Baking (rec.food.baking) For bakers, would-be bakers, and fans and consumers of breads, pastries, cakes, pies, cookies, crackers, bagels, and other items commonly found in a bakery. Includes all methods of preparation, both conventional and not.

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  #31 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 27-03-2005, 06:39 AM
Eric Jorgensen
 
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On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 03:35:49 GMT
"Raj V" wrote:

Eric Jorgensen wrote:
SNIP
The ceramic tile transfers heat very quickly, and the bottom of the
crust is very well seared, but then it's pretty much done. The bottom
of the pizza ends up being over-hard and the quality of the crumb
suffers because of the drop in the rate of thermal transfer. The only
way to compensate is to use a lower oven temperature, and then the
quality of the browning on the top side suffers.

I get a more uniform bake with the fibrament stone. With the oven at
500f the bottom of the crust is not over hard, the crumb is well
developed,
and if i use the old tiles to lower the ceiling over the pizza, the top
is very well browned.

SNIP

I'm curious, what is there about the fibrament stone that allows it to
cook more uniformly than the ceramic tiles, the thickness? My old
Saltilo tiles were about 3/4 inch thick and made the el cheapo Sears
oven we used at that time fairly usable. They cracked, but I used them
for almost 20 years that way with no problems.



I've never used saltillo in an oven, so I can't compare it directly.

The fibrament cement is a mixture of heat conductive materials and
insulating materials that ensure a more steady rate of thermal transfer.
Certainly more steady than my old ceramic tiles, which are admittedly
denser than saltillo.


The oven of the local pizza joint, Fuzzy's, is set to almost 600 degrees
and has what looks like a thick brick-like floor. Since it is constantly
being opened I assume it probably stays around 500 degrees. Excellent
pizza BTW.



The pizza fascists from Naples mandate an oven temperature in excess of
700 degrees. At least if you want to call it Neapolitan Pizza (tm). At
these temperatures, the bake time is less than 2 minutes.

There are probably a lot of good commercial oven floor materials.
Fibrament is the only one that I know of available in a home oven product
that can be ordered online and arrive at your door inside of a week, with a
10 year warranty.

With my ceramic tiles, I had this problem. The accepted wisdom is "as
hot as possible" but at 500f the ceramic tiles were turning my crust into a
cracker. I had to back it down to 425, and then the outer crust still came
out crunchy.

With the fibrament slab, it takes a lot longer to get it up to 500f
than it took with the ceramic tiles. My bake time is shorter than it was at
500f with the ceramic tiles.

There's a distinctive acrid stench of searing dough when the stone
starts to dump heat into the pizza. With the fibrament stone, it's not as
strong, and it doesn't last as long. I suspect that this means that the
peak thermal transfer rate rapidly drops off after the initial contact.

But, the crust is cooked through faster, which has to mean that the
curve flattens out and i get more heat over time than i did with the
ceramic tiles.

The other great thing, the outer ring of the crust is crisp and browned
on the outside, soft, fluffy, and chewey on the inside. This was a
surprise. I did not expect this at all. It's also very nice.

It looks like the secret to bubbling cheese and browned toppings
WITHOUT an overcooked crust at home is lowering the ceiling over the pizza.

If you go to Lowes or Home Depot you can get five 7" unglazed quarry
tiles for about a dollar each, and if you *ask, they will grudgingly admit
that they can cut one of them for free. Have them cut one of them squarely
in half, perpendicular to the ridges on the underside of the tile. This
will give you a 14x17.5 ceramic shelf on one of your oven racks. Assuming
you can fit that on your racks. This is what i used to bake my pizza on.

With this 6" above the pizza, by the time the outer ring of the crust is
browned, the cheese in the center is bubbling and the pepperoni has started
to curl upward. This is probably true even if you're baking a frozen pizza
on the bare rack.

You'd think that all the open air space above this suspended ceiling
would kill the effect, but it doesn't. I should experiment with putting, I
don't know, a pan of bread sticks up there.

It might be possible to get some of the same effect by putting a half
sheet pan (cookie sheet? what's that?) on the rack above whatever you're
baking your pizza on, but I'm not going to experiment with that until the
next time i get roped into baking pizza at my parents house.


  #32 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 27-03-2005, 06:39 AM
Eric Jorgensen
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 03:35:49 GMT
"Raj V" wrote:

Eric Jorgensen wrote:
SNIP
The ceramic tile transfers heat very quickly, and the bottom of the
crust is very well seared, but then it's pretty much done. The bottom
of the pizza ends up being over-hard and the quality of the crumb
suffers because of the drop in the rate of thermal transfer. The only
way to compensate is to use a lower oven temperature, and then the
quality of the browning on the top side suffers.

I get a more uniform bake with the fibrament stone. With the oven at
500f the bottom of the crust is not over hard, the crumb is well
developed,
and if i use the old tiles to lower the ceiling over the pizza, the top
is very well browned.

SNIP

I'm curious, what is there about the fibrament stone that allows it to
cook more uniformly than the ceramic tiles, the thickness? My old
Saltilo tiles were about 3/4 inch thick and made the el cheapo Sears
oven we used at that time fairly usable. They cracked, but I used them
for almost 20 years that way with no problems.



I've never used saltillo in an oven, so I can't compare it directly.

The fibrament cement is a mixture of heat conductive materials and
insulating materials that ensure a more steady rate of thermal transfer.
Certainly more steady than my old ceramic tiles, which are admittedly
denser than saltillo.


The oven of the local pizza joint, Fuzzy's, is set to almost 600 degrees
and has what looks like a thick brick-like floor. Since it is constantly
being opened I assume it probably stays around 500 degrees. Excellent
pizza BTW.



The pizza fascists from Naples mandate an oven temperature in excess of
700 degrees. At least if you want to call it Neapolitan Pizza (tm). At
these temperatures, the bake time is less than 2 minutes.

There are probably a lot of good commercial oven floor materials.
Fibrament is the only one that I know of available in a home oven product
that can be ordered online and arrive at your door inside of a week, with a
10 year warranty.

With my ceramic tiles, I had this problem. The accepted wisdom is "as
hot as possible" but at 500f the ceramic tiles were turning my crust into a
cracker. I had to back it down to 425, and then the outer crust still came
out crunchy.

With the fibrament slab, it takes a lot longer to get it up to 500f
than it took with the ceramic tiles. My bake time is shorter than it was at
500f with the ceramic tiles.

There's a distinctive acrid stench of searing dough when the stone
starts to dump heat into the pizza. With the fibrament stone, it's not as
strong, and it doesn't last as long. I suspect that this means that the
peak thermal transfer rate rapidly drops off after the initial contact.

But, the crust is cooked through faster, which has to mean that the
curve flattens out and i get more heat over time than i did with the
ceramic tiles.

The other great thing, the outer ring of the crust is crisp and browned
on the outside, soft, fluffy, and chewey on the inside. This was a
surprise. I did not expect this at all. It's also very nice.

It looks like the secret to bubbling cheese and browned toppings
WITHOUT an overcooked crust at home is lowering the ceiling over the pizza.

If you go to Lowes or Home Depot you can get five 7" unglazed quarry
tiles for about a dollar each, and if you *ask, they will grudgingly admit
that they can cut one of them for free. Have them cut one of them squarely
in half, perpendicular to the ridges on the underside of the tile. This
will give you a 14x17.5 ceramic shelf on one of your oven racks. Assuming
you can fit that on your racks. This is what i used to bake my pizza on.

With this 6" above the pizza, by the time the outer ring of the crust is
browned, the cheese in the center is bubbling and the pepperoni has started
to curl upward. This is probably true even if you're baking a frozen pizza
on the bare rack.

You'd think that all the open air space above this suspended ceiling
would kill the effect, but it doesn't. I should experiment with putting, I
don't know, a pan of bread sticks up there.

It might be possible to get some of the same effect by putting a half
sheet pan (cookie sheet? what's that?) on the rack above whatever you're
baking your pizza on, but I'm not going to experiment with that until the
next time i get roped into baking pizza at my parents house.

  #33 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 27-03-2005, 06:39 AM
Eric Jorgensen
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Sun, 27 Mar 2005 03:35:49 GMT
"Raj V" wrote:

Eric Jorgensen wrote:
SNIP
The ceramic tile transfers heat very quickly, and the bottom of the
crust is very well seared, but then it's pretty much done. The bottom
of the pizza ends up being over-hard and the quality of the crumb
suffers because of the drop in the rate of thermal transfer. The only
way to compensate is to use a lower oven temperature, and then the
quality of the browning on the top side suffers.

I get a more uniform bake with the fibrament stone. With the oven at
500f the bottom of the crust is not over hard, the crumb is well
developed,
and if i use the old tiles to lower the ceiling over the pizza, the top
is very well browned.

SNIP

I'm curious, what is there about the fibrament stone that allows it to
cook more uniformly than the ceramic tiles, the thickness? My old
Saltilo tiles were about 3/4 inch thick and made the el cheapo Sears
oven we used at that time fairly usable. They cracked, but I used them
for almost 20 years that way with no problems.



I've never used saltillo in an oven, so I can't compare it directly.

The fibrament cement is a mixture of heat conductive materials and
insulating materials that ensure a more steady rate of thermal transfer.
Certainly more steady than my old ceramic tiles, which are admittedly
denser than saltillo.


The oven of the local pizza joint, Fuzzy's, is set to almost 600 degrees
and has what looks like a thick brick-like floor. Since it is constantly
being opened I assume it probably stays around 500 degrees. Excellent
pizza BTW.



The pizza fascists from Naples mandate an oven temperature in excess of
700 degrees. At least if you want to call it Neapolitan Pizza (tm). At
these temperatures, the bake time is less than 2 minutes.

There are probably a lot of good commercial oven floor materials.
Fibrament is the only one that I know of available in a home oven product
that can be ordered online and arrive at your door inside of a week, with a
10 year warranty.

With my ceramic tiles, I had this problem. The accepted wisdom is "as
hot as possible" but at 500f the ceramic tiles were turning my crust into a
cracker. I had to back it down to 425, and then the outer crust still came
out crunchy.

With the fibrament slab, it takes a lot longer to get it up to 500f
than it took with the ceramic tiles. My bake time is shorter than it was at
500f with the ceramic tiles.

There's a distinctive acrid stench of searing dough when the stone
starts to dump heat into the pizza. With the fibrament stone, it's not as
strong, and it doesn't last as long. I suspect that this means that the
peak thermal transfer rate rapidly drops off after the initial contact.

But, the crust is cooked through faster, which has to mean that the
curve flattens out and i get more heat over time than i did with the
ceramic tiles.

The other great thing, the outer ring of the crust is crisp and browned
on the outside, soft, fluffy, and chewey on the inside. This was a
surprise. I did not expect this at all. It's also very nice.

It looks like the secret to bubbling cheese and browned toppings
WITHOUT an overcooked crust at home is lowering the ceiling over the pizza.

If you go to Lowes or Home Depot you can get five 7" unglazed quarry
tiles for about a dollar each, and if you *ask, they will grudgingly admit
that they can cut one of them for free. Have them cut one of them squarely
in half, perpendicular to the ridges on the underside of the tile. This
will give you a 14x17.5 ceramic shelf on one of your oven racks. Assuming
you can fit that on your racks. This is what i used to bake my pizza on.

With this 6" above the pizza, by the time the outer ring of the crust is
browned, the cheese in the center is bubbling and the pepperoni has started
to curl upward. This is probably true even if you're baking a frozen pizza
on the bare rack.

You'd think that all the open air space above this suspended ceiling
would kill the effect, but it doesn't. I should experiment with putting, I
don't know, a pan of bread sticks up there.

It might be possible to get some of the same effect by putting a half
sheet pan (cookie sheet? what's that?) on the rack above whatever you're
baking your pizza on, but I'm not going to experiment with that until the
next time i get roped into baking pizza at my parents house.

  #34 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 31-03-2005, 09:42 PM
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Try Charles Van Over's "The Best Bread Ever" for THE WAY in your food
processor. Also highly recommended are Peter Rineharts's fine works
on breads.

Three cheers for thick stones. The only way to go.

Run your over up as HIGH as it will go; typically this will be only
about 550 but with a thick stone and at least an hour preheat you will
get closer to the real thing found in the brick ovens.

Weigh your ingredients, stick to maybe 68% hydration on pizza dough.
Skip the oil. Go easy on the yeast, and no sugar. Forget about
tossing.

We spent 3 weeks in Italy last fall and I was pleased to visit quite a
few pizzerias. I talked my way into the back room of several just to
witness exactly how they do it. The best pizza we had there came from
a place in Tuscany where I watched the guys grab balls of dough, slam
'em down on the counter, give 'em about 6 or 7 quick rolls in several
directions with the french pin, and whip out a ready to go pizza in
about 20 seconds. Into the hearth oven and no more than about 3
minutes later out comes a smoking hot beautifully cooked pizza.

Nirvana.

By the way, is there a general consensus that the Fibraments are pretty
much the way to go? This stuff is actually in many commercial ovens as
the decking, I believe, yes?

  #35 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 27-04-2005, 04:35 AM
jimmyjames
 
Posts: n/a
Default

pizza stone snob
"Eric Jorgensen" wrote in message
news:[email protected]
On Sat, 26 Mar 2005 04:25:09 GMT
"jimmyjames" wrote:

I have an "unglazed ceramic tile" 5/8ths 14x14 (Sq.)
It works every bit as good as my 18" round pizza pan with the "holes".
Except when I use the stone, I have to not only have to heat up the
oven, I have to heat up the stinkin stone. The people at "bed, bath and
beyond" really wanted me to buy a pizza stone... I asked what the
advantage was and they said " well, alls ya gotta do is heat the stone,
take the pizza out of the box, and slide the pizza on to the stone"
I'll put my pizza up to anyones! Stinkin' "pizza stone snobs"!



Aight. You're on. Come on over any time.

I upgraded from five 7" unglazed ceramic tiles to a 20x15x.75 Fibrament
stone this week. I have one of those perforated pans, too.

The difference is more than noticeable.

The perforated pans trap too much moisture, and the bottom of the crust
ends up being slightly gelled by the steam. Also, cheese gets stuck in the
holes and i hate cleaning it.

The ceramic tile transfers heat very quickly, and the bottom of the
crust is very well seared, but then it's pretty much done. The bottom of
the pizza ends up being over-hard and the quality of the crumb suffers
because of the drop in the rate of thermal transfer. The only way to
compensate is to use a lower oven temperature, and then the quality of the
browning on the top side suffers.

I get a more uniform bake with the fibrament stone. With the oven at
500f the bottom of the crust is not over hard, the crumb is well

developed,
and if i use the old tiles to lower the ceiling over the pizza, the top is
very well browned.

I'm still experimenting with it. Made my third pizza tonight. I'm sure
i'll get sick of pizza at some point and have to start making breads on

it.

Do i have to preheat it? You betcha. It takes like an hour for my 70's
vintage crappy Whirlpool oven to get it to 500f. But it's worth it.

As for BB&B, I've seen their pizza stone, and it's best used as a clay
pigeon.

Someone here mentioned having a great deal of success with a slab of
soapstone, and i imagine that works quite well. More likely to break than
the fibrament stone, but way cheaper if you buy it as a scrap -- stone
vendors often have likely shaped chunks left over after cutting out a hole
for a sink in a counter top, for example.





  #36 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 27-04-2005, 04:35 AM
jimmyjames
 
Posts: n/a
Default

pizza stone snob
"Eric Jorgensen" wrote in message
news:[email protected]
On Sat, 26 Mar 2005 04:25:09 GMT
"jimmyjames" wrote:

I have an "unglazed ceramic tile" 5/8ths 14x14 (Sq.)
It works every bit as good as my 18" round pizza pan with the "holes".
Except when I use the stone, I have to not only have to heat up the
oven, I have to heat up the stinkin stone. The people at "bed, bath and
beyond" really wanted me to buy a pizza stone... I asked what the
advantage was and they said " well, alls ya gotta do is heat the stone,
take the pizza out of the box, and slide the pizza on to the stone"
I'll put my pizza up to anyones! Stinkin' "pizza stone snobs"!



Aight. You're on. Come on over any time.

I upgraded from five 7" unglazed ceramic tiles to a 20x15x.75 Fibrament
stone this week. I have one of those perforated pans, too.

The difference is more than noticeable.

The perforated pans trap too much moisture, and the bottom of the crust
ends up being slightly gelled by the steam. Also, cheese gets stuck in the
holes and i hate cleaning it.

The ceramic tile transfers heat very quickly, and the bottom of the
crust is very well seared, but then it's pretty much done. The bottom of
the pizza ends up being over-hard and the quality of the crumb suffers
because of the drop in the rate of thermal transfer. The only way to
compensate is to use a lower oven temperature, and then the quality of the
browning on the top side suffers.

I get a more uniform bake with the fibrament stone. With the oven at
500f the bottom of the crust is not over hard, the crumb is well

developed,
and if i use the old tiles to lower the ceiling over the pizza, the top is
very well browned.

I'm still experimenting with it. Made my third pizza tonight. I'm sure
i'll get sick of pizza at some point and have to start making breads on

it.

Do i have to preheat it? You betcha. It takes like an hour for my 70's
vintage crappy Whirlpool oven to get it to 500f. But it's worth it.

As for BB&B, I've seen their pizza stone, and it's best used as a clay
pigeon.

Someone here mentioned having a great deal of success with a slab of
soapstone, and i imagine that works quite well. More likely to break than
the fibrament stone, but way cheaper if you buy it as a scrap -- stone
vendors often have likely shaped chunks left over after cutting out a hole
for a sink in a counter top, for example.



  #37 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 27-04-2005, 03:56 PM
Eric Jorgensen
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Wed, 27 Apr 2005 03:35:02 GMT
"jimmyjames" wrote:

pizza stone snob



I'm also a tea snob, and an unrepentant arguer that volkswagens are
superior to hondas. I also believe that it's entirely appropriate for a
convicted felon such as Martha Stewart to have to wear a cumbersome
tracking device while under house arrest - just to remind 'em that they're
still being punished.

Wanna make something of it? I question your right to use the name of a
Stephen Root character, and challenge you to a bake-off, provided you can
pay my nominal travel and hosting fees . . .
  #38 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 27-04-2005, 03:56 PM
Eric Jorgensen
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Wed, 27 Apr 2005 03:35:02 GMT
"jimmyjames" wrote:

pizza stone snob



I'm also a tea snob, and an unrepentant arguer that volkswagens are
superior to hondas. I also believe that it's entirely appropriate for a
convicted felon such as Martha Stewart to have to wear a cumbersome
tracking device while under house arrest - just to remind 'em that they're
still being punished.

Wanna make something of it? I question your right to use the name of a
Stephen Root character, and challenge you to a bake-off, provided you can
pay my nominal travel and hosting fees . . .
  #39 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 28-04-2005, 02:01 AM
jimmyjames
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Tea... That's a Chinese drink isn't it? Aren't they a seven or eight
thousand year old society that still use sticks to eat with? And the VW and
Honda thing? We fought both Japan and Germany in the last "Big One" and now
If you're driving an American made car, "Yer sum kinda idiot!" I DRIVE A
TOYOTA! MADE RIGHT HERE IN THE GOOD OL' USA!
Martha Stewart?!?! I alllllwaaaayzz hated her... ("Hate?... That's some
mighty strong language there, "BIG BOY"...) But that's plenty to fill
volumes and volumes on another day.... Anyway... I think that both OJ and
Michael Jackson are completely INNOCENT!
And the name? It's my "given" last name... My full name is James J
Jimmyjames.
James James Jimmyjames IV

I'm also a tea snob, and an unrepentant arguer that volkswagens are
superior to hondas. I also believe that it's entirely appropriate for a
convicted felon such as Martha Stewart to have to wear a cumbersome
tracking device while under house arrest - just to remind 'em that they're
still being punished.

Wanna make something of it? I question your right to use the name of a
Stephen Root character, and challenge you to a bake-off, provided you can
pay my nominal travel and hosting fees . . .



  #40 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 28-04-2005, 02:14 AM
jimmyjames
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Oh yea... As an experiment, Last night, I made a pizza using "Pillsbury
Pizza Dough" I even used the stinkin' Pizza Stone. I used Italian Sausage,
Manzinilla olive slices, Sauteed Onions and Mushrooms, pepperoni and a
little more than a lb. of mozerla...
It was better than frozen, better than boboli... but not nearly as good as
Good ol' homade crust on my perforated pan...

"Eric Jorgensen" wrote in message
news:[email protected]
On Wed, 27 Apr 2005 03:35:02 GMT
"jimmyjames" wrote:

pizza stone snob



I'm also a tea snob, and an unrepentant arguer that volkswagens are
superior to hondas. I also believe that it's entirely appropriate for a
convicted felon such as Martha Stewart to have to wear a cumbersome
tracking device while under house arrest - just to remind 'em that they're
still being punished.

Wanna make something of it? I question your right to use the name of a
Stephen Root character, and challenge you to a bake-off, provided you can
pay my nominal travel and hosting fees . . .





  #41 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 28-04-2005, 12:19 PM
Ida Slapter
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Wed, 27 Apr 2005 08:56:09 -0600, Eric Jorgensen
wrote:

I also believe that it's entirely appropriate for a
convicted felon such as Martha Stewart to have to wear a cumbersome
tracking device while under house arrest - just to remind 'em that they're
still being punished.


How do you feel about conticted and released sexual preditors?



The Fine Art of Cooking involves personal choice.
Many preferences, ingredients, and procedures may not
be consistent with what you know to be true.
As with any recipe, you may find your personal
intervention will be necessary. Bon Appetit!
  #42 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 28-04-2005, 02:16 PM
Mike Avery
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Ida Slapter wrote:

On Wed, 27 Apr 2005 08:56:09 -0600, Eric Jorgensen
wrote:



I also believe that it's entirely appropriate for a
convicted felon such as Martha Stewart to have to wear a cumbersome
tracking device while under house arrest - just to remind 'em that they're
still being punished.



How do you feel about conticted and released sexual preditors?



I'm not sure what either of these have to do with baking.

In Martha Stewart's case, she hasn't finished serving her sentence.
She's on probation, and the tracking device is part of her sentence.

In the case of sexual predators, there are some real issues. If they
are out on probation, they should be tracked like any other parolee.
However, should a person be marked for life because of something they
did and served a sentence for? Should they have another chance at a
normal life. Registration has caused some real problems for people who
are trying to get their lives back together. Some people have made
independent copies of the sexual offender lists and put them on-line.
And, while you can get off the government's lists, you can't get off the
independent ones - there are just too many of them. Which doesn't seem
at all fair.

So, I'd like say yes, they should have a chance at a normal life, but
the recidivism rate on sexual offenders is shockingly high. Until we
have therapy that really, really works, until we have therapy and
analysis that can accurately predict which offender will return to their
illegal ways, registration is the least of the evils.

Mike

  #43 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 28-04-2005, 02:16 PM
Wayne Boatwright
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Thu 28 Apr 2005 04:19:29a, Ida Slapter wrote in rec.food.baking:

On Wed, 27 Apr 2005 08:56:09 -0600, Eric Jorgensen
wrote:

I also believe that it's entirely appropriate for a
convicted felon such as Martha Stewart to have to wear a cumbersome
tracking device while under house arrest - just to remind 'em that they're
still being punished.


How do you feel about conticted and released sexual preditors?


I say if you "contict" them, then you should relase them!

--
Wayne Boatwright **
____________________________________________

Give me a smart idiot over a stupid genius any day.
Sam Goldwyn, 1882-1974
  #44 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 28-04-2005, 02:24 PM
Eric Jorgensen
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On Thu, 28 Apr 2005 11:19:29 GMT
Ida Slapter wrote:

On Wed, 27 Apr 2005 08:56:09 -0600, Eric Jorgensen
wrote:

I also believe that it's entirely appropriate for a
convicted felon such as Martha Stewart to have to wear a cumbersome
tracking device while under house arrest - just to remind 'em that
they're still being punished.


How do you feel about conticted and released sexual preditors?



When their attorneys successfully argue that they should commute half
their sentence to house arrest, they should wear 'em too.
  #45 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 28-04-2005, 08:58 PM
Ida Slapter
 
Posts: n/a
Default

On 28 Apr 2005 15:16:23 +0200, Wayne Boatwright
wrote:

I say if you "contict" them, then you should relase them!


Ok...there was an error with one finger between a "T" and a
"V".....and I know you know the meaning of one finger! vbg



The Fine Art of Cooking involves personal choice.
Many preferences, ingredients, and procedures may not
be consistent with what you know to be true.
As with any recipe, you may find your personal
intervention will be necessary. Bon Appetit!


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