I read a lot of the posts here and everyone seems to get involved in the
process of "getting it right" and in this process spending wads of dosh on
this and that particular additive/device for making the perfect wine,
personally I make wine to get ratted and save money, if it tastes ok and has
enough alcohol it's fine by me, a few floaty bits aint gonna hurt me and god
knows what the acid levels etc are, all I care about is the end result.
Am i wrong in thinking this way as I thought the whole purpose of alcohol
was to get wasted.
Do not take offence at my comments as they are not meant that way, after all
i am quite ratted on latest kit brew.
Happy drinking.

Leon, you're a hoot! Some folks have palates in their tongues and like
to swish and sniff. If you just want the buzz, hey, go for it. smile.
Personally, I like to share my wine. Giving someone a "wow, that's good"
reaction makes me smile inside.
I don't plan on submitting to contests for prizes. If I can make a
better bottle of wine than I can buy, and it's cheaper. wow. how cool. I
have money left over for gas for my car. smile.

--
DAve

p.s. Wonder if anyone has car gas kits... hmm, now THAT would be
interesting.

leon wrote:
> I read a lot of the posts here and everyone seems to get involved in the
> process of "getting it right" and in this process spending wads of dosh on
> this and that particular additive/device for making the perfect wine,
> personally I make wine to get ratted and save money, if it tastes ok and has
> enough alcohol it's fine by me, a few floaty bits aint gonna hurt me and god
> knows what the acid levels etc are, all I care about is the end result.
> Am i wrong in thinking this way as I thought the whole purpose of alcohol
> was to get wasted.
> Do not take offence at my comments as they are not meant that way, after all
> i am quite ratted on latest kit brew.
> Happy drinking.
>
>

Hello,
No offence taken...winemaking at home can be as easy or as difficult as
one wants to make it - it is up to you, the individual winemaker. We all
start at one point, and some of us move on, some of us don't. I've always
thought we're pretty good at accepting anyone who wants to make wine, at
whatever level. I make fruit, veggie, herb, and frozen juice wines. I really
don't have an interest in making a grape wine, nor do I take much interest
in the chemistry side of things. However, I do appreciate those who do have
the interest, the background, and the desire to learn from others (I read a
lot of the posts). Welcome.
Darlene


"leon" > wrote in message
...
>I read a lot of the posts here and everyone seems to get involved in the
>process of "getting it right" and in this process spending wads of dosh on
>this and that particular additive/device for making the perfect wine,
>personally I make wine to get ratted and save money, if it tastes ok and
>has enough alcohol it's fine by me, a few floaty bits aint gonna hurt me
>and god knows what the acid levels etc are, all I care about is the end
>result.
> Am i wrong in thinking this way as I thought the whole purpose of alcohol
> was to get wasted.
> Do not take offence at my comments as they are not meant that way, after
> all i am quite ratted on latest kit brew.
> Happy drinking.
>

I would be the first to say all of the hardware I use to test wines has
only a minimal effect on making wine better. Mine were about as good
when I only had a hydrometer as they are now but were made from
pre-balanced juice. Maybe I just fell into a good thing though...Your
senses are the best tools you have as a winemaker. The tools and
testing just make it easier for me to verify what I taste or smell and
what I want to do next, if anything. It's easy to make a bad wine
from good materials but impossible to make a great wine from bad
materials.

Most of the testing just helps me not ruin a good thing; most wines
make themselves anyway. The other thing that happened at least with me
is I got a lot pickier about what I like and dislike in a wine over
time. I don't know how that happened actually. I travel a lot and
started noticing there were things I didn't care for in a glass of wine
I had spent $7 for and that mine had tasted something like that at one
point but I did something to change it; mine cost around $0.50 a glass
even factoring in the equipment. Sometimes a little change makes a
bigger difference than I would have expected, it's part of the art.

Joe

I spent a few years living/working in south west france and during one of
these years i followed and participated in the process from pruning the vine
to picking grapes, then they went into this large round wooden press and the
juice ran out down a concrete trough into a large concrete pit where the
juice stayed for a while.
Later the juice was run off into oak barrels these having been swilled out
with water and then a sulphur taper was lit and left to burn a while in the
barrel.
After the appropriate time of fermenting in the barrel the bottles were
swilled with water and lined up to be filled from the barrels.
Then the bottles were corked with dry corks without any sulphite soaking
etc, using an old floor corker.
This was a small scale operation for the use of the family living there and
of course i enjoyed this wine everyday.
My point is that at no time during this process was any particular care
taken about cleanliness etc and the end result was excellent.
I am off to open a bottle now, at 50 pence a bottle it is well worth the
effort.
Hic!

"leon" > wrote in message
...

> Am i wrong in thinking this way as I thought the whole purpose of alcohol
> was to get wasted.

Probably not the whole purpose, and I suppose you should define "wasted".
I tend to think of "wasted" as falling-down sloppy drunk, and this is
certainly
not my purpose in drinking alcohol.

I find a good meal preceded by the cold bite of an ice-cold vodka martini
to be a great joy. And the same good meal in concert with a fine wine
can only enhance the sensual taste experience.

I recently discovered that a glass of good port with a rich chocolate
dessert
does amazing things to the inside of my mouth. Try it sometime.
It has to be experienced to be believed. Again, it has to be a very good
port.

While the above combination of food and alcohol doesn't leave me "wasted"
I have been know to be very happy leaving some restaurants and the
confines of my own kitchen and dining room.

Now that I have begun making my own wine I have found that the wine I
make is far superior to any that I usually buy. I'm just not rich enough to
buy
$30-40 bottles of wine to get the same experience I find that I can now
make for around $4-5 per bottle.

This wine making is a good thing.

Leon, leon, leon...you remind me of myself 40 years ago. When in college we
would buy a six-pack of good beer. After that was gone it didn't matter
what was in the bottle. The main mission was to get high and have a good
time...at least until the next morning.

Fast forward to 2006. Now days I'm retired, have a nice vineyard, make wine
and beer as a hobby. And yes, I spend "wads of dosh" doing these things.
But, I only drink the good stuff now days.

Bill Frazier
Olathe, Kansas USA

leon wrote
">I read a lot of the posts here and everyone seems to get involved in the
> process of "getting it right" and in this process spending wads of dosh
> on this and that particular additive/device for making the perfect wine,
> personally I make wine to get ratted and save money, if it tastes ok and
> has enough alcohol it's fine by me"

"William Frazier" > wrote in message
...
> Leon, leon, leon...you remind me of myself 40 years ago. When in college
> we would buy a six-pack of good beer. After that was gone it didn't
> matter what was in the bottle. The main mission was to get high and have
> a good time...at least until the next morning.
>
> Fast forward to 2006. Now days I'm retired, have a nice vineyard, make
> wine and beer as a hobby. And yes, I spend "wads of dosh" doing these
> things. But, I only drink the good stuff now days.
>
> Bill Frazier
> Olathe, Kansas USA
>
> leon wrote
> ">I read a lot of the posts here and everyone seems to get involved in the
>> process of "getting it right" and in this process spending wads of dosh
>> on this and that particular additive/device for making the perfect wine,
>> personally I make wine to get ratted and save money, if it tastes ok and
>> has enough alcohol it's fine by me"
>
>

Funny old world innit, i retired a few years ago and now spend my time
making cheap kit wines and also fruit and veg wines from my garden produce,
and then enjoy drinking them.
When i reach the bottom of the bottle i am happy and that is all that really
matters to me.
You drink your goodstuff, but i also drink my goodstuff, hic, maybe too
often or maybe not enough, hic, time for another.
Enjoy.

I do both Leon....nothing wrong with either if you ask me. I make my
cheapest plonky quaffing wine from frozen concentrate, and the rest,
the more "crafty" stuff from herbs and fruit from my garden. Actually I
like to drink the plnok whilst admiring the crafty stuff

sean

"snpm" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>I do both Leon....nothing wrong with either if you ask me. I make my
> cheapest plonky quaffing wine from frozen concentrate, and the rest,
> the more "crafty" stuff from herbs and fruit from my garden. Actually I
> like to drink the plnok whilst admiring the crafty stuff
>
> sean
>

Yep i do the same, the quick kit wines give me my day to day supply and the
rest i make up as i go along.
I get a nice wine from hibiscus sabdariffa flowers (grown in my garden)
mixed with elderberry and sloe ( gathered locally ),although hibiscus on its
own is very nice.

See you all got it all wrong.

For the most part I like making good wine and making it cheap cheap
cheap.

For instance with a little elbow grease I make 6 gallons of pretty good
mulberry wine for the price of sugar and a can or two of grape
concentrate.

but i do not get trashed on it. what a waste of good wine.


leon wrote:
> I read a lot of the posts here and everyone seems to get involved in the
> process of "getting it right" and in this process spending wads of dosh on
> this and that particular additive/device for making the perfect wine,
> personally I make wine to get ratted and save money, if it tastes ok and has
> enough alcohol it's fine by me, a few floaty bits aint gonna hurt me and god
> knows what the acid levels etc are, all I care about is the end result.
> Am i wrong in thinking this way as I thought the whole purpose of alcohol
> was to get wasted.
> Do not take offence at my comments as they are not meant that way, after all
> i am quite ratted on latest kit brew.
> Happy drinking.

"Droopy" > wrote in message
oups.com...

>
> but i do not get trashed on it. what a waste of good wine.
>
>
Don't see how drinking wine is wasting it, what else can you do with wine
but drink it.
It's alcohol and alcohol gets you drunk, cannot think of any other reason
for wine, unless you like lining all the bottles up and looking at them with
the light shining through and enjoying the colours
Me, i drink wine and i make it as cheaply as possible, and i enjoy the
feeling after drinking it.
After all once the bottle is open you have to drink it because it don't
really keep long once the air gets to it, then by the time you reach the
bottom of the bottle you feel so good you just have to open another, and
with your friends smiling and saying go on open another, what can a poor boy
do
Enjoy.
http://www.shunammite.com/bacchus.html

leon wrote:
>what can a poor boy
> do


Go to an AA meeting?

"Droopy" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> leon wrote:
>>what can a poor boy
>> do
>
>
> Go to an AA meeting?
>

Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha.
Oh how we larfed.
Where's the damn corkscrew, hic.
Sorry did you say AA meeting, why would i want to go to a motoring
association meeting, don't drive, too drunk, hic.

On 7/21/2006 1:04 PM, leon wrote:
> "Droopy" > wrote in message
> oups.com...
>
>>leon wrote:
>>
>>>what can a poor boy
>>>do
>>
>>
>>Go to an AA meeting?
>>
>
>
> Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha.
> Oh how we larfed.
> Where's the damn corkscrew, hic.
> Sorry did you say AA meeting, why would i want to go to a motoring
> association meeting, don't drive, too drunk, hic.

Leon,

The motoring association you refer to is abbreviated AAA. But I'm not
surprised you're seeing extra letters, with your attitude towards
drinking to excess. Seriously, if your goal is to get drunk you can buy
cheap booze much more cheaply than you can make it.


Cheers,
Ken

"mail box" > wrote in message
...
> On 7/21/2006 1:04 PM, leon wrote:
>> "Droopy" > wrote in message
>> oups.com...
>>
>>>leon wrote:
>>>
>>>>what can a poor boy
>>>>do
>>>
>>>
>>>Go to an AA meeting?
>>>
>>
>>
>> Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha.
>> Oh how we larfed.
>> Where's the damn corkscrew, hic.
>> Sorry did you say AA meeting, why would i want to go to a motoring
>> association meeting, don't drive, too drunk, hic.
>
> Leon,
>
> The motoring association you refer to is abbreviated AAA. But I'm not
> surprised you're seeing extra letters, with your attitude towards drinking
> to excess. Seriously, if your goal is to get drunk you can buy cheap
> booze much more cheaply than you can make it.
>
>
> Cheers,
> Ken

Nope i was refering to:
http://www.theaa.com
There is no cheap booze around here, and anyway that is not what i like.
Cheap homemade wine is what does it for me, tastes good, smells good, and a
lot of bottles for a little outlay.
Incidentally, i am not advocating drinking to excess, just until the legs
wobble and the grin is fixed from ear to ear.
Wine is for enjoying and it is up to the drinker to decide their own
personal limititation.
Life is too short to take it seriously.
Enjoy. hic.

On 7/21/2006 3:50 PM, leon wrote:
[snipped]

> Incidentally, i am not advocating drinking to excess, just until the
legs
> wobble and the grin is fixed from ear to ear.

Your past posts contradict the above statement:

> i am quite ratted on latest kit brew.

> It's alcohol and alcohol gets you drunk, cannot think of any other reason
> for wine

> Sorry did you say AA meeting, why would i want to go to a motoring
> association meeting, don't drive, too drunk, hic.

It reads a lot as though you are indeed advocating drinking to excess.
Not trying (terribly hard) to belabor the point, just pointing out the
discrepancy.


Cheers,
Ken

"mail box" > wrote in message
...
> On 7/21/2006 3:50 PM, leon wrote:
> [snipped]
>
> > Incidentally, i am not advocating drinking to excess, just until the
> legs
> > wobble and the grin is fixed from ear to ear.
>
> Your past posts contradict the above statement:
>
> > i am quite ratted on latest kit brew.
>
> > It's alcohol and alcohol gets you drunk, cannot think of any other
> > reason
> > for wine
>
> > Sorry did you say AA meeting, why would i want to go to a motoring
> > association meeting, don't drive, too drunk, hic.
>
> It reads a lot as though you are indeed advocating drinking to excess.
> Not trying (terribly hard) to belabor the point, just pointing out the
> discrepancy.
>
>
> Cheers,
> Ken

God, you people are sooo picky, don't any of you have a sense of humour,
hic.

Gentlemen, please...let us agree to disagree, or disagree to agree.
Darlene ;o)

"leon" > wrote in message
...
>
> "mail box" > wrote in message
> ...
>> On 7/21/2006 3:50 PM, leon wrote:
>> [snipped]
>>
>> > Incidentally, i am not advocating drinking to excess, just until the
>> legs
>> > wobble and the grin is fixed from ear to ear.
>>
>> Your past posts contradict the above statement:
>>
>> > i am quite ratted on latest kit brew.
>>
>> > It's alcohol and alcohol gets you drunk, cannot think of any other
>> > reason
>> > for wine
>>
>> > Sorry did you say AA meeting, why would i want to go to a motoring
>> > association meeting, don't drive, too drunk, hic.
>>
>> It reads a lot as though you are indeed advocating drinking to excess.
>> Not trying (terribly hard) to belabor the point, just pointing out the
>> discrepancy.
>>
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Ken
>
> God, you people are sooo picky, don't any of you have a sense of humour,
> hic.
>

On 7/21/2006 5:31 PM, leon wrote:
> "mail box" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>On 7/21/2006 3:50 PM, leon wrote:
>>[snipped]
>>
>>
>>>Incidentally, i am not advocating drinking to excess, just until the
>>
>>legs
>>
>>>wobble and the grin is fixed from ear to ear.
>>
>>Your past posts contradict the above statement:
>>
>>
>>>i am quite ratted on latest kit brew.
>>
>>>It's alcohol and alcohol gets you drunk, cannot think of any other
>>>reason
>>>for wine
>>
>>>Sorry did you say AA meeting, why would i want to go to a motoring
>>>association meeting, don't drive, too drunk, hic.
>>
>>It reads a lot as though you are indeed advocating drinking to excess.
>>Not trying (terribly hard) to belabor the point, just pointing out the
>>discrepancy.
>>
>>
>>Cheers,
>>Ken
>
>
> God, you people are sooo picky, don't any of you have a sense of humour,
> hic.


Leon,

I have a sense of humor. It's just that I find jokes about alcoholism
about as funny as jokes about suicide. That is to say, not very funny
at all.
And please, I'm not presenting my opinions as being representative of
any one else in this news group, so please don't apply any labels to
others due to my posts.


Cheers,
Ken

"Dar V" > wrote in message
...
> Gentlemen, please...let us agree to disagree, or disagree to agree.
> Darlene ;o)
>
Okay, i agree to disagree or disagree to agree with whatever.
Just enjoy drinking my wine. :-)

I've yet to bottle my first batch, but I'm looking forward to trying to
come up with something drinkable that I could point to and say that I
helped the fruit. There are too many cheap versions of wine to do it
for financial reasons in my opinion. My misspent youth enjoyed many
bottles of Boones Farm Strawberry Hill, Pink Catawba, and Blue Nun.
The latter being my high end stuff for fancy friends.

Alcohol has contributed to the demise of many and I think that is what
has Ken concerned. I've found people who have seen the destruction
first hand, particularly a loved one, find little humor deep in the
bottle.

Having said that, I drink a couple glasses of someone elses wine every
evening. The weekends, with dinner guests and merryment it goes much
beyond that to the wobbly legs, big grin times. My frequent dinner
guests are all neighbors and they walk home, so no harm, no foul.
Remember, yeast is proof that God loves us and she wants us to be
happy.

Ramblings and musings,

Rick

PS: There seem to be a few Ricks on this board.

"EnoNut" > wrote in message
oups.com...

The weekends, with dinner guests and merryment it goes much
> beyond that to the wobbly legs, big grin times. My frequent dinner
> guests are all neighbors and they walk home, so no harm, no foul.
> Remember, yeast is proof that God loves us and she wants us to be
> happy.
>
> Ramblings and musings,
>
> Rick
>
> PS: There seem to be a few Ricks on this board.
>

I was going to say something, but i will just agree with your comments,
can't remember what it was i was going to say anyway, hic.
Enjoy

Joe Sallustio wrote:
> I would be the first to say all of the hardware I use to test wines has
> only a minimal effect on making wine better. Mine were about as good
> when I only had a hydrometer as they are now but were made from
> pre-balanced juice. Maybe I just fell into a good thing though...Your
> senses are the best tools you have as a winemaker. The tools and
> testing just make it easier for me to verify what I taste or smell and
> what I want to do next, if anything. It's easy to make a bad wine
> from good materials but impossible to make a great wine from bad
> materials.
>
> Most of the testing just helps me not ruin a good thing; most wines
> make themselves anyway. The other thing that happened at least with me
> is I got a lot pickier about what I like and dislike in a wine over
> time. I don't know how that happened actually. I travel a lot and
> started noticing there were things I didn't care for in a glass of wine
> I had spent $7 for and that mine had tasted something like that at one
> point but I did something to change it; mine cost around $0.50 a glass
> even factoring in the equipment. Sometimes a little change makes a
> bigger difference than I would have expected, it's part of the art.
>
> Joe
>

Tonight I gave a friend of mine a bottle of my methgelin, a brew I'm
extremely proud of, it cost about £2 a bottle to make. I'm currently
drinking a dram or two of £200/bottle single malt whisky that he gave
me. I'd rather be drinking the methgelin, it's better (But then I'd
rather be drinking the £75/bottle bowmore special casking he gave me,
only got a shot or two of that left though ) What a bottle costs isn't
everything. How much you enjoy drinking it is. Somehow, drinking
something you've made and having friends say "wow, that's good" makes a
big difference.

On 7/22/2006 7:47 PM, alien wrote:
> Joe Sallustio wrote:
>
>> I would be the first to say all of the hardware I use to test wines has
>> only a minimal effect on making wine better. Mine were about as good
>> when I only had a hydrometer as they are now but were made from
>> pre-balanced juice. Maybe I just fell into a good thing though...Your
>> senses are the best tools you have as a winemaker. The tools and
>> testing just make it easier for me to verify what I taste or smell and
>> what I want to do next, if anything. It's easy to make a bad wine
>> from good materials but impossible to make a great wine from bad
>> materials.
>>
>> Most of the testing just helps me not ruin a good thing; most wines
>> make themselves anyway. The other thing that happened at least with me
>> is I got a lot pickier about what I like and dislike in a wine over
>> time. I don't know how that happened actually. I travel a lot and
>> started noticing there were things I didn't care for in a glass of wine
>> I had spent $7 for and that mine had tasted something like that at one
>> point but I did something to change it; mine cost around $0.50 a glass
>> even factoring in the equipment. Sometimes a little change makes a
>> bigger difference than I would have expected, it's part of the art.
>>
>> Joe
>>
>
> Tonight I gave a friend of mine a bottle of my methgelin, a brew I'm
> extremely proud of, it cost about £2 a bottle to make. I'm currently
> drinking a dram or two of £200/bottle single malt whisky that he gave
> me. I'd rather be drinking the methgelin, it's better (But then I'd
> rather be drinking the £75/bottle bowmore special casking he gave me,
> only got a shot or two of that left though ) What a bottle costs isn't
> everything. How much you enjoy drinking it is. Somehow, drinking
> something you've made and having friends say "wow, that's good" makes a
> big difference.
>

Not to derail the topic, but I very much enjoy the Bowmore 17 year old
offering. It's just lovely.

I've found that it's really very difficult to get a true appraisal from
friends/family/acquaintances. They don't want to say negative things
about something you've hand crafted, regardless of how they really feel.
I've had friends take two sips from the glass, rave about a mead of
mine, and then leave it on the counter. It's a matter of taste, as mead
is not like most wines. I don't take it personally when friends don't
enjoy my mead, and I take it with a large grain of salt when they heap
praises on my meads. Blind judging is the way to go for an unbiased
appraisal, but even then the number of decent mead judges are limited.
Case in point, I recently entered my mead in my homebrew club
competition for the AHA COC. I took second place, and was very happy
with that result. I myself judged the winning entry and gave it a 19 on
a 20 point scale. It was excellent. But a significant portion of those
who had judged my mead offered the advise that it would be better once
it was not so young and had aged a while. Given that fact that this was
a three year old mead, and (if I may be so bold as to judge my own mead)
it is very well integrated and not at all likely to improve with further
aging, I strongly disagree with the judges on this point. I'd far
rather receive judging remarks that say that the judge felt that my mead
was not well integrated, or which point out a flaw or a perceived
deficiency, rather than a judging remark that attempts to guess at some
facet of the mead making process or history and which may be just a wild
guess with no basis in reality.


Cheers,
Ken

Ken wrote;
"I've found that it's really very difficult to get a true appraisal from
friends/family/acquaintances. They don't want to say negative things
about something you've hand crafted, regardless of how they really feel."

You never met my daughter!

"Blind judging is the way to go for an unbiased appraisal, but even then
the number of decent mead judges are limited...
I'd far rather receive judging remarks that say that the judge felt that my
mead
was not well integrated, or which point out a flaw or a perceived
deficiency, rather than a judging remark that attempts to guess at some
facet of the mead making process or history and which may be just a wild
guess with no basis in reality."

My wine club puts on an amateur contest every year. We always have lots of
meads, melomels,
etc. entered and have a separate category for these honey based drinks.
Several members are
mead makers and act as judges. We make an effort to give meaningful
feedback to those who enter the
contest. We have a nice prize for mead best-of-class this year...etched
glasses. Check out
website www.cellarmasters.org.

Bill Frazier
Olathe, Kansas USA

For me it is like woodcarving or fine art..It is taking a raw medium and
creating a beautiful piece of work for all to enjoy.

EnoNut wrote:
> yeast is proof that God loves us and she wants us to be
> happy.
>

Ben Franklin is rolling over in his grave.

Everyone knows that "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be
happy"

> Everyone knows that "Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be
> happy"

Yes, but it's still yeast doing the job and this is a wine forum so I
used a bit of "Poetic License" and modified it a bit.. trying to stay
on forum

"mail box" > wrote in message
...
<<snip>>
>
> I've found that it's really very difficult to get a true appraisal from
> friends/family/acquaintances. They don't want to say negative things
> about something you've hand crafted, regardless of how they really feel.
> I've had friends take two sips from the glass, rave about a mead of mine,
> and then leave it on the counter. It's a matter of taste, as mead is not
> like most wines. I don't take it personally when friends don't enjoy my
> mead, and I take it with a large grain of salt when they heap praises on
> my meads. Blind judging is the way to go for an unbiased appraisal, but
> even then the number of decent mead judges are limited. Case in point, I
> recently entered my mead in my homebrew club competition for the AHA COC.
> I took second place, and was very happy with that result. I myself judged
> the winning entry and gave it a 19 on a 20 point scale. It was excellent.
> But a significant portion of those who had judged my mead offered the
> advise that it would be better once it was not so young and had aged a
> while. Given that fact that this was a three year old mead, and (if I may
> be so bold as to judge my own mead) it is very well integrated and not at
> all likely to improve with further aging, I strongly disagree with the
> judges on this point. I'd far rather receive judging remarks that say
> that the judge felt that my mead was not well integrated, or which point
> out a flaw or a perceived deficiency, rather than a judging remark that
> attempts to guess at some facet of the mead making process or history and
> which may be just a wild guess with no basis in reality.
>
>
> Cheers,
> Ken

I know my friends are giving me honest prase when they start bringing me
sacks of bottles and expecting full ones in return!

Why do I make wine - namely good wine rather than just alcohol!

1) because I like wine.
2) because I can make a wine more attuned to my taste than I can buy.
3) because it is a great hobby, and I do not mind spending money on by
hobbies.

Even with the above requirements and the money I spend on ingredients and
equipment, my wine is cheaper than commercial wine that I would like.

Ray

Ken,

I agree that one's friends are often overly kind in their appraisal of
homemade wines. You really can't trust most feedback you get to your
face; people just want to please, and they want to be supportive. Some
don't even have a clue, but they're still very affirmative of your (our)
efforts. They're all nice people. Just look elsewhere for constructive
criticism.

I've found two things to identify worthwhile feedback:

First, if a person can give you specific, detailed points of
like/dislike, and appear somewhat knowledgeable, it might be worth
listening to.

Second, I do bottle counts at wine events. Sometimes I'll stand within
sight of the bar and keep an eye on which wines go first, or if people
return for more. Other times I'll count empty bottles afterwards (if I'm
the host), to see how I did against the competition in actual usage. If
done discretely, this can yield valuable feedback, or, sometimes a blow
to the ego. If a stranger( who doesn't know your connection) makes a
face when they taste your wine, say something like " Say, you don't
seem to think much of that wine with the yellow label. What's wrong with
it?" Chances are you'll hear something useful.

Ya gotta be sly.

BTW, at our July Fourth picnic, we had 22 neighbors show up. A fairly
sophisticated and experienced bunch of wine drinkers for the most part.
Most brought bottles of ( commercially produced ) wine, of the quality
that you would want to bring as a gift. The bar was a help-yourself
table at the back of the patio. The next day I counted 16 empty bottles,
of which 10 were labeled "Mike's Good Wine" , and there were still a
dozen commercial bottles. I figure the average person had about 3
glasses of my wine.

Made me feel pretty pleased, but don't mind me. I'm just crowing a
bit. ;-)

Mike MTM, Cokesbury, NJ, USA

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