On Tuesday, July 10, 2018 at 8:16:38 PM UTC-5, Nancy Young wrote:
>
> On 7/10/2018 7:41 PM, wrote:
>
> > On Tuesday, July 10, 2018 at 4:35:46 PM UTC-5, Nancy Young wrote:
>
> > Here's a picture of the tumblers with that straw with the bulge.
> >
> > https://s22.postimg.cc/rao7gija9/Insulated_Tumbler.jpg
>
> Those would have been perfect. I should have looked at the
> dollar store, apparently.
>
> Nancy
>
>
I still see them at my Dollar Tree. If you have one near or even a
Big Lots or Dollar General, check them out.

"jmcquown" wrote in message ...

On 7/10/2018 8:13 PM, notbob wrote:
> On 7/10/2018 4:50 PM, U.S. Janet B. wrote:
>
>> I loved having a fountain pen. I had no need for it for school but
>> kept one anyway. I always filled it with peacock blue ink. I felt so
>> 'smart'
>
> Still a lot of us, around. Shelly is not the only fountain-pen
> aficionado. I'm currently learning copperplate using dip pens.
>
> I'm learning basic calligraphy cuz they stopped teaching kids in CA (my
> GD's!) "cursive" which I learned in grade school! Weather, or not, I can
> convince my GD's to learn SOME form of cursive remains to be seen. 8|
>
> nb
>
Copperplate? Sounds like you're teaching them to etch in metal with a
hot electric engraving tool.

Seriously, you don't have to learn calligraphy or use a fountain pen
(they are fun, though!) to teach your grandaughters to write in cursive.

Is there a reason given they've stopped teaching cursive? I'm guessing
it has something to do with computers, email and texting and oh, no need
for writing letters in a fancy hand anymore. Sad but true.

I do still send hand written letters or cards occasionally. But they
don't have to be perfect. Because of my mish-mash of schools my
penmanship evolved into a half cursive/half print. I'm not worried
about it being pretty. It's legible.

Jill

==

My handwriting is rubbish. Like yours half cursive/half print. In junior
school we started off with cursive and half way through changed to italics.

It certainly messed up my writing.

On Tuesday, July 10, 2018 at 4:59:41 PM UTC-4, Sheldon wrote:
> On Mon, 9 Jul 2018 22:49:29 -0400, Dave Smith
> > wrote:
>
> >On 2018-07-09 6:29 PM, wrote:
> >> On Mon, 9 Jul 2018 09:48:19 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> >>
> >> I grew up with paper straws and wooden ice cream spoons, never saw
> >> plastic til the 6o's. I never saw plastic ball point pens until the
> >> late 50s
> >
> >Ball point pens were slow off the start and were very expensive in the
> >1950s. When I was in elementary school we had to learn to write with
> >stick pens. Once we demonstrated mastery of that we could use fountain
> >pens, and we used them right through high school. By the time I got to
> >university Bic pens were cheap.
>
> Just the opposite in the US, we learned to write long hand with
> fountain pens.

Things must have changed in the generation between you and me. I learned
to write cursive with a pencil.

Cindy Hamilton

On Wednesday, July 11, 2018 at 5:37:51 AM UTC-5, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
>
> On Tuesday, July 10, 2018 at 4:59:41 PM UTC-4, Sheldon wrote:
> >
> > Just the opposite in the US, we learned to write long hand with
> > fountain pens.
>
> Things must have changed in the generation between you and me. I learned
> to write cursive with a pencil.
>
> Cindy Hamilton
>
>
Same here. Fountains were not used until junior high and only for book
reports and such.

On 7/11/2018 11:37 AM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:

> Things must have changed in the generation between you and me. I learned
> to write cursive with a pencil.
>
As did I.
We started to use dip pens after learning cursive, then we were allowed
to use fountain pens. None of my classes allowed ball-points.

On 2018-07-11 6:37 AM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
> On Tuesday, July 10, 2018 at 4:59:41 PM UTC-4, Sheldon wrote:
>> On Mon, 9 Jul 2018 22:49:29 -0400, Dave Smith
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> On 2018-07-09 6:29 PM, wrote:
>>>> On Mon, 9 Jul 2018 09:48:19 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
>>>>
>>>> I grew up with paper straws and wooden ice cream spoons, never saw
>>>> plastic til the 6o's. I never saw plastic ball point pens until the
>>>> late 50s
>>>
>>> Ball point pens were slow off the start and were very expensive in the
>>> 1950s. When I was in elementary school we had to learn to write with
>>> stick pens. Once we demonstrated mastery of that we could use fountain
>>> pens, and we used them right through high school. By the time I got to
>>> university Bic pens were cheap.
>>
>> Just the opposite in the US, we learned to write long hand with
>> fountain pens.
>
> Things must have changed in the generation between you and me. I learned
> to write cursive with a pencil.


I was referring only to the use of pens and I think I may have used the
wrong term, calling them stick pens when they are actually dip pens.
IIRC we learned to write with pencils first and then progressed to pens.
We had to learn to write with a dip pen first. That meant having to
dip the tip into an ink pot every few words and to blot it dry so the
ink didn't run and smear.

After we learned how to use dip pens we could use fountain pens. They
were typically loaded from the ink pot in the desk. Cartridges soon
became available, and in different colours. Peacock blue was always
popular with students but not with teachers.

On 2018-07-11 6:41 AM, S Viemeister wrote:
> On 7/11/2018 11:37 AM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
>
>> Things must have changed in the generation between you and me.Â* I learned
>> to write cursive with a pencil.
>>
> As did I.
> We started to use dip pens after learning cursive, then we were allowed
> to use fountain pens. None of my classes allowed ball-points.
>
Same here. Cursive was initially taught when we used chalk and small
blackboards in my village school.

On Wed, 11 Jul 2018 03:37:47 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
> wrote:

>On Tuesday, July 10, 2018 at 4:59:41 PM UTC-4, Sheldon wrote:
>> On Mon, 9 Jul 2018 22:49:29 -0400, Dave Smith
>> > wrote:
>>
>> >On 2018-07-09 6:29 PM, wrote:
>> >> On Mon, 9 Jul 2018 09:48:19 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
>> >>
>> >> I grew up with paper straws and wooden ice cream spoons, never saw
>> >> plastic til the 6o's. I never saw plastic ball point pens until the
>> >> late 50s
>> >
>> >Ball point pens were slow off the start and were very expensive in the
>> >1950s. When I was in elementary school we had to learn to write with
>> >stick pens. Once we demonstrated mastery of that we could use fountain
>> >pens, and we used them right through high school. By the time I got to
>> >university Bic pens were cheap.
>>
>> Just the opposite in the US, we learned to write long hand with
>> fountain pens.
>
>Things must have changed in the generation between you and me. I learned
>to write cursive with a pencil.
>
>Cindy Hamilton


We learned printing with a pencil. Our desks had a built-in inkwell.
We began learning cursive with a dip pen but then switched to
fountainpens as we were able to buy one, $4 for a fountainpen was a
lot for most 3rd graders in 1950.

On Wednesday, July 11, 2018 at 8:41:11 AM UTC-4, S Viemeister wrote:
> On 7/11/2018 11:37 AM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
>
> > Things must have changed in the generation between you and me. I learned
> > to write cursive with a pencil.
> >
> As did I.
> We started to use dip pens after learning cursive, then we were allowed
> to use fountain pens. None of my classes allowed ball-points.

I'm an infant of 61. It was all ball points for us. As a lefty,
I've never been able to use a fountain pen. Not amenable to being
pushed across the page, and my hand drags through the ink.

Cindy Hamilton

"Cindy Hamilton" > wrote in message
...
> On Tuesday, July 10, 2018 at 4:59:41 PM UTC-4, Sheldon wrote:
>> On Mon, 9 Jul 2018 22:49:29 -0400, Dave Smith
>> > wrote:
>>
>> >On 2018-07-09 6:29 PM, wrote:
>> >> On Mon, 9 Jul 2018 09:48:19 -0700 (PDT), Cindy Hamilton
>> >>
>> >> I grew up with paper straws and wooden ice cream spoons, never saw
>> >> plastic til the 6o's. I never saw plastic ball point pens until the
>> >> late 50s
>> >
>> >Ball point pens were slow off the start and were very expensive in the
>> >1950s. When I was in elementary school we had to learn to write with
>> >stick pens. Once we demonstrated mastery of that we could use fountain
>> >pens, and we used them right through high school. By the time I got to
>> >university Bic pens were cheap.
>>
>> Just the opposite in the US, we learned to write long hand with
>> fountain pens.
>
> Things must have changed in the generation between you and me. I learned
> to write cursive with a pencil.
>
> Cindy Hamilton


Same here, a pencil.

Cheri

On Wednesday, July 11, 2018 at 7:50:54 AM UTC-5, Dave Smith wrote:
>
> I was referring only to the use of pens and I think I may have used the
> wrong term, calling them stick pens when they are actually dip pens.
> IIRC we learned to write with pencils first and then progressed to pens.
> We had to learn to write with a dip pen first. That meant having to
> dip the tip into an ink pot every few words and to blot it dry so the
> ink didn't run and smear.
>
> After we learned how to use dip pens we could use fountain pens. They
> were typically loaded from the ink pot in the desk. Cartridges soon
> became available, and in different colours. Peacock blue was always
> popular with students but not with teachers.
>
>
To be honest, I don't think they would have allowed open ink pots in
any classroom when I was child, even all the way to senior high school.
Ruined clothes, ink fights, spilled ink on the floor. Nope, definitely
no open ink pots in a classroom.

I've never anyone write with a dipped pen except on TV. It looks messy
as hell and slow and tedious with all the blotting.

On Wednesday, July 11, 2018 at 8:16:19 AM UTC-5, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
>
> I'm an infant of 61. It was all ball points for us. As a lefty,
> I've never been able to use a fountain pen. Not amenable to being
> pushed across the page, and my hand drags through the ink.
>
> Cindy Hamilton
>
>
Lefty as well and using a fountain would really have slowed us down waiting
for ink to dry or continuously blotting.

On 7/10/2018 6:54 PM, jmcquown wrote:

> On 7/10/2018 8:13 PM, notbob wrote:

> Copperplate?Â* Sounds like you're teaching them to etch in metal with a
> hot electric engraving tool.

Close, but no cigar!

It's also called "engrosser's script", but yes, it was a "script"
originated as a way to copy copperplate engraving. Eventually,
Copperplate evolved into Spencerian or ornamental writing, which later
evolved into Cursive. You are probably correct in yer speculation that
typewriters and computers killed handwriting.

>Because of my mish-mash of schools my
> penmanship evolved into a half cursive/half print.Â* I'm not worried
> about it being pretty.Â* It's legible.

Yes. I learned cursive in grade school, but later learned to put all my
notes in majuscule (upper-case) print. It's the way engineers typically
communicate. After about 18 mos of printing in minuscules (lower-case,
alarm room logs), my handwriting was jes atrocious. The other reason I
wanted to learn "ornamental copperplate". But, the "flourishes" are
killing me.

nb

On 2018-07-11 9:16 AM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
> On Wednesday, July 11, 2018 at 8:41:11 AM UTC-4, S Viemeister wrote:
>> On 7/11/2018 11:37 AM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
>>
>>> Things must have changed in the generation between you and me. I learned
>>> to write cursive with a pencil.
>>>
>> As did I.
>> We started to use dip pens after learning cursive, then we were allowed
>> to use fountain pens. None of my classes allowed ball-points.
>
> I'm an infant of 61. It was all ball points for us. As a lefty,
> I've never been able to use a fountain pen. Not amenable to being
> pushed across the page, and my hand drags through the ink.
>

You came along just about the time that ballpoints became cheap and
reliable, and they seemed to have lost interest in penmanship.

On a side note... even though we had a bountiful supply of cheap
ballpoint pens at work, I always used me own pens. I would buy Parker
ball point pens. I found them more comfortable to hold and they could be
used upside down for a few words, which was handy at work. A cartridge
would last me for months, compared to stick pens which usually went
missing withing a couple hours. I just had to remember to take them out
of my pocket when I got home because they did not endure laundry cycles.

Having used my own pens for so many years I developed the habit of
automatically returning pens to my pocket when I was finished writing.
As a result, I have become an inadvertent pen thief. If someone loans me
a pen for something that automatic behaviour leads me to treat it as I
would treat my own pens... into the pocket.

On Wednesday, July 11, 2018 at 9:34:24 AM UTC-5, notbob wrote:
>
> Yes. I learned cursive in grade school, but later learned to put all my
> notes in majuscule (upper-case) print. It's the way engineers typically
> communicate. After about 18 mos of printing in minuscules (lower-case,
> alarm room logs), my handwriting was jes atrocious. The other reason I
> wanted to learn "ornamental copperplate". But, the "flourishes" are
> killing me.
>
> nb
>
>
Have you used the Palmer final t yet?

I'm thinking it was the Palmer method of cursive writing that was
taught when I was in school. Every lower case letter starts ON
the line.

On 2018-07-11 9:35 AM, wrote:
> On Wednesday, July 11, 2018 at 7:50:54 AM UTC-5, Dave Smith wrote:

>> After we learned how to use dip pens we could use fountain pens. They
>> were typically loaded from the ink pot in the desk. Cartridges soon
>> became available, and in different colours. Peacock blue was always
>> popular with students but not with teachers.
>>
>>
> To be honest, I don't think they would have allowed open ink pots in
> any classroom when I was child, even all the way to senior high school.
> Ruined clothes, ink fights, spilled ink on the floor. Nope, definitely
> no open ink pots in a classroom.

True. Teachers and janitors were probably happy to see them gone. I once
got into trouble for a stupid prank. There was a cute girl seated in
front of me and her pig tails were often resting on my desk. Opportunity
knocks once but temptation leans on the door bell. I dipped the end of
her right pigtail into my ink pot. I don't think she realized that but
she probably sensed that something was a miss and jerked her head
forward, ripping her pig tail from my 10 year old fingers and onto her
immaculately clean white blouse.


> I've never anyone write with a dipped pen except on TV. It looks messy
> as hell and slow and tedious with all the blotting.

True. It was slow, but it was also an art form.

On 7/11/2018 7:35 AM, wrote:

> I've never anyone write with a dipped pen except on TV. It looks messy
> as hell and slow and tedious with all the blotting.

Mostly correct.

Dip pens are all you sed. Messy, slow, and tedious ....but, they also
are very "flexible", allowing fine-line up-strokes and thick-line
down-strokes, a phenomena found in really OLD fountain pens (also, very
pricey! FP's).

Lotta Youtube videos with dip pens. Here's one:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ib2VURj0ykc

BTW, the dip pen she (Suzanne Cunningham) is using is called an
"oblique" dip pen, as opposed to a "straight" dip pen.

nb

Cindy Hamilton wrote:
>
> Things must have changed in the generation between you and me. I learned
> to write cursive with a pencil.

I'm actually stunned that people here claim they don't teach kids
cursive now. Is that true? I find it hard to believe but I can
check with my daughter about this. I have 2 grandchildren in
elementary school.

I've also heard that they teach limited math now too since
everyone has calculators of some sort so no need to learn the
basics?

Dave Smith wrote:
>
> We had to learn to write with a dip pen first. That meant having to
> dip the tip into an ink pot every few words and to blot it dry so the
> ink didn't run and smear.
>
> After we learned how to use dip pens we could use fountain pens. They
> were typically loaded from the ink pot in the desk. Cartridges soon
> became available,

Dude. I thought you were younger than me but you are talking 19th
century nonsense, imo.
I just turned 65 12 days ago and none of that applied when I was
in school. Always pencils and ballpoint pens for my time. Except:
an option was to use a cartridge pen. I tried that for a time
only because I thought it was kind of cool. Sharp and scratchy
and wet ink though so I didn't use that much.

Pens "loaded from the ink pot in the desk?"
Are you Ben Franklin?
Or maybe grew up in a little house on the prairie?



Did you start out young, using a feather with an ink well?

S Viemeister wrote:
>
> On 7/11/2018 11:37 AM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
>
> > Things must have changed in the generation between you and me. I learned
> > to write cursive with a pencil.
> >
> As did I.
> We started to use dip pens after learning cursive, then we were allowed
> to use fountain pens. None of my classes allowed ball-points.

gasp! older than old people still hanging on to life here in
RFC.

Dave Smith wrote:
>
> I once
> got into trouble for a stupid prank. There was a cute girl seated in
> front of me and her pig tails were often resting on my desk. Opportunity
> knocks once but temptation leans on the door bell. I dipped the end of
> her right pigtail into my ink pot. I don't think she realized that but
> she probably sensed that something was a miss and jerked her head
> forward, ripping her pig tail from my 10 year old fingers and onto her
> immaculately clean white blouse.

Oh horse crap! Pants on fire, Dave! You never did that, you lying
POS. That old story had been going around forever on movies and
books about the old days. I have read so many stories about
"dipping a girl's pigtail in the ink well." Kiss my ass!

You are so busted with this phony story. Try again. Do not pass
Go, do not collect $200.

On 2018-07-11 11:49 AM, Gary wrote:
> Cindy Hamilton wrote:
>>
>> Things must have changed in the generation between you and me. I learned
>> to write cursive with a pencil.
>
> I'm actually stunned that people here claim they don't teach kids
> cursive now. Is that true? I find it hard to believe but I can
> check with my daughter about this. I have 2 grandchildren in
> elementary school.

I just Googled it and it seems that cursive is no longer on the
curriculum here in Ontario, or most of the rest of Canada. It can be
taught at the discretion of teachers, but only about 40% of schools were
teaching it as of three years ago.


> I've also heard that they teach limited math now too since
> everyone has calculators of some sort so no need to learn the
> basics?

I don't know if there is any truth to that. They are still teaching the
basics here. Calculators are certainly helpful in higher levels. I had
to take statistics and probability courses at university in the early
70s when calculators were extremely expensive. A pocket calculator that
would add, subtract, multiply and divide was about $250, and those that
had memory banks were a lot more. Working out even the simplest
formulae involved squaring and figuring out square roots. The mechanics
of all the calculations was overwhelming and interfered with learning.
By my second here the department had set up a calculator room where we
could do the math.

On 2018-07-11 11:53 AM, Gary wrote:
> Dave Smith wrote:
>>
>> I once
>> got into trouble for a stupid prank. There was a cute girl seated in
>> front of me and her pig tails were often resting on my desk. Opportunity
>> knocks once but temptation leans on the door bell. I dipped the end of
>> her right pigtail into my ink pot. I don't think she realized that but
>> she probably sensed that something was a miss and jerked her head
>> forward, ripping her pig tail from my 10 year old fingers and onto her
>> immaculately clean white blouse.
>
> Oh horse crap! Pants on fire, Dave! You never did that, you lying
> POS. That old story had been going around forever on movies and
> books about the old days. I have read so many stories about
> "dipping a girl's pigtail in the ink well." Kiss my ass!
>
> You are so busted with this phony story. Try again. Do not pass
> Go, do not collect $200.
>


No. I am not busted. It happened. I got into a lot of trouble over it.

On 7/11/2018 9:49 AM, Gary wrote:

> I'm actually stunned that people here claim they don't teach kids
> cursive now. Is that true?

Yes.

In NorCal, they stopped teaching it years ago. Neither of my
granddaughters knows how to write in cursive and my oldest GD jes
graduated high school! 8|

nb

In article >, penmart01
@aol.com says...
>
> On Tue, 10 Jul 2018 08:22:04 -0400, Nancy Young >
> wrote:
>
> >On 7/9/2018 9:43 PM, wrote:
> >> On Monday, July 9, 2018 at 11:05:10 AM UTC-5, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> >
> >>> https://www.npr.org/2018/07/09/62722...plastic-straws
> >>> http://www.latimes.com/business/la-f...709-story.html
> >>> Though plastic drinking straws have become one of the more high-profile
> >>> issues environmentally, they make up only about 4% of the plastic trash
> >>> by number of pieces, and far less by weight. Straws add up to about
> >>> 2,000 tons of the nearly 9 million tons of plastic waste that ends up in
> >>> waters around the globe each year.
> >>>
> >>>
> >> I don't partake of anything Starbucks offers but I appreciate a straw with
> >> whatever fountain drink I get at whatever establishment.
> >
> >I had lunch at some chain restaurant the other day and was surprised
> >to find my straw was not plastic but heavy paper. Worked just fine.
> >
> >nancy
>
> Growing up all straws were paper. Actually safetywise paper straws
> are mush better, same as how some lollypops have paper sticks.

In the last three days I've hunted high and low for oldfashioned
wooden lolly sticks so the grands could make ice lollies. Younger shop
assistants looked blank, and one told me " Nobody makes their own ice
lollies these days; just buy some from the freezer section". I finally
tracked sticks down in Glasgow in a specialist kitchen shop. Whatever
happened to the simple things in life.

Last night we mashed strawberries with yoghurt, froze it on sticks in
pots and the grands have just eaten them. Tomorrow, banana lollies.

Janet UK

On Wed, 11 Jul 2018 17:33:09 +0100, Janet > wrote:

>In article >, penmart01
says...
>>
>> On Tue, 10 Jul 2018 08:22:04 -0400, Nancy Young >
>> wrote:
>>
>> >On 7/9/2018 9:43 PM, wrote:
>> >> On Monday, July 9, 2018 at 11:05:10 AM UTC-5, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>> >
>> >>> https://www.npr.org/2018/07/09/62722...plastic-straws
>> >>> http://www.latimes.com/business/la-f...709-story.html
>> >>> Though plastic drinking straws have become one of the more high-profile
>> >>> issues environmentally, they make up only about 4% of the plastic trash
>> >>> by number of pieces, and far less by weight. Straws add up to about
>> >>> 2,000 tons of the nearly 9 million tons of plastic waste that ends up in
>> >>> waters around the globe each year.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >> I don't partake of anything Starbucks offers but I appreciate a straw with
>> >> whatever fountain drink I get at whatever establishment.
>> >
>> >I had lunch at some chain restaurant the other day and was surprised
>> >to find my straw was not plastic but heavy paper. Worked just fine.
>> >
>> >nancy
>>
>> Growing up all straws were paper. Actually safetywise paper straws
>> are mush better, same as how some lollypops have paper sticks.
>
> In the last three days I've hunted high and low for oldfashioned
>wooden lolly sticks so the grands could make ice lollies. Younger shop
>assistants looked blank, and one told me " Nobody makes their own ice
>lollies these days; just buy some from the freezer section". I finally
>tracked sticks down in Glasgow in a specialist kitchen shop. Whatever
>happened to the simple things in life.
>
> Last night we mashed strawberries with yoghurt, froze it on sticks in
>pots and the grands have just eaten them. Tomorrow, banana lollies.
>
> Janet UK


https://www.amazon.co.uk/PLAIN-WOODE.../dp/B01AYGXNS0

Janet wrote:
>
> Last night we mashed strawberries with yoghurt, froze it on sticks in
> pots and the grands have just eaten them. Tomorrow, banana lollies.

I've got vanilla yogurt and peach slices to try tonight. Not
freezing though, just eating cold in a bowl.

"Gary" > wrote in message ...
> Cindy Hamilton wrote:
>>
>> Things must have changed in the generation between you and me. I learned
>> to write cursive with a pencil.
>
> I'm actually stunned that people here claim they don't teach kids
> cursive now. Is that true? I find it hard to believe but I can
> check with my daughter about this. I have 2 grandchildren in
> elementary school.


Yes, it is true where I am.

Cheri

On Wednesday, July 11, 2018 at 10:44:34 AM UTC-4, Dave Smith wrote:
> On 2018-07-11 9:16 AM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
> > On Wednesday, July 11, 2018 at 8:41:11 AM UTC-4, S Viemeister wrote:
> >> On 7/11/2018 11:37 AM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
> >>
> >>> Things must have changed in the generation between you and me. I learned
> >>> to write cursive with a pencil.
> >>>
> >> As did I.
> >> We started to use dip pens after learning cursive, then we were allowed
> >> to use fountain pens. None of my classes allowed ball-points.
> >
> > I'm an infant of 61. It was all ball points for us. As a lefty,
> > I've never been able to use a fountain pen. Not amenable to being
> > pushed across the page, and my hand drags through the ink.
> >
>
> You came along just about the time that ballpoints became cheap and
> reliable, and they seemed to have lost interest in penmanship.

I probably used mostly pencil up until 7th grade, which would have
been in 1969.

> On a side note... even though we had a bountiful supply of cheap
> ballpoint pens at work, I always used me own pens.

I buy my own pens, too. I like a fairly slim ball point pen with a
fine point. Looks like I've settled on Papermate Comfort Mate pens.

I still mainly use pencil, except for signing stuff.

Cindy Hamilton

"Gary" > wrote in message ...

> gasp! older than old people still hanging on to life here in
> RFC.


It's from eating all that great food from the past, tuna casseroles, green
bean casseroles, fish sticks, Jell-O salads, Spam, Potted Meat, boxed pizza
mix, Chef Boyardee, McDonald's and so on. ;-)

Cheri

On Wed, 11 Jul 2018 12:15:24 -0400, Dave Smith
> wrote:

>On 2018-07-11 11:49 AM, Gary wrote:
>> Cindy Hamilton wrote:
>>>
>>> Things must have changed in the generation between you and me. I learned
>>> to write cursive with a pencil.
>>
>> I'm actually stunned that people here claim they don't teach kids
>> cursive now. Is that true? I find it hard to believe but I can
>> check with my daughter about this. I have 2 grandchildren in
>> elementary school.
>
>I just Googled it and it seems that cursive is no longer on the
>curriculum here in Ontario, or most of the rest of Canada. It can be
>taught at the discretion of teachers, but only about 40% of schools were
>teaching it as of three years ago.
>
>
>> I've also heard that they teach limited math now too since
>> everyone has calculators of some sort so no need to learn the
>> basics?
>
>I don't know if there is any truth to that. They are still teaching the
>basics here. Calculators are certainly helpful in higher levels. I had
>to take statistics and probability courses at university in the early
>70s when calculators were extremely expensive. A pocket calculator that
>would add, subtract, multiply and divide was about $250, and those that
>had memory banks were a lot more. Working out even the simplest
>formulae involved squaring and figuring out square roots. The mechanics
>of all the calculations was overwhelming and interfered with learning.
>By my second here the department had set up a calculator room where we
>could do the math.
>
>
Ahh, thinking back to the days of the slide ruler.

On Wednesday, July 11, 2018 at 10:49:30 AM UTC-5, Gary wrote:
>
> I'm actually stunned that people here claim they don't teach kids
> cursive now. Is that true? I find it hard to believe but I can
> check with my daughter about this. I have 2 grandchildren in
> elementary school.
>
I was getting my drivers license renewed two years ago and there was a
woman sitting there with her about 20 year old grandson. They were
talking and something was said about cursive writing and he said he had
a hard reading anyone's cursive writing as it was not taught in school.
He was only taught how to print.
>
> I've also heard that they teach limited math now too since
> everyone has calculators of some sort so no need to learn the
> basics?
>
My two youngest nephews are being home schooled and are home schooled
all year long. Their cousins have been with them while they are out of
public school and one is having a bit of math problems. One was taught
when she needed to count something it should written out such as to add
12 + 5 it should written as 1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1+1. Then she
was to count all those ones to come up with her answer.

No wonder American kids are becoming so stupid. Sister-in-law is
correcting that **** poor teaching method as she's teaching her sons
math she's working on that cousin's math skills as well.

On Wed, 11 Jul 2018 17:33:09 +0100, Janet > wrote:

>In article >, penmart01
says...
>>
>> On Tue, 10 Jul 2018 08:22:04 -0400, Nancy Young >
>> wrote:
>>
>> >On 7/9/2018 9:43 PM, wrote:
>> >> On Monday, July 9, 2018 at 11:05:10 AM UTC-5, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>> >
>> >>> https://www.npr.org/2018/07/09/62722...plastic-straws
>> >>> http://www.latimes.com/business/la-f...709-story.html
>> >>> Though plastic drinking straws have become one of the more high-profile
>> >>> issues environmentally, they make up only about 4% of the plastic trash
>> >>> by number of pieces, and far less by weight. Straws add up to about
>> >>> 2,000 tons of the nearly 9 million tons of plastic waste that ends up in
>> >>> waters around the globe each year.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >> I don't partake of anything Starbucks offers but I appreciate a straw with
>> >> whatever fountain drink I get at whatever establishment.
>> >
>> >I had lunch at some chain restaurant the other day and was surprised
>> >to find my straw was not plastic but heavy paper. Worked just fine.
>> >
>> >nancy
>>
>> Growing up all straws were paper. Actually safetywise paper straws
>> are mush better, same as how some lollypops have paper sticks.
>
> In the last three days I've hunted high and low for oldfashioned
>wooden lolly sticks so the grands could make ice lollies. Younger shop
>assistants looked blank, and one told me " Nobody makes their own ice
>lollies these days; just buy some from the freezer section". I finally
>tracked sticks down in Glasgow in a specialist kitchen shop. Whatever
>happened to the simple things in life.
>
> Last night we mashed strawberries with yoghurt, froze it on sticks in
>pots and the grands have just eaten them. Tomorrow, banana lollies.
>
> Janet UK

See thread on Amazon, wooden popsicle sticks are available (in colors)
in both the grocery and arts and crafts section.

On 7/11/2018 10:33 AM, Janet wrote:
> Whatever
> happened to the simple things in life.

They began making 'em in plastic. 8|

nb

On Wednesday, July 11, 2018 at 11:33:13 AM UTC-5, Janet wrote:
>
> In the last three days I've hunted high and low for oldfashioned
> wooden lolly sticks so the grands could make ice lollies. Younger shop
> assistants looked blank, and one told me " Nobody makes their own ice
> lollies these days; just buy some from the freezer section". I finally
> tracked sticks down in Glasgow in a specialist kitchen shop. Whatever
> happened to the simple things in life.
>
> Janet UK
>
>
I'm glad you found them as I was going to suggest going to a craft store
as they would have them.

On 2018-07-11 6:41 AM, S Viemeister wrote:
> On 7/11/2018 11:37 AM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
>
>> Things must have changed in the generation between you and me.Â* I learned
>> to write cursive with a pencil.
>>
> As did I.
> We started to use dip pens after learning cursive, then we were allowed
> to use fountain pens. None of my classes allowed ball-points.
>
Furthermore, we were taught how to hold a pen or pencil. Some of the
cumbersome ways kids handle them these days is testimony to falling
standards.

On 7/11/2018 11:57 AM, graham wrote:

> Furthermore, we were taught how to hold a pen or pencil. Some of the
> cumbersome ways kids handle them these days is testimony to falling
> standards.

BUT! .....can you touch-type?

nb

On 2018-07-11 2:01 PM, notbob wrote:
> On 7/11/2018 11:57 AM, graham wrote:
>
>> Furthermore, we were taught how to hold a pen or pencil. Some of the
>> cumbersome ways kids handle them these days is testimony to falling
>> standards.
>
> BUT! .....can you touch-type?Â*
>
>

Yes, I can.

On 7/11/2018 12:53 PM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
> On Wednesday, July 11, 2018 at 10:44:34 AM UTC-4, Dave Smith wrote:

>> On a side note... even though we had a bountiful supply of cheap
>> ballpoint pens at work, I always used me own pens.
>
> I buy my own pens, too. I like a fairly slim ball point pen with a
> fine point. Looks like I've settled on Papermate Comfort Mate pens.

I always brought in my own pens, I guess I'm fussy. These days it's
Paper Made Flex Grip fine point. Mostly I use them for puzzles.
Also Ticonderoga #3 pencils.

nancy

On 7/11/2018 6:57 PM, graham wrote:
> On 2018-07-11 6:41 AM, S Viemeister wrote:
>> On 7/11/2018 11:37 AM, Cindy Hamilton wrote:
>>
>>> Things must have changed in the generation between you and me. I
>>> learned
>>> to write cursive with a pencil.
>>>
>> As did I.
>> We started to use dip pens after learning cursive, then we were
>> allowed to use fountain pens. None of my classes allowed ball-points.
>>
> Furthermore, we were taught how to hold a pen or pencil. Some of the
> cumbersome ways kids handle them these days is testimony to falling
> standards.

Yes. So many younger folk have incredibly ways of gripping their writing
tools.