To resurrect an old thread of mine, my press basket is near done and I'm
considering the coating. We discussed varnish vs "salad bowl" finishes with
some sort of consensus on food grade grade finishes although I also get the
feeling that a well dried spar varnish would be OK as well.

Here are the new questions for the group:

- the salad bowl varnishes are an oil or mix of oils clearly marked food
grade that is suppose to dry on, a salad in a bowl is vastly different to
grape juice - does anyone have an opinion on whether it might impart a
flavour to the finished wine?

- my thinking here is that if the oil is a bad decision then I can always
varnish for next year, I think the varnish will go over just about any finish,
thoughts on this one?

Don

"Don S" > wrote in message
om...
> To resurrect an old thread of mine, my press basket is near done and I'm
> considering the coating. We discussed varnish vs "salad bowl" finishes
with
> some sort of consensus on food grade grade finishes although I also get
the
> feeling that a well dried spar varnish would be OK as well.
>
> Here are the new questions for the group:
>
> - the salad bowl varnishes are an oil or mix of oils clearly marked food
> grade that is suppose to dry on, a salad in a bowl is vastly different to
> grape juice - does anyone have an opinion on whether it might impart a
> flavour to the finished wine?

Oils tend to be alcohol soluble. I wouldn't want oil in my wine.

> - my thinking here is that if the oil is a bad decision then I can always
> varnish for next year, I think the varnish will go over just about any
finish,
> thoughts on this one?

Surface preparation for painting or varnishing involves _removing_ oils and
any such contaminants from the surface so that the paint/varnish will stick.
I'd bet you'd find varnish won't stick very well to a surface that had been
oiled - even after sanding - because the oil would have penetrated the wood,
which is quite porous.

IOW, I think you have to decide on a surface treatment now and stick with
it. Just my 2¢ worth.

Tom S

>
> IOW, I think you have to decide on a surface treatment now and stick with
> it. Just my 2¢ worth.

My gut feeling says to go with varnish. I'm worried about the oils which is
why I posted and I get the feeling that a well dried varnish is impervious
not to alcholol but to grape juice. I'd probably wash it with a can of mixed
Welch's juice anyway before starting in any case.

Don

Just off the top of my head but isn't varnish made of denatured alcohol
and varnish flakes? Would it be possible that the fruit might dissolve
the varnish over time?

In my opinion the best finish is no finish at all. Bare wood can take
care of itself as long as you keep it clean. Wood also has some bacteria
fighting qualities. If you're really set on finishing the wood why not
talk to a professional at a paint store. I'm sure there are epoxy type
finishes out there that will work very well.

Andrew

Don S wrote:
>>IOW, I think you have to decide on a surface treatment now and stick with
>>it. Just my 2¢ worth.
>
>
> My gut feeling says to go with varnish. I'm worried about the oils which is
> why I posted and I get the feeling that a well dried varnish is impervious
> not to alcholol but to grape juice. I'd probably wash it with a can of mixed
> Welch's juice anyway before starting in any case.
>
> Don

Just off the top of my head but isn't varnish made of denatured alcohol
and varnish flakes? Would it be possible that the fruit might dissolve
the varnish over time?

In my opinion the best finish is no finish at all. Bare wood can take
care of itself as long as you keep it clean. Wood also has some bacteria
fighting qualities. If you're really set on finishing the wood why not
talk to a professional at a paint store. I'm sure there are epoxy type
finishes out there that will work very well.

Andrew

Don S wrote:
>>IOW, I think you have to decide on a surface treatment now and stick with
>>it. Just my 2¢ worth.
>
>
> My gut feeling says to go with varnish. I'm worried about the oils which is
> why I posted and I get the feeling that a well dried varnish is impervious
> not to alcholol but to grape juice. I'd probably wash it with a can of mixed
> Welch's juice anyway before starting in any case.
>
> Don

Just off the top of my head but isn't varnish made of denatured alcohol
and varnish flakes? Would it be possible that the fruit might dissolve
the varnish over time?

In my opinion the best finish is no finish at all. Bare wood can take
care of itself as long as you keep it clean. Wood also has some bacteria
fighting qualities. If you're really set on finishing the wood why not
talk to a professional at a paint store. I'm sure there are epoxy type
finishes out there that will work very well.

Andrew

Don S wrote:
>>IOW, I think you have to decide on a surface treatment now and stick with
>>it. Just my 2¢ worth.
>
>
> My gut feeling says to go with varnish. I'm worried about the oils which is
> why I posted and I get the feeling that a well dried varnish is impervious
> not to alcholol but to grape juice. I'd probably wash it with a can of mixed
> Welch's juice anyway before starting in any case.
>
> Don

>
> IOW, I think you have to decide on a surface treatment now and stick with
> it. Just my 2¢ worth.

My gut feeling says to go with varnish. I'm worried about the oils which is
why I posted and I get the feeling that a well dried varnish is impervious
not to alcholol but to grape juice. I'd probably wash it with a can of mixed
Welch's juice anyway before starting in any case.

Don

I will be attaching my fresh cut oak to my press basket shortly.

I don't plan on treating it at all.

2-3 times a year it might be used, then stored in the garage.

Doesn't seem to me that much could happen to it.

Why take a chance with contamination.
Why take a chance "sealing" in the water behind the varnish.
Wood finishes don't offer 100% sealing.




(Don S) wrote in message . com>...
> To resurrect an old thread of mine, my press basket is near done and I'm
> considering the coating. We discussed varnish vs "salad bowl" finishes with
> some sort of consensus on food grade grade finishes although I also get the
> feeling that a well dried spar varnish would be OK as well.
>
> Here are the new questions for the group:
>
> - the salad bowl varnishes are an oil or mix of oils clearly marked food
> grade that is suppose to dry on, a salad in a bowl is vastly different to
> grape juice - does anyone have an opinion on whether it might impart a
> flavour to the finished wine?
>
> - my thinking here is that if the oil is a bad decision then I can always
> varnish for next year, I think the varnish will go over just about any finish,
> thoughts on this one?
>
> Don

Pete,
I agree wholeheartedly. Many years ago I put together a press basket in
a hurry, and in a pinch I used untreated pine slats. Zero problems, and
the press & basket are still going strong for a buddy. If you wash the
wood & dry it after using, and store it in a dry location, any
close-pored wood will last indefinitely. I've always marvelled at the
old unpainted, untreated wood on barns etc. which lasts for decades if
allowed to air out. However, I strongly recommend a good scrubbing of
all equipment before ( & after) using.



Mike MTM, Cokesbury, New Jersey, USA

"Pete" > wrote in message
om...
> Why take a chance "sealing" in the water behind the varnish.
> Wood finishes don't offer 100% sealing.

The fact is that a well air-dried piece of wood, sealed with varnish, is
about as good as you can do. If the wood is properly dried, there won't be
moisture trapped under the varnish. Once the varnish is thoroughly dried it
is effectively impervious to ~14% alcohol solution - at least for the time
wine will be in contact with it.

A varnished press is also a heck of a lot easier to clean than one that is
unfinished.

Tom S

> Once the varnish is thoroughly dried it is effectively impervious
> to ~14% alcohol solution - at least for the time wine will be in
> contact with it.

In fact it wouldn't be alcohol but grape juice, alcohol may be a great
solution to dissolve impurities from the varnish in but the grape juice
is only slight acidic.

I'm looking now at my dining room table and it has a clear hard finish
on it - what would that be? And it would be food grade right?

Don

"Don S" > wrote in message
om...
> I'm looking now at my dining room table and it has a clear hard finish
> on it - what would that be? And it would be food grade right?

I don't know about your table, but mine has a marble top coated with
polyurethane. Urethanes are pretty commonly used to finish wood surfaces
these days. As for whether it's food grade, I don't worry about that.

Tom S

Probably not considered food grade.
Probably a poly type finsh.. depends on the age.

Would you see this same finish on a salad bowl?
Something that comes in extended contact with food?


>
> I'm looking now at my dining room table and it has a clear hard finish
> on it - what would that be? And it would be food grade right?
>
> Don

"Don S" > wrote in message
om...
> I'm looking now at my dining room table and it has a clear hard finish
> on it - what would that be? And it would be food grade right?

I don't know about your table, but mine has a marble top coated with
polyurethane. Urethanes are pretty commonly used to finish wood surfaces
these days. As for whether it's food grade, I don't worry about that.

Tom S

Probably not considered food grade.
Probably a poly type finsh.. depends on the age.

Would you see this same finish on a salad bowl?
Something that comes in extended contact with food?


>
> I'm looking now at my dining room table and it has a clear hard finish
> on it - what would that be? And it would be food grade right?
>
> Don

I guess if you can assmume there are no open pores in your varnish "seal".
The porous ends of the slats and any bolt connections could compromise the seal.
Then... you would be sealing in fluid.



"Tom S" > wrote in message .com>...
> "Pete" > wrote in message
> om...
> > Why take a chance "sealing" in the water behind the varnish.
> > Wood finishes don't offer 100% sealing.
>
> The fact is that a well air-dried piece of wood, sealed with varnish, is
> about as good as you can do. If the wood is properly dried, there won't be
> moisture trapped under the varnish. Once the varnish is thoroughly dried it
> is effectively impervious to ~14% alcohol solution - at least for the time
> wine will be in contact with it.
>
> A varnished press is also a heck of a lot easier to clean than one that is
> unfinished.
>
> Tom S

> Once the varnish is thoroughly dried it is effectively impervious
> to ~14% alcohol solution - at least for the time wine will be in
> contact with it.

In fact it wouldn't be alcohol but grape juice, alcohol may be a great
solution to dissolve impurities from the varnish in but the grape juice
is only slight acidic.

I'm looking now at my dining room table and it has a clear hard finish
on it - what would that be? And it would be food grade right?

Don

> Once the varnish is thoroughly dried it is effectively impervious
> to ~14% alcohol solution - at least for the time wine will be in
> contact with it.

In fact it wouldn't be alcohol but grape juice, alcohol may be a great
solution to dissolve impurities from the varnish in but the grape juice
is only slight acidic.

I'm looking now at my dining room table and it has a clear hard finish
on it - what would that be? And it would be food grade right?

Don

I guess if you can assmume there are no open pores in your varnish "seal".
The porous ends of the slats and any bolt connections could compromise the seal.
Then... you would be sealing in fluid.



"Tom S" > wrote in message .com>...
> "Pete" > wrote in message
> om...
> > Why take a chance "sealing" in the water behind the varnish.
> > Wood finishes don't offer 100% sealing.
>
> The fact is that a well air-dried piece of wood, sealed with varnish, is
> about as good as you can do. If the wood is properly dried, there won't be
> moisture trapped under the varnish. Once the varnish is thoroughly dried it
> is effectively impervious to ~14% alcohol solution - at least for the time
> wine will be in contact with it.
>
> A varnished press is also a heck of a lot easier to clean than one that is
> unfinished.
>
> Tom S

"Pete" > wrote in message
om...
> Why take a chance "sealing" in the water behind the varnish.
> Wood finishes don't offer 100% sealing.

The fact is that a well air-dried piece of wood, sealed with varnish, is
about as good as you can do. If the wood is properly dried, there won't be
moisture trapped under the varnish. Once the varnish is thoroughly dried it
is effectively impervious to ~14% alcohol solution - at least for the time
wine will be in contact with it.

A varnished press is also a heck of a lot easier to clean than one that is
unfinished.

Tom S

Not to complicate matters but this issue as been raised before.
If you were to purchase a new press the recommended type of coating would be
food grade paint, as this form would not contaminate the fruit.
Some have indicated that clear or brown tint varnish would be suitable but
as this is oil base this is not recommended, as the varnish gives of surface
contamination
when in contact with what is been placed on it.

Stephen SG


"Don S" > wrote in message
om...
| To resurrect an old thread of mine, my press basket is near done and I'm
| considering the coating. We discussed varnish vs "salad bowl" finishes
with
| some sort of consensus on food grade grade finishes although I also get
the
| feeling that a well dried spar varnish would be OK as well.
|
| Here are the new questions for the group:
|
| - the salad bowl varnishes are an oil or mix of oils clearly marked food
| grade that is suppose to dry on, a salad in a bowl is vastly different to
| grape juice - does anyone have an opinion on whether it might impart a
| flavour to the finished wine?
|
| - my thinking here is that if the oil is a bad decision then I can always
| varnish for next year, I think the varnish will go over just about any
finish,
| thoughts on this one?
|
| Don

>To resurrect an old thread of mine, my press basket is near done and I'm
>considering the coating<<

Hi Don,

I just rebuilt my grandfathers old basket press, and I used maple for the
basket and also for the tray the basket sits in. I do not plan on putting any
coating on it, as I don't think it's neccessary.

I think that any coating that comes in contact with the grapes/juice should be
food grade, such as salad bowl finish. This also can easily be reapplied when
neccessary. But I think the best coating is none!

Just my opinion,
Good luck,
Paul B.

I will be attaching my fresh cut oak to my press basket shortly.

I don't plan on treating it at all.

2-3 times a year it might be used, then stored in the garage.

Doesn't seem to me that much could happen to it.

Why take a chance with contamination.
Why take a chance "sealing" in the water behind the varnish.
Wood finishes don't offer 100% sealing.




(Don S) wrote in message . com>...
> To resurrect an old thread of mine, my press basket is near done and I'm
> considering the coating. We discussed varnish vs "salad bowl" finishes with
> some sort of consensus on food grade grade finishes although I also get the
> feeling that a well dried spar varnish would be OK as well.
>
> Here are the new questions for the group:
>
> - the salad bowl varnishes are an oil or mix of oils clearly marked food
> grade that is suppose to dry on, a salad in a bowl is vastly different to
> grape juice - does anyone have an opinion on whether it might impart a
> flavour to the finished wine?
>
> - my thinking here is that if the oil is a bad decision then I can always
> varnish for next year, I think the varnish will go over just about any finish,
> thoughts on this one?
>
> Don

Not to complicate matters but this issue as been raised before.
If you were to purchase a new press the recommended type of coating would be
food grade paint, as this form would not contaminate the fruit.
Some have indicated that clear or brown tint varnish would be suitable but
as this is oil base this is not recommended, as the varnish gives of surface
contamination
when in contact with what is been placed on it.

Stephen SG


"Don S" > wrote in message
om...
| To resurrect an old thread of mine, my press basket is near done and I'm
| considering the coating. We discussed varnish vs "salad bowl" finishes
with
| some sort of consensus on food grade grade finishes although I also get
the
| feeling that a well dried spar varnish would be OK as well.
|
| Here are the new questions for the group:
|
| - the salad bowl varnishes are an oil or mix of oils clearly marked food
| grade that is suppose to dry on, a salad in a bowl is vastly different to
| grape juice - does anyone have an opinion on whether it might impart a
| flavour to the finished wine?
|
| - my thinking here is that if the oil is a bad decision then I can always
| varnish for next year, I think the varnish will go over just about any
finish,
| thoughts on this one?
|
| Don

Don S wrote:

> To resurrect an old thread of mine, my press basket is near done and I'm
> considering the coating. We discussed varnish vs "salad bowl" finishes with
> some sort of consensus on food grade grade finishes although I also get the
> feeling that a well dried spar varnish would be OK as well.
>
> Here are the new questions for the group:
>
> - the salad bowl varnishes are an oil or mix of oils clearly marked food
> grade that is suppose to dry on, a salad in a bowl is vastly different to
> grape juice - does anyone have an opinion on whether it might impart a
> flavour to the finished wine?
>
> - my thinking here is that if the oil is a bad decision then I can always
> varnish for next year, I think the varnish will go over just about any finish,
> thoughts on this one?
>
> Don


What are you planning to use for the press? A piece of 3/4"-16 or
1"-12 all-thread, or an acme threaded lead screw and bolt, or a
hydraulic jack? Where does one even buy an acme nut?

I'd like to build an apple crusher and a cider press. I have quite a
few board feet of ash and maple lumber that ought to be good for making
the basket, and douglas fir 2x4 should be good enough for the frame if I
reinforce with a little steel at strategic points. (can you tell that I
don't have any measured drawings and plans?)

BTW, if you use oak to make the basket, make sure it is white oak and
not red oak -- white oak is closed grained and red oak has open grain.

Best regards,
Bob

"Don S" > wrote in message
om...
> To resurrect an old thread of mine, my press basket is near done and I'm
> considering the coating. We discussed varnish vs "salad bowl" finishes
with
> some sort of consensus on food grade grade finishes although I also get
the
> feeling that a well dried spar varnish would be OK as well.
>
> Here are the new questions for the group:
>
> - the salad bowl varnishes are an oil or mix of oils clearly marked food
> grade that is suppose to dry on, a salad in a bowl is vastly different to
> grape juice - does anyone have an opinion on whether it might impart a
> flavour to the finished wine?

Oils tend to be alcohol soluble. I wouldn't want oil in my wine.

> - my thinking here is that if the oil is a bad decision then I can always
> varnish for next year, I think the varnish will go over just about any
finish,
> thoughts on this one?

Surface preparation for painting or varnishing involves _removing_ oils and
any such contaminants from the surface so that the paint/varnish will stick.
I'd bet you'd find varnish won't stick very well to a surface that had been
oiled - even after sanding - because the oil would have penetrated the wood,
which is quite porous.

IOW, I think you have to decide on a surface treatment now and stick with
it. Just my 2¢ worth.

Tom S

Not to complicate matters but this issue as been raised before.
If you were to purchase a new press the recommended type of coating would be
food grade paint, as this form would not contaminate the fruit.
Some have indicated that clear or brown tint varnish would be suitable but
as this is oil base this is not recommended, as the varnish gives of surface
contamination
when in contact with what is been placed on it.

Stephen SG


"Don S" > wrote in message
om...
| To resurrect an old thread of mine, my press basket is near done and I'm
| considering the coating. We discussed varnish vs "salad bowl" finishes
with
| some sort of consensus on food grade grade finishes although I also get
the
| feeling that a well dried spar varnish would be OK as well.
|
| Here are the new questions for the group:
|
| - the salad bowl varnishes are an oil or mix of oils clearly marked food
| grade that is suppose to dry on, a salad in a bowl is vastly different to
| grape juice - does anyone have an opinion on whether it might impart a
| flavour to the finished wine?
|
| - my thinking here is that if the oil is a bad decision then I can always
| varnish for next year, I think the varnish will go over just about any
finish,
| thoughts on this one?
|
| Don

>To resurrect an old thread of mine, my press basket is near done and I'm
>considering the coating<<

Hi Don,

I just rebuilt my grandfathers old basket press, and I used maple for the
basket and also for the tray the basket sits in. I do not plan on putting any
coating on it, as I don't think it's neccessary.

I think that any coating that comes in contact with the grapes/juice should be
food grade, such as salad bowl finish. This also can easily be reapplied when
neccessary. But I think the best coating is none!

Just my opinion,
Good luck,
Paul B.