Salut/Hi TB,

le/on 24 Jan 2005 02:54:40 -0800, tu disais/you said:-

>. Browsing in a wine-shop (looking for reasonably-priced Meursaults.
>Actually, what is the opening level for Meursault-price one would
>expect in France or Germany?

It all depends upon the level. A village level wine from a decent producer
should be found at around the ‚¬15-20 mark. A 1st growth vineyard from a very
good producer? ‚¬35 or so - well I just bought ther superb 2002 vintage
Meursault-Genevrières from Mikulski at ‚¬32 a bottle - but I was lucky, as
he'd sold out.

>further said that he has no idea how well or badly were the wines kept,
>but one could look at sediments or wine-levels or labels and basically
>try one's luck.

As always.. (sorry to go on about it) it all depends upon the year and the
grower.


--
All the Best
Ian Hoare
http://www.souvigne.com
mailbox full to avoid spam. try me at website

Hi folks,

I had a very interesting experience with an old wine last weekend which
I would like to share and put forth some questions that I had in the
regard hoping for your feedback.

.. Browsing in a wine-shop (looking for reasonably-priced Meursaults.
Actually, what is the opening level for Meursault-price one would
expect in France or Germany? Is it more like 15 Euros per bottle or
30?), we saw some mixed cases of rather old wines. The shopkeeper told
us that these are wines found in the cellar of a recently-deceased
person by the next-of-kin, who - not having any interest in wines and
looking to make maybe a thousand Euros or so - are selling them. He
further said that he has no idea how well or badly were the wines kept,
but one could look at sediments or wine-levels or labels and basically
try one's luck. He had a 195x Rioja which was marked for 55 Euros but
we passed that. One bottle that we did buy said:

1971
Vino BARBARESCO
ITALIEN
VINO A DENOMINATIONE D'ORIGINE CONTROLLATA
IMBOTTIGLIATO DALLA
Casa Vinicola
ABBAZIA S. GAUDENZIO
dei F.lli Santero
S=2E Stefano Belbo (CN)
R=2EI 90/CN
CONT. LT. 0.720
ALCOOL GR.13

There was no sediment in the bottle, the wine level was quite high, the
cork sat fairly tight, so we did pay the 14 Euros one asked for it and
opened it immediately upon reaching home.

We poured out two glass immediately from the bottle and put the rest in
a decanter.

First comments about the cork. It was a rather long cork (Modelo is the
word?) and said F.LLI SANTERO as well as S. STEFANO B. on the cork. It
had red-brown streaks on the bottom third of its body and was quite
tight in the bottle. The latter two points did indicate that the bottle
was reasonably well-kept.

Our notes:
- Lucid, pale, a touch watery with the classical browning of Spanna
- Complex nose with licorice, leather, anise, dried flowers. Very
fresh, indicating acidity.
- Soft tannins, quite fresh on the palate due to the acidity
- A touche disappearing but robust taste of licorice, anise, cinammon,
a touch of leather.
- A rather light body for a Barbaresco with a mildly shrinking-in-mouth
astringency
- The taste had frankly a quick finish but it lingered on the breath
for long (not just the alcohol, also the complex extracts)

The second and third pours from the bottle showed a very thin white-ish
slick-like layer on top of the wine which disappeared after a few
minutes.

All in all, we felt quite happy with the experiment and wish the seller
had more bottles of this wine.

Some questions that I have though:

1=2E It was a DOC, not a DOCG. I thought Barbaresco was an "original"
DOCG since 1963. Am I mistaked or is it possible to get DOC Barbaresco
also (i.e. without the Garantia)?

2=2E The fresh acid was quite surprising. Now it was very pleasant and
not puckering, it also balanced the complex nose and mouth well. But it
was really much more "forward leaning" (higher acidity, a touch
shrinking-in-mouth, shorter-finish,) than the average 199x
Nebbiolo-based wines that I have tasted. Was it simply age or are
Barbarescos often like this?

3=2E The bottle itself was asymmetric and looked almost hand-made. It had
0=2E72 litres of wine, though the bottle itself was marked 0.75 on the
back. Was it common to bottle 0.72 l?

4=2E The label said "ITALIEN" and not "ITALIA". This must mean that it
was meant to be sold in Germany, I suppose.

5=2E The bottle was C=F4tes du Rh=F4ne-shaped with a shield-shaped label.
Is/ was that common? I thought Barbarescos are usually bottled in
Bordeaux-shaped bottles with rectangular labels.

Cheers

"TB" > wrote:

> 1. It was a DOC, not a DOCG. I thought Barbaresco was an
> "original" DOCG since 1963. Am I mistaked

Yes.

> or is it possible to get DOC Barbaresco also (i.e. without the
> Garantia)?

Now: no. Back then: yes.

The first DOCG decree - for Brunello - was signed by the President of
the Italian Republic on July 1, 1980, and published in the Gazetto
Ufficiale on November 15, 1980.

The relevant dates for the next DOCGs:

1980-07-01 / 1981-01-22 Barolo
1980-07-01 / not available* Vino Nobile di Montepulciano
1980-10-03 / 1981-09-03 Barbaresco

*) because of subsequent supersedes that only refer to the "D.P.R."
dates, the "Decreto del Presidente della Republica".

M.

"TB" > wrote:

> 3. The bottle itself was asymmetric and looked almost hand-made.
> It had 0.72 litres of wine, though the bottle itself was marked
> 0.75 on the back. Was it common to bottle 0.72 l?

Yes.

> 4. The label said "ITALIEN" and not "ITALIA". This must mean
> that it was meant to be sold in Germany, I suppose.

Very probably.

> 5. The bottle was Côtes du Rhône-shaped with a shield-shaped
> label. Is/ was that common?

Yes.

> I thought Barbarescos are usually bottled in Bordeaux-shaped
> bottles with rectangular labels.

The "Albeisa" bottle shape - a kind of slightly slimmer burgundy
type - is quite traditional in the Piemonte. One large house using
Burgundy shaped bottles is Fontanafredda:

<http://pensiero.hp.infoseek.co.jp/image/vino293.jpg>

As to the label form, this is entirely up to the producer. Take a
look at Bordeaux: you can have tetragons (rectangles), trapezoids
(old Gruaud & Talbot; Haut Brion) and even octogons (Beychevelle,
Margaux). And in Champagne you can have just about everything,
from neck labels (Gosset) to coat-of-arms shields (Dom Pérignon).

M.