Preserving (rec.food.preserving) Devoted to the discussion of recipes, equipment, and techniques of food preservation. Techniques that should be discussed in this forum include canning, freezing, dehydration, pickling, smoking, salting, and distilling.

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Old 01-02-2010, 01:08 AM posted to rec.food.preserving
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Default Making Wine Jelly or Vinegar with Homemade Wine

Hello all,

We have blackberries on my fiance's property. He has about thirty 5 yr old
thorny plants and last January we planted 100 of the new thornless
varieties, needless to say we hope to have lots of berries this year. Last
year at then end of the season fiance made some wine with the berries that
were too ugly to sell. He is not all that experienced with wine but very
experienced with beer brewing. We're not really sure how to judge the
outcome of this wine because neither of us are connoisseurs. We are
thinking of making Wine Jelly or Blackberry Vinegar out of it. If I had to
describe it, I would say it tastes kind of like a cross between beer and
wine. It's got beautiful color, of course, it's got some alcohol and
whatever sugar was left in it fermented out in the quart jars to give it a
little bit of zing (carbonation I guess). It's also got a little bitter
flavor. It does not taste sour and it does not taste like Vinegar. It's
nice, but the flavor to me is not all that great. I mean I could drink it
just for the health/ antioxidant benefits, but it would be nice if it tasted
a little better. It's almost like it has an "unfinished" taste. There is a
little bit of lees in the bottom of the glass when you get done, if that is
the right word. I'm sure w/o tasting it you all can not advise properly,
but I'll ask a couple questions about making vinegar or jelly.

I've researched making vinegar and looked for culture on the Internet, I
found 8oz jars for around $12. The issue is that I have about three gallons
of wine and recipe for vinegar states I have to use 96oz of mother. (I
think it's 8oz starter, 8 oz water, 16 oz wine).
I wrote a guy on Ebay and he quoted me that amount and said if I wanted a
large amount he'd order it. Everything I've read says the mother continues
to grow and get larger and you can cut off pieces and give them away/sell/
whatever. Why would I need THAT much starter? I'm thinking you can just
put in 16oz or so and let it go. I think Blackberry Vinegar with some
Rosemary would be divine.

The other option would be to make Jelly. I could wait till I get some Basil
going and flavor it with that or other herbs. I know the Vinegar would be
good, I'm just not sure about the jelly.


--
Rita Foust
Garland, TX
Zone 7b-8a
Farmer Jones Eco-Friendly Plants & Produce
http://www.localharvest.org/farms/M10383




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Old 01-02-2010, 07:03 PM posted to rec.food.preserving
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Default Making Wine Jelly or Vinegar with Homemade Wine

On Jan 31, 7:08*pm, "Garland Grower"
wrote:
Hello all,

We have blackberries on my fiance's property. *He has about thirty 5 yr old
thorny plants and last January we planted 100 of the new thornless
varieties, needless to say we hope to have lots of berries this year. *Last
year at then end of the season fiance made some wine with the berries that
were too ugly to sell. *He is not all that experienced with wine but very
experienced with beer brewing. *We're not really sure how to judge the
outcome of this wine because neither of us are connoisseurs. *We are
thinking of making Wine Jelly or Blackberry Vinegar out of it. *If I had to
describe it, I would say it tastes kind of like a cross between beer and
wine. *It's got beautiful color, of course, it's got some alcohol and
whatever sugar was left in it fermented out in the quart jars to give it a
little bit of zing (carbonation I guess). *It's also got a little bitter
flavor. *It does not taste sour and it does not taste like Vinegar. *It's
nice, but the flavor to me is not all that great. *I mean I could drink it
just for the health/ antioxidant benefits, but it would be nice if it tasted
a little better. *It's almost like it has an "unfinished" taste. *There is a
little bit of lees in the bottom of the glass when you get done, if that is
the right word. *I'm sure w/o tasting it you all can not advise properly,
but I'll ask a couple questions about making vinegar or jelly.

I've researched making vinegar and looked for culture on the Internet, I
found 8oz jars for around $12. *The issue is that I have about three gallons
of wine and recipe for vinegar states I have to use 96oz of mother. *(I
think it's 8oz starter, 8 oz water, 16 oz wine).
I wrote a guy on Ebay and he quoted me that amount and said if I wanted a
large amount he'd order it. *Everything I've read says the mother continues
to grow and get larger and you can cut off pieces and give them away/sell/
whatever. *Why would I need THAT much starter? *I'm thinking you can just
put in 16oz or so and let it go. *I think Blackberry Vinegar with some
Rosemary would be divine.

The other option would be to make Jelly. *I could wait till I get some Basil
going and flavor it with that or other herbs. *I know the Vinegar would be
good, I'm just not sure about the jelly.

--
Rita Foust
Garland, TX
Zone 7b-8a
Farmer Jones Eco-Friendly Plants & Producehttp://www.localharvest.org/farms/M10383


may I suggest that you buy enough to get started with making the
vinegar and then just use the starter from that for the larger
amount?

Actually I'd never heard about using a "mother" to make vinegar. I've
made it by leaving Cider open to the air. I thought that was how all
vinegar was made. I'd like to hear why you'd need a starter to turn
wine into vinegar before I invested money into it. LOL Kitty
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Old 02-02-2010, 05:49 PM posted to rec.food.preserving
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Default Making Wine Jelly or Vinegar with Homemade Wine

Kathi Jones wrote:

Actually I'd never heard about using a "mother" to make vinegar. I've
made it by leaving Cider open to the air. I thought that was how all
vinegar was made. I'd like to hear why you'd need a starter to turn
wine into vinegar before I invested money into it.


Starting wild will produce random results as a starting point.
Starting with a mother culture should produce known results. The idea
of a mother is it's a starter culture that has already been judged to
make better vinegar. There's been time to put it through selection for
better results.

Compare with brewing beer with wild yeast from the air versus a pure
strain derived from the one isolated by Carlsberg a few hundred years
ago. There's a region in Belgium where the wild yeast produces superior
ale but other than that region chances are the wild stuff will not be as
good as the stuff that was isolated a long time ago and ever since then
selected for quality.
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Old 03-02-2010, 01:59 AM posted to rec.food.preserving
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Default Making Wine Jelly or Vinegar with Homemade Wine

Kitty wrote:

may I suggest that you buy enough to get started with making the
vinegar and then just use the starter from that for the larger
amount?


I've seen unpasteurized vinegar for sale in health food stores. You
could make your mother from that.

B/
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Old 03-02-2010, 05:28 PM posted to rec.food.preserving
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Default Making Wine Jelly or Vinegar with Homemade Wine

On Feb 2, 7:59*pm, Brian Mailman wrote:
Kitty wrote:
may I suggest that you buy enough to get started with making the
vinegar and then just use the starter from that for the larger
amount?


I've seen unpasteurized vinegar for sale in health food stores. *You
could make your mother from that.

B/


thanks for all the answers about vinegar. So, now I have a question
of my own.

I bought unpasturized sweet Cider, and wanted vinegar. so I let it
ferment, and then left that open to the air to turn to vinegar.
Should I have bought yeast to ferment the cider in the first place?
should I have used a starter for the vinegar? I use a lot of cider
vinegar and would love to make my own. thanks for any help. Kitty


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Old 03-02-2010, 11:24 PM posted to rec.food.preserving
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Default Making Wine Jelly or Vinegar with Homemade Wine

Kitty wrote:
On Feb 2, 7:59 pm, Brian Mailman wrote:
Kitty wrote:
may I suggest that you buy enough to get started with making the
vinegar and then just use the starter from that for the larger
amount?


I've seen unpasteurized vinegar for sale in health food stores. You
could make your mother from that.


thanks for all the answers about vinegar. So, now I have a question
of my own.

I bought unpasturized sweet Cider, and wanted vinegar. so I let it
ferment, and then left that open to the air to turn to vinegar.
Should I have bought yeast to ferment the cider in the first place?


You may have heard the story that Louis Pasteur had been hired by the
Parisian vintners to solve a centuries-old mystery on why grape juice
sometimes went to vinegar instead of wine...

My feeling is yes, for the first batch, so you know what kind of yeast
you're getting. After that, you can probably inoculate one batch from
an older one.

should I have used a starter for the vinegar?


Same answer...

I use a lot of cider vinegar and would love to make my own.


Commendable project! burrowing around in bookmarks... I have a link on
how to do it. I imagine it's the same process for cider vinegar as wine
vinegar.

http://www.honeyflowfarm.com/newsletters/2006/winter/vinegarpage.htm
or
http://tinyurl.com/yjwyn7m

B/
thanks for any help. Kitty
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Old 06-02-2010, 06:06 PM posted to rec.food.preserving
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Default Making Wine Jelly or Vinegar with Homemade Wine

thanks for the web sites. I'm enjoying learning more and planning how
to do this. thanks, Kitty

On Feb 3, 5:24*pm, Brian Mailman wrote:
Kitty wrote:
On Feb 2, 7:59 pm, Brian Mailman wrote:
Kitty wrote:
may I suggest that you buy enough to get started with making the
vinegar and then just use the starter from that for the larger
amount?


I've seen unpasteurized vinegar for sale in health food stores. *You
could make your mother from that.


thanks for all the answers about vinegar. *So, now I have a question
of my own.


I bought unpasturized sweet Cider, and wanted vinegar. *so I let it
ferment, and then left that open to the air to turn to vinegar.
Should I have bought yeast to ferment the cider in the first place?


You may have heard the story that Louis Pasteur had been hired by the
Parisian vintners to solve a centuries-old mystery on why grape juice
sometimes went to vinegar instead of wine...

My feeling is yes, for the first batch, so you know what kind of yeast
you're getting. *After that, you can probably inoculate one batch from
an older one.

should I have used a starter for the vinegar?


Same answer...

* I use a lot of cider vinegar and would love to make my own.

Commendable project! burrowing around in bookmarks... I have a link on
how to do it. *I imagine it's the same process for cider vinegar as wine
vinegar.

http://www.honeyflowfarm.com/newsletters/2006/winter/vinegarpage.htm
orhttp://tinyurl.com/yjwyn7m

B/
* *thanks for any help. *Kitty




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