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>From: Keynes
>Newsgroups: alt.philosophy, talk.philosophy.misc, talk.politics.animals,
>misc.rural, uk.business.agriculture, alt.food.vegan
>Date: Thu, 01 Jan 2004 21:49:38 -0600

>On Fri, 02 Jan 2004 02:25:22 GMT, "Rubystars" > wrote:
>
>>
>>"Jonathan Ball" > wrote in message
thlink.net...
>>> Rubystars wrote:
>>>
>>> > "Jonathan Ball" > wrote in message
>>> > ...
>>> >
>>> >>OF COURSE "this country" could be fed without raising any
>>> >>farm animals.
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > That would force a lot of people to go on vegan diets though and most
>>> > wouldn't know how to do so properly, even some who do know how to do the
>>> > right things have to stop.
>>>
>>> They could figure it out. The point is, farm animals
>>> aren't necessary to feed people.
>>
>>At the population we have now, I think they are.
>>
>>If there was a smaller population broken up into villages, etc. then sure,
>>we wouldn't need farm animals, but we do right now.
>>
>>-Rubystars
>
>It's just customary. Pre WWII folks in the US ate less than half as
>much meat per capita. A political candidate ran on the platform
>of 'a chicken in every pot'. Even meat on sundays was a luxury
>for many (bacon possibly excepted).

Can you name that politician? And was not the promise based on more jobs?

>
>Now we have an obesity-diabetes problem that's becoming epidemic.
>There's an indian tribe split by the mexican border. Those on the US side
>are nearly 100% obese and diabetic. Those on the mexican side kept their
>traditional diet and don't even have those problems.

Can you name that tribe? Where are they?

>
>There's also the problem with the stink and pollution of
>factory farming and the increased likelyhood (near certainty)
>of epidemic e coli and salmonella infections. I don't mention the
>morality of killing animals. Animals kill animals even if we don't.
>All life feeds on other life. Those poor birds, mice, snakes and
>bugs in the fields are eating one another.
By what do you measure the wealth of a
birds, mice, snakes and bugs in the fields?

The bird would probably feel wealthy if it had many bugs and seed to eat. The
mouse might consider a few seeds to be of some wealth. The snake would feel
wealthy with too many mice in the field.

Fact is every rung in the food chain feel wealthy if there is an abundance of a
certain food item, and less competiton for the resources.

>But if I had to kill animals
>to eat myself, I would only do it in times of direst emergency.

And you would have to adjust to eating meats, where as you would be in
competition with the omnivore who regularly eats vegetables and meats.

>
>It takes about nine pounds of feed to make a pound of beef,
>not counting quite a bit of water both for cows and feed.
>(You have to feed a cow for years. That feed is gone away.)

Nope it is recyled as nitrogen-rich fertilizer.

>Purely grass fed beef would be economical, but feeding them
>is wasteful. Chickens, turkeys and fish have a 2-3 pound feed
>to one pound of meat ratio. Eggs are even more efficient.
>(Unfortunately, livestock is chock full of added hormones
>and antibiotics. That can't be good in the long run.)
>
>Most of the US grain goes into feed, with excesses exported to
>feed livestock in other countries. If we ate plants directly we'd have
>a huge surplus (which would be a bit of an economic problem since
>grain is already grown at a loss, requiring subsidies).

Are you sure there wouldn't be more competiton for vegetables, thus driving the
prices up?

>
>Most other countries don't eat as much meat as we do.
>Devout hindus and buddhists eat no meat. Our diet is too
>cheap and calorie rich for our own good. A mosty vegetarian
>diet can be nutritionally balanced and quite delicious.
>It's just not in our western culture these days to even think
>about it. I love meat - fatty meat - myself, and eat it often.
>But cuban rice and beans is delicious. South Indian cooking
>is outstanding. Chinese vegetable stews (sometimes flavored
>with a bit of meat) are my specialty. And we often have meat-free
>pasta meals around here. Meat is like candy.
>You can get too much for your own good.
>

I try to eat a balanced diet myself, Italian, Chinese, Mexican, and good old
American foods. I'd even eat a Vegan if I had to.

caveat lector

Halcitron misc.survivalism
Check your six and know when to duck.
NRA Member since 2002
The Law of the Land, is the weapon in your hand.

Smith & Wesson starts where the Bill of Rights stop.

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