On Mon, 22 Feb 2016 12:02:12 -0800 (PST), Helpful person
> wrote:

>On Monday, February 22, 2016 at 2:33:46 PM UTC-5, Jeßus wrote:
>> On Mon, 22 Feb 2016 11:24:00 -0800 (PST), Helpful person
>
>> >
>> >It's unfortunate that what I consider the best grapes are not available in the US. The large black seeded grapes still available in parts of Europe are wonderful. They taste of grapes, not just sugar like most US fruit. The flesh is "fruit like", not crunchy like nearly all the seedless grapes in the US.
>>
>> I'm with you 100% there. I'm not a fan of the modern varieties,
>> especially those huge seedless grapes. The flavour and texture just
>> isn't right. And I *like* the seeds.
>
>It seems to get worse every year. Even in California, where the local markets sell terrific fruit, everything is beginning to taste the same. Citrus is no longer sour, strawberries have to be sugary, plums have lost their acidity while retaining only their sweetness etc. It's sad.

Yes, the problem is across the board with fruits, and I include things
like tomatoes in that too. Which is why there has been a resurgence in
'heritage' varieties. Most of my fruit trees are heritage varieties -
the fruit isn't always pretty to look at but taste fantastic. My
favourite apple is Cox's orange pippin - a small and 'ugly' apple -
but the taste and texture is far better than any of the modern
commercial varieties.

>Now being on the East coast I can no longer get excited about buying fruit. Occasionally I'll find good apples, manderine oranges, concord grapes or melon.

By some freak chance I managed to find a bag of excellent oranges
about three years ago. What a revelation they were! Australia used to
grow vast quantities of oranges and they were fine, now they all come
from South America and never, ever taste fresh. Almost impossible to
find anything other than Valencias as well. I've also had to give up
on bananas, unfortunately. Never properly ripe and once again the
varieties used just aren't the same.

On Monday, February 22, 2016 at 3:21:46 PM UTC-5, Jeßus wrote:
> On Mon, 22 Feb 2016 12:02:12 -0800 (PST), Helpful person wrote:
>
> >On Monday, February 22, 2016 at 2:33:46 PM UTC-5, Jeßus wrote:
> >> On Mon, 22 Feb 2016 11:24:00 -0800 (PST), Helpful person
> >
> >> >
> >> >It's unfortunate that what I consider the best grapes are not available in the US. The large black seeded grapes still available in parts of Europe are wonderful. They taste of grapes, not just sugar like most US fruit. The flesh is "fruit like", not crunchy like nearly all the seedless grapes in the US.
> >>
> >> I'm with you 100% there. I'm not a fan of the modern varieties,
> >> especially those huge seedless grapes. The flavour and texture just
> >> isn't right. And I *like* the seeds.
> >
> >It seems to get worse every year. Even in California, where the local markets sell terrific fruit, everything is beginning to taste the same. Citrus is no longer sour, strawberries have to be sugary, plums have lost their acidity while retaining only their sweetness etc. It's sad.
>
> Yes, the problem is across the board with fruits, and I include things
> like tomatoes in that too. Which is why there has been a resurgence in
> 'heritage' varieties. Most of my fruit trees are heritage varieties -
> the fruit isn't always pretty to look at but taste fantastic. My
> favourite apple is Cox's orange pippin - a small and 'ugly' apple -
> but the taste and texture is far better than any of the modern
> commercial varieties.

I wouldn't call a Cox's orange pippin particularly ugly. Now Bramleys are ugly. They are the size of a grapefruit, almost as tart as a lemon and used for pies. I used to like eating them as my mother cut them up for the pie. Cox's are good. i also like russets.

I agree with tomatoes. The acidity is needed to stimulate the taste buds. Store bought, apart from being old, are now also on the sweet side. That's OK for yellow tomatoes, but not for red.


>
> >Now being on the East coast I can no longer get excited about buying fruit. Occasionally I'll find good apples, manderine oranges, concord grapes or melon.
>
> By some freak chance I managed to find a bag of excellent oranges
> about three years ago. What a revelation they were! Australia used to
> grow vast quantities of oranges and they were fine, now they all come
> from South America and never, ever taste fresh. Almost impossible to
> find anything other than Valencias as well. I've also had to give up
> on bananas, unfortunately. Never properly ripe and once again the
> varieties used just aren't the same.

When I was a kid relatives in Israel used to send us a crate of oranges each year. They were the best oranges I've ever had.

http://www.richardfisher.com

On Tue, 23 Feb 2016 05:37:51 -0800 (PST), Helpful person
> wrote:

>On Monday, February 22, 2016 at 3:21:46 PM UTC-5, Jeßus wrote:
>> On Mon, 22 Feb 2016 12:02:12 -0800 (PST), Helpful person wrote:
>>
>> >On Monday, February 22, 2016 at 2:33:46 PM UTC-5, Jeßus wrote:
>> >> On Mon, 22 Feb 2016 11:24:00 -0800 (PST), Helpful person
>> >
>> >> >
>> >> >It's unfortunate that what I consider the best grapes are not available in the US. The large black seeded grapes still available in parts of Europe are wonderful. They taste of grapes, not just sugar like most US fruit. The flesh is "fruit like", not crunchy like nearly all the seedless grapes in the US.
>> >>
>> >> I'm with you 100% there. I'm not a fan of the modern varieties,
>> >> especially those huge seedless grapes. The flavour and texture just
>> >> isn't right. And I *like* the seeds.
>> >
>> >It seems to get worse every year. Even in California, where the local markets sell terrific fruit, everything is beginning to taste the same. Citrus is no longer sour, strawberries have to be sugary, plums have lost their acidity while retaining only their sweetness etc. It's sad.
>>
>> Yes, the problem is across the board with fruits, and I include things
>> like tomatoes in that too. Which is why there has been a resurgence in
>> 'heritage' varieties. Most of my fruit trees are heritage varieties -
>> the fruit isn't always pretty to look at but taste fantastic. My
>> favourite apple is Cox's orange pippin - a small and 'ugly' apple -
>> but the taste and texture is far better than any of the modern
>> commercial varieties.
>
>I wouldn't call a Cox's orange pippin particularly ugly.

I should have worded that better - I don't personally think they're
ugly, but other people do. Or at least places like supermarkets do.

>Now Bramleys are ugly.

I have a Bramley here, haven't had any fruit from the tree as yet,
come to think of it... my Granny Smiths have produced fruit, however.

>They are the size of a grapefruit, almost as tart as a lemon and used for pies.
>I used to like eating them as my mother cut them up for the pie. Cox's are good.
>i also like russets.

Russets are good too, I might even have one in my orchard?

>I agree with tomatoes. The acidity is needed to stimulate the taste buds.
>Store bought, apart from being old, are now also on the sweet side. That's
>OK for yellow tomatoes, but not for red.
>
>
>>
>> >Now being on the East coast I can no longer get excited about buying fruit. Occasionally I'll find good apples, manderine oranges, concord grapes or melon.
>>
>> By some freak chance I managed to find a bag of excellent oranges
>> about three years ago. What a revelation they were! Australia used to
>> grow vast quantities of oranges and they were fine, now they all come
>> from South America and never, ever taste fresh. Almost impossible to
>> find anything other than Valencias as well. I've also had to give up
>> on bananas, unfortunately. Never properly ripe and once again the
>> varieties used just aren't the same.
>
>When I was a kid relatives in Israel used to send us a crate of oranges each year. They were the best oranges I've ever had.

Lucky you!