So I just picked up the "FRESH" turkey that I WAS going to brine for
tomorrow's turkey fry. This is the "FRESH" turkey that I ordered a week ago
from our locally owned and operated "Angelo's Fresh Market".

After 20 min. of waiting for the staff to find the "FRESH" 14# turkey, the
"FRESH" turkey lost 1.5#. The next closest was a 20#, too big for my fryer.

Got the "FRESH" turkey home and noticed that "FRESH" turkey now means "with
9.5% natural turkey broth and seasonings", seasoning being SALT and SODIUM
PHOSPHATE.

I wanted a FRESH TURKEY, not a f#ckin $1.69 per lb. chemistry set! I wanted
to brine it with my seasonings, not theirs! And I have a real problem paying
for 9.5% water.

So much for supporting the local guy.

Next time I'm going back to the Amish turkey. for 1.89 per lb. at least they
know what FRESH means.

"Usenet" > wrote in message
.com...
> So I just picked up the "FRESH" turkey that I WAS going to brine for
> tomorrow's turkey fry. This is the "FRESH" turkey that I ordered a week
> ago from our locally owned and operated "Angelo's Fresh Market".
>
> After 20 min. of waiting for the staff to find the "FRESH" 14# turkey, the
> "FRESH" turkey lost 1.5#. The next closest was a 20#, too big for my
> fryer.
>
> Got the "FRESH" turkey home and noticed that "FRESH" turkey now means
> "with 9.5% natural turkey broth and seasonings", seasoning being SALT and
> SODIUM PHOSPHATE.
>
> I wanted a FRESH TURKEY, not a f#ckin $1.69 per lb. chemistry set! I
> wanted to brine it with my seasonings, not theirs! And I have a real
> problem paying for 9.5% water.
>
> So much for supporting the local guy.
>
> Next time I'm going back to the Amish turkey. for 1.89 per lb. at least
> they know what FRESH means.
>
>
If you dry-brine a water added turkey, some of that 9% extra water should
come out of the turkey. The sodium chloride percent in the turkey tries to
equilabrate with the saltier solution of the brine on the surface of the
turkey. That does make the turkey more salty than it was when it came from
the turkey producer. I have a 10% water added turkey dry brining in the frig
now. Tonight, after 48 hours I'm going to rinse and air dry overnight.

Kent

"Kent" wrote in message ...


"Usenet" > wrote in message
.com...
> So I just picked up the "FRESH" turkey that I WAS going to brine for
> tomorrow's turkey fry. This is the "FRESH" turkey that I ordered a week
> ago from our locally owned and operated "Angelo's Fresh Market".
>
> After 20 min. of waiting for the staff to find the "FRESH" 14# turkey, the
> "FRESH" turkey lost 1.5#. The next closest was a 20#, too big for my
> fryer.
>
> Got the "FRESH" turkey home and noticed that "FRESH" turkey now means
> "with 9.5% natural turkey broth and seasonings", seasoning being SALT and
> SODIUM PHOSPHATE.
>
> I wanted a FRESH TURKEY, not a f#ckin $1.69 per lb. chemistry set! I
> wanted to brine it with my seasonings, not theirs! And I have a real
> problem paying for 9.5% water.
>
> So much for supporting the local guy.
>
> Next time I'm going back to the Amish turkey. for 1.89 per lb. at least
> they know what FRESH means.
>
>
If you dry-brine a water added turkey, some of that 9% extra water should
come out of the turkey. The sodium chloride percent in the turkey tries to
equilabrate with the saltier solution of the brine on the surface of the
turkey. That does make the turkey more salty than it was when it came from
the turkey producer. I have a 10% water added turkey dry brining in the frig
now. Tonight, after 48 hours I'm going to rinse and air dry overnight.

Kent

1st off, that makes no friggin sense. Second, I wanted to instill MY flavors
which your "dry salt to insanity" will not.

From http://www.thefreedictionary.com/brine

brine (brn)
n.

"Gene" > wrote in message
news
>
>
> "Kent" wrote in message ...
>
>
> "Usenet" > wrote in message
> .com...
>> So I just picked up the "FRESH" turkey that I WAS going to brine for
>> tomorrow's turkey fry. This is the "FRESH" turkey that I ordered a week
>> ago from our locally owned and operated "Angelo's Fresh Market".
>>
>> After 20 min. of waiting for the staff to find the "FRESH" 14# turkey,
>> the "FRESH" turkey lost 1.5#. The next closest was a 20#, too big for my
>> fryer.
>>
>> Got the "FRESH" turkey home and noticed that "FRESH" turkey now means
>> "with 9.5% natural turkey broth and seasonings", seasoning being SALT and
>> SODIUM PHOSPHATE.
>>
>> I wanted a FRESH TURKEY, not a f#ckin $1.69 per lb. chemistry set! I
>> wanted to brine it with my seasonings, not theirs! And I have a real
>> problem paying for 9.5% water.
>>
>> So much for supporting the local guy.
>>
>> Next time I'm going back to the Amish turkey. for 1.89 per lb. at least
>> they know what FRESH means.
>>
>>
> If you dry-brine a water added turkey, some of that 9% extra water should
> come out of the turkey. The sodium chloride percent in the turkey tries to
> equilabrate with the saltier solution of the brine on the surface of the
> turkey. That does make the turkey more salty than it was when it came
> from
> the turkey producer. I have a 10% water added turkey dry brining in the
> frig
> now. Tonight, after 48 hours I'm going to rinse and air dry overnight.
>
> Kent
>
> 1st off, that makes no friggin sense. Second, I wanted to instill MY
> flavors which your "dry salt to insanity" will not.
>
> From http://www.thefreedictionary.com/brine
>
> brine (brn)
> n.
> 1. Water saturated with or containing large amounts of a salt, especially
> sodium chloride.
> 2.
> a. The water of a sea or an ocean.
> b. A large body of salt water.
> 3. Salt water used for preserving and pickling foods.
> tr.v. brined, brin·ing, brines
> To immerse, preserve, or pickle in salt water.
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> [Middle English, from Old English brne.]
>
> brine [bra?n]
> n
> 1. (Cookery) a strong solution of salt and water, used for salting and
> pickling meats, etc
> 2. (Earth Sciences / Physical Geography) the sea or its water
> 3. (Chemistry / Elements & Compounds) Chem
> a. a concentrated solution of sodium chloride in water
> b. any solution of a salt in water a potassium chloride brine
> vb
> (tr) to soak in or treat with brine
> [Old English brine; related to Middle Dutch brine, Old Slavonic bridu
> bitter, Sanskrit bibhraya burnt]
> brinish adj
> Collins English Dictionary - Complete and Unabridged © HarperCollins
> Publishers 1991, 1994, 1998, 2000, 2003
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> brine (brn)
> 1. Water saturated with or containing large amounts of a salt, especially
> sodium chloride. The high salt content is usually due to evaporation or
> freezing.
> 2. The water of a sea or ocean.
>
> The American Heritage® Science Dictionary Copyright © 2005 by Houghton
> Mifflin Company. Published by Houghton Mifflin Company. All rights
> reserved.
>
>
> Notice a consistincy? SALT AND WATER. No such thing as a dry BRINE, I
> don't care what America's Test Kitchen says.
>
>
>
>
>
>

Again:

I'm not a fan of calling a salt rub a brine, but technically it is a form of
brining:


DEHYDRO-BRINING
DEFINITION:
In dehydro-brining, a higher concentration of salt is added to a particulet
(piece) of a food product in order to leach the moisture out of the product.
As the salt permeates back into the product, it preserves it. The theory
behind this method is that when the salt and acid levels in a food product
are disequilibrated, they will naturally re-equilibrate, and in so doing,
stabilize the food product. This method is very different from traditional
brining in that it does not involve the use of water. Additionally,
traditional brining can take months before the product is preserved, whereas
dehydro-brining can typically be done within a 24 hour time period.



Find something else to bash Kent about.

"Pico Rico" wrote in message ...


snip

Again:

I'm not a fan of calling a salt rub a brine, but technically it is a form of
brining:


DEHYDRO-BRINING
DEFINITION:
In dehydro-brining, a higher concentration of salt is added to a particulet
(piece) of a food product in order to leach the moisture out of the product.
As the salt permeates back into the product, it preserves it. The theory
behind this method is that when the salt and acid levels in a food product
are disequilibrated, they will naturally re-equilibrate, and in so doing,
stabilize the food product. This method is very different from traditional
brining in that it does not involve the use of water. Additionally,
traditional brining can take months before the product is preserved, whereas
dehydro-brining can typically be done within a 24 hour time period.


Find something else to bash Kent about.

Dehydro "brining" is a new word bash up. The idea is to use salt to
dehydrate meat using salt in order to PRESERVE it and not as a method to
instill flavor and force additional moisture into the meat so it can better
withstand a longer cooking process without drying out.

Normal brining is also use in shorter cooking to add flavor AND and extra
moisture.

Dehydro-brining is a newer way of saying "to preserve with salt". A very old
technique, now *******ized for the gullible. Using a preservation technique
to "fake a brine". I just don't even see the point.

The next big technique on the horizon is Hyper-moisture gaseous Dihydrogen
Monoxide cooking.

I stand by my comments.

As to bashing Kent, that wasn't my intention. But you have to admit, he does
make it easy.

"Gene" > wrote in message
m...
>
>
> "Pico Rico" wrote in message ...
>
>
> snip
>
> Again:
>
> I'm not a fan of calling a salt rub a brine, but technically it is a form
> of
> brining:
>
>
> DEHYDRO-BRINING
> DEFINITION:
> In dehydro-brining, a higher concentration of salt is added to a
> particulet
> (piece) of a food product in order to leach the moisture out of the
> product.
> As the salt permeates back into the product, it preserves it. The theory
> behind this method is that when the salt and acid levels in a food product
> are disequilibrated, they will naturally re-equilibrate, and in so doing,
> stabilize the food product. This method is very different from traditional
> brining in that it does not involve the use of water. Additionally,
> traditional brining can take months before the product is preserved,
> whereas
> dehydro-brining can typically be done within a 24 hour time period.
>
>
> Find something else to bash Kent about.
>
> Dehydro "brining" is a new word bash up. The idea is to use salt to
> dehydrate meat using salt in order to PRESERVE it and not as a method to
> instill flavor and force additional moisture into the meat so it can
> better withstand a longer cooking process without drying out.
>
> Normal brining is also use in shorter cooking to add flavor AND and extra
> moisture.
>
> Dehydro-brining is a newer way of saying "to preserve with salt". A very
> old technique, now *******ized for the gullible. Using a preservation
> technique to "fake a brine". I just don't even see the point.

so, you put salt on a turkey, keep it in the fridge for a day, then roast
it, and you call that "preserving"?

You are as easy as Kent!

"Gene" > wrote in message
m...
>
>
> "Pico Rico" wrote in message ...
>
>
> snip
>
> Again:
>
> I'm not a fan of calling a salt rub a brine, but technically it is a form
> of
> brining:
>
>
> DEHYDRO-BRINING
> DEFINITION:
> In dehydro-brining, a higher concentration of salt is added to a
> particulet
> (piece) of a food product in order to leach the moisture out of the
> product.
> As the salt permeates back into the product, it preserves it. The theory
> behind this method is that when the salt and acid levels in a food product
> are disequilibrated, they will naturally re-equilibrate, and in so doing,
> stabilize the food product. This method is very different from traditional
> brining in that it does not involve the use of water. Additionally,
> traditional brining can take months before the product is preserved,
> whereas
> dehydro-brining can typically be done within a 24 hour time period.
>
>
> Find something else to bash Kent about.
>
> Dehydro "brining" is a new word bash up. The idea is to use salt to
> dehydrate meat using salt in order to PRESERVE it and not as a method to
> instill flavor and force additional moisture into the meat so it can
> better withstand a longer cooking process without drying out.
>
> Normal brining is also use in shorter cooking to add flavor AND and extra
> moisture.
>
> Dehydro-brining is a newer way of saying "to preserve with salt". A very
> old technique, now *******ized for the gullible. Using a preservation
> technique to "fake a brine". I just don't even see the point.
>
> The next big technique on the horizon is Hyper-moisture gaseous Dihydrogen
> Monoxide cooking.
>
> I stand by my comments.
>
> As to bashing Kent, that wasn't my intention. But you have to admit, he
> does make it easy.
>
>
In order for the salt to get into the meat, it must go into solution. At
that point, for a period of time, it becomes brine. The initial, or maximum
concentration of that brine is about 40mg/100ml, or 40%. The salt not in
solution remains as salt on the surface. I have a turkey brining dry with
surface salt in my frig. A concentrated solution of NaCl has developed in
the brining bag from the aqueous fraction of the turkey muscle that is in
solution with the salt. That solution is brine. A reverse brine, but
unquestionably a brine. It must become a brine to get into the muscle
initially, and it's a brine when it comes out. After time, a portion,
hopefully most of it, seeps back into the turkey. The salt in the the muscle
inside equilibrates with the brine outside of the turkey.

Kent



Kent

Kent

On Wed, 23 Nov 2011 13:43:40 -0600, "Usenet" >
wrote:



>I wanted a FRESH TURKEY, not a f#ckin $1.69 per lb. chemistry set! I wanted
>to brine it with my seasonings, not theirs! And I have a real problem paying
>for 9.5% water.
>

You got a comparative bargain. You paid $2 for that 1.25 pounds of
water. If you went to a ball game, you'd pay $4 for a bottle of
water. See, you got a deal and it is turkey flavored to boot.

"Ed Pawlowski" wrote in message
...

On Wed, 23 Nov 2011 13:43:40 -0600, "Usenet" >
wrote:



>I wanted a FRESH TURKEY, not a f#ckin $1.69 per lb. chemistry set! I
>wanted
>to brine it with my seasonings, not theirs! And I have a real problem
>paying
>for 9.5% water.
>

You got a comparative bargain. You paid $2 for that 1.25 pounds of
water. If you went to a ball game, you'd pay $4 for a bottle of
water. See, you got a deal and it is turkey flavored to boot.

I can pay $13.00 for a 30 pack of Busch beer. That comes out to .40 a can.
Much better deal than $2 for 1.25 pounds of water. Given the choice, I would
rather they kept the water out and gave me a few beers

In article >,
"Usenet" > wrote:

> So I just picked up the "FRESH" turkey that I WAS going to brine for
> tomorrow's turkey fry. This is the "FRESH" turkey that I ordered a week ago
> from our locally owned and operated "Angelo's Fresh Market".
>
> After 20 min. of waiting for the staff to find the "FRESH" 14# turkey, the
> "FRESH" turkey lost 1.5#. The next closest was a 20#, too big for my fryer.
>
> Got the "FRESH" turkey home and noticed that "FRESH" turkey now means "with
> 9.5% natural turkey broth and seasonings", seasoning being SALT and SODIUM
> PHOSPHATE.
>
> I wanted a FRESH TURKEY, not a f#ckin $1.69 per lb. chemistry set! I wanted
> to brine it with my seasonings, not theirs! And I have a real problem paying
> for 9.5% water.
>
> So much for supporting the local guy.
>
> Next time I'm going back to the Amish turkey. for 1.89 per lb. at least they
> know what FRESH means.

seems to me that what you wanted was a "local" with no additives, but you didn't
make your order clear

snip

seems to me that what you wanted was a "local" with no additives, but you
didn't
make your order clear

Maybe you are correct. But then again, I get really tired of new ways of
saying stuff that mislead in order to confuse or mislead the consumer.

When did CUSTOMER turn into CONSUMER? (no need to answer that)

If it is a fresh turkey you are selling, then I want a turkey that was
killed, plucked, and handed over. Not injected, rubbed, stroked, or
otherwise molested.

Fresh but "treated" would be a good term to define the product without
****ing off people like me (and others I am sure). But screw that too. The
customer was always right. WTF happened to that?

Sqwertz went on about how he just brined a pre-brined turkey. On first
glance it might look like he just screwed up. But I don't think so. The
labeling and marketing con-game is in place to screw the average
"smoke-a-dope" or otherwise non-pro cook. There is profit in creative
"marketing". Market and sell to sheep and people who do not know the
difference and have no clue how to cook anyway.

Meat, heat, and eat.

Simple. Not so much anymore. Now we got choices that should not even be out
there. I know in my father's time that water and stuff was added to turkey
and ham. But it was under fire from the media at the time for doing so. It
was the start of producing for "value", not quality.

The part that ****es me off most is that the only way the "local" guy has to
survive is to maintain integrity. To not do what the chains do. To maybe
charge a lil bit more, but because of it, to provide QUALITY.

This is not the 1st local store I have seen cave in. And be sure, they ARE
caving in. But it is a store I have been supporting for awhile now.

This place is in the process of expanding..opening another location. Would
be great, if not for the cave in.

Before anyone says that this is much ado about a small issue, let me say
that this turkey indecent is not the only issue. And that it is a hell of a
time to find out that you got a pre-brined turkey at the last hour.

In article >,
"Gene" > wrote:

> snip
>
> seems to me that what you wanted was a "local" with no additives, but you
> didn't
> make your order clear
>
> Maybe you are correct. But then again, I get really tired of new ways of
> saying stuff that mislead in order to confuse or mislead the consumer.

so the fact that you know that "new ways of saying stuff that mislead in order
to confuse or mislead the consumer" is happening, you still didn't do enough due
diligence?

"25/11/11" wrote in message
...

In article >,
"Gene" > wrote:

> snip
>
> seems to me that what you wanted was a "local" with no additives, but you
> didn't
> make your order clear
>
> Maybe you are correct. But then again, I get really tired of new ways of
> saying stuff that mislead in order to confuse or mislead the consumer.

so the fact that you know that "new ways of saying stuff that mislead in
order
to confuse or mislead the consumer" is happening, you still didn't do enough
due
diligence?

The point is that I should not have to. So next time it is within my right
to find another producer, to take my $$$ elsewhere.

In article > ,
"Gene" > wrote:

> "25/11/11" wrote in message
> ...
>
> In article >, "Gene"
> > wrote:
>
> > snip
> >
> > seems to me that what you wanted was a "local" with no additives, but you
> > didn't make your order clear
> >
> > Maybe you are correct. But then again, I get really tired of new ways of
> > saying stuff that mislead in order to confuse or mislead the consumer.
>
> so the fact that you know that "new ways of saying stuff that mislead in
> order to confuse or mislead the consumer" is happening, you still didn't do
> enough due diligence?
>
> The point is that I should not have to.

really?


> So next time it is within my right to
> find another producer, to take my $$$ elsewhere.

in fact you have apparently stumbled on a real business opportunity and should
be that producer

On Thu, 24 Nov 2011 16:06:10 -0600, "Gene" >
wrote:



>>
>> Maybe you are correct. But then again, I get really tired of new ways of
>> saying stuff that mislead in order to confuse or mislead the consumer.
>
>so the fact that you know that "new ways of saying stuff that mislead in
>order
>to confuse or mislead the consumer" is happening, you still didn't do enough
>due
>diligence?
>
>The point is that I should not have to. So next time it is within my right
>to find another producer, to take my $$$ elsewhere.
>


I agree. To me, fresh means not frozen, no additives. According to
the newspaper today, expect to pay big bucks though. Turkeys that are
free range can be $2 to $3 a pound. Organic can be $4 to $6, and some
heritage breeds are running $6 to $12 a pound.

On 24-Nov-2011, 25/11/11 > wrote:

> In article >,
> "Gene" > wrote:
>
> > snip
> >
> > seems to me that what you wanted was a "local" with no additives, but
> > you
> > didn't
> > make your order clear
> >
> > Maybe you are correct. But then again, I get really tired of new ways of
> >
> > saying stuff that mislead in order to confuse or mislead the consumer.
>
> so the fact that you know that "new ways of saying stuff that mislead in
> order
> to confuse or mislead the consumer" is happening, you still didn't do
> enough due
> diligence?

I note that Gene posted with a 'Real' ID from a 'Real' email address while
the respondent is hiding behind a veil of obscurity. So who gives a shit
what he/she says?

--
Brick(Better to remain silent and be thought a fool
then to speak up and remove all doubt)

In article >,
wrote:

> On 24-Nov-2011, 25/11/11 > wrote:
>
> > In article >,
> > "Gene" > wrote:
> >
> > > snip
> > >
> > > seems to me that what you wanted was a "local" with no additives, but you
> > > didn't make your order clear
> > >
> > > Maybe you are correct. But then again, I get really tired of new ways of
> > >
> > > saying stuff that mislead in order to confuse or mislead the consumer.
> >
> > so the fact that you know that "new ways of saying stuff that mislead in
> > order to confuse or mislead the consumer" is happening, you still didn't do
> > enough due diligence?
>
> I note that Gene posted with a 'Real' ID from a 'Real' email address while
> the respondent is hiding behind a veil of obscurity. So who gives a shit
> what he/she says?

explain to us how my veil of obscurity changes the validity of my point. bet you
can't

snip

I note that Gene posted with a 'Real' ID from a 'Real' email address while
the respondent is hiding behind a veil of obscurity. So who gives a shit
what he/she says?

I'm sure it is one of 3 people here changing name just to screw around. Sad
life if that is what it takes him to get his jollies.

Yes, email me at that address and I will get it and prob respond to most
people. I got nothing to hide.

On 25-Nov-2011, "Gene" > wrote:

> Lines: 14
>
> snip
>
> I note that Gene posted with a 'Real' ID from a 'Real' email address while
> the respondent is hiding behind a veil of obscurity. So who gives a shit
> what he/she says?
>
> I'm sure it is one of 3 people here changing name just to screw around.
> Sad
> life if that is what it takes him to get his jollies.
>
> Yes, email me at that address and I will get it and prob respond to most
> people. I got nothing to hide.

Likewise.

--
Brick(Better to remain silent and be thought a fool
then to speak up and remove all doubt)

this is the exactt point i always make when people whine and bitch about
walmart, they aren't doing anything different than anybody else, its not
local vs big box, its, hunt and slueth out what you actually want and are
willing to pay for, good luck, Lee
"Usenet" > wrote in message
.com...
> So I just picked up the "FRESH" turkey that I WAS going to brine for
> tomorrow's turkey fry. This is the "FRESH" turkey that I ordered a week
> ago from our locally owned and operated "Angelo's Fresh Market".
>
> After 20 min. of waiting for the staff to find the "FRESH" 14# turkey, the
> "FRESH" turkey lost 1.5#. The next closest was a 20#, too big for my
> fryer.
>
> Got the "FRESH" turkey home and noticed that "FRESH" turkey now means
> "with 9.5% natural turkey broth and seasonings", seasoning being SALT and
> SODIUM PHOSPHATE.
>
> I wanted a FRESH TURKEY, not a f#ckin $1.69 per lb. chemistry set! I
> wanted to brine it with my seasonings, not theirs! And I have a real
> problem paying for 9.5% water.
>
> So much for supporting the local guy.
>
> Next time I'm going back to the Amish turkey. for 1.89 per lb. at least
> they know what FRESH means.
>
>
>
>