As posted earlier, I'm interested in the hobby. However, the best
temperature I can muster will range from around 70 deg. F in the
winter to around 76 deg F in the summer; unless there is a relatively
simple, inexpensive way to get the temperature lower. I've read a bit
about temperature in winemaking, but haven't been able to get anything
definitive (the temperatures are all over the place).

I'm really much more interested in reds than whites (I rarely drink
white wines). I don't want to jump into the hobby, only to find out
that I have very limited options as to what I can make and that the
quality of whatever I make will always be subpar. Is it worth

"Jack" > wrote in message
om...
> As posted earlier, I'm interested in the hobby. However, the best
> temperature I can muster will range from around 70 deg. F in the
> winter to around 76 deg F in the summer; unless there is a relatively
> simple, inexpensive way to get the temperature lower.

If you're making reds, you don't need the temperature lower than that. Reds
sometimes hit 100°F during peak fermentation, and that's no problem as long
as the yeast don't die.

Tom S

>
> If you're making reds, you don't need the temperature lower than that. Reds
> sometimes hit 100°F during peak fermentation, and that's no problem as long
> as the yeast don't die.

There's also the ability to use the wet t-shirt technique to
bring the temperature down. Which you might want to use for
whites in any case. If your ambient is high and your humidity
low it can bring down the temperature by 10 to 20 F fairly
easy.

Don

By wet t-shirt, do you mean placing the fermenter in a tub of water,
draping the t-shirt over the fermenter and into the water?


(Don S) wrote in message . com>...
> >
> > If you're making reds, you don't need the temperature lower than that. Reds
> > sometimes hit 100°F during peak fermentation, and that's no problem as long
> > as the yeast don't die.
>
> There's also the ability to use the wet t-shirt technique to
> bring the temperature down. Which you might want to use for
> whites in any case. If your ambient is high and your humidity
> low it can bring down the temperature by 10 to 20 F fairly
> easy.
>
> Don

> By wet t-shirt, do you mean placing the fermenter in a tub of water,
> draping the t-shirt over the fermenter and into the water?

Yep. I had come across an article in an old Winemaking Magazine
after reading your post. The technique can lower temperatures
dramatically but it's limited by the dewpoint which I take it
is set by the relative humidity.

It seems that the closer you get to 100% humidity the nearer
you are to a 0 degree temp drop. If you have, and I'm making
these numbers up, something like 90 F ambient temp and 30%
humidity you can get up to a 30 deg F temp drop. There was
a chart published with the article but there must be forumlas
out there somewhere.

There's also the possibility of getting an old fridge and
setting your carboy inside. If your only making 23l or so
at a time that may do it but like Tom says I don't think you
need to worry about the temperature of reds all that much.

Don

Would there be any benefit to using lower temperatures at certain
times during the fermentation process? For instance, would lower
temperatures benefit the process if they could be achieved during the
first month, the last week, or some middle 2 weeks of fermentation?
(Note: I'm making these times up, just trying to get point across.)
If there was one part of the process that would enhance the overall
quality of the wine by fermenting @ lower temperatures, I could
probably comply. The room I'll use for fermentation stays relatively
dry as during the warm months of the year, we run the air
conditioning. I wouldn't mind using the wet t-shirt method and even a
fan, if I could get better quality out of a relatively short amount of
time-- say not more than 6 weeks. I just wouldn't want to have to
keep up the process for 6 mos. or anything like that.

(Don S) wrote in message . com>...
> > By wet t-shirt, do you mean placing the fermenter in a tub of water,
> > draping the t-shirt over the fermenter and into the water?
>
> Yep. I had come across an article in an old Winemaking Magazine
> after reading your post. The technique can lower temperatures
> dramatically but it's limited by the dewpoint which I take it
> is set by the relative humidity.
>
> It seems that the closer you get to 100% humidity the nearer
> you are to a 0 degree temp drop. If you have, and I'm making
> these numbers up, something like 90 F ambient temp and 30%
> humidity you can get up to a 30 deg F temp drop. There was
> a chart published with the article but there must be forumlas
> out there somewhere.
>
> There's also the possibility of getting an old fridge and
> setting your carboy inside. If your only making 23l or so
> at a time that may do it but like Tom says I don't think you
> need to worry about the temperature of reds all that much.
>
> Don

> As posted earlier, I'm interested in the hobby. However, the best
> temperature I can muster will range from around 70 deg. F in the
> winter to around 76 deg F in the summer; unless there is a relatively
> simple, inexpensive way to get the temperature lower. I've read a bit
> about temperature in winemaking, but haven't been able to get anything
> definitive (the temperatures are all over the place).

Aside from the fact that winemakers may not have complete control over
temperatures, the reason they would be "all over the place" because
it's an extraction issue. Fermentation temperature in reds is a hotly
debated (pun intended) topic - some like a spike up around 27-30 C
(81-86 F) whereas others like it cooler all the way. It just depends
on how much extraction you want really.

As Tom metioned, you wouldn't really want a temperature much lower
than 70 F (21 C) when fermenting a red anyway.

Ben

Jack, really, you are worrying over noting. Don't worry so much about
temperature. Most of us make wine in the kitchen or the bedroom or the
basement where temperature is not well controlled. You are just fine in the
70-76 deg. range. You will be surprised how well it will come out. Yes,
some serious winemakers will control temp. but most of us do not and we make
some fine wines.

Ray

"Jack" > wrote in message
om...
> As posted earlier, I'm interested in the hobby. However, the best
> temperature I can muster will range from around 70 deg. F in the
> winter to around 76 deg F in the summer; unless there is a relatively
> simple, inexpensive way to get the temperature lower. I've read a bit
> about temperature in winemaking, but haven't been able to get anything
> definitive (the temperatures are all over the place).
>
> I'm really much more interested in reds than whites (I rarely drink
> white wines). I don't want to jump into the hobby, only to find out
> that I have very limited options as to what I can make and that the
> quality of whatever I make will always be subpar. Is it worth

Thanks for all the info. I guess I'm getting a little ahead of
myself. As long as I can produce a variety of reds with good quality
at the temperatures I have, I can always worry about refining that
later.

I'm estimating the temperatures in this closet anyway, though I think
I'm pretty close. I'm going to take some readings with a thermometer
to see what I've really got. I went in there this morning and it was
noticeably cooler than the rooms outside the closet. Who knows, it
might even be a little cool in the winter, which would mean I would
ferment in another room during the cold months.

(Jack) wrote in message . com>...
> As posted earlier, I'm interested in the hobby. However, the best
> temperature I can muster will range from around 70 deg. F in the
> winter to around 76 deg F in the summer; unless there is a relatively
> simple, inexpensive way to get the temperature lower. I've read a bit
> about temperature in winemaking, but haven't been able to get anything
> definitive (the temperatures are all over the place).
>
> I'm really much more interested in reds than whites (I rarely drink
> white wines). I don't want to jump into the hobby, only to find out
> that I have very limited options as to what I can make and that the
> quality of whatever I make will always be subpar. Is it worth

Just a suggestion -- if you are going to go to the trouble of taking
readings. You may see some temperature swings, day to night, but the wine
may not experience these. It takes a while for a large vat of liquid to
adjust to changing surroundings. You might have a temperature range of
70-80 degrees in the room but only 73 to 75 degrees in the liquid. You
might put a one gal jug of water and a 5 gal jug or pail of water into the
area you are concerned about. Give them a couple of days to adjust. Then
measure the temp. in the room and each of the jugs several times a day for a
few days and see what the temperature range really is.

Let us know what you end up with. Then make your wine. I have no doubt
that it will come out great but it would be interesting to know what the
range is.

Ray


"Jack" > wrote in message
om...
> Thanks for all the info. I guess I'm getting a little ahead of
> myself. As long as I can produce a variety of reds with good quality
> at the temperatures I have, I can always worry about refining that
> later.
>
> I'm estimating the temperatures in this closet anyway, though I think
> I'm pretty close. I'm going to take some readings with a thermometer
> to see what I've really got. I went in there this morning and it was
> noticeably cooler than the rooms outside the closet. Who knows, it
> might even be a little cool in the winter, which would mean I would
> ferment in another room during the cold months.
>
> (Jack) wrote in message
. com>...
> > As posted earlier, I'm interested in the hobby. However, the best
> > temperature I can muster will range from around 70 deg. F in the
> > winter to around 76 deg F in the summer; unless there is a relatively
> > simple, inexpensive way to get the temperature lower. I've read a bit
> > about temperature in winemaking, but haven't been able to get anything
> > definitive (the temperatures are all over the place).
> >
> > I'm really much more interested in reds than whites (I rarely drink
> > white wines). I don't want to jump into the hobby, only to find out
> > that I have very limited options as to what I can make and that the
> > quality of whatever I make will always be subpar. Is it worth

>>You might put a one gal jug of water and a 5 gal jug or pail of
water into the area you are concerned about. Give them a couple of
days to adjust. Then
measure the temp. in the room and each of the jugs several times a day
for a
few days and see what the temperature range really is.<<

Excellent idea. However, until I order an equipment kit, I don't have
a 5 gal bucket. Technically, the temperature of the liquid would be
the average temperature of the room. Of course, to get a really
accurate average temperature, you would have to take many, many
readings. For now, I'm just going to take 3 readings per day, each at
the same time of day. I will try to take readings on some cold days,
and some not so cold days. This should get me within 2-3 degrees F of
the actual temperature the wine will have. By the way, my first
reading was 67 deg F @ 9:00 pm tonight. I'm afraid my average
temperature in that room is going to be a little cooler than expected
(at least during the winter). I was estimating 70 deg F in the winter
and up to 76 deg F in the summer. Looks like that might be 4 or 5
degrees high.

Your fermenting temps will be fine; you should be more concerned with
ageing and storing temps. That steady temp around 55F can be much more
difficult to find and maintain than someplace to ferment.

I ended up putting a gallon pitcher of water in this room and
measuring temperature. Basically, the temp. fluctuates between 66 deg
F and 67 deg F. From what I've read on Keller's site and from talking
to a guy @ Midwest Supplies, warm temps. are more critical during
primary fermentation. Could I use just an ordinary heating pad during
the week of primary fermentation? Any other suggestions?

@midsouth.rr.com (Jack) wrote in message . com>...
> Thanks for all the info. I guess I'm getting a little ahead of
> myself. As long as I can produce a variety of reds with good quality
> at the temperatures I have, I can always worry about refining that
> later.
>
> I'm estimating the temperatures in this closet anyway, though I think
> I'm pretty close. I'm going to take some readings with a thermometer
> to see what I've really got. I went in there this morning and it was
> noticeably cooler than the rooms outside the closet. Who knows, it
> might even be a little cool in the winter, which would mean I would
> ferment in another room during the cold months.
>

I do not think you have anything to worry about. Here's a link you may find of
interest where the writer recommends fermenting at relatively cool temps. I
have tried his theory, and it works in regards to temps (but I still do not
ferment intially in the carboy)


http://home.thezone.net/~phumber/brewing.htm



>
>I ended up putting a gallon pitcher of water in this room and
>measuring temperature. Basically, the temp. fluctuates between 66 deg
>F and 67 deg F. From what I've read on Keller's site and from talking
>to a guy @ Midwest Supplies, warm temps. are more critical during
>primary fermentation. Could I use just an ordinary heating pad during
>the week of primary fermentation? Any other suggestions?
>
(Jack) wrote in message
.com>...
>> Thanks for all the info. I guess I'm getting a little ahead of
>> myself. As long as I can produce a variety of reds with good quality
>> at the temperatures I have, I can always worry about refining that
>> later.
>>
>> I'm estimating the temperatures in this closet anyway, though I think
>> I'm pretty close. I'm going to take some readings with a thermometer
>> to see what I've really got. I went in there this morning and it was
>> noticeably cooler than the rooms outside the closet. Who knows, it
>> might even be a little cool in the winter, which would mean I would
>> ferment in another room during the cold months.

Yes, you can use a heat pad or an electric blanket. But do not put it under
the carboy. The weight could pinch the wires and cause a fire hazard.
During fermentation the heat will go up due to the yeast action. You may
find it is enough to just put a regular blanket around it. Experiment.

Ray

"Jack" > wrote in message
om...
> I ended up putting a gallon pitcher of water in this room and
> measuring temperature. Basically, the temp. fluctuates between 66 deg
> F and 67 deg F. From what I've read on Keller's site and from talking
> to a guy @ Midwest Supplies, warm temps. are more critical during
> primary fermentation. Could I use just an ordinary heating pad during
> the week of primary fermentation? Any other suggestions?
>
> @midsouth.rr.com (Jack) wrote in message
. com>...
> > Thanks for all the info. I guess I'm getting a little ahead of
> > myself. As long as I can produce a variety of reds with good quality
> > at the temperatures I have, I can always worry about refining that
> > later.
> >
> > I'm estimating the temperatures in this closet anyway, though I think
> > I'm pretty close. I'm going to take some readings with a thermometer
> > to see what I've really got. I went in there this morning and it was
> > noticeably cooler than the rooms outside the closet. Who knows, it
> > might even be a little cool in the winter, which would mean I would
> > ferment in another room during the cold months.
> >