"Ophelia" > wrote in message
...
>
> "James Silverton" > wrote in message
> news:k0HAi.3$cA6.0@trnddc05...
>>>
>> Then you will be missing treats! There are several flavors of knishes
>> which are pastries stuffed with potatoes, meat and often both. The
>> information on "soakers" was new to me: you live and learn!
>
> So is a knish like a pasty then, James?

Sort of, but not sweet. Most often, street vendors sell the kind with potato
inside, flavored with a little onion black pepper. Delis and restaurants
will have other varieties, but they're not a sweet pastry.

In article >,
George > wrote:

> Omelet wrote:
> > In article >,
> > "Pete C." > wrote:
> >
> >>> My house is all electric. On purpose...
> >> It's not a big deal really, when you have an oil bill for heating you
> >> have a low electric bill. Spend $100 on oil instead of electricity, it
> >> mostly balances. Of course in the summer you're using electric for A/C,
> >> but you are using little or no oil during those months.
> >
> > LP keeps going up every year. I know people with tanks that are
> > seriously hurting in the winter. So much so that the heat gets shut off
> > and they use space heaters.
> >
> > And convert over to electric stoves.
>
> Everyone has to do their part to keep all of those fashion statement
> SUVs running...

<lol>

And the Hummers... (been seeing more of those lately, makes me Ill!)
--
Peace, Om

Remove _ to validate e-mails.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a Son of a bitch" -- Jack Nicholson

"Omelet" > wrote in message
news
> In article >,
> George > wrote:
>
>> Omelet wrote:
>> > In article >,
>> > "Pete C." > wrote:
>> >
>> >>> My house is all electric. On purpose...
>> >> It's not a big deal really, when you have an oil bill for heating you
>> >> have a low electric bill. Spend $100 on oil instead of electricity, it
>> >> mostly balances. Of course in the summer you're using electric for
>> >> A/C,
>> >> but you are using little or no oil during those months.
>> >
>> > LP keeps going up every year. I know people with tanks that are
>> > seriously hurting in the winter. So much so that the heat gets shut off
>> > and they use space heaters.
>> >
>> > And convert over to electric stoves.
>>
>> Everyone has to do their part to keep all of those fashion statement
>> SUVs running...
>
> <lol>
>
> And the Hummers... (been seeing more of those lately, makes me Ill!)
> --
> Peace, Om


What's your problem with Hummers???

In article >,
"JoeSpareBedroom" > wrote:

> >> Everyone has to do their part to keep all of those fashion statement
> >> SUVs running...
> >
> > <lol>
> >
> > And the Hummers... (been seeing more of those lately, makes me Ill!)
> > --
> > Peace, Om
>
>
> What's your problem with Hummers???

Oh stop it.

Shitty gas mileage (HumVees, not hummingbirds!).

What else?
--
Peace, Om

Remove _ to validate e-mails.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a Son of a bitch" -- Jack Nicholson

Ophelia wrote on Tue, 28 Aug 2007 07:54:26 +0100:


O> "James Silverton" > wrote in
O> message news:k0HAi.3$cA6.0@trnddc05...
??>>>
??>> Then you will be missing treats! There are several flavors
??>> of knishes which are pastries stuffed with potatoes, meat
??>> and often both. The information on "soakers" was new to
me:
??>> you live and learn!


James Silverton
Potomac, Maryland

E-mail, with obvious alterations:
not.jim.silverton.at.verizon.not

Ophelia wrote on Tue, 28 Aug 2007 07:54:26 +0100:


O> "James Silverton" > wrote in
O> message news:k0HAi.3$cA6.0@trnddc05...
??>>>
??>> Then you will be missing treats! There are several flavors
??>> of knishes which are pastries stuffed with potatoes, meat
??>> and often both. The information on "soakers" was new to
me:
??>> you live and learn!

It's so long since I had a pasty that I can't say for sure but
to my recollection, leaving out matters of flavoring, a knish
has quite a lot less crust.

James Silverton
Potomac, Maryland

E-mail, with obvious alterations:
not.jim.silverton.at.verizon.not

"Omelet" > wrote in message
news
> In article >,
> "JoeSpareBedroom" > wrote:
>
>> >> Everyone has to do their part to keep all of those fashion statement
>> >> SUVs running...
>> >
>> > <lol>
>> >
>> > And the Hummers... (been seeing more of those lately, makes me Ill!)
>> > --
>> > Peace, Om
>>
>>
>> What's your problem with Hummers???
>
> Oh stop it.
>
> Shitty gas mileage (HumVees, not hummingbirds!).
>
> What else?
> --
> Peace, Om


So, they use too much oil. So do you. You happily buy products in excessive
packaging. Might be made from recycled plastic, might not. You don't care,
though, as long as it's convenient for you.

JoeSpareBedroom wrote:

>
> So, they use too much oil. So do you. You happily buy products in excessive
> packaging. Might be made from recycled plastic, might not. You don't care,
> though, as long as it's convenient for you.
>
>
Anyone with an aircraft carrier vehicle is wasting oil way above and
beyond what they and others might be wasting on "convenience".

Also not everyone "happily buys products in excessive packaging". We
take reusable bags to the store so we aren't wasting plastic and often
buy products at smaller merchants and farm markets etc where minimal or
no packaging is used. I am quite sure we are not the only ones.

"George" > wrote in message
. ..
> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>
>>
>> So, they use too much oil. So do you. You happily buy products in
>> excessive packaging. Might be made from recycled plastic, might not. You
>> don't care, though, as long as it's convenient for you.
> Anyone with an aircraft carrier vehicle is wasting oil way above and
> beyond what they and others might be wasting on "convenience".
>
> Also not everyone "happily buys products in excessive packaging". We take
> reusable bags to the store so we aren't wasting plastic and often buy
> products at smaller merchants and farm markets etc where minimal or no
> packaging is used. I am quite sure we are not the only ones.


I never said "everyone". I'm focused right now on Om's hypocrisy. She points
to passenger tanks as wasteful, but chooses to buy products with excessive
packaging. And, it doesn't really matter if the stuff is recycled. It still
uses energy to make that happen.

JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
> "Ophelia" > wrote in message
> ...
>>
>> "James Silverton" > wrote in message
>> news:k0HAi.3$cA6.0@trnddc05...
>>>>
>>> Then you will be missing treats! There are several flavors of
>>> knishes which are pastries stuffed with potatoes, meat and often
>>> both. The information on "soakers" was new to me: you live and
>>> learn!
>>
>> So is a knish like a pasty then, James?
>
> Sort of, but not sweet. Most often, street vendors sell the kind with
> potato inside, flavored with a little onion black pepper. Delis and
> restaurants will have other varieties, but they're not a sweet pastry.

Think of Cornish Pasties? Do you remember them?

http://www.cornishlight.co.uk/cornish-pasty.htm

"Ophelia" > wrote in message
...
> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>> "Ophelia" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>>
>>> "James Silverton" > wrote in message
>>> news:k0HAi.3$cA6.0@trnddc05...
>>>>>
>>>> Then you will be missing treats! There are several flavors of
>>>> knishes which are pastries stuffed with potatoes, meat and often
>>>> both. The information on "soakers" was new to me: you live and
>>>> learn!
>>>
>>> So is a knish like a pasty then, James?
>>
>> Sort of, but not sweet. Most often, street vendors sell the kind with
>> potato inside, flavored with a little onion black pepper. Delis and
>> restaurants will have other varieties, but they're not a sweet pastry.
>
> Think of Cornish Pasties? Do you remember them?
>
> http://www.cornishlight.co.uk/cornish-pasty.htm


Sounds similar. Now I'm hungry!

JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
> "Ophelia" > wrote in message
> ...
>> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>>> "Ophelia" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>>
>>>> "James Silverton" > wrote in message
>>>> news:k0HAi.3$cA6.0@trnddc05...
>>>>>>
>>>>> Then you will be missing treats! There are several flavors of
>>>>> knishes which are pastries stuffed with potatoes, meat and often
>>>>> both. The information on "soakers" was new to me: you live and
>>>>> learn!
>>>>
>>>> So is a knish like a pasty then, James?
>>>
>>> Sort of, but not sweet. Most often, street vendors sell the kind
>>> with potato inside, flavored with a little onion black pepper.
>>> Delis and restaurants will have other varieties, but they're not a
>>> sweet pastry.
>>
>> Think of Cornish Pasties? Do you remember them?
>>
>> http://www.cornishlight.co.uk/cornish-pasty.htm
>
>
> Sounds similar. Now I'm hungry!

there is a good recipe above

"Ophelia" > wrote in message
...
> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>> "Ophelia" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>>>> "Ophelia" > wrote in message
>>>> ...
>>>>>
>>>>> "James Silverton" > wrote in message
>>>>> news:k0HAi.3$cA6.0@trnddc05...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Then you will be missing treats! There are several flavors of
>>>>>> knishes which are pastries stuffed with potatoes, meat and often
>>>>>> both. The information on "soakers" was new to me: you live and
>>>>>> learn!
>>>>>
>>>>> So is a knish like a pasty then, James?
>>>>
>>>> Sort of, but not sweet. Most often, street vendors sell the kind
>>>> with potato inside, flavored with a little onion black pepper.
>>>> Delis and restaurants will have other varieties, but they're not a
>>>> sweet pastry.
>>>
>>> Think of Cornish Pasties? Do you remember them?
>>>
>>> http://www.cornishlight.co.uk/cornish-pasty.htm
>>
>>
>> Sounds similar. Now I'm hungry!
>
> there is a good recipe above
>

I'll have one of the large staff of servants make it for me immediately.

"JoeSpareBedroom" > wrote in message
news:NlXAi.14795>>>>
>>>> http://www.cornishlight.co.uk/cornish-pasty.htm
>>>
>>>
>>> Sounds similar. Now I'm hungry!
>>
>> there is a good recipe above
>>
>
> I'll have one of the large staff of servants make it for me immediately.
>

Ooooooooooohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh get 'im )))

In article >,
George > wrote:

> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>
> >
> > So, they use too much oil. So do you. You happily buy products in excessive
> > packaging. Might be made from recycled plastic, might not. You don't care,
> > though, as long as it's convenient for you.
> >
> >
> Anyone with an aircraft carrier vehicle is wasting oil way above and
> beyond what they and others might be wasting on "convenience".
>
> Also not everyone "happily buys products in excessive packaging". We
> take reusable bags to the store so we aren't wasting plastic and often
> buy products at smaller merchants and farm markets etc where minimal or
> no packaging is used. I am quite sure we are not the only ones.

I'd rather use plastic bags and packaging than kill trees...
--
Peace, Om

Remove _ to validate e-mails.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a Son of a bitch" -- Jack Nicholson

In article >,
"JoeSpareBedroom" > wrote:

> "George" > wrote in message
> . ..
> > JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> So, they use too much oil. So do you. You happily buy products in
> >> excessive packaging. Might be made from recycled plastic, might not. You
> >> don't care, though, as long as it's convenient for you.
> > Anyone with an aircraft carrier vehicle is wasting oil way above and
> > beyond what they and others might be wasting on "convenience".
> >
> > Also not everyone "happily buys products in excessive packaging". We take
> > reusable bags to the store so we aren't wasting plastic and often buy
> > products at smaller merchants and farm markets etc where minimal or no
> > packaging is used. I am quite sure we are not the only ones.
>
>
> I never said "everyone". I'm focused right now on Om's hypocrisy. She points
> to passenger tanks as wasteful, but chooses to buy products with excessive
> packaging. And, it doesn't really matter if the stuff is recycled. It still
> uses energy to make that happen.

What do you drive?
--
Peace, Om

Remove _ to validate e-mails.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a Son of a bitch" -- Jack Nicholson

"Omelet" > wrote in message
news
> In article >,
> "JoeSpareBedroom" > wrote:
>
>> "George" > wrote in message
>> . ..
>> > JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>> >
>> >>
>> >> So, they use too much oil. So do you. You happily buy products in
>> >> excessive packaging. Might be made from recycled plastic, might not.
>> >> You
>> >> don't care, though, as long as it's convenient for you.
>> > Anyone with an aircraft carrier vehicle is wasting oil way above and
>> > beyond what they and others might be wasting on "convenience".
>> >
>> > Also not everyone "happily buys products in excessive packaging". We
>> > take
>> > reusable bags to the store so we aren't wasting plastic and often buy
>> > products at smaller merchants and farm markets etc where minimal or no
>> > packaging is used. I am quite sure we are not the only ones.
>>
>>
>> I never said "everyone". I'm focused right now on Om's hypocrisy. She
>> points
>> to passenger tanks as wasteful, but chooses to buy products with
>> excessive
>> packaging. And, it doesn't really matter if the stuff is recycled. It
>> still
>> uses energy to make that happen.
>
> What do you drive?
> --
> Peace, Om

Irrelevant. Strike the question from the record.

> It's so long since I had a pasty that I can't say for sure...

Personally, I never wear pasties. :^)

"George" > wrote in message
...
> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>> "George" > wrote in message
>> . ..
>>> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>>>
>>>> So, they use too much oil. So do you. You happily buy products in
>>>> excessive packaging. Might be made from recycled plastic, might not.
>>>> You don't care, though, as long as it's convenient for you.
>>> Anyone with an aircraft carrier vehicle is wasting oil way above and
>>> beyond what they and others might be wasting on "convenience".
>>>
>>> Also not everyone "happily buys products in excessive packaging". We
>>> take reusable bags to the store so we aren't wasting plastic and often
>>> buy products at smaller merchants and farm markets etc where minimal or
>>> no packaging is used. I am quite sure we are not the only ones.
>>
>>
>> I never said "everyone". I'm focused right now on Om's hypocrisy. She
>> points to passenger tanks as wasteful, but chooses to buy products with
>> excessive packaging. And, it doesn't really matter if the stuff is
>> recycled. It still uses energy to make that happen.
> You are missing my point. Suppose family "A" and family "B" are identical
> in every way (including buying overpackaged items)except family "A" has
> his & hers personal aircraft carriers in the driveway and family "B" has
> normal cars. Which one is more wasteful?

Obviously, family A. This assumes both families own the same brand of car,
but different models.

JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
> "George" > wrote in message
> . ..
>> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>>
>>> So, they use too much oil. So do you. You happily buy products in
>>> excessive packaging. Might be made from recycled plastic, might not. You
>>> don't care, though, as long as it's convenient for you.
>> Anyone with an aircraft carrier vehicle is wasting oil way above and
>> beyond what they and others might be wasting on "convenience".
>>
>> Also not everyone "happily buys products in excessive packaging". We take
>> reusable bags to the store so we aren't wasting plastic and often buy
>> products at smaller merchants and farm markets etc where minimal or no
>> packaging is used. I am quite sure we are not the only ones.
>
>
> I never said "everyone". I'm focused right now on Om's hypocrisy. She points
> to passenger tanks as wasteful, but chooses to buy products with excessive
> packaging. And, it doesn't really matter if the stuff is recycled. It still
> uses energy to make that happen.
>
>
You are missing my point. Suppose family "A" and family "B" are
identical in every way (including buying overpackaged items)except
family "A" has his & hers personal aircraft carriers in the driveway and
family "B" has normal cars. Which one is more wasteful?

In article >,
"JoeSpareBedroom" > wrote:

> >> I never said "everyone". I'm focused right now on Om's hypocrisy. She
> >> points
> >> to passenger tanks as wasteful, but chooses to buy products with
> >> excessive
> >> packaging. And, it doesn't really matter if the stuff is recycled. It
> >> still
> >> uses energy to make that happen.
> >
> > What do you drive?
> > --
> > Peace, Om
>
> Irrelevant. Strike the question from the record.

Chicken. ;-)

I'm kinda in between with my Chevy S-10.
I get 21 to 23 mpg.
--
Peace, Om

Remove _ to validate e-mails.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a Son of a bitch" -- Jack Nicholson

In article >,
George > wrote:

> > I never said "everyone". I'm focused right now on Om's hypocrisy. She
> > points
> > to passenger tanks as wasteful, but chooses to buy products with excessive
> > packaging. And, it doesn't really matter if the stuff is recycled. It still
> > uses energy to make that happen.
> >
> >
> You are missing my point. Suppose family "A" and family "B" are
> identical in every way (including buying overpackaged items)except
> family "A" has his & hers personal aircraft carriers in the driveway and
> family "B" has normal cars. Which one is more wasteful?

<applause>
--
Peace, Om

Remove _ to validate e-mails.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a Son of a bitch" -- Jack Nicholson

Robert L Bass wrote:
>> It's so long since I had a pasty that I can't say for sure...
>
> Personally, I never wear pasties. :^)

You wear steak and kidney pies????

In article >,
"Ophelia" > wrote:

> Robert L Bass wrote:
> >> It's so long since I had a pasty that I can't say for sure...
> >
> > Personally, I never wear pasties. :^)
>
> You wear steak and kidney pies????

<ROFL!!!>
--
Peace, Om

Remove _ to validate e-mails.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a Son of a bitch" -- Jack Nicholson

Omelet wrote:
>
> In article >,
> "Pete C." > wrote:
>
> > > Entrance on private property. I could not keep out spelunkers tho'.
> > > They are generally respectful tho' so that is cool.
> > >
> > > It's still a pipe dream at the moment. ;-)
> >
> > A lot of work to drill an entrance into a cave, not the least of which
> > is locating the surface point above the cave.
>
> It would take some research and I'd want it drilled at a 45 degree angle
> or so to make stairs more practical.

Have you considered just how big the drill would have to be to allow for
stairs? Think along the lines of 5'+ at least which would cost a fortune
to drill.

>
> > > > Make a nice root cellar.
> > >
> > > No kidding!
> > > Caverns here tend to be a bit damp tho.
> > > Shallower ones are dryer.
> >
> > The one I was at in NB certainly was wet, another couple a fair distance
> > to the west were quite dry.
>
> Natural Bridge is a deeper cave than Wonder World.

Not Natural Bridge, a non-public cave in the New Braunfels area.

>
> > >
> > > Ok, that's odd. The local cavers seem to be pretty responsible for the
> > > most part.
> >
> > The "Cavers" are the "pros" and the ones affiliated with the NSS
> > generally.
>
> Hm. More research needed.... but the local explored map of WW cave is
> posted. I think I could see about where it runs since I'm not that far
> away.

http://www.caves.org/

>
> I might simply be SOL.

Could be.

> --
> Peace, Om
>
> Remove _ to validate e-mails.
>
> "My mother never saw the irony in calling me a Son of a bitch" -- Jack Nicholson

Omelet wrote:
>
> In article >,
> George > wrote:
>
> > Omelet wrote:
> > > In article >,
> > > "Pete C." > wrote:
> > >
> > >>> My house is all electric. On purpose...
> > >> It's not a big deal really, when you have an oil bill for heating you
> > >> have a low electric bill. Spend $100 on oil instead of electricity, it
> > >> mostly balances. Of course in the summer you're using electric for A/C,
> > >> but you are using little or no oil during those months.
> > >
> > > LP keeps going up every year. I know people with tanks that are
> > > seriously hurting in the winter. So much so that the heat gets shut off
> > > and they use space heaters.
> > >
> > > And convert over to electric stoves.
> >
> > Everyone has to do their part to keep all of those fashion statement
> > SUVs running...
>
> <lol>
>
> And the Hummers... (been seeing more of those lately, makes me Ill!)

Those are the "H3"s, nothing more than the equivalent of a Jeep Liberty
(leprosy) with a stupid body on it.

George wrote:
>
> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
> > "George" > wrote in message
> > . ..
> >> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
> >>
> >>> So, they use too much oil. So do you. You happily buy products in
> >>> excessive packaging. Might be made from recycled plastic, might not. You
> >>> don't care, though, as long as it's convenient for you.
> >> Anyone with an aircraft carrier vehicle is wasting oil way above and
> >> beyond what they and others might be wasting on "convenience".
> >>
> >> Also not everyone "happily buys products in excessive packaging". We take
> >> reusable bags to the store so we aren't wasting plastic and often buy
> >> products at smaller merchants and farm markets etc where minimal or no
> >> packaging is used. I am quite sure we are not the only ones.
> >
> >
> > I never said "everyone". I'm focused right now on Om's hypocrisy. She points
> > to passenger tanks as wasteful, but chooses to buy products with excessive
> > packaging. And, it doesn't really matter if the stuff is recycled. It still
> > uses energy to make that happen.
> >
> >
> You are missing my point. Suppose family "A" and family "B" are
> identical in every way (including buying overpackaged items)except
> family "A" has his & hers personal aircraft carriers in the driveway and
> family "B" has normal cars. Which one is more wasteful?

Insufficient information. Annual mileage / use of vehicle required for a
relevant answer.

"Pete C." > wrote in message
...
> George wrote:
>>
>> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>> > "George" > wrote in message
>> > . ..
>> >> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>> >>
>> >>> So, they use too much oil. So do you. You happily buy products in
>> >>> excessive packaging. Might be made from recycled plastic, might not.
>> >>> You
>> >>> don't care, though, as long as it's convenient for you.
>> >> Anyone with an aircraft carrier vehicle is wasting oil way above and
>> >> beyond what they and others might be wasting on "convenience".
>> >>
>> >> Also not everyone "happily buys products in excessive packaging". We
>> >> take
>> >> reusable bags to the store so we aren't wasting plastic and often buy
>> >> products at smaller merchants and farm markets etc where minimal or no
>> >> packaging is used. I am quite sure we are not the only ones.
>> >
>> >
>> > I never said "everyone". I'm focused right now on Om's hypocrisy. She
>> > points
>> > to passenger tanks as wasteful, but chooses to buy products with
>> > excessive
>> > packaging. And, it doesn't really matter if the stuff is recycled. It
>> > still
>> > uses energy to make that happen.
>> >
>> >
>> You are missing my point. Suppose family "A" and family "B" are
>> identical in every way (including buying overpackaged items)except
>> family "A" has his & hers personal aircraft carriers in the driveway and
>> family "B" has normal cars. Which one is more wasteful?
>
> Insufficient information. Annual mileage / use of vehicle required for a
> relevant answer.

I assumed family A had a couple of Escalades and family B had something like
a couple of Corollas. You don't need gas mileage data to take it from there.
The only Corolla that gets 12 mpg (like an Escalade) is a broken Corolla.

"Pete C." > wrote in message
...
> Omelet wrote:
>>
>> In article >,
>> George > wrote:
>>
>> > Omelet wrote:
>> > > In article >,
>> > > "Pete C." > wrote:
>> > >
>> > >>> My house is all electric. On purpose...
>> > >> It's not a big deal really, when you have an oil bill for heating
>> > >> you
>> > >> have a low electric bill. Spend $100 on oil instead of electricity,
>> > >> it
>> > >> mostly balances. Of course in the summer you're using electric for
>> > >> A/C,
>> > >> but you are using little or no oil during those months.
>> > >
>> > > LP keeps going up every year. I know people with tanks that are
>> > > seriously hurting in the winter. So much so that the heat gets shut
>> > > off
>> > > and they use space heaters.
>> > >
>> > > And convert over to electric stoves.
>> >
>> > Everyone has to do their part to keep all of those fashion statement
>> > SUVs running...
>>
>> <lol>
>>
>> And the Hummers... (been seeing more of those lately, makes me Ill!)
>
> Those are the "H3"s, nothing more than the equivalent of a Jeep Liberty
> (leprosy) with a stupid body on it.

leprosy ROFL! Sounds like that came from the same book as my former boss'
term for his car: BM Trouble You

JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>
> "Pete C." > wrote in message
> ...
> > George wrote:
> >>
> >> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
> >> > "George" > wrote in message
> >> > . ..
> >> >> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >>> So, they use too much oil. So do you. You happily buy products in
> >> >>> excessive packaging. Might be made from recycled plastic, might not.
> >> >>> You
> >> >>> don't care, though, as long as it's convenient for you.
> >> >> Anyone with an aircraft carrier vehicle is wasting oil way above and
> >> >> beyond what they and others might be wasting on "convenience".
> >> >>
> >> >> Also not everyone "happily buys products in excessive packaging". We
> >> >> take
> >> >> reusable bags to the store so we aren't wasting plastic and often buy
> >> >> products at smaller merchants and farm markets etc where minimal or no
> >> >> packaging is used. I am quite sure we are not the only ones.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > I never said "everyone". I'm focused right now on Om's hypocrisy. She
> >> > points
> >> > to passenger tanks as wasteful, but chooses to buy products with
> >> > excessive
> >> > packaging. And, it doesn't really matter if the stuff is recycled. It
> >> > still
> >> > uses energy to make that happen.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> You are missing my point. Suppose family "A" and family "B" are
> >> identical in every way (including buying overpackaged items)except
> >> family "A" has his & hers personal aircraft carriers in the driveway and
> >> family "B" has normal cars. Which one is more wasteful?
> >
> > Insufficient information. Annual mileage / use of vehicle required for a
> > relevant answer.
>
> I assumed family A had a couple of Escalades and family B had something like
> a couple of Corollas. You don't need gas mileage data to take it from there.
> The only Corolla that gets 12 mpg (like an Escalade) is a broken Corolla.

Family A Parent(s) work(s) from home, does the homestead thing (no
grocery shopping), home school the kids and only leave the enclave once
a week to go to church.

Family B Parents both work, 15 mile and 20 mile commutes, grocery shop
three times a week at the store 8 miles away because they aren't
organized, drive kids to school, sports, etc., older kids drive all over
the place to see friends.

Not good to make assumptions...

"Pete C." > wrote in message
...
> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>>
>> "Pete C." > wrote in message
>> ...
>> > George wrote:
>> >>
>> >> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>> >> > "George" > wrote in message
>> >> > . ..
>> >> >> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >>> So, they use too much oil. So do you. You happily buy products in
>> >> >>> excessive packaging. Might be made from recycled plastic, might
>> >> >>> not.
>> >> >>> You
>> >> >>> don't care, though, as long as it's convenient for you.
>> >> >> Anyone with an aircraft carrier vehicle is wasting oil way above
>> >> >> and
>> >> >> beyond what they and others might be wasting on "convenience".
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Also not everyone "happily buys products in excessive packaging".
>> >> >> We
>> >> >> take
>> >> >> reusable bags to the store so we aren't wasting plastic and often
>> >> >> buy
>> >> >> products at smaller merchants and farm markets etc where minimal or
>> >> >> no
>> >> >> packaging is used. I am quite sure we are not the only ones.
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > I never said "everyone". I'm focused right now on Om's hypocrisy.
>> >> > She
>> >> > points
>> >> > to passenger tanks as wasteful, but chooses to buy products with
>> >> > excessive
>> >> > packaging. And, it doesn't really matter if the stuff is recycled.
>> >> > It
>> >> > still
>> >> > uses energy to make that happen.
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> You are missing my point. Suppose family "A" and family "B" are
>> >> identical in every way (including buying overpackaged items)except
>> >> family "A" has his & hers personal aircraft carriers in the driveway
>> >> and
>> >> family "B" has normal cars. Which one is more wasteful?
>> >
>> > Insufficient information. Annual mileage / use of vehicle required for
>> > a
>> > relevant answer.
>>
>> I assumed family A had a couple of Escalades and family B had something
>> like
>> a couple of Corollas. You don't need gas mileage data to take it from
>> there.
>> The only Corolla that gets 12 mpg (like an Escalade) is a broken Corolla.
>
> Family A Parent(s) work(s) from home, does the homestead thing (no
> grocery shopping), home school the kids and only leave the enclave once
> a week to go to church.
>
> Family B Parents both work, 15 mile and 20 mile commutes, grocery shop
> three times a week at the store 8 miles away because they aren't
> organized, drive kids to school, sports, etc., older kids drive all over
> the place to see friends.
>
> Not good to make assumptions...

Everyone else observing this discussion assumed "all else being equal". Not
you, though.

JoeSpareBedroom wrote:

>>
>> Not good to make assumptions...
>
> Everyone else observing this discussion assumed "all else being equal". Not
> you, though.
>
>
No assumption needed. I specifically stated:

"Suppose family "A" and family "B" are identical in every way (including
buying overpackaged items)except..."

George wrote:
>
> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>
> >>
> >> Not good to make assumptions...
> >
> > Everyone else observing this discussion assumed "all else being equal". Not
> > you, though.
> >
> >
> No assumption needed. I specifically stated:
>
> "Suppose family "A" and family "B" are identical in every way (including
> buying overpackaged items)except..."

The problem is, everybody is different. People who give those who are
driving larger vehicles the "wasteful" line simply have no bases for
that claim.

"Pete C." > wrote in message
...
> George wrote:
>>
>> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>>
>> >>
>> >> Not good to make assumptions...
>> >
>> > Everyone else observing this discussion assumed "all else being equal".
>> > Not
>> > you, though.
>> >
>> >
>> No assumption needed. I specifically stated:
>>
>> "Suppose family "A" and family "B" are identical in every way (including
>> buying overpackaged items)except..."
>
> The problem is, everybody is different. People who give those who are
> driving larger vehicles the "wasteful" line simply have no bases for
> that claim.


As George just taught you in his last message, this thought experiment was
set up with both families being IDENTICAL IN EVERY WAY. Your input has no
meaning. Sit down. Be quiet.

> You wear steak and kidney pies????

Yes, on my hips or so it seems. :^)

--

Regards,
Robert L Bass

=============================>
Bass Home Electronics
941-925-8650
4883 Fallcrest Circle
Sarasota · Florida · 34233
http://www.bassburglaralarms.com
=============================>

"Robert L Bass" > wrote in message
news:mD5Bi.6797$Yg.1016@trnddc02...
>> You wear steak and kidney pies????
>
> Yes, on my hips or so it seems. :^)

Hehe IKWYM ))

In article >,
"Pete C." > wrote:

> Omelet wrote:
> >
> > In article >,
> > "Pete C." > wrote:
> >
> > > > Entrance on private property. I could not keep out spelunkers tho'.
> > > > They are generally respectful tho' so that is cool.
> > > >
> > > > It's still a pipe dream at the moment. ;-)
> > >
> > > A lot of work to drill an entrance into a cave, not the least of which
> > > is locating the surface point above the cave.
> >
> > It would take some research and I'd want it drilled at a 45 degree angle
> > or so to make stairs more practical.
>
> Have you considered just how big the drill would have to be to allow for
> stairs? Think along the lines of 5'+ at least which would cost a fortune
> to drill.

I know. That's why I call it a "pipe dream". ;-)

The manager I worked for at Inner Space Caverns 25 years ago bragged
about how he used a lot of "wetback" labor to clear the cave for
tourists.

<sigh>

>
> >
> > > > > Make a nice root cellar.
> > > >
> > > > No kidding!
> > > > Caverns here tend to be a bit damp tho.
> > > > Shallower ones are dryer.
> > >
> > > The one I was at in NB certainly was wet, another couple a fair distance
> > > to the west were quite dry.
> >
> > Natural Bridge is a deeper cave than Wonder World.
>
> Not Natural Bridge, a non-public cave in the New Braunfels area.

Very cool. One of the bat caves?


> > Hm. More research needed.... but the local explored map of WW cave is
> > posted. I think I could see about where it runs since I'm not that far
> > away.
>
> http://www.caves.org/

Ok, but it's posted on the wall at the gift shop and it's currently open
for tourists.

>
> >
> > I might simply be SOL.
>
> Could be.

But it would be so very cool... in more ways than one! <g>
--
Peace, Om

Remove _ to validate e-mails.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a Son of a bitch" -- Jack Nicholson

In article >,
"Pete C." > wrote:

> Omelet wrote:
> >
> > In article >,
> > George > wrote:
> >
> > > Omelet wrote:
> > > > In article >,
> > > > "Pete C." > wrote:
> > > >
> > > >>> My house is all electric. On purpose...
> > > >> It's not a big deal really, when you have an oil bill for heating you
> > > >> have a low electric bill. Spend $100 on oil instead of electricity, it
> > > >> mostly balances. Of course in the summer you're using electric for A/C,
> > > >> but you are using little or no oil during those months.
> > > >
> > > > LP keeps going up every year. I know people with tanks that are
> > > > seriously hurting in the winter. So much so that the heat gets shut off
> > > > and they use space heaters.
> > > >
> > > > And convert over to electric stoves.
> > >
> > > Everyone has to do their part to keep all of those fashion statement
> > > SUVs running...
> >
> > <lol>
> >
> > And the Hummers... (been seeing more of those lately, makes me Ill!)
>
> Those are the "H3"s, nothing more than the equivalent of a Jeep Liberty
> (leprosy) with a stupid body on it.

And they get really bad mileage...
--
Peace, Om

Remove _ to validate e-mails.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a Son of a bitch" -- Jack Nicholson

On Tue, 28 Aug 2007 13:58:42 GMT, "JoeSpareBedroom"
> wrote:

>"George" > wrote in message
...
>> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> So, they use too much oil. So do you. You happily buy products in
>>> excessive packaging. Might be made from recycled plastic, might not. You
>>> don't care, though, as long as it's convenient for you.
>> Anyone with an aircraft carrier vehicle is wasting oil way above and
>> beyond what they and others might be wasting on "convenience".
>>
>> Also not everyone "happily buys products in excessive packaging". We take
>> reusable bags to the store so we aren't wasting plastic and often buy
>> products at smaller merchants and farm markets etc where minimal or no
>> packaging is used. I am quite sure we are not the only ones.
>
>
>I never said "everyone". I'm focused right now on Om's hypocrisy. She points
>to passenger tanks as wasteful, but chooses to buy products with excessive
>packaging. And, it doesn't really matter if the stuff is recycled. It still
>uses energy to make that happen.
>
how many thousand packages of butter leaf lettuce equal a hummer?
jesus.

your pal,
blake

In article >,
blake murphy > wrote:

> On Tue, 28 Aug 2007 13:58:42 GMT, "JoeSpareBedroom"
> > wrote:
>
> >"George" > wrote in message
> ...
> >> JoeSpareBedroom wrote:
> >>
> >>>
> >>> So, they use too much oil. So do you. You happily buy products in
> >>> excessive packaging. Might be made from recycled plastic, might not. You
> >>> don't care, though, as long as it's convenient for you.
> >> Anyone with an aircraft carrier vehicle is wasting oil way above and
> >> beyond what they and others might be wasting on "convenience".
> >>
> >> Also not everyone "happily buys products in excessive packaging". We take
> >> reusable bags to the store so we aren't wasting plastic and often buy
> >> products at smaller merchants and farm markets etc where minimal or no
> >> packaging is used. I am quite sure we are not the only ones.
> >
> >
> >I never said "everyone". I'm focused right now on Om's hypocrisy. She points
> >to passenger tanks as wasteful, but chooses to buy products with excessive
> >packaging. And, it doesn't really matter if the stuff is recycled. It still
> >uses energy to make that happen.
> >
> how many thousand packages of butter leaf lettuce equal a hummer?
> jesus.
>
> your pal,
> blake

;-)

He's having a bad case of male PMS.

It IS a full moon...

http://www.buttsacrossamerica.com/
--
Peace, Om

Remove _ to validate e-mails.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a Son of a bitch" -- Jack Nicholson