Winemaking (rec.crafts.winemaking) Discussion of the process, recipes, tips, techniques and general exchange of lore on the process, methods and history of wine making. Includes traditional grape wines, sparkling wines & champagnes.

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  #1 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 15-10-2004, 08:02 PM
Ray Calvert
 
Posts: n/a
Default A strange ferment

Okay, a follow up to some posts I have made over the last few months.

Back in February I started a 2.5 gal batch of Welch's Frozen Concord and a
batch of the Niagra. I used the recipe on Jack's site for both. I started
each at SG = 1.085. After 5 days I racked each. The Niagra continued fine.
The Concord bubbled for a few days and stopped. I let it sit for a week or
so and checked it . It was at 1.030, right where it was when I racked it.
I repitched it. Nothing. I had a batch of mustang that needed racking into
secondary so I added a pint of the lease and let it go for 3 weeks.
Nothing.

In the mean time I had started a batch of Welch's frozen Grape/Raspberry.
It did the same thing and stuck at 1.030.

The Niagara finished out fine, cleared and was a very nice wine.

I needed to rack my cherry out of secondary to bulk age so I just racked
both the two stuch lines onto the gal or so racked both of the two stuck
wines onto the cherry sedement and stired them up good. After two weeks,
nothing. The SG was down to about 1.020 thanks to adding all the dry
finished lease.

At this point I gave up. I racked it to a 5 gal carboy and set it asside to
clear. I figured that I would just have some sweet, low alcohol wine. That
was months ago. This weekend I figured I should rack off any sedement.
When I checked it, I saw a bubble. I watched it and low and behold the
airlock is bubbling at about 1 bubble a min. It is finally fermenting.

I have no idea when it started, how long it has been going, or how much
longer it will go. I did not even check the SG, just left it alone. I will
check it in two weeks when I get back from vacation. In 25+ years of wine
making this is the longest ferment I have ever had. One thing is for sure.
If I like the results, I will never be able to duplicate it.

In previous posts I have made some comments about the Welch's Concord
sticking. Well, I am not sure now. Oh ... The Niagara is almost gone. A
very nice white wine. Better than most of the Kit Whites I have made.

Ray



  #2 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 15-10-2004, 08:46 PM
Dar V
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Ray,
I have noticed over the past couple of years, that some of the frozen
concentrates do get stuck and don't ferment to dry. Why, I don't know, but
I have not had a stuck ferment when I have added yeast nutrient to the batch
before adding the yeast. I'm not familiar with Jack's recipe, so does it
call for yeast nutrient?
Darlene

"Ray Calvert" wrote in message
news
Okay, a follow up to some posts I have made over the last few months.

Back in February I started a 2.5 gal batch of Welch's Frozen Concord and a
batch of the Niagra. I used the recipe on Jack's site for both. I
started each at SG = 1.085. After 5 days I racked each. The Niagra
continued fine. The Concord bubbled for a few days and stopped. I let it
sit for a week or so and checked it . It was at 1.030, right where it was
when I racked it. I repitched it. Nothing. I had a batch of mustang that
needed racking into secondary so I added a pint of the lease and let it go
for 3 weeks. Nothing.

In the mean time I had started a batch of Welch's frozen Grape/Raspberry.
It did the same thing and stuck at 1.030.

The Niagara finished out fine, cleared and was a very nice wine.

I needed to rack my cherry out of secondary to bulk age so I just racked
both the two stuch lines onto the gal or so racked both of the two stuck
wines onto the cherry sedement and stired them up good. After two weeks,
nothing. The SG was down to about 1.020 thanks to adding all the dry
finished lease.

At this point I gave up. I racked it to a 5 gal carboy and set it asside
to clear. I figured that I would just have some sweet, low alcohol wine.
That was months ago. This weekend I figured I should rack off any
sedement. When I checked it, I saw a bubble. I watched it and low and
behold the airlock is bubbling at about 1 bubble a min. It is finally
fermenting.

I have no idea when it started, how long it has been going, or how much
longer it will go. I did not even check the SG, just left it alone. I
will check it in two weeks when I get back from vacation. In 25+ years of
wine making this is the longest ferment I have ever had. One thing is for
sure. If I like the results, I will never be able to duplicate it.

In previous posts I have made some comments about the Welch's Concord
sticking. Well, I am not sure now. Oh ... The Niagara is almost gone. A
very nice white wine. Better than most of the Kit Whites I have made.

Ray




  #3 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 15-10-2004, 08:46 PM
Dar V
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Ray,
I have noticed over the past couple of years, that some of the frozen
concentrates do get stuck and don't ferment to dry. Why, I don't know, but
I have not had a stuck ferment when I have added yeast nutrient to the batch
before adding the yeast. I'm not familiar with Jack's recipe, so does it
call for yeast nutrient?
Darlene

"Ray Calvert" wrote in message
news
Okay, a follow up to some posts I have made over the last few months.

Back in February I started a 2.5 gal batch of Welch's Frozen Concord and a
batch of the Niagra. I used the recipe on Jack's site for both. I
started each at SG = 1.085. After 5 days I racked each. The Niagra
continued fine. The Concord bubbled for a few days and stopped. I let it
sit for a week or so and checked it . It was at 1.030, right where it was
when I racked it. I repitched it. Nothing. I had a batch of mustang that
needed racking into secondary so I added a pint of the lease and let it go
for 3 weeks. Nothing.

In the mean time I had started a batch of Welch's frozen Grape/Raspberry.
It did the same thing and stuck at 1.030.

The Niagara finished out fine, cleared and was a very nice wine.

I needed to rack my cherry out of secondary to bulk age so I just racked
both the two stuch lines onto the gal or so racked both of the two stuck
wines onto the cherry sedement and stired them up good. After two weeks,
nothing. The SG was down to about 1.020 thanks to adding all the dry
finished lease.

At this point I gave up. I racked it to a 5 gal carboy and set it asside
to clear. I figured that I would just have some sweet, low alcohol wine.
That was months ago. This weekend I figured I should rack off any
sedement. When I checked it, I saw a bubble. I watched it and low and
behold the airlock is bubbling at about 1 bubble a min. It is finally
fermenting.

I have no idea when it started, how long it has been going, or how much
longer it will go. I did not even check the SG, just left it alone. I
will check it in two weeks when I get back from vacation. In 25+ years of
wine making this is the longest ferment I have ever had. One thing is for
sure. If I like the results, I will never be able to duplicate it.

In previous posts I have made some comments about the Welch's Concord
sticking. Well, I am not sure now. Oh ... The Niagara is almost gone. A
very nice white wine. Better than most of the Kit Whites I have made.

Ray




  #4 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 15-10-2004, 09:17 PM
Ray Calvert
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Yes, 1 tsp per gal. His recipe is at
http://winemaking.jackkeller.net/reques65.asp

Ray

"Dar V" wrote in message
...
Ray,
I have noticed over the past couple of years, that some of the frozen
concentrates do get stuck and don't ferment to dry. Why, I don't know,
but I have not had a stuck ferment when I have added yeast nutrient to the
batch before adding the yeast. I'm not familiar with Jack's recipe, so
does it call for yeast nutrient?
Darlene

"Ray Calvert" wrote in message
news
Okay, a follow up to some posts I have made over the last few months.

Back in February I started a 2.5 gal batch of Welch's Frozen Concord and
a batch of the Niagra. I used the recipe on Jack's site for both. I
started each at SG = 1.085. After 5 days I racked each. The Niagra
continued fine. The Concord bubbled for a few days and stopped. I let it
sit for a week or so and checked it . It was at 1.030, right where it
was when I racked it. I repitched it. Nothing. I had a batch of mustang
that needed racking into secondary so I added a pint of the lease and let
it go for 3 weeks. Nothing.

In the mean time I had started a batch of Welch's frozen Grape/Raspberry.
It did the same thing and stuck at 1.030.

The Niagara finished out fine, cleared and was a very nice wine.

I needed to rack my cherry out of secondary to bulk age so I just racked
both the two stuch lines onto the gal or so racked both of the two stuck
wines onto the cherry sedement and stired them up good. After two
weeks, nothing. The SG was down to about 1.020 thanks to adding all the
dry finished lease.

At this point I gave up. I racked it to a 5 gal carboy and set it asside
to clear. I figured that I would just have some sweet, low alcohol wine.
That was months ago. This weekend I figured I should rack off any
sedement. When I checked it, I saw a bubble. I watched it and low and
behold the airlock is bubbling at about 1 bubble a min. It is finally
fermenting.

I have no idea when it started, how long it has been going, or how much
longer it will go. I did not even check the SG, just left it alone. I
will check it in two weeks when I get back from vacation. In 25+ years
of wine making this is the longest ferment I have ever had. One thing is
for sure. If I like the results, I will never be able to duplicate it.

In previous posts I have made some comments about the Welch's Concord
sticking. Well, I am not sure now. Oh ... The Niagara is almost gone.
A very nice white wine. Better than most of the Kit Whites I have made.

Ray






  #5 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 15-10-2004, 09:36 PM
Paul E. Lehmann
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Ray Calvert wrote:

..... After 5 days I racked each. The Niagra continued
fine.
The Concord bubbled for a few days and stopped. I let it sit for a week
or
so and checked it . It was at 1.030, right where it was when I racked it.
I repitched it. Nothing.


Ray, when making wines from frozed juice or kit wines, you might consider
carying over the lees when you rack the first time and possibly every time
- until ready to bottle and then rack off the lees.

With concentrated juice there are no organic particles that could possible
cause H2S problems and therefore the lees are probably sweet and will only
help the wine. You may have thrown out whatever small ammount of nutrients
were in the wine when you racked. In your subsequent rackings and adding
lees, it took awhile for the nutrients in the lees you added to help what
few yeast cells were left.

My method is after the initial racking off the gross lees - even wine with
fresh grapes - in subsequent rackings, if the lees smell sweet and no bad
orders - I include them and stir them back into the wine. My initial
racking - when making wine from fresh grapes - is several hours after I
press. By that time most of the "heavies" have settled out.

I do not understand why so many people rack, rack and then rack some more -
especially in kit wines.


  #6 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 15-10-2004, 09:36 PM
Paul E. Lehmann
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Ray Calvert wrote:

..... After 5 days I racked each. The Niagra continued
fine.
The Concord bubbled for a few days and stopped. I let it sit for a week
or
so and checked it . It was at 1.030, right where it was when I racked it.
I repitched it. Nothing.


Ray, when making wines from frozed juice or kit wines, you might consider
carying over the lees when you rack the first time and possibly every time
- until ready to bottle and then rack off the lees.

With concentrated juice there are no organic particles that could possible
cause H2S problems and therefore the lees are probably sweet and will only
help the wine. You may have thrown out whatever small ammount of nutrients
were in the wine when you racked. In your subsequent rackings and adding
lees, it took awhile for the nutrients in the lees you added to help what
few yeast cells were left.

My method is after the initial racking off the gross lees - even wine with
fresh grapes - in subsequent rackings, if the lees smell sweet and no bad
orders - I include them and stir them back into the wine. My initial
racking - when making wine from fresh grapes - is several hours after I
press. By that time most of the "heavies" have settled out.

I do not understand why so many people rack, rack and then rack some more -
especially in kit wines.
  #7 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 15-10-2004, 10:14 PM
Ray Calvert
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Thanks Paul. Jack made some simular sugestions backe when I first had
problems. He thought I may have lost all the yeast. But I could not get
any going in it again. Maybe I did lose all the nutrient.

Ray

"Paul E. Lehmann" wrote in message
...
Ray Calvert wrote:

..... After 5 days I racked each. The Niagra continued
fine.
The Concord bubbled for a few days and stopped. I let it sit for a week
or
so and checked it . It was at 1.030, right where it was when I racked
it.
I repitched it. Nothing.


Ray, when making wines from frozed juice or kit wines, you might consider
carying over the lees when you rack the first time and possibly every time
- until ready to bottle and then rack off the lees.

With concentrated juice there are no organic particles that could possible
cause H2S problems and therefore the lees are probably sweet and will only
help the wine. You may have thrown out whatever small ammount of
nutrients
were in the wine when you racked. In your subsequent rackings and adding
lees, it took awhile for the nutrients in the lees you added to help what
few yeast cells were left.

My method is after the initial racking off the gross lees - even wine with
fresh grapes - in subsequent rackings, if the lees smell sweet and no bad
orders - I include them and stir them back into the wine. My initial
racking - when making wine from fresh grapes - is several hours after I
press. By that time most of the "heavies" have settled out.

I do not understand why so many people rack, rack and then rack some
more -
especially in kit wines.



  #8 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 15-10-2004, 11:15 PM
Dar V
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Ray,
I reread your post and I checked my notes. Another thing I do when using
the frozen concentrates, is to ferment in a glass carboy with a wide top,
covered in plastic. I stir 2 tx a day, just like a batch using fruit. I
rack when it hits 1.000 or below, which is usually in 4-6 days, then I
transfer to a glass carboy with a bung and airlock. This is totally
different method than when I started 4 years ago. Good-luck.
Darlene

"Ray Calvert" wrote in message
m...
Thanks Paul. Jack made some simular sugestions backe when I first had
problems. He thought I may have lost all the yeast. But I could not get
any going in it again. Maybe I did lose all the nutrient.

Ray

"Paul E. Lehmann" wrote in message
...
Ray Calvert wrote:

..... After 5 days I racked each. The Niagra continued
fine.
The Concord bubbled for a few days and stopped. I let it sit for a week
or
so and checked it . It was at 1.030, right where it was when I racked
it.
I repitched it. Nothing.


Ray, when making wines from frozed juice or kit wines, you might consider
carying over the lees when you rack the first time and possibly every
time
- until ready to bottle and then rack off the lees.

With concentrated juice there are no organic particles that could
possible
cause H2S problems and therefore the lees are probably sweet and will
only
help the wine. You may have thrown out whatever small ammount of
nutrients
were in the wine when you racked. In your subsequent rackings and adding
lees, it took awhile for the nutrients in the lees you added to help what
few yeast cells were left.

My method is after the initial racking off the gross lees - even wine
with
fresh grapes - in subsequent rackings, if the lees smell sweet and no bad
orders - I include them and stir them back into the wine. My initial
racking - when making wine from fresh grapes - is several hours after I
press. By that time most of the "heavies" have settled out.

I do not understand why so many people rack, rack and then rack some
more -
especially in kit wines.





  #9 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 15-10-2004, 11:15 PM
Dar V
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Ray,
I reread your post and I checked my notes. Another thing I do when using
the frozen concentrates, is to ferment in a glass carboy with a wide top,
covered in plastic. I stir 2 tx a day, just like a batch using fruit. I
rack when it hits 1.000 or below, which is usually in 4-6 days, then I
transfer to a glass carboy with a bung and airlock. This is totally
different method than when I started 4 years ago. Good-luck.
Darlene

"Ray Calvert" wrote in message
m...
Thanks Paul. Jack made some simular sugestions backe when I first had
problems. He thought I may have lost all the yeast. But I could not get
any going in it again. Maybe I did lose all the nutrient.

Ray

"Paul E. Lehmann" wrote in message
...
Ray Calvert wrote:

..... After 5 days I racked each. The Niagra continued
fine.
The Concord bubbled for a few days and stopped. I let it sit for a week
or
so and checked it . It was at 1.030, right where it was when I racked
it.
I repitched it. Nothing.


Ray, when making wines from frozed juice or kit wines, you might consider
carying over the lees when you rack the first time and possibly every
time
- until ready to bottle and then rack off the lees.

With concentrated juice there are no organic particles that could
possible
cause H2S problems and therefore the lees are probably sweet and will
only
help the wine. You may have thrown out whatever small ammount of
nutrients
were in the wine when you racked. In your subsequent rackings and adding
lees, it took awhile for the nutrients in the lees you added to help what
few yeast cells were left.

My method is after the initial racking off the gross lees - even wine
with
fresh grapes - in subsequent rackings, if the lees smell sweet and no bad
orders - I include them and stir them back into the wine. My initial
racking - when making wine from fresh grapes - is several hours after I
press. By that time most of the "heavies" have settled out.

I do not understand why so many people rack, rack and then rack some
more -
especially in kit wines.





  #10 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 16-10-2004, 12:38 AM
lhender
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Ray,
I am green as a gourd at this new hobby and in my first batch of Muscadine
wine the primary ferment went okay, added yeast and got a less than moderate
ferment. After a week I transferred it to the secondary carboys and put an
air lock on it. This was on December 2nd (south GA) 2 years ago and
probably too chilly.

It fermented steadily, but VERY slowly until after Thanksgiving last year,
almost a year. I added fresh yeast on one occasion shortly after
transferring to the secondary to try to get it going. No luck. I racked it
a couple of times to get if off the sediment and it cleared very well and
finally fermented dry. I bottled it and a couple of months later tried it.
Smelled great. Tasted like...well you know, wine... but different. It
might have been okay in a year or two, or ten, or it might have poisoned me.
With no experience for comparison purposes I opted to pour 48 bottles down
the drain, (insert sound of weeping).

This year's batch looks very promising and was started with frozen
muscadines back in June. Everything has gone well and it tastes much better.
I will bottle in a couple of weeks unless I decide to let it bulk age in the
carboys. I think I learned that getting off to a good ferment to start with
is important.
Logan
"Ray Calvert" wrote in message
news
Okay, a follow up to some posts I have made over the last few months.

Back in February I started a 2.5 gal batch of Welch's Frozen Concord and a
batch of the Niagra. I used the recipe on Jack's site for both. I
started each at SG = 1.085. After 5 days I racked each. The Niagra
continued fine. The Concord bubbled for a few days and stopped. I let it
sit for a week or so and checked it . It was at 1.030, right where it was
when I racked it. I repitched it. Nothing. I had a batch of mustang that
needed racking into secondary so I added a pint of the lease and let it go
for 3 weeks. Nothing.

In the mean time I had started a batch of Welch's frozen Grape/Raspberry.
It did the same thing and stuck at 1.030.

The Niagara finished out fine, cleared and was a very nice wine.

I needed to rack my cherry out of secondary to bulk age so I just racked
both the two stuch lines onto the gal or so racked both of the two stuck
wines onto the cherry sedement and stired them up good. After two weeks,
nothing. The SG was down to about 1.020 thanks to adding all the dry
finished lease.

At this point I gave up. I racked it to a 5 gal carboy and set it asside
to clear. I figured that I would just have some sweet, low alcohol wine.
That was months ago. This weekend I figured I should rack off any
sedement. When I checked it, I saw a bubble. I watched it and low and
behold the airlock is bubbling at about 1 bubble a min. It is finally
fermenting.

I have no idea when it started, how long it has been going, or how much
longer it will go. I did not even check the SG, just left it alone. I
will check it in two weeks when I get back from vacation. In 25+ years of
wine making this is the longest ferment I have ever had. One thing is for
sure. If I like the results, I will never be able to duplicate it.

In previous posts I have made some comments about the Welch's Concord
sticking. Well, I am not sure now. Oh ... The Niagara is almost gone. A
very nice white wine. Better than most of the Kit Whites I have made.

Ray






  #11 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 16-10-2004, 12:38 AM
lhender
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Ray,
I am green as a gourd at this new hobby and in my first batch of Muscadine
wine the primary ferment went okay, added yeast and got a less than moderate
ferment. After a week I transferred it to the secondary carboys and put an
air lock on it. This was on December 2nd (south GA) 2 years ago and
probably too chilly.

It fermented steadily, but VERY slowly until after Thanksgiving last year,
almost a year. I added fresh yeast on one occasion shortly after
transferring to the secondary to try to get it going. No luck. I racked it
a couple of times to get if off the sediment and it cleared very well and
finally fermented dry. I bottled it and a couple of months later tried it.
Smelled great. Tasted like...well you know, wine... but different. It
might have been okay in a year or two, or ten, or it might have poisoned me.
With no experience for comparison purposes I opted to pour 48 bottles down
the drain, (insert sound of weeping).

This year's batch looks very promising and was started with frozen
muscadines back in June. Everything has gone well and it tastes much better.
I will bottle in a couple of weeks unless I decide to let it bulk age in the
carboys. I think I learned that getting off to a good ferment to start with
is important.
Logan
"Ray Calvert" wrote in message
news
Okay, a follow up to some posts I have made over the last few months.

Back in February I started a 2.5 gal batch of Welch's Frozen Concord and a
batch of the Niagra. I used the recipe on Jack's site for both. I
started each at SG = 1.085. After 5 days I racked each. The Niagra
continued fine. The Concord bubbled for a few days and stopped. I let it
sit for a week or so and checked it . It was at 1.030, right where it was
when I racked it. I repitched it. Nothing. I had a batch of mustang that
needed racking into secondary so I added a pint of the lease and let it go
for 3 weeks. Nothing.

In the mean time I had started a batch of Welch's frozen Grape/Raspberry.
It did the same thing and stuck at 1.030.

The Niagara finished out fine, cleared and was a very nice wine.

I needed to rack my cherry out of secondary to bulk age so I just racked
both the two stuch lines onto the gal or so racked both of the two stuck
wines onto the cherry sedement and stired them up good. After two weeks,
nothing. The SG was down to about 1.020 thanks to adding all the dry
finished lease.

At this point I gave up. I racked it to a 5 gal carboy and set it asside
to clear. I figured that I would just have some sweet, low alcohol wine.
That was months ago. This weekend I figured I should rack off any
sedement. When I checked it, I saw a bubble. I watched it and low and
behold the airlock is bubbling at about 1 bubble a min. It is finally
fermenting.

I have no idea when it started, how long it has been going, or how much
longer it will go. I did not even check the SG, just left it alone. I
will check it in two weeks when I get back from vacation. In 25+ years of
wine making this is the longest ferment I have ever had. One thing is for
sure. If I like the results, I will never be able to duplicate it.

In previous posts I have made some comments about the Welch's Concord
sticking. Well, I am not sure now. Oh ... The Niagara is almost gone. A
very nice white wine. Better than most of the Kit Whites I have made.

Ray




  #12 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 16-10-2004, 01:52 AM
pinky
 
Posts: n/a
Default

There are certainly occasions when strange things happen in the wine making
world. It is something like 10 years ago when I was making mainly "country
wines" and regularly made up a 5 gallon batch of wine each year -- made
from white grape juice/Apple juice/orange juice as bought from the
supermarket shelves.
Not to worry about the recipe.Once fermentation was finished ( in 5 gallon
(imp) polyethylene) I would transfer to 1 gallon (imp) to let it mature on
for about 3/4 months ready for summer BBQ drinking.

Anyway on this occasion the batch I made just tasted fairly awful but being
a thrifty ( i.e. mean) wine maker I put the 5 x 1 gallon carboys at the back
of my bulk aging room and gently forgot about them. It was about 18 months
later in the middle of winter when I happened to be doing a general tidy
around when I lifted up the 5 carboy and put them on my fermenting shelves.
Now this room was unheated and the temperature fell to very close to
freezing in there when it was cold outside. The thing that caught my eye was
that there was a tiny ring of v small bubbles around the internal
circumference of 4 of the 5 carboys -- just a single width of single
bubbles. I just thought I had disturbed to wine in moving them.
Anyway to try and keep it short they sat through that winter and a second
year and the whole time just that single line of bubbles. If I had an hour
to waste I could actually catch a bubble arising through the wine.
Now I was making about 150 gallons (imp) a year at that time -- being in a
4 year convalescent period after major surgery-- and since the stuff in the
carboy has tasted so 'orrible I just let them sit there. and it spent a
good 2 years in the carboy -- and all the time had this extremely slow
fermentation going on.
I remember commenting about it to Jack Keller at the time.
I have no idea of what was happening and my records were minimal at the
time but the wine when I eventually breached the seal on the first carboy
was quite excellent and totally different in character to the normal summer
plonk produced by that recipe. 4 out of the 5 carboys were like that -- the
5th one I used for cooking!!!!
I have never experienced anything like it before or since.
This wine making thingy is so, thrilling, frustrating, annoying,
pleasurable -- the worst thing is when you are drinking the last bottle of a
batch that you made years before, which has improved, month by month, year
by year, and you think --- why didn't I make 2'ce as much!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
It is never repeatable!
Sorry for the long post

--
Trevor A Panther
In South Yorkshire, England
Remove "PSANTISPAM" from my address line to reply.
All outgoing mail is scanned by Norton
Anti Virus for your protection too!
"lhender" wrote in message
news
Ray,
I am green as a gourd at this new hobby and in my first batch of Muscadine
wine the primary ferment went okay, added yeast and got a less than
moderate ferment. After a week I transferred it to the secondary carboys
and put an air lock on it. This was on December 2nd (south GA) 2 years
ago and probably too chilly.

It fermented steadily, but VERY slowly


snipsnip



  #13 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 16-10-2004, 06:50 AM
Hoss
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Interesting, Ray.

I have been trying gallon batches of many different welch's
concentrates. To learn and to see what is worth the efforts of a
larger batch..

For example, I just bottled white grape raspberry, fermented down to
1.011, stabilized, and tastes marvelous. A Strawberry Raspberry,
ferment down to 1.02 and stopped, so I stabilized anyway, this is
rougher, going to let this sit in bottle a while longer.

A week later, I tried white grape (niagara frozen concentrate), white
grape peach (juice, not concentrate), and strawberry kiwi (juicy juice
brand, not concentrate). The straw-kiwi fermented out fast, down to
..995 in week and a half, that is bottled already and resting. The
niagara concentrate stuck at 1.045. It's clearing, but still high at
1.045. the white grape peach is even worse at 1.065. They all
started out at about1.090 and at most 1.100 s.g. I used Jack's recipe
and his method, sort of along the lines of the way Dar does it, as she
has quite a bit of experience doing one gallon batches. they are
still sitting there, but I'm using old carlo rossi bottles as primary
and secondary, so they are a little tough to stir.

In light of that, I just tried another batch of Welch's niagara, three
gallon this time, tripled jacks recipe, used lalvin 1118, and in 5
days it went from 1.092 down to 1.001. I stirred for the last time
tonight, and will rack to secondary tomorrow.

What I don't understand is that for this batch, it fermented strong
and continuous and I stirred twice daily. I also am using a large
plastic primary for this batch. The failed batch above was stirred to
the best of my ability, fermented more than strong, even vigorously
for 3 days, then stopped very quickly. Same with the WG-Peach.

I think my stucks are just losses and will try again later.

I also have a gallon batch of welches tropical passion (100% juice of
apple, grape, orange, passion, and pineapple) This started 5 days ago
high at 1.110, now is down to 1.020 and still going, will probably get
to rack in a day or two, still stirring twice daily.

I have recently got wild berry concentrate (apple, grape, cherry,
raspberry) and will try that when my primaries come available, one
gallon, more if I like.

I intend on making a 5 gal batch of the white grape rasp as soon as I
get the concentrate. This stuff was good.

I may have to pick up a few cans of concord, just to try of course,
and let you know how that goes.

Greg



On Fri, 15 Oct 2004 19:02:59 GMT, "Ray Calvert"
wrote:

Okay, a follow up to some posts I have made over the last few months.

Back in February I started a 2.5 gal batch of Welch's Frozen Concord and a
batch of the Niagra. I used the recipe on Jack's site for both. I started
each at SG = 1.085. After 5 days I racked each. The Niagra continued fine.
The Concord bubbled for a few days and stopped. I let it sit for a week or
so and checked it . It was at 1.030, right where it was when I racked it.
I repitched it. Nothing. I had a batch of mustang that needed racking into
secondary so I added a pint of the lease and let it go for 3 weeks.
Nothing.

In the mean time I had started a batch of Welch's frozen Grape/Raspberry.
It did the same thing and stuck at 1.030.

The Niagara finished out fine, cleared and was a very nice wine.

I needed to rack my cherry out of secondary to bulk age so I just racked
both the two stuch lines onto the gal or so racked both of the two stuck
wines onto the cherry sedement and stired them up good. After two weeks,
nothing. The SG was down to about 1.020 thanks to adding all the dry
finished lease.

At this point I gave up. I racked it to a 5 gal carboy and set it asside to
clear. I figured that I would just have some sweet, low alcohol wine. That
was months ago. This weekend I figured I should rack off any sedement.
When I checked it, I saw a bubble. I watched it and low and behold the
airlock is bubbling at about 1 bubble a min. It is finally fermenting.

I have no idea when it started, how long it has been going, or how much
longer it will go. I did not even check the SG, just left it alone. I will
check it in two weeks when I get back from vacation. In 25+ years of wine
making this is the longest ferment I have ever had. One thing is for sure.
If I like the results, I will never be able to duplicate it.

In previous posts I have made some comments about the Welch's Concord
sticking. Well, I am not sure now. Oh ... The Niagara is almost gone. A
very nice white wine. Better than most of the Kit Whites I have made.

Ray



  #14 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 16-10-2004, 06:50 AM
Hoss
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Interesting, Ray.

I have been trying gallon batches of many different welch's
concentrates. To learn and to see what is worth the efforts of a
larger batch..

For example, I just bottled white grape raspberry, fermented down to
1.011, stabilized, and tastes marvelous. A Strawberry Raspberry,
ferment down to 1.02 and stopped, so I stabilized anyway, this is
rougher, going to let this sit in bottle a while longer.

A week later, I tried white grape (niagara frozen concentrate), white
grape peach (juice, not concentrate), and strawberry kiwi (juicy juice
brand, not concentrate). The straw-kiwi fermented out fast, down to
..995 in week and a half, that is bottled already and resting. The
niagara concentrate stuck at 1.045. It's clearing, but still high at
1.045. the white grape peach is even worse at 1.065. They all
started out at about1.090 and at most 1.100 s.g. I used Jack's recipe
and his method, sort of along the lines of the way Dar does it, as she
has quite a bit of experience doing one gallon batches. they are
still sitting there, but I'm using old carlo rossi bottles as primary
and secondary, so they are a little tough to stir.

In light of that, I just tried another batch of Welch's niagara, three
gallon this time, tripled jacks recipe, used lalvin 1118, and in 5
days it went from 1.092 down to 1.001. I stirred for the last time
tonight, and will rack to secondary tomorrow.

What I don't understand is that for this batch, it fermented strong
and continuous and I stirred twice daily. I also am using a large
plastic primary for this batch. The failed batch above was stirred to
the best of my ability, fermented more than strong, even vigorously
for 3 days, then stopped very quickly. Same with the WG-Peach.

I think my stucks are just losses and will try again later.

I also have a gallon batch of welches tropical passion (100% juice of
apple, grape, orange, passion, and pineapple) This started 5 days ago
high at 1.110, now is down to 1.020 and still going, will probably get
to rack in a day or two, still stirring twice daily.

I have recently got wild berry concentrate (apple, grape, cherry,
raspberry) and will try that when my primaries come available, one
gallon, more if I like.

I intend on making a 5 gal batch of the white grape rasp as soon as I
get the concentrate. This stuff was good.

I may have to pick up a few cans of concord, just to try of course,
and let you know how that goes.

Greg



On Fri, 15 Oct 2004 19:02:59 GMT, "Ray Calvert"
wrote:

Okay, a follow up to some posts I have made over the last few months.

Back in February I started a 2.5 gal batch of Welch's Frozen Concord and a
batch of the Niagra. I used the recipe on Jack's site for both. I started
each at SG = 1.085. After 5 days I racked each. The Niagra continued fine.
The Concord bubbled for a few days and stopped. I let it sit for a week or
so and checked it . It was at 1.030, right where it was when I racked it.
I repitched it. Nothing. I had a batch of mustang that needed racking into
secondary so I added a pint of the lease and let it go for 3 weeks.
Nothing.

In the mean time I had started a batch of Welch's frozen Grape/Raspberry.
It did the same thing and stuck at 1.030.

The Niagara finished out fine, cleared and was a very nice wine.

I needed to rack my cherry out of secondary to bulk age so I just racked
both the two stuch lines onto the gal or so racked both of the two stuck
wines onto the cherry sedement and stired them up good. After two weeks,
nothing. The SG was down to about 1.020 thanks to adding all the dry
finished lease.

At this point I gave up. I racked it to a 5 gal carboy and set it asside to
clear. I figured that I would just have some sweet, low alcohol wine. That
was months ago. This weekend I figured I should rack off any sedement.
When I checked it, I saw a bubble. I watched it and low and behold the
airlock is bubbling at about 1 bubble a min. It is finally fermenting.

I have no idea when it started, how long it has been going, or how much
longer it will go. I did not even check the SG, just left it alone. I will
check it in two weeks when I get back from vacation. In 25+ years of wine
making this is the longest ferment I have ever had. One thing is for sure.
If I like the results, I will never be able to duplicate it.

In previous posts I have made some comments about the Welch's Concord
sticking. Well, I am not sure now. Oh ... The Niagara is almost gone. A
very nice white wine. Better than most of the Kit Whites I have made.

Ray



  #15 (permalink)   Report Post  
Old 16-10-2004, 04:22 PM
Dar V
 
Posts: n/a
Default

Hoss,
I wouldn't call them losses. I still bottled my batches which stuck. I
guess I would let them finish, stabilize, and just drink them sooner than
the other batches, because they won't have the alcohol level for good aging.
Look at them as a bunch of wine coolers....
Darlene

"Hoss" wrote in message
...
Interesting, Ray.

I have been trying gallon batches of many different welch's
concentrates. To learn and to see what is worth the efforts of a
larger batch..

For example, I just bottled white grape raspberry, fermented down to
1.011, stabilized, and tastes marvelous. A Strawberry Raspberry,
ferment down to 1.02 and stopped, so I stabilized anyway, this is
rougher, going to let this sit in bottle a while longer.

A week later, I tried white grape (niagara frozen concentrate), white
grape peach (juice, not concentrate), and strawberry kiwi (juicy juice
brand, not concentrate). The straw-kiwi fermented out fast, down to
.995 in week and a half, that is bottled already and resting. The
niagara concentrate stuck at 1.045. It's clearing, but still high at
1.045. the white grape peach is even worse at 1.065. They all
started out at about1.090 and at most 1.100 s.g. I used Jack's recipe
and his method, sort of along the lines of the way Dar does it, as she
has quite a bit of experience doing one gallon batches. they are
still sitting there, but I'm using old carlo rossi bottles as primary
and secondary, so they are a little tough to stir.

In light of that, I just tried another batch of Welch's niagara, three
gallon this time, tripled jacks recipe, used lalvin 1118, and in 5
days it went from 1.092 down to 1.001. I stirred for the last time
tonight, and will rack to secondary tomorrow.

What I don't understand is that for this batch, it fermented strong
and continuous and I stirred twice daily. I also am using a large
plastic primary for this batch. The failed batch above was stirred to
the best of my ability, fermented more than strong, even vigorously
for 3 days, then stopped very quickly. Same with the WG-Peach.

I think my stucks are just losses and will try again later.

I also have a gallon batch of welches tropical passion (100% juice of
apple, grape, orange, passion, and pineapple) This started 5 days ago
high at 1.110, now is down to 1.020 and still going, will probably get
to rack in a day or two, still stirring twice daily.

I have recently got wild berry concentrate (apple, grape, cherry,
raspberry) and will try that when my primaries come available, one
gallon, more if I like.

I intend on making a 5 gal batch of the white grape rasp as soon as I
get the concentrate. This stuff was good.

I may have to pick up a few cans of concord, just to try of course,
and let you know how that goes.

Greg



On Fri, 15 Oct 2004 19:02:59 GMT, "Ray Calvert"
wrote:

Okay, a follow up to some posts I have made over the last few months.

Back in February I started a 2.5 gal batch of Welch's Frozen Concord and a
batch of the Niagra. I used the recipe on Jack's site for both. I
started
each at SG = 1.085. After 5 days I racked each. The Niagra continued
fine.
The Concord bubbled for a few days and stopped. I let it sit for a week
or
so and checked it . It was at 1.030, right where it was when I racked it.
I repitched it. Nothing. I had a batch of mustang that needed racking
into
secondary so I added a pint of the lease and let it go for 3 weeks.
Nothing.

In the mean time I had started a batch of Welch's frozen Grape/Raspberry.
It did the same thing and stuck at 1.030.

The Niagara finished out fine, cleared and was a very nice wine.

I needed to rack my cherry out of secondary to bulk age so I just racked
both the two stuch lines onto the gal or so racked both of the two stuck
wines onto the cherry sedement and stired them up good. After two weeks,
nothing. The SG was down to about 1.020 thanks to adding all the dry
finished lease.

At this point I gave up. I racked it to a 5 gal carboy and set it asside
to
clear. I figured that I would just have some sweet, low alcohol wine.
That
was months ago. This weekend I figured I should rack off any sedement.
When I checked it, I saw a bubble. I watched it and low and behold the
airlock is bubbling at about 1 bubble a min. It is finally fermenting.

I have no idea when it started, how long it has been going, or how much
longer it will go. I did not even check the SG, just left it alone. I
will
check it in two weeks when I get back from vacation. In 25+ years of wine
making this is the longest ferment I have ever had. One thing is for
sure.
If I like the results, I will never be able to duplicate it.

In previous posts I have made some comments about the Welch's Concord
sticking. Well, I am not sure now. Oh ... The Niagara is almost gone. A
very nice white wine. Better than most of the Kit Whites I have made.

Ray







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