Hello,


The coating on my Le Creuset pots lasted no longer than 2 years’ use. I
have asked about it, but any one I mention it to is incredulous. Of
course, I don’t have them “in hand” when I mention it.



Two pots out of 3 cracked. Two pots’ coating rendered them unusable as
well.



Since the last pot (the largest pot and not cracked) that I have left is
still in my possession after sitting on the top shelf for many years, I
decided to take a few pictures to send to see if anyone has ever seen such a
thing.



I’m just wondering if you could take a look at

http://freepages.family.rootsweb.com...reusetpots.htm



Has this happened to you or anyone you know? 3 out of 3 ain’t bad!



Dee

"Dee Randall" > wrote in
:

> Hello,
>
>
> The coating on my Le Creuset pots lasted no longer than 2 years’ use.
> I have asked about it, but any one I mention it to is incredulous.
> Of course, I don’t have them “in hand” when I mention it.
>
>
>
> Two pots out of 3 cracked. Two pots’ coating rendered them unusable
> as well.
>
>
>
> Since the last pot (the largest pot and not cracked) that I have left
> is still in my possession after sitting on the top shelf for many
> years, I decided to take a few pictures to send to see if anyone has
> ever seen such a thing.
>
>
>
> I’m just wondering if you could take a look at
>
> http://freepages.family.rootsweb.com...milyPage/lecre
> usetpots.htm
>
>
>
> Has this happened to you or anyone you know? 3 out of 3 ain’t bad!
>
>
>
> Dee


Dee, I took a look at your pictures and was horrified at what I saw! I
cannot believe that LeCreuset pots could ever get in this condition.

I purchased 18 pieces of LeCreuset back in 1973-1974 and have used them
consistently since then, only occasionally using other cookware. I have
used them on both gas and electric cooktops, both coil burners and
smoothtop, and all but one of my pots look virtually like the day they
were brought home. I don't use metal utensils, but I do use wood, nylon,
and occasionally rubber spatulas.

As far as cleaning, I soak them in baking soda water if something is
stuck rather than scraping it out. But I never wash them by hand, as
they always go in the dishwasher.

Only one of my pots shows any sign of use or age. It's a 2-quart French
oven. The interior surface has uniformly dulled. In fact, it became
that way within the first year or so of use and has never gotten any
worse. I have no discolorations at all in any of the pots.

From the looks of yours, it may be that you have consistently used too
much heat. Cast iron, either plain or enameled only requires low to
moderate heat and never should be heated on the highest setting. Apart
from that, I can't think of anything you might have done to cause it in
normal use.

At this stage I don't think you can raelly improve the condition of your
pots, but I should think that they could still be used.

Regretfully,
Wayne

Mine are as discoloured as yours but I don't have the scratches. When I
questioned this with the shop I bought them from (I live in Australia) I was
told that it's because I put them in a dishwasher. They gave me one new
saucepan - as a goodwill token, they said. My grandad had the same le
Creuset stuff for 60 years and his looked brand new. I'm happy to make the
trade off in discolouring to put them in the dishwasher. If it came to
handwashing, I'd change saucepans first!

In your place, I'd contact Le Creuset - particularly about the scratching.
I think it's only a matter of time before the rest of the enamel starts
coming off.

Viviane

"Dee Randall" > wrote in message
...
> Hello,
>
>
> The coating on my Le Creuset pots lasted no longer than 2 years' use. I
> have asked about it, but any one I mention it to is incredulous. Of
> course, I don't have them "in hand" when I mention it.
>
>
>
> Two pots out of 3 cracked. Two pots' coating rendered them unusable as
> well.
>
>
>
> Since the last pot (the largest pot and not cracked) that I have left is
> still in my possession after sitting on the top shelf for many years, I
> decided to take a few pictures to send to see if anyone has ever seen such
a
> thing.
>
>
>
> I'm just wondering if you could take a look at
>
>
http://freepages.family.rootsweb.com...reusetpots.htm
>
>
>
> Has this happened to you or anyone you know? 3 out of 3 ain't bad!
>
>
>
> Dee
>
>


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.552 / Virus Database: 344 - Release Date: 15/12/2003

Thanks for your reply.
Mine are not enamel, but the cream-colored sand/glass glaze. I think the
enamel is better.

I wish there were a perfect pot/pan. It seems in my case there is not. I
keep purchasing every new thing that comes on the market, looking for one.
I have purchased my share of vacuum cleaners as well over the years.

I guess the only thing really perfect cooking pan/pot is cast iron, but who
wants to cook tomatoes in cast iron -- I get enough iron without doing that.
Besides re-conditioning them with GREASE when you cook certain things in
them!

Dee










"Viviane" > wrote in message
u...
> Mine are as discoloured as yours but I don't have the scratches. When I
> questioned this with the shop I bought them from (I live in Australia) I
was
> told that it's because I put them in a dishwasher. They gave me one new
> saucepan - as a goodwill token, they said. My grandad had the same le
> Creuset stuff for 60 years and his looked brand new. I'm happy to make
the
> trade off in discolouring to put them in the dishwasher. If it came to
> handwashing, I'd change saucepans first!
>
> In your place, I'd contact Le Creuset - particularly about the scratching.
> I think it's only a matter of time before the rest of the enamel starts
> coming off.
>
> Viviane
>
> "Dee Randall" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Hello,
> >
> >
> > The coating on my Le Creuset pots lasted no longer than 2 years' use. I
> > have asked about it, but any one I mention it to is incredulous. Of
> > course, I don't have them "in hand" when I mention it.
> >
> >
> >
> > Two pots out of 3 cracked. Two pots' coating rendered them unusable as
> > well.
> >
> >
> >
> > Since the last pot (the largest pot and not cracked) that I have left
is
> > still in my possession after sitting on the top shelf for many years, I
> > decided to take a few pictures to send to see if anyone has ever seen
such
> a
> > thing.
> >
> >
> >
> > I'm just wondering if you could take a look at
> >
> >
>
http://freepages.family.rootsweb.com...reusetpots.htm
> >
> >
> >
> > Has this happened to you or anyone you know? 3 out of 3 ain't bad!
> >
> >
> >
> > Dee
> >
> >
>
>
> ---
> Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
> Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
> Version: 6.0.552 / Virus Database: 344 - Release Date: 15/12/2003
>
>

"Dee Randall" > wrote in message
...
> Hello,
>
>
> The coating on my Le Creuset pots lasted no longer than 2 years' use. I
> have asked about it, but any one I mention it to is incredulous. Of
> course, I don't have them "in hand" when I mention it.
>
>
>
>

I'd hate to see what you do to your cast iron pans. My Le Creuset is twenty
plus years old and is discolored but not a crack yet.

We have been cooking with Le Creuset pots (5 French ovens--var. sizes,
buffet server, 3 sauce pans and a beef fondue pot since 1979. With the
exception of some staining they are all in good functional and esthetic
shape: the insides are all intact and reasonably presentable, the outside
enamel is very clean save a few minor chips on the edges (user error). They
have never been in a dishwasher. On a only 2-3 occasions over the last 24
years have I used bleach to remove a stain on the inside. We use
scotchbrite blue (or equivalent) pads to clean them.

What did you typically cook in your pots, how did you heat them (gas,
electric, high or low heat), and how did you clean them?

The crack on the pan that you showed on you web page looks more like a
scratch to me. I would expect a crack to be somewhat irregular in pattern,
fairly continous (in depth) and not to bend around. A shallow scratch from
a one time use of a hard utensil could erode into something larger, possible
in a dishwasher?

Ceramic coatings, such as the porcelain enamel that is used on the inside of
the pots, are very tough things both chemically and physically, but they can
be damaged by chipping and heat, e.g the space shuttle tiles, and agressive
chemicals; especially by two or all of the above in combination.

Thermal shock will damage a ceramic coating. From the Le Creuset website
(their CAPS): "NEVER fill a hot pot or pan with cold water, or plunge into
water for soaking. For stubborn clean-ups, fill cool pan with hot soapy
water and let soak. Then, scrub with nylon brush or pad to clean." That
might explain the depth of some of the pitting (micro cracking)--like what
happens to a cement driveway over several years of freeze thaw cycles
northern climate. This could be initiated or exacerbated in a cooking pot,
by strong caustics under heat, i.e. dishwashing detergents, or, maybe, very
long exposures to highly acidic foods (less likely though, most food aren't
acidic enough).

I was curious about automatic dishwashing detergents so I googled
"dishwashing detergent china" and found this at Waterford Crystal's web
site: "It is safe to wash your Waterford Fine Bone China in an automatic
dishwasher as long as you load it with dishes fully secured and placed so
that they do not touch each other. Do not wash at temperatures higher than
149° Fahrenheit and use the "short wash" or "china and crystal" cycles. The
rinse cycle should follow immediately to flush away detergent deposits that
could form a film if they remain on the dishes too long." Now of course Le
Creuset is not fine bone china, but the basic properties are similar and the
coating is much thicker. Le Creuset should be able to stand up to a
dishwasher under moderate conditions (better than china); frequent washing
might lead to visible cumulative wear.

The overall staining you show looks like that from regular usage, the darker
staining (and its pattern) looks like the stain I would get from
overhearing, some of which I have never been able to remove. I am always
amazed at the low flame required to cook on Le Creuset pots, a testament to
the heat capacity of cast iron.

It is possible, but unlikely, that the three pots were made in the same
batch with the same interior coating. Since it has happened to three
different pots all in while in your control you also need to consider what
effect you might of had on them. Sorry.

All is not lost, the pots are still usable in their present state--just not
as pretty; if all the interior coating was gone it would be like a plain
old cast iron pot. They may not be as pretty as they once were, but they
are almost just as useful. Get them back into service, now!

Regards, PS



"Dee Randall" > wrote in message
...
> Hello,
> >
> The coating on my Le Creuset pots lasted no longer than 2 years' use. I
> have asked about it, but any one I mention it to is incredulous. Of
> course, I don't have them "in hand" when I mention it.
>
> Two pots out of 3 cracked. Two pots' coating rendered them unusable as
> well.
>
> Since the last pot (the largest pot and not cracked) that I have left is
> still in my possession after sitting on the top shelf for many years, I
> decided to take a few pictures to send to see if anyone has ever seen such
a
> thing.
>
> I'm just wondering if you could take a look at
>
>
http://freepages.family.rootsweb.com...age/lecreusetp
ots.htm
>
> Has this happened to you or anyone you know? 3 out of 3 ain't bad!
>
> Dee


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.536 / Virus Database: 331 - Release Date: 11/3/03

Hello, the picture of the pot on my site is the one pot that is left and it
does not have a crack. I showed the "Scratch." I discussed that the other
two pots were cracked and I had thrown them out as they were unusable.

My pot that is pictured is not enamel. The pots I discusssed are the
"cream-colored sand/glass glazed ones." I haven't had trouble with the
white enameled pots in the past at all. I have had several, but for some
reason they were lost in moves -- I wish I had them back, they were the
white enameled inside. I have one long fish enamel pan that I have had for
30+ years and it is beautiful inside.


I have never put my pots in a dishwasher. To my knowledge, none of my
pots/pans have ever been in a dishwasher.

I have always used electric stoves. I have never used any scratch material
to clean my pots.

I have never used metal spoons, forks, spatulas on any of my pans. I used
wooden spoons before they had rubber cooking spatulas.

I have never put a hot pan into cold water, or cold water into a hot pan.

I always wash my china and crystal by hand.

You say,
The overall staining you show looks like that from regular usage, the darker
> staining (and its pattern) looks like the stain I would get from
> overhearing, some of which I have never been able to remove. >>>>

It is not staining -- it is the glaze that has come off thru usage. It has
worked its way thru to the cast iron which is black.

You say,
..........
if all the interior coating was gone it would be like a plain
> old cast iron pot.
Get them back into service, now!
> .........

When I think of all the coating I ate that came off in my food, I don't
think I want to.
But I only have ONE pot left and the glaze would be coming off into the food
each time I cooked in it. That is not to my liking.

Thanks for your huge reply.

Dee




"ps" > wrote in message
...
> We have been cooking with Le Creuset pots (5 French ovens--var. sizes,
> buffet server, 3 sauce pans and a beef fondue pot since 1979. With the
> exception of some staining they are all in good functional and esthetic
> shape: the insides are all intact and reasonably presentable, the outside
> enamel is very clean save a few minor chips on the edges (user error).
They
> have never been in a dishwasher. On a only 2-3 occasions over the last 24
> years have I used bleach to remove a stain on the inside. We use
> scotchbrite blue (or equivalent) pads to clean them.
>
> What did you typically cook in your pots, how did you heat them (gas,
> electric, high or low heat), and how did you clean them?
>
> The crack on the pan that you showed on you web page looks more like a
> scratch to me. I would expect a crack to be somewhat irregular in
pattern,
> fairly continous (in depth) and not to bend around. A shallow scratch
from
> a one time use of a hard utensil could erode into something larger,
possible
> in a dishwasher?
>
> Ceramic coatings, such as the porcelain enamel that is used on the inside
of
> the pots, are very tough things both chemically and physically, but they
can
> be damaged by chipping and heat, e.g the space shuttle tiles, and
agressive
> chemicals; especially by two or all of the above in combination.
>
> Thermal shock will damage a ceramic coating. From the Le Creuset website
> (their CAPS): "NEVER fill a hot pot or pan with cold water, or plunge
into
> water for soaking. For stubborn clean-ups, fill cool pan with hot soapy
> water and let soak. Then, scrub with nylon brush or pad to clean." That
> might explain the depth of some of the pitting (micro cracking)--like what
> happens to a cement driveway over several years of freeze thaw cycles
> northern climate. This could be initiated or exacerbated in a cooking
pot,
> by strong caustics under heat, i.e. dishwashing detergents, or, maybe,
very
> long exposures to highly acidic foods (less likely though, most food
aren't
> acidic enough).
>
> I was curious about automatic dishwashing detergents so I googled
> "dishwashing detergent china" and found this at Waterford Crystal's web
> site: "It is safe to wash your Waterford Fine Bone China in an automatic
> dishwasher as long as you load it with dishes fully secured and placed so
> that they do not touch each other. Do not wash at temperatures higher than
> 149° Fahrenheit and use the "short wash" or "china and crystal" cycles.
The
> rinse cycle should follow immediately to flush away detergent deposits
that
> could form a film if they remain on the dishes too long." Now of course
Le
> Creuset is not fine bone china, but the basic properties are similar and
the
> coating is much thicker. Le Creuset should be able to stand up to a
> dishwasher under moderate conditions (better than china); frequent washing
> might lead to visible cumulative wear.
>
> The overall staining you show looks like that from regular usage, the
darker
> staining (and its pattern) looks like the stain I would get from
> overhearing, some of which I have never been able to remove. I am always
> amazed at the low flame required to cook on Le Creuset pots, a testament
to
> the heat capacity of cast iron.
>
> It is possible, but unlikely, that the three pots were made in the same
> batch with the same interior coating. Since it has happened to three
> different pots all in while in your control you also need to consider what
> effect you might of had on them. Sorry.
>
> All is not lost, the pots are still usable in their present state--just
not
> as pretty; They may not be as pretty as they once were, but they
> are almost just as useful. Get them back into service, now!
>
> Regards, PS
>
>
>
> "Dee Randall" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Hello,
> > >
> > The coating on my Le Creuset pots lasted no longer than 2 years' use. I
> > have asked about it, but any one I mention it to is incredulous. Of
> > course, I don't have them "in hand" when I mention it.
> >
> > Two pots out of 3 cracked. Two pots' coating rendered them unusable as
> > well.
> >
> > Since the last pot (the largest pot and not cracked) that I have left
is
> > still in my possession after sitting on the top shelf for many years, I
> > decided to take a few pictures to send to see if anyone has ever seen
such
> a
> > thing.
> >
> > I'm just wondering if you could take a look at
> >
> >
>
http://freepages.family.rootsweb.com...age/lecreusetp
> ots.htm
> >
> > Has this happened to you or anyone you know? 3 out of 3 ain't bad!
> >
> > Dee
>
>
> ---
> Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
> Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
> Version: 6.0.536 / Virus Database: 331 - Release Date: 11/3/03
>
>

Dee,

From the Le Creuset website:
(http://www.lecreuset.com/new/product...erial=castiron)

Q: Is the enamel harmful if ingested?
A: No. It meets all FDA standards.

While I speculated on a few possibilities that involved chemical attack to
explain your experiences with the Le Creuset pans, the actual coatings would
be considered by most chemists to be inert--under typical use; at least as
much as any other piece of ceramic that you may have in your house--the Le
Creuset coating is probably very similar to many ceramic glazes. The amount
of coating that might come off in any given dish is so small as to be
insignificant and, regardless, biologically inert. The pot with its damage
coating is only visually hazardous. One tin of canned tuna or any fresh
water lake fish from the US is much more hazardous. Water from any city
with a delivery system at least 60-70 years old, e.g. parts of New York City
or Chicago, may have more lead in it than what you'll get out of your pot
(-0-).

You say that you've only used them on an electric stove. That could account
for the pattern of wear. It is possible that the heating element on the
stove was not uniformly in contact with the pot. Areas where it was in
complete contact with element could of had localized overheating leading to
accelerated erosion of the porcelain enamel. Electric elements are MUCH
more efficient than gas burners for heat transfer; they will routinely boil
water faster than any home gas stove burner--even the high output burners.

Sure all of this may be moot. If you' re convinced that it is a
manufacturing defect, then your only recourse is to take it up with the
manufacturer. There is a Le Creuset outlet store in Hanover, MD, is that
close to you? http://www.outletsonline.com/lecreuset/lestores.html I think
that Le Creuset USA actually has something to do with the stores. Put the
onus on them to replace it. Too bad you didn't save the others, cracks
should never happen.

Good luck.

ps

"Dee Randall" > wrote in message
...
>
>
> Hello, the picture of the pot on my site is the one pot that is left and
it
> does not have a crack. I showed the "Scratch." I discussed that the other
> two pots were cracked and I had thrown them out as they were unusable.
>
> My pot that is pictured is not enamel. The pots I discusssed are the
> "cream-colored sand/glass glazed ones." I haven't had trouble with the
> white enameled pots in the past at all. I have had several, but for some
> reason they were lost in moves -- I wish I had them back, they were the
> white enameled inside. I have one long fish enamel pan that I have had for
> 30+ years and it is beautiful inside.
>
>
> I have never put my pots in a dishwasher. To my knowledge, none of my
> pots/pans have ever been in a dishwasher.
>
> I have always used electric stoves. I have never used any scratch
material
> to clean my pots.
>
> I have never used metal spoons, forks, spatulas on any of my pans. I used
> wooden spoons before they had rubber cooking spatulas.
>
> I have never put a hot pan into cold water, or cold water into a hot pan.
>
> I always wash my china and crystal by hand.
>
> You say,
> The overall staining you show looks like that from regular usage, the
darker
> > staining (and its pattern) looks like the stain I would get from
> > overhearing, some of which I have never been able to remove. >>>>
>
> It is not staining -- it is the glaze that has come off thru usage. It
has
> worked its way thru to the cast iron which is black.
>
> You say,
> .........
> if all the interior coating was gone it would be like a plain
> > old cast iron pot.
> Get them back into service, now!
> > .........
>
> When I think of all the coating I ate that came off in my food, I don't
> think I want to.
> But I only have ONE pot left and the glaze would be coming off into the
food
> each time I cooked in it. That is not to my liking.
>
> Thanks for your huge reply.
>
> Dee
>
>
>
>
> "ps" > wrote in message
> ...
> > We have been cooking with Le Creuset pots (5 French ovens--var. sizes,
> > buffet server, 3 sauce pans and a beef fondue pot since 1979. With the
> > exception of some staining they are all in good functional and esthetic
> > shape: the insides are all intact and reasonably presentable, the
outside
> > enamel is very clean save a few minor chips on the edges (user error).
> They
> > have never been in a dishwasher. On a only 2-3 occasions over the last
24
> > years have I used bleach to remove a stain on the inside. We use
> > scotchbrite blue (or equivalent) pads to clean them.
> >
> > What did you typically cook in your pots, how did you heat them (gas,
> > electric, high or low heat), and how did you clean them?
> >
> > The crack on the pan that you showed on you web page looks more like a
> > scratch to me. I would expect a crack to be somewhat irregular in
> pattern,
> > fairly continous (in depth) and not to bend around. A shallow scratch
> from
> > a one time use of a hard utensil could erode into something larger,
> possible
> > in a dishwasher?
> >
> > Ceramic coatings, such as the porcelain enamel that is used on the
inside
> of
> > the pots, are very tough things both chemically and physically, but they
> can
> > be damaged by chipping and heat, e.g the space shuttle tiles, and
> agressive
> > chemicals; especially by two or all of the above in combination.
> >
> > Thermal shock will damage a ceramic coating. From the Le Creuset
website
> > (their CAPS): "NEVER fill a hot pot or pan with cold water, or plunge
> into
> > water for soaking. For stubborn clean-ups, fill cool pan with hot soapy
> > water and let soak. Then, scrub with nylon brush or pad to clean." That
> > might explain the depth of some of the pitting (micro cracking)--like
what
> > happens to a cement driveway over several years of freeze thaw cycles
> > northern climate. This could be initiated or exacerbated in a cooking
> pot,
> > by strong caustics under heat, i.e. dishwashing detergents, or, maybe,
> very
> > long exposures to highly acidic foods (less likely though, most food
> aren't
> > acidic enough).
> >
> > I was curious about automatic dishwashing detergents so I googled
> > "dishwashing detergent china" and found this at Waterford Crystal's web
> > site: "It is safe to wash your Waterford Fine Bone China in an
automatic
> > dishwasher as long as you load it with dishes fully secured and placed
so
> > that they do not touch each other. Do not wash at temperatures higher
than
> > 149° Fahrenheit and use the "short wash" or "china and crystal" cycles.
> The
> > rinse cycle should follow immediately to flush away detergent deposits
> that
> > could form a film if they remain on the dishes too long." Now of course
> Le
> > Creuset is not fine bone china, but the basic properties are similar and
> the
> > coating is much thicker. Le Creuset should be able to stand up to a
> > dishwasher under moderate conditions (better than china); frequent
washing
> > might lead to visible cumulative wear.
> >
> > The overall staining you show looks like that from regular usage, the
> darker
> > staining (and its pattern) looks like the stain I would get from
> > overhearing, some of which I have never been able to remove. I am
always
> > amazed at the low flame required to cook on Le Creuset pots, a testament
> to
> > the heat capacity of cast iron.
> >
> > It is possible, but unlikely, that the three pots were made in the same
> > batch with the same interior coating. Since it has happened to three
> > different pots all in while in your control you also need to consider
what
> > effect you might of had on them. Sorry.
> >
> > All is not lost, the pots are still usable in their present state--just
> not
> > as pretty; They may not be as pretty as they once were, but they
> > are almost just as useful. Get them back into service, now!
> >
> > Regards, PS
> >
> >
> >
> > "Dee Randall" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > > Hello,
> > > >
> > > The coating on my Le Creuset pots lasted no longer than 2 years' use.
I
> > > have asked about it, but any one I mention it to is incredulous. Of
> > > course, I don't have them "in hand" when I mention it.
> > >
> > > Two pots out of 3 cracked. Two pots' coating rendered them unusable
as
> > > well.
> > >
> > > Since the last pot (the largest pot and not cracked) that I have left
> is
> > > still in my possession after sitting on the top shelf for many years,
I
> > > decided to take a few pictures to send to see if anyone has ever seen
> such
> > a
> > > thing.
> > >
> > > I'm just wondering if you could take a look at
> > >
> > >
> >
>
http://freepages.family.rootsweb.com...age/lecreusetp
> > ots.htm
> > >
> > > Has this happened to you or anyone you know? 3 out of 3 ain't bad!
> > >
> > > Dee
> >
> >
> > ---
> > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
> > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
> > Version: 6.0.536 / Virus Database: 331 - Release Date: 11/3/03
> >
> >
>
>


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.536 / Virus Database: 331 - Release Date: 11/3/03

"ps" > wrote in message
...
> Dee,
>
> From the Le Creuset website:
> (http://www.lecreuset.com/new/product...erial=castiron)
>
> Q: Is the enamel harmful if ingested?
> A: No. It meets all FDA standards.
>
Bloody great snip!

About 35 years ago, the London Sunday Times reported that some of the Le
Creuset EXTERIOR glazes had some nasty metals in them such as cadmium.
Le Creuset IMMEDIATELY changed the glaze formulæ to make their pots
completely safe.

I notice that there are now cheaper clones from China on the market. I bet
they don't give a damn about what goes into their glazes!

Graham

Graham,

The question is: how accessible is the cadmium? It would probably take some
serious chemical and or physical abuse to leach it out. Then one would have
to eat it. Unlikely for an exterior coating, but best to not use it if
there is a choice. The true hazard is to the environment, like when cadmium
containing materials are tossed in the dump (like nickel cadmium
rechargeable batteries!!). Not too many Le Creuset pots make it to the
dump, save Dee's, and, even then, the cadmium is well tied up in the
coating. Ceramic encapsulation is the preferred way to dispose of many
hazardous materials, like plutonium for example. In fact, there are silica
encapsulated pigments in use today which could not be used if encapsulation
did not render a not biologically inert material, see
http://www.walsh-assoc.com/news27.htm for a representative explanation.

And since I'm on a roll here, the hazardous elements that we are
considering, e.g. chromium, lead, cadmium, etc, are all derived from natural
products, i.e. minerals, dug out of the earth. These minerals are typically
oxides, silicates, and aluminates and combinations of thereof. The glazes
and encapsulated pigments are in the same general chemical families as the
minerals. Consider that underground aquifers (read: drinking water) my run
through deposits of these materials. As long as it's not too acidic (cf
acid rain--lakes are another matter), we're ok. Actually, underground water
is more likely to be alkaline, probably making the risk even less so.

Risk of exposure to lead and other elements in ceramic coatings is a long
term continuous exposure health hazard. I would think that one would have
to drink alot of grapefruit juice to poison one's self (sic?). However,
there are now readily available economical alternatives. There is no reason
for anyone to ethically use these materials anymore. Unfortunately, not all
countries have seen fit to outlaw them.

Last, you are right on about non-compliant (per US & Canadian regs) coatings
being used in other parts of the world. I recall some chinese pottery being
removed from the US market only 3-5 years ago because they were made with
unsafe lead glaze. I am sure that the manufacturer must have known what
they were doing...

PS

"Graham" > wrote in message
news:WojEb.742754$pl3.660004@pd7tw3no...
>
> "ps" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Dee,
> >
> > From the Le Creuset website:
> > (http://www.lecreuset.com/new/product...erial=castiron)
> >
> > Q: Is the enamel harmful if ingested?
> > A: No. It meets all FDA standards.
> >
> Bloody great snip!
>
> About 35 years ago, the London Sunday Times reported that some of the Le
> Creuset EXTERIOR glazes had some nasty metals in them such as cadmium.
> Le Creuset IMMEDIATELY changed the glaze formulæ to make their pots
> completely safe.
>
> I notice that there are now cheaper clones from China on the market. I
bet
> they don't give a damn about what goes into their glazes!
>
> Graham
>
>


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.536 / Virus Database: 331 - Release Date: 11/3/03

Thanks for this informational url. Appreciated!

There is one paragraph I noted:

Step 5 Each item is then sprayed with two different coats of enamel. First
the internal color then the familiar bright colored enamel on the exterior.
Both are fired at 1450°F. This high heat firing embodies the enamel into the
cast iron, making it almost completely resistant to damage during normal
use.

It seems that if they were fired at 1450, that an electric stove would not
be damaging the interior; perhaps what was cooked in them might: i.e, such
as a tomato-y/sugar-y chutney cooked for hours. Would this be considered as
abusing one's pans -- seriously!

Also thanks for the url where the stores are mentioned. As a matter of
fact, in the next month or so, I have to go to Leesburg, VA where there is a
store located -- but, only a Premium Outlet; but someday I may get to
Hanover, MD, as well. [I'm from VA]


Dee






"ps" > wrote in message
...
> Dee,
>
> From the Le Creuset website:
> (http://www.lecreuset.com/new/product...erial=castiron)
>
> Q: Is the enamel harmful if ingested?
> A: No. It meets all FDA standards.
>
> While I speculated on a few possibilities that involved chemical attack to
> explain your experiences with the Le Creuset pans, the actual coatings
would
> be considered by most chemists to be inert--under typical use; at least as
> much as any other piece of ceramic that you may have in your house--the Le
> Creuset coating is probably very similar to many ceramic glazes. The
amount
> of coating that might come off in any given dish is so small as to be
> insignificant and, regardless, biologically inert. The pot with its
damage
> coating is only visually hazardous. One tin of canned tuna or any fresh
> water lake fish from the US is much more hazardous. Water from any city
> with a delivery system at least 60-70 years old, e.g. parts of New York
City
> or Chicago, may have more lead in it than what you'll get out of your pot
> (-0-).
>
> You say that you've only used them on an electric stove. That could
account
> for the pattern of wear. It is possible that the heating element on the
> stove was not uniformly in contact with the pot. Areas where it was in
> complete contact with element could of had localized overheating leading
to
> accelerated erosion of the porcelain enamel. Electric elements are MUCH
> more efficient than gas burners for heat transfer; they will routinely
boil
> water faster than any home gas stove burner--even the high output burners.
>
> Sure all of this may be moot. If you' re convinced that it is a
> manufacturing defect, then your only recourse is to take it up with the
> manufacturer. There is a Le Creuset outlet store in Hanover, MD, is that
> close to you? http://www.outletsonline.com/lecreuset/lestores.html I
think
> that Le Creuset USA actually has something to do with the stores. Put the
> onus on them to replace it. Too bad you didn't save the others, cracks
> should never happen.
>
> Good luck.
>
> ps
>
> "Dee Randall" > wrote in message
> ...
> >
> >
> > Hello, the picture of the pot on my site is the one pot that is left and
> it
> > does not have a crack. I showed the "Scratch." I discussed that the
other
> > two pots were cracked and I had thrown them out as they were unusable.
> >
> > My pot that is pictured is not enamel. The pots I discusssed are the
> > "cream-colored sand/glass glazed ones." I haven't had trouble with the
> > white enameled pots in the past at all. I have had several, but for
some
> > reason they were lost in moves -- I wish I had them back, they were the
> > white enameled inside. I have one long fish enamel pan that I have had
for
> > 30+ years and it is beautiful inside.
> >
> >
> > I have never put my pots in a dishwasher. To my knowledge, none of my
> > pots/pans have ever been in a dishwasher.
> >
> > I have always used electric stoves. I have never used any scratch
> material
> > to clean my pots.
> >
> > I have never used metal spoons, forks, spatulas on any of my pans. I
used
> > wooden spoons before they had rubber cooking spatulas.
> >
> > I have never put a hot pan into cold water, or cold water into a hot
pan.
> >
> > I always wash my china and crystal by hand.
> >
> > You say,
> > The overall staining you show looks like that from regular usage, the
> darker
> > > staining (and its pattern) looks like the stain I would get from
> > > overhearing, some of which I have never been able to remove. >>>>
> >
> > It is not staining -- it is the glaze that has come off thru usage. It
> has
> > worked its way thru to the cast iron which is black.
> >
> > You say,
> > .........
> > if all the interior coating was gone it would be like a plain
> > > old cast iron pot.
> > Get them back into service, now!
> > > .........
> >
> > When I think of all the coating I ate that came off in my food, I don't
> > think I want to.
> > But I only have ONE pot left and the glaze would be coming off into the
> food
> > each time I cooked in it. That is not to my liking.
> >
> > Thanks for your huge reply.
> >
> > Dee
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > "ps" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > > We have been cooking with Le Creuset pots (5 French ovens--var. sizes,
> > > buffet server, 3 sauce pans and a beef fondue pot since 1979. With
the
> > > exception of some staining they are all in good functional and
esthetic
> > > shape: the insides are all intact and reasonably presentable, the
> outside
> > > enamel is very clean save a few minor chips on the edges (user error).
> > They
> > > have never been in a dishwasher. On a only 2-3 occasions over the
last
> 24
> > > years have I used bleach to remove a stain on the inside. We use
> > > scotchbrite blue (or equivalent) pads to clean them.
> > >
> > > What did you typically cook in your pots, how did you heat them (gas,
> > > electric, high or low heat), and how did you clean them?
> > >
> > > The crack on the pan that you showed on you web page looks more like a
> > > scratch to me. I would expect a crack to be somewhat irregular in
> > pattern,
> > > fairly continous (in depth) and not to bend around. A shallow scratch
> > from
> > > a one time use of a hard utensil could erode into something larger,
> > possible
> > > in a dishwasher?
> > >
> > > Ceramic coatings, such as the porcelain enamel that is used on the
> inside
> > of
> > > the pots, are very tough things both chemically and physically, but
they
> > can
> > > be damaged by chipping and heat, e.g the space shuttle tiles, and
> > agressive
> > > chemicals; especially by two or all of the above in combination.
> > >
> > > Thermal shock will damage a ceramic coating. From the Le Creuset
> website
> > > (their CAPS): "NEVER fill a hot pot or pan with cold water, or plunge
> > into
> > > water for soaking. For stubborn clean-ups, fill cool pan with hot
soapy
> > > water and let soak. Then, scrub with nylon brush or pad to clean."
That
> > > might explain the depth of some of the pitting (micro cracking)--like
> what
> > > happens to a cement driveway over several years of freeze thaw cycles
> > > northern climate. This could be initiated or exacerbated in a cooking
> > pot,
> > > by strong caustics under heat, i.e. dishwashing detergents, or, maybe,
> > very
> > > long exposures to highly acidic foods (less likely though, most food
> > aren't
> > > acidic enough).
> > >
> > > I was curious about automatic dishwashing detergents so I googled
> > > "dishwashing detergent china" and found this at Waterford Crystal's
web
> > > site: "It is safe to wash your Waterford Fine Bone China in an
> automatic
> > > dishwasher as long as you load it with dishes fully secured and placed
> so
> > > that they do not touch each other. Do not wash at temperatures higher
> than
> > > 149° Fahrenheit and use the "short wash" or "china and crystal"
cycles.
> > The
> > > rinse cycle should follow immediately to flush away detergent deposits
> > that
> > > could form a film if they remain on the dishes too long." Now of
course
> > Le
> > > Creuset is not fine bone china, but the basic properties are similar
and
> > the
> > > coating is much thicker. Le Creuset should be able to stand up to a
> > > dishwasher under moderate conditions (better than china); frequent
> washing
> > > might lead to visible cumulative wear.
> > >
> > > The overall staining you show looks like that from regular usage, the
> > darker
> > > staining (and its pattern) looks like the stain I would get from
> > > overhearing, some of which I have never been able to remove. I am
> always
> > > amazed at the low flame required to cook on Le Creuset pots, a
testament
> > to
> > > the heat capacity of cast iron.
> > >
> > > It is possible, but unlikely, that the three pots were made in the
same
> > > batch with the same interior coating. Since it has happened to three
> > > different pots all in while in your control you also need to consider
> what
> > > effect you might of had on them. Sorry.
> > >
> > > All is not lost, the pots are still usable in their present
state--just
> > not
> > > as pretty; They may not be as pretty as they once were, but they
> > > are almost just as useful. Get them back into service, now!
> > >
> > > Regards, PS
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > "Dee Randall" > wrote in message
> > > ...
> > > > Hello,
> > > > >
> > > > The coating on my Le Creuset pots lasted no longer than 2 years'
use.
> I
> > > > have asked about it, but any one I mention it to is incredulous.
Of
> > > > course, I don't have them "in hand" when I mention it.
> > > >
> > > > Two pots out of 3 cracked. Two pots' coating rendered them unusable
> as
> > > > well.
> > > >
> > > > Since the last pot (the largest pot and not cracked) that I have
left
> > is
> > > > still in my possession after sitting on the top shelf for many
years,
> I
> > > > decided to take a few pictures to send to see if anyone has ever
seen
> > such
> > > a
> > > > thing.
> > > >
> > > > I'm just wondering if you could take a look at
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
http://freepages.family.rootsweb.com...age/lecreusetp
> > > ots.htm
> > > >
> > > > Has this happened to you or anyone you know? 3 out of 3 ain't bad!
> > > >
> > > > Dee
> > >
> > >
> > > ---
> > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
> > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
> > > Version: 6.0.536 / Virus Database: 331 - Release Date: 11/3/03
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
> ---
> Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
> Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
> Version: 6.0.536 / Virus Database: 331 - Release Date: 11/3/03
>
>

Premium outlet is the development company that runs the mall, the actual
store should be a Le Creuset operation.

"Dee Randall" > wrote in message
...
> Thanks for this informational url. Appreciated!
>
> There is one paragraph I noted:
>
> Step 5 Each item is then sprayed with two different coats of enamel. First
> the internal color then the familiar bright colored enamel on the
exterior.
> Both are fired at 1450°F. This high heat firing embodies the enamel into
the
> cast iron, making it almost completely resistant to damage during normal
> use.
>
> It seems that if they were fired at 1450, that an electric stove would not
> be damaging the interior; perhaps what was cooked in them might: i.e, such
> as a tomato-y/sugar-y chutney cooked for hours. Would this be considered
as
> abusing one's pans -- seriously!
>
> Also thanks for the url where the stores are mentioned. As a matter of
> fact, in the next month or so, I have to go to Leesburg, VA where there is
a
> store located -- but, only a Premium Outlet; but someday I may get to
> Hanover, MD, as well. [I'm from VA]
>
>
> Dee
>
>
>
>
>
>
> "ps" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Dee,
> >
> > From the Le Creuset website:
> > (http://www.lecreuset.com/new/product...erial=castiron)
> >
> > Q: Is the enamel harmful if ingested?
> > A: No. It meets all FDA standards.
> >
> > While I speculated on a few possibilities that involved chemical attack
to
> > explain your experiences with the Le Creuset pans, the actual coatings
> would
> > be considered by most chemists to be inert--under typical use; at least
as
> > much as any other piece of ceramic that you may have in your house--the
Le
> > Creuset coating is probably very similar to many ceramic glazes. The
> amount
> > of coating that might come off in any given dish is so small as to be
> > insignificant and, regardless, biologically inert. The pot with its
> damage
> > coating is only visually hazardous. One tin of canned tuna or any
fresh
> > water lake fish from the US is much more hazardous. Water from any city
> > with a delivery system at least 60-70 years old, e.g. parts of New York
> City
> > or Chicago, may have more lead in it than what you'll get out of your
pot
> > (-0-).
> >
> > You say that you've only used them on an electric stove. That could
> account
> > for the pattern of wear. It is possible that the heating element on the
> > stove was not uniformly in contact with the pot. Areas where it was in
> > complete contact with element could of had localized overheating leading
> to
> > accelerated erosion of the porcelain enamel. Electric elements are MUCH
> > more efficient than gas burners for heat transfer; they will routinely
> boil
> > water faster than any home gas stove burner--even the high output
burners.
> >
> > Sure all of this may be moot. If you' re convinced that it is a
> > manufacturing defect, then your only recourse is to take it up with the
> > manufacturer. There is a Le Creuset outlet store in Hanover, MD, is
that
> > close to you? http://www.outletsonline.com/lecreuset/lestores.html I
> think
> > that Le Creuset USA actually has something to do with the stores. Put
the
> > onus on them to replace it. Too bad you didn't save the others, cracks
> > should never happen.
> >
> > Good luck.
> >
> > ps
> >
> > "Dee Randall" > wrote in message
> > ...
> > >
> > >
> > > Hello, the picture of the pot on my site is the one pot that is left
and
> > it
> > > does not have a crack. I showed the "Scratch." I discussed that the
> other
> > > two pots were cracked and I had thrown them out as they were unusable.
> > >
> > > My pot that is pictured is not enamel. The pots I discusssed are the
> > > "cream-colored sand/glass glazed ones." I haven't had trouble with
the
> > > white enameled pots in the past at all. I have had several, but for
> some
> > > reason they were lost in moves -- I wish I had them back, they were
the
> > > white enameled inside. I have one long fish enamel pan that I have had
> for
> > > 30+ years and it is beautiful inside.
> > >
> > >
> > > I have never put my pots in a dishwasher. To my knowledge, none of my
> > > pots/pans have ever been in a dishwasher.
> > >
> > > I have always used electric stoves. I have never used any scratch
> > material
> > > to clean my pots.
> > >
> > > I have never used metal spoons, forks, spatulas on any of my pans. I
> used
> > > wooden spoons before they had rubber cooking spatulas.
> > >
> > > I have never put a hot pan into cold water, or cold water into a hot
> pan.
> > >
> > > I always wash my china and crystal by hand.
> > >
> > > You say,
> > > The overall staining you show looks like that from regular usage, the
> > darker
> > > > staining (and its pattern) looks like the stain I would get from
> > > > overhearing, some of which I have never been able to remove. >>>>
> > >
> > > It is not staining -- it is the glaze that has come off thru usage.
It
> > has
> > > worked its way thru to the cast iron which is black.
> > >
> > > You say,
> > > .........
> > > if all the interior coating was gone it would be like a plain
> > > > old cast iron pot.
> > > Get them back into service, now!
> > > > .........
> > >
> > > When I think of all the coating I ate that came off in my food, I
don't
> > > think I want to.
> > > But I only have ONE pot left and the glaze would be coming off into
the
> > food
> > > each time I cooked in it. That is not to my liking.
> > >
> > > Thanks for your huge reply.
> > >
> > > Dee
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > "ps" > wrote in message
> > > ...
> > > > We have been cooking with Le Creuset pots (5 French ovens--var.
sizes,
> > > > buffet server, 3 sauce pans and a beef fondue pot since 1979. With
> the
> > > > exception of some staining they are all in good functional and
> esthetic
> > > > shape: the insides are all intact and reasonably presentable, the
> > outside
> > > > enamel is very clean save a few minor chips on the edges (user
error).
> > > They
> > > > have never been in a dishwasher. On a only 2-3 occasions over the
> last
> > 24
> > > > years have I used bleach to remove a stain on the inside. We use
> > > > scotchbrite blue (or equivalent) pads to clean them.
> > > >
> > > > What did you typically cook in your pots, how did you heat them
(gas,
> > > > electric, high or low heat), and how did you clean them?
> > > >
> > > > The crack on the pan that you showed on you web page looks more like
a
> > > > scratch to me. I would expect a crack to be somewhat irregular in
> > > pattern,
> > > > fairly continous (in depth) and not to bend around. A shallow
scratch
> > > from
> > > > a one time use of a hard utensil could erode into something larger,
> > > possible
> > > > in a dishwasher?
> > > >
> > > > Ceramic coatings, such as the porcelain enamel that is used on the
> > inside
> > > of
> > > > the pots, are very tough things both chemically and physically, but
> they
> > > can
> > > > be damaged by chipping and heat, e.g the space shuttle tiles, and
> > > agressive
> > > > chemicals; especially by two or all of the above in combination.
> > > >
> > > > Thermal shock will damage a ceramic coating. From the Le Creuset
> > website
> > > > (their CAPS): "NEVER fill a hot pot or pan with cold water, or
plunge
> > > into
> > > > water for soaking. For stubborn clean-ups, fill cool pan with hot
> soapy
> > > > water and let soak. Then, scrub with nylon brush or pad to clean."
> That
> > > > might explain the depth of some of the pitting (micro
cracking)--like
> > what
> > > > happens to a cement driveway over several years of freeze thaw
cycles
> > > > northern climate. This could be initiated or exacerbated in a
cooking
> > > pot,
> > > > by strong caustics under heat, i.e. dishwashing detergents, or,
maybe,
> > > very
> > > > long exposures to highly acidic foods (less likely though, most food
> > > aren't
> > > > acidic enough).
> > > >
> > > > I was curious about automatic dishwashing detergents so I googled
> > > > "dishwashing detergent china" and found this at Waterford Crystal's
> web
> > > > site: "It is safe to wash your Waterford Fine Bone China in an
> > automatic
> > > > dishwasher as long as you load it with dishes fully secured and
placed
> > so
> > > > that they do not touch each other. Do not wash at temperatures
higher
> > than
> > > > 149° Fahrenheit and use the "short wash" or "china and crystal"
> cycles.
> > > The
> > > > rinse cycle should follow immediately to flush away detergent
deposits
> > > that
> > > > could form a film if they remain on the dishes too long." Now of
> course
> > > Le
> > > > Creuset is not fine bone china, but the basic properties are similar
> and
> > > the
> > > > coating is much thicker. Le Creuset should be able to stand up to a
> > > > dishwasher under moderate conditions (better than china); frequent
> > washing
> > > > might lead to visible cumulative wear.
> > > >
> > > > The overall staining you show looks like that from regular usage,
the
> > > darker
> > > > staining (and its pattern) looks like the stain I would get from
> > > > overhearing, some of which I have never been able to remove. I am
> > always
> > > > amazed at the low flame required to cook on Le Creuset pots, a
> testament
> > > to
> > > > the heat capacity of cast iron.
> > > >
> > > > It is possible, but unlikely, that the three pots were made in the
> same
> > > > batch with the same interior coating. Since it has happened to
three
> > > > different pots all in while in your control you also need to
consider
> > what
> > > > effect you might of had on them. Sorry.
> > > >
> > > > All is not lost, the pots are still usable in their present
> state--just
> > > not
> > > > as pretty; They may not be as pretty as they once were, but they
> > > > are almost just as useful. Get them back into service, now!
> > > >
> > > > Regards, PS
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > "Dee Randall" > wrote in message
> > > > ...
> > > > > Hello,
> > > > > >
> > > > > The coating on my Le Creuset pots lasted no longer than 2 years'
> use.
> > I
> > > > > have asked about it, but any one I mention it to is incredulous.
> Of
> > > > > course, I don't have them "in hand" when I mention it.
> > > > >
> > > > > Two pots out of 3 cracked. Two pots' coating rendered them
unusable
> > as
> > > > > well.
> > > > >
> > > > > Since the last pot (the largest pot and not cracked) that I have
> left
> > > is
> > > > > still in my possession after sitting on the top shelf for many
> years,
> > I
> > > > > decided to take a few pictures to send to see if anyone has ever
> seen
> > > such
> > > > a
> > > > > thing.
> > > > >
> > > > > I'm just wondering if you could take a look at
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>
http://freepages.family.rootsweb.com...age/lecreusetp
> > > > ots.htm
> > > > >
> > > > > Has this happened to you or anyone you know? 3 out of 3 ain't
bad!
> > > > >
> > > > > Dee
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ---
> > > > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
> > > > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
> > > > Version: 6.0.536 / Virus Database: 331 - Release Date: 11/3/03
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > ---
> > Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
> > Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
> > Version: 6.0.536 / Virus Database: 331 - Release Date: 11/3/03
> >
> >
>
>


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.536 / Virus Database: 331 - Release Date: 11/3/03

I should have noted that porcelain enamel OEM coatings are used on metal
dishwasher tubs. They must be able to withstand heat or caustic, and even
in combination! For a Le Creuset pot, the dishwasher may be one of the
milder things it has to deal with.

ps


"Dee Randall" > wrote in message
...
> Hello,
>
>
> The coating on my Le Creuset pots lasted no longer than 2 years' use. I
> have asked about it, but any one I mention it to is incredulous. Of
> course, I don't have them "in hand" when I mention it.
>
>
>
> Two pots out of 3 cracked. Two pots' coating rendered them unusable as
> well.
>
>
>
> Since the last pot (the largest pot and not cracked) that I have left is
> still in my possession after sitting on the top shelf for many years, I
> decided to take a few pictures to send to see if anyone has ever seen such
a
> thing.
>
>
>
> I'm just wondering if you could take a look at
>
>
http://freepages.family.rootsweb.com...age/lecreusetp
ots.htm
>
>
>
> Has this happened to you or anyone you know? 3 out of 3 ain't bad!
>
>
>
> Dee
>
>


---
Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.536 / Virus Database: 331 - Release Date: 11/3/03

"Dee Randall" > wrote in message
...
> Hello,
> The coating on my Le Creuset pots lasted no longer than 2 years' use. I
> have asked about it, but any one I mention it to is incredulous. Of
> course, I don't have them "in hand" when I mention it.
> Two pots out of 3 cracked. Two pots' coating rendered them unusable as
> well.
> Since the last pot (the largest pot and not cracked) that I have left is
> still in my possession after sitting on the top shelf for many years, I
> decided to take a few pictures to send to see if anyone has ever seen such a
> thing.
>
> I'm just wondering if you could take a look at
>
>
http://freepages.family.rootsweb.com...reusetpots.htm

I cook on (natural) gas.
Have just checked my well used 20 year old Le Creuset casserole (looks identical
to that in your photo) and whilst there is a very little staining on the base
(inside) it is in very good condition. If I was more house proud, I'm sure it
could be cleaned up. However, due to its weight and risk of cracking from
uneven expansion, I never heat it quickly (always on the lowest, and widest
spread flame) and I don't have any of the tell tale marks in your photos.
It looks to me as though you've abused your pans.
--
M Stewart
Milton Keynes, UK
www.megalith.freeserve.co.uk/oddimage.htm
http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/ms1938/

It looks to me as though you've abused your pans.

No, I haven't at all.
Dee

"Malcolm Stewart" > wrote in
message ...
> "Dee Randall" > wrote in message
> ...
> > Hello,
> > The coating on my Le Creuset pots lasted no longer than 2 years' use. I
> > have asked about it, but any one I mention it to is incredulous. Of
> > course, I don't have them "in hand" when I mention it.
> > Two pots out of 3 cracked. Two pots' coating rendered them unusable as
> > well.
> > Since the last pot (the largest pot and not cracked) that I have left
is
> > still in my possession after sitting on the top shelf for many years, I
> > decided to take a few pictures to send to see if anyone has ever seen
such a
> > thing.
> >
> > I'm just wondering if you could take a look at
> >
> >
>
http://freepages.family.rootsweb.com...reusetpots.htm
>
> I cook on (natural) gas.
> Have just checked my well used 20 year old Le Creuset casserole (looks
identical
> to that in your photo) and whilst there is a very little staining on the
base
> (inside) it is in very good condition. If I was more house proud, I'm
sure it
> could be cleaned up. However, due to its weight and risk of cracking from
> uneven expansion, I never heat it quickly (always on the lowest, and
widest
> spread flame) and I don't have any of the tell tale marks in your photos.
> It looks to me as though you've abused your pans.
> --
> M Stewart
> Milton Keynes, UK
> www.megalith.freeserve.co.uk/oddimage.htm
> http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/ms1938/
>
>

"Malcolm Stewart" > wrote in message >...

> I cook on (natural) gas.
> Have just checked my well used 20 year old Le Creuset casserole (looks identical
> to that in your photo) and whilst there is a very little staining on the base
> (inside) it is in very good condition. If I was more house proud, I'm sure it
> could be cleaned up. However, due to its weight and risk of cracking from
> uneven expansion, I never heat it quickly (always on the lowest, and widest
> spread flame) and I don't have any of the tell tale marks in your photos.
> It looks to me as though you've abused your pans.

With all due respect to Dee, I have to agree that the pans certainly
appear to have been subjected to abuse. I have about 20 Le Creuset
pieces and all of them look like new in spite of heavy use. Did you
carefully read & follow the care instructions? With Le Creuset you
can't use high heat or abrasive cleansers, for example. In my
experience, most people don't bother to read the instructions & then
are upset & angry when the product doesn't perform as they expected.

Thank you for your respect.

I have written previously what I did not do to my pans. I respect my pans
and my cooking skills.
I have been cooking since 1954 (almost 40 years) and have spent a lot of
hours cooking and probably have abused pan in the past. But these pans were
never abused.

I do appreciate your feedback, as it is interesting to me what others think
that caused this.

My best,
Dee



"scorpiogirl" > wrote in message
om...
> "Malcolm Stewart" > wrote in
message >...
>
> > I cook on (natural) gas.
> > Have just checked my well used 20 year old Le Creuset casserole (looks
identical
> > to that in your photo) and whilst there is a very little staining on the
base
> > (inside) it is in very good condition. If I was more house proud, I'm
sure it
> > could be cleaned up. However, due to its weight and risk of cracking
from
> > uneven expansion, I never heat it quickly (always on the lowest, and
widest
> > spread flame) and I don't have any of the tell tale marks in your
photos.
> > It looks to me as though you've abused your pans.
>
> With all due respect to Dee, I have to agree that the pans certainly
> appear to have been subjected to abuse. I have about 20 Le Creuset
> pieces and all of them look like new in spite of heavy use. Did you
> carefully read & follow the care instructions? With Le Creuset you
> can't use high heat or abrasive cleansers, for example. In my
> experience, most people don't bother to read the instructions & then
> are upset & angry when the product doesn't perform as they expected.

I'm glad I can cook better than I can subtract. Me, oh, My, where does time
go??!! almost 50 years.

Dee

"Dee Randall" > wrote in message
...
> Thank you for your respect.
>
> I have written previously what I did not do to my pans. I respect my pans
> and my cooking skills.
> I have been cooking since 1954 (almost 40 years) and have spent a lot of
> hours cooking and probably have abused pan in the past. But these pans
were
> never abused.
>
> I do appreciate your feedback, as it is interesting to me what others
think
> that caused this.
>
> My best,
> Dee
>
>
>
> "scorpiogirl" > wrote in message
> om...
> > "Malcolm Stewart" > wrote in
> message >...
> >
> > > I cook on (natural) gas.
> > > Have just checked my well used 20 year old Le Creuset casserole (looks
> identical
> > > to that in your photo) and whilst there is a very little staining on
the
> base
> > > (inside) it is in very good condition. If I was more house proud, I'm
> sure it
> > > could be cleaned up. However, due to its weight and risk of cracking
> from
> > > uneven expansion, I never heat it quickly (always on the lowest, and
> widest
> > > spread flame) and I don't have any of the tell tale marks in your
> photos.
> > > It looks to me as though you've abused your pans.
> >
> > With all due respect to Dee, I have to agree that the pans certainly
> > appear to have been subjected to abuse. I have about 20 Le Creuset
> > pieces and all of them look like new in spite of heavy use. Did you
> > carefully read & follow the care instructions? With Le Creuset you
> > can't use high heat or abrasive cleansers, for example. In my
> > experience, most people don't bother to read the instructions & then
> > are upset & angry when the product doesn't perform as they expected.
>
>

"Dee Randall" > wrote:

> I do appreciate your feedback, as it is interesting to me what others think
> that caused this.

I find myself wondering if there was a bad production lot somewhere
along the line.

I have two LC pieces, both skillets (bought at a consignment shop for
about $10 both pieces). One has a bare cast iron interior, the other is
fully glazed. The bare interior (now seasoned, of course) is wonderful
for single fried eggs and such; the glazed is wonderful for reduction
sauces. The glazed interior one is somewhat badly crazed and stained on
the inside; I'm guessing someone misused it a few times, thinking it was
the bitchin' rock awesome because of the price (or a gift) and discarded
it after realizing it didn't meet his/her needs. Even crazed and
chipped, it does a fine job for my needs. :-)

Le Creuset did improve their enamel coatings starting in the late eighties or
nineties I believe. I was told it was made harder, and more resistant to
chipping and scratching. As technology improves over the years, it's reasonable
for them to also improve their products based on new manufacturing techiques,
materials and processes.

scorpiogirl wrote:


>
> With all due respect to Dee, I have to agree that the pans certainly
> appear to have been subjected to abuse. I have about 20 Le Creuset
> pieces and all of them look like new in spite of heavy use. Did you
> carefully read & follow the care instructions? With Le Creuset you
> can't use high heat or abrasive cleansers, for example. In my
> experience, most people don't bother to read the instructions & then
> are upset & angry when the product doesn't perform as they expected.

Are you not supposed to be able to boil things in them, then? If you
are, how do you explain the potato damage to one of mine?
--
Kate XXXXXX
Lady Catherine, Wardrobe Mistress of the Chocolate Buttons
http://www.diceyhome.free-online.co.uk
Click on Kate's Pages and explore!

Kate Dicey > wrote in message >...
> scorpiogirl wrote:
>
>
> >
> > With all due respect to Dee, I have to agree that the pans certainly
> > appear to have been subjected to abuse. I have about 20 Le Creuset
> > pieces and all of them look like new in spite of heavy use. Did you
> > carefully read & follow the care instructions? With Le Creuset you
> > can't use high heat or abrasive cleansers, for example. In my
> > experience, most people don't bother to read the instructions & then
> > are upset & angry when the product doesn't perform as they expected.
>
> Are you not supposed to be able to boil things in them, then? If you
> are, how do you explain the potato damage to one of mine?

I guess my point is that I have no idea what caused some peoples' pans
to be damaged, but if I were to guess, I'd say the damage was almost
definitely caused by improper usage. I know people don't like to hear
this and prefer to blame the manufacturer, but I think the problem is
usually with the user. Most people I know don't bother to thoroughly
read care instructions when they buy something new because they think
they already know how to use the product and don't show much interest
in learning how to use new products correctly. I see a lot of cookware
reviews on Amazon (not Le Creuset specifically) where people rant that
they've gone through numerous sets of cookware in a short time and had
them replaced over & over by the manufacturer, yet they don't seem to
consider that the problem is the way they use the product rather than
widespread manufacturing defects.

And to answer the question, I don't use Le Creuset to boil water since
the instructions state low-medium heat only and it takes too long to
boil at that temperature. I do use them to simmer soups and cook
grains at a low temp, but I would expect potatoes to be fine if you
have enough patience to avoid using a temp higher than medium. Also,
never use metal utensils which will scratch & discolor the enamel. I
have 2 sets of Le Crueset silicone utensils that work very well.

I also routinely wash my Le Creuset in the dishwasher and I haven't
seen any problem. I do soak the pans first if there is any stuck-on
food and scrub gently with a plastic scrubber designed for nonstick
cookware. I remove occasional stubborn stains with a tiny bit of
Barkeeper's Friend, but the manufacturer does not recommend any
abrasive products. My pans all look brand new and I have absolutely no
staining inside.

"scorpiogirl" > wrote in message
om...

> I guess my point is that I have no idea what caused some peoples' pans
> to be damaged, but if I were to guess, I'd say the damage was almost
> definitely caused by improper usage. I know people don't like to hear
> this and prefer to blame the manufacturer, but I think the problem is
> usually with the user. Most people I know don't bother to thoroughly
> read care instructions when they buy something new because they think
> they already know how to use the product and don't show much interest
> in learning how to use new products correctly. I see a lot of cookware
> reviews on Amazon (not Le Creuset specifically) where people rant that
snip

Came across the latest Le Creuset stuff yesterday when shopping, and as a result
of this thread, I found and read carefully the Care Instructions. Le Creuset
have clearly had their lawyers write these, and in a way, they're almost too
careful now. Doubt if I would now buy them (based on how "delicate" the
utensils are) if I hadn't had good service from mine for about 20 years.

--
M Stewart
Milton Keynes, UK
www.megalith.freeserve.co.uk/oddimage.htm
http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/ms1938/

Dee Randall wrote:
>
> Hello,
>
> The coating on my Le Creuset pots lasted no longer than 2 years’ use. I
> have asked about it, but any one I mention it to is incredulous. Of
> course, I don’t have them “in hand” when I mention it.
>
> Two pots out of 3 cracked. Two pots’ coating rendered them unusable as
> well.
>
> Since the last pot (the largest pot and not cracked) that I have left is
> still in my possession after sitting on the top shelf for many years, I
> decided to take a few pictures to send to see if anyone has ever seen such a
> thing.
>
> I’m just wondering if you could take a look at
>
> http://freepages.family.rootsweb.com...reusetpots.htm
>
> Has this happened to you or anyone you know? 3 out of 3 ain’t bad!
>
> Dee

Ha! BTDT! That looks just like mine did! I treated them VVEERRYY
gently as they were a wedding present in 1982. They weren't put in the
dishwasher in those days, because I didn't own one until most of their
woking life was over. The first time I boiled potatoes in one, a great
lump of enamel disappeared, and they went downhill from there. (The spud
stuck like I'd Araldited it in, and no, the pot did NOT boil dry!) Of
six pieces, this happened to 3 saucepans. The sauté pan (which gets
used on a HIGH heat for sealing meat, and has had metal utensils used in
it, to boot!) is, after 21 years use, still fine: a little worn, but
nothing like that. The little milk pan has lost most of its non-stick,
and I've only ever used wooden things in it, and the small oval roasting
dish is ok in the bottom, but the rim has chipped.

I got some good quality stainless steel pans, and they are MUCH better.

I took great care of my wedding present Le Cruset saucepans, and they
did exactly what yours have done. My grandmother abused her cheap and
cheerful enamelled saucepans mightily, and they outlasted her, enamel
intact. Not only that, but I own an old pre-war double boiler
(enamelled inside and out), which I keep now for arty things (great for
melting wax for Batik), and except for a chip on the lid where it once
got dropped, it too is perfect.

Other friends who have Le Cruset have had equally variable experiences,
with some lasting well, and others turning black and chipping at the
drop of a cool feather! I am not impressed and will not be owning
more. I'd rather pay the same sort of money and have a few more Aga
saucepans! (I have one, and it's lovely, but that little milk pan sized
saucepan alone costs about £60! I'm glad it was a present!)
--
Kate XXXXXX
Lady Catherine, Wardrobe Mistress of the Chocolate Buttons
http://www.diceyhome.free-online.co.uk
Click on Kate's Pages and explore!

Thanks Kate for your long passionate answer. I appreciate it. I know I'm
not the only person out there that has had this happen, and it's good to
hear that I'm not the only person this has happened to that hasn't abused
their pans.

I, too have had cheap enameled pans, expensive enameled tea pots, Chantal
enameled pans, which I have three and use 2 of them, and of courese, they
have all outperformed the cream-colored glazed Le Creuset pans. I had a
nice Chantal enameled large stock pot which was left on a burner that
mal-functioned and the enamel melted down. But Chantal is also expensive
and I think perhaps needs more care than the Le Creuset regarding
temperature.

I really am envious of the people on TV that use the Le Creuset pans when I
have none anymore. They look so lovely and the cooking in them looks so
inviting.

What is BTDT - I can't figure it.
<snip>Ha! BTDT!

Dee


"Kate Dicey" > wrote in message
...
> Dee Randall wrote:
> >
> > Hello,
> >
> > The coating on my Le Creuset pots lasted no longer than 2 years' use. I
> > have asked about it, but any one I mention it to is incredulous. Of
> > course, I don't have them "in hand" when I mention it.
> >
> > Two pots out of 3 cracked. Two pots' coating rendered them unusable as
> > well.
> >
> > Since the last pot (the largest pot and not cracked) that I have left
is
> > still in my possession after sitting on the top shelf for many years, I
> > decided to take a few pictures to send to see if anyone has ever seen
such a
> > thing.
> >
> > I'm just wondering if you could take a look at
> >
> >
http://freepages.family.rootsweb.com...reusetpots.htm
> >
> > Has this happened to you or anyone you know? 3 out of 3 ain't bad!
> >
> > Dee
>
> Ha! BTDT! That looks just like mine did! I treated them VVEERRYY
> gently as they were a wedding present in 1982. They weren't put in the
> dishwasher in those days, because I didn't own one until most of their
> woking life was over. The first time I boiled potatoes in one, a great
> lump of enamel disappeared, and they went downhill from there. (The spud
> stuck like I'd Araldited it in, and no, the pot did NOT boil dry!) Of
> six pieces, this happened to 3 saucepans. The sauté pan (which gets
> used on a HIGH heat for sealing meat, and has had metal utensils used in
> it, to boot!) is, after 21 years use, still fine: a little worn, but
> nothing like that. The little milk pan has lost most of its non-stick,
> and I've only ever used wooden things in it, and the small oval roasting
> dish is ok in the bottom, but the rim has chipped.
>
> I got some good quality stainless steel pans, and they are MUCH better.
>
> I took great care of my wedding present Le Cruset saucepans, and they
> did exactly what yours have done. My grandmother abused her cheap and
> cheerful enamelled saucepans mightily, and they outlasted her, enamel
> intact. Not only that, but I own an old pre-war double boiler
> (enamelled inside and out), which I keep now for arty things (great for
> melting wax for Batik), and except for a chip on the lid where it once
> got dropped, it too is perfect.
>
> Other friends who have Le Cruset have had equally variable experiences,
> with some lasting well, and others turning black and chipping at the
> drop of a cool feather! I am not impressed and will not be owning
> more. I'd rather pay the same sort of money and have a few more Aga
> saucepans! (I have one, and it's lovely, but that little milk pan sized
> saucepan alone costs about £60! I'm glad it was a present!)
> --
> Kate XXXXXX
> Lady Catherine, Wardrobe Mistress of the Chocolate Buttons
> http://www.diceyhome.free-online.co.uk
> Click on Kate's Pages and explore!

Dee Randall wrote:
>
> Thanks Kate for your long passionate answer. I appreciate it. I know I'm
> not the only person out there that has had this happen, and it's good to
> hear that I'm not the only person this has happened to that hasn't abused
> their pans.

You aren't by a long chalk... A VEEERRRYYY long chalk!
>
> I, too have had cheap enameled pans, expensive enameled tea pots, Chantal
> enameled pans, which I have three and use 2 of them, and of courese, they
> have all outperformed the cream-colored glazed Le Creuset pans. I had a
> nice Chantal enameled large stock pot which was left on a burner that
> mal-functioned and the enamel melted down. But Chantal is also expensive
> and I think perhaps needs more care than the Le Creuset regarding
> temperature.
>
> I really am envious of the people on TV that use the Le Creuset pans when I
> have none anymore. They look so lovely and the cooking in them looks so
> inviting.
>
> What is BTDT - I can't figure it.
> <snip>Ha! BTDT!
>

Been There, Done That!

--
Kate XXXXXX
Lady Catherine, Wardrobe Mistress of the Chocolate Buttons
http://www.diceyhome.free-online.co.uk
Click on Kate's Pages and explore!