Just venting a bit. Ignore at will.

A couple of months ago one of the breakers on the main electrical box
tripped. I thought I'd reset it but it took several tries before it
actually "took".

This particular circuit controls (oddly) the overhead lights in the
master bathroom where the tub and toilet are AND all the electrical
outlets in the garage. Where the freezer is. That last time this
happened I finally got it reset. <whew> In the meantime, I'd moved as
much frozen food into the freezer in the side-by-side fridge as I could
fit. I stored some things in the neighbor's freezer.

This time, I've moved what I can fit to the fridge/freezer already.
Because this time, that breaker absolutely will *not* reset. I've tried
at least 20 times now. I think the breaker switch itself needs to be
replaced.

I've got a home warranty so I put in a service request. And left a
message with the electricians they have a contract with. Here we are,
two days before Thanksgiving. Even if I'm not cooking for company I
stand to lose a goodly amount of food. I sure hope they can get someone
out here tomorrow. I *know* this electrical company isn't going to be
working on Thanksgiving. Possibly not even the day after. If they
can't get to it tomorrow I'll be hunting down an electrican who can.
I'm not sure I'll be able to find one.

The good news is, I procrastinated about going to the grocery store
yesterday. And today it was raining like mad. I'm not fond of
loading a lot of groceries into the car when it's pouring down rain. So
at least I won't lose as much food as I might if I'd already gone to
Publix.

Jill

"jmcquown" > wrote in message
...
> Just venting a bit. Ignore at will.
>
> A couple of months ago one of the breakers on the main electrical box
> tripped. I thought I'd reset it but it took several tries before it
> actually "took".
>
> This particular circuit controls (oddly) the overhead lights in the master
> bathroom where the tub and toilet are AND all the electrical outlets in
> the garage. Where the freezer is. That last time this happened I finally
> got it reset. <whew> In the meantime, I'd moved as much frozen food into
> the freezer in the side-by-side fridge as I could fit. I stored some
> things in the neighbor's freezer.
>
> This time, I've moved what I can fit to the fridge/freezer already.
> Because this time, that breaker absolutely will *not* reset. I've tried
> at least 20 times now. I think the breaker switch itself needs to be
> replaced.
>
> I've got a home warranty so I put in a service request. And left a
> message with the electricians they have a contract with. Here we are, two
> days before Thanksgiving. Even if I'm not cooking for company I stand to
> lose a goodly amount of food. I sure hope they can get someone out here
> tomorrow. I *know* this electrical company isn't going to be working on
> Thanksgiving. Possibly not even the day after. If they can't get to it
> tomorrow I'll be hunting down an electrican who can. I'm not sure I'll be
> able to find one.
>
> The good news is, I procrastinated about going to the grocery store
> yesterday. And today it was raining like mad. I'm not fond of loading
> a lot of groceries into the car when it's pouring down rain. So at least
> I won't lose as much food as I might if I'd already gone to Publix.
>
> Jill

what, no helpful male neighbor? Changing a breaker is child's play.

On Tue, 26 Nov 2013 17:32:09 -0800, "Pico Rico"
> wrote:

>
>"jmcquown" > wrote in message
...
>> Just venting a bit. Ignore at will.
>>
>> A couple of months ago one of the breakers on the main electrical box
>> tripped. I thought I'd reset it but it took several tries before it
>> actually "took".
>>
>> This particular circuit controls (oddly) the overhead lights in the master
>> bathroom where the tub and toilet are AND all the electrical outlets in
>> the garage. Where the freezer is. That last time this happened I finally
>> got it reset. <whew> In the meantime, I'd moved as much frozen food into
>> the freezer in the side-by-side fridge as I could fit. I stored some
>> things in the neighbor's freezer.
>>
>> This time, I've moved what I can fit to the fridge/freezer already.
>> Because this time, that breaker absolutely will *not* reset. I've tried
>> at least 20 times now. I think the breaker switch itself needs to be
>> replaced.
>>
>> I've got a home warranty so I put in a service request. And left a
>> message with the electricians they have a contract with. Here we are, two
>> days before Thanksgiving. Even if I'm not cooking for company I stand to
>> lose a goodly amount of food. I sure hope they can get someone out here
>> tomorrow. I *know* this electrical company isn't going to be working on
>> Thanksgiving. Possibly not even the day after. If they can't get to it
>> tomorrow I'll be hunting down an electrican who can. I'm not sure I'll be
>> able to find one.
>>
>> The good news is, I procrastinated about going to the grocery store
>> yesterday. And today it was raining like mad. I'm not fond of loading
>> a lot of groceries into the car when it's pouring down rain. So at least
>> I won't lose as much food as I might if I'd already gone to Publix.
>>
>> Jill
>
>what, no helpful male neighbor? Changing a breaker is child's play.
>
I suspect this breaker may be a GFCI breaker. (If it is, it will have
a test button).

You may be able to get it to work again by unplugging everything that
is on that breaker (the stuff that is currently dead) and trying to
reset it.

BTW it is good you have a warranty. GFCI breakers are expensive.

On Tue, 26 Nov 2013 21:02:42 -0500, Metspitzer >
wrote:

>On Tue, 26 Nov 2013 17:32:09 -0800, "Pico Rico"
> wrote:
>
>>
>>"jmcquown" > wrote in message
...
>>> Just venting a bit. Ignore at will.
>>>
>>> A couple of months ago one of the breakers on the main electrical box
>>> tripped. I thought I'd reset it but it took several tries before it
>>> actually "took".
>>>
>>> This particular circuit controls (oddly) the overhead lights in the master
>>> bathroom where the tub and toilet are AND all the electrical outlets in
>>> the garage. Where the freezer is. That last time this happened I finally
>>> got it reset. <whew> In the meantime, I'd moved as much frozen food into
>>> the freezer in the side-by-side fridge as I could fit. I stored some
>>> things in the neighbor's freezer.
>>>
>>> This time, I've moved what I can fit to the fridge/freezer already.
>>> Because this time, that breaker absolutely will *not* reset. I've tried
>>> at least 20 times now. I think the breaker switch itself needs to be
>>> replaced.
>>>
>>> I've got a home warranty so I put in a service request. And left a
>>> message with the electricians they have a contract with. Here we are, two
>>> days before Thanksgiving. Even if I'm not cooking for company I stand to
>>> lose a goodly amount of food. I sure hope they can get someone out here
>>> tomorrow. I *know* this electrical company isn't going to be working on
>>> Thanksgiving. Possibly not even the day after. If they can't get to it
>>> tomorrow I'll be hunting down an electrican who can. I'm not sure I'll be
>>> able to find one.
>>>
>>> The good news is, I procrastinated about going to the grocery store
>>> yesterday. And today it was raining like mad. I'm not fond of loading
>>> a lot of groceries into the car when it's pouring down rain. So at least
>>> I won't lose as much food as I might if I'd already gone to Publix.
>>>
>>> Jill
>>
>>what, no helpful male neighbor? Changing a breaker is child's play.
>>
>I suspect this breaker may be a GFCI breaker. (If it is, it will have
>a test button).
>
>You may be able to get it to work again by unplugging everything that
>is on that breaker (the stuff that is currently dead) and trying to
>reset it.
>
>BTW it is good you have a warranty. GFCI breakers are expensive.

The freezer might be the problem. You can also test this by using a
drop cord and plugging it into a working outlet.

On 11/26/2013 9:07 PM, Metspitzer wrote:

>> You may be able to get it to work again by unplugging everything that
>> is on that breaker (the stuff that is currently dead) and trying to
>> reset it.
>>
>> BTW it is good you have a warranty. GFCI breakers are expensive.
>
> The freezer might be the problem. You can also test this by using a
> drop cord and plugging it into a working outlet.
>

Freezer and refrigerators should never be on a GFCI breaker.

They cost from $25 to $75, much less than the premium on a home
warranty. Home warranties are a waste of money. The company is in
business to make a profit. Put that money in the bank and you can
afford any repair needed.

"Ed Pawlowski" wrote in message
...

Freezer and refrigerators should never be on a GFCI breaker.

~~~~~~~~
I learned this many years ago. The man who did lawn maintenance for me
mowed the lawn while I was out of town on vacation. He stepped into some
water while he was using something that was plugged into an electrical
outlet. Fortunately, the CFCI worked just as it was supposed to, and it
immediately shut down the outlets connected to it. When I got home, I
learned that the outlets in the garage were connected to that same
breaker--and my freezer was in the garage. I immediately had a separate
breaker installed for the freezer (after discarding all the food that was in
it).

Note: I have several outlets that are GFCI outlets (all the kitchen and
bathroom outlets). However, the one I was describing was set in the breaker
box, so it controls several outlets.

MaryL

"Metspitzer" > wrote in message
...
> On Tue, 26 Nov 2013 17:32:09 -0800, "Pico Rico"
> > wrote:
>
>>
>>"jmcquown" > wrote in message
...
>>> Just venting a bit. Ignore at will.
>>>
>>> A couple of months ago one of the breakers on the main electrical box
>>> tripped. I thought I'd reset it but it took several tries before it
>>> actually "took".
>>>
>>> This particular circuit controls (oddly) the overhead lights in the
>>> master
>>> bathroom where the tub and toilet are AND all the electrical outlets in
>>> the garage. Where the freezer is. That last time this happened I
>>> finally
>>> got it reset. <whew> In the meantime, I'd moved as much frozen food
>>> into
>>> the freezer in the side-by-side fridge as I could fit. I stored some
>>> things in the neighbor's freezer.
>>>
>>> This time, I've moved what I can fit to the fridge/freezer already.
>>> Because this time, that breaker absolutely will *not* reset. I've tried
>>> at least 20 times now. I think the breaker switch itself needs to be
>>> replaced.
>>>
>>> I've got a home warranty so I put in a service request. And left a
>>> message with the electricians they have a contract with. Here we are,
>>> two
>>> days before Thanksgiving. Even if I'm not cooking for company I stand
>>> to
>>> lose a goodly amount of food. I sure hope they can get someone out here
>>> tomorrow. I *know* this electrical company isn't going to be working on
>>> Thanksgiving. Possibly not even the day after. If they can't get to it
>>> tomorrow I'll be hunting down an electrican who can. I'm not sure I'll
>>> be
>>> able to find one.
>>>
>>> The good news is, I procrastinated about going to the grocery store
>>> yesterday. And today it was raining like mad. I'm not fond of
>>> loading
>>> a lot of groceries into the car when it's pouring down rain. So at
>>> least
>>> I won't lose as much food as I might if I'd already gone to Publix.
>>>
>>> Jill
>>
>>what, no helpful male neighbor? Changing a breaker is child's play.
>>
> I suspect this breaker may be a GFCI breaker. (If it is, it will have
> a test button).

I wouldn't

>
> You may be able to get it to work again by unplugging everything that
> is on that breaker (the stuff that is currently dead) and trying to
> reset it.
>

that would be a worthwhile thing to try regardless.

> BTW it is good you have a warranty. GFCI breakers are expensive.

The service charge is the killer.

Pico Rico wrote:
>
> "jmcquown" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Just venting a bit. Ignore at will.
>>
>> A couple of months ago one of the breakers on the main electrical box
>> tripped. I thought I'd reset it but it took several tries before it
>> actually "took".
>>
>> This particular circuit controls (oddly) the overhead lights in the master
>> bathroom where the tub and toilet are AND all the electrical outlets in
>> the garage. Where the freezer is. That last time this happened I finally
>> got it reset. <whew> In the meantime, I'd moved as much frozen food into
>> the freezer in the side-by-side fridge as I could fit. I stored some
>> things in the neighbor's freezer.
>>
>> This time, I've moved what I can fit to the fridge/freezer already.
>> Because this time, that breaker absolutely will *not* reset. I've tried
>> at least 20 times now. I think the breaker switch itself needs to be
>> replaced.
>>
>> I've got a home warranty so I put in a service request. And left a
>> message with the electricians they have a contract with. Here we are, two
>> days before Thanksgiving. Even if I'm not cooking for company I stand to
>> lose a goodly amount of food. I sure hope they can get someone out here
>> tomorrow. I *know* this electrical company isn't going to be working on
>> Thanksgiving. Possibly not even the day after. If they can't get to it
>> tomorrow I'll be hunting down an electrican who can. I'm not sure I'll be
>> able to find one.
>>
>> The good news is, I procrastinated about going to the grocery store
>> yesterday. And today it was raining like mad. I'm not fond of loading
>> a lot of groceries into the car when it's pouring down rain. So at least
>> I won't lose as much food as I might if I'd already gone to Publix.
>>
>> Jill
>
> what, no helpful male neighbor? Changing a breaker is child's play.

because everyone knows ... if you have a penis you can change a breaker

On 2013-11-27, tert in seattle > wrote:
> Pico Rico wrote:

>> what, no helpful male neighbor? Changing a breaker is child's play.

> because everyone knows ... if you have a penis you can change a breaker

Seems to me, a helpful link might be more useful than insults:

http://www.hammerzone.com/archives/e...er/install.htm

I bet even Home Depot has some flyer or such on how to change a
breaker. BTW, I used to work with a very nice lady electrician. She
certainly knew more about electrical than I, and I've done my share.

nb

"notbob" > wrote in message
...
> On 2013-11-27, tert in seattle > wrote:
>> Pico Rico wrote:
>
>>> what, no helpful male neighbor? Changing a breaker is child's play.
>
>> because everyone knows ... if you have a penis you can change a breaker
>
> Seems to me, a helpful link might be more useful than insults:
>
> http://www.hammerzone.com/archives/e...er/install.htm
>
> I bet even Home Depot has some flyer or such on how to change a
> breaker. BTW, I used to work with a very nice lady electrician. She
> certainly knew more about electrical than I, and I've done my share.
>
> nb

did you feel a spark?

On 11/27/2013 8:26 AM, Pico Rico wrote:
> "notbob" > wrote in message
> ...
>> On 2013-11-27, tert in seattle > wrote:
>>> Pico Rico wrote:
>>
>>>> what, no helpful male neighbor? Changing a breaker is child's play.
>>
>>> because everyone knows ... if you have a penis you can change a breaker
>>
>> Seems to me, a helpful link might be more useful than insults:
>>
>> http://www.hammerzone.com/archives/e...er/install.htm
>>
>> I bet even Home Depot has some flyer or such on how to change a
>> breaker. BTW, I used to work with a very nice lady electrician. She
>> certainly knew more about electrical than I, and I've done my share.
>>
>> nb
>
> did you feel a spark?
>
>
Common ground?

On 11/26/2013 8:23 PM, jmcquown wrote:
> Just venting a bit. Ignore at will.


>
> This particular circuit controls (oddly) the overhead lights in the
> master bathroom where the tub and toilet are AND all the electrical
> outlets in the garage. Where the freezer is. That last time this
> happened I finally got it reset. <whew> In the meantime, I'd moved as
> much frozen food into the freezer in the side-by-side fridge as I could
> fit. I stored some things in the neighbor's freezer.


Get a heavy duty extension cord and plug the freezer into a different
circuit. Freezers don't take all that much power so most receptacle
will do as long as it is on another breaker..

Garage circuits are often on GFCI breakers or receptacles. Freezers
should not be plugged unto them because the cause the problem you are
seeing.

Don't renew that home warranty either. You may have peace of mind, but
they are costly and rare that a homeowner comes out ahead. Put that
money in the bank and come out way ahead.

On 11/26/2013 9:56 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>
> Don't renew that home warranty either. You may have peace of mind, but
> they are costly and rare that a homeowner comes out ahead. Put that
> money in the bank and come out way ahead.

AGREE! I had one that refused to service/replace the compressor on my
AC because I couldn't produce maintenance records. I had just bought
the house a year earlier. what a waste of money they were.

--
CAPSLOCK–Preventing Login Since 1980.

On 11/26/2013 9:56 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> On 11/26/2013 8:23 PM, jmcquown wrote:
>> Just venting a bit. Ignore at will.
>
>
>>
>> This particular circuit controls (oddly) the overhead lights in the
>> master bathroom where the tub and toilet are AND all the electrical
>> outlets in the garage. Where the freezer is. That last time this
>> happened I finally got it reset. <whew> In the meantime, I'd moved as
>> much frozen food into the freezer in the side-by-side fridge as I could
>> fit. I stored some things in the neighbor's freezer.
>
>
> Get a heavy duty extension cord and plug the freezer into a different
> circuit. Freezers don't take all that much power so most receptacle
> will do as long as it is on another breaker.

The problem with that is I'd have to leave the kitchen door ajar and
plug it in in the kitchen. (That breaker controls all the outlets in the
garage.) Leaving that door ajar is not really an ideal situation.
There are a lot of creepy-crawly things looking to come inside as the
temperature drops. No thanks!

I'll be taking some things over to stash in the neighbors' freezer tomorrow.

> Garage circuits are often on GFCI breakers or receptacles. Freezers
> should not be plugged unto them because the cause the problem you are
> seeing.
>
I have no idea what a GFCI receptacle is. As I said, my parents had a
large freezer plugged into this same outlet for many years. No
problems, unless you count a 23 year old freezer finally giving up the
ghost.

> Don't renew that home warranty either. You may have peace of mind, but
> they are costly and rare that a homeowner comes out ahead. Put that
> money in the bank and come out way ahead.
>
I don't pay much. My neighbor has the same type of warranty. Her house
has two water heaters. They replaced both when they died, just a meager
service charge/deductible.

They've sent plumbers to clear toilet problems that wound up being due
to clogs in the outflow valve. Under the foundation but of course there
is a place it cuts into the sewer line. Really, $75 for the service
call isn't all that much money. Nor is the about $500 a year I pay for
the home warranty.

Jill

On 11/26/2013 9:56 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:

>
> Don't renew that home warranty either. You may have peace of mind, but
> they are costly and rare that a homeowner comes out ahead. Put that
> money in the bank and come out way ahead.
>

They can't be accused of providing good service. It sounds like the
furnace repair service my brother had contracted with. The guy didn't
want to come out on a Sunday night but my brother insisted. When he
finally came he could not fix it.... replace the fan belt because he
didn't have the part. Not much of an emergency repair service if they
don't even carry a supply of belts.

On Tuesday, November 26, 2013 9:56:27 PM UTC-5, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>
> Get a heavy duty extension cord and plug the freezer into a different
> circuit. Freezers don't take all that much power so most receptacle
> will do as long as it is on another breaker..
>
> Garage circuits are often on GFCI breakers or receptacles. Freezers
> should not be plugged unto them because the cause the problem you are
> seeing.
>
> Don't renew that home warranty either. You may have peace of mind, but
> they are costly and rare that a homeowner comes out ahead. Put that
> money in the bank and come out way ahead.

Excellent advice except for one point. As
stated, when running, freezers do not need a
high amperage. However, when the compressor
first switches on it does have a high amperage
spike. I can easily imagine this overloading a
GFCI circuit.

http://www.richardfisher.com

On 11/27/2013 7:47 AM, Helpful person wrote:
> As
> stated, when running, freezers do not need a
> high amperage.

Try again:

http://www.doityourself.com/stry/ins...-chest-freezer

If the freezer runs on 110V then you will need 12 by 2 electrical wiring
and a 110 V outlet. If it uses 220V then you will need 12 by 3
electrical wiring and a 220V outlet. You will need a circuit breaker
which supports the number of amps you will be drawing for your freezer.
In most cases if it is a 220V you will want a 30-amp breaker. An 110V
will usually require a 15- or 20-amp breaker. This information can be
found in the manual supplied with the freezer.

On 11/26/2013 8:23 PM, jmcquown wrote:
> This particular circuit controls (oddly) the overhead lights in the
> master bathroom where the tub and toilet are AND all the electrical
> outlets in the garage. Where the freezer is....

The Virginia townhouse we just moved out of had this same odd
arrangement -- the garage outlets were on the same circuit as the master
bathroom, up on the third floor. When something kicked the garage
refrigerator off, the first thing to do was to check the GFCI outlet in
the upstairs bathroom.

-- Larry

On 11/27/2013 9:13 AM, pltrgyst wrote:
> On 11/26/2013 8:23 PM, jmcquown wrote:
>> This particular circuit controls (oddly) the overhead lights in the
>> master bathroom where the tub and toilet are AND all the electrical
>> outlets in the garage. Where the freezer is....
>
> The Virginia townhouse we just moved out of had this same odd
> arrangement -- the garage outlets were on the same circuit as the master
> bathroom, up on the third floor. When something kicked the garage
> refrigerator off, the first thing to do was to check the GFCI outlet in
> the upstairs bathroom.
>
> -- Larry
>
A frig should never be on a gfi circuit.

On Wed, 27 Nov 2013 09:15:43 -0700, "Pearl F. Buck"
> wrote:

>On 11/27/2013 9:13 AM, pltrgyst wrote:
>> On 11/26/2013 8:23 PM, jmcquown wrote:
>>> This particular circuit controls (oddly) the overhead lights in the
>>> master bathroom where the tub and toilet are AND all the electrical
>>> outlets in the garage. Where the freezer is....
>>
>> The Virginia townhouse we just moved out of had this same odd
>> arrangement -- the garage outlets were on the same circuit as the master
>> bathroom, up on the third floor. When something kicked the garage
>> refrigerator off, the first thing to do was to check the GFCI outlet in
>> the upstairs bathroom.
>>
>> -- Larry
>>
>A frig should never be on a gfi circuit.

Like you say, it shouldn't be. I don't know how a home warranty
works, but it would be worth a try to get a separate outlet installed
for the freezer.

I think new codes even require the freezer on a GFCI (in the garage),
but it shouldn't be so overloaded that it trips. The freezer should
be on a separate circuit, even if that separate circuit is a GFCI.

On 11/27/2013 11:56 AM, Metspitzer wrote:

>> A frig should never be on a gfi circuit.
>
> Like you say, it shouldn't be. I don't know how a home warranty
> works, but it would be worth a try to get a separate outlet installed
> for the freezer.

Home warranty works like this. You pay the warranty company money. If
something breaks, they spend as little as possible to get things working
again and keep the rest of the money. Put that $500 a year into a
saving account and you can handle just about anything needed around the
house.

In today's money I've been a homeowner for 48 years. Paying for a
warranty would have been $24,000 over that time. Over the years I've
replaced most every appliance we have and the heater in my present
house. I'm about $10,000 ahead and I have the top of the line
appliances I want, not some cheap crap or overhaul by a warranty
company. Stuff wears out and then you replace it.

GFCI outlets are required in garages as well as bathrooms and outdoors.
It would be against code to run a circuit out there that is not GFCI.
Even if you want to, it is not a warranty situation at all and they
would pay nothing. That is between you and the electrician.


>
> I think new codes even require the freezer on a GFCI (in the garage),
> but it shouldn't be so overloaded that it trips. The freezer should
> be on a separate circuit, even if that separate circuit is a GFCI.
>

Seems that is the case
http://www.esgroundingsolutions.com/...a-refrigerator

—¾In a Dwelling Unit (house or apartment) refrigerators located inside
the kitchen do NOT have to have a GFCI. See 210.8(A)(6), Exhibit
210.13, 210.52(B)(1), 210.52(B)(2), 210.52(B)(3), and Exhibit 210.28.
If the circuit feeding the refrigerator outlet is branched to any other
outlet, it must be a 20-A circuit. If the circuit feeding the
refrigerator outlet is a dedicated individual circuit, than it can be
either 15-A or 20-A.
—¾In a garage or an unfinished basement of a Dwelling unit, the
refrigerator must have a GFCI circuit. In fact ALL outlets must be GFCI
in garages and unfinished basements. See 210.8(A)(2) and Exhibit 210.10.

Pearl F. Buck wrote:
> On 11/27/2013 9:13 AM, pltrgyst wrote:
> > On 11/26/2013 8:23 PM, jmcquown wrote:
> > > This particular circuit controls (oddly) the overhead lights in
> > > the master bathroom where the tub and toilet are AND all the
> > > electrical outlets in the garage. Where the freezer is....
> >
> > The Virginia townhouse we just moved out of had this same odd
> > arrangement -- the garage outlets were on the same circuit as the
> > master bathroom, up on the third floor. When something kicked the
> > garage refrigerator off, the first thing to do was to check the
> > GFCI outlet in the upstairs bathroom.
> >
> > -- Larry
> >
> A frig should never be on a gfi circuit.

He didn't say it was. He said it was on the same circuit [breaker] as a
GFCI outlet.


--

Reply in group, but if emailing remove the last word.

On 11/29/2013 3:15 PM, Tom Del Rosso wrote:
> Pearl F. Buck wrote:
>> On 11/27/2013 9:13 AM, pltrgyst wrote:
>>> On 11/26/2013 8:23 PM, jmcquown wrote:
>>>> This particular circuit controls (oddly) the overhead lights in
>>>> the master bathroom where the tub and toilet are AND all the
>>>> electrical outlets in the garage. Where the freezer is....
>>>
>>> The Virginia townhouse we just moved out of had this same odd
>>> arrangement -- the garage outlets were on the same circuit as the
>>> master bathroom, up on the third floor. When something kicked the
>>> garage refrigerator off, the first thing to do was to check the
>>> GFCI outlet in the upstairs bathroom.
>>>
>>> -- Larry
>>>
>> A frig should never be on a gfi circuit.
>
> He didn't say it was. He said it was on the same circuit [breaker] as a
> GFCI outlet.

That would put it on the GFCI as all the other outlets are downstream as
they all must be protected. Code requires garages and bathrooms to be
GFCI protected and it can be done with a breaker or outlet upstream..

On 11/29/2013 1:15 PM, Tom Del Rosso wrote:
> Pearl F. Buck wrote:
>> On 11/27/2013 9:13 AM, pltrgyst wrote:
>>> On 11/26/2013 8:23 PM, jmcquown wrote:
>>>> This particular circuit controls (oddly) the overhead lights in
>>>> the master bathroom where the tub and toilet are AND all the
>>>> electrical outlets in the garage. Where the freezer is....
>>>
>>> The Virginia townhouse we just moved out of had this same odd
>>> arrangement -- the garage outlets were on the same circuit as the
>>> master bathroom, up on the third floor. When something kicked the
>>> garage refrigerator off, the first thing to do was to check the
>>> GFCI outlet in the upstairs bathroom.
>>>
>>> -- Larry
>>>
>> A frig should never be on a gfi circuit.
>
> He didn't say it was. He said it was on the same circuit [breaker] as a
> GFCI outlet.
>
>
That is functionally the same thing.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Residual-current_device

In the United States and Canada, a residual-current device is most
commonly known as a Ground Fault Circuit Interrupter (GFCI), Ground
Fault Interrupter (GFI) or an Appliance Leakage Current Interrupter
(ALCI). Ground Fault Condition is defined as: An unintentional,
electrically conducting connection between an ungrounded conductor of an
electrical circuit and the normally non-current-carrying conductors,
metallic enclosures, metallic raceways, metallic equipment or earth.

On 11/26/2013 7:56 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> Get a heavy duty extension cord and plug the freezer into a different
> circuit. Freezers don't take all that much power so most receptacle
> will do as long as it is on another breaker..

Well...no, you're wrong:

http://www.ehow.com/info_12193777_li...ppliances.html

...most refrigerators need 20 amps

http://www.doityourself.com/stry/ins...-chest-freezer

You will need a circuit breaker which supports the number of amps you
will be drawing for your freezer. In most cases if it is a 220V you will
want a 30-amp breaker. An 110V will usually require a 15- or 20-amp
breaker. This information can be found in the manual supplied with the
freezer.

On Fri, 29 Nov 2013 14:02:02 -0700, "Pearl F. Buck"
> wrote:

>On 11/26/2013 7:56 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>> Get a heavy duty extension cord and plug the freezer into a different
>> circuit. Freezers don't take all that much power so most receptacle
>> will do as long as it is on another breaker..
>
>Well...no, you're wrong:
>
>http://www.ehow.com/info_12193777_li...ppliances.html
>
>..most refrigerators need 20 amps
>
>http://www.doityourself.com/stry/ins...-chest-freezer
>
>You will need a circuit breaker which supports the number of amps you
>will be drawing for your freezer. In most cases if it is a 220V you will
>want a 30-amp breaker. An 110V will usually require a 15- or 20-amp
>breaker. This information can be found in the manual supplied with the
>freezer.
The guy you are quoting doesn't know much about electricity. If you
are selecting a freezer and your choice is between 120V and a 240V,
the 240V will use less amps (half) not more.

On 11/29/2013 4:11 PM, Metspitzer wrote:
> On Fri, 29 Nov 2013 14:02:02 -0700, "Pearl F. Buck"
> > wrote:
>
>> On 11/26/2013 7:56 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>> Get a heavy duty extension cord and plug the freezer into a different
>>> circuit. Freezers don't take all that much power so most receptacle
>>> will do as long as it is on another breaker..
>>
>> Well...no, you're wrong:
>>
>> http://www.ehow.com/info_12193777_li...ppliances.html
>>
>> ..most refrigerators need 20 amps
>>
>> http://www.doityourself.com/stry/ins...-chest-freezer
>>
>> You will need a circuit breaker which supports the number of amps you
>> will be drawing for your freezer. In most cases if it is a 220V you will
>> want a 30-amp breaker. An 110V will usually require a 15- or 20-amp
>> breaker. This information can be found in the manual supplied with the
>> freezer.
> The guy you are quoting doesn't know much about electricity. If you
> are selecting a freezer and your choice is between 120V and a 240V,
> the 240V will use less amps (half) not more.
>
They must have reversed the numbers, your correction is on the money.

On 11/29/2013 4:02 PM, Pearl F. Buck wrote:
> On 11/26/2013 7:56 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>> Get a heavy duty extension cord and plug the freezer into a different
>> circuit. Freezers don't take all that much power so most receptacle
>> will do as long as it is on another breaker..
>
> Well...no, you're wrong:
>
> http://www.ehow.com/info_12193777_li...ppliances.html
>
>
> ..most refrigerators need 20 amps

That was probably correct 30 years ago, but not today
http://www.whirlpool.com/digitalasse...ruction_EN.pdf

From the Whirlpool Freezer manual, page 4
A 115 Volt, 60 Hz., AC only 15- or 20-amp fused, grounded
electrical supply is required. It is recommended that a separate
circuit serving only your refrigerator and a separate circuit serving
only your freezer be provided.


>
> http://www.doityourself.com/stry/ins...-chest-freezer
>
> You will need a circuit breaker which supports the number of amps you
> will be drawing for your freezer. In most cases if it is a 220V you will
> want a 30-amp breaker. An 110V will usually require a 15- or 20-amp
> breaker. This information can be found in the manual supplied with the
> freezer.

Wow, that information is waaaaay off. Double the volts, half the amps.
Perhaps a large commercial freezer, bit any home freezer is 115 volts
and not that much power is needed. Note also, it contradicts what you
said above about using a 15A breaker.

On 11/29/2013 5:25 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
> On 11/29/2013 4:02 PM, Pearl F. Buck wrote:
>> On 11/26/2013 7:56 PM, Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>>> Get a heavy duty extension cord and plug the freezer into a different
>>> circuit. Freezers don't take all that much power so most receptacle
>>> will do as long as it is on another breaker..
>>
>> Well...no, you're wrong:
>>
>> http://www.ehow.com/info_12193777_li...ppliances.html
>>
>>
>>
>> ..most refrigerators need 20 amps
>
> That was probably correct 30 years ago, but not today
> http://www.whirlpool.com/digitalasse...ruction_EN.pdf
>
>
> From the Whirlpool Freezer manual, page 4
> A 115 Volt, 60 Hz., AC only 15- or 20-amp fused, grounded
> electrical supply is required. It is recommended that a separate
> circuit serving only your refrigerator and a separate circuit serving
> only your freezer be provided.
>
>
>>
>> http://www.doityourself.com/stry/ins...-chest-freezer
>>
>> You will need a circuit breaker which supports the number of amps you
>> will be drawing for your freezer. In most cases if it is a 220V you will
>> want a 30-amp breaker. An 110V will usually require a 15- or 20-amp
>> breaker. This information can be found in the manual supplied with the
>> freezer.
>
> Wow, that information is waaaaay off. Double the volts, half the amps.

They obviously reversed the numbers, yes.

> Perhaps a large commercial freezer, bit any home freezer is 115 volts
> and not that much power is needed. Note also, it contradicts what you
> said above about using a 15A breaker.

http://manuals.frigidaire.com/prodin...7H_0911_EN.pdf

Minimum Circuit Required (Amps)

15

On 11/26/2013 3:23 PM, jmcquown wrote:
> Just venting a bit. Ignore at will.
>
> A couple of months ago one of the breakers on the main electrical box
> tripped. I thought I'd reset it but it took several tries before it
> actually "took".
>
> This particular circuit controls (oddly) the overhead lights in the
> master bathroom where the tub and toilet are AND all the electrical
> outlets in the garage. Where the freezer is. That last time this
> happened I finally got it reset. <whew> In the meantime, I'd moved as
> much frozen food into the freezer in the side-by-side fridge as I could
> fit. I stored some things in the neighbor's freezer.

It might be that you're not supposed to be running a freezer in the
garage. OTOH, the first thing you should do is to replace the breaker -
they're surprisingly cheap. Getting a guy to do it for you might be
costly though.

>
> This time, I've moved what I can fit to the fridge/freezer already.
> Because this time, that breaker absolutely will *not* reset. I've tried
> at least 20 times now. I think the breaker switch itself needs to be
> replaced.
>
> I've got a home warranty so I put in a service request. And left a
> message with the electricians they have a contract with. Here we are,
> two days before Thanksgiving. Even if I'm not cooking for company I
> stand to lose a goodly amount of food. I sure hope they can get someone
> out here tomorrow. I *know* this electrical company isn't going to be
> working on Thanksgiving. Possibly not even the day after. If they
> can't get to it tomorrow I'll be hunting down an electrican who can. I'm
> not sure I'll be able to find one.
>
> The good news is, I procrastinated about going to the grocery store
> yesterday. And today it was raining like mad. I'm not fond of
> loading a lot of groceries into the car when it's pouring down rain. So
> at least I won't lose as much food as I might if I'd already gone to
> Publix.
>
> Jill

On 11/26/2013 10:29 PM, dsi1 wrote:
> On 11/26/2013 3:23 PM, jmcquown wrote:
>> Just venting a bit. Ignore at will.
>>
>> A couple of months ago one of the breakers on the main electrical box
>> tripped. I thought I'd reset it but it took several tries before it
>> actually "took".
>>
>> This particular circuit controls (oddly) the overhead lights in the
>> master bathroom where the tub and toilet are AND all the electrical
>> outlets in the garage. Where the freezer is. That last time this
>> happened I finally got it reset. <whew> In the meantime, I'd moved as
>> much frozen food into the freezer in the side-by-side fridge as I could
>> fit. I stored some things in the neighbor's freezer.
>
> It might be that you're not supposed to be running a freezer in the
> garage.

Thing is, my parents ran a much larger freezer from the time they built
the house. It was never a problem.

OTOH, the first thing you should do is to replace the breaker -
> they're surprisingly cheap. Getting a guy to do it for you might be
> costly though.
>
That's what I need, the switch replaced. I think. The electrical panel
is original to the 1987 house. Something was bound to go wrong at some
point.

Jill

On 11/26/2013 5:33 PM, jmcquown wrote:
> On 11/26/2013 10:29 PM, dsi1 wrote:
>> On 11/26/2013 3:23 PM, jmcquown wrote:
>>> Just venting a bit. Ignore at will.
>>>
>>> A couple of months ago one of the breakers on the main electrical box
>>> tripped. I thought I'd reset it but it took several tries before it
>>> actually "took".
>>>
>>> This particular circuit controls (oddly) the overhead lights in the
>>> master bathroom where the tub and toilet are AND all the electrical
>>> outlets in the garage. Where the freezer is. That last time this
>>> happened I finally got it reset. <whew> In the meantime, I'd moved as
>>> much frozen food into the freezer in the side-by-side fridge as I could
>>> fit. I stored some things in the neighbor's freezer.
>>
>> It might be that you're not supposed to be running a freezer in the
>> garage.
>
> Thing is, my parents ran a much larger freezer from the time they built
> the house. It was never a problem.
>
> OTOH, the first thing you should do is to replace the breaker -
>> they're surprisingly cheap. Getting a guy to do it for you might be
>> costly though.
>>
> That's what I need, the switch replaced. I think. The electrical panel
> is original to the 1987 house. Something was bound to go wrong at some
> point.

I've had to replace the breakers in the places we lived several times.
They cost five bucks or so but I guess that's why they tend to break a
lot - they're built kind of cheaply.

>
> Jill

On 11/26/2013 8:23 PM, jmcquown wrote:
> Just venting a bit. Ignore at will.
>
> A couple of months ago one of the breakers on the main electrical box
> tripped. I thought I'd reset it but it took several tries before it
> actually "took".
>
> This particular circuit controls (oddly) the overhead lights in the
> master bathroom where the tub and toilet are AND all the electrical
> outlets in the garage. Where the freezer is. That last time this
> happened I finally got it reset. <whew> In the meantime, I'd moved as
> much frozen food into the freezer in the side-by-side fridge as I could
> fit. I stored some things in the neighbor's freezer.
>
> This time, I've moved what I can fit to the fridge/freezer already.
> Because this time, that breaker absolutely will *not* reset. I've tried
> at least 20 times now. I think the breaker switch itself needs to be
> replaced.
>
> I've got a home warranty so I put in a service request. And left a
> message with the electricians they have a contract with. Here we are,
> two days before Thanksgiving. Even if I'm not cooking for company I
> stand to lose a goodly amount of food. I sure hope they can get someone
> out here tomorrow. I *know* this electrical company isn't going to be
> working on Thanksgiving. Possibly not even the day after. If they
> can't get to it tomorrow I'll be hunting down an electrican who can. I'm
> not sure I'll be able to find one.
>
> The good news is, I procrastinated about going to the grocery store
> yesterday. And today it was raining like mad. I'm not fond of
> loading a lot of groceries into the car when it's pouring down rain. So
> at least I won't lose as much food as I might if I'd already gone to
> Publix.
>
> Jill

I hate having electrical problems. I have an outside outlet plus some
motion sensor lights that aren't working and of course my brother says
don't call an electrician, that he'll come fix it. Well, a month later,
no fix. lol I won't bug him about it even though he offered. I'm just
going to call an electrician. Some of the motion sensor light light up
my driveway when I come home so I hate coming home to a dark driveway.
It will be fixed very soon one way or the other, but likely the way that
will cost me.

--
CAPSLOCK–Preventing Login Since 1980.

On 11/26/2013 8:23 PM, jmcquown wrote:
> Just venting a bit. Ignore at will.
>
> A couple of months ago one of the breakers on the main electrical box
> tripped. I thought I'd reset it but it took several tries before it
> actually "took".
>
> This particular circuit controls (oddly) the overhead lights in the
> master bathroom where the tub and toilet are AND all the electrical
> outlets in the garage. Where the freezer is. That last time this
> happened I finally got it reset. <whew> In the meantime, I'd moved as
> much frozen food into the freezer in the side-by-side fridge as I could
> fit. I stored some things in the neighbor's freezer.



I am confused. Was the breaker hard to flip or did it keep tripping
when you flipped it? Breakers are easily replaced. If it is constantly
tripping it you might be overloading the circuit, or there could be as
wiring problem that is shorting it out causing it to trip.
>
> This time, I've moved what I can fit to the fridge/freezer already.
> Because this time, that breaker absolutely will *not* reset. I've tried
> at least 20 times now. I think the breaker switch itself needs to be
> replaced.
>
> I've got a home warranty so I put in a service request. And left a
> message with the electricians they have a contract with. Here we are,
> two days before Thanksgiving. Even if I'm not cooking for company I
> stand to lose a goodly amount of food. I sure hope they can get someone
> out here tomorrow. I *know* this electrical company isn't going to be
> working on Thanksgiving. Possibly not even the day after. If they
> can't get to it tomorrow I'll be hunting down an electrican who can. I'm
> not sure I'll be able to find one.
>
> The good news is, I procrastinated about going to the grocery store
> yesterday. And today it was raining like mad. I'm not fond of
> loading a lot of groceries into the car when it's pouring down rain. So
> at least I won't lose as much food as I might if I'd already gone to
> Publix.
>
How about running an extension cord to the freezer from a different
circuit.
I

On 11/26/2013 10:55 PM, Dave Smith wrote:
> On 11/26/2013 8:23 PM, jmcquown wrote:
>> Just venting a bit. Ignore at will.
>>
>> A couple of months ago one of the breakers on the main electrical box
>> tripped. I thought I'd reset it but it took several tries before it
>> actually "took".
>>
>> This particular circuit controls (oddly) the overhead lights in the
>> master bathroom where the tub and toilet are AND all the electrical
>> outlets in the garage. Where the freezer is. That last time this
>> happened I finally got it reset. <whew> In the meantime, I'd moved as
>> much frozen food into the freezer in the side-by-side fridge as I could
>> fit. I stored some things in the neighbor's freezer.
>
>
> I am confused. Was the breaker hard to flip or did it keep tripping
> when you flipped it? Breakers are easily replaced.

When this happened a couple of months ago I reset every breaker in the
box. Literally. This one sounds like it's snapping to but it didn't
until I reset it several times. This time it won't set at all. It goes
right back to 'tripped'.

> tripping it you might be overloading the circuit, or there could be as
> wiring problem that is shorting it out causing it to trip.

It could be a wiring issue but hopefully just the breaker for that
circuit. I haven't plugged anything extra into that circuit since I've
lived here.

Jill

On 11/26/2013 6:07 PM, jmcquown wrote:
> On 11/26/2013 10:55 PM, Dave Smith wrote:
>> On 11/26/2013 8:23 PM, jmcquown wrote:
>>> Just venting a bit. Ignore at will.
>>>
>>> A couple of months ago one of the breakers on the main electrical box
>>> tripped. I thought I'd reset it but it took several tries before it
>>> actually "took".
>>>
>>> This particular circuit controls (oddly) the overhead lights in the
>>> master bathroom where the tub and toilet are AND all the electrical
>>> outlets in the garage. Where the freezer is. That last time this
>>> happened I finally got it reset. <whew> In the meantime, I'd moved as
>>> much frozen food into the freezer in the side-by-side fridge as I could
>>> fit. I stored some things in the neighbor's freezer.
>>
>>
>> I am confused. Was the breaker hard to flip or did it keep tripping
>> when you flipped it? Breakers are easily replaced.
>
> When this happened a couple of months ago I reset every breaker in the
> box. Literally. This one sounds like it's snapping to but it didn't
> until I reset it several times. This time it won't set at all. It goes
> right back to 'tripped'.

Maybe you could duct tape it on to the on position. I've had this
happen. It means that the breaker in the box is broken.

>
>> tripping it you might be overloading the circuit, or there could be as
>> wiring problem that is shorting it out causing it to trip.
>
> It could be a wiring issue but hopefully just the breaker for that
> circuit. I haven't plugged anything extra into that circuit since I've
> lived here.
>
> Jill

On 11/26/2013 11:14 PM, dsi1 wrote:
> On 11/26/2013 6:07 PM, jmcquown wrote:
>> On 11/26/2013 10:55 PM, Dave Smith wrote:
>>> On 11/26/2013 8:23 PM, jmcquown wrote:
>>>> Just venting a bit. Ignore at will.
>>>>
>>>> A couple of months ago one of the breakers on the main electrical box
>>>> tripped. I thought I'd reset it but it took several tries before it
>>>> actually "took".
>>>>
>>>> This particular circuit controls (oddly) the overhead lights in the
>>>> master bathroom where the tub and toilet are AND all the electrical
>>>> outlets in the garage. Where the freezer is. That last time this
>>>> happened I finally got it reset. <whew> In the meantime, I'd moved as
>>>> much frozen food into the freezer in the side-by-side fridge as I could
>>>> fit. I stored some things in the neighbor's freezer.
>>>
>>>
>>> I am confused. Was the breaker hard to flip or did it keep tripping
>>> when you flipped it? Breakers are easily replaced.
>>
>> When this happened a couple of months ago I reset every breaker in the
>> box. Literally. This one sounds like it's snapping to but it didn't
>> until I reset it several times. This time it won't set at all. It goes
>> right back to 'tripped'.
>
> Maybe you could duct tape it on to the on position. I've had this
> happen. It means that the breaker in the box is broken.
>
Yes, I already said I'm pretty sure the breaker is broken. I plan to
have it repaired. I'm not going to try to jury-rig it.

Jill

jmcquown > wrote:
> On 11/26/2013 11:14 PM, dsi1 wrote:
>> On 11/26/2013 6:07 PM, jmcquown wrote:
>>> On 11/26/2013 10:55 PM, Dave Smith wrote:
>>>> On 11/26/2013 8:23 PM, jmcquown wrote:
>>>>> Just venting a bit. Ignore at will.
>>>>>
>>>>> A couple of months ago one of the breakers on the main electrical box
>>>>> tripped. I thought I'd reset it but it took several tries before it
>>>>> actually "took".
>>>>>
>>>>> This particular circuit controls (oddly) the overhead lights in the
>>>>> master bathroom where the tub and toilet are AND all the electrical
>>>>> outlets in the garage. Where the freezer is. That last time this
>>>>> happened I finally got it reset. <whew> In the meantime, I'd moved as
>>>>> much frozen food into the freezer in the side-by-side fridge as I could
>>>>> fit. I stored some things in the neighbor's freezer.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I am confused. Was the breaker hard to flip or did it keep tripping
>>>> when you flipped it? Breakers are easily replaced.
>>>
>>> When this happened a couple of months ago I reset every breaker in the
>>> box. Literally. This one sounds like it's snapping to but it didn't
>>> until I reset it several times. This time it won't set at all. It goes
>>> right back to 'tripped'.
>>
>> Maybe you could duct tape it on to the on position. I've had this
>> happen. It means that the breaker in the box is broken.
>>
> Yes, I already said I'm pretty sure the breaker is broken. I plan to
> have it repaired. I'm not going to try to jury-rig it.
>
> Jill

I can't tell what you see and feel. I would first unplug freezer, and try
to reset it.

Greg

On Tuesday, November 26, 2013 10:14:31 PM UTC-6, dsi1 wrote:

>
> Maybe you could duct tape it on to the on position. I've had this
>
> happen. It means that the breaker in the box is broken.
>
And those of you with fuses, the next time one burns out, pennies are
cheaper than fuses.

Breakers and fuses are there for a reason.

--Bryan sex+

On 11/26/2013 9:07 PM, jmcquown wrote:
> This one sounds like it's snapping to but it didn't until I reset it
> several times. This time it won't set at all. It goes right back to
> 'tripped'.

It has failed and been rendered inoperable, not a safe situation.

Kill the breaker for this circuit and get an electrician who knows what
he is doing.