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Historic (rec.food.historic) Discussing and discovering how food was made and prepared way back when--From ancient times down until (& possibly including or even going slightly beyond) the times when industrial revolution began to change our lives. |
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Said to be the first ever printed recipe for bread from the anonymous
'The Good Huswife's Haindmaide for the Kitchen' of 1594. THE MAKING OF FINE MANCHET Take half a bushell of fine flower twise boulted, and a gallon of faire luke warm water, almost a handful of white salt, and almost a pinte of yest, then temper all these together, without any more liquor, as hard as ye can handle it: then let it lie halfe an hower, then take it up, and make your Manchetts, and let them stand almost an hower in the oven. Memorandum, that of every bushell of meale may be made five and twentie caste of bread, and every loaf to way a pounde besyde the chesill. Manchet is the name for the small fine round white loaves of the period. A bushell is a measure of volume, about 60lb of flour. Bolting is the sifting of the meal to remove the bran and make white flour. The 'caste' of bread is an old quantity of bread, two or three loaves according to their size. The 'chesill' is the finer wheat germ and small dross which is removed from the flour after the coarse bran. Interesting that the dough is made up as 'hard' (dry, stiff?) as possible. No high hydration bread there. Also the time taken in the making is very short. I can't believe an hour in the oven is the baking time, maybe an hour rising in the warm oven before the fire is lit. The yeast is presumably brewers yeast in solution, a by-product of beer making. Tim w |
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In article >, Tim W > wrote:
>Said to be the first ever printed recipe for bread from the anonymous > > 'The Good Huswife's Haindmaide for the Kitchen' of 1594. >Interesting that the dough is made up as 'hard' (dry, stiff?) as possible. >No high hydration bread there. Also the time taken in the making is very >short. I can't believe an hour in the oven is the baking time, maybe an hour >rising in the warm oven before the fire is lit. The yeast is presumably >brewers yeast in solution, a by-product of beer making. I don't believe that's quite how the ovens of the time worked. The bread ovens would be of the domed sort, and the method of use was to jam the burning material in there until it was up to temperature, then pull all the embers out, give it a quick mopping, and then do the baking with the residual heat. Given that, there really isn't a warm oven for the bread to rise in, nor a way to simply light the fire. I suspect that the instructions are correct, given the technology and ingredients of the day. JB ------------ Jeff Berry - http://www.aspiringluddite.com - food, musings, etc. |
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![]() "Jeff Berry" > wrote in message ... > In article >, Tim W > > wrote: >>Said to be the first ever printed recipe for bread from the anonymous >> >> 'The Good Huswife's Haindmaide for the Kitchen' of 1594. >>.... I can't believe an hour in the oven is the baking time, maybe an hour >>rising in the warm oven before the fire is lit. .... > > I don't believe that's quite how the ovens of the time worked. The bread > ovens would be of the domed sort, and the method of use was to jam the > burning material in there until it was up to temperature, then pull all > the > embers out, give it a quick mopping, and then do the baking with the > residual heat. > > Given that, there really isn't a warm oven for the bread to rise in, nor a > way to simply light the fire. I suspect that the instructions are > correct, > given the technology and ingredients of the day. > If a wood fired oven is used daily I thougth it might be a warm place for proving the loaves before it was lit, but I can't be right because the timing would still be all wrong, you would have to remove them and wait at least another hour while you fired the oven with faggots. Anyway those timings can't be too accurate or critical in a world without clocks. They must equate almost to "prove for a short while then bake slow and long" Tim W |
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![]() "Tim W" > wrote in message ... > > "Jeff Berry" > wrote in message > ... >> In article >, Tim W > >> wrote: >>>Said to be the first ever printed recipe for bread from the anonymous >>> >>> 'The Good Huswife's Haindmaide for the Kitchen' of 1594. >>>.... I can't believe an hour in the oven is the baking time, maybe an >>>hour >>>rising in the warm oven before the fire is lit. .... > >> >> I don't believe that's quite how the ovens of the time worked. The bread >> ovens would be of the domed sort, and the method of use was to jam the >> burning material in there until it was up to temperature, then pull all >> the >> embers out, give it a quick mopping, and then do the baking with the >> residual heat. >> >> Given that, there really isn't a warm oven for the bread to rise in, nor >> a >> way to simply light the fire. I suspect that the instructions are >> correct, >> given the technology and ingredients of the day. >> > > > If a wood fired oven is used daily I thougth it might be a warm place for > proving the loaves before it was lit, but I can't be right because the > timing would still be all wrong, you would have to remove them and wait at > least another hour while you fired the oven with faggots. > > Anyway those timings can't be too accurate or critical in a world without > clocks. They must equate almost to "prove for a short while then bake slow > and long" Ahh but you'm forgettin' the sun and sun dials, luvvie ![]() -- -- https://www.shop.helpforheroes.org.uk/ |
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In article >, Tim W > wrote:
>If a wood fired oven is used daily I thougth it might be a warm place for >proving the loaves before it was lit, but I can't be right because the >timing would still be all wrong, you would have to remove them and wait at >least another hour while you fired the oven with faggots. The kitchen itself is probably pretty warm most of the time. >Anyway those timings can't be too accurate or critical in a world without >clocks. They must equate almost to "prove for a short while then bake slow >and long" A fair point. Depending on where you were and local custom, there might be fairly accurate clocks and/or ringing of church bells to get you pretty close. On the other hand, once you've done it a few times, you probably developed a pretty good idea of when it was ready to go into the oven. (For that matter, "half an hour," might really mean "get the oven ready and when it's ready put the bread in.") A larger question is whether the recipe was actually intended to be used or was intended as an illustrative example of "how things work." JB ------------ Jeff Berry - http://www.aspiringluddite.com - food, musings, etc. |
Posted to alt.bread.recipes,rec.food.historic
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![]() "Tim W" > wrote in message ... > > "Jeff Berry" > wrote in message > ... >> In article >, Tim W > >> wrote: >>>Said to be the first ever printed recipe for bread from the anonymous >>> >>> 'The Good Huswife's Haindmaide for the Kitchen' of 1594. >>>.... I can't believe an hour in the oven is the baking time, maybe an >>>hour >>>rising in the warm oven before the fire is lit. .... > >> >> I don't believe that's quite how the ovens of the time worked. The bread >> ovens would be of the domed sort, and the method of use was to jam the >> burning material in there until it was up to temperature, then pull all >> the >> embers out, give it a quick mopping, and then do the baking with the >> residual heat. >> >> Given that, there really isn't a warm oven for the bread to rise in, nor >> a >> way to simply light the fire. I suspect that the instructions are >> correct, >> given the technology and ingredients of the day. >> > > > If a wood fired oven is used daily I thougth it might be a warm place for > proving the loaves before it was lit, but I can't be right because the > timing would still be all wrong, you would have to remove them and wait at > least another hour while you fired the oven with faggots. > > Anyway those timings can't be too accurate or critical in a world without > clocks. They must equate almost to "prove for a short while then bake slow > and long" > > Tim W I doubt that a wood fired oven was used every day. For example, in rural England in C19 and in France, firing up the oven was a weekly affair. Graham |
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![]() "graham" > wrote in message ... > > "Tim W" > wrote in message > ... >> >> "Jeff Berry" > wrote in message >> ... >>> In article >, Tim W > >>> wrote: >>>>Said to be the first ever printed recipe for bread from the anonymous >>>> >>>> 'The Good Huswife's Haindmaide for the Kitchen' of 1594. >>>>.... I can't believe an hour in the oven is the baking time, maybe an >>>>hour >>>>rising in the warm oven before the fire is lit. .... >> >>> >>> I don't believe that's quite how the ovens of the time worked. The >>> bread >>> ovens would be of the domed sort, and the method of use was to jam the >>> burning material in there until it was up to temperature, then pull all >>> the >>> embers out, give it a quick mopping, and then do the baking with the >>> residual heat. >>> >>> Given that, there really isn't a warm oven for the bread to rise in, nor >>> a >>> way to simply light the fire. I suspect that the instructions are >>> correct, >>> given the technology and ingredients of the day. >>> >> >> >> If a wood fired oven is used daily I thougth it might be a warm place for >> proving the loaves before it was lit, but I can't be right because the >> timing would still be all wrong, you would have to remove them and wait >> at least another hour while you fired the oven with faggots. >> >> Anyway those timings can't be too accurate or critical in a world without >> clocks. They must equate almost to "prove for a short while then bake >> slow and long" >> > I doubt that a wood fired oven was used every day. For example, in rural > England in C19 and in France, firing up the oven was a weekly affair. > Graham That may well have been the case where they had a big enough oven but there is an old oven been uncovered in the fireplace in my cottage which had a floor measuring about 2' x 3'. I don't suppose you could get enough of a fire going in anything much smaller. The floor space is about the same as you would have in a modern household double oven with shelves. It could only have served the house and must have been fired as required - daily if there were enough mouths to feed. That recipe for Manchet though - I don't have the full context I just found it quoted as is: it's titled The Good Houswife's Handmaid but the quantities are for making about 90 x 1lb Manchets. Not at all household quantities and it would need a very big oven to bake them even in two batches. So that just doesn't make sense. Tim w |
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