Wonderful information, I envy your references. Can you actually say if cha2
connection to tu2 is a well-establishe fact and if yes, can you point me
toward a ref? If its too difficult, forget it.

One thing though (about cha being as I aid - "steeped drink".
Let us follow Einstein and and put together several thought experiments.

Experiment one:
Person A who is a guest of Person B said in presence of others in Chinese (I
am using the mix of English and Chinese so its easier for everyone to
follow):
" I want some CHA".
Person B asked "What kind?"
Person A : "I'd like some Chrisantemun flower CHA if possible"

If CHA HAS to be C. sinensis the person B would be surprised with the
request for Chrisantemun flower variety.
If CHA is a general "steeped drink", he will not be surprised.

My questions to you:
1. Will B be surprized? and if yes
2. How A should ask for a non-C. sinensis tea?

Cheers,

Alex.




"Livio Zanini" > wrote in message
...
>
>> Comment: I think that translating "cha" as "tea" while 100% right for
>> general purposes, for people deeply interested in tea certain notes
>> should
>> be added. The full and precise meaning of "Cha" is "steeped drink".
> Although
>> 99% of the time it is made of C. sinensis, many other plants can be used.
>> Translating it to English "tea" is still the best because in English
>> "tea"
>> can also be non-C. sinensis (Camomille tea, etc.).
>> Addition: There is a Chinese character that means :leaves of C.
> sinensis" -
>> its ming2. It combines normal character ming - "name" with grass radical
>> (same as on the top of "cha"). Unicode index U+8317.
>
>
> Just a few remarks: The character "cha2" seems to be the graphical
> evolution
> of "tu2", a character that was used in ancient times to indicate a kind of
> "bitter vegetable". "Cha2" in its present shape, came in to use only in
> the
> Tang dynasty (8th century), with the composition of "Chajing" by Lu Yu,
> but
> it seems that the character "tu2" was already pronunced "cha2" when used
> to
> indicate C. sinensis in order to distinguis it from other "bitter plants".
> Regard to "ming2", ancient lexicographical dictionaries define it as "buds
> of tu2", which seems to confirm the identification of "tu2" with tea.
> It would also be useful to remind that tea was boiled and not steeped by
> the
> time the character "cha2" came in to use.
> Apart its historical development, the Chinese character "cha2", as its
> equivalent English word "tea", indicates basically three things: a plant,
> the dried leaves of this plant and the beverage prepared with these
> leaves.
> As a plant "cha2" indicates solely C. sinensis. If followed by the term
> "shu3" (genus), it indicates the whole genus Camellia, out of which C.
> sinensis is the only "drinkable" specie. As dry leaves and beverage it
> indicates mainly the leaves of C. sinensis and the beverage prepared with
> them. It can also be used for the leaves of other plants used for
> preparing
> drinks, but always preceded by the name of the plant: e.g. juhua cha
> (Chrisantemun flowers tea), xingren cha (almond porridge), kuding cha
> (beverage made with Ilex kudingcha).
>
>