The plates seem small so I was wondering if pre-grinding the beans at
coarsest setting then regrinding at finest for espresso grind?

Any comments about this technique?

Michael

On Wed, 25 Sep 2013 20:51:22 -0400, mawil1013 > wrote:

> The plates seem small so I was wondering if pre-grinding the beans at
> coarsest setting then regrinding at finest for espresso grind?
>
> Any comments about this technique?
>
All the commercial grinders you see in grocery stores say not put the
beans through twice. No idea why, but the logical assumption is that
doing it might clog the machine.


--
Food is an important part of a balanced diet.

On 9/26/2013 1:02 AM, sf wrote:
> On Wed, 25 Sep 2013 20:51:22 -0400, mawil1013 > wrote:
>
>> The plates seem small so I was wondering if pre-grinding the beans at
>> coarsest setting then regrinding at finest for espresso grind?
>>
>> Any comments about this technique?
>>
> All the commercial grinders you see in grocery stores say not put the
> beans through twice. No idea why, but the logical assumption is that
> doing it might clog the machine.
>
>
I'm looking at it wondering how it works, how can a huge bean get in
there if it's adjusted for fine! LOL, it looks like there are side bars
that do the initial breaking down of the bean structure?

On Thu, 26 Sep 2013 07:13:52 -0400, mawil1013 > wrote:

> On 9/26/2013 1:02 AM, sf wrote:
> > On Wed, 25 Sep 2013 20:51:22 -0400, mawil1013 > wrote:
> >
> >> The plates seem small so I was wondering if pre-grinding the beans at
> >> coarsest setting then regrinding at finest for espresso grind?
> >>
> >> Any comments about this technique?
> >>
> > All the commercial grinders you see in grocery stores say not put the
> > beans through twice. No idea why, but the logical assumption is that
> > doing it might clog the machine.
> >
> >
> I'm looking at it wondering how it works, how can a huge bean get in
> there if it's adjusted for fine! LOL, it looks like there are side bars
> that do the initial breaking down of the bean structure?

Have you even tried it yet? Stop over analyzing, plug it in and do
it! You might be pleasantly surprised.

--
Food is an important part of a balanced diet.

On 9/25/13 8:51 PM, mawil1013 wrote:
> The plates seem small so I was wondering if pre-grinding the beans at
> coarsest setting then regrinding at finest for espresso grind?
>
> Any comments about this technique?

It's not necessary. The mill plates have a tapered fit -- which is how
the whole beans even enter the grinding area -- so this is, in effect,
already being done.

BTW, this very grinder has been around for about 25 years, under at
least a dozen different brand names, with slightly modified housing, and
all priced around $60. The most frequent criticisms of it are its small
capacity, static electricity problems, and the fact that the it usually
blows some coffee all over the counter (Many people place it inside a
box or something similar to limit the mess.)

I had one and quickly moved up to something better. YMMV.

-- Larry

On 9/26/2013 10:47 AM, sf wrote:
> On Thu, 26 Sep 2013 07:13:52 -0400, mawil1013 > wrote:
>
>> On 9/26/2013 1:02 AM, sf wrote:
>>> On Wed, 25 Sep 2013 20:51:22 -0400, mawil1013 > wrote:
>>>
>>>> The plates seem small so I was wondering if pre-grinding the beans at
>>>> coarsest setting then regrinding at finest for espresso grind?
>>>>
>>>> Any comments about this technique?
>>>>
>>> All the commercial grinders you see in grocery stores say not put the
>>> beans through twice. No idea why, but the logical assumption is that
>>> doing it might clog the machine.
>>>
>>>
>> I'm looking at it wondering how it works, how can a huge bean get in
>> there if it's adjusted for fine! LOL, it looks like there are side bars
>> that do the initial breaking down of the bean structure?
>
> Have you even tried it yet? Stop over analyzing, plug it in and do
> it! You might be pleasantly surprised.
>
Beans Saturday! No more OA!

On Thu, 26 Sep 2013 17:16:26 -0400, mawil1013 > wrote:

>On 9/26/2013 10:47 AM, sf wrote:
>> On Thu, 26 Sep 2013 07:13:52 -0400, mawil1013 > wrote:
>>
>>> On 9/26/2013 1:02 AM, sf wrote:
>>>> On Wed, 25 Sep 2013 20:51:22 -0400, mawil1013 > wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> The plates seem small so I was wondering if pre-grinding the beans at
>>>>> coarsest setting then regrinding at finest for espresso grind?
>>>>>
>>>>> Any comments about this technique?
>>>>>
>>>> All the commercial grinders you see in grocery stores say not put the
>>>> beans through twice. No idea why, but the logical assumption is that
>>>> doing it might clog the machine.
>>>>
>>>>
>>> I'm looking at it wondering how it works, how can a huge bean get in
>>> there if it's adjusted for fine! LOL, it looks like there are side bars
>>> that do the initial breaking down of the bean structure?

Coffee mill mechanisms feed coffee beans the same as how peppermills
feed peppercorns, they employ an Archimedes screw but configured so
that it has a tapered portion at it's leading edge that grabs the
larger diameter... it starts the process the same as wood grabs a wood
screw only in the obverse... like how a ship's propeller grabs water
and "grinds" it, with minimal cavitation to propel the vessel
smoothly... when run in reverse there's lots of cavitation... so never
crank your pepper mill in reverse or it will quickly become damaged.
For the same reason never grind your pepper mill or coffee mill empty,
or the burrs will meet and grind each other. For your mill's long
life refill before they run empty... the beans and corns are the lube
that keep the burrs apart.

Brooklyn1 wrote:
> On Thu, 26 Sep 2013 17:16:26 -0400, > wrote:
>
>> On 9/26/2013 10:47 AM, sf wrote:
>>> On Thu, 26 Sep 2013 07:13:52 -0400, > wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 9/26/2013 1:02 AM, sf wrote:
>>>>> On Wed, 25 Sep 2013 20:51:22 -0400, > wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> The plates seem small so I was wondering if pre-grinding the beans at
>>>>>> coarsest setting then regrinding at finest for espresso grind?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Any comments about this technique?
>>>>>>
>>>>> All the commercial grinders you see in grocery stores say not put the
>>>>> beans through twice. No idea why, but the logical assumption is that
>>>>> doing it might clog the machine.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> I'm looking at it wondering how it works, how can a huge bean get in
>>>> there if it's adjusted for fine! LOL, it looks like there are side bars
>>>> that do the initial breaking down of the bean structure?
>
> Coffee mill mechanisms feed coffee beans the same as how peppermills
> feed peppercorns, they employ an Archimedes screw but configured so
> that it has a tapered portion at it's leading edge that grabs the
> larger diameter... it starts the process the same as wood grabs a wood
> screw only in the obverse... like how a ship's propeller grabs water
> and "grinds" it, with minimal cavitation to propel the vessel
> smoothly... when run in reverse there's lots of cavitation... so never
> crank your pepper mill in reverse or it will quickly become damaged.
> For the same reason never grind your pepper mill or coffee mill empty,
> or the burrs will meet and grind each other. For your mill's long
> life refill before they run empty... the beans and corns are the lube
> that keep the burrs apart.

Ah, so I should stop grinding (manually) before the grinder is empty?
--
Jean B.

On Thu, 26 Sep 2013 22:21:48 -0400, "Jean B." > wrote:

>Brooklyn1 wrote:
>> On Thu, 26 Sep 2013 17:16:26 -0400, > wrote:
>>
>>> On 9/26/2013 10:47 AM, sf wrote:
>>>> On Thu, 26 Sep 2013 07:13:52 -0400, > wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 9/26/2013 1:02 AM, sf wrote:
>>>>>> On Wed, 25 Sep 2013 20:51:22 -0400, > wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The plates seem small so I was wondering if pre-grinding the beans at
>>>>>>> coarsest setting then regrinding at finest for espresso grind?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Any comments about this technique?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> All the commercial grinders you see in grocery stores say not put the
>>>>>> beans through twice. No idea why, but the logical assumption is that
>>>>>> doing it might clog the machine.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> I'm looking at it wondering how it works, how can a huge bean get in
>>>>> there if it's adjusted for fine! LOL, it looks like there are side bars
>>>>> that do the initial breaking down of the bean structure?
>>
>> Coffee mill mechanisms feed coffee beans the same as how peppermills
>> feed peppercorns, they employ an Archimedes screw but configured so
>> that it has a tapered portion at it's leading edge that grabs the
>> larger diameter... it starts the process the same as wood grabs a wood
>> screw only in the obverse... like how a ship's propeller grabs water
>> and "grinds" it, with minimal cavitation to propel the vessel
>> smoothly... when run in reverse there's lots of cavitation... so never
>> crank your pepper mill in reverse or it will quickly become damaged.
>> For the same reason never grind your pepper mill or coffee mill empty,
>> or the burrs will meet and grind each other. For your mill's long
>> life refill before they run empty... the beans and corns are the lube
>> that keep the burrs apart.
>
>Ah, so I should stop grinding (manually) before the grinder is empty?

Depends whose grinder you're talkin'.

Brooklyn1 wrote:
> On Thu, 26 Sep 2013 22:21:48 -0400, "Jean > wrote:
>
>> Brooklyn1 wrote:
>>> On Thu, 26 Sep 2013 17:16:26 -0400, > wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 9/26/2013 10:47 AM, sf wrote:
>>>>> On Thu, 26 Sep 2013 07:13:52 -0400, > wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 9/26/2013 1:02 AM, sf wrote:
>>>>>>> On Wed, 25 Sep 2013 20:51:22 -0400, > wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The plates seem small so I was wondering if pre-grinding the beans at
>>>>>>>> coarsest setting then regrinding at finest for espresso grind?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Any comments about this technique?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> All the commercial grinders you see in grocery stores say not put the
>>>>>>> beans through twice. No idea why, but the logical assumption is that
>>>>>>> doing it might clog the machine.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm looking at it wondering how it works, how can a huge bean get in
>>>>>> there if it's adjusted for fine! LOL, it looks like there are side bars
>>>>>> that do the initial breaking down of the bean structure?
>>>
>>> Coffee mill mechanisms feed coffee beans the same as how peppermills
>>> feed peppercorns, they employ an Archimedes screw but configured so
>>> that it has a tapered portion at it's leading edge that grabs the
>>> larger diameter... it starts the process the same as wood grabs a wood
>>> screw only in the obverse... like how a ship's propeller grabs water
>>> and "grinds" it, with minimal cavitation to propel the vessel
>>> smoothly... when run in reverse there's lots of cavitation... so never
>>> crank your pepper mill in reverse or it will quickly become damaged.
>>> For the same reason never grind your pepper mill or coffee mill empty,
>>> or the burrs will meet and grind each other. For your mill's long
>>> life refill before they run empty... the beans and corns are the lube
>>> that keep the burrs apart.
>>
>> Ah, so I should stop grinding (manually) before the grinder is empty?
>
> Depends whose grinder you're talkin'.

I knew I was asking for trouble.

--
Jean B.

On Thu, 26 Sep 2013 17:16:26 -0400, mawil1013 > wrote:

> On 9/26/2013 10:47 AM, sf wrote:
> >
> > Have you even tried it yet? Stop over analyzing, plug it in and do
> > it! You might be pleasantly surprised.
> >
> Beans Saturday! No more OA!

Full report Saturday PM then. LOL

--
Food is an important part of a balanced diet.

"Jean B." wrote:
>Brooklyn1 wrote:
>> "Jean B." wrote:
>>
>> Ah, so I should stop grinding (manually) before the grinder is empty?
>
>> Depends whose grinder you're talkin'.
>
>I knew I was asking for trouble.

Yesterday instead of grinding I was digging: planted another 'Fat
Albert" Colorado blue spruce to complete my trio:
http://i42.tinypic.com/292qlxg.jpg

Sometime next week there'll be lots of grinding, the stump grinding
guy will be here, I had seven huge cedars removed, some kind of
disease has killed all of them around here. I don't really miss them,
they were in a hedgerow so now that it's been thinned out there is
more light and space for the other trees, and seven less trees for me
to mow around:
http://i41.tinypic.com/kcm29z.jpg

Brooklyn1 wrote:
> "Jean B." wrote:
>> Brooklyn1 wrote:
>>> "Jean B." wrote:
>>>
>>> Ah, so I should stop grinding (manually) before the grinder is empty?
>>
>>> Depends whose grinder you're talkin'.
>>
>> I knew I was asking for trouble.
>
> Yesterday instead of grinding I was digging: planted another 'Fat
> Albert" Colorado blue spruce to complete my trio:
> http://i42.tinypic.com/292qlxg.jpg
>
> Sometime next week there'll be lots of grinding, the stump grinding
> guy will be here, I had seven huge cedars removed, some kind of
> disease has killed all of them around here. I don't really miss them,
> they were in a hedgerow so now that it's been thinned out there is
> more light and space for the other trees, and seven less trees for me
> to mow around:
> http://i41.tinypic.com/kcm29z.jpg
>
>
Too bad about the cedars. Did you leave the snags (if they can be
called that when cut) and nests there?

Nice to see you planting. I intended to plant much more here but have
only planted five trees here this far.

--
--
Jean B.

On Tue, 01 Oct 2013 20:18:58 -0400, "Jean B." > wrote:

>Brooklyn1 wrote:
>> "Jean B." wrote:
>>> Brooklyn1 wrote:
>>>> "Jean B." wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Ah, so I should stop grinding (manually) before the grinder is empty?
>>>
>>>> Depends whose grinder you're talkin'.
>>>
>>> I knew I was asking for trouble.
>>
>> Yesterday instead of grinding I was digging: planted another 'Fat
>> Albert" Colorado blue spruce to complete my trio:
>> http://i42.tinypic.com/292qlxg.jpg
>>
>> Sometime next week there'll be lots of grinding, the stump grinding
>> guy will be here, I had seven huge cedars removed, some kind of
>> disease has killed all of them around here. I don't really miss them,
>> they were in a hedgerow so now that it's been thinned out there is
>> more light and space for the other trees, and seven less trees for me
>> to mow around:
>> http://i41.tinypic.com/kcm29z.jpg
>>
>>
>Too bad about the cedars. Did you leave the snags (if they can be
>called that when cut) and nests there?

The bird houses were removed but are not worth saving, they've been
there ten years so are somewhat decayed, and squirrels chewed the
openings way too large for attracting birds... I will be getting new.
And by snags I will assume you mean stumps, those will be ground down
below ground level.

>Nice to see you planting. I intended to plant much more here but have
>only planted five trees here this far.

Which five trees? Don't wait too long to plant more trees, trees
grow slowly. And unless you are young, like under 30, don't bother
planting seedlings or you'll never sit in their shade... plant the
largest trees you can manage.

In article >, gravesend10
@verizon.net says...

> The bird houses were removed but are not worth saving, they've been
> there ten years so are somewhat decayed, and squirrels chewed the
> openings way too large for attracting birds... I will be getting new.

In article >, gravesend10
@verizon.net says...

> The bird houses were removed but are not worth saving, they've been
> there ten years so are somewhat decayed, and squirrels chewed the
> openings way too large for attracting birds... I will be getting new.

John makes and fits a metal plate on the roof and round the bird box
entrance hole to defeat predators. You might be able to buy some; pic
here

http://www.nestbox.co.uk/Accessories-for-Boxes/

Janet UK

On Wed, 2 Oct 2013 09:23:32 +0100, Janet > wrote:

>In article >, gravesend10
says...
>
>> The bird houses were removed but are not worth saving, they've been
>> there ten years so are somewhat decayed, and squirrels chewed the
>> openings way too large for attracting birds... I will be getting new.
>
> John makes and fits a metal plate on the roof and round the bird box
>entrance hole to defeat predators. You might be able to buy some; pic
>here
>
> http://www.nestbox.co.uk/Accessories-for-Boxes/
>
> Janet UK

I can buy those plates or even make them but the houses them selves
are really not worth rehabing, the wood is rotten. It would be best
to mount new ones. There are people around here who make wooden
garden projects including bird houses and sell them for like $10.

On 9/27/2013 3:01 AM, sf wrote:
> On Thu, 26 Sep 2013 17:16:26 -0400, mawil1013 > wrote:
>
>> On 9/26/2013 10:47 AM, sf wrote:
>>>
>>> Have you even tried it yet? Stop over analyzing, plug it in and do
>>> it! You might be pleasantly surprised.
>>>
>> Beans Saturday! No more OA!
>
> Full report Saturday PM then. LOL
>
Wow! Sorry to drop the thread, got super occupied this week, The local
coffee was a great spot, I bought 4oz dark and 4 oz decaf, both espresso
grind and dark. I stirred the beans together and tossed into grinder
bin. I do 50/50 all the time. anyway, $3.75 for 4 oz of fresh beans, I
can do that. The smell of the freshly ground beans is great!

--
Michael

On Fri, 04 Oct 2013 19:44:36 -0400, mawil1013 > wrote:

> On 9/27/2013 3:01 AM, sf wrote:
> > On Thu, 26 Sep 2013 17:16:26 -0400, mawil1013 > wrote:
> >
> >> On 9/26/2013 10:47 AM, sf wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Have you even tried it yet? Stop over analyzing, plug it in and do
> >>> it! You might be pleasantly surprised.
> >>>
> >> Beans Saturday! No more OA!
> >
> > Full report Saturday PM then. LOL
> >
> Wow! Sorry to drop the thread, got super occupied this week, The local
> coffee was a great spot, I bought 4oz dark and 4 oz decaf, both espresso
> grind and dark. I stirred the beans together and tossed into grinder
> bin. I do 50/50 all the time. anyway, $3.75 for 4 oz of fresh beans, I
> can do that. The smell of the freshly ground beans is great!

Hope you continue to enjoy it.

--
Food is an important part of a balanced diet.

Brooklyn1 wrote:
> On Tue, 01 Oct 2013 20:18:58 -0400, "Jean > wrote:
>
>> Brooklyn1 wrote:
>>> "Jean B." wrote:
>>>> Brooklyn1 wrote:
>>>>> "Jean B." wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Ah, so I should stop grinding (manually) before the grinder is empty?
>>>>
>>>>> Depends whose grinder you're talkin'.
>>>>
>>>> I knew I was asking for trouble.
>>>
>>> Yesterday instead of grinding I was digging: planted another 'Fat
>>> Albert" Colorado blue spruce to complete my trio:
>>> http://i42.tinypic.com/292qlxg.jpg
>>>
>>> Sometime next week there'll be lots of grinding, the stump grinding
>>> guy will be here, I had seven huge cedars removed, some kind of
>>> disease has killed all of them around here. I don't really miss them,
>>> they were in a hedgerow so now that it's been thinned out there is
>>> more light and space for the other trees, and seven less trees for me
>>> to mow around:
>>> http://i41.tinypic.com/kcm29z.jpg
>>>
>>>
>> Too bad about the cedars. Did you leave the snags (if they can be
>> called that when cut) and nests there?
>
> The bird houses were removed but are not worth saving, they've been
> there ten years so are somewhat decayed, and squirrels chewed the
> openings way too large for attracting birds... I will be getting new.
> And by snags I will assume you mean stumps, those will be ground down
> below ground level.
>
>> Nice to see you planting. I intended to plant much more here but have
>> only planted five trees here this far.
>
> Which five trees? Don't wait too long to plant more trees, trees
> grow slowly. And unless you are young, like under 30, don't bother
> planting seedlings or you'll never sit in their shade... plant the
> largest trees you can manage.

Three cherry trees (NOT ornamental) and two apple trees. One of the
cherries has gotten pretty tall.

I wish I could afford large trees (getting, planting, and watering).
These were medium-sized, and any others that I get will have to be
somewhat smaller (I think). Maybe I will go looking now, because the
nurseries are having fall sales.

--
Jean B.

Jean B. wrote:
> Brooklyn1 wrote:
>> Jean B. wrote:
>>> Brooklyn1 wrote:
>>>> Jean B. wrote:
>>>>> Brooklyn1 wrote:
>>>>>> Jean B. wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ah, so I should stop grinding (manually) before the grinder is empty?
>>>>>
>>>>>> Depends whose grinder you're talkin'.
>>>>>
>>>>> I knew I was asking for trouble.
>>>>
>>>> Yesterday instead of grinding I was digging: planted another 'Fat
>>>> Albert" Colorado blue spruce to complete my trio:
>>>> http://i42.tinypic.com/292qlxg.jpg
>>>>
>>>> Sometime next week there'll be lots of grinding, the stump grinding
>>>> guy will be here, I had seven huge cedars removed, some kind of
>>>> disease has killed all of them around here. I don't really miss them,
>>>> they were in a hedgerow so now that it's been thinned out there is
>>>> more light and space for the other trees, and seven less trees for me
>>>> to mow around:
>>>> http://i41.tinypic.com/kcm29z.jpg
>>>>
>>> Too bad about the cedars. Did you leave the snags (if they can be
>>> called that when cut) and nests there?
>>
>> The bird houses were removed but are not worth saving, they've been
>> there ten years so are somewhat decayed, and squirrels chewed the
>> openings way too large for attracting birds... I will be getting new.
>> And by snags I will assume you mean stumps, those will be ground down
>> below ground level.
>>
>>> Nice to see you planting. I intended to plant much more here but have
>>> only planted five trees here this far.
>>
>> Which five trees? Don't wait too long to plant more trees, trees
>> grow slowly. And unless you are young, like under 30, don't bother
>> planting seedlings or you'll never sit in their shade... plant the
>> largest trees you can manage.
>
>Three cherry trees (NOT ornamental) and two apple trees. One of the
>cherries has gotten pretty tall.

Fruit trees grow relatively quickly. Which type of cherry? And which
type of apple? Many fruit trees are not self pollenating so for bet
results you should plant a pollenator (there are charts on line).

>I wish I could afford large trees (getting, planting, and watering).
>These were medium-sized, and any others that I get will have to be
>somewhat smaller (I think). Maybe I will go looking now, because the
>nurseries are having fall sales.

Yes, fall is a good time to transplant and prices are lower because
nurseries need to sell off their stock or replant before the first
frost. But I advise against just grabbing anything because it's cheap
(the cheap often turns out expensive). You really should have a plan
of which trees to plant where. Take careful measurements of your
property and then ascertain the mature size and growth habits of
plantings... there's no point planting something that over grows its
space and has to be removed in ten years. I'd stay aways from the
trees touted as fast growing; like poplar, giant thuja, silver maple,
etc., fast growing trees have weak wood, are prone to disease, and are
relatively short lived. I would strongly suggest buying from a *real*
nursery, one that has its own growing fields... the garden centers at
the big box stores stock very limited choices, don't sell the best
stock, and it's very often not true to its label, ie. you can choose a
semi dwarf plum and it will actually be a standard and may not even be
plum. Btw, what size fruit trees did you plant, I'm in favor of semi
dwarf, standards are difficult to harvest and when properly pruned are
not very attractive. Without knowing your property I really can't
make recommendations, but you may want to consider hawthorn,
crabapple, gingko, Kentucky coffee, linden, and various conifers.

Brooklyn1 wrote:
> Yes, fall is a good time to transplant and prices are lower because
> nurseries need to sell off their stock or replant before the first
> frost. But I advise against just grabbing anything because it's cheap
> (the cheap often turns out expensive).

I don't do that.

You really should have a plan
> of which trees to plant where.

I have been thinking about a berm of native trees and bushes that
benefit the critters. Kind-of a critter paradise, which also gives me
more privacy.

Take careful measurements of your
> property and then ascertain the mature size and growth habits of
> plantings... there's no point planting something that over grows its
> space and has to be removed in ten years.

Thanks for that reminder. That is what I have done in the past, and who
knows whether I would remember to do that now.

I'd stay aways from the
> trees touted as fast growing; like poplar, giant thuja, silver maple,
> etc., fast growing trees have weak wood, are prone to disease, and are
> relatively short lived.

Yes, I have absorbed that fact. I have read, though, that they might be
used for quick screening, while other slower-growing trees grow a bit.

I would strongly suggest buying from a *real*
> nursery, one that has its own growing fields... the garden centers at
> the big box stores stock very limited choices, don't sell the best
> stock, and it's very often not true to its label, ie. you can choose a
> semi dwarf plum and it will actually be a standard and may not even be
> plum.

I but from nurseries, but I don't think they grow there own trees and
bushes.

Btw, what size fruit trees did you plant, I'm in favor of semi
> dwarf, standards are difficult to harvest and when properly pruned are
> not very attractive.

Normal-sized trees, but then I am more interested in having them for
animals than I am for harvesting fruit for myself. If it happens,
that'd be nice, but if it doesn't, that is fine too.

Without knowing your property I really can't
> make recommendations, but you may want to consider hawthorn,
> crabapple, gingko, Kentucky coffee, linden, and various conifers.

I do have two crabapples. Gingko is a c--pshoot, and they aren't
indigenous. I am not up on Kentucky coffee. I had linden at the last
house and forget what I disliked about it. Conifers, yes. Birder
friend suggests juniper, so that will be part of the mix.

Thank you for your comments, Sheldon.
--
Jean B.

On 10/6/2013 11:15 AM, Brooklyn1 wrote:

> I'd stay aways from the
> trees touted as fast growing; like poplar, giant thuja, silver maple,
> etc., fast growing trees have weak wood, are prone to disease, and are
> relatively short lived.

I have to agree wholeheartedly with this. I had to remove poplars from
my yard and I think they were only about 15 years old. Horrible root
systems and they died young.

Neighbors have some sort of evergreen trees that also grow quickly and
die young. They've been losing part of the trees for years and always
into my yard. They've had several cut down professionally. What's left
look out of place. The original owners of the house wanted fast growing
trees that surrounded their house to provide privacy.
--
CAPSLOCK–Preventing Login Since 1980.

On Mon, 07 Oct 2013 02:58:16 -0400, Cheryl >
wrote:

> The original owners of the house wanted fast growing
> trees that surrounded their house to provide privacy.

I live in the city and wanted a fast growing privacy screen between
houses too, so I planted Black Stemmed Pittosporum which grew about 5
feet the first year reached their full height in 6-7 years. 30 feet
is works for me.

--
Food is an important part of a balanced diet.

On Sun, 06 Oct 2013 23:36:00 -0400, "Jean B." > wrote:

>Brooklyn1 wrote:
>> Yes, fall is a good time to transplant and prices are lower because
>> nurseries need to sell off their stock or replant before the first
>> frost. But I advise against just grabbing anything because it's cheap
>> (the cheap often turns out expensive).
>
>I don't do that.
>
> You really should have a plan
>> of which trees to plant where.
>
>I have been thinking about a berm of native trees and bushes that
>benefit the critters. Kind-of a critter paradise, which also gives me
>more privacy.
>
> Take careful measurements of your
>> property and then ascertain the mature size and growth habits of
>> plantings... there's no point planting something that over grows its
>> space and has to be removed in ten years.
>
>Thanks for that reminder. That is what I have done in the past, and who
>knows whether I would remember to do that now.
>
> I'd stay aways from the
>> trees touted as fast growing; like poplar, giant thuja, silver maple,
>> etc., fast growing trees have weak wood, are prone to disease, and are
>> relatively short lived.
>
>Yes, I have absorbed that fact. I have read, though, that they might be
>used for quick screening, while other slower-growing trees grow a bit.
>
> I would strongly suggest buying from a *real*
>> nursery, one that has its own growing fields... the garden centers at
>> the big box stores stock very limited choices, don't sell the best
>> stock, and it's very often not true to its label, ie. you can choose a
>> semi dwarf plum and it will actually be a standard and may not even be
>> plum.
>
>I but from nurseries, but I don't think they grow there own trees and
>bushes.
>
>Btw, what size fruit trees did you plant, I'm in favor of semi
>> dwarf, standards are difficult to harvest and when properly pruned are
>> not very attractive.
>
>Normal-sized trees, but then I am more interested in having them for
>animals than I am for harvesting fruit for myself. If it happens,
>that'd be nice, but if it doesn't, that is fine too.

They still need proper yearly pruning or they tend to branch too
densely and that causes multiple diseases due to lack of air
circulation and branch breakage from excessive weight of the fruit.
You'd do better with semi dwarf fruit trees, those grow 12'-15' feet
tall and wide and produce well but are a lot more manageable than
standards that really require professional care.

>> Without knowing your property I really can't
>> make recommendations, but you may want to consider hawthorn,
>> crabapple, gingko, Kentucky coffee, linden, and various conifers.
>
>I do have two crabapples. Gingko is a c--pshoot, and they aren't
>indigenous. I am not up on Kentucky coffee. I had linden at the last
>house and forget what I disliked about it. Conifers, yes. Birder
>friend suggests juniper, so that will be part of the mix.

Gingko grows most anywhere, nothing bother's them.
http://kwanten.home.xs4all.nl/
I can't imagine what's to dislike about linden, they are an excellent
shade/street tree, not affected by pollution, only thing one may not
like is that they grow huge but very slowly.
I can't grow juniper here unless I fence it, deer like it too much...
I have rug juniper as ground cover in my front foundation plantings
bed but it's fenced.
Kentucky coffee trees are very interesting, they have deeply fisssured
bark that's quite attractive, they can grow fairly tall but not nearly
as wide, and they have fantastic gold fall foliage. One drawback is
that they can be expensive and not easy to locate at a nursery, the
nursery I use told me I quite possibley have the only Kentucky coffee
tree in this county. There's a horrendous deluge out there now, I
just managed this two minutes before the sky opened, geese couldn't
care less... it's that tall tree with it's gold leaves:
http://i40.tinypic.com/2zs0hmt.jpg

>Thank you for your comments, Sheldon.

You're welcome.

On Mon, 07 Oct 2013 02:58:16 -0400, Cheryl >
wrote:

>On 10/6/2013 11:15 AM, Brooklyn1 wrote:
>
>> I'd stay aways from the
>> trees touted as fast growing; like poplar, giant thuja, silver maple,
>> etc., fast growing trees have weak wood, are prone to disease, and are
>> relatively short lived.
>
>I have to agree wholeheartedly with this. I had to remove poplars from
>my yard and I think they were only about 15 years old. Horrible root
>systems and they died young.
>
>Neighbors have some sort of evergreen trees that also grow quickly and
>die young. They've been losing part of the trees for years and always
>into my yard. They've had several cut down professionally. What's left
>look out of place. The original owners of the house wanted fast growing
>trees that surrounded their house to provide privacy.

That was silly, they wasted 15 years growing trash. It's much smarter
to plant high quality trees that will give much pleasusre while
growing and especially to enjoy later on... people don't live long
enough for do overs with trees.

On Mon, 07 Oct 2013 08:05:17 -0700, sf > wrote:

>On Mon, 07 Oct 2013 02:58:16 -0400, Cheryl >
>wrote:
>
>> The original owners of the house wanted fast growing
>> trees that surrounded their house to provide privacy.
>
>I live in the city and wanted a fast growing privacy screen between
>houses too, so I planted Black Stemmed Pittosporum which grew about 5
>feet the first year reached their full height in 6-7 years. 30 feet
>is works for me.

That's not a tree, it's a shrub that's often used as a hedge...
wouldn't survive New England winters.
http://www.plumjam.com/herbarium/esh...enuifolium.cfm
In New England I'd plant Canadian Hemlock for a screen.

On 10/7/2013 2:44 PM, Brooklyn1 wrote:

> Kentucky coffee trees are very interesting, they have deeply fisssured
> bark that's quite attractive, they can grow fairly tall but not nearly
> as wide, and they have fantastic gold fall foliage. One drawback is
> that they can be expensive and not easy to locate at a nursery, the
> nursery I use told me I quite possibley have the only Kentucky coffee
> tree in this county. There's a horrendous deluge out there now, I
> just managed this two minutes before the sky opened, geese couldn't
> care less... it's that tall tree with it's gold leaves:
> http://i40.tinypic.com/2zs0hmt.jpg

It's a very attractive tree.

--
CAPSLOCK–Preventing Login Since 1980.

On 10/7/2013 2:48 PM, Brooklyn1 wrote:
> On Mon, 07 Oct 2013 02:58:16 -0400, Cheryl >
> wrote:
>
>> On 10/6/2013 11:15 AM, Brooklyn1 wrote:
>>
>>> I'd stay aways from the
>>> trees touted as fast growing; like poplar, giant thuja, silver maple,
>>> etc., fast growing trees have weak wood, are prone to disease, and are
>>> relatively short lived.
>>
>> I have to agree wholeheartedly with this. I had to remove poplars from
>> my yard and I think they were only about 15 years old. Horrible root
>> systems and they died young.
>>
>> Neighbors have some sort of evergreen trees that also grow quickly and
>> die young. They've been losing part of the trees for years and always
>> into my yard. They've had several cut down professionally. What's left
>> look out of place. The original owners of the house wanted fast growing
>> trees that surrounded their house to provide privacy.
>
> That was silly, they wasted 15 years growing trash. It's much smarter
> to plant high quality trees that will give much pleasusre while
> growing and especially to enjoy later on... people don't live long
> enough for do overs with trees.
>
Completely agree. They look so ugly now, with lots of dead branches. The
screening that was originally intended is completely gone, and only
parts of the originals still exist. I'd very much discourage anyone
from trying to screen in their property with fast-growing trees.

--
CAPSLOCK–Preventing Login Since 1980.

On 10/7/2013 2:59 PM, Brooklyn1 wrote:
> On Mon, 07 Oct 2013 08:05:17 -0700, sf > wrote:
>
>> On Mon, 07 Oct 2013 02:58:16 -0400, Cheryl >
>> wrote:
>>
>>> The original owners of the house wanted fast growing
>>> trees that surrounded their house to provide privacy.
>>
>> I live in the city and wanted a fast growing privacy screen between
>> houses too, so I planted Black Stemmed Pittosporum which grew about 5
>> feet the first year reached their full height in 6-7 years. 30 feet
>> is works for me.

Our houses are too close together for such tall trees. Previous owner of
my house planted poplars for some unknown reason, because they surely
don't provide privacy, though they did provide some shade because they
were on the south-east facing side of my house. But when they had to be
taken down, it was dangerous.
>
> That's not a tree, it's a shrub that's often used as a hedge...
> wouldn't survive New England winters.
> http://www.plumjam.com/herbarium/esh...enuifolium.cfm
> In New England I'd plant Canadian Hemlock for a screen.
>


--
CAPSLOCK–Preventing Login Since 1980.

On Tue, 08 Oct 2013 23:40:44 -0400, Cheryl >
wrote:

> Completely agree. They look so ugly now, with lots of dead branches. The
> screening that was originally intended is completely gone, and only
> parts of the originals still exist. I'd very much discourage anyone
> from trying to screen in their property with fast-growing trees.

It's unusual for people to stay in one place for 30 years, so I
disagree. Screen the property with fast growing trees and be happy,
you might change your mind in 25 years about wanting them (I would) or
the next owners of the property will not like them for one reason or
another and take them down anyway. In the meant time, enjoy it.

--
Food is an important part of a balanced diet.

On Tue, 08 Oct 2013 23:38:22 -0400, Cheryl >
wrote:

>On 10/7/2013 2:44 PM, Brooklyn1 wrote:
>
>> Kentucky coffee trees are very interesting, they have deeply fisssured
>> bark that's quite attractive, they can grow fairly tall but not nearly
>> as wide, and they have fantastic gold fall foliage. One drawback is
>> that they can be expensive and not easy to locate at a nursery, the
>> nursery I use told me I quite possibley have the only Kentucky coffee
>> tree in this county. There's a horrendous deluge out there now, I
>> just managed this two minutes before the sky opened, geese couldn't
>> care less... it's that tall tree with it's gold leaves:
>> http://i40.tinypic.com/2zs0hmt.jpg
>
>It's a very attractive tree.

Here's a better photo I took after the storm passed:
http://i40.tinypic.com/hsukar.jpg
More information:
http://www.hort.uconn.edu/plants/g/gymdio/gymdio1.html

On Tue, 08 Oct 2013 23:40:44 -0400, Cheryl >
wrote:

>On 10/7/2013 2:48 PM, Brooklyn1 wrote:
>> On Mon, 07 Oct 2013 02:58:16 -0400, Cheryl >
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On 10/6/2013 11:15 AM, Brooklyn1 wrote:
>>>
>>>> I'd stay aways from the
>>>> trees touted as fast growing; like poplar, giant thuja, silver maple,
>>>> etc., fast growing trees have weak wood, are prone to disease, and are
>>>> relatively short lived.
>>>
>>> I have to agree wholeheartedly with this. I had to remove poplars from
>>> my yard and I think they were only about 15 years old. Horrible root
>>> systems and they died young.
>>>
>>> Neighbors have some sort of evergreen trees that also grow quickly and
>>> die young. They've been losing part of the trees for years and always
>>> into my yard. They've had several cut down professionally. What's left
>>> look out of place. The original owners of the house wanted fast growing
>>> trees that surrounded their house to provide privacy.
>>
>> That was silly, they wasted 15 years growing trash. It's much smarter
>> to plant high quality trees that will give much pleasusre while
>> growing and especially to enjoy later on... people don't live long
>> enough for do overs with trees.
>>
>Completely agree. They look so ugly now, with lots of dead branches. The
>screening that was originally intended is completely gone, and only
>parts of the originals still exist. I'd very much discourage anyone
>from trying to screen in their property with fast-growing trees.

For just a few dollars more and the same labor (planting is most of
the cost) they would have a lovely stand of screening trees now.
Caznadian hemlock are not expensive, are relatively fast growing, and
make a great privacy screen/windbreak.

On 10/8/2013 11:40 PM, Cheryl wrote:
> On 10/7/2013 2:48 PM, Brooklyn1 wrote:

>> That was silly, they wasted 15 years growing trash. It's much smarter
>> to plant high quality trees that will give much pleasusre while
>> growing and especially to enjoy later on... people don't live long
>> enough for do overs with trees.
>>
> Completely agree. They look so ugly now, with lots of dead branches. The
> screening that was originally intended is completely gone, and only
> parts of the originals still exist. I'd very much discourage anyone
> from trying to screen in their property with fast-growing trees.

Schip laurels make a nice solid, thick hedge. I don't know how high
they grow, we keep the one shrub we have to 8 feet or so. Evergreen.

nancy

On Thu, 17 Oct 2013 08:41:56 -0400, Nancy Young
> wrote:

>On 10/8/2013 11:40 PM, Cheryl wrote:
>> On 10/7/2013 2:48 PM, Brooklyn1 wrote:
>
>>> That was silly, they wasted 15 years growing trash. It's much smarter
>>> to plant high quality trees that will give much pleasusre while
>>> growing and especially to enjoy later on... people don't live long
>>> enough for do overs with trees.
>>>
>> Completely agree. They look so ugly now, with lots of dead branches. The
>> screening that was originally intended is completely gone, and only
>> parts of the originals still exist. I'd very much discourage anyone
>> from trying to screen in their property with fast-growing trees.
>
>Schip laurels make a nice solid, thick hedge. I don't know how high
>they grow, we keep the one shrub we have to 8 feet or so. Evergreen.

Okay as a shrub but I wouldn't like it as a hedge... actually I don't
much care for hedges, I'd rather two/three rows of staggered plantings
for screening. Also you probably live in a growing zone at the border
of survival for this plant, where I live it wouldn't last a winter.
Naturally what to plant for screening depends on space. Where I
lived previously it was a typical surburban lot, not a lot of space
between houses, so I planted grapes on a trellis, a great privacy
screen and I didn't care that the leaves dropped this time of year,
no one sat outside in the cold.
http://www.louistheplantgeek.com/a-g...s-laurocerasus
http://forums.gardenweb.com/forums/l...044155851.html