nospam wrote:

> "Greed" as you call it runs the world. Without you would never have
> another drug developed nor promoted. You would have little interest in
> anything that smacks of R&D.

I thought that christianity talked about sharing, caring and helping
others. You characterize a desire to make a living as greed. You
debase the currency of ethics and morality by attributing the
impulsion to engage in commerce as mere greed. It is abundantly clear
that you know virtually nothing about business. Drug companies aren't
filled with grasping Scrooges looking to make another killing. R&D
isn't only about greedy money-making. Look at vaccines. Look at the
genome project. Look at NASA and NIH research.

> Greed makes the world go round and every Republican understands that and
> that is why we are compassionate conservatives

This makes even less sense that the normal nonsense you're posting.
You're greedy so that makes you compassionate? Those two concepts are
mutually exclusive.

> unlike the disgusting
> liberals who promote greed that lines only their pockets and projects.

You know, I don't think of myself as a liberal or a conservative, but
this is just crap. If you look at the last 20 years of what business
people have been indicted and jailed, who've run Enron, Worldcom,
Adelphia, the brokerage houses and mutual funds that have been shown
to be involved in criminal activity, how many liberals do you count?
These guys were and are all heavy contributors to republican causes.
Go back and look at the savings and loan debacle. Charles Keating and
his friends who cost the American public hundreds of billion of
dollars. Look at the airlines and phone companies that were
deregulated and have ended up costing the public vast, vast sums of
money.

> As Republicans we promote GOD, Family, Morality and Patriotism.

So I guess Limbaugh's felonious drug purchases fall in there
somewhere, right. What was he promoting with oxycontin? He has
regularly denigrated drug addicts. Oh, look...

> You
> will find all satanic liberals are just the opposite.

It actually sounds like you promote hatred, discrimination, ignorance
and a smug sense of superiority. It also sounds like you haven't even
a distant clue what "liberal" actually means in American politics.
Might be interesting to note that the founding fathers who guaranteed
rights to people were liberal by the standards of their day. Can't
forget Lincoln who enacted social programs. Teddy Roosevelt and his
setting aside millions of acres of commercially useful lands as
national parks. Kennedy and his tax cuts.

If you leave the definition of liberal to Hannity, Limbaugh, Savage,
Boortz and the other extremists who talk the talk but don't walk the
walk, it essentially amounts to anybody that doesn't agree with them.
Not a one has held public office. Not a one has had to balance a
budget or plan an administration. They're collectively a bunch of
spectators who take shots from the sideline. Talkers, whiners, victims
of the evil liberals who haven't been in control of the congress for
more than a decade, and, finally, do-nothings who merely talk. That's
all they do: talk.

I bet you don't like blacks, Italians and cripples, either. Drains on
the public treasury, don't you know. Do you plan on cashing your
social security checks? Liberal program, you know. How about Medicare
and the prescription program? Gonna take advantage of it?

> We must get rid of, root out everyone of them. Listen to Sean Hannity
> and hear the real stories of what dreck liberals are.

It's very easy to pin a label on people and demonize them. Very simple
to put your fingers in your ears, chant la-la-la-la-la and make sure
you don't hear anything of what other have to say. It's the cowardly
way. It's the way of the fanatic and the unquestioning True Believer
who doesn't need any new information because they already know
everything.

Shame on you for your uncharitable ways. Shame on you for your
self-satisfaction. Shame on you for believeing that you have an
exclusive grasp on truth. Shame on you for your, fanatical unchristian
hatreds.

Pastorio


> Peanutjake wrote:
>
>> "mike gray, CID" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>
>>> Peanutjake wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> "nospam" > wrote in message
>>>> nk.net...
>>>>
>>>>> It is an important war that sets precedent for what America will do to
>>>>> those who attack it.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> You sound like one of those right-wing conservative nazi fascists I
>>>> keep hearing about.
>>>>
>>>> Shame on you.
>>>
>>>
>>> You sound like one of those left-wing liberal populist anarchists I keep
>>> hearing about.
>>
>>
>>
>> Left-wing liberal populist, yes.
>>
>> Anarchist, No.
>>
>> The Anarchists of the past are called Libertarians today.
>>
>> I am in favor of helping people.
>> I am against greed.
>> PJ
>>
>>
>>
>>
>

nospam wrote:

> Ever hear of 9/11? Did you hear Atty General Ashcraft speak today and
> the First 4 Square Church is Washington? He explained how it is all
> tied in and how the Iraqui and Iranis are all behind these attacks and
> he said there will more attacks at any time.

I bet he showed the same charts that Powell used at the UN when they
showed all the weapons of mass destruction we're gonna find any day
now. No one has found any proof of his assertions. None. Period.

This is the same uptight Ashcroft who had an $8000 drape put over the
naked aluminum breast of the sculpture of the female "Justice" in the
justice department. Somehow that's "dirty" to this man.

> We need to be armed and wear the WHOLE ARMOR OF GOD to be protected.
> Thank God we have a Christian President to lead us and not a horrible
> sinner like the last one.

I don't want to go to your church and I don't have to. That's
democracy. Not what's going on in Iraq.



> Mary Belle,
> Bistoury's mom house sitting and setting it straight.
>
> wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 22 Nov 2003 23:55:52 GMT, nospam >
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>> These people have been put in their place and now will not attack
>>> America again.
>>
>>
>>
>> Wow. You really are an idiot. When did anyone from Iraq "attack" the
>> US?
>>
>> (answer for the clueless: never)
>
>

"Bob Pastorio" > wrote

> I hate to point out the fact that it was American bombs that despoiled
> the country. Hussein didn't blow up the power plants, water plants,
> roads, bridges, private homes and public facilities

My question is
Are we supposed to restore the infrastructure of Iraq to the way it was before we started this war?

Or are we supposed to restore the infrastructure of Iraq to the way it was before the war 10 years
ago?

Or are we supposed to restore the infrastructure of Iraq to the way it was before Saddam came into
power?

Or are we supposed to bring the infrastructure of Iraq into the twenty-first century?

PJ

nospam wrote:

> Obviously you should plan for your own future and not lean on others to
> pay your rent, cars, medical or any other debts you might have.
> Self reliance is what you need.

Good of you to tell everyone how to live. Funny thing that the bible
says otherwise. That we should nurture each other and help with
corporal acts of mercy and charity.

That's the christian bible, apparently that part was left out of your
"compassionate conservative" bible.

> You sound like a real true un patriotic liberal.

Because...?

Pointing out the enormous holes in your posts is hardly unpatriotic.

> We have a great president and we will again elect him and not let the
> liberals get hold again of any part of the government.

The liberals haven't had any part of the government since Reagan. Oh,
except for the 8 years that the economy grew, the budget was balanced
and the national debt was paid down.

Now that we have the largest budget deficit in our history, I'm sure
you're proud of the wonderful changes that this administration has made.

Learn some history from a book that doesn't come with crayons.

Pastorio

> Mary Belle
>
> MuscleMan wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 22 Nov 2003 20:08:47 GMT, nospam >
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>> It is an important war that sets precedent for what America will do
>>> to those who attack it.
>>
>> Iraq did not attack the US, ever, nor at any time. Dang, when you
>> discipline your kids, do you put the neighbors' kids i ntime out to
>> teach yours a lesso nwhen your mess up?
>>
>>> We have now given to them the right and money to have a wonderful
>>> medical system that will be based on ours and they will be entitled
>>> to all the very same access to hospital and medical care as we do.
>>
>> No, I live here i nthe US andhave n omedical care. I work full time.
>> The Iraqi people will have free medical care. No medical care and free
>> medical care are not the same.
>>
>>> Afterall, We set the standards in medicine and all medical care.
>>
>> Actually, Canada does. That's the natio nmost civilized societies try
>> to model themselves after.
>>
>> We're a lot like a banana republic, we just have more people.
>
>>> This man is a chosen man who will lead us into a far better world
>>> than any of us have known.
>>
>> He wasn't chosen, he lost the election. He will lead us into a worl
>> we've never known though-unemployment like we've never known, more
>> hungry than we've ever known.

nospam wrote:

> It is the right of our President Bush to give the support he needs as he
> leads these Crusades against the evildoers. To even question why he
> does anything is the most unpatriotic acts around.

Excuse me...? The founding fathers very specifically put in an
amendment to the constitution that said we have the right to take the
government away for any administration that doesn't do what it should.
That's why we have the vote. That's why we have checks and balances in
our form of government.

You sound like a nazi or a Baathist. Bushland uber alles.

> Why don't you find a commie coutry you would like to live in.

There aren't any left. Know why...?

Because people wanted to be able to participate in their governments.
They wanted to be able to affect how it worked and what it did. That's
democracy. Not silence when the government works.

Were you silent when Clinton was president? Didn't think so. So you
get rights the rest of us don't? That how you see democracy? Not a chance.

Pastorio

> Mary Belle
>
> MuscleMan wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 22 Nov 2003 15:02:50 -0500, Ronnie Ruff
>> > wrote:
>>
>>
>>> On Sat, 22 Nov 2003 19:58:19 +0000, nospam wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> It is my understanding that this group is a great supporter in the
>>>> US for
>>>> the rights of the elderly seniors. They have and are promoting a
>>>> wonderful
>>>> new Medicare bill that will enhance the access to pharamceuticals
>>>> for them
>>>> at a lesser cost. It is also our understanding that those with
>>>> minimal
>>>> income will have all the medications they require at no cost at all. We
>>>> should appreciate all that President Bush has done for those in lesser
>>>> circumstances in the US.
>>>
>>>
>>> What a load of crap. Bush has done nothing for US seniors except kill
>>> their granchildren by sending them off to fight a needless war.
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> If instead of telling other people how to run their country he gave
>> that 87 billion to us, we'd have an extra 34 million per county i nthe
>> US to spend. Imagine, we'd have absolutely excellent infrastructure,
>> not to mention paid for meds.
>>
>> Bush is a loser. Let him try to reclaim the oil companies' lost oil
>> rigs and etc. with his own money.
>>
>>
>>
>

nospam wrote:

> I am a patriotic supporter of our God given President

You are insane. "God given president..."

> and as with most
> all of those who are patriots in The United States we fully support him
> in all his acts and don't question his reasons. Afterall he knows all
> the problems and we don't know any of it.

HOw stupid are your friends and family, then. They're too stupid to
analyze the workings of a human being. Too stupid to evaluate the
obvious and too stupid to make sincere judgements.

This is a pitiful statement of what a sheep you are. Follow the leader
and think not a thought. Nothing could be wrong (they're perfect
people who are in Washington) and ever has it been thus. UNless they
were democrats.

> Not only are you the dumb one but another liberal non-patriot scum and
> should be sent to another country.

This is your version of democracy? Deport those who don't agree with
you? How about when the democrats are elected and they want to send
you away? That ok too?

What a crippled vision you have of this "great experiment." I bet you
never heard of that, either, right?

Pastorio


> Mary Belle A patriot and supporter of Our Wonderful George Bush
> President now and another Four.
> Close the gates to the liberals
>
> wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 22 Nov 2003 19:58:19 GMT, nospam >
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>> We should appreciate all that President Bush has done for those in
>>> lesser circumstances in the US.
>>
>>
>>
>> Are you ****ing nuts? Delusional? Or just dumb as a box of rocks?
>
>

nospam wrote:

> Obviously this is how you deal with those who oppose your opinions.

<LOL>

You're the one who wants to *deport* people who don't agree with you.
You're the one who wants to send people to "commie" countries.

And you're upset when somebody hands you back the kind of crap you
spread? That's too funny. You're a hoot...

> We
> who are the true Americans and Christians will be heard even though your
> kind attempts to stiffle us and shut down our chruches and take away our
> religious rights.

Nothing worse than somebody trying to stiffle you. Almost as bad as to
stifle them. Please note that no one here has attempted to stifle you.
Please not that no one has tried to shut down your church. Note that
no one has tried to take away your religious rights.

You posted your ugliness and ignorance in a public forum and people
have replied to you. That's the democratic way. You're free to post
what you want. They're free to post what they want.

I especially like it when you "true Americans and Christians" whine
and whimper about being victimized by the national minority. Those
nasty liberals have taken control of the legal system and the congress
and are victimizing us. We must fight every day with all our might.

Lessee, congress is controlled by republicans. The president and
cabinet are republicans. The supreme court is essentially republican.
There are more republican governors than democrats. As of this point,
there are more registered republicans than democrats nationally. More
republicans were elected to offices in the last election at the
beginning of November.

If anybody is taking your rights away, it's the people in power. Who
are they...? Right. Republicans. Either that, or those republicans
with the power of office don't know how to use it to protect the citizens.

> I urge you to read David Limbaugh's new book about the liberals taking
> away the rights of Christians.

Funny thing about that. Most clergy are liberals. They don't generally
do that "greed" thing that you "compassionate conservatives" are so
fond of. They get into it because of their faith, irrespective of
denomination. All of the great religions are about goodness and mercy
and charity. Those abstract principles that have nothing to do with
"greed." Except for the folks, male and female, that have those slick
hairdos and expensive suits on tv. They're greedy. And they usually
run for office on conservative tickets.

The country is being run by christians right now. Whine to them. You
poor persecuted majority. Whine, whine...

Victims, victims...

Poor us, poor us...

Go say that stuff around the bottom of my rose bushes. That'll help
them grow tall and healthy.

Pastorio


> Mary Belle
>
> Priscilla Ballou wrote:
>
>> In article k.net>,
>> nospam > wrote:
>>
>>
>>> I am a patriotic supporter of our God given President and as with
>>> most all of those who are patriots in The United States we fully
>>> support him in all his acts and don't question his reasons. Afterall
>>> he knows all the problems and we don't know any of it.
>>> Not only are you the dumb one but another liberal non-patriot scum
>>> and should be sent to another country.
>>> Mary Belle A patriot and supporter of Our Wonderful George Bush
>>> President now and another Four.
>>> Close the gates to the liberals
>>
>>
>>
>> Oh, you're the same right wing idiot who's been posting in religious
>> newsgroups.
>>
>> I'm beginning to suspect you're actually a troll. No-one could be as
>> much of a stereotype as you present yourself to be. Or as stupid.
>>
>> Priscilla
>
>

>
> Wow. You really are an idiot. When did anyone from Iraq "attack" the
> US?
>
> (answer for the clueless: never)


No one from Nazi Germany ever attacked us, either.

And we only declared war on them when the Japanese attacked.

And if ya don't understand, ya really are an idiot.

"mike gray" > wrote in message
...
>
> >
> > Wow. You really are an idiot. When did anyone from Iraq "attack" the
> > US?
> >
> > (answer for the clueless: never)
>
>
> No one from Nazi Germany ever attacked us, either.
>
> And we only declared war on them when the Japanese attacked.
>
> And if ya don't understand, ya really are an idiot.
>

You got your history wrong mike.

Germany and Italy declared war on the U.S. a few days after Japan attacked Pearl Harbor.

PJ

On Wed, 03 Dec 2003 00:07:51 GMT, mike gray >
wrote:

>
>>
>> Wow. You really are an idiot. When did anyone from Iraq "attack" the
>> US?
>>
>> (answer for the clueless: never)
>
>
>No one from Nazi Germany ever attacked us, either.
>
>And we only declared war on them when the Japanese attacked.
>
>And if ya don't understand, ya really are an idiot.


when we went to war with Germany we weren't lied too.

Mack
Type 1 since 1975
http://www.alt-support-diabetes.org
http://www.insulin-pumpers.org

In tribute to the United States of America and the State
of Israel, two bastions of strength in a world filled with strife and
terrorism.

Peanutjake wrote:
> "mike gray" > wrote in message
> ...
>>
>> >
>> > Wow. You really are an idiot. When did anyone from Iraq "attack" the
>> > US?
>> >
>> > (answer for the clueless: never)
>>
>>
>> No one from Nazi Germany ever attacked us, either.
>>
>> And we only declared war on them when the Japanese attacked.
>>
>> And if ya don't understand, ya really are an idiot.
>>
>
> You got your history wrong mike.
>
> Germany and Italy declared war on the U.S. a few days after Japan attacked Pearl Harbor.
>

This thread (like most here) deals only with over-simplifications.

When one delves into the complications of war, rash statements like
"Iraq never attacked the US" become a bit blurry.

On 12/5/41 Zhukov began his counteroffensive. On 12/7, Japan attacked a
US possession. On 12/8, the US and Britain declared war on Japan,
forming an alliance with the Chinese and the Russians including material
support of Zhukov. Only then did the Japanese declare war on the US. As
the US was now allied with the Russians who were counterattacking the
Germans, Germany and Italy went through the formality of declaring war
on the US on 12/11.

Iraq has been a long time and strong supporter of Wahabism, which aims
to overthrow all middle-eastern states, many of which are allies of the
US. The Wahabis have attacked the US directly on at least fifteen
occasions, and have attacked our allies a hundred times. When we look
back at this nascent middle east war, 50 years from now, the alliances
made will be as strange as the alliances we made in 41 and 42. Remember
our good friend Stalin and our enemy, the Italians? In war, our enemy's
friends are our enemies. That's why we are in Iraq and why we are
forcing states like Iran and Jordan to choose sides before the real
fighting starts. The game has not yet begun, we are now just choosing up
sides.

And to keep it on topic, thanks to Bush for finally delivering the drug
benefit that the Democrats have been promising for decades. Now the Dems
are scrambling to find a new promise to suck in the hopeful vote. A
chicken in every pot sounds good....

"mike gray" > wrote in message
...
> Peanutjake wrote:
> > "mike gray" > wrote in message
> > ...
> >>
> >> >
> >> > Wow. You really are an idiot. When did anyone from Iraq "attack" the
> >> > US?
> >> >
> >> > (answer for the clueless: never)
> >>
> >>
> >> No one from Nazi Germany ever attacked us, either.
> >>
> >> And we only declared war on them when the Japanese attacked.
> >>
> >> And if ya don't understand, ya really are an idiot.
> >>
> >
> > You got your history wrong mike.
> >
> > Germany and Italy declared war on the U.S. a few days after Japan attacked Pearl Harbor.
> >
>
> This thread (like most here) deals only with over-simplifications.
>
> When one delves into the complications of war, rash statements like
> "Iraq never attacked the US" become a bit blurry.
>
> On 12/5/41 Zhukov began his counteroffensive. On 12/7, Japan attacked a
> US possession. On 12/8, the US and Britain declared war on Japan,
> forming an alliance with the Chinese and the Russians including material
> support of Zhukov. Only then did the Japanese declare war on the US. As
> the US was now allied with the Russians who were counterattacking the
> Germans, Germany and Italy went through the formality of declaring war
> on the US on 12/11.
>
> Iraq has been a long time and strong supporter of Wahabism, which aims
> to overthrow all middle-eastern states, many of which are allies of the
> US. The Wahabis have attacked the US directly on at least fifteen
> occasions, and have attacked our allies a hundred times.

You've got it wrong again, Mike

The center of Wahabism in Saudi Arabia.
The government of Iraq was a secular one.

Iraq had freedom of religion in its constitution unlike Saudi Arabia where christian missionaries
are put in jail.

Bush is a murderer.

PJ

Peanutjake wrote:

> You've got it wrong again, Mike
>
> The center of Wahabism in Saudi Arabia.

And the center of Christianity is in Palestine. So what?

> The government of Iraq was a secular one.

Never said it wasn't. But the secular government of Iraq was a strong
supporter of Wahabism, financially and otherwise.

> Iraq had freedom of religion in its constitution unlike Saudi Arabia where christian missionaries
> are put in jail.

Christians are not put in jail in Saudi Arabia except when they
proselytize. Same as in the US. And Iraq was a dictatorship (a
constitutional dictatorship?).

> Bush is a murderer.

Whatever. That keeps it simple enough for the mantra-driven.

"mike gray, CID" > wrote in message
...

<snip>

> Christians are not put in jail in Saudi Arabia except when they
> proselytize. Same as in the US. And Iraq was a dictatorship (a
> constitutional dictatorship?).

<snip>

Same as in the US? Proselytizing is not unlawful in the US. Why do you feel
that Christians are not put in jail ... except when they proselytize? I'm just
trying to get the sense of your input.

--
Steve, T2 since 9/29/03

On Wed, 03 Dec 2003 15:26:47 +0000, mike gray wrote:

> And to keep it on topic, thanks to Bush for finally delivering the drug
> benefit that the Democrats have been promising for decades. Now the Dems
> are scrambling to find a new promise to suck in the hopeful vote. A
> chicken in every pot sounds good....

Like you said look deeper.

On Wed, 03 Dec 2003 22:54:41 +0000, mike gray, CID wrote:

>> The center of Wahabism in Saudi Arabia.
>
> And the center of Christianity is in Palestine. So what?

Not currently.. His statement is current, yours the past.