JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
> "Dave Bugg" wrote:
> > JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
> >
> >> Ummm....here's another way to look at it: If a few hundred soldiers
> >> said "We're not going, and you can throw us all in jail if you want",
> >> that could be viewed as a form of democracy. In other countries,
> >> soldiers take over governments with violence, so refusing to take
> >> part in a broken war would actually be a mild reaction.
> >
> > Are you always so blatantly ignorant and absurd??? Every time you post
> > something, it's like you open your own personal sack of stupid and spill
> > the contents. <Plonk>
>
> Me stupid? You can't explain what you object to. Why don't you try that
> before throwing stones?

What's to explain, even a pea brained imbecile coward such as yourself
deep down inside knows with no doubt whatsoever that those who don't
serve or at least support those who do in a meaningful manner can
always find someone to buy you a one way ticket to some dictatorship
country... LEAVE AND NEVER COME BACK, you ignorant yellowbellied
parasitic mother****er!

Sheldon

sf wrote:

> Oh? Maybe at the officer level, but not at the grunt level.

Well, the GAO reports on the demographics of military recruits completely
disagrees with your statements. Go do a search.

>> 2. If someone wants to join the military for employment, so what?
>> There is not a damned thing wrong with that. Military service is a
>> noble pursuit.
>
> Certainly, but I don't advocate it as a default position - especially
> in war time.... it has something to do with life, death and permanent
> serious injuries.

No one advocates death or injury, not in any industrial or military
profession. And the "grunt" is only one of hundreds of jobs in the military.


>> 3. What has this to do with the the reason for my original reply?

> What's wrong with you Dave? It's *not* the soliders' fault we're at
> war and I didn't say it was.

Please read the thread from the beginning. You were not the person I first
replied to in this thread.
--
Dave
www.davebbq.com

sf wrote:

> People aren't exactly flooding the military so they can fight in Iraq.
> That's why some soldiers are doing their second, third or more tour of
> duty over there.
>
> http://www.zogby.com/NEWS/ReadNews.dbm?ID=1075
> http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14999341/#storyContinued
> http://www.latimes.com/news/nationwo...eadlines-world
> ( http://tinylink.com/?tOoGSHOdIL )

The repeated tours have little to do with military recruitment, it has to do
with the current Bush doctrine of commiting limited numbers of troops to the
Iraqi theater. That's why McCain is so insistent on increasing troop levels
to Iraq. The fracked up notion of Bush, and the departing Rumsfield, that
you can use small levels of deployed troops to remove the enemy in one area,
then leave and move the troops to the next hot spot is crap. You have to
have the number of troops needed to take AND HOLD disputed ground. Trying to
win this action "on the lean" is unexcusable.

--
Dave
www.davebbq.com

Dave Bugg wrote:

> sf wrote:

Look, sf, I apologize if I appear to be harsh at you. That's wasn't my
intention. I didn't want to get sidetracked into sidebar discussions of all
issues of the military, I merely wanted to respond to Horowitz.
--
Dave
www.davebbq.com

"Sheldon" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>
> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>> "Dave Bugg" wrote:
>> > JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>> >
>> >> Ummm....here's another way to look at it: If a few hundred soldiers
>> >> said "We're not going, and you can throw us all in jail if you want",
>> >> that could be viewed as a form of democracy. In other countries,
>> >> soldiers take over governments with violence, so refusing to take
>> >> part in a broken war would actually be a mild reaction.
>> >
>> > Are you always so blatantly ignorant and absurd??? Every time you post
>> > something, it's like you open your own personal sack of stupid and
>> > spill
>> > the contents. <Plonk>
>>
>> Me stupid? You can't explain what you object to. Why don't you try that
>> before throwing stones?
>
> What's to explain, even a pea brained imbecile coward such as yourself
> deep down inside knows with no doubt whatsoever that those who don't
> serve or at least support those who do in a meaningful manner can
> always find someone to buy you a one way ticket to some dictatorship
> country... LEAVE AND NEVER COME BACK, you ignorant yellowbellied
> parasitic mother****er!
>
> Sheldon
>

Where do you imagine I said that I don't support those who serve?

<sf> wrote in message ...
> On Wed, 22 Nov 2006 08:58:12 -0800, "Dave Bugg" >
> wrote:
>
>>sf wrote:
>>
>>> Unfortunately, being a soldier is sometimes the only viable employment
>>> option left for a young man (or woman) in certain parts of the
>>> country. The US has been bleeding entry level white collar and
>>> manufacturing jobs for years and it's time we recognized it.
>>
>>1. While some may choose to join the military because of the employment,
>>it
>>is a small fraction of the total.
>
> Oh? Maybe at the officer level, but not at the grunt level.
>
>>2. If someone wants to join the military for employment, so what? There is
>>not a damned thing wrong with that. Military service is a noble pursuit.
>
> Certainly, but I don't advocate it as a default position - especially
> in war time.... it has something to do with life, death and permanent
> serious injuries.
>
>>3. What has this to do with the the reason for my original reply?
>
> What's wrong with you Dave? It's *not* the soliders' fault we're at
> war and I didn't say it was.

You'll never convince Dave of that. He's already made up his tiny mind.

"Dave Bugg" > wrote in message
...
> sf wrote:
>
>> Oh? Maybe at the officer level, but not at the grunt level.
>
> Well, the GAO reports on the demographics of military recruits completely
> disagrees with your statements. Go do a search.
>
>>> 2. If someone wants to join the military for employment, so what?
>>> There is not a damned thing wrong with that. Military service is a
>>> noble pursuit.
>>
>> Certainly, but I don't advocate it as a default position - especially
>> in war time.... it has something to do with life, death and permanent
>> serious injuries.
>
> No one advocates death or injury, not in any industrial or military
> profession. And the "grunt" is only one of hundreds of jobs in the
> military.

Your president and his master may not advocate it, but they sure as hell
don't care when it happens.

"Dave Bugg" > wrote in message
...
> sf wrote:
>
>> People aren't exactly flooding the military so they can fight in Iraq.
>> That's why some soldiers are doing their second, third or more tour of
>> duty over there.
>>
>> http://www.zogby.com/NEWS/ReadNews.dbm?ID=1075
>> http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14999341/#storyContinued
>> http://www.latimes.com/news/nationwo...eadlines-world
>> ( http://tinylink.com/?tOoGSHOdIL )
>
> The repeated tours have little to do with military recruitment, it has to
> do with the current Bush doctrine of commiting limited numbers of troops
> to the Iraqi theater. That's why McCain is so insistent on increasing
> troop levels to Iraq. The fracked up notion of Bush, and the departing
> Rumsfield, that you can use small levels of deployed troops to remove the
> enemy in one area, then leave and move the troops to the next hot spot is
> crap. You have to have the number of troops needed to take AND HOLD
> disputed ground. Trying to win this action "on the lean" is unexcusable.

Starting the war was inexcusable. All the reasons for it have been shown to
be nonsense.

sf wrote:
> On Wed, 22 Nov 2006 08:58:12 -0800, "Dave Bugg" >
> wrote:
>
> >sf wrote:
> >
> >> Unfortunately, being a soldier is sometimes the only viable employment
> >> option left for a young man (or woman) in certain parts of the
> >> country. The US has been bleeding entry level white collar and
> >> manufacturing jobs for years and it's time we recognized it.
> >
> >1. While some may choose to join the military because of the employment, it
> >is a small fraction of the total.
>
> Oh? Maybe at the officer level, but not at the grunt level.
>
> >2. If someone wants to join the military for employment, so what? There is
> >not a damned thing wrong with that. Military service is a noble pursuit.
>
> Certainly, but I don't advocate it as a default position - especially
> in war time.... it has something to do with life, death and permanent
> serious injuries.
>
> >3. What has this to do with the the reason for my original reply?
>
> What's wrong with you Dave? It's *not* the soliders' fault we're at
> war and I didn't say it was.

What's wrong with you... it's much more simplistic... ask yourself if
you'd rather be speaking arabic or more likely have your head lopped
off. Were it not for those who served in the big wars your kids would
likely not have been born because you would have been in a mass
kraut/gook grave. You are seriously mentally difficient... I know
insects with a far higher IQ than yours. Even though there are plenty
of krauts/gooks who have US citizenship, in a NY minute each and every
one of them wish for another opportunity. The US made a big mistake in
not dropping another dozen atom bombs on Japan, and done the same to
the friggin' kraut bundt *******s. There ain't a jap/gook or a kraut
on this planet today who ain't gleeful about the arab mother****ers
trying to take over the US.

Bush is an idiot not becaue he attacked Afghanistan and Iraq, but
because he didn't bomb ALL the arabs into total and absolute
annilation, shoulda taken no more than 24 hours... by noon of 09/12/01
shoulda been not a living moslem on planet Earth, but what would you
expect from the typical castrated texan.

Sheldon

"Sheldon" > wrote in message
oups.com...

>> What's wrong with you Dave? It's *not* the soliders' fault we're at
>> war and I didn't say it was.
>
> What's wrong with you... it's much more simplistic... ask yourself if
> you'd rather be speaking arabic or more likely have your head lopped
> off. Were it not for those who served in the big wars your kids would
> likely not have been born because you would have been in a mass
> kraut/gook grave. You are seriously mentally difficient... I know
> insects with a far higher IQ than yours. Even though there are plenty
> of krauts/gooks who have US citizenship, in a NY minute each and every
> one of them wish for another opportunity. The US made a big mistake in
> not dropping another dozen atom bombs on Japan, and done the same to
> the friggin' kraut bundt *******s. There ain't a jap/gook or a kraut
> on this planet today who ain't gleeful about the arab mother****ers
> trying to take over the US.
>
> Bush is an idiot not becaue he attacked Afghanistan and Iraq, but
> because he didn't bomb ALL the arabs into total and absolute
> annilation, shoulda taken no more than 24 hours... by noon of 09/12/01
> shoulda been not a living moslem on planet Earth, but what would you
> expect from the typical castrated texan.
>
> Sheldon
>

Sheldon, the orderlies will be there soon to give you your pills. Take some
deep breaths, and step away from the computer.

By the way, you don't have a tractor.

JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
> "Sheldon" > wrote in message
> oups.com...
>
> >> What's wrong with you Dave? It's *not* the soliders' fault we're at
> >> war and I didn't say it was.
> >
> > What's wrong with you... it's much more simplistic... ask yourself if
> > you'd rather be speaking arabic or more likely have your head lopped
> > off. Were it not for those who served in the big wars your kids would
> > likely not have been born because you would have been in a mass
> > kraut/gook grave. You are seriously mentally difficient... I know
> > insects with a far higher IQ than yours. Even though there are plenty
> > of krauts/gooks who have US citizenship, in a NY minute each and every
> > one of them wish for another opportunity. The US made a big mistake in
> > not dropping another dozen atom bombs on Japan, and done the same to
> > the friggin' kraut bundt *******s. There ain't a jap/gook or a kraut
> > on this planet today who ain't gleeful about the arab mother****ers
> > trying to take over the US.
> >
> > Bush is an idiot not becaue he attacked Afghanistan and Iraq, but
> > because he didn't bomb ALL the arabs into total and absolute
> > annilation, shoulda taken no more than 24 hours... by noon of 09/12/01
> > shoulda been not a living moslem on planet Earth, but what would you
> > expect from the typical castrated texan.
> >
> > Sheldon
> >
>
> Sheldon, the orderlies will be there soon to give you your pills. Take some
> deep breaths, and step away from the computer.
>
> By the way, you don't have a tractor.

Hmm, jealous mother****er.

"Sheldon" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>
> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>> "Sheldon" > wrote in message
>> oups.com...
>>
>> >> What's wrong with you Dave? It's *not* the soliders' fault we're at
>> >> war and I didn't say it was.
>> >
>> > What's wrong with you... it's much more simplistic... ask yourself if
>> > you'd rather be speaking arabic or more likely have your head lopped
>> > off. Were it not for those who served in the big wars your kids would
>> > likely not have been born because you would have been in a mass
>> > kraut/gook grave. You are seriously mentally difficient... I know
>> > insects with a far higher IQ than yours. Even though there are plenty
>> > of krauts/gooks who have US citizenship, in a NY minute each and every
>> > one of them wish for another opportunity. The US made a big mistake in
>> > not dropping another dozen atom bombs on Japan, and done the same to
>> > the friggin' kraut bundt *******s. There ain't a jap/gook or a kraut
>> > on this planet today who ain't gleeful about the arab mother****ers
>> > trying to take over the US.
>> >
>> > Bush is an idiot not becaue he attacked Afghanistan and Iraq, but
>> > because he didn't bomb ALL the arabs into total and absolute
>> > annilation, shoulda taken no more than 24 hours... by noon of 09/12/01
>> > shoulda been not a living moslem on planet Earth, but what would you
>> > expect from the typical castrated texan.
>> >
>> > Sheldon
>> >
>>
>> Sheldon, the orderlies will be there soon to give you your pills. Take
>> some
>> deep breaths, and step away from the computer.
>>
>> By the way, you don't have a tractor.
>
> Hmm, jealous mother****er.
>

No, pusswad. Back to the subject:

There is no terrorist threat. Have some faith in your NSA. Not your
president, but pretty much everyone else.

Dave Bugg wrote:
>
> Stan Horwitz wrote:
>
> > In article .com>,
> > "Kris" > wrote:
> >
> >> Well said! I have a friend in Iraq and another waiting for it. We
> >> need to be thankful to them.
> >
> > If young men and women like your friends would stop volunteering to
> > fight in Iraq, what would the United States lose? Damned if I know! On
> > the other hand, if people would stop volunteering to kill or be killed
> > in Iraq, we would have fewer corpses being shipped to Dover, Delaware
> > and the United States' VA hospitals would be less crowded.
>
> A backdoor method of blaming the soldiers. **** YOU!!!!


Ouch. Getting a little touchy there are we. I certainly didn't
get the impression that he was blaming the soldiers. He just said
that of people stopped volunteering there would be so many coming
back in coffins and wheel chairs. It's not their fault that they
were sent over there on the basis of a bunch of lies, and that
they are now stuck there until the mess can be cleaned up. The
death toll is close to 3000 and thousands more have been wounded.
A lot of those wounds are multiple limb amputations. They are
horrendous injuries.


It would be nice if those men and women could be home with their
families for Thanksgiving.

Oh pshaw, on Wed 22 Nov 2006 09:08:56p, Green Mtn. Griller meant to say...

>
> "Green Mtn. Griller" > wrote in message
> news:l2O8h.5683$7a2.3141@trndny06...
>>A little off-topic I guess, but before everyone gets too busy preparing
>>for and anticipating "The Big Day", I'd like to ask all to please
>>remember the men and women who are serving in the military, when you
>>give thanks for all of the blessings you have. Regardless of politics
>>and politicians. These men and women are there for all of us, around
>>the country and around the world and many of them won't be able to be
>>with their families during the holiday season. Our son is a Seabee in
>>the U.S. Navy and is preparing to go to Iraq after the New Year. Please
>>remember all of our service members. Thanks and I hope everyone has a
>>great T-Day!
>>
>> No offense to non-U.S. readers, I know Thursday is just another
>> Thursday to you! :-)
>>
>
> My apologies to all who read this post, I should have known better. All
> I wanted to do is remind people that there are fathers, sons, mothers,
> daughters, etc. that won't be able to spend this time with their
> families. I did not want to start a political slugfest or dredge up bad
> memories. To those who took the post as it was intended, thank you and
> I hope that all of your loved ones can spend time together. To those
> who felt it necessary to use it as a soapbox to spout your political
> viewpoints, well...my opinion of you was expressed much more eloquently
> by others, than I could have conveyed.

I read your post with thoughtfulness, thankfulness, and pleasure.


--
Wayne Boatwright
__________________________________________________

Useless Invention: Solar powered night light.

"JoeSpareBedroom" > wrote in message
...
> "Green Mtn. Griller" > wrote in message
> news:l2O8h.5683$7a2.3141@trndny06...
>
>> Our son is a Seabee in the U.S. Navy and is preparing to go to Iraq after
>> the New Year.
>
> Good. You have 5-6 weeks to stop him, even if it means hiding him with
> friends in another country. If you want him killed, be honest and tell
> him, and then do it yourself, rather than delegate this awful thing to
> your president, who doesn't give a damn about your son, or anyone else's.
>

Brilliant suggestion. Thank you.

On Wed, 22 Nov 2006 21:51:40 -0500, Dave Smith wrote:

> Dave Bugg wrote:

>> A backdoor method of blaming the soldiers. **** YOU!!!!
>
>
> Ouch. Getting a little touchy there are we.

YOU are SOOOOO STUPID!

go Dave Bugg!


dove smith you suck! your opinions are some what like a set of numb nutz!
5,000 posts of stupidity!

"Green Mtn. Griller" > wrote in message
news:l2O8h.5683$7a2.3141@trndny06...
>A little off-topic I guess, but before everyone gets too busy preparing for
>and anticipating "The Big Day", I'd like to ask all to please remember the
>men and women who are serving in the military, when you give thanks for all
>of the blessings you have. Regardless of politics and politicians. These
>men and women are there for all of us, around the country and around the
>world and many of them won't be able to be with their families during the
>holiday season. Our son is a Seabee in the U.S. Navy and is preparing to
>go to Iraq after the New Year. Please remember all of our service members.
>Thanks and I hope everyone has a great T-Day!
>
> No offense to non-U.S. readers, I know Thursday is just another Thursday
> to you! :-)
>

My apologies to all who read this post, I should have known better. All I
wanted to do is remind people that there are fathers, sons, mothers,
daughters, etc. that won't be able to spend this time with their families.
I did not want to start a political slugfest or dredge up bad memories. To
those who took the post as it was intended, thank you and I hope that all of
your loved ones can spend time together. To those who felt it necessary to
use it as a soapbox to spout your political viewpoints, well...my opinion of
you was expressed much more eloquently by others, than I could have
conveyed.

"Wayne Boatwright" <wayneboatwright_at_gmail.com> wrote in message
28.19...
> Oh pshaw, on Wed 22 Nov 2006 09:08:56p, Green Mtn. Griller meant to say...
>
>>
>> "Green Mtn. Griller" > wrote in message
>> news:l2O8h.5683$7a2.3141@trndny06...
>>>A little off-topic I guess, but before everyone gets too busy preparing
>>>for and anticipating "The Big Day", I'd like to ask all to please
>>>remember the men and women who are serving in the military, when you
>>>give thanks for all of the blessings you have. Regardless of politics
>>>and politicians. These men and women are there for all of us, around
>>>the country and around the world and many of them won't be able to be
>>>with their families during the holiday season. Our son is a Seabee in
>>>the U.S. Navy and is preparing to go to Iraq after the New Year. Please
>>>remember all of our service members. Thanks and I hope everyone has a
>>>great T-Day!
>>>
>>> No offense to non-U.S. readers, I know Thursday is just another
>>> Thursday to you! :-)
>>>
>>
>> My apologies to all who read this post, I should have known better. All
>> I wanted to do is remind people that there are fathers, sons, mothers,
>> daughters, etc. that won't be able to spend this time with their
>> families. I did not want to start a political slugfest or dredge up bad
>> memories. To those who took the post as it was intended, thank you and
>> I hope that all of your loved ones can spend time together. To those
>> who felt it necessary to use it as a soapbox to spout your political
>> viewpoints, well...my opinion of you was expressed much more eloquently
>> by others, than I could have conveyed.
>
> I read your post with thoughtfulness, thankfulness, and pleasure.
>
>
> --
> Wayne Boatwright
> __________________________________________________
>
> Useless Invention: Solar powered night light.
>

Thank you, Wayne. I hope others did also (I'm sure they did). Have a
wonderful holiday!

In article >,
"Dave Bugg" > wrote:

> sf wrote:
>
> > People aren't exactly flooding the military so they can fight in Iraq.
> > That's why some soldiers are doing their second, third or more tour of
> > duty over there.
> >
> > http://www.zogby.com/NEWS/ReadNews.dbm?ID=1075
> > http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14999341/#storyContinued
> > http://www.latimes.com/news/nationwo...ep26,1,4149783.
> > story?coll=la-headlines-world
> > ( http://tinylink.com/?tOoGSHOdIL )
>
> The repeated tours have little to do with military recruitment, it has to do
> with the current Bush doctrine of commiting limited numbers of troops to the
> Iraqi theater. That's why McCain is so insistent on increasing troop levels
> to Iraq. The fracked up notion of Bush, and the departing Rumsfield, that
> you can use small levels of deployed troops to remove the enemy in one area,
> then leave and move the troops to the next hot spot is crap. You have to
> have the number of troops needed to take AND HOLD disputed ground. Trying to
> win this action "on the lean" is unexcusable.

I heard a news story just the other day about the National Guard (or it
might have been the Reserves), you lose all your benefits if you leave.
So if you go fight a tour in Iraq, then decide to drop out when your
tour of duty is over, you get no benefits at all. There's a bit of a
movement in congress to fix that situation, but I have no idea how much
momentum it is gathering.

In article >,
Dan Abel > wrote:

> In article >,
> Stan Horwitz > wrote:
>
>
> > If young men and women like your friends would stop volunteering to
> > fight in Iraq, what would the United States lose? Damned if I know! On
> > the other hand, if people would stop volunteering to kill or be killed
> > in Iraq, we would have fewer corpses being shipped to Dover, Delaware
> > and the United States' VA hospitals would be less crowded.
> >
> > The war in Iraq is Bush's ego trip and failed oil grab. I see no reason
> > to thank anyone for enabling Bush to continue his disastrous foreign
> > policy. The truly patriotic thing for your friends to do is to stay out
> > of Iraq, get educated, and become productive citizens.
> >
> > That's just my personal opinion, mind you!
>
> I don't agree. I worked for the US Army for three years (as a
> civilian), and it was very clear that decisions about who to go to war
> with are always made by civilians. The people who voluntarily join the
> military (or get drafted) are just following orders.
>
> The people of the US elected GWB, and they are to blame for this, not
> the soldiers.

You have a point, only where soldiers who signed up before GWB invaded
Iraq are concerned. Those who signed up after the Iraq war began do not
get my sympathy.