I am pleased to report that my first batch of kiwi wine is doing great
so far. Just moved from primary to carbouy. Looks like most of the
big fermentation is already done. Tasted it and it has a really nice
taste - chardonnay-like with a little residual sugar.

I kind of adapted Jack's recipe in that I supplimented apples for some
kiwi fruit and then added 1/2 straight kiwi juice (from cooking and
straining end of season kiwis) with 1/2 boiled water when I took out
the must.

The result really has a lot of body to it (don't know what it will be
like 6 months from now).

Is still very cloudy. I hope that time and racking will solve that.

Still need to make up about 2 inches on my 5 gallon carbouy. Or do I?
Is it crucial to make up a two inch space below the neck to avoid
oxydation? I suppose I will use water for this but I may cook up a
bunch of apples I have - strain the juice and add them as well.

Anyway, if it wasn't so cloudy, I could drink this stuff right now.
Taste great to me.

Any comments or suggestions?

Thanks,

Eric

Eric Deaver wrote:

> Any comments or suggestions?

Did you use any pectic enzyme? If you heated stuff that might have set
the pectins. I'm not too familiar with kiwifruit and pectin but that
could be the source of the haze.

--
charles

"Once ... in the wilds of Afghanistan, I lost my corkscrew, and we were
forced to live on nothing but food and water for days."
- W.C. Fields

It is still pretty early on in the process so I think the haze is just
suspended yeast or other stuff. I did heat some of the kiwi to juice
them earlier. What do you mean by "set the pectins". Is this
something that can be corrected with pectin enzyme?

Thanks,

Eric


On Wed, 22 Oct 2003 16:03:42 -0400, Charles H
> wrote:

>Eric Deaver wrote:
>
>> Any comments or suggestions?
>
>Did you use any pectic enzyme? If you heated stuff that might have set
>the pectins. I'm not too familiar with kiwifruit and pectin but that
>could be the source of the haze.

Eric Deaver wrote:

> It is still pretty early on in the process so I think the haze is just
> suspended yeast or other stuff. I did heat some of the kiwi to juice
> them earlier. What do you mean by "set the pectins". Is this
> something that can be corrected with pectin enzyme?

Well, when making jams, heat is used to set the pectin so the jam
jellies... since there isn't as much water in jam is coagulates...

I think pectic enzyme will get rid of it. Negodki mentioned a test
involving denatured alcohol, you can try that and know for sure.

Since it's a young wine though I would just give it some time. If it
turns out to be something other than pectic haze, I've had good results
with Kieselsol and Chitin finings (sold under the Claro K-C mark) I'd
also check for protein haze and treat with bentonite accordingly...
processes for all of these things are in the google archives. HTH

--
charles

"Once ... in the wilds of Afghanistan, I lost my corkscrew, and we were
forced to live on nothing but food and water for days."
- W.C. Fields

"Charles H" > wrote:

> also check for protein haze and treat with bentonite accordingly...
> processes for all of these things are in the google archives. HTH

Charles,

Is there a way of checking for protein haze (besides adding bentonite or
sparkeloid and seeing if it clears)?

As I understand it, there are 4 types of hazes: pectin, protein, starch
(with some country wines), and darned-if-i-can-figure-it-out. I know how to
cure the first 3, but I'm still looking for a consistent treatment for the
last one.

Negodki wrote:

> Is there a way of checking for protein haze (besides adding bentonite or
> sparkeloid and seeing if it clears)?

Warming a sample up should be a way to detect it... the proteins
polymerize and form the haze...

SchlossGoist has a great summary of it:
http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=e....supernews.com


--
charles

"Once ... in the wilds of Afghanistan, I lost my corkscrew, and we were
forced to live on nothing but food and water for days."
- W.C. Fields

Eric,

Two inches is a lot of head space to make up. If you like the taste now
anything you add could have a detrimental effect. Personally thats why I
have so many different size carboys and jugs. I would rack to a smaller
carboy and any remaining into a 1 gallon or smaller jug or bottle. When you
next rack you can top off with the smaller jug.

Tom

"Eric Deaver" > wrote in message
...
> I am pleased to report that my first batch of kiwi wine is doing great
> so far. Just moved from primary to carbouy. Looks like most of the
> big fermentation is already done. Tasted it and it has a really nice
> taste - chardonnay-like with a little residual sugar.
>
> I kind of adapted Jack's recipe in that I supplimented apples for some
> kiwi fruit and then added 1/2 straight kiwi juice (from cooking and
> straining end of season kiwis) with 1/2 boiled water when I took out
> the must.
>
> The result really has a lot of body to it (don't know what it will be
> like 6 months from now).
>
> Is still very cloudy. I hope that time and racking will solve that.
>
> Still need to make up about 2 inches on my 5 gallon carbouy. Or do I?
> Is it crucial to make up a two inch space below the neck to avoid
> oxydation? I suppose I will use water for this but I may cook up a
> bunch of apples I have - strain the juice and add them as well.
>
> Anyway, if it wasn't so cloudy, I could drink this stuff right now.
> Taste great to me.
>
> Any comments or suggestions?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Eric

Tom,

I presume I can use any one gallon glass jar for the one gallon
amount. Do you know where I can locate a three to four gallon carboy.
I think I have about 4 gallons of wine total.

Eric


On Wed, 22 Oct 2003 12:58:12 -0700, "Tom" >
wrote:

>Eric,
>
>Two inches is a lot of head space to make up. If you like the taste now
>anything you add could have a detrimental effect. Personally thats why I
>have so many different size carboys and jugs. I would rack to a smaller
>carboy and any remaining into a 1 gallon or smaller jug or bottle. When you
>next rack you can top off with the smaller jug.
>
>Tom
>
>"Eric Deaver" > wrote in message
.. .
>> I am pleased to report that my first batch of kiwi wine is doing great
>> so far. Just moved from primary to carbouy. Looks like most of the
>> big fermentation is already done. Tasted it and it has a really nice
>> taste - chardonnay-like with a little residual sugar.
>>
>> I kind of adapted Jack's recipe in that I supplimented apples for some
>> kiwi fruit and then added 1/2 straight kiwi juice (from cooking and
>> straining end of season kiwis) with 1/2 boiled water when I took out
>> the must.
>>
>> The result really has a lot of body to it (don't know what it will be
>> like 6 months from now).
>>
>> Is still very cloudy. I hope that time and racking will solve that.
>>
>> Still need to make up about 2 inches on my 5 gallon carbouy. Or do I?
>> Is it crucial to make up a two inch space below the neck to avoid
>> oxydation? I suppose I will use water for this but I may cook up a
>> bunch of apples I have - strain the juice and add them as well.
>>
>> Anyway, if it wasn't so cloudy, I could drink this stuff right now.
>> Taste great to me.
>>
>> Any comments or suggestions?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Eric
>

If you are talking two inches at the top of a standard 5 gal carboy that is
very little. You want an inch or so anyway. You could top up with water if
you wanted. If you are talking 2 inches in a 1 gal jug, that is a bit more.
You probably should top up with something.

But do not top up with cooked apples. If you do not sorbate, that could
restart the ferment which would cloud things up again and delay everything.
If you do sorbate it would definitely change the flavor. Not good if you
already like it. I would not want Apple flavored Kiwi wine.

Racking will not clear your wine. It will get the wine off the sediment.
Give it 6 months and see if it clears on its own. If not try pectin enzyme
or betonite. But don't rush it.

Ray

"Eric Deaver" > wrote in message
...
> I am pleased to report that my first batch of kiwi wine is doing great
> so far. Just moved from primary to carbouy. Looks like most of the
> big fermentation is already done. Tasted it and it has a really nice
> taste - chardonnay-like with a little residual sugar.
>
> I kind of adapted Jack's recipe in that I supplimented apples for some
> kiwi fruit and then added 1/2 straight kiwi juice (from cooking and
> straining end of season kiwis) with 1/2 boiled water when I took out
> the must.
>
> The result really has a lot of body to it (don't know what it will be
> like 6 months from now).
>
> Is still very cloudy. I hope that time and racking will solve that.
>
> Still need to make up about 2 inches on my 5 gallon carbouy. Or do I?
> Is it crucial to make up a two inch space below the neck to avoid
> oxydation? I suppose I will use water for this but I may cook up a
> bunch of apples I have - strain the juice and add them as well.
>
> Anyway, if it wasn't so cloudy, I could drink this stuff right now.
> Taste great to me.
>
> Any comments or suggestions?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Eric

It is two inches from where the neck starts (not from the top) of a
five gallon carboy. Is that significant.

Thanks for the advice on clearing. I once had this problem with apple
wine and it was simply a matter of adding pectin enzyme. I will wait
a good six months before addressing.

Eric


On Wed, 22 Oct 2003 23:51:06 GMT, "Ray" > wrote:

>If you are talking two inches at the top of a standard 5 gal carboy that is
>very little. You want an inch or so anyway. You could top up with water if
>you wanted. If you are talking 2 inches in a 1 gal jug, that is a bit more.
>You probably should top up with something.
>
>But do not top up with cooked apples. If you do not sorbate, that could
>restart the ferment which would cloud things up again and delay everything.
>If you do sorbate it would definitely change the flavor. Not good if you
>already like it. I would not want Apple flavored Kiwi wine.
>
>Racking will not clear your wine. It will get the wine off the sediment.
>Give it 6 months and see if it clears on its own. If not try pectin enzyme
>or betonite. But don't rush it.
>
>Ray
>
>"Eric Deaver" > wrote in message
.. .
>> I am pleased to report that my first batch of kiwi wine is doing great
>> so far. Just moved from primary to carbouy. Looks like most of the
>> big fermentation is already done. Tasted it and it has a really nice
>> taste - chardonnay-like with a little residual sugar.
>>
>> I kind of adapted Jack's recipe in that I supplimented apples for some
>> kiwi fruit and then added 1/2 straight kiwi juice (from cooking and
>> straining end of season kiwis) with 1/2 boiled water when I took out
>> the must.
>>
>> The result really has a lot of body to it (don't know what it will be
>> like 6 months from now).
>>
>> Is still very cloudy. I hope that time and racking will solve that.
>>
>> Still need to make up about 2 inches on my 5 gallon carbouy. Or do I?
>> Is it crucial to make up a two inch space below the neck to avoid
>> oxydation? I suppose I will use water for this but I may cook up a
>> bunch of apples I have - strain the juice and add them as well.
>>
>> Anyway, if it wasn't so cloudy, I could drink this stuff right now.
>> Taste great to me.
>>
>> Any comments or suggestions?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Eric
>

"Eric Deaver" > wrote:

> It is two inches from where the neck starts (not from the top) of a
> five gallon carboy. Is that significant.

Yes. 1-2" from the bottom of the rubber stopper is the most airspace you
want to allow. Some people top of to 1/2", but since this doesn't allow
enough room for fluid expansion should the temperature change, I don't
recommend it.

> Thanks for the advice on clearing. I once had this problem with apple
> wine and it was simply a matter of adding pectin enzyme. I will wait
> a good six months before addressing.

> >Racking will not clear your wine. It will get the wine off the sediment.
> >Give it 6 months and see if it clears on its own. If not try pectin
enzyme
> >or betonite. But don't rush it.

Actually, racking may indeed clear the wine. The induction of fresh air
_sometimes_ helps wine to clear. Pectic enzyme works best if introduced
initially, and it only works if the haze is caused by pectin. Adding 100 ml
of methanol (or denatured alcohol) to 30 ml of wine will cause jelly-like
clots or strings if there is a pectin haze. If there is no indication of
pectin, the enzyme is a waste of time.

Wait a few months and see if it starts to clear. Every wine will clear
eventually, if you have the time to wait, but it may take years. Then, if
it's a white wine, try bentonite or sparkaloid. For a red wine, try adding
tannin (or strong tea) or egg-whites.

Eric,
next time, don't boil; the water. Unnecessary dribble from the dark ages.
Joanne

"Eric Deaver" > wrote in message
...
> I am pleased to report that my first batch of kiwi wine is doing great
> so far. Just moved from primary to carbouy. Looks like most of the
> big fermentation is already done. Tasted it and it has a really nice
> taste - chardonnay-like with a little residual sugar.
>
> I kind of adapted Jack's recipe in that I supplimented apples for some
> kiwi fruit and then added 1/2 straight kiwi juice (from cooking and
> straining end of season kiwis) with 1/2 boiled water when I took out
> the must.
>
> The result really has a lot of body to it (don't know what it will be
> like 6 months from now).
>
> Is still very cloudy. I hope that time and racking will solve that.
>
> Still need to make up about 2 inches on my 5 gallon carbouy. Or do I?
> Is it crucial to make up a two inch space below the neck to avoid
> oxydation? I suppose I will use water for this but I may cook up a
> bunch of apples I have - strain the juice and add them as well.
>
> Anyway, if it wasn't so cloudy, I could drink this stuff right now.
> Taste great to me.
>
> Any comments or suggestions?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Eric