I just heard on the 5 o'clock morning news, that the Second Avenue
Deli in New York City is closed since Sunday, in a dispute with the
landlord. There is a good chance, according to the owners of the
deli, that the restaurant will not reopen.

I hope that it is not going to happen.

Margaret Suran wrote:
> I just heard on the 5 o'clock morning news, that the Second Avenue
> Deli in New York City is closed since Sunday, in a dispute with the
> landlord. There is a good chance, according to the owners of the
> deli, that the restaurant will not reopen.
>
> I hope that it is not going to happen.


Famous 2nd Avenue Deli shuts down, possibly for good


January 5, 2006, 4:03 AM EST

NEW YORK (AP) _ One of the most famous delis in New York City may have
served its last corn beef on rye.

The owner of the 2nd Avenue Deli said he closed the restaurant Sunday
after a lease dispute with the building's new owners.

"My current rent is $24,000 a month for 2,800 square feet," Jack
Lebewohl told The New York Times. "They want $33,000. I can't afford
that."

Jonis Realty of Great Neck, N.Y., owns the building. The Times said
messages left with representatives of Jonis Realty were not returned.

The deli has been a landmark in the Lower East Side ever since it
opened in 1954, serving much-loved Jewish fare like chopped liver,
potato kugel and hefty corn beef sandwiches.

Lebewohl said the restaurant needs to undergo major renovations to pass
Board of Health regulations. Lebewohl said he couldn't justify the
added investment without a more affordable long-term lease.

Lebewohl, 57, said he wants to reopen but can't without a new lease
agreement.

His brother, Abe, a Holocaust survivor who founded the restaurant, was
shot and killed while attempting to make a bank deposit in 1996.

"My goal is to reopen," he told the paper. "We've become a
destination."

Copyright 2006 Newsday Inc.
---

Sheldon

"Sheldon" > wrote in message
ps.com...

> "My current rent is $24,000 a month for 2,800 square feet,"

Oxygen! Gimme oxygen quick! That's some serious rent.

In article >,
"Doug Kanter" > wrote:

> "Sheldon" > wrote in message
> ps.com...
>
> > "My current rent is $24,000 a month for 2,800 square feet,"
>
> Oxygen! Gimme oxygen quick! That's some serious rent.

Have you ever been in there, Doug?
--
http://www.jamlady.eboard.com, updated 1-3-2006, Sam I Am! and Hello!

"Melba's Jammin'" > wrote in message
...
> In article >,
> "Doug Kanter" > wrote:
>
>> "Sheldon" > wrote in message
>> ps.com...
>>
>> > "My current rent is $24,000 a month for 2,800 square feet,"
>>
>> Oxygen! Gimme oxygen quick! That's some serious rent.
>
> Have you ever been in there, Doug?

Not in over 20 years.

In article >,
"Doug Kanter" > wrote:

> "Melba's Jammin'" > wrote in message
> ...
> > In article >,
> > "Doug Kanter" > wrote:
> >
> >> "Sheldon" > wrote in message
> >> ps.com...
> >>
> >> > "My current rent is $24,000 a month for 2,800 square feet,"
> >>
> >> Oxygen! Gimme oxygen quick! That's some serious rent.
> >
> > Have you ever been in there, Doug?
>
> Not in over 20 years.

Busy place. Rent's high, for sure, and they've got to be taking in a
boatload of money. But not, apparently, enough to justify what? a
30-35% monthly increase? I weep for sad.
--
http://www.jamlady.eboard.com, updated 1-3-2006, Sam I Am! and Hello!

Here is the article from today's NY Times:

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/01/05/nyregion/05deli.html

Margaret Suran wrote:
>
> I just heard on the 5 o'clock morning news, that the Second Avenue Deli
> in New York City is closed since Sunday, in a dispute with the
> landlord. There is a good chance, according to the owners of the deli,
> that the restaurant will not reopen.
>
> I hope that it is not going to happen.

After reading the articles posted, and admittedly I know little about
real estate in NYC, do you think they were price gouging 2nd Ave Deli a
bit much? Do rents really go for 33,000/month for that type of space?
Such a shame the deli never purchased the building long ago
Goomba

Goomba38 wrote:
> Margaret Suran wrote:
>
>>
>> I just heard on the 5 o'clock morning news, that the Second Avenue
>> Deli in New York City is closed since Sunday, in a dispute with the
>> landlord. There is a good chance, according to the owners of the
>> deli, that the restaurant will not reopen.
>>
>> I hope that it is not going to happen.
>
>
> After reading the articles posted, and admittedly I know little about
> real estate in NYC, do you think they were price gouging 2nd Ave Deli a
> bit much? Do rents really go for 33,000/month for that type of space?
> Such a shame the deli never purchased the building long ago
> Goomba


Sadly, that is the way many places in New York City get forced out of
business. My favorite French Pastry Shop, Bonte's, just two blocks
from here, lost its place that way, as did Voulez Vous, a wonderful
little Bistro type restaurant right across the street from where I
live. It's one after another, with NYC real estate prices being insane.

Goomba38 wrote:
> Margaret Suran wrote:
> >
> > I just heard on the 5 o'clock morning news, that the Second Avenue Deli
> > in New York City is closed since Sunday, in a dispute with the
> > landlord. There is a good chance, according to the owners of the deli,
> > that the restaurant will not reopen.
> >
> > I hope that it is not going to happen.
>
> After reading the articles posted, and admittedly I know little about
> real estate in NYC, do you think they were price gouging 2nd Ave Deli a
> bit much? Do rents really go for 33,000/month for that type of space?
> Such a shame the deli never purchased the building long ago
> Goomba

Purchase the entire building... you're talking The Donald, not some
fercocktah deli.

Yeah NYC rents go up by the thousands, they do, and more. Actually for
NYC that space at a $5,000/mo price increase is not exhorbitant,
especially not at the end of a five year lease, that's like an 18%
increase... RE has increased far more and with normal inflation figured
in that rent is actually a bargain. A $5,000/mo increase comes to some
$200/day... or a dozen sandwiches.

I don't think the rent increase has anything to do with whether the
deli will continue in business... they can very easily make up that
$200/day if only by increasing the prices on their menu by 1/2%, and/or
squeezing in one more small table. I think there are two other reasons
the deli may close forever... first, the cost of massive upgrading to
meet current health code requirements... obviously seriously neglected
over the past many years until now it's a huge bill... that's pure
neglect, which means the owner was seriously contemplating for a long
time not renewing the lease regardless (like he didn't know there'd be
a rent increase, right) and instead was simply squirreling away the
upgrade gelt for retirement, which leads to the second reason, and
probably the more real reason, the owner is just getting too old and
there is no family heir who wants to continue in what is one of the
roughest businesses on Earth, operating a kosher deli... no outsider
will buy it, because even though many would like to they just can't do
kosher... even McDonalds with all their Mega-Billions can't do
kosher... I don't mean won't, I mean can't, as in literally
*incapable*... I mean there's a lot more to doing kosher than an
Irishman agreeing to a circumcision. Shit happens... noo, what else...
next victim.

Sheldon

"Sheldon" > wrote

> upgrade gelt for retirement, which leads to the second reason, and
> probably the more real reason, the owner is just getting too old and
> there is no family heir who wants to continue in what is one of the
> roughest businesses on Earth, operating a kosher deli... no outsider
> will buy it, because even though many would like to they just can't do
> kosher... even McDonalds with all their Mega-Billions can't do
> kosher... I don't mean won't, I mean can't, as in literally
> *incapable*... I mean there's a lot more to doing kosher than an
> Irishman agreeing to a circumcision. Shit happens... noo, what else...
> next victim.

Perhaps you're right about the family, when I last saw, the kids were
all in the business. Who knows, that was then. However, it is not a
kosher deli, unless kosher delis have started serving up bacon and
egg and cheese sandwiches.

nancy

Sorry, Sheldon, it is indeed kosher.

nancy

On Thu, 5 Jan 2006 12:24:40 -0500, "Nancy Young" >
wrote:

>Sorry, Sheldon, it is indeed kosher.
>
>nancy
>


You bet it is...when I took my kids there at some point years ago, one
of them insisted on a cheeseburger and it broke his heart.

Boron

Nancy Young wrote:
> Sorry, Sheldon, it is indeed kosher.
>
> nancy
>
>

so do they serve bacon or not?

--

saerah

http://anisaerah.blogspot.com/

"Peace is not an absence of war, it is a virtue, a state of mind, a
disposition for benevolence, confidence, justice."
-Baruch Spinoza

"There is a theory which states that if ever anybody discovers exactly
what the Universe is for and why it is here, it will instantly disappear
and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable. There
is another theory which states that this has already happened."
-Douglas Adams

On Thu, 5 Jan 2006 12:24:40 -0500, "Nancy Young" >
rummaged among random neurons and opined:

>Sorry, Sheldon, it is indeed kosher.
>
You wanna know *how* kosher??? When I had lunch there with my daughter
and Margaret Suran, we had a shopping bag that included some
foodstuffs I'd bought for my daughter to take back to her place in
Brooklyn. She had to hide it in her backpack b/c Margaret told us we'd
be refused service if they caught sight of it..

And no yelling about the sneakiness. If they didn't see it, I didn't
do it.

Backdoor babe,
Terry "Squeaks" Pulliam Burd
AAC(F)BV66.0748.CA

"If the soup had been as hot as the claret, if the claret had been as
old as the bird, and if the bird's breasts had been as full as the
waitress's, it would have been a very good dinner."

-- Duncan Hines

To reply, replace "spaminator" with "cox"

Nancy Young wrote:
> "Sheldon" > wrote
>
> > upgrade gelt for retirement, which leads to the second reason, and
> > probably the more real reason, the owner is just getting too old and
> > there is no family heir who wants to continue in what is one of the
> > roughest businesses on Earth, operating a kosher deli... no outsider
> > will buy it, because even though many would like to they just can't do
> > kosher... even McDonalds with all their Mega-Billions can't do
> > kosher... I don't mean won't, I mean can't, as in literally
> > *incapable*... I mean there's a lot more to doing kosher than an
> > Irishman agreeing to a circumcision. Shit happens... noo, what else...
> > next victim.
>
> Perhaps you're right about the family, when I last saw, the kids were
> all in the business. Who knows, that was then. However, it is not a
> kosher deli, unless kosher delis have started serving up bacon and
> egg and cheese sandwiches.

You must be confusing delis... The Second Avenue Deli is indeed kosher,
not Katz's and not many other NYC delis, but The Second Avenue Deli is
definitely kosher... not kosher style, kosher!

http://www.2ndavedeli.com

good post, Sheldon

Sheldon wrote:

> A $5,000/mo increase comes to some $200/day... or a dozen sandwiches.

So the PROFIT on a single sandwich is $17? Looked at the menu online at
http://www.bridgeandtunnelclub.com/b...avenuedeli.htm and I
see you're full of shit, as usual.

Bob

On Thu 05 Jan 2006 04:02:13p, Thus Spake Zarathustra, or was it Bob
Terwilliger?

> Sheldon wrote:
>
>> A $5,000/mo increase comes to some $200/day... or a dozen sandwiches.
>
> So the PROFIT on a single sandwich is $17? Looked at the menu online at
> http://www.bridgeandtunnelclub.com/b...avenuedeli.htm and I
> see you're full of shit, as usual.

Sheldon is long overdue for a box of Feenamint.

--
Wayne Boatwright *¿*
__________________________________________________ ________________
And if we enter a room full of manure, may we believe in the pony.

I wrote:

> Sheldon wrote:
>
>> A $5,000/mo increase comes to some $200/day... or a dozen sandwiches.
>
> So the PROFIT on a single sandwich is $17? Looked at the menu online at
> http://www.bridgeandtunnelclub.com/b...avenuedeli.htm and I
> see you're full of shit, as usual.

That menu is out-of-date, as I've seen from subsequent posts.
http://www.2ndavedeli.com/2nd%20Aven...ant%20Menu.pdf is
more current, and it's possible that Sheldon is correct: If the deli sold a
dozen more of its MOST EXPENSIVE sandwiches, it's possible that the profit
could come to more than $200. Of course, if they sold an extra dozen
chopped-liver sandwiches, the aggregate profit wouldn't even come CLOSE to
$200.

Bob

"Margaret Suran" > wrote

> I just heard on the 5 o'clock morning news, that the Second Avenue Deli in
> New York City is closed since Sunday, in a dispute with the landlord.
> There is a good chance, according to the owners of the deli, that the
> restaurant will not reopen.

That should be illegal, as long as they're flinging eminent domain
all over the place willy nilly, save an institution. "Mayor Bloomberg!
Buy the building!"

nancy

In article >,
Margaret Suran > wrote:

> I just heard on the 5 o'clock morning news, that the Second Avenue
> Deli in New York City is closed since Sunday, in a dispute with the
> landlord. There is a good chance, according to the owners of the
> deli, that the restaurant will not reopen.
>
> I hope that it is not going to happen.

How dare they!! NOW where will I fight with you over a check? Can you
find out where Lisa and Mary are or will go? This is terrible news,
Margaret.
--
http://www.jamlady.eboard.com, updated 1-3-2006, Sam I Am! and Hello!

On Thu, 05 Jan 2006 07:44:49 -0600, Melba's Jammin'
> rummaged among random neurons
and opined:

>How dare they!! NOW where will I fight with you over a check? Can you
>find out where Lisa and Mary are or will go? This is terrible news,
>Margaret.

You ever win a check with Margaret? I swear, the woman got up at oh
dawn thirty to hoof it to the 2nd Ave. Deli to make sure Lisa and Mary
gave her the check. Next time, I'm going to have Kristen distract her
while I snag the check, but don't tell Margaret. <ssshhhh!>

BTW, Mary and Lisa loved their gifts, Barb.

Sneakily,
Terry "Squeaks" Pulliam Burd
AAC(F)BV66.0748.CA

"If the soup had been as hot as the claret, if the claret had been as
old as the bird, and if the bird's breasts had been as full as the
waitress's, it would have been a very good dinner."

-- Duncan Hines

To reply, replace "spaminator" with "cox"

In article >,
Terry Pulliam Burd > wrote:

> On Thu, 05 Jan 2006 07:44:49 -0600, Melba's Jammin'
> > rummaged among random neurons
> and opined:
>
> >How dare they!! NOW where will I fight with you over a check? Can you
> >find out where Lisa and Mary are or will go? This is terrible news,
> >Margaret.
>
> You ever win a check with Margaret?

More than once. :-)

> I swear, the woman got up at oh
> dawn thirty to hoof it to the 2nd Ave. Deli to make sure Lisa and
> Mary gave her the check.

That's because of the time I did that to her. Oh my Alex!! I was
absolutely mortified at my behavior!! I liketa died -- I got into an
almost-screaming match in the deli. I shudder and shake every time I
think about it. I got lost in the emotion, passionate person that I
am. But the check was mine. And Lisa, Alex bless her, was calm as
anything while we "talked." Alex forgive me! (I've made it up to
Lisa.) <shudders in horror at my public behavior -- people were LOOKING>

> Next time, I'm going to have Kristen distract her
> while I snag the check, but don't tell Margaret. <ssshhhh!>
>
> BTW, Mary and Lisa loved their gifts, Barb.

> Sneakily,
> Terry "Squeaks" Pulliam Burd
> AAC(F)BV66.0748.CA
--
http://www.jamlady.eboard.com, updated 1-3-2006, Sam I Am! and Hello!

Terry Pulliam Burd wrote:
> On Thu, 05 Jan 2006 07:44:49 -0600, Melba's Jammin'
> > rummaged among random neurons
> and opined:
>
>
>>How dare they!! NOW where will I fight with you over a check? Can you
>>find out where Lisa and Mary are or will go? This is terrible news,
>>Margaret.
>
>
> You ever win a check with Margaret? I swear, the woman got up at oh
> dawn thirty to hoof it to the 2nd Ave. Deli to make sure Lisa and Mary
> gave her the check. Next time, I'm going to have Kristen distract her
> while I snag the check, but don't tell Margaret. <ssshhhh!>
>
> BTW, Mary and Lisa loved their gifts, Barb.
>
> Sneakily,
> Terry "Squeaks" Pulliam Burd



Terry, Guess from whom I learned to do it?

On Fri, 06 Jan 2006 13:19:31 -0500, Margaret Suran
> rummaged among random neurons and
opined:

>
>
>Terry Pulliam Burd wrote:

>> You ever win a check with Margaret? I swear, the woman got up at oh
>> dawn thirty to hoof it to the 2nd Ave. Deli to make sure Lisa and Mary
>> gave her the check. Next time, I'm going to have Kristen distract her
>> while I snag the check, but don't tell Margaret. <ssshhhh!>

>Terry, Guess from whom I learned to do it?

Lemme guess...are her initials BS (which really kinda fits when you
think about it)?

Archly,
Terry "Squeaks" Pulliam Burd
AAC(F)BV66.0748.CA

"If the soup had been as hot as the claret, if the claret had been as
old as the bird, and if the bird's breasts had been as full as the
waitress's, it would have been a very good dinner."

-- Duncan Hines

To reply, replace "spaminator" with "cox"

In article >,
Terry Pulliam Burd > wrote:

> On Fri, 06 Jan 2006 13:19:31 -0500, Margaret Suran
> > rummaged among random neurons and
> opined:
>
> >
> >
> >Terry Pulliam Burd wrote:
>
> >> You ever win a check with Margaret? I swear, the woman got up at oh
> >> dawn thirty to hoof it to the 2nd Ave. Deli to make sure Lisa and Mary
> >> gave her the check. Next time, I'm going to have Kristen distract her
> >> while I snag the check, but don't tell Margaret. <ssshhhh!>
>
> >Terry, Guess from whom I learned to do it?
>
> Lemme guess...are her initials BS (which really kinda fits when you
> think about it)?

Hey, hey, hey!! It's Christmas Day! Have a little charity.
-B
--
http://www.jamlady.eboard.com, updated 1-3-2006, Sam I Am! and Hello!

On Thu, 05 Jan 2006 05:24:18 -0500, Margaret Suran
> rummaged among random neurons and
opined:

>
>I just heard on the 5 o'clock morning news, that the Second Avenue
>Deli in New York City is closed since Sunday, in a dispute with the
>landlord. There is a good chance, according to the owners of the
>deli, that the restaurant will not reopen.
>
>I hope that it is not going to happen.

<sob!> Margaret, this is horrible! This is the same place you, Kristen
and I had our last luncheon? I thought they had a plaque installed
memorializing the occasion and, therefore, it became a historical
landmark...alert the media!!

Indignantly,
Terry "Squeaks" Pulliam Burd
AAC(F)BV66.0748.CA

"If the soup had been as hot as the claret, if the claret had been as
old as the bird, and if the bird's breasts had been as full as the
waitress's, it would have been a very good dinner."

-- Duncan Hines

To reply, replace "spaminator" with "cox"