Dua>
>I'd always used time and the color of the crust to tell me when the bread
>was done as I like it. Since I always bake into a cold oven, I add
>5-minutes to the recipe recommended baking time. All of my recipes
>recommend 30-35 min.
>
>I execute it by timing 5-min, and then 2, 15-min. segments. Depending one
>what I'm making, I sometimes break that final 15-min segment into 3, 5-min.
>segments. The initial 5-min interval is to make me get up and check on
>how the loaf has sprung, and to be sure to check the temp to see that it's
>correct--and/or turn it down in case of a hotter than normal start.
>
>The first 15-min segment is just time to pass, and the second one is to
>fine-tune the color and amount of "doneness" that I'm looking for.
>
>So, after getting a phone call and not hearing my timer last
>week--remembering it only when I could smell that something was going up in
>smoke...I broke down and bought a couple of those instant digital
>temperature meters. One has a temperature alert setting; in that I can set
>the target temperature, and it'll alert me when it's been achieved.
>Finally, I was going to be able to bake at the 20th century level!
>
>What motivated me was hearing about folks undercooking the insides of their
>loaves--and a curiosity as to how this was affecting me.
>
>I have nearly a dozen recipes that I bake on a regular basis. They are all
>recommended at 30-35 min. At the moment I'm baking a pair of high-hydration
>Coccodrillo loaves. The recommended target temperature was given to me as
>"at least" 203F. Most of what I've read on this list seems to indicate that
>an internal temperature of at least 197F or so was desired.
>
>Well, since I can't push a sensor into a HH glop of dough waiting to be
>baked, I had to wait for it to at least firm up. After about 15-min it was
>puffed out, and starting to brown. I put in the probe, and it immediately
>spun up to 208F! I took the loaf out, after about 22 min. total, when it
>reached 210F.
>
>I used the second loaf to see how high the temp gets when I bake it the
>normal way (by time). Pretty well the same thing happened. In 15-min or so
>the temp spun up to 210, and stayed there until I'd run the full 35-min
>course of baking.
>
>Now, to my questions. What purpose is served by baking to a specific
>temperature? And what does it mean if the "end" temperature seems to be too
>high? Should I stop baking when the temp gets to the recommended temp? Am
>I using the wrong temperatures?
>
>FWIW; I just did a calibration on the meter. It was within 1-degree at 32 &
>spot-on at 212F. So I'm relatively certain that it's accurate enough.
>
>I'll report what I find when they cool enough for cutting a bit later this
>PM...
>
>Hope someone has a clue they can pass on...
>
>
>Dusty

Dusty, the use of a probe thermometer is "belt and braces" for normal (60-65%
hydration) lean bread, for these doughs I find that colour and "hollow
bottoms" are sufficient to judge when the bread has cooked.

I use the probe for 2 main categories of bread.

Heavily enriched doughs, particularly sweet ones, doughs, a cheese Brioche for
example, or Portugese Sweet Bread, can, and often do brown and give a hollow
hump when the centre of the loaf is barely cooked and a doughy centre can
result from use of eye and sound as the sole indicators of a coooked loaf.

High hydration (70%+) breads can be difficult browned well, and be giving a
hollow sound when the crumb has "cooked" to the point of the change in the
starch molecules that produces the hollow sound but still require another 10,
20, or even, in some of my experimental breads 30 minutes to remove the dreaded
"Gummy crumb".

In extreme cases, I have had to bake to 213-214F (I know, that's above water
boiling point but 90% hydration Pain a l'Ancienne will reach that internal temp
without burning the crust.

Rules of thumb.

Enriched doughs with eggs, fat and sugar I bake to at least 195F

Lean "normal" hydration doughs, the classic Parisian Baguette for example, I
bake to at least 200 and preferably 205F (for my tastes, any kind of gummy,
sticky, doughy centre is an emetic)

High hydration and Pain a l'Ancienne I bake to at least 205F and , if in doubt,
right up to 212F.

These temperatures are not carved in stone but they are a reliable start point.


Love

John

Dua>
>I'd always used time and the color of the crust to tell me when the bread
>was done as I like it. Since I always bake into a cold oven, I add
>5-minutes to the recipe recommended baking time. All of my recipes
>recommend 30-35 min.
>
>I execute it by timing 5-min, and then 2, 15-min. segments. Depending one
>what I'm making, I sometimes break that final 15-min segment into 3, 5-min.
>segments. The initial 5-min interval is to make me get up and check on
>how the loaf has sprung, and to be sure to check the temp to see that it's
>correct--and/or turn it down in case of a hotter than normal start.
>
>The first 15-min segment is just time to pass, and the second one is to
>fine-tune the color and amount of "doneness" that I'm looking for.
>
>So, after getting a phone call and not hearing my timer last
>week--remembering it only when I could smell that something was going up in
>smoke...I broke down and bought a couple of those instant digital
>temperature meters. One has a temperature alert setting; in that I can set
>the target temperature, and it'll alert me when it's been achieved.
>Finally, I was going to be able to bake at the 20th century level!
>
>What motivated me was hearing about folks undercooking the insides of their
>loaves--and a curiosity as to how this was affecting me.
>
>I have nearly a dozen recipes that I bake on a regular basis. They are all
>recommended at 30-35 min. At the moment I'm baking a pair of high-hydration
>Coccodrillo loaves. The recommended target temperature was given to me as
>"at least" 203F. Most of what I've read on this list seems to indicate that
>an internal temperature of at least 197F or so was desired.
>
>Well, since I can't push a sensor into a HH glop of dough waiting to be
>baked, I had to wait for it to at least firm up. After about 15-min it was
>puffed out, and starting to brown. I put in the probe, and it immediately
>spun up to 208F! I took the loaf out, after about 22 min. total, when it
>reached 210F.
>
>I used the second loaf to see how high the temp gets when I bake it the
>normal way (by time). Pretty well the same thing happened. In 15-min or so
>the temp spun up to 210, and stayed there until I'd run the full 35-min
>course of baking.
>
>Now, to my questions. What purpose is served by baking to a specific
>temperature? And what does it mean if the "end" temperature seems to be too
>high? Should I stop baking when the temp gets to the recommended temp? Am
>I using the wrong temperatures?
>
>FWIW; I just did a calibration on the meter. It was within 1-degree at 32 &
>spot-on at 212F. So I'm relatively certain that it's accurate enough.
>
>I'll report what I find when they cool enough for cutting a bit later this
>PM...
>
>Hope someone has a clue they can pass on...
>
>
>Dusty

Dusty, the use of a probe thermometer is "belt and braces" for normal (60-65%
hydration) lean bread, for these doughs I find that colour and "hollow
bottoms" are sufficient to judge when the bread has cooked.

I use the probe for 2 main categories of bread.

Heavily enriched doughs, particularly sweet ones, doughs, a cheese Brioche for
example, or Portugese Sweet Bread, can, and often do brown and give a hollow
hump when the centre of the loaf is barely cooked and a doughy centre can
result from use of eye and sound as the sole indicators of a coooked loaf.

High hydration (70%+) breads can be difficult browned well, and be giving a
hollow sound when the crumb has "cooked" to the point of the change in the
starch molecules that produces the hollow sound but still require another 10,
20, or even, in some of my experimental breads 30 minutes to remove the dreaded
"Gummy crumb".

In extreme cases, I have had to bake to 213-214F (I know, that's above water
boiling point but 90% hydration Pain a l'Ancienne will reach that internal temp
without burning the crust.

Rules of thumb.

Enriched doughs with eggs, fat and sugar I bake to at least 195F

Lean "normal" hydration doughs, the classic Parisian Baguette for example, I
bake to at least 200 and preferably 205F (for my tastes, any kind of gummy,
sticky, doughy centre is an emetic)

High hydration and Pain a l'Ancienne I bake to at least 205F and , if in doubt,
right up to 212F.

These temperatures are not carved in stone but they are a reliable start point.


Love

John