Hello all,

It's been a long time since my last post - like, last summer, when I
first got my New Braunfels Bandera smoker and started trying my hand
at this. I got a lot of help and a lot of suggestions from the group
here. I tried them all, too. Figured I'd check in and let folks know
what I've been up to, not that I was around all that much last year
for folks to get to know me. Hope everybody's doing well. Since
then:

1) I've figured out that I can't tend a fire worth a flip. There's an
art form to it, and I never did figure it out.

2) I modified my Bandera a bit, adding the deflector in the smoke
chamber and raising up the fire grate a little in the firebox. Thanks
to whoever it was that suggested that - it did help. But, when you
can't tend a fire to save your life, all the mods in the world can't
help you much.

3) I've gotten married to a guy who just loves smoked pork. He's
suffered through every smoking attempt I've made. Somebody's gotta'
be the guinea pig, right?

4) He's cut up several year's worth of pecan wood, and some oak, just
for my developing smoking habit. We've got a cherry tree that's about
to come down, too, and some apple on the way soon.

5) I've admitted defeat as far as offset smokers go, mainly due to
Event No. 1.

6) Jack bought me a Great Outdoors gas tower smoker. Seems he figured
that if he provided me with something I could tend, I'd keep on
smoking. It worked.

I know a lot of people don't care for the gas smokers, but I have to
admit, for those of us who are pyrotechnically challenged, having a
constant source of heat is a blessing. I get much better results from
my gas smoker than I ever did from the Bandera, and the Bandera
results were already pretty darn good. So far, I've done pork butts,
pork spare ribs, and chicken quarters with it.

One big difference I've noticed in the food is that the bark from the
gas smoker is much more attractive than that from the wood smoker. It
isn't tough, and the color is much nicer, not black and crispy like
the wood smoker produced.

I tried to learn the art of maintaining a fire, but it didn't happen,
no matter what I tried. I just couldn't keep the fire consistent.
Now I read through some recent posts and find that the fires in
off-set smokers are more difficult to control in the first place.
Figures I'd pick a difficult one to start out on, huh? Live and
learn, I suppose.

The Great Outdoors smoker will last me for awhile, but it will
eventually need to be replaced. I'll probably look into a similar
style wood smoker at that point. Or not, depending on how lazy I've
gotten in the meantime. It is pretty convenient to be able to get the
temperature stabilized and walk away from it for a few hours.

Well, that pretty much sums up my smoking adventures for the last year
or so. Not much in the other areas that I haven't already mentioned:
got married in May, honeymooned in Cozumel, Mexico. When we got back,
I traded my 1100 Magna motorcycle for a newer, 750 Magna.

Went to Iowa a few weeks ago on a mission trip. Our first full day
there, one of the members of the hosting church smoked some pork for
us, so I got to talk to somebody who's been doing this for awhile. He
uses a rub from a company in Bakersfiled, California, called
Shepherds. The original blend is pretty good, although it is a bit
salty. He sent some home with me to try out.

I'll quit yapping now. Y'all take care.

Lori
SE Tennessee

New Braunfels Bandera
Great Outdoors gas smoker model 3600

Um.... that's pretty much it.

Great post, Lori
What kind of gas smoker are you using?
Cheers,
Kent

Lori Hunt wrote:
>
> Hello all,
>
> It's been a long time since my last post - like, last summer, when I
> first got my New Braunfels Bandera smoker and started trying my hand
> at this. I got a lot of help and a lot of suggestions from the group
> here. I tried them all, too. Figured I'd check in and let folks know
> what I've been up to, not that I was around all that much last year
> for folks to get to know me. Hope everybody's doing well. Since
> then:
>
> 1) I've figured out that I can't tend a fire worth a flip. There's an
> art form to it, and I never did figure it out.
>
> 2) I modified my Bandera a bit, adding the deflector in the smoke
> chamber and raising up the fire grate a little in the firebox. Thanks
> to whoever it was that suggested that - it did help. But, when you
> can't tend a fire to save your life, all the mods in the world can't
> help you much.
>
> 3) I've gotten married to a guy who just loves smoked pork. He's
> suffered through every smoking attempt I've made. Somebody's gotta'
> be the guinea pig, right?
>
> 4) He's cut up several year's worth of pecan wood, and some oak, just
> for my developing smoking habit. We've got a cherry tree that's about
> to come down, too, and some apple on the way soon.
>
> 5) I've admitted defeat as far as offset smokers go, mainly due to
> Event No. 1.
>
> 6) Jack bought me a Great Outdoors gas tower smoker. Seems he figured
> that if he provided me with something I could tend, I'd keep on
> smoking. It worked.
>
> I know a lot of people don't care for the gas smokers, but I have to
> admit, for those of us who are pyrotechnically challenged, having a
> constant source of heat is a blessing. I get much better results from
> my gas smoker than I ever did from the Bandera, and the Bandera
> results were already pretty darn good. So far, I've done pork butts,
> pork spare ribs, and chicken quarters with it.
>
> One big difference I've noticed in the food is that the bark from the
> gas smoker is much more attractive than that from the wood smoker. It
> isn't tough, and the color is much nicer, not black and crispy like
> the wood smoker produced.
>
> I tried to learn the art of maintaining a fire, but it didn't happen,
> no matter what I tried. I just couldn't keep the fire consistent.
> Now I read through some recent posts and find that the fires in
> off-set smokers are more difficult to control in the first place.
> Figures I'd pick a difficult one to start out on, huh? Live and
> learn, I suppose.
>
> The Great Outdoors smoker will last me for awhile, but it will
> eventually need to be replaced. I'll probably look into a similar
> style wood smoker at that point. Or not, depending on how lazy I've
> gotten in the meantime. It is pretty convenient to be able to get the
> temperature stabilized and walk away from it for a few hours.
>
> Well, that pretty much sums up my smoking adventures for the last year
> or so. Not much in the other areas that I haven't already mentioned:
> got married in May, honeymooned in Cozumel, Mexico. When we got back,
> I traded my 1100 Magna motorcycle for a newer, 750 Magna.
>
> Went to Iowa a few weeks ago on a mission trip. Our first full day
> there, one of the members of the hosting church smoked some pork for
> us, so I got to talk to somebody who's been doing this for awhile. He
> uses a rub from a company in Bakersfiled, California, called
> Shepherds. The original blend is pretty good, although it is a bit
> salty. He sent some home with me to try out.
>
> I'll quit yapping now. Y'all take care.
>
> Lori
> SE Tennessee
>
> New Braunfels Bandera
> Great Outdoors gas smoker model 3600
>
> Um.... that's pretty much it.

Great post, Lori
What kind of gas smoker are you using?
Cheers,
Kent

Lori Hunt wrote:
>
> Hello all,
>
> It's been a long time since my last post - like, last summer, when I
> first got my New Braunfels Bandera smoker and started trying my hand
> at this. I got a lot of help and a lot of suggestions from the group
> here. I tried them all, too. Figured I'd check in and let folks know
> what I've been up to, not that I was around all that much last year
> for folks to get to know me. Hope everybody's doing well. Since
> then:
>
> 1) I've figured out that I can't tend a fire worth a flip. There's an
> art form to it, and I never did figure it out.
>
> 2) I modified my Bandera a bit, adding the deflector in the smoke
> chamber and raising up the fire grate a little in the firebox. Thanks
> to whoever it was that suggested that - it did help. But, when you
> can't tend a fire to save your life, all the mods in the world can't
> help you much.
>
> 3) I've gotten married to a guy who just loves smoked pork. He's
> suffered through every smoking attempt I've made. Somebody's gotta'
> be the guinea pig, right?
>
> 4) He's cut up several year's worth of pecan wood, and some oak, just
> for my developing smoking habit. We've got a cherry tree that's about
> to come down, too, and some apple on the way soon.
>
> 5) I've admitted defeat as far as offset smokers go, mainly due to
> Event No. 1.
>
> 6) Jack bought me a Great Outdoors gas tower smoker. Seems he figured
> that if he provided me with something I could tend, I'd keep on
> smoking. It worked.
>
> I know a lot of people don't care for the gas smokers, but I have to
> admit, for those of us who are pyrotechnically challenged, having a
> constant source of heat is a blessing. I get much better results from
> my gas smoker than I ever did from the Bandera, and the Bandera
> results were already pretty darn good. So far, I've done pork butts,
> pork spare ribs, and chicken quarters with it.
>
> One big difference I've noticed in the food is that the bark from the
> gas smoker is much more attractive than that from the wood smoker. It
> isn't tough, and the color is much nicer, not black and crispy like
> the wood smoker produced.
>
> I tried to learn the art of maintaining a fire, but it didn't happen,
> no matter what I tried. I just couldn't keep the fire consistent.
> Now I read through some recent posts and find that the fires in
> off-set smokers are more difficult to control in the first place.
> Figures I'd pick a difficult one to start out on, huh? Live and
> learn, I suppose.
>
> The Great Outdoors smoker will last me for awhile, but it will
> eventually need to be replaced. I'll probably look into a similar
> style wood smoker at that point. Or not, depending on how lazy I've
> gotten in the meantime. It is pretty convenient to be able to get the
> temperature stabilized and walk away from it for a few hours.
>
> Well, that pretty much sums up my smoking adventures for the last year
> or so. Not much in the other areas that I haven't already mentioned:
> got married in May, honeymooned in Cozumel, Mexico. When we got back,
> I traded my 1100 Magna motorcycle for a newer, 750 Magna.
>
> Went to Iowa a few weeks ago on a mission trip. Our first full day
> there, one of the members of the hosting church smoked some pork for
> us, so I got to talk to somebody who's been doing this for awhile. He
> uses a rub from a company in Bakersfiled, California, called
> Shepherds. The original blend is pretty good, although it is a bit
> salty. He sent some home with me to try out.
>
> I'll quit yapping now. Y'all take care.
>
> Lori
> SE Tennessee
>
> New Braunfels Bandera
> Great Outdoors gas smoker model 3600
>
> Um.... that's pretty much it.

Lori Hunt wrote:


> One big difference I've noticed in the food is that the bark from the
> gas smoker is much more attractive than that from the wood smoker. It
> isn't tough, and the color is much nicer, not black and crispy like
> the wood smoker produced.



A wood fire will do that when it's smoldering.

See #1.

TFM®

On 10-Jul-2004, Lori Hunt > wrote:

> Hello all,
>
> It's been a long time since my last post - like, last summer, when I
> first got my New Braunfels Bandera smoker and started trying my hand
> at this. I got a lot of help and a lot of suggestions from the group
> here. I tried them all, too. Figured I'd check in and let folks know
> what I've been up to, not that I was around all that much last year
> for folks to get to know me. Hope everybody's doing well. Since
> then:
>

Nice hearing from you again Lori and congratulations on your nuptuals.

<snip>

>
> I'll quit yapping now. Y'all take care.
>
> Lori
> SE Tennessee
>
> New Braunfels Bandera
> Great Outdoors gas smoker model 3600
>
> Um.... that's pretty much it.

Sorry to hear about your unsatisfactory results with your
Bandera. I couldn't tell exactly, but if you were trying to
manage a totally wood fire, that's much more difficult
then wood over lump. I've only done all wood a couple of
times with mostly unsatisfactory results. (New Braunfels
Silver Smoker). In any case, you can't go away for several
hours or even a few and expect the fire to maintain. I have
to tend mine every 50 to 75 minutes even with all lump.
But I like it anyway. Go figure.

--
M&M ("When You're Over The Hill You Pick Up Speed")

"Lori Hunt" > wrote in message
...
> Hello all,
>
> It's been a long time since my last post - like, last summer, when I
> first got my New Braunfels Bandera smoker and started trying my hand
> at this. I got a lot of help and a lot of suggestions from the group
> here. I tried them all, too. Figured I'd check in and let folks know
> what I've been up to, not that I was around all that much last year
> for folks to get to know me. Hope everybody's doing well. Since
> then:
>
> 1) I've figured out that I can't tend a fire worth a flip. There's an
> art form to it, and I never did figure it out.
>
> 2) I modified my Bandera a bit, adding the deflector in the smoke
> chamber and raising up the fire grate a little in the firebox. Thanks
> to whoever it was that suggested that - it did help. But, when you
> can't tend a fire to save your life, all the mods in the world can't
> help you much.

Lori, there's a Bandera forum somewhere that supposedly has a load of knowledge.
Did you try that?


Tyler

I think I found it!
http://www.walmart.com/catalog/produ...885#long_descr
Lori what's the lowest temp. you can smoke with this unit, assuming this
is the correct one? Say with an outside temp. of 75F. As we all know,
particularly at low smoking temps, outside temp dictates smoking temp.
I'm trying to cold smoke salmon.
Thanks
Kent


Lori Hunt wrote:
>
> Hello all,
>
> It's been a long time since my last post - like, last summer, when I
> first got my New Braunfels Bandera smoker and started trying my hand
> at this. I got a lot of help and a lot of suggestions from the group
> here. I tried them all, too. Figured I'd check in and let folks know
> what I've been up to, not that I was around all that much last year
> for folks to get to know me. Hope everybody's doing well. Since
> then:
>
> 1) I've figured out that I can't tend a fire worth a flip. There's an
> art form to it, and I never did figure it out.
>
> 2) I modified my Bandera a bit, adding the deflector in the smoke
> chamber and raising up the fire grate a little in the firebox. Thanks
> to whoever it was that suggested that - it did help. But, when you
> can't tend a fire to save your life, all the mods in the world can't
> help you much.
>
> 3) I've gotten married to a guy who just loves smoked pork. He's
> suffered through every smoking attempt I've made. Somebody's gotta'
> be the guinea pig, right?
>
> 4) He's cut up several year's worth of pecan wood, and some oak, just
> for my developing smoking habit. We've got a cherry tree that's about
> to come down, too, and some apple on the way soon.
>
> 5) I've admitted defeat as far as offset smokers go, mainly due to
> Event No. 1.
>
> 6) Jack bought me a Great Outdoors gas tower smoker. Seems he figured
> that if he provided me with something I could tend, I'd keep on
> smoking. It worked.
>
> I know a lot of people don't care for the gas smokers, but I have to
> admit, for those of us who are pyrotechnically challenged, having a
> constant source of heat is a blessing. I get much better results from
> my gas smoker than I ever did from the Bandera, and the Bandera
> results were already pretty darn good. So far, I've done pork butts,
> pork spare ribs, and chicken quarters with it.
>
> One big difference I've noticed in the food is that the bark from the
> gas smoker is much more attractive than that from the wood smoker. It
> isn't tough, and the color is much nicer, not black and crispy like
> the wood smoker produced.
>
> I tried to learn the art of maintaining a fire, but it didn't happen,
> no matter what I tried. I just couldn't keep the fire consistent.
> Now I read through some recent posts and find that the fires in
> off-set smokers are more difficult to control in the first place.
> Figures I'd pick a difficult one to start out on, huh? Live and
> learn, I suppose.
>
> The Great Outdoors smoker will last me for awhile, but it will
> eventually need to be replaced. I'll probably look into a similar
> style wood smoker at that point. Or not, depending on how lazy I've
> gotten in the meantime. It is pretty convenient to be able to get the
> temperature stabilized and walk away from it for a few hours.
>
> Well, that pretty much sums up my smoking adventures for the last year
> or so. Not much in the other areas that I haven't already mentioned:
> got married in May, honeymooned in Cozumel, Mexico. When we got back,
> I traded my 1100 Magna motorcycle for a newer, 750 Magna.
>
> Went to Iowa a few weeks ago on a mission trip. Our first full day
> there, one of the members of the hosting church smoked some pork for
> us, so I got to talk to somebody who's been doing this for awhile. He
> uses a rub from a company in Bakersfiled, California, called
> Shepherds. The original blend is pretty good, although it is a bit
> salty. He sent some home with me to try out.
>
> I'll quit yapping now. Y'all take care.
>
> Lori
> SE Tennessee
>
> New Braunfels Bandera
> Great Outdoors gas smoker model 3600
>
> Um.... that's pretty much it.

Lori Hunt wrote:
> Hello all,
>
> It's been a long time since my last post - like, last summer, when I
> first got my New Braunfels Bandera smoker and started trying my hand
> at this. I got a lot of help and a lot of suggestions from the group
> here. I tried them all, too. Figured I'd check in and let folks know
> what I've been up to, not that I was around all that much last year
> for folks to get to know me. Hope everybody's doing well. Since
> then:
>
> 1) I've figured out that I can't tend a fire worth a flip. There's an
> art form to it, and I never did figure it out.

Are you burning 100% wood in the offset? Do you pre-burn
the wood before putting it into the offset (i.e. put already
glowing/charred chunks of wood in) ?

Cheers,
Dana

Lori Hunt wrote:
> Hello all,
>
> It's been a long time since my last post - like, last summer, when I
> first got my New Braunfels Bandera smoker and started trying my hand
> at this. I got a lot of help and a lot of suggestions from the group
> here. I tried them all, too. Figured I'd check in and let folks know
> what I've been up to, not that I was around all that much last year
> for folks to get to know me. Hope everybody's doing well. Since
> then:
>
> 1) I've figured out that I can't tend a fire worth a flip. There's an
> art form to it, and I never did figure it out.

Are you burning 100% wood in the offset? Do you pre-burn
the wood before putting it into the offset (i.e. put already
glowing/charred chunks of wood in) ?

Cheers,
Dana

Kent H. wrote:

> I think I found it!
> http://www.walmart.com/catalog/produ...885#long_descr
> Lori what's the lowest temp. you can smoke with this unit, assuming this
> is the correct one? Say with an outside temp. of 75F. As we all know,
> particularly at low smoking temps, outside temp dictates smoking temp.
> I'm trying to cold smoke salmon.


Funny you should ask. I posted that very question to the Great Outdoors
Smokey Mountain yahoo group.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/smokeymountain/

As I rememeber the response I got was the lowest stable temp they
could get was somewhere around 150 F.

--
Reg email: RegForte (at) (that free MS email service) (dot) com

Tyler Hopper wrote:

> I've heard the same thing about all of these types of smokers. That low the
> burner has to cycle on and off a lot and the temp swings are quite wide.
>
> I wonder if adding some mass like a pizza stone would help.

Loaded ovens do have less temperature swing, but the reason behind the
"low temperature stability" issue has to do with the basic design of
this type of smoker oven.

Smoker ovens, with very few exceptions (Bradley being the main one),
are a single, insulated chamber. The smoke box is typically located
at the bottom of the chamber, and single heating element is used
to both heat the oven and generate smoke. This is the source of the
problem.

Once you've generated enough heat to get the wood smoking, you've
also pumped your well insulated metal cabinet full of heat as well.
That makes it very hard to have both smoke and low temperature
at the same time. Once smoke is successfully generated it means
you also have lots of heat inside the chamber, and the heat wants
to stay there.

The manufacturers should give reliable specifications for things
like "lowest temperature of smoke" and "lowest stable temperature".
If enough people demand this they will eventually respond and
start doing it.

--
Reg email: RegForte (at) (that free MS email service) (dot) com

"Reg" > wrote in message
m...

> Smoker ovens, with very few exceptions (Bradley being the main one),
> are a single, insulated chamber. The smoke box is typically located
> at the bottom of the chamber, and single heating element is used
> to both heat the oven and generate smoke. This is the source of the
> problem.

So I assume you're saying Bradley uses a dual heat element? I know they sell the
smoker both with and without the "smoke generator".

I ask because I've been looking at one and am a little hesitant because of the
price and the proprietary wood biscuits they're fired with.


Tyler

Tyler Hopper wrote:

> So I assume you're saying Bradley uses a dual heat element? I know they sell the
> smoker both with and without the "smoke generator".

Correct. Plus the dual heat element helps, but doesn't completely solve the
problem. If you want true cold smoke, no higher than ambient, you'll end up
adding a hose and/or chamber between the generator and the main
unit. Otherwise expect about 100-110 F at 75 F ambient, no wind.

I use the smoke generator hooked up to a modified blower box from
The Sausage Maker. I'm very happy with the arrangement. Totally
cold smoke, variable airflow, large volume, etc.

I think this is where Bradley really shines, when using the generator
in a customized setup for doing big cold smoke batches. The bigger the
batch, the more you spread out the cost of supplies. And it's *totally*
hands off operation. Very cool.

> I ask because I've been looking at one and am a little hesitant because of the
> price and the proprietary wood biscuits they're fired with.

I agree. The proprietary supplies issue is a *big* drawback. The numbers
tell the story.

It's about a buck an hour in biscuits to run. If you use the thing 20 hours
per week, that's $1040 per year, not including electricity. That's over twice
the cost of the unit itself per year, every year, forever.

I mitigate this problem by batching. Most of the stuff I cold smoke are not
all that perishable so they can wait before they're smoked (cheese, dry cured
salami, other dry cured meats). I do one big session a week, with as much
product in it I can get. That brings my unit cost way down.

Also, there are other drawbacks to Bradley...

The smoke generator mechanism isn't all that well put together. It has
fairly cheap components and it's not very durable. The biscuits shed all
kinds of sawdust and crap, which has to be cleaned out from the inside
or the generator occasionally. This thing will jam on you if you're not
careful. I've already sent one back.

They fail to mention the importance of generator maintenance in their
four color brochures, in the user manual, or anywhere else. Till you
call customer support. I hate that.

Anyway, let me know if I can help with your decision.

--
Reg email: RegForte (at) (that free MS email service) (dot) com

Tyler Hopper wrote:

> So I assume you're saying Bradley uses a dual heat element? I know they sell the
> smoker both with and without the "smoke generator".

Correct. Plus the dual heat element helps, but doesn't completely solve the
problem. If you want true cold smoke, no higher than ambient, you'll end up
adding a hose and/or chamber between the generator and the main
unit. Otherwise expect about 100-110 F at 75 F ambient, no wind.

I use the smoke generator hooked up to a modified blower box from
The Sausage Maker. I'm very happy with the arrangement. Totally
cold smoke, variable airflow, large volume, etc.

I think this is where Bradley really shines, when using the generator
in a customized setup for doing big cold smoke batches. The bigger the
batch, the more you spread out the cost of supplies. And it's *totally*
hands off operation. Very cool.

> I ask because I've been looking at one and am a little hesitant because of the
> price and the proprietary wood biscuits they're fired with.

I agree. The proprietary supplies issue is a *big* drawback. The numbers
tell the story.

It's about a buck an hour in biscuits to run. If you use the thing 20 hours
per week, that's $1040 per year, not including electricity. That's over twice
the cost of the unit itself per year, every year, forever.

I mitigate this problem by batching. Most of the stuff I cold smoke are not
all that perishable so they can wait before they're smoked (cheese, dry cured
salami, other dry cured meats). I do one big session a week, with as much
product in it I can get. That brings my unit cost way down.

Also, there are other drawbacks to Bradley...

The smoke generator mechanism isn't all that well put together. It has
fairly cheap components and it's not very durable. The biscuits shed all
kinds of sawdust and crap, which has to be cleaned out from the inside
or the generator occasionally. This thing will jam on you if you're not
careful. I've already sent one back.

They fail to mention the importance of generator maintenance in their
four color brochures, in the user manual, or anywhere else. Till you
call customer support. I hate that.

Anyway, let me know if I can help with your decision.

--
Reg email: RegForte (at) (that free MS email service) (dot) com

Thanks for the discussion. I'll try to reply to several questions at
once here.

Q: Was I using lump with wood or wood only?
A: Both. I started out using wood only. Then I tried lump. Then
the lump with the wood. I did get better results with the lump/wood
combination, but it was a major test of my patience to keep the fire
going at the right temperatures. And, I've got tons of wood, free.
Well, maybe not tons of it, but a lot, and sources for more.

Q: Did I pre-burn and get the fire glowing red first?
A: No. In retrospect, that would probably help out with the
temperature eveness issue. It's a lot easier to keep a large fire
burning than it is to maintain a small one. Right now the smokers are
setting on the deck, which doesn't encourage fire pits. I may try
setting up the wood smoker out in the back yard with a fire pit next
to it so all I have to do is shovel coals in from the fire pit.

Q: What's the lowest stable temp on the gas smoker?
A: Dunno. I usually keep it in the range between 225-250 or so. It
can go lower, but I'm not sure how much lower. Right now, ambient
temperature in SE TN is 90 degrees or so. I don't think this setup
will work for cold smoking.

Q: Did I find the Bandera forum?
A: Yes, but I didn't devote the time to get anything out of it. Lot
of great info there, just didn't tap into it.

I have a lot of admiration for the folks who have the patience to
master fire tending. I'm not cut out to sit among your ranks right
now, but maybe once things settle down here and life isn't quite so
hectic, I'll get the hang of it. A lot of my trouble with
fire-tending boils down to self-discipline and distractions. I'm
trying to finish up my associates degree, work full time, new husband,
finish moving, be involved in church, find time for my motorcycle...
just too much going on. Once some of the stuff is taken care (I can't
go to school forever, can? Please say no....), I can take a full
weekend and do nothing but work with the fire. Until then, it's the
gas smoker. I can get a lot of homework done in 3-4 hours. : )

Grins,

Lori
SE TN

New Braunfels Bandera
Great Outdoors Model 3600 Gas Smoker

Thanks for the discussion. I'll try to reply to several questions at
once here.

Q: Was I using lump with wood or wood only?
A: Both. I started out using wood only. Then I tried lump. Then
the lump with the wood. I did get better results with the lump/wood
combination, but it was a major test of my patience to keep the fire
going at the right temperatures. And, I've got tons of wood, free.
Well, maybe not tons of it, but a lot, and sources for more.

Q: Did I pre-burn and get the fire glowing red first?
A: No. In retrospect, that would probably help out with the
temperature eveness issue. It's a lot easier to keep a large fire
burning than it is to maintain a small one. Right now the smokers are
setting on the deck, which doesn't encourage fire pits. I may try
setting up the wood smoker out in the back yard with a fire pit next
to it so all I have to do is shovel coals in from the fire pit.

Q: What's the lowest stable temp on the gas smoker?
A: Dunno. I usually keep it in the range between 225-250 or so. It
can go lower, but I'm not sure how much lower. Right now, ambient
temperature in SE TN is 90 degrees or so. I don't think this setup
will work for cold smoking.

Q: Did I find the Bandera forum?
A: Yes, but I didn't devote the time to get anything out of it. Lot
of great info there, just didn't tap into it.

I have a lot of admiration for the folks who have the patience to
master fire tending. I'm not cut out to sit among your ranks right
now, but maybe once things settle down here and life isn't quite so
hectic, I'll get the hang of it. A lot of my trouble with
fire-tending boils down to self-discipline and distractions. I'm
trying to finish up my associates degree, work full time, new husband,
finish moving, be involved in church, find time for my motorcycle...
just too much going on. Once some of the stuff is taken care (I can't
go to school forever, can? Please say no....), I can take a full
weekend and do nothing but work with the fire. Until then, it's the
gas smoker. I can get a lot of homework done in 3-4 hours. : )

Grins,

Lori
SE TN

New Braunfels Bandera
Great Outdoors Model 3600 Gas Smoker

Lori Hunt wrote:
>
> I have a lot of admiration for the folks who have the patience to
> master fire tending. I'm not cut out to sit among your ranks right
> now, but maybe once things settle down here and life isn't quite so
> hectic, I'll get the hang of it. A lot of my trouble with
> fire-tending boils down to self-discipline and distractions. I'm
> trying to finish up my associates degree, work full time, new husband,
> finish moving, be involved in church, find time for my motorcycle...
> just too much going on. Once some of the stuff is taken care (I can't
> go to school forever, can? Please say no....), I can take a full
> weekend and do nothing but work with the fire. Until then, it's the
> gas smoker. I can get a lot of homework done in 3-4 hours. : )

It's learned over a lifetime, no rush, just keep making the effort. You got
a leg up, you're interested in learning and you can read and learn. That'll
speed things up considerably.
That long learning curve shouldnt scare ya, how often do you BBQ? Now if you
translated that to baseball, you wouldnt even be able to catch a ball yet.
So fire tending is easier than learning to play baseball with some semblance
of skill. That said, I bet you'll be happy with your efforts by the end of
this or next summer and you'll have yourself a lifeskill that will pay you
back manyfold.
You'll learn a lot of fire skills grilling too. So dont gas that steak, fire
up some coals and let osmosis do it's job.


--

Lori Hunt wrote:
>
> I have a lot of admiration for the folks who have the patience to
> master fire tending. I'm not cut out to sit among your ranks right
> now, but maybe once things settle down here and life isn't quite so
> hectic, I'll get the hang of it. A lot of my trouble with
> fire-tending boils down to self-discipline and distractions. I'm
> trying to finish up my associates degree, work full time, new husband,
> finish moving, be involved in church, find time for my motorcycle...
> just too much going on. Once some of the stuff is taken care (I can't
> go to school forever, can? Please say no....), I can take a full
> weekend and do nothing but work with the fire. Until then, it's the
> gas smoker. I can get a lot of homework done in 3-4 hours. : )

It's learned over a lifetime, no rush, just keep making the effort. You got
a leg up, you're interested in learning and you can read and learn. That'll
speed things up considerably.
That long learning curve shouldnt scare ya, how often do you BBQ? Now if you
translated that to baseball, you wouldnt even be able to catch a ball yet.
So fire tending is easier than learning to play baseball with some semblance
of skill. That said, I bet you'll be happy with your efforts by the end of
this or next summer and you'll have yourself a lifeskill that will pay you
back manyfold.
You'll learn a lot of fire skills grilling too. So dont gas that steak, fire
up some coals and let osmosis do it's job.


--

Lori Hunt wrote:

> Q: Did I pre-burn and get the fire glowing red first?
> A: No. In retrospect, that would probably help out with the
> temperature eveness issue. It's a lot easier to keep a large fire
> burning than it is to maintain a small one. Right now the smokers are
> setting on the deck, which doesn't encourage fire pits. I may try
> setting up the wood smoker out in the back yard with a fire pit next
> to it so all I have to do is shovel coals in from the fire pit.

Even small chunks of wood will generate a fair bit of heat until
they burn down, so this alone could be what was driving you crazy
with temperature variation. Be warned - I'm still learning and
my technique may turn out to be terrible, or I may change it. But
this is what I do right now...

My technique with lump is to get a 'proper' fire started, this is
usually a chimney-full, get the pit stabilized around the temperature
I want with the firebox damper around 2/3 open. The first time or two
you do this, you might want to not fill the chimney all the way,
maybe just half-way, so you don't have a fire that's too big to
start with. If the fire is way too big, you'll go nuts trying to
damp it down with the firebox damper, then opening the damper
and watching the temperature start shooting up again. Worse yet,
you can end up with a smoldering fire. Suppose I'm shooting for a
200-225 temperature, I aim for a fire with the damper mostly open
that might be as high as 240-250 and drops gradually.

So, when the fire is little too low, say, when it starts to
get down to 200, I'll add a lump or two to the fire and wait
a while to see where the temperature ends up at. I don't stand
there and watch it, I usually set a timer for 10 minutes or so.
I like to see the fire run back up around the high point, say
240-250 and then I leave it alone until it drops to the low end
of the range.

Once I get accustomed to about how much lump I need to
add periodically, I probably have to tend the fire every
hour or a little longer. Don't drive yourself nuts watching
the temperature gauge; if I'm aiming at 225, then 200-250 is
a fair range. I don't mess with the firebox damper at all,
just let the fire cycle up and down over time.

My personal suggestion for a fire that's getting away,
say more than 50F above the 'median' temperature and won't
come under control with the damper is to simply remove some
fuel from it (use your chimney maybe or a little weber-style
grill to hold the burning lump/wood).


SE TN is beautiful!

Cheers,
Dana

On 13-Jul-2004, "Tyler Hopper" > wrote:

> "Lori Hunt" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Thanks for the discussion. I'll try to reply to several questions at
> > once here.
> >
> > I have a lot of admiration for the folks who have the patience to
> > master fire tending. I'm not cut out to sit among your ranks right
> > now, but maybe once things settle down here and life isn't quite so
> > hectic, I'll get the hang of it. A lot of my trouble with
> > fire-tending boils down to self-discipline and distractions. I'm
> > trying to finish up my associates degree, work full time, new husband,
> > finish moving, be involved in church, find time for my motorcycle...
> > just too much going on. Once some of the stuff is taken care (I can't
> > go to school forever, can? Please say no....), I can take a full
> > weekend and do nothing but work with the fire. Until then, it's the
> > gas smoker. I can get a lot of homework done in 3-4 hours. : )
> >
> > Grins,
> >
> > Lori
> > SE TN
>
> Hey Lori, let me say I appreciate your honesty. From time to time we have folks
> come in here whining about how bad their stuff comes out, blames it on the meat,
> blames it on the fuel, blames it on planet alignment, etc.
>
> At least you have the huevos to stand up and say it's me, I don't have the time
> to devote, I need to practice more, etc. Good for you.
>
> I think whenever you get a little spare time it would be well spent browsing
> thru the Yahoo! Bandera forum. I'm told it's a gold mine. I hear with the
> correct mods you can go a few hrs. without screwing with the fire.
>
> Let us know if we can help.
>
>
> Tyler

Hey Lori, at the risk of being sacriligious, you might want to look into getting
a drop in burner ala Big Jim's LazyQ. It will work in your Bandara just fine. You
use a nasty old cast iron skillet on top of the burner to roast your flavor chunks
for smoke and the burner makes more then enough heat to fire your pit. Best
thing is though, you don't have to F&*( with it. Big Jim gets two or three cooks
from and 20# bottle with a 5 foot pit. Nobody badmouths Big Jim's 'Q'.

--
M&M ("When You're Over The Hill You Pick Up Speed")

"Dana Myers" > wrote in message
om...
> Once I get accustomed to about how much lump I need to
> add periodically, I probably have to tend the fire every
> hour or a little longer. Don't drive yourself nuts watching
> the temperature gauge; if I'm aiming at 225, then 200-250 is
> a fair range. I don't mess with the firebox damper at all,
> just let the fire cycle up and down over time.
>
> My personal suggestion for a fire that's getting away,
> say more than 50F above the 'median' temperature and won't
> come under control with the damper is to simply remove some
> fuel from it (use your chimney maybe or a little weber-style
> grill to hold the burning lump/wood).
>
>
> SE TN is beautiful!
>
> Cheers,
> Dana

There was some discussion a while back about arranging the lump in a linear
fashion rather than just dumping it in a pile. Start the fire on one end of the
"line" and you could keep it small and hot. Never cooked in an offset so I can't
really say much.

The thing I do on a slow cook on the K7 is to bury the wood chunks under the
lump in layers and start the fire from the top. This does two things. It burns
slower going from the top down rather than the bottom up. Secondly by the time
the wood starts smoking the fire from above seems to burn off a lot of the VOCs
which prevents billowing smoke.

_________
ht_redneck

M&M wrote:

> Nobody badmouths
> Big Jim's 'Q'.

That's a fact.

M&M wrote:

> Nobody badmouths
> Big Jim's 'Q'.

That's a fact.

Tyler Hopper wrote:

> There was some discussion a while back about arranging the lump in a linear
> fashion rather than just dumping it in a pile. Start the fire on one end of the
> "line" and you could keep it small and hot. Never cooked in an offset so I can't
> really say much.

Interesting. Presumably the fire would be arranged to burn from
the damper-end?

> The thing I do on a slow cook on the K7 is to bury the wood chunks under the
> lump in layers and start the fire from the top. This does two things. It burns
> slower going from the top down rather than the bottom up. Secondly by the time
> the wood starts smoking the fire from above seems to burn off a lot of the VOCs
> which prevents billowing smoke.

Good idea; I do something which might be considered similar...

Sometimes I put wood chunks in the firebox *under* the grate,
so the wood is laying on the bottom of the firebox and being
baked from the top. After a few minutes, the wood chunk starts
to charcoalize (and sometimes catches on fire, of course) and
I turn it over and repeat the "baking". Then I take the chunk
and set it on top of the fire and it immediately bursts into
flame. This is one way I avoid billowing smoke.

Cheers,
Dana

"Dana Myers" > wrote in message
om...
> Tyler Hopper wrote:
>
> > There was some discussion a while back about arranging the lump in a linear
> > fashion rather than just dumping it in a pile. Start the fire on one end of
the
> > "line" and you could keep it small and hot. Never cooked in an offset so I
can't
> > really say much.
>
> Interesting. Presumably the fire would be arranged to burn from
> the damper-end?

Can't say as I've never cooked on a offset but that sounds reasonable to me.
Sounds particularly adaptable to a horizontal barrel cooker without an external
fire box. frohe?

I sure wish Eskwired was still around. I believe he cooked on a NBBD and knew
every trick in the book. Won a few competitions with it.

_________
ht_redneck

Tyler Hopper wrote:
> "Dana Myers" > wrote in message
>> Interesting. Presumably the fire would be arranged to burn from
>> the damper-end?
>
> Can't say as I've never cooked on a offset but that sounds reasonable
> to me. Sounds particularly adaptable to a horizontal barrel cooker
> without an external fire box. frohe?
>
> I sure wish Eskwired was still around. I believe he cooked on a NBBD
> and knew every trick in the book. Won a few competitions with it.

Damn, I remember when he posted around here, didnt know he was a barrell
guy, wasnt that long ago either.

FWIW, seems that the fuel burns best further away from the inlet damper and
closer to the firebox exit hole near the cooking chamber. I assume that's
where the best through ventilation occurs.
Probably another reason fuel doesnt burn too well there on mine as well,
only strays gets close to the inlet so they don't get much help from their
neighbors.


--

"Duwop" > wrote in message
...
> Tyler Hopper wrote:
> > "Dana Myers" > wrote in message
> >> Interesting. Presumably the fire would be arranged to burn from
> >> the damper-end?
> >
> > Can't say as I've never cooked on a offset but that sounds reasonable
> > to me. Sounds particularly adaptable to a horizontal barrel cooker
> > without an external fire box. frohe?
> >
> > I sure wish Eskwired was still around. I believe he cooked on a NBBD
> > and knew every trick in the book. Won a few competitions with it.
>
> Damn, I remember when he posted around here, didnt know he was a barrell
> guy, wasnt that long ago either.

No, I believe he used a NBBD.

"Duwop" > wrote in message
...
> Tyler Hopper wrote:
> > "Dana Myers" > wrote in message
> >> Interesting. Presumably the fire would be arranged to burn from
> >> the damper-end?
> >
> > Can't say as I've never cooked on a offset but that sounds reasonable
> > to me. Sounds particularly adaptable to a horizontal barrel cooker
> > without an external fire box. frohe?
> >
> > I sure wish Eskwired was still around. I believe he cooked on a NBBD
> > and knew every trick in the book. Won a few competitions with it.
>
> Damn, I remember when he posted around here, didnt know he was a barrell
> guy, wasnt that long ago either.

No, I believe he used a NBBD.

Tyler Hopper wrote:
> "Duwop" > wrote in message
>>
>> Damn, I remember when he posted around here, didnt know he was a
>> barrell guy, wasnt that long ago either.
>
> No, I believe he used a NBBD.

Sorry, nomenclature, I think of barrell and off-set as synonymous. Frohe
would disagree as would Rocky I guess.



--

Tyler Hopper wrote:
> Can't say as I've never cooked on a offset but that sounds
reasonable
> to me. Sounds particularly adaptable to a horizontal barrel cooker
> without an external fire box. frohe?

I've not done it personally but it does sound resonable. Still, air
flow would be the key to keepin it burnin at the right rate for temp
control. Since my ol drum is leaky as hell, I'm more into fire size
to keep my temps where I want them.
--
-frohe
Life is too short to be in a hurry

Tyler Hopper wrote:
> Can't say as I've never cooked on a offset but that sounds
reasonable
> to me. Sounds particularly adaptable to a horizontal barrel cooker
> without an external fire box. frohe?

I've not done it personally but it does sound resonable. Still, air
flow would be the key to keepin it burnin at the right rate for temp
control. Since my ol drum is leaky as hell, I'm more into fire size
to keep my temps where I want them.
--
-frohe
Life is too short to be in a hurry

Duwop wrote:
> Sorry, nomenclature, I think of barrell and off-set as synonymous.
> Frohe would disagree as would Rocky I guess.

Yeah, I don't think I could lump the two together.
--
-frohe
Life is too short to be in a hurry

Duwop wrote:
> Sorry, nomenclature, I think of barrell and off-set as synonymous.
> Frohe would disagree as would Rocky I guess.

Yeah, I don't think I could lump the two together.
--
-frohe
Life is too short to be in a hurry

Dave Bugg wrote:
> M&M wrote:
>
>> Nobody badmouths
>> Big Jim's 'Q'.
>
> That's a fact.

Only when the line is too long (I was drinking beer and BSing with TFM® and
others) and the brisket runs out!
I'll try *not* to let that happen ever again.

BOB
but everything else was excellent

Duwop wrote:

>>"Dana Myers" > wrote in message
>>
>>>Interesting. Presumably the fire would be arranged to burn from
>>>the damper-end?

> FWIW, seems that the fuel burns best further away from the inlet damper and
> closer to the firebox exit hole near the cooking chamber. I assume that's
> where the best through ventilation occurs.

I tend to think that the airflow is more consistent the
further you get from the damper opening; this probably
wouldn't be true if there was a duct of some length
(a few feet) attached at the damper opening, but I'm
not up to trying that mod quite yet. :-)

> Probably another reason fuel doesnt burn too well there on mine as well,
> only strays gets close to the inlet so they don't get much help from their
> neighbors.

Good point.

Cheers,
Dana

Lori Hunt wrote:


> Q: Did I pre-burn and get the fire glowing red first?
> A: No. In retrospect, that would probably help out with the
> temperature eveness issue. It's a lot easier to keep a large fire
> burning than it is to maintain a small one. Right now the smokers are
> setting on the deck, which doesn't encourage fire pits.

Get that stuff *off* the deck! Now! You *do* like your house,
don't you?
I'm serious. Never cook on anything but concrete or your yard.



Once some of the stuff is taken care (I can't
> go to school forever, can? Please say no....), I can take a full
> weekend and do nothing but work with the fire. Until then, it's the
> gas smoker. I can get a lot of homework done in 3-4 hours. : )
>
> Grins,
>
> Lori


Darlin', some of us that have been "practicing" for years *still*
work on fire control. It does take more than a weekend.
I detect a real sense of dedication here though, and I'm sure you'll
get it right with time.


Best of luck with all your endeavours,
TFM®

Duwop wrote:
> Tyler Hopper wrote:
>> "Duwop" > wrote in message
>>>
>>> Damn, I remember when he posted around here, didnt know he was a
>>> barrell guy, wasnt that long ago either.
>>
>> No, I believe he used a NBBD.
>
> Sorry, nomenclature, I think of barrell and off-set as synonymous.
> Frohe would disagree as would Rocky I guess.


What about us purists? When we hear "barrel", we think of a device for
burning logs to coals for the purpose of shoveling.


Yeah, I know, I'm not a real purist as I've cooked with gas and lump, but I
have been there.


TFM®

TFM® wrote:
> Duwop wrote:
>> Tyler Hopper wrote:
>>> "Duwop" > wrote in message
>>>>
>>>> Damn, I remember when he posted around here, didnt know he was a
>>>> barrell guy, wasnt that long ago either.
>>>
>>> No, I believe he used a NBBD.
>>
>> Sorry, nomenclature, I think of barrell and off-set as synonymous.
>> Frohe would disagree as would Rocky I guess.
>
>
> What about us purists? When we hear "barrel", we think of a device for
> burning logs to coals for the purpose of shoveling.
>
>
> Yeah, I know, I'm not a real purist as I've cooked with gas and lump, but I
> have been there.
>
>
> TFM®

Dood! If I bring a Ceramic (with a capital K) to Burnt Island on Jan. 1, and
fire it up for you, you will have then cooked on just about all of 'em, Huh?

BOB

TFM® wrote:
> Duwop wrote:
>> Tyler Hopper wrote:
>>> "Duwop" > wrote in message
>>>>
>>>> Damn, I remember when he posted around here, didnt know he was a
>>>> barrell guy, wasnt that long ago either.
>>>
>>> No, I believe he used a NBBD.
>>
>> Sorry, nomenclature, I think of barrell and off-set as synonymous.
>> Frohe would disagree as would Rocky I guess.
>
>
> What about us purists? When we hear "barrel", we think of a device for
> burning logs to coals for the purpose of shoveling.
>
>
> Yeah, I know, I'm not a real purist as I've cooked with gas and lump, but I
> have been there.
>
>
> TFM®

Dood! If I bring a Ceramic (with a capital K) to Burnt Island on Jan. 1, and
fire it up for you, you will have then cooked on just about all of 'em, Huh?

BOB

BOB wrote:
> TFM® wrote:
>> Duwop wrote:
>>> Tyler Hopper wrote:
>>>> "Duwop" > wrote in message
>>>>>
>>>>> Damn, I remember when he posted around here, didnt know he was a
>>>>> barrell guy, wasnt that long ago either.
>>>>
>>>> No, I believe he used a NBBD.
>>>
>>> Sorry, nomenclature, I think of barrell and off-set as synonymous.
>>> Frohe would disagree as would Rocky I guess.
>>
>>
>> What about us purists? When we hear "barrel", we think of a device
>> for burning logs to coals for the purpose of shoveling.
>>
>>
>> Yeah, I know, I'm not a real purist as I've cooked with gas and
>> lump, but I have been there.
>>
>>
>> TFM®
>
> Dood! If I bring a Ceramic (with a capital K) to Burnt Island on
> Jan. 1, and fire it up for you, you will have then cooked on just
> about all of 'em, Huh?
>
> BOB


All but electric, compadre.

Bring it. You know there will be the need for extra feed when all the
yokels have gone. Our campsite is just a couple miles away. We can have a
shindig!

Big Jim's been to the camp. We're semi-civilized. Have no fear.


TFM®