You can see it he

http://www.gourmet.com/food/2009/02/...e=1#showHeader

I get an error when I click on item 2, but I can
get to item 2 by replacing 1 with 2 in the URL.

I wouldn't put air conditioning on the list, but
I've never lived in a place with an air conditioner.

I'm not that keen on timers, either. I used to use
a clock, and now I use the clock in my computer or
TV set.

Chimney starter? I use fluid, and before that I used
an electric starter. Either works fine. The chimney
starter doesn't provide any new capability.

I'm not going to finish looking at this list. Too much
of it seems bogus.

Mark Thorson wrote:
> You can see it he
>
> http://www.gourmet.com/food/2009/02/...e=1#showHeader
>
> I get an error when I click on item 2, but I can
> get to item 2 by replacing 1 with 2 in the URL.
>
> I wouldn't put air conditioning on the list, but
> I've never lived in a place with an air conditioner.
>
> I'm not that keen on timers, either. I used to use
> a clock, and now I use the clock in my computer or
> TV set.
>
> Chimney starter? I use fluid, and before that I used
> an electric starter. Either works fine. The chimney
> starter doesn't provide any new capability.
>
> I'm not going to finish looking at this list. Too much
> of it seems bogus.


I wouldn't call it bogus, but I wouldn't call any of the items they
mention "revolutionary" either. I'd call them conveniences that we
could live without but most of us have succumbed to many of them.

gloria p

On Mar 15, 6:36*pm, Gloria P > wrote:
> Mark Thorson wrote:
> > You can see it he
>
> >http://www.gourmet.com/food/2009/02/...ed-the-way-we-...
>
> > I get an error when I click on item 2, but I can
> > get to item 2 by replacing 1 with 2 in the URL.
>
> > I wouldn't put air conditioning on the list, but
> > I've never lived in a place with an air conditioner.
>
> > I'm not that keen on timers, either. *I used to use
> > a clock, and now I use the clock in my computer or
> > TV set.
>
> > Chimney starter? *I use fluid, and before that I used
> > an electric starter. *Either works fine. *The chimney
> > starter doesn't provide any new capability.
>
> > I'm not going to finish looking at this list. *Too much
> > of it seems bogus.
>
> I wouldn't call it bogus, but I wouldn't call any of the items they
> mention "revolutionary" either. *I'd call them conveniences that we
> could live without but most of us have succumbed to many of them.
>
> gloria p

They definitely have an odd way of describing revolutionary. The
fridge for sure. Machines that chop and puree, easy on the cook.

Dish washer, plastic wrap, vacuum sealer, crockpot, mechanical timer,
television, microwave and the Internet, convenience.

Silpat, AC, overnight delivery, microplane, Tupperware (the brand),
grills and gas grills, chimney starter, non-stick cookwa I get
along nicely without thankyouverymuch

Summer if I'm going to bake or use the oven, I start early in the
morning, and use a fan to get rid of the excess heat after I'm done.
More usual, tho, is to simply plan menus that don't require the oven.
Simple enough.

maxine in ri

Gloria P wrote:
> Mark Thorson wrote:
>> You can see it he
>>
>> http://www.gourmet.com/food/2009/02/...e=1#showHeader
>>
>>
>> I get an error when I click on item 2, but I can
>> get to item 2 by replacing 1 with 2 in the URL.
>>
>> I wouldn't put air conditioning on the list, but
>> I've never lived in a place with an air conditioner.
>>
>> I'm not that keen on timers, either. I used to use
>> a clock, and now I use the clock in my computer or
>> TV set.
>>
>> Chimney starter? I use fluid, and before that I used
>> an electric starter. Either works fine. The chimney
>> starter doesn't provide any new capability.
>>
>> I'm not going to finish looking at this list. Too much
>> of it seems bogus.
>
>
> I wouldn't call it bogus, but I wouldn't call any of the items they
> mention "revolutionary" either. I'd call them conveniences that we
> could live without but most of us have succumbed to many of them.
>
> gloria p

About the only one that I see there is I would call a true step in the
evolution of cooking is the refrigerator...

Mark Thorson wrote:
> You can see it he
>
> http://www.gourmet.com/food/2009/02/...e=1#showHeader
>
> I get an error when I click on item 2, but I can
> get to item 2 by replacing 1 with 2 in the URL.
>
> I wouldn't put air conditioning on the list, but
> I've never lived in a place with an air conditioner.
>
> I'm not that keen on timers, either. I used to use
> a clock, and now I use the clock in my computer or
> TV set.
>
> Chimney starter? I use fluid, and before that I used
> an electric starter. Either works fine. The chimney
> starter doesn't provide any new capability.
>
> I'm not going to finish looking at this list. Too much
> of it seems bogus.


I think that the whole list if a crock. Non stick frying pans are handy
for some things, but I would suggest that the cast iron pan was probably
a more significant cooking item than non stick.

Air conditioning?? What the hell does that have to to with cooking?

I so use times. AAMOF, I bought my wife a quadruple timer from Lee
Valley because she had a habit of turning off the oven to reset the
timer for multiple dishes. Timers are handly but hardly a significant
factor.

The chimney starter is a handy gimmick, but it's not as if there was no
other way to light charcoal.


Plastic wrap is handy, but a vacuum sealer???? I use mine but I survived
just fine without one for years.

WTF does a dishwasher have to do with cooking? That's another appliance
I lived without for a long time and one that I don't often use myself,
finding it faster and easier to wash dishes by hand.


Microwave?????? I rarely use mine. It is handy for reheating leftovers
and for heating up frozen prepared foods, which in my mind, might almost
qualify it for a detriment to culinary development.

I might consider food processors to be an even better appliance than a
blender, since an FP can do a lot of jobs that a blender cannot.

Slow cooker? I don't have one and have never had anything cooked in one
that could not have been cooked on the stove top or in the oven.


The microplane is pretty handy, but there were lots of zesters and
grated around before someone adopted a body shop tool for the kitchen.

I am sure that Weber fans might disagree, but I have to wonder why they
mention the gas grill and the Weber grill. They are both basically BBQ
grills. While I use my gas grill as long as it is warm and well lit on
the patio, most BBQs tend to be relegated to putting the guy who can't
cook in charge of cooking the meat.


As for the silpat.... I haev to plead ignorance. I have heard of them
and seen them used on cooking shows. While one of my favourite celebrity
cooks seems to like it, she says you can use parchment paper.
Accordingly, parchment paper would be the one that changed cooking, not
the silpat.

On Sun, 15 Mar 2009 15:02:08 -0800, Mark Thorson >
shouted from the highest rooftop:

>
>I'm not going to finish looking at this list. Too much
>of it seems bogus.

Not so much "bogus" as superficial IMO. Giving a gas and charcoal BBQ
separate listings is pretty silly as well. Whoever put the list
together doesn't appear to have given it much thought.


--

una cerveza mas por favor ...

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~
Wax-up and drop-in of Surfing's Golden Years: <http://www.surfwriter.net>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~

bob wrote:
> On Sun, 15 Mar 2009 15:02:08 -0800, Mark Thorson >
> shouted from the highest rooftop:
>
>> I'm not going to finish looking at this list. Too much
>> of it seems bogus.
>
> Not so much "bogus" as superficial IMO. Giving a gas and charcoal BBQ
> separate listings is pretty silly as well. Whoever put the list
> together doesn't appear to have given it much thought.
>
>


Done by committee, do you suppose?

gloria p

On Sun, 15 Mar 2009 18:56:53 -0600, Gloria P >
wrote:

>bob wrote:
>> On Sun, 15 Mar 2009 15:02:08 -0800, Mark Thorson >
>> shouted from the highest rooftop:
>>
>>> I'm not going to finish looking at this list. Too much
>>> of it seems bogus.
>>
>> Not so much "bogus" as superficial IMO. Giving a gas and charcoal BBQ
>> separate listings is pretty silly as well. Whoever put the list
>> together doesn't appear to have given it much thought.
>>
>>
>
>
>Done by committee, do you suppose?
>
Sounds more like it was done by people who don't cook much and don't
have much experience *not* using those items. I gave Tupperware an ok
because it has spawned other products that we can buy on the grocery
store shelf now. Let's say it was an excellent idea back in the day
and the concept has evolved.



--
I never worry about diets. The only carrots that
interest me are the number of carats in a diamond.

Mae West

On Mon, 16 Mar 2009 12:04:42 +1300, bob wrote:

> On Sun, 15 Mar 2009 15:02:08 -0800, Mark Thorson >
> shouted from the highest rooftop:
>
>>
>>I'm not going to finish looking at this list. Too much
>>of it seems bogus.
>
> Not so much "bogus" as superficial IMO. Giving a gas and charcoal BBQ
> separate listings is pretty silly as well. Whoever put the list
> together doesn't appear to have given it much thought.

take it for what it is, not some work of philosophy. like any 'top twenty'
(or what have you) list, it's mostly fluff and for fun if you have a good
time arguing about such things.

that said, i do get a lot of use from my kitchen time (a lux, actually),
and am surprised it was not invented until 1936 (a time, it should be
noted, before every appliance with the possible exception of a toaster had
a clock in it). i only wish this one had the single 'ding,' instead of
'brriiing,' which makes me jump every time.

your pal,
blake

blake murphy wrote:
> On Mon, 16 Mar 2009 12:04:42 +1300, bob wrote:
>
>> On Sun, 15 Mar 2009 15:02:08 -0800, Mark Thorson >
>> shouted from the highest rooftop:
>>
>>> I'm not going to finish looking at this list. Too much
>>> of it seems bogus.
>> Not so much "bogus" as superficial IMO. Giving a gas and charcoal BBQ
>> separate listings is pretty silly as well. Whoever put the list
>> together doesn't appear to have given it much thought.
>
> take it for what it is, not some work of philosophy. like any 'top twenty'
> (or what have you) list, it's mostly fluff and for fun if you have a good
> time arguing about such things.
>
> that said, i do get a lot of use from my kitchen time (a lux, actually),
> and am surprised it was not invented until 1936 (a time, it should be
> noted, before every appliance with the possible exception of a toaster had
> a clock in it). i only wish this one had the single 'ding,' instead of
> 'brriiing,' which makes me jump every time.
>
> your pal,
> blake

Yes!!!!! I want an old wind-up timer, that just has one ding. I
agree re jumping. It scares me every time.

--
Jean B.

On Mon, 16 Mar 2009 11:07:14 -0400, "Jean B." > shouted
from the highest rooftop:

>blake murphy wrote:
>> On Mon, 16 Mar 2009 12:04:42 +1300, bob wrote:
>>
>>> On Sun, 15 Mar 2009 15:02:08 -0800, Mark Thorson >
>>> shouted from the highest rooftop:
>>>
>>>> I'm not going to finish looking at this list. Too much
>>>> of it seems bogus.
>>> Not so much "bogus" as superficial IMO. Giving a gas and charcoal BBQ
>>> separate listings is pretty silly as well. Whoever put the list
>>> together doesn't appear to have given it much thought.
>>
>> take it for what it is, not some work of philosophy. like any 'top twenty'
>> (or what have you) list, it's mostly fluff and for fun if you have a good
>> time arguing about such things.
>>
>> that said, i do get a lot of use from my kitchen time (a lux, actually),
>> and am surprised it was not invented until 1936 (a time, it should be
>> noted, before every appliance with the possible exception of a toaster had
>> a clock in it). i only wish this one had the single 'ding,' instead of
>> 'brriiing,' which makes me jump every time.
>>
>> your pal,
>> blake
>
>Yes!!!!! I want an old wind-up timer, that just has one ding. I
>agree re jumping. It scares me every time.

We had a great little wind-up timer for around 20 years, but when it
broke it couldn't be fixed. So we bought another one, which lasted
less than three years. Then another, and another, and another - each
of which lasted less than a year. And the were not inexpensive either.
So I decided to try a digital timer and wonder why it took me so long.
It's been working beautifully for the past three years and is far more
accurate than the mechanical timers.

The only downside is the alarm. You can hear it anywhere in the house,
but it's not recommended for anyone with a weak heart.


..
--

una cerveza mas por favor ...

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~
Wax-up and drop-in of Surfing's Golden Years: <http://www.surfwriter.net>
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~

bob wrote:
> We had a great little wind-up timer for around 20 years, but when it
> broke it couldn't be fixed. So we bought another one, which lasted
> less than three years. Then another, and another, and another - each
> of which lasted less than a year. And the were not inexpensive either.
> So I decided to try a digital timer and wonder why it took me so long.
> It's been working beautifully for the past three years and is far more
> accurate than the mechanical timers.
>
> The only downside is the alarm. You can hear it anywhere in the house,
> but it's not recommended for anyone with a weak heart.
>

I think the answer for me, then, would be to look at a consignment
shop or thrift store--or an estate or yard sale. Many old things
seem to have been built to last.
--
Jean B.

On Mon, 16 Mar 2009 11:07:14 -0400, Jean B. wrote:

> blake murphy wrote:
>> On Mon, 16 Mar 2009 12:04:42 +1300, bob wrote:
>>
>>> On Sun, 15 Mar 2009 15:02:08 -0800, Mark Thorson >
>>> shouted from the highest rooftop:
>>>
>>>> I'm not going to finish looking at this list. Too much
>>>> of it seems bogus.
>>> Not so much "bogus" as superficial IMO. Giving a gas and charcoal BBQ
>>> separate listings is pretty silly as well. Whoever put the list
>>> together doesn't appear to have given it much thought.
>>
>> take it for what it is, not some work of philosophy. like any 'top twenty'
>> (or what have you) list, it's mostly fluff and for fun if you have a good
>> time arguing about such things.
>>
>> that said, i do get a lot of use from my kitchen time (a lux, actually),
>> and am surprised it was not invented until 1936 (a time, it should be
>> noted, before every appliance with the possible exception of a toaster had
>> a clock in it). i only wish this one had the single 'ding,' instead of
>> 'brriiing,' which makes me jump every time.
>>
>> your pal,
>> blake
>
> Yes!!!!! I want an old wind-up timer, that just has one ding. I
> agree re jumping. It scares me every time.

it awakens some part of the lizard brain that says 'omgomg! i have to get
up to go to school!'

your pal,
blake

"Mark Thorson" > wrote in message
...
> You can see it he
>
> http://www.gourmet.com/food/2009/02/...e=1#showHeader
>
> I get an error when I click on item 2, but I can
> get to item 2 by replacing 1 with 2 in the URL.
>
> I wouldn't put air conditioning on the list, but
> I've never lived in a place with an air conditioner.
>
> I'm not that keen on timers, either. I used to use
> a clock, and now I use the clock in my computer or
> TV set.
>
> Chimney starter? I use fluid, and before that I used
> an electric starter. Either works fine. The chimney
> starter doesn't provide any new capability.
>
> I'm not going to finish looking at this list. Too much
> of it seems bogus.


Yeah, really. I rather think the knife was a big deal. And fire, hard to
cook without fire. Although that really isn't an invention I suppose.

Paul

On Sun, 15 Mar 2009 15:02:08 -0800, Mark Thorson >
wrote:

>You can see it he
>
>http://www.gourmet.com/food/2009/02/...e=1#showHeader
>
>I get an error when I click on item 2, but I can
>get to item 2 by replacing 1 with 2 in the URL.
>
>I wouldn't put air conditioning on the list, but
>I've never lived in a place with an air conditioner.
>
I haven't either, but I've visited other parts of the country/world
when I was grateful to have one.

>I'm not that keen on timers, either. I used to use
>a clock, and now I use the clock in my computer or
>TV set.
>
Oh, I need a timer just to boil water. I tend to wander off, do
something else and forget I've got something boiling on the stove -
it's not an age thing either, it's something I've done all my life.

>
>I'm not going to finish looking at this list. Too much
>of it seems bogus.

Maybe it's one of those Manhattan conversation starters. That list is
stretching it for me too. I don't use a chimney, a vacuum sealer,
silpat, a microplane, a crockpot, and I don't use my microwave to
cook... but others on this ng do.


--
I never worry about diets. The only carrots that
interest me are the number of carats in a diamond.

Mae West

Yes, mostly bogus and convenience, but you do have to admit that a
fridge is pretty useful. Hard to imagine what it would have been like
to keep a kitchen a hundred years ago without one.

And to the chimney haters - I don't do much grilling, but hate the
smell of lighter fluid, either applied by me or in those quick-start
briquettes. Made my chimney starter from a coffee can. Works great.

B

bulka wrote:
>
> And to the chimney haters - I don't do much grilling, but hate the
> smell of lighter fluid, either applied by me or in those quick-start
> briquettes. Made my chimney starter from a coffee can. Works great.

Quick-start briquettes do impart a horrible flavor,
but handled properly liquid starter gets completely
burnt off. As long as areas touched by the fluid
get really hot, it all gets baked off or burnt.

"sf" > wrote in message
...
> On Sun, 15 Mar 2009 15:02:08 -0800, Mark Thorson >
> wrote:
>
>>You can see it he
>>
>>http://www.gourmet.com/food/2009/02/...e=1#showHeader
>>
>>I get an error when I click on item 2, but I can
>>get to item 2 by replacing 1 with 2 in the URL.
>>
>>I wouldn't put air conditioning on the list, but
>>I've never lived in a place with an air conditioner.
>>
> I haven't either, but I've visited other parts of the country/world
> when I was grateful to have one.
>
Try living in Bangkok for a couple of years. You'll learn to appreciate an
air conditioner.

Jill

On Sun 15 Mar 2009 04:02:08p, Mark Thorson told us...

> You can see it he
>
> http://www.gourmet.com/food/2009/02/...he-way-we-cook
> ?slide=1#showHeader

Personally, I would hardly call many, if any, of these choices
"revolutionary", but some certainly added convenience to the
kitchen/cooking environment.

1. Non-stick coating... In general, if you have decent cookware, non-
stick coatings don't provide a huge advantage except, perhaps, for cooking
eggs. While it's true that things don't stick to most of them, with good
cookware and proper cooking techniques, foods don't stick to many cooking
services. Where they can be a distinct advantage is in very thin cheap
cookware which is prone to burning and sticking food.

2. Air conditioning... Because my dad was an HVAC engineer, I never lived
in a home that didn't have air conditioning. Many people would agree that
it provides a comfortable and consistent living environment. Unless you
live in a climate where temperatures and/or humidity soar in the summer, I
don't see that it provides a huge advantage to cooking. Living in Arizona,
however, it's an essential that I could/would absolutely not live without,
cooking included.

3. Timers... I don't own, need, or want any external stand-alone timers,
but if my appliances (range, microwaves, toaster ovens, etc.), didn't have
their own timers I would consider them essential for many things,
especially baking, roasting, etc.

4. Chimney starter... Since I haven't used charcoal in 35 years, it
certainly isn't an essential to me. For those who do use charcoal, there
are numerous easy ways to start a charcoal fire. Perhaps those who use
these find thm easier, less messy, and more convenient than other methods.

5. Plastic wrap... Originally developed as an improvement over waxed
paper, it is an essential in my kitchen. It performs better for most uses,
although both waxed paper and parchment paper have unique uses where
plastic wrap cannot be substituted.

6. Television... Julia Child, in particular, started a cooking
revolutioin that brought good food and good cooking techniques to the
masses. Other television cooks have frequently made positive offerings as
well.

7. Vacuum sealers... I don't own one and probably wouldn't use it much if
I did. I can understand what many people feel the advantages may be, but
they're unimportant to me. A heavy weight plastic bag and soda straw
suffice for my needs.

8. Dishwashers... An absolute essential in my kitchen. I would most
likely cook infrequently if I had to clean up after myself. I grew up with
one in every house we lived in, and it was my first purchase in the first
apartment I rented that didn't have one. I know dishwashers are
subjective, though, as many proclaim to enjoy washing dishes by hand.

9. Silpat... I bought a sheet once and threw it out after a couple of
uses. Just another damned thing to clean. Parchment is just as effective,
IMO, and I'd rather dispose of it rather than clean it.

10. Refrigerators (and/or freezers)... A total revolution to the kitchen
and cooking. Before refrigerators, most home cooks had to shop almost
daily to provide fresh food for the table. Refrigerators also spawned many
dishes that simply weren't possible with ice boxes or "nothing" to keep
food at low storage or frozen temperatures.

11. Overnight freight... An absolute and total waste of money, IMO. The
cost of overnight freight today almost always is greater than the item
being shipped. I can't think of anything I need that badly to warrant
such a cost.

12. The Internet... As much as I love owning cookbooks, the ease of
locating a huge assortment of recipes on the Internet has no comparison.
For those who cannot afford to build a substantial library of cookbooks,
searching the Internet for recipes and/or sharing them with others, saves
hours of laborious searching through libraries or enquiring about them from
others.

13. Food procesors... An absolute essential among my kitchen appliances.
I owned the first model offered in the US, the Robot-Coupe. I couldn't
believe how much time it saved in food prep. There are probably a number
of dishes I make that I wouldn't bother with if I didn't have a food
processor. My orignal Robot-Coupe was replaced after a decade with a
Cuisinart and a Hamilton Beach. The Robot-Coupe was replaced because of a
broken workbowl which, at the time, couldn't be replaced. The brand is of
such high quality, I would buy an imported Robot-Coupe if I could afford
today's prices.

14. Gas grills... My decided preference over charcoal. I prefer it's
almost instant heat, convenience, temperature accuracy, lack of mess, etc.
The model I own has a drawer to hold wood chips to add a smoke flavor.

15. Microplane graters... A true advance over ordinary grater,
particularly for certain food itemks. Yet, ordinary graters also have
advantages over microplanes. I wouldn't part with either.

16. Blenders... Blenders have been around a lot longer than most people
realize. Although entire cookbooks have been written for their use, IMO
there are a few basic uses that nothing else can duplicate, not even food
processors.

17. Slow cookers... Like the Robot Coupe, the original Crock-Pot was an
early addition to my kitchen. I later replaced it with a similar model
with a removable crock, then later added a larger oval-shaped model. I
have tried many recipes either designed for or adapted for the slow cooker.
In the vast majority of cases, I found the final product inferior to the
original cooking method. I can't believe that so many people use them
numerous times a week to put a dinner on the table.

18. Tupperware... Years ago I bought a rather large collection of
Tupperware pieces. I don't have many any longer, as I really prefer
storing in the old-style glass refrigerator containers. I do like the
cheap, disposable plastic containers for storing food in the freezer,
however. Tupperware, as a brand, seems terrifically overpriced.

19. Microwaves... Like the Robot Coupe and the Crock-Pot, a first
generation microwave was an early addtion to my kitchen. An Amana, it came
with a large hard-bound cookbook with some decent and some very contrived
recipes. Newer technology has made them a better cooking medium, although
I have to say that I almost never cook a "meal" in the microwave. It is
usually used to reheat, defrost, or an interim step in a recipe.

20. Weber Grill... Never owned one. Grew up with a huge wood-fired brick
and stone barbecue in the back yard. It produced great food, but I
wouldn't trade it for a gas grill. The main advantage of a Weber kettle or
similar grill is its portability.

--
Wayne Boatwright

"One man's meat is another man's poison"
- Oswald Dykes, English writer, 1709.

Wayne Boatwright wrote:
>
> 2. Air conditioning... Because my dad was an HVAC engineer, I never lived
> in a home that didn't have air conditioning.
>
> 8. Dishwashers... An absolute essential in my kitchen. I would most
> likely cook infrequently if I had to clean up after myself. I grew up
> with one in every house we lived in, and it was my first purchase in the
> first apartment I rented that didn't have one. I know dishwashers are
> subjective, though, as many proclaim to enjoy washing dishes by hand.

Geez Louise! You grew up like Richie Rich or
George W. Bush! Probably don't even know what
shit smells like because always had servants to
.. . . I'll let Sheldon finish that sentence.

Do you even know what a bread crust is? Or were
they all sliced off your sandwiches before you
ever saw them? Diary entry -- "Found seed in
orange juice, had cook flogged."

ENJOY WASHING DISHES ??? Seen it in paintings,
have you, Richie? Happy peasants washing dishes?
If I were a painter, I'd paint pictures of
happy peasants cleaning cat litter boxes.
And I'd sell them to the ruling class, who would
assume they reflected an underlying reality
that supported their imagination of the natural
order of things. I bet they'd sell pretty well,
too. Especially in Texas. And other places
where they use air conditioning and Mexicans.
Happy Mexicans.

"Mark Thorson" > wrote in message
...
> Wayne Boatwright wrote:
>>
>> 2. Air conditioning... Because my dad was an HVAC engineer, I never
>> lived
>> in a home that didn't have air conditioning.
>>
>> 8. Dishwashers... An absolute essential in my kitchen. I would most
>> likely cook infrequently if I had to clean up after myself. I grew up
>> with one in every house we lived in, and it was my first purchase in the
>> first apartment I rented that didn't have one. I know dishwashers are
>> subjective, though, as many proclaim to enjoy washing dishes by hand.
>
> Geez Louise! You grew up like Richie Rich or
> George W. Bush! Probably don't even know what
> shit smells like because always had servants to
> . . . I'll let Sheldon finish that sentence.

I'm about he same age as Wayne. Middle class family and AC all the way. I
think we were the first on our block. I did not have a dishwasher until I
bought my first house at 20. Have not been without one since.

Ed Pawlowski wrote:

> I'm about he same age as Wayne. Middle class family and AC all the way. I
> think we were the first on our block. I did not have a dishwasher until I
> bought my first house at 20. Have not been without one since.
>
I think I'm 15-20 years younger than Wayne, but we always had
dishwashers and air conditioning growing up in Dallas.

"Goomba" > wrote in message
...
> Ed Pawlowski wrote:
>
>> I'm about he same age as Wayne. Middle class family and AC all the way.
>> I think we were the first on our block. I did not have a dishwasher
>> until I bought my first house at 20. Have not been without one since.
> I think I'm 15-20 years younger than Wayne, but we always had dishwashers
> and air conditioning growing up in Dallas.

Evidently having the AC help, your cuter than Wayne too!

"Michael "Dog3"" > wrote in message
...
> "Ed Pawlowski" >
> : in rec.food.cooking
>
>> I'm about he same age as Wayne. Middle class family and AC all the
>> way. I think we were the first on our block. I did not have a
>> dishwasher until I bought my first house at 20. Have not been without
>> one since.
>
> You're about 10 years older than I am. Remember your first microwave?
> Actually I could live without a microwave but they sure come in handy
> sometimes.
>
> Michael

We didn't get a microwave until about 1985. Now that we have it, we use it
frequently. Serves a purpose, but some things are better cooked
conventionally. The one we have now is also a convection oven and we use it
as a second oven. Handy for big meals.

Ed Pawlowski said...

>
> "Michael "Dog3"" > wrote in message
> ...
>> "Ed Pawlowski" >
>> : in rec.food.cooking
>>
>>> I'm about he same age as Wayne. Middle class family and AC all the
>>> way. I think we were the first on our block. I did not have a
>>> dishwasher until I bought my first house at 20. Have not been without
>>> one since.
>>
>> You're about 10 years older than I am. Remember your first microwave?
>> Actually I could live without a microwave but they sure come in handy
>> sometimes.
>>
>> Michael
>
> We didn't get a microwave until about 1985. Now that we have it, we use
> it frequently. Serves a purpose, but some things are better cooked
> conventionally. The one we have now is also a convection oven and we
> use it as a second oven. Handy for big meals.


The small tabletop convection toaster oven does a great job of cooking
small roasts (browning included) in next to no time. Does a superb job
roasting chateaubriand (2 lbs.) in 25 minutes, flipping once.

Not to mention reheating leftover pizza. The microwave would turn it into
some form of cardboard.

Hats off to convection oven cooking!

Andy

On Mon 16 Mar 2009 12:20:07a, Mark Thorson told us...

> Newsgroups: rec.food.cooking
> Subject: Gourmet's list of 20 inventions that changed cooking (long
> response) From: Mark Thorson >
>
> Wayne Boatwright wrote:
>>
>> 2. Air conditioning... Because my dad was an HVAC engineer, I never
>> lived in a home that didn't have air conditioning.
>>
>> 8. Dishwashers... An absolute essential in my kitchen. I would most
>> likely cook infrequently if I had to clean up after myself. I grew up
>> with one in every house we lived in, and it was my first purchase in
>> the first apartment I rented that didn't have one. I know dishwashers
>> are subjective, though, as many proclaim to enjoy washing dishes by
>> hand.
>
> Geez Louise! You grew up like Richie Rich or
> George W. Bush! Probably don't even know what
> shit smells like because always had servants to
> . . . I'll let Sheldon finish that sentence.

Give a guy a break, Mark. I grew up as the only child in an upper middle
class family. My parents weren't wealthy, but my dad made a very
comfortable living. Most homes in our neighborhood had dishwashers and
automatic clothes washers and dryers. Not everyone had central air
conditioning.

We didn't have "servants", but we did have a yard man and my mother did
have a cleaning lady. My mother did all the cooking and some of th
cleaning she preferred doing herself.

--
Wayne Boatwright

"One man's meat is another man's poison"
- Oswald Dykes, English writer, 1709.

Wayne Boatwright wrote:
>
> Give a guy a break, Mark. I grew up as the only child in an upper middle
> class family. My parents weren't wealthy, but my dad made a very
> comfortable living. Most homes in our neighborhood had dishwashers and
> automatic clothes washers and dryers. Not everyone had central air
> conditioning.

I should have known! Washers and dryers, indeed.
I'll bet you had color TV, too! And Touch-Tone
phones. All of your butter was curled.
Dog professionally groomed twice a week.
If it wasn't silk, it would be new dollar bills
for toilet paper.

On Mon 16 Mar 2009 08:44:45p, Mark Thorson told us...

> Wayne Boatwright wrote:
>>
>> Give a guy a break, Mark. I grew up as the only child in an upper
middle
>> class family. My parents weren't wealthy, but my dad made a very
>> comfortable living. Most homes in our neighborhood had dishwashers and
>> automatic clothes washers and dryers. Not everyone had central air
>> conditioning.
>
> I should have known! Washers and dryers, indeed.
> I'll bet you had color TV, too! And Touch-Tone
> phones. All of your butter was curled.
> Dog professionally groomed twice a week.
> If it wasn't silk, it would be new dollar bills
> for toilet paper.

This is getting to be too funny. :-) Actually, we didn't even have a TV
until 1951. When my dad did buy one, he bought a B&W set with a larger
screen than most folks had, IIRC it was 20". The standard 21" inch screens
weren't on the market yet. OTOH, he refused to buy a color set until the
original B&W set had completely quit working. That wasn't until 1966.
Everyone I knew had a color set before my parents did. My mother served
butter like most folks do, in 1/4 lb. sticks in a butter dish, although I
admit that she used a butter press when we had company. We got a toy
shepherd when I was 5 years old. My mother bathed her herself once a week
in the stationary tubs down in the basement. Uh, toilet paper? Standard
2-ply on the roll like most folks.

--
Wayne Boatwright

"One man's meat is another man's poison"
- Oswald Dykes, English writer, 1709.

Mark Thorson wrote:

> Wayne Boatwright wrote:
> >
> > Give a guy a break, Mark. I grew up as the only child in an upper
middle
> > class family. My parents weren't wealthy, but my dad made a very
> > comfortable living. Most homes in our neighborhood had dishwashers and
> > automatic clothes washers and dryers. Not everyone had central air
> > conditioning.
>
> I should have known! Washers and dryers, indeed.
> I'll bet you had color TV, too! And Touch-Tone
> phones. All of your butter was curled.
> Dog professionally groomed twice a week.
> If it wasn't silk, it would be new dollar bills
> for toilet paper.


Yup...Lil' Wayne's dear ole mudder dressed him up like Little Lord
Fauntleroy, when puberty hit he was dressed in Mary Janes, a starched
pinafore, and he had a head full of golden barrel curls, that's why the
neighborhood kids referreed to him as "The Top Fop", e.g. he was spoiled
R-O-T-T-E-N.

Lol...


--
Best
Greg

On Mar 16, 3:20*am, Mark Thorson > wrote:
> Wayne Boatwright wrote:
>
> > 2. *Air conditioning... *Because my dad was an HVAC engineer, I never lived
> > in a home that didn't have air conditioning.
>
> > 8. *Dishwashers... *An absolute essential in my kitchen. *I would most
> > likely cook infrequently if I had to clean up after myself. *I grew up
> > with one in every house we lived in, and it was my first purchase in the
> > first apartment I rented that didn't have one. *I know dishwashers are
> > subjective, though, as many proclaim to enjoy washing dishes by hand.
>
> Geez Louise! *You grew up like Richie Rich or
> George W. Bush! *Probably don't even know what
> shit smells like because always had servants to
> . . . I'll let Sheldon finish that sentence.
>
> Do you even know what a bread crust is? *Or were
> they all sliced off your sandwiches before you
> ever saw them? *Diary entry -- "Found seed in
> orange juice, had cook flogged."
>
> ENJOY WASHING DISHES ??? *Seen it in paintings,
> have you, Richie? *Happy peasants washing dishes?
> If I were a painter, I'd paint pictures of
> happy peasants cleaning cat litter boxes.
> And I'd sell them to the ruling class, who would
> assume they reflected an underlying reality
> that supported their imagination of the natural
> order of things. *I bet they'd sell pretty well,
> too. *Especially in Texas. *And other places
> where they use air conditioning and Mexicans.
> Happy Mexicans.

Sounding a little jealous, aren't you? I know there are folks in this
world who had it better than me, or had more than we did when growning
up, but as a kid, do you have a choice of living in the lap of luxury
(as you seem to think Wayne did) or in a cardboard shack? No. Grow
up.

maxine in ri

"Wayne Boatwright" > wrote in message
>
> 1. Non-stick coating... In general, if you have decent cookware, non-
> stick coatings don't provide a huge advantage except, perhaps, for cooking
> eggs.

We have two Teflon coated pans. One is a small pan used almost exclusivey
for eggs. The other is thick aluminum and works well for a general use pan.
Agree on the other comments and the SS pans are better at browning.


> 2. Air conditioning... Because my dad was an HVAC engineer, I never
> lived
> in a home that didn't have air conditioning. Many people would agree that
> it provides a comfortable and consistent living environment.

People lived for centuries without it, but we first got AC just downstairs
when I was about 8 or 10 years old. It was a huge heavy window unit and in
the summer we'd sleep on the LR floor in comfort. Older homes were designed
better to keep things cooler with high ceilings and big eaves but that
changed in the 40's or so.



> 3. Timers... I don't own, need, or want any external stand-alone timers,
> but if my appliances (range, microwaves, toaster ovens, etc.), didn't have
> their own timers I would consider them essential for many things,
> especially baking, roasting, etc.

Baking is about the only thing we use a timer for. Most cooking is by feel
or sight. Handy, but we could survive without.

>
> 4. Chimney starter... Since I haven't used charcoal in 35 years, it
> certainly isn't an essential to me.

I use mine a few times a year. Far from an essential.


For those who do use charcoal, there
> are numerous easy ways to start a charcoal fire. Perhaps those who use
> these find thm easier, less messy, and more convenient than other methods.
>
> 5. Plastic wrap... Originally developed as an improvement over waxed
> paper, it is an essential in my kitchen.

We don't use a lot of wrap, but we do use bags and containers for the same
reason. Definitly a big plus for preservation of leftovers and lunches.


>
> 6. Television... Julia Child, in particular, started a cooking
> revolutioin that brought good food and good cooking techniques to the
> masses. Other television cooks have frequently made positive offerings as
> well. .

Frugal Gourmet was my first "regular" show to watch. Who'd have thought in
1960 that we'd have the Food Network?

>
> 7. Vacuum sealers... I don't own one and probably wouldn't use it much
> if
> I did.

We shop once a month and use the freezer. Handy for us.
>
> 8. Dishwashers... An absolute essential in my kitchen.

Absoluely. Won't be without one. Does such a nice job too.


>
> 9. Silpat... I bought a sheet once and threw it out after a couple of
> uses.

Never had one, never wanted one.



>
> 10. Refrigerators (and/or freezers)... A total revolution to the kitchen
> and cooking. Before refrigerators, most home cooks had to shop almost
> daily to provide fresh food for the table. Refrigerators also spawned
> many
> dishes that simply weren't possible with ice boxes or "nothing" to keep
> food at low storage or frozen temperatures.

Can't imagine not having one. We have two plus a freezer. Our ancestors had
it tough. Live the icemaker and water dispenser too.


>
> 11. Overnight freight... An absolute and total waste of money, IMO. The
> cost of overnight freight today almost always is greater than the item
> being shipped. I can't think of anything I need that badly to warrant
> such a cost.

Air freight is a big deal for the seafood industry. Air is about hte only
way people inside the cost can get fresh seafood. OTOH, it can be carried
to the extreme.

>
> 12. The Internet... As much as I love owning cookbooks, the ease of
> locating a huge assortment of recipes on the Internet has no comparison.

I've learned an incredible amount of information from the internet, food,
tools, vacations, and on and on.
>
> 13. Food procesors... An absolute essential among my kitchen appliances.
> I owned the first model offered in the US, the Robot-Coupe. I couldn't
> believe how much time it saved in food prep.

I can take it or leave it. We use our maybe twice a month. It does nothing
that cannot be done by other methods, it just does it faster. For small
batches, little time is save.


>
> 14. Gas grills... My decided preference over charcoal. I prefer it's
> almost instant heat, convenience, temperature accuracy, lack of mess, etc.
> The model I own has a drawer to hold wood chips to add a smoke flavor.

Same here

>
> 15. Microplane graters... A true advance over ordinary grater,
> particularly for certain food itemks. Yet, ordinary graters also have
> advantages over microplanes. I wouldn't part with either.

Good for zesting

>
> 16. Blenders... Blenders have been around a lot longer than most people
> realize. Although entire cookbooks have been written for their use, IMO
> there are a few basic uses that nothing else can duplicate, not even food
> processors.

We use it even less than the food processor. Maybe we should make an effort
to learn more about what it can do.

>
> 17. Slow cookers...

Don't have one. Dutch oven and stove top. My wife is home so she can watch
it.


>
> 18. Tupperware... Years ago I bought a rather large collection of
> Tupperware pieces. I don't have many any longer, as I really prefer
> storing in the old-style glass refrigerator containers. I do like the
> cheap, disposable plastic containers for storing food in the freezer,
> however. Tupperware, as a brand, seems terrifically overpriced.

We use Rubbermaid and Glad container, but Tupper started the whole plastic
thing.

>
> 19. Microwaves... Like the Robot Coupe and the Crock-Pot, a first
> generation microwave was an early addtion to my kitchen.

Late addition for us. It has good uses.
>
> 20. Weber Grill... Never owned one. Grew up with a huge wood-fired
> brick
> and stone barbecue in the back yard. It produced great food, but I
> wouldn't trade it for a gas grill. The main advantage of a Weber kettle
> or
> similar grill is its portability.

Hey, we had a brick setup too. Did crab boils on it too.

--
Ed
http://pages.cthome.net/edhome/

Mark Thorson said...

> You can see it he
>
> http://www.gourmet.com/food/2009/02/...he-way-we-cook
> ?slide=1#showHeader
>
> I get an error when I click on item 2, but I can
> get to item 2 by replacing 1 with 2 in the URL.
>
> I wouldn't put air conditioning on the list, but
> I've never lived in a place with an air conditioner.
>
> I'm not that keen on timers, either. I used to use
> a clock, and now I use the clock in my computer or
> TV set.
>
> Chimney starter? I use fluid, and before that I used
> an electric starter. Either works fine. The chimney
> starter doesn't provide any new capability.
>
> I'm not going to finish looking at this list. Too much
> of it seems bogus.


They forgot

Mandolines
George Forman Grill
Toasters

Refrigerators, from another poster, In England, they kept kegs of beer
underground as a method to keep it cool. I remember in Oxford, at a hotel I
had a rum 'n' coke but had to BEG for ice cubes. They were seriously
stingy. A breakfast thing??? <VBG>

Best,

Andy

Mark Thorson wrote:
> You can see it he
>
> http://www.gourmet.com/food/2009/02/...e=1#showHeader
>
> I get an error when I click on item 2, but I can
> get to item 2 by replacing 1 with 2 in the URL.
>
> I wouldn't put air conditioning on the list, but
> I've never lived in a place with an air conditioner.
>
> I'm not that keen on timers, either. I used to use
> a clock, and now I use the clock in my computer or
> TV set.
>
> Chimney starter? I use fluid, and before that I used
> an electric starter. Either works fine. The chimney
> starter doesn't provide any new capability.
>
> I'm not going to finish looking at this list. Too much
> of it seems bogus.

Gee. I use a fraction of these things, and some don't sound like
a good idea at all.

1. Nonstick coating--turns out not to be good for you, among
other things.

2. Air conditioning--depends on one's climate I suppose. I don't
like, say, using the oven or otherwise generating much heat when I
have the AC on. If I do have to cook something for an extended
period when it is hot, I prefer to do that in the early morning or
at night.

3. Timer--yes, I do use them--both for timing (duh) and to remind
myself that something is on or something needs to be done.

4. Chimney starter--not applicable to me (now).

5. Plastic wrap--depends on one's definition of cooking; it is
not good to COOK with it. Or to wrap fatty foods in it.

6. TV--well, mom used to watch Julia Child et al., so there was
probably a carryover effect on my cooking. I don't watch TV.

7. Vacuum sealers--I haven't ever used one. Come to think of it,
I do have one, given to me by someone else who didn't use it.

8. Dishwasher--useful, but mine has been broken for years.

9. Silpat--I don't own any. I wonder whether down the line,
research will show it is a bad idea, like nonstick coating.

10. Refrigerator--I'll go along with this one.

11. Overnight freight--yes and no. I think ideally we need to
buy local produce etc. and eat in season.

12. The Internet--obviously, being here, I agree with this as far
as access to recipes and information goes.

13. Food processor--I gave mine away to a former rfc poster years
ago and very rarely regret that.

14. Gas grill--if and when I get up the nerve to grill, it will
be with charcoal (at least I think so).

15. Microplane--I have never used one and have survived!

16. Blender (or Blendor--they should spell the Waring product
correctly)--useful. I think one might have to include stick
blenders here....

17. Slow cooker--I can see this, especially for folks who can't
be home cooking for hours before dinner.

18. Tupperware--I prefer containers made of glass/Pyrex.

19. Microwave oven--yes, especially when it comes to reheating.

20. Weber Grill--???

This is an odd list. How about a beater (even the hand-cranked
ones were a big improvement on having to beat things for hours,
and the electric ones were obviously an improvement over that).

Or a coffee grinder (home or store) for those of us who like coffee?

Or a stove/range/oven (as vs. using the fireplace?

Or indoor plumbing/easy access to water?

Or electricity, if you want to get down to basics?
--
Jean B.

Jean wrote on Mon, 16 Mar 2009 09:39:39 -0400:

> Mark Thorson wrote:
>> You can see it he
>>
>> http://www.gourmet.com/food/2009/02/...e=1#showHeader
>>
>> I get an error when I click on item 2, but I can
>> get to item 2 by replacing 1 with 2 in the URL.
>>
>> I wouldn't put air conditioning on the list, but
>> I've never lived in a place with an air conditioner.
>>
>> I'm not that keen on timers, either. I used to use
>> a clock, and now I use the clock in my computer or
>> TV set.
>>
>> Chimney starter? I use fluid, and before that I used
>> an electric starter. Either works fine. The chimney
>> starter doesn't provide any new capability.
>>
>> I'm not going to finish looking at this list. Too much
>> of it seems bogus.

> Gee. I use a fraction of these things, and some don't sound
> like a good idea at all.

> 1. Nonstick coating--turns out not to be good for you, among other
> things.

> 2. Air conditioning--depends on one's climate I suppose. I
> don't like, say, using the oven or otherwise generating much
> heat when I have the AC on. If I do have to cook something
> for an extended period when it is hot, I prefer to do that in the
> early morning or at night.

> 3. Timer--yes, I do use them--both for timing (duh) and to
> remind myself that something is on or something needs to be
> done.

> 4. Chimney starter--not applicable to me (now).

> 5. Plastic wrap--depends on one's definition of cooking; it
> is not good to COOK with it. Or to wrap fatty foods in it.

> 6. TV--well, mom used to watch Julia Child et al., so there
> was probably a carryover effect on my cooking. I don't watch TV.

> 7. Vacuum sealers--I haven't ever used one. Come to think of
> it, I do have one, given to me by someone else who didn't use it.

> 8. Dishwasher--useful, but mine has been broken for years.

> 9. Silpat--I don't own any. I wonder whether down the line, research
> will show it is a bad idea, like nonstick coating.

> 10. Refrigerator--I'll go along with this one.

> 11. Overnight freight--yes and no. I think ideally we need
> to buy local produce etc. and eat in season.

> 12. The Internet--obviously, being here, I agree with this as
> far as access to recipes and information goes.

> 13. Food processor--I gave mine away to a former rfc poster
> years ago and very rarely regret that.

> 14. Gas grill--if and when I get up the nerve to grill, it
> will be with charcoal (at least I think so).

> 15. Microplane--I have never used one and have survived!

> 16. Blender (or Blendor--they should spell the Waring product
> correctly)--useful. I think one might have to include stick blenders
> here....

> 17. Slow cooker--I can see this, especially for folks who
> can't be home cooking for hours before dinner.

> 18. Tupperware--I prefer containers made of glass/Pyrex.

> 19. Microwave oven--yes, especially when it comes to
> reheating.

> 20. Weber Grill--???

> This is an odd list. How about a beater (even the
> hand-cranked ones were a big improvement on having to beat
> things for hours, and the electric ones were obviously an
> improvement over that).

> Or a coffee grinder (home or store) for those of us who like
> coffee?

> Or a stove/range/oven (as vs. using the fireplace?

> Or indoor plumbing/easy access to water?

> Or electricity, if you want to get down to basics?

Also, too many phobias and misstatementsd to counter in one post!
--

James Silverton
Potomac, Maryland

Email, with obvious alterations: not.jim.silverton.at.verizon.not

On Mar 16, 9:39*am, "Jean B." > wrote:

> 11. *Overnight freight--yes and no. *I think ideally we need to
> buy local produce etc. and eat in season.

No. No. No.

I don't want to spend half the year eating nothing but parsnips.
The ground is frozen solid for three of those months.

How do you suggest we feed the millions of people who live
in the northern tier of states?

Cindy Hamilton

In article
>,
Cindy Hamilton > wrote:

> On Mar 16, 9:39*am, "Jean B." > wrote:
>
> > 11. *Overnight freight--yes and no. *I think ideally we need to
> > buy local produce etc. and eat in season.
>
> No. No. No.
>
> I don't want to spend half the year eating nothing but parsnips.
> The ground is frozen solid for three of those months.
>
> How do you suggest we feed the millions of people who live
> in the northern tier of states?
>
> Cindy Hamilton

Okra.
--
Peace! Om

I find hope in the darkest of days, and focus in the brightest. I do not judge the universe. -- Dalai Lama

"Cindy Hamilton" > wrote in message
...
On Mar 16, 9:39 am, "Jean B." > wrote:

> 11. Overnight freight--yes and no. I think ideally we need to
> buy local produce etc. and eat in season.

No. No. No.

I don't want to spend half the year eating nothing but parsnips.
The ground is frozen solid for three of those months.

How do you suggest we feed the millions of people who live
in the northern tier of states?

Cindy Hamilton

************************************************** ***

Truck and railcar. Much cheaper than overnight air.

On Mon 16 Mar 2009 07:38:03p, Ed Pawlowski told us...

>
> "Cindy Hamilton" > wrote in message
> ...
> On Mar 16, 9:39 am, "Jean B." > wrote:
>
>> 11. Overnight freight--yes and no. I think ideally we need to buy
>> local produce etc. and eat in season.
>
> No. No. No.
>
> I don't want to spend half the year eating nothing but parsnips.
> The ground is frozen solid for three of those months.
>
> How do you suggest we feed the millions of people who live
> in the northern tier of states?
>
> Cindy Hamilton
>
> ************************************************** ***
>
> Truck and railcar. Much cheaper than overnight air.

Frozen vegetables?

--
Wayne Boatwright

"One man's meat is another man's poison"
- Oswald Dykes, English writer, 1709.

On Mar 17, 12:27*am, Wayne Boatwright
> wrote:
> On Mon 16 Mar 2009 07:38:03p, Ed Pawlowski told us...
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > "Cindy Hamilton" > wrote in message
> ....
> > On Mar 16, 9:39 am, "Jean B." > wrote:
>
> >> 11. Overnight freight--yes and no. I think ideally we need to buy
> >> local produce etc. and eat in season.
>
> > No. *No. *No.
>
> > I don't want to spend half the year eating nothing but parsnips.
> > The ground is frozen solid for three of those months.
>
> > How do you suggest we feed the millions of people who live
> > in the northern tier of states?
>
> > Cindy Hamilton
>
> > ************************************************** ***
>
> > Truck and railcar. *Much cheaper than overnight air.
>
> Frozen vegetables?

Practically the only vegetables my husband will eat is: salad.

I do not want to contemplate frozen lettuce, although I do
contemplate it occasionally as a result of delays in
shipping.

Truck and railcar obviously are viable options, it's how we
snowlanders get much of our food already. I don't think
air freight is necessary (except maybe for some fish).

I just get so peeved when people say "eat locally" without
thinking about the real effects on millions of snowlanders.
Christ, it's hard enough to get Midwesterners to eat
vegetables as it is. (I don't count corn as a vegetable;
in my book it's a starch.)

Cindy Hamilton

Cindy Hamilton wrote:
> On Mar 16, 9:39 am, "Jean B." > wrote:
>
>> 11. Overnight freight--yes and no. I think ideally we need to
>> buy local produce etc. and eat in season.
>
> No. No. No.
>
> I don't want to spend half the year eating nothing but parsnips.
> The ground is frozen solid for three of those months.
>
> How do you suggest we feed the millions of people who live
> in the northern tier of states?

Even tomatoes don't come in until late July, and they're done
in September ... I'm for sure not going to do without fresh
tomatoes most of the year. The local farmstands close after
October because nothing is growing. I live in zone 7, it's not
even a really cold state, there are much colder. There would be
no lettuce, nothing, for most of the year. Never lemons. Never
bananas.

The local/in season thing is a nice idea, but it only works during
the few growing months, if you have any interest in fresh vegetables
and fruits.

nancy