I need advice on cooking various greens, such as Kale, Collard Greens,
etc. Recently they have been included in some orders at nice
restaurants, and I find them delicious. Tonight I cooked Collard
Greens for the first time, but they seemed a little bitter. I sauted
them in a small amount of bacon fat, garlic, olive oil--stir-fried
them. How do you cook them? Is one kind better than another? Should I
have added a bit of sugar to the mix? Would appreciate any advice.
TIA
Nancree

nancree wrote:
> I need advice on cooking various greens, such as Kale, Collard Greens,
> etc. Recently they have been included in some orders at nice
> restaurants, and I find them delicious. Tonight I cooked Collard
> Greens for the first time, but they seemed a little bitter. I sauted
> them in a small amount of bacon fat, garlic, olive oil--stir-fried
> them. How do you cook them? Is one kind better than another? Should I
> have added a bit of sugar to the mix? Would appreciate any advice.
> TIA
> Nancree

Nancree,

My husband boils his down for a good hour and a half with ham hocks and some
greens seasoning (what's in that, I have no idea!). I personally don't care
for greens, but I've heard that Collard Greens are more bitter than mustard
or kale. Good luck!

kili

I would have done what you did. Maybe more salt than you would think,
and some lemon (or vinegar, but I prefer lemon) to cut the bitterness?

I would also braise them after sauteeing, in whatever liquid seems
appropriate - water, stock, tomato broth from the can of tomatoes. I
think, but am not positive (you food science types check me on this)
that braising in liquid mellows the bitterness of the greens. They
aren't really intended for quick sauteeing or stir fries, unless you
get the miniature winter greens we see here in California. But even
those are labeled "braising mix".

I wouldn't dump in a quart of liquid, just enough to keep the greens
wet while braising for a good while (20 minutes? - I just check
frequently to see, haven't timed it)

I have a recipe from the NYC Union Square Farmers' Market, xeroxed and
handed out at the stand 15 years ago, for Kenyan greens. It involves
sauteeing, some lemon juice and red pepper flakes. Braising after
sauteeing is definitely part of the technique. The greens were supposed
to be kale and/or collard. If you really want me to I will try to find
where I filed this and post a real recipe, not these vague guidelines.

Leila

On Tue, 08 Feb 2005 06:06:35 GMT, "kilikini"
> wrote:

> My husband boils his down for a good hour and a half with ham hocks and some
> greens seasoning (what's in that, I have no idea!). I personally don't care
> for greens, but I've heard that Collard Greens are more bitter than mustard
> or kale. Good luck!

I tried collards exactly ONCE. They are VERY bitter. Maybe
if someone who knows what they're doing cooks them and adds
something "special" they aren't - but I'd never eaten or
cooked them before and I won't do it again.

sf

sf wrote:
> On Tue, 08 Feb 2005 06:06:35 GMT, "kilikini"
> > wrote:
>
> > My husband boils his down for a good hour and a half with ham
hocks and some
> > greens seasoning (what's in that, I have no idea!). I personally
don't care
> > for greens, but I've heard that Collard Greens are more bitter
than mustard
> > or kale. Good luck!
>
> I tried collards exactly ONCE. They are VERY bitter. Maybe
> if someone who knows what they're doing cooks them and adds
> something "special" they aren't - but I'd never eaten or
> cooked them before and I won't do it again.
>
> sf

Collards are only bitter if they contain too much nitrogen. The ones
you ate had been picked too late, or cooked too late after having been
picked. Collards should be picked early (young) and cooked the same
day - or the next - after they are picked.

hth,
-L.

nancree wrote:
> I need advice on cooking various greens, such as Kale, Collard
Greens,
> etc. Recently they have been included in some orders at nice
> restaurants, and I find them delicious. Tonight I cooked Collard
> Greens for the first time, but they seemed a little bitter. I sauted
> them in a small amount of bacon fat, garlic, olive oil--stir-fried
> them. How do you cook them? Is one kind better than another? Should
I
> have added a bit of sugar to the mix? Would appreciate any advice.
> TIA
> Nancree

The bitterness is related to the amount of nitrogen in the greens - see
my reply to sf.

I steam the heck out of them, drain and *then* season them. My MIL
seasons them with ham bone, or bacon, etc. while they are cooking. I
just add a little butter or margerine, salt, pepper and a tad of
Italian dressing, after steaming. the best greens are those you grow
yourself - because you can control the conditions under which they are
grown. Most greens are best purchased in the Spring.

-L.

On Mon 07 Feb 2005 10:59:24p, nancree wrote in rec.food.cooking:

> I need advice on cooking various greens, such as Kale, Collard Greens,
> etc. Recently they have been included in some orders at nice
> restaurants, and I find them delicious. Tonight I cooked Collard
> Greens for the first time, but they seemed a little bitter. I sauted
> them in a small amount of bacon fat, garlic, olive oil--stir-fried
> them. How do you cook them? Is one kind better than another? Should I
> have added a bit of sugar to the mix? Would appreciate any advice.
> TIA
> Nancree
>

Collard greens, in particular, tend to more bitterness. Whether or not you
saute first, there should always be liquid involved. My Mississippi
grandmother always cooked collard greens in combination with some other type
like turnip greens or mustard greens because she felt that collard greens
alone were too strongly flavored. She also added a little sugar to the
cooking water. Greens were always served with some vinegar in which small
hot peppers had been steeped. Most often, she cooked greens with a smoked
ham hock or added some bacon fat.

HTH
Wayne

In article .com>,
"nancree" > wrote:

> I need advice on cooking various greens, such as Kale, Collard Greens,
> etc.

I agree with the other posters' suggestion to mix greens. I mix
collards with turnip greens and like the combination much better than
collards alone.

My recipe involves browning and then braising a smoked ham hock (or
even a ham steak slice) for about an hour (ham slice for maybe a third
or half of that time) and then adding the greens. Make sure to remove
the ribs from the leaves; IMHO they don't add anything to the dish.
Braise for up to another hour, until the greens are soft. Don't use
too much water -- you want _some_ to make "pot likker" for your
cornbread (you are serving cornbread, right?) but you don't want
"greens soup." Add a splash of vinegar and a couple shakes of pepper
sauce. I prefer to serve mine with tomatoes (canned and drained are
okay if it's not the month in which we can get good local tomatoes) or
salsa and cornbread and maybe some more pepper sauce. Surprisingly
filling and nutritious (if a little high in sodium).

sd

On 7 Feb 2005 21:59:24 -0800, "nancree" > wrote:

>I need advice on cooking various greens, such as Kale, Collard Greens,
>etc. Recently they have been included in some orders at nice
>restaurants, and I find them delicious. Tonight I cooked Collard
>Greens for the first time, but they seemed a little bitter. I sauted
>them in a small amount of bacon fat, garlic, olive oil--stir-fried
>them. How do you cook them? Is one kind better than another? Should I
>have added a bit of sugar to the mix? Would appreciate any advice.
>TIA
>Nancree
If I have recently cook a country ham and have a piece of "hock," I
use that to season the greens. Otherwise, I do something along the
following line.

Leonard

@@@@@ Now You're Cooking! Export Format

Esau's Winter Greens

vegetables

1 Tbsp peanut oil
1/3 c apple-smoked bacon; chopped
1/2 c white onion; finely chopped
1 tbsp garlic; minced
16 c collard greens (about 2 large bunch; washed, stemmed, & choppe
3/4 c chicken stock
24 ozs light ale
1 tsp sugar
1 1/2 tbsps red wine vinegar
salt
1/8 tsp cayenne
1/4 tsp black pepper; freshly ground

Heat the oil in a heavy -bottomed non reactive pot over medium heat.
Add
the bacon and cook for 4-5 minutes or until crisp. Remove the bacon
and
reserve.

Add the onion to the hot fat and cook, stirring occassionally, for 4
minutes or until it starts to soften. Add the garlic and cook for 1
minute.

Return the bacon to the pot and add the greens, stock, ale, sugar,
vinegar,
and 1 teaspoon of salt. Bring the greens to a rapid simmer and cook,
stirring occassionally, for about 45 minutes or until they are
thoroughly
cooked and tender. Season with the cayenne pepper, black pepper, and
more
salt to taste. Serve immediately.

Source:
"Louis Osteen's Charleston Cuisine"

"nancree" > wrote in message
oups.com...
>I need advice on cooking various greens, such as Kale, Collard Greens,
> etc. Recently they have been included in some orders at nice
> restaurants, and I find them delicious. Tonight I cooked Collard
> Greens for the first time, but they seemed a little bitter. I sauted
> them in a small amount of bacon fat, garlic, olive oil--stir-fried
> them. How do you cook them? Is one kind better than another? Should I
> have added a bit of sugar to the mix? Would appreciate any advice.

I use just a little bit of olive oil to caramelize some sliced onions. Then
I throw in some trimmed and chopped swiss chard (for example) that is still
wet from rincing, and some coarsely chopped garlic. Cover and steam until
done. Season with salt and pepper.

sf wrote:
> On Tue, 08 Feb 2005 06:06:35 GMT, "kilikini"
> > wrote:
>
>> My husband boils his down for a good hour and a half with ham hocks
>> and some greens seasoning (what's in that, I have no idea!). I
>> personally don't care for greens, but I've heard that Collard
>> Greens are more bitter than mustard or kale. Good luck!
>
> I tried collards exactly ONCE. They are VERY bitter. Maybe
> if someone who knows what they're doing cooks them and adds
> something "special" they aren't - but I'd never eaten or
> cooked them before and I won't do it again.
>
> sf

I prefer turnip greens over collards any day. And yes, they should be
boiled (but don't have to be cooked to total mush). A bit of cooked bacon
or salt pork thrown in the pot (or a ham hock) adds a lot.

Jill

"nancree" > wrote:

>I need advice on cooking various greens, such as Kale, Collard Greens,
>etc. Recently they have been included in some orders at nice
>restaurants, and I find them delicious. Tonight I cooked Collard
>Greens for the first time, but they seemed a little bitter. I sauted
>them in a small amount of bacon fat, garlic, olive oil--stir-fried
>them. How do you cook them? Is one kind better than another? Should I
>have added a bit of sugar to the mix? Would appreciate any advice.
>TIA
>Nancree


Go pick so smaller, younger leaves. Wash and put in pot with about 1/2
- 2 cups of water. Cook for about 30 minutes with some bacon grease.
Not at all bitter.


--
Susan N.

"Moral indignation is in most cases two percent moral, 48 percent indignation, and 50 percent envy."
Vittorio De Sica, Italian movie director (1901-1974)

On 7 Feb 2005 21:59:24 -0800, "nancree" > wrote:

>I need advice on cooking various greens, such as Kale, Collard Greens,
>etc. Recently they have been included in some orders at nice
>restaurants, and I find them delicious. Tonight I cooked Collard
>Greens for the first time, but they seemed a little bitter. I sauted
>them in a small amount of bacon fat, garlic, olive oil--stir-fried
>them. How do you cook them? Is one kind better than another? Should I
>have added a bit of sugar to the mix? Would appreciate any advice.
>TIA
>Nancree

First cut out all the large vanes.
Then wash them as well as you would spinach.
Add bacon fat to a pan and then add the collards, they will wilt down
tremendously.

The are bitter, serve with hot sauce.

I have never heard of adding sugar to them, but your the one eating
them.

Now all this said, I do not eat them, this is how I cook them for
others.

Pan Ohco

A dear friend, who lives in North Carolina, recently sent me the
instructions for cooking greens. I have never eaten greens and wanted
to try them, so she tried to tell me everything I might need to know.
The market where I usually shop has not had any greens, this week, but
I'm hoping to find them somewhere else today.

Oh.."Pork Seasoning" that she mentions is Saz=F3n Goya, a great ham
flavored seasoning that is good in beans and soups.

Here is her letter..just as she sent it to me.
jillie
Roseville, CA

No biggy cooking greens, if you do it once and they come out good
you've got it
made.......
First of all people in the South wait until the frost hits the greens
(that really makes
them tender and delicious) up North we cook them all summer..( this
goes for
Collards, Mustard, Kale, turnips and slick greens)....but I would clean
them (look
for worms) then roll the leaves (like rolled cigars) cut them up and I
would put
them into a bag and put into the freezer to "frost" and then take them
out to cook .
..=2E..HOWEVER, if you want to freeze them to last for the winter....clean
them,
roll them up and slice them (about an inch wide) put them into a
colander >
then into boiling water for a minute or so (this is to shrink them)
then dump them
into cold water to stop the cooking > then into a strainer to drain the
water > put
into plastic bags (I weigh mine and bag a lb a bag < that's enough for
two people
one meal.....
After all that are you tired : )
If you just want to cook a meal for the night clean them cut them
up put them into the freezer for an hour or so (or overnight)
..( or just go ahead and cook them without putting them in the
freezer)..
fry some bacon, or salt pork ( unless you happen to have some Old
southern
Ham< I doubt that one) Or use at least two packages of that "Pork
Seasoning"
Tom sent you (watch adding salt using that one) frying the bacon with
canola oil
is good , but not Olive oil , different taste......cook greens until
they are tender....
..=2EThink I gave you the low down but if I missed something don't
hesitate to ask
again.....

That is a great recipe. It must be from Ginny. I would try it, but
nobody else would even look at it.

Jillie, did you see Peggy's post in rec.food.baking yesterday? She
sure could use some help with her bread baking.

Thanks to all of you who offered advice on cooking collard greens. It
looks like my main mistake was not braising them after sauteeing. I
was just stir-frying them. Also, I'll try another kind next time, kale
or swiss chard, for instance. And serving them with vinegar sounds
good, too. RFC is wonderful, isn't it? Just like having your kitchen
full of friends.
Nancree

Hi, Margaret,

Didn't see the message, but did send Peggy pictures and some
suggestions for her bread. She is trying to make it rocket science and
it's just flour, water and yeast. Hope I got her on the right track.

And yes, it is Ginny's recipe. Wish I could go take cooking lessons
from her for about a month!

Michael, the bread we're talking about is Ciabatta..done partly in the
bread machine. I'd be happy to send you the recipe and some (I hope)
helpful pictures of the procedure.
jillie
Roseville, CA

Collard greens that are bitter are that way because they haven't been
trimmed properly.

Put your greens on a cutting board. With a sharp knife, cut the fat
'vein' out of the greens and remove the stems.

Roll the now-trimmed greens up like a cabbage roll, then cut them into
slices.

Wash them in cool water two or three times. Nobody likes dirty gritty
greens.

Saute some sliced/diced onions in a little butter or olive oil. Add some
minced garlic. Put in some smoked tukrey parts. Add water to cover.
Bring to a boil. Add collard greens. Add some vinegar, maybe a
tablespoon or two. Also some crushed red pepper flakes.

After the greens come to a boil, turn them down to a simmer. Let simmer
for a couple of hours.

nancree wrote:
>
> I need advice on cooking various greens, such as Kale, Collard Greens,
> etc. Recently they have been included in some orders at nice
> restaurants, and I find them delicious. Tonight I cooked Collard
> Greens for the first time, but they seemed a little bitter. I sauted
> them in a small amount of bacon fat, garlic, olive oil--stir-fried
> them. How do you cook them? Is one kind better than another? Should I
> have added a bit of sugar to the mix? Would appreciate any advice.
> TIA
> Nancree

Welll, I'm of the "boil the hell outa 'em" school
of greens cookery. Dump them in a big pot of water
and through in some smoked ham hocks and cook until
they surrender. I've tried them cooked other ways
and it just doesn't do it for me.

Kate

--
Kate Connally
“If I were as old as I feel, I’d be dead already.”
Goldfish: “The wholesome snack that smiles back,
Until you bite their heads off.”
What if the hokey pokey really *is* what it's all about?

sf wrote:
>
> On Tue, 08 Feb 2005 06:06:35 GMT, "kilikini"
> > wrote:
>
> > My husband boils his down for a good hour and a half with ham hocks and some
> > greens seasoning (what's in that, I have no idea!). I personally don't care
> > for greens, but I've heard that Collard Greens are more bitter than mustard
> > or kale. Good luck!
>
> I tried collards exactly ONCE. They are VERY bitter. Maybe
> if someone who knows what they're doing cooks them and adds
> something "special" they aren't - but I'd never eaten or
> cooked them before and I won't do it again.
>
> sf

I've never found collards to be bitter at all.
And I'm fairly sensitive to bitter tastes. But
then I always eat them well cooked with smoked
ham hocks or even smoked turkey legs and they
are fine. I once had them "al dente" just lightly
sauteed at a Brazilian restaurant. I didn't care
for the texture, but they weren't bitter that
way either.

Kate

--
Kate Connally
“If I were as old as I feel, I’d be dead already.”
Goldfish: “The wholesome snack that smiles back,
Until you bite their heads off.”
What if the hokey pokey really *is* what it's all about?

Sharon Chilson wrote:
> Collard greens that are bitter are that way because they haven't
been
> trimmed properly.
>
> Put your greens on a cutting board. With a sharp knife, cut the fat
> 'vein' out of the greens and remove the stems.

Collards are not bitter from the stems/veins... if collards are bitter
it's not from the stems, it's because the leaves are bitter, the leaves
are supposed to be bitter, if they're not bitter than they're spinach
and not collards.

Now you're not the first one in this thread who mentioned cutting out
the stems (something you saw on foodtv but have never actually done
yourself) but then don't say what to do with the stems, if anything
(which is what proves you've never actually done this). The stems
require much longer cooking times to become tender, so they should be
diced and cooked as a separate vegetable, or added to soups/stews.

On Tue, 08 Feb 2005 16:19:00 -0500, Kate Connally >
wrote:

>nancree wrote:
>>
>> I need advice on cooking various greens, such as Kale, Collard Greens,
>> etc. Recently they have been included in some orders at nice
>> restaurants, and I find them delicious. Tonight I cooked Collard
>> Greens for the first time, but they seemed a little bitter. I sauted
>> them in a small amount of bacon fat, garlic, olive oil--stir-fried
>> them. How do you cook them? Is one kind better than another? Should I
>> have added a bit of sugar to the mix? Would appreciate any advice.
>> TIA
>> Nancree
>
>Welll, I'm of the "boil the hell outa 'em" school
>of greens cookery. Dump them in a big pot of water
>and through in some smoked ham hocks and cook until
>they surrender. I've tried them cooked other ways
>and it just doesn't do it for me.
>
>Kate
In the southern US where collards and such are commonplace, we do tend
to cook vegetables to death. For greens, the aim is to use enough
liquid to keep them wet, but to limit the liquid so that it is almost
cooked away by the time the greens are done.

I remember that my grandmother would cook collard leaves whole. When
they were done, she would cut them up with kitchen shears. I never
quite figured that out. Unfortunately, she's not around any more, so I
can't ask her why she did that. My mother still does this, but she
does it because, "that's the way my mother did it." I guess I've
broken the chain, because I chop them very coarsely before cooking.

Leonard

Leonard Lehew wrote:
>
> On Tue, 08 Feb 2005 16:19:00 -0500, Kate Connally >
> wrote:
>
> >nancree wrote:
> >>
> >> I need advice on cooking various greens, such as Kale, Collard Greens,
> >> etc. Recently they have been included in some orders at nice
> >> restaurants, and I find them delicious. Tonight I cooked Collard
> >> Greens for the first time, but they seemed a little bitter. I sauted
> >> them in a small amount of bacon fat, garlic, olive oil--stir-fried
> >> them. How do you cook them? Is one kind better than another? Should I
> >> have added a bit of sugar to the mix? Would appreciate any advice.
> >> TIA
> >> Nancree
> >
> >Welll, I'm of the "boil the hell outa 'em" school
> >of greens cookery. Dump them in a big pot of water
> >and through in some smoked ham hocks and cook until
> >they surrender. I've tried them cooked other ways
> >and it just doesn't do it for me.
> >
> >Kate
> In the southern US where collards and such are commonplace, we do tend
> to cook vegetables to death. For greens, the aim is to use enough
> liquid to keep them wet, but to limit the liquid so that it is almost
> cooked away by the time the greens are done.
>
> I remember that my grandmother would cook collard leaves whole. When
> they were done, she would cut them up with kitchen shears. I never
> quite figured that out. Unfortunately, she's not around any more, so I
> can't ask her why she did that. My mother still does this, but she
> does it because, "that's the way my mother did it." I guess I've
> broken the chain, because I chop them very coarsely before cooking.
>
> Leonard

If I were going to cook them from scratch I would certainly
chop them up first. It seems like it would be a pain in
the butt to try to chop afterwards. You'd have to wait until
they cooled to handle them. Anyway, I've only made them
from scratch once. I usually buy frozen chopped collard
greens. So easy! Most of the work - cleaning and chopping -
is already done.

Kate

--
Kate Connally
“If I were as old as I feel, I’d be dead already.”
Goldfish: “The wholesome snack that smiles back,
Until you bite their heads off.”
What if the hokey pokey really *is* what it's all about?

There are a number of differently flavored "Sazon Goyas." (Sazons
Goya?) The one called simply "Sazon Goya" is primarily MSG. I suspect
the other varieties are too.

-bwg

wrote:
> There are a number of differently flavored "Sazon Goyas." (Sazons
> Goya?) The one called simply "Sazon Goya" is primarily MSG. I suspect
> the other varieties are too.

Sazon Goya *is* MSG, a flavor enhancer... they are those tiny foil
packets, some of which also contain seasoning, ie. garlic, onion,
pepper, etc. but most contain a colorant and are typically used for
rice.

Goya Adobo is various flavored seasoning, packaged in large shaker
bottles.. this is a *flavored salt*, contains no MSG... this is what's
typically used for seasoning, also costs much, much less than the Goya
Sazon (MSG).

Anyway, there is nothing nefarious about MSG, like salt it occurs
naturally in most foods, MSG even occurs in breast milk. It's not the
MSG but the food in which it occurs naturally that people are allergic
to. The only- *ONLY* reason for "Chinese Food Syndrom* is because most
Chinese cooks use way too much MSG... ingesting comparable quantities
of ordinary table salt will result in the same symptoms, only far
worse... and no one is allergic to table salt... in either case it's a
result of overdosing... no different from the sypmtoms associated with
overdosing on booze, folks don't exhibit drunkeness, puke their guts,
and wake the next day hung over because they're allergic to bourbon,
regardless in certain Southern US biomes it's known as Bubba's Dew Drop
Inn Syndrome.

Sheldon

"Leonard Lehew" > wrote in message
...
> On Tue, 08 Feb 2005 16:19:00 -0500, Kate Connally >
> wrote:
> In the southern US where collards and such are commonplace, we do tend
> to cook vegetables to death. For greens, the aim is to use enough
> liquid to keep them wet, but to limit the liquid so that it is almost
> cooked away by the time the greens are done.

No "pot liquor"????? My mother always savoured the pot liquor left.

Where I've worked we'd usually cut out the main rib running through the
center, chop and saute it seperately with shallots. The leaves can then be
cooked to a tender point without losing the bright green appearance. Then
the two are re-combined.

Kate Connally wrote:
>
> If I were going to cook them from scratch I would certainly
> chop them up first. It seems like it would be a pain in
> the butt to try to chop afterwards. You'd have to wait until
> they cooled to handle them. Anyway, I've only made them
> from scratch once. I usually buy frozen chopped collard
> greens. So easy! Most of the work - cleaning and chopping -
> is already done.

Frozen are also much better quality than typical stupidmarket greens,
certainly fresher too... stupidmarket greens were picked more than two
weeks ago, frozen greens were flash frozen within an hour of harvest.
And frozen greens almost always cost less, no waste. A good trickto
cut down on cooking time is to as soon as you get your greens home to
clean, chop, and freeze... freezing breaks down the fiber... of course
then you may as well buy greens already frozen. Of course if you grow
your own... then go out each day and pick just the young tender leaves.

"Sheldon" > wrote in message
oups.com...

> Frozen are also much better quality than typical stupidmarket greens,
> certainly fresher too... stupidmarket greens were picked more than two
> weeks ago, frozen greens were flash frozen within an hour of harvest.
> And frozen greens almost always cost less, no waste. A good trickto
> cut down on cooking time is to as soon as you get your greens home to
> clean, chop, and freeze... freezing breaks down the fiber... of course
> then you may as well buy greens already frozen. Of course if you grow
> your own... then go out each day and pick just the young tender leaves.
>

Clever. Freezing will tenderize, since the expanded water breaks the leaves
from the inside out.

For greens, I'd have to agree.. one of the best frozen products. Every
restaurant I've worked used frozen spinach for everything except salad.
Amazingly, they used fresh chard to make what was virtually creamed-spinach,
substituting fresh chard. Peas were another product typically purchased
frozen.

Don't want to blow your theory there, Sheldon, but I've been cooking
collard greens for a long time. I always remove the stem/thick vein
before cooking them. My sisters-in-law, and my husband, all from rural
Mississippi, have always cooked them that way, as did their mother and
their grandmother and even their great-grandmother who had once been a
slave. The first three generations cooked them with ham hocks. My
husband and I don't eat pork so we use smoked turkey in ours. Now maybe
that's not how you cook them, but that's how we do. I don't fnd collards
to be bitter, but that's more than likely because I trim the stems and
thick veins before I cook them.

I actually use a lot of frozen spinach, especially in the winter. It's
Safeway brand organic spinach, and the cost savings and prep time saved
over fresh organic spinach is significant.

Yes, quality probably is somewhat better, although here in California
we get really nice greens in the winter time. My rule of thumb for
fresh greens is - don't buy when the price goes way up, because then
they're out of season or having a hard time with the crop for some
reason. There are periods of the year that are too hot for chard,
spinach et al, and they wilt. Other times when it's cold and rainy and
the fields wash out.

If I were really industrious I'd be growing my own chard - it thrives
around here (Oakland CA) in the winter time. But snails thrive too so
it ends up being more trouble than it's worth to me. Maybe next year,
when my kids can get into it with me. I did plant a couple of flats of
chard and one of mesclun two years ago and got tiny baby greens in
small quantities for another year. THe snails got lots of them but I
got some. And the greens just wouldn't die, kept coming back almost
like weeds.

Leila