On 14 Jan 2006 05:50:01 -0800, wrote:

>We do not eat meat for the same reason cited by you. We eat eggs from
>cage free chickens

More on the chicken thing. Since most broiler chickens have decent
but short lives, eating chicken most often contributes to decent lives for
chickens, along with the associated cds. Eating meat substitutes like the
following:

Worthington Meatless Chicken, Turkey, Ham, Vegetarian Hot Dogs
and Prosage Patties

Lightlife Chicken Nuggets and Chicken Patties

Boca Meatless Chick'n and Breakfast Patties

Quorn Meat-Free Patties, Nuggets and Cutlets

Morningstar Farms Garden Veggie Patties, Chick Patties,
Chik'n Nuggets, Corn Dogs

contributes to cds associated with raising chickens, plus those
associated with the veggies in the products, plus it contributes
to the battery method of raising hens since those products all
contain egg whites. Those "veg*n" products come out on the
less ethical side of real chicken, imo.

dh@. wrote:
> On 14 Jan 2006 05:50:01 -0800, wrote:
>
> >We do not eat meat for the same reason cited by you. We eat eggs from
> >cage free chickens
>
> More on the chicken thing. Since most broiler chickens have decent
> but short lives,

Unlikely.

> eating chicken most often contributes to decent lives for
> chickens, along with the associated cds.

What does the term "food conversion ratio" mean to you dhld?

> Eating meat substitutes like the
> following:
>
> Worthington Meatless Chicken, Turkey, Ham, Vegetarian Hot Dogs
> and Prosage Patties
>
> Lightlife Chicken Nuggets and Chicken Patties
>
> Boca Meatless Chick'n and Breakfast Patties
>
> Quorn Meat-Free Patties, Nuggets and Cutlets
>
> Morningstar Farms Garden Veggie Patties, Chick Patties,
> Chik'n Nuggets, Corn Dogs
>
> contributes to cds associated with raising chickens, plus those
> associated with the veggies in the products, plus it contributes
> to the battery method of raising hens

Presumably the poster you are replying to would not eat the
products on those grounds.

> since those products all
> contain egg whites. Those "veg*n" products come out on the
> less ethical side of real chicken, imo.

On 15 Jan 2006 15:55:57 -0800, "Dave" > wrote:

>
>dh@. wrote:
>> On 14 Jan 2006 05:50:01 -0800, wrote:
>>
>> >We do not eat meat for the same reason cited by you. We eat eggs from
>> >cage free chickens
>>
>> More on the chicken thing. Since most broiler chickens have decent
>> but short lives,
>
>Unlikely.
>
>> eating chicken most often contributes to decent lives for
>> chickens, along with the associated cds.
>
>What does the term "food conversion ratio" mean to you dhld?

Little or nothing in regards to whether or not it's cruel to animals to
raise them for food, which is what I consider to be the main issue.

>> Eating meat substitutes like the
>> following:
>>
>> Worthington Meatless Chicken, Turkey, Ham, Vegetarian Hot Dogs
>> and Prosage Patties
>>
>> Lightlife Chicken Nuggets and Chicken Patties
>>
>> Boca Meatless Chick'n and Breakfast Patties
>>
>> Quorn Meat-Free Patties, Nuggets and Cutlets
>>
>> Morningstar Farms Garden Veggie Patties, Chick Patties,
>> Chik'n Nuggets, Corn Dogs
>>
>> contributes to cds associated with raising chickens, plus those
>> associated with the veggies in the products, plus it contributes
>> to the battery method of raising hens
>
>Presumably the poster you are replying to would not eat the
>products on those grounds.

Maybe. It's more certain that he/she would not eat products
in order to deliberately contribute to decent lives for animals
raised to eat.

>> since those products all
>> contain egg whites. Those "veg*n" products come out on the
>> less ethical side of real chicken, imo.

****wit David Harrison lied:
> On 15 Jan 2006 15:55:57 -0800, "Dave" > wrote:
>
> >
> >****wit David Harrison lied:
> >> On 14 Jan 2006 05:50:01 -0800, wrote:
> >>
> >> >We do not eat meat for the same reason cited by you. We eat eggs from
> >> >cage free chickens
> >>
> >> More on the chicken thing. Since most broiler chickens have decent
> >> but short lives,
> >
> >Unlikely.
> >
> >> eating chicken most often contributes to decent lives for
> >> chickens, along with the associated cds.
> >
> >What does the term "food conversion ratio" mean to you dhld?
>
> Little or nothing in regards to whether or not it's cruel to animals to
> raise them for food, which is what I consider to be the main issue.

No, the main issue is WHY do you stupidly obsess on whether or not
livestock continue to exist, and pretend to make it appear that you are
concerned on "their" behalf?


> >> Eating meat substitutes like the
> >> following:
> >>
> >> Worthington Meatless Chicken, Turkey, Ham, Vegetarian Hot Dogs
> >> and Prosage Patties
> >>
> >> Lightlife Chicken Nuggets and Chicken Patties
> >>
> >> Boca Meatless Chick'n and Breakfast Patties
> >>
> >> Quorn Meat-Free Patties, Nuggets and Cutlets
> >>
> >> Morningstar Farms Garden Veggie Patties, Chick Patties,
> >> Chik'n Nuggets, Corn Dogs
> >>
> >> contributes to cds associated with raising chickens, plus those
> >> associated with the veggies in the products, plus it contributes
> >> to the battery method of raising hens
> >
> >Presumably the poster you are replying to would not eat the
> >products on those grounds.
>
> Maybe. It's more certain that he/she would not eat products
> in order to deliberately contribute to decent lives for animals
> raised to eat.

YOU don't choose foods in order to contribute to (bleagh) "decent
lives" for animals.

<dh@.> wrote
> On 15 Jan 2006 15:55:57 -0800, "Dave" > wrote:

>>Presumably the poster you are replying to would not eat the
>>products on those grounds.
>
> Maybe. It's more certain that he/she would not eat products
> in order to deliberately contribute to decent lives for animals
> raised to eat.

I would hope not. Nobody in their right mind thinks like that.

On Tue, 17 Jan 2006 07:30:18 GMT, "Dutch" > wrote:

>
><dh@.> wrote
>> On 15 Jan 2006 15:55:57 -0800, "Dave" > wrote:
>
>>>Presumably the poster you are replying to would not eat the
>>>products on those grounds.
>>
>> Maybe. It's more certain that he/she would not eat products
>> in order to deliberately contribute to decent lives for animals
>> raised to eat.
>
>I would hope not. Nobody in their right mind thinks like that.

Some of us do, which is why we buy cage free eggs, and
why growers can profit from making them available. You're just
too stupid to understand.

dh@. wrote:

> On Tue, 17 Jan 2006 07:30:18 GMT, "Dutch" > wrote:
>
>
>><dh@.> wrote
>>
>>>On 15 Jan 2006 15:55:57 -0800, "Dave" > wrote:
>>
>>>>Presumably the poster you are replying to would not eat the
>>>>products on those grounds.
>>>
>>> Maybe. It's more certain that he/she would not eat products
>>>in order to deliberately contribute to decent lives for animals
>>>raised to eat.
>>
>>I would hope not. Nobody in their right mind thinks like that.
>
>
> Some of us do,

You don't give a shit about quality of life for
livestock, ****wit. ALL you care about is that the
livestock exist:

Yes, it is the unborn animals that will be
born if nothing prevents that from happening,
that would experience the loss if their lives
are prevented.
****wit - 08/01/2000

What gives you the right to want to deprive
them [unborn animals] of having what life they
could have?
****wit - 10/12/2001

<dh@.> wrote
> On Tue, 17 Jan 2006 07:30:18 GMT, "Dutch" > wrote:
>
>>
>><dh@.> wrote
>>> On 15 Jan 2006 15:55:57 -0800, "Dave" > wrote:
>>
>>>>Presumably the poster you are replying to would not eat the
>>>>products on those grounds.
>>>
>>> Maybe. It's more certain that he/she would not eat products
>>> in order to deliberately contribute to decent lives for animals
>>> raised to eat.
>>
>>I would hope not. Nobody in their right mind thinks like that.
>
> Some of us do, which is why we buy cage free eggs, and
> why growers can profit from making them available.

Stop playing games ****wit. People choose to eat free range *instead of*
conventionally-produced products because they prefer to support better
animal welfare, not because they support animals "getting to experience
life". Nobody in their right mind thinks it's better to eat a free-range egg
and support a hen "getting to experience life" than to not eat an egg at
all.

dh@. wrote:
> On 15 Jan 2006 15:55:57 -0800, "Dave" > wrote:
>
> >
> >dh@. wrote:
> >> On 14 Jan 2006 05:50:01 -0800, wrote:
> >>
> >> >We do not eat meat for the same reason cited by you. We eat eggs from
> >> >cage free chickens
> >>
> >> More on the chicken thing. Since most broiler chickens have decent
> >> but short lives,
> >
> >Unlikely.
> >
> >> eating chicken most often contributes to decent lives for
> >> chickens, along with the associated cds.
> >
> >What does the term "food conversion ratio" mean to you dhld?
>
> Little or nothing

When you consume a broiler chicken you also indirectly consume all
the crops grown to feed that chicken.

> in regards to whether or not it's cruel to animals to
> raise them for food,

I believe modern industrial methods of animal so-called farming
are cruel. I don't believe raising animals for food is cruel per-se.

> which is what I consider to be the main issue.

It is one of the main issues. Environmental impact is the other.
>
> >> Eating meat substitutes like the
> >> following:
> >>
> >> Worthington Meatless Chicken, Turkey, Ham, Vegetarian Hot Dogs
> >> and Prosage Patties
> >>
> >> Lightlife Chicken Nuggets and Chicken Patties
> >>
> >> Boca Meatless Chick'n and Breakfast Patties
> >>
> >> Quorn Meat-Free Patties, Nuggets and Cutlets
> >>
> >> Morningstar Farms Garden Veggie Patties, Chick Patties,
> >> Chik'n Nuggets, Corn Dogs
> >>
> >> contributes to cds associated with raising chickens, plus those
> >> associated with the veggies in the products, plus it contributes
> >> to the battery method of raising hens
> >
> >Presumably the poster you are replying to would not eat the
> >products on those grounds.
>
> Maybe. It's more certain that he/she would not eat products
> in order to deliberately contribute to decent lives for animals
> raised to eat.

With all that spinning you do you must spend your life feeling dizzy.

> >> since those products all
> >> contain egg whites. Those "veg*n" products come out on the
> >> less ethical side of real chicken, imo.

On 17 Jan 2006 08:58:34 -0800, "Dave" > wrote:

>
>dh@. wrote:
>> On 15 Jan 2006 15:55:57 -0800, "Dave" > wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >dh@. wrote:
>> >> On 14 Jan 2006 05:50:01 -0800, wrote:
>> >>
>> >> >We do not eat meat for the same reason cited by you. We eat eggs from
>> >> >cage free chickens
>> >>
>> >> More on the chicken thing. Since most broiler chickens have decent
>> >> but short lives,
>> >
>> >Unlikely.
>> >
>> >> eating chicken most often contributes to decent lives for
>> >> chickens, along with the associated cds.
>> >
>> >What does the term "food conversion ratio" mean to you dhld?
>>
>> Little or nothing
>
>When you consume a broiler chicken you also indirectly consume all
>the crops grown to feed that chicken.
>
>> in regards to whether or not it's cruel to animals to
>> raise them for food,
>
>I believe modern industrial methods of animal so-called farming
>are cruel.

Some are. Some are not.

>I don't believe raising animals for food is cruel per-se.

Sometimes they benefit. Sometimes they don't. IF you are
actually able to understand that fact, you are probably the
only other person besides myself who can. Even IF you are
able to understand the fact, as yet you have shown no
sign of being able to understand how it's significant. Neither
has anyone else.

>> which is what I consider to be the main issue.
>
>It is one of the main issues. Environmental impact is the other.

I've often asked which wildlife and why. No one can answer.
It's apparently a secret "answer" that no one can explain or even
try to explain.

>> >> Eating meat substitutes like the
>> >> following:
>> >>
>> >> Worthington Meatless Chicken, Turkey, Ham, Vegetarian Hot Dogs
>> >> and Prosage Patties
>> >>
>> >> Lightlife Chicken Nuggets and Chicken Patties
>> >>
>> >> Boca Meatless Chick'n and Breakfast Patties
>> >>
>> >> Quorn Meat-Free Patties, Nuggets and Cutlets
>> >>
>> >> Morningstar Farms Garden Veggie Patties, Chick Patties,
>> >> Chik'n Nuggets, Corn Dogs
>> >>
>> >> contributes to cds associated with raising chickens, plus those
>> >> associated with the veggies in the products, plus it contributes
>> >> to the battery method of raising hens
>> >
>> >Presumably the poster you are replying to would not eat the
>> >products on those grounds.
>>
>> Maybe. It's more certain that he/she would not eat products
>> in order to deliberately contribute to decent lives for animals
>> raised to eat.
>
>With all that spinning you do

Like what, exactly?

****wit David Harrison, hick in Buford, GA, lied:

> On 17 Jan 2006 08:58:34 -0800, "Dave" > wrote:
>
>
>>****wit David Harrison, hick in Buford, GA, lied:
>>
>>>On 15 Jan 2006 15:55:57 -0800, "Dave" > wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>****wit David Harrison, hick in Buford, GA, lied:
>>>>
>>>>>On 14 Jan 2006 05:50:01 -0800, wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>We do not eat meat for the same reason cited by you. We eat eggs from
>>>>>>cage free chickens
>>>>>
>>>>> More on the chicken thing. Since most broiler chickens have decent
>>>>>but short lives,
>>>>
>>>>Unlikely.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>eating chicken most often contributes to decent lives for
>>>>>chickens, along with the associated cds.
>>>>
>>>>What does the term "food conversion ratio" mean to you dhld?
>>>
>>> Little or nothing
>>
>>When you consume a broiler chicken you also indirectly consume all
>>the crops grown to feed that chicken.
>>
>>
>>>in regards to whether or not it's cruel to animals to
>>>raise them for food,
>>
>>I believe modern industrial methods of animal so-called farming
>>are cruel.
>
>
> Some are. Some are not.

Not that you care, ****wit. ALL you care about is that
livestock exist.


>>I don't believe raising animals for food is cruel per-se.

****wit does, Dave. He believes killing animals for
human consumption requires some kind of mitigation.


>
>
> Sometimes they benefit. Sometimes they don't

NO animals "benefit" from coming into existence, ****wit.



>>>which is what I consider to be the main issue.
>>
>>It is one of the main issues. Environmental impact is the other.
>
>
> I've often asked which wildlife and why. No one can answer.

No one will *bother* to answer, ****wit, because it
isn't a serious question; it's just another of your
****witted attempts to waste people's time, and for you
to avoid answering the *real* question: WHY are you so
obsessed with livestock continuing to exist?

Why won't you answer the question, ****wit?


>>>>>Eating meat substitutes like the
>>>>>following:
>>>>>
>>>>>Worthington Meatless Chicken, Turkey, Ham, Vegetarian Hot Dogs
>>>>>and Prosage Patties
>>>>>
>>>>>Lightlife Chicken Nuggets and Chicken Patties
>>>>>
>>>>>Boca Meatless Chick'n and Breakfast Patties
>>>>>
>>>>>Quorn Meat-Free Patties, Nuggets and Cutlets
>>>>>
>>>>>Morningstar Farms Garden Veggie Patties, Chick Patties,
>>>>>Chik'n Nuggets, Corn Dogs
>>>>>
>>>>>contributes to cds associated with raising chickens, plus those
>>>>>associated with the veggies in the products, plus it contributes
>>>>>to the battery method of raising hens
>>>>
>>>>Presumably the poster you are replying to would not eat the
>>>>products on those grounds.
>>>
>>> Maybe. It's more certain that he/she would not eat products
>>>in order to deliberately contribute to decent lives for animals
>>>raised to eat.
>>
>>With all that spinning you do
>
>
> Like what, exactly?

Your "animals' 'getting to experience life' is a
'benefit'" spinning, ****WIT - the spinning that I
don't let you get away with.

dh@. wrote:
> On 17 Jan 2006 08:58:34 -0800, "Dave" > wrote:
>
> >
> >dh@. wrote:
> >> On 15 Jan 2006 15:55:57 -0800, "Dave" > wrote:
> >>
> >> >
> >> >dh@. wrote:
> >> >> On 14 Jan 2006 05:50:01 -0800, wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> >We do not eat meat for the same reason cited by you. We eat eggs from
> >> >> >cage free chickens
> >> >>
> >> >> More on the chicken thing. Since most broiler chickens have decent
> >> >> but short lives,
> >> >
> >> >Unlikely.
> >> >
> >> >> eating chicken most often contributes to decent lives for
> >> >> chickens, along with the associated cds.
> >> >
> >> >What does the term "food conversion ratio" mean to you dhld?
> >>
> >> Little or nothing
> >
> >When you consume a broiler chicken you also indirectly consume all
> >the crops grown to feed that chicken.
> >
> >> in regards to whether or not it's cruel to animals to
> >> raise them for food,
> >
> >I believe modern industrial methods of animal so-called farming
> >are cruel.
>
> Some are. Some are not.

I am not aware of any modern industrial methods of animal
so-called farming that are not cruel. Note that grass fed beef
is not a modern industrial method.
>
> >I don't believe raising animals for food is cruel per-se.
>
> Sometimes they benefit. Sometimes they don't. IF you are
> actually able to understand that fact, you are probably the
> only other person besides myself who can. Even IF you are
> able to understand the fact, as yet you have shown no
> sign of being able to understand how it's significant. Neither
> has anyone else.
>
> >> which is what I consider to be the main issue.
> >
> >It is one of the main issues. Environmental impact is the other.
>
> I've often asked which wildlife and why. No one can answer.
> It's apparently a secret "answer" that no one can explain or even
> try to explain.

Environmental impact is not just about habitat destruction.
Eg. Animal wastes, routine use of antibiotics associated
with the emergence of superbugs, inefficient use of
non-renewable resources,
>
> >> >> Eating meat substitutes like the
> >> >> following:
> >> >>
> >> >> Worthington Meatless Chicken, Turkey, Ham, Vegetarian Hot Dogs
> >> >> and Prosage Patties
> >> >>
> >> >> Lightlife Chicken Nuggets and Chicken Patties
> >> >>
> >> >> Boca Meatless Chick'n and Breakfast Patties
> >> >>
> >> >> Quorn Meat-Free Patties, Nuggets and Cutlets
> >> >>
> >> >> Morningstar Farms Garden Veggie Patties, Chick Patties,
> >> >> Chik'n Nuggets, Corn Dogs
> >> >>
> >> >> contributes to cds associated with raising chickens, plus those
> >> >> associated with the veggies in the products, plus it contributes
> >> >> to the battery method of raising hens
> >> >
> >> >Presumably the poster you are replying to would not eat the
> >> >products on those grounds.
> >>
> >> Maybe. It's more certain that he/she would not eat products
> >> in order to deliberately contribute to decent lives for animals
> >> raised to eat.
> >
> >With all that spinning you do
>
> Like what, exactly?

What you just wrote.

"Dave" > in oups.com:

>> Eating meat substitutes like the following:
>>
>> Worthington Meatless Chicken, Turkey, Ham, Vegetarian Hot Dogs
>> and Prosage Patties
>>
>> Lightlife Chicken Nuggets and Chicken Patties
>>
>> Boca Meatless Chick'n and Breakfast Patties
>>
>> Quorn Meat-Free Patties, Nuggets and Cutlets
>>
>> Morningstar Farms Garden Veggie Patties, Chick Patties,
>> Chik'n Nuggets, Corn Dogs
>>
>> contributes to cds associated with raising chickens, plus those
>> associated with the veggies in the products, plus it contributes to
>> the battery method of raising hens
>
> Presumably the poster you are replying to would not eat the
> products on those grounds.

i doubt many established v's eat any of those very often. i've had some of those boca things about 5 to 8 times in my whole life
(prepared/given to me by a nonveggie). i've been veggie since the early 80's

--
only a god with a sense of cruel irony would wait until the religiots were behind the door before passing out (i.e., distributing :-)
) the brains.
http://web.archive.org/web/200411280...8_20041028.htm

****wit David Harrison lied:

> On 14 Jan 2006 05:50:01 -0800, wrote:
>
>
>>We do not eat meat for the same reason cited by you. We eat eggs from
>>cage free chickens
>
>
> More on the chicken thing. Since most broiler chickens have decent
> but short lives,

Short for sure. Your opinion about their lives being
"decent" is meaningless.


> eating chicken most often contributes to decent lives for
> chickens,

Causing chickens or any other livestock animals to live
is not doing something nice for them.