Barbecue (alt.food.barbecue) Discuss barbecue and grilling--southern style "low and slow" smoking of ribs, shoulders and briskets, as well as direct heat grilling of everything from burgers to salmon to vegetables.

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Default Brisket Technique

One "old-timer" told me his secret:

On an off-set smoker make a small wood fire directly in the cooking
chamber and place the brisket fat-side down over that fire and let
cook for about two hours. Let it smoke like crazy. Then, turn over and
cook the other side for about an hour.

Then, move the fire to the fire box and coat the brisket with Wishbone
Italian Dressing. Cook the brisket on in-direct heat in the cooking
chamber for about 15 hours at 225 degrees.

Will try this over upcoming July 4'th.

Any feed-back?

Thanks,

low-n-slow

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Default Brisket Technique


> wrote in message
ups.com...
> One "old-timer" told me his secret:
>
> On an off-set smoker make a small wood fire directly in the cooking
> chamber and place the brisket fat-side down over that fire and let
> cook for about two hours. Let it smoke like crazy. Then, turn over and
> cook the other side for about an hour.
>
> Then, move the fire to the fire box and coat the brisket with Wishbone
> Italian Dressing. Cook the brisket on in-direct heat in the cooking
> chamber for about 15 hours at 225 degrees.
>
> Will try this over upcoming July 4'th.
>
> Any feed-back?
>
> Thanks,
>
> low-n-slow
>


Not the way I do it, but that does not mean it will not work. The "smoke
like crazy" has to be done with some care to avoid bitterness. I just cook
it at 250 until done. I'm not sure what the Wishbone will do or not do, but
I've used it on chicken parts when I grill them with OK results.

Give it a try and let us know.
--
Ed
http://pages.cthome.net/edhome/


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Default Brisket Technique


"Nonnymus" > wrote in message
>
> After you take the meat off after 15 hours at 225f, please report back on
> 1) level of doneness, 2) crust depth, 3) the machine used to carve it and
> 4) the reaction of the guests.
>
> Nonny


Why do you ask? I always do mine for about that time, usually 250 though.
Every piece of meat is different, but it should be very tender with a nice
bark. Mine slices very easily with a standard kitchen knife. The 1/4"
thick slices on the plate are easily broken to bite size with just the fork.


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Edwin Pawlowski wrote:
> "Nonnymus" > wrote in message
>> After you take the meat off after 15 hours at 225f, please report back on
>> 1) level of doneness, 2) crust depth, 3) the machine used to carve it and
>> 4) the reaction of the guests.
>>
>> Nonny

>
> Why do you ask? I always do mine for about that time, usually 250 though.
> Every piece of meat is different, but it should be very tender with a nice
> bark. Mine slices very easily with a standard kitchen knife. The 1/4"
> thick slices on the plate are easily broken to bite size with just the fork.
>
>


I cannot remember ever cooking anything that long. If it works, that's
great, and I'm happy for all.

--
---Nonnymus---
You don’t stand any taller by
trying to make others appear shorter.
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Default Brisket Technique


On 1-Jul-2007, Nonnymus > wrote:

> Edwin Pawlowski wrote:
> > "Nonnymus" > wrote in message
> >> After you take the meat off after 15 hours at 225f, please report back
> >> on
> >> 1) level of doneness, 2) crust depth, 3) the machine used to carve it
> >> and
> >> 4) the reaction of the guests.
> >>
> >> Nonny

> >
> > Why do you ask? I always do mine for about that time, usually 250
> > though.
> > Every piece of meat is different, but it should be very tender with a
> > nice
> > bark. Mine slices very easily with a standard kitchen knife. The 1/4"
> > thick slices on the plate are easily broken to bite size with just the
> > fork.
> >
> >

>
> I cannot remember ever cooking anything that long. If it works, that's
> great, and I'm happy for all.
>
> --
> ---Nonnymus---


Jun 16, 2007, 12.2# packer cut brisket. Slathered liberally with CYM and
thoroughly rubbed with Bayou Blast. Eleven hours at about 250°F. Cooked
a little over. Internal was 200° when I took it off and wrapped it for
resting.
Brisket yielded 6.5# after trimming about 1/2# of fat off and cooking eleven
hours. Meat slices nicely after an hour of rest. Easily slices down to 1/16"
or less with a very sharp, thin, Chinese butcher knife. There is no
remaining
taste of the original mustard or dry rub. Garlic and pepper taste has
disappeared completely. I kept smoke going for the first three or four
hours.
Ring is 1/4" to 3/8" thick. It has a very pleasing smoky taste. We're eating
it on crusty Italian bread that has some of the outer crust trimmed off. The
meat is topped with fresh coleslaw.

Brick(Enforce the law first; change it later if necessary)
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Default Brisket Technique

On Jul 1, 1:09 am, "Edwin Pawlowski" > wrote:
> "Nonnymus" > wrote in message
>
> > After you take the meat off after 15 hours at 225f, please report back on
> > 1) level of doneness, 2) crust depth, 3) the machine used to carve it and
> > 4) the reaction of the guests.

>
> > Nonny

>
> Why do you ask? I always do mine for about that time, usually 250 though.
> Every piece of meat is different, but it should be very tender with a nice
> bark. Mine slices very easily with a standard kitchen knife. The 1/4"
> thick slices on the plate are easily broken to bite size with just the fork.


I cooked an 8lb brisket yesterday in my WSM. It took only 10 hours at
270 to get the meat up to 196 and fork tender. I only used one chunk
of hickory because I like light smoke on my brisket. The smoke ring
was 1/4" the crust had a nice bite and the meat was delicious. I've
done them at 225 and I don't taste a difference in the results, nor do
I have the patience or stamina to cook for 15 hours.

Cam



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Default Brisket Technique

Well, I admit that I must be wrong. I apologize. I'm not very strong
on brisket, so I guess I have a lot to learn about it. I can hold my
own on ribs, butt, chicken and seafood, but most of my beef experience
is with steaks.

Now, educate me a little more, if you will. Is the higher temperature
needed for rendering out the fat, breaking down the collagen or making
the crust? (Yes to all?) The internal temperature of 200f would be
something between a misdemeanor and felony if we were talking a rib
roast.<grin>

Nonny

wrote:
> On 1-Jul-2007, Nonnymus > wrote:
>
>> Edwin Pawlowski wrote:
>>> "Nonnymus" > wrote in message
>>>> After you take the meat off after 15 hours at 225f, please report back
>>>> on
>>>> 1) level of doneness, 2) crust depth, 3) the machine used to carve it
>>>> and
>>>> 4) the reaction of the guests.
>>>>
>>>> Nonny
>>> Why do you ask? I always do mine for about that time, usually 250
>>> though.
>>> Every piece of meat is different, but it should be very tender with a
>>> nice
>>> bark. Mine slices very easily with a standard kitchen knife. The 1/4"
>>> thick slices on the plate are easily broken to bite size with just the
>>> fork.
>>>
>>>

>> I cannot remember ever cooking anything that long. If it works, that's
>> great, and I'm happy for all.
>>
>> --
>> ---Nonnymus---

>
> Jun 16, 2007, 12.2# packer cut brisket. Slathered liberally with CYM and
> thoroughly rubbed with Bayou Blast. Eleven hours at about 250°F. Cooked
> a little over. Internal was 200° when I took it off and wrapped it for
> resting.
> Brisket yielded 6.5# after trimming about 1/2# of fat off and cooking eleven
> hours. Meat slices nicely after an hour of rest. Easily slices down to 1/16"
> or less with a very sharp, thin, Chinese butcher knife. There is no
> remaining
> taste of the original mustard or dry rub. Garlic and pepper taste has
> disappeared completely. I kept smoke going for the first three or four
> hours.
> Ring is 1/4" to 3/8" thick. It has a very pleasing smoky taste. We're eating
> it on crusty Italian bread that has some of the outer crust trimmed off. The
> meat is topped with fresh coleslaw.
>
> Brick(Enforce the law first; change it later if necessary)


--
---Nonnymus---
You don’t stand any taller by
trying to make others appear shorter.
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Default Brisket Technique


"Nonnymus" > wrote in message
...
> Well, I admit that I must be wrong. I apologize. I'm not very strong on
> brisket, so I guess I have a lot to learn about it. I can hold my own on
> ribs, butt, chicken and seafood, but most of my beef experience is with
> steaks.
>
> Now, educate me a little more, if you will. Is the higher temperature
> needed for rendering out the fat, breaking down the collagen or making the
> crust? (Yes to all?) The internal temperature of 200f would be something
> between a misdemeanor and felony if we were talking a rib roast.<grin>
>
> Nonny
>

snip

I usually run mine about 240-270 depending on the wind.

The extra 20 degrees will shave some off the cook time, and will contribute
to the bark a bit.

I shoot for 190 degrees, and let it rest in an ice chest for about 45
minutes. She'll rise up to 195, then come down.

I like my brisket almost pullable; others like it sliceable. If that's you,
pull her off at 165. (It will be some tough.)

I have done overnighters before (Big drum type smoker, set it and forget
it, 230 degrees for 11 hours.) I have also had hellacious brisket which
came off in 3 hours at 350 degrees.

It's done when it's done.

Sure, I'll have another beer.


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Default Brisket Technique

Nonnymus wrote:

Man, please don't top-post; it takes to long to figure out who or what
you're responding to.

> Now, educate me a little more, if you will. Is the higher temperature
> needed for rendering out the fat, breaking down the collagen or making
> the crust? (Yes to all?) The internal temperature of 200f would be
> something between a misdemeanor and felony if we were talking a rib
> roast.<grin>


Exactly. A prime rib roast ain't the same cut of beef. Not all meat is
suitable for bbq.

--
Dave
www.davebbq.com


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"Nonnymus" > wrote in message
...
> Well, I admit that I must be wrong. I apologize. I'm not very strong on
> brisket, so I guess I have a lot to learn about it. I can hold my own on
> ribs, butt, chicken and seafood, but most of my beef experience is with
> steaks.
>
> Now, educate me a little more, if you will. Is the higher temperature
> needed for rendering out the fat, breaking down the collagen or making the
> crust? (Yes to all?) The internal temperature of 200f would be something
> between a misdemeanor and felony if we were talking a rib roast.<grin>
>
> Nonny


Brisket is a very tough cut of meat and needs to have a lot of collagen
broken down, thus the long times at low temperature. Going to an internal
temperature of 190 to 200 is OK, unlike a good rob roast. It will be the
most tender piece of meat you ever had. I don't do any basting or mopping,
but others swear by it.

The time given is for a full packer cut, not for trimmed flats. They are
more troublesome and I don't do them. You want to leave some fat cap to
render during the long cooking times.

Just apply the rub of your choice, if any, and cook until tender. Now, Big
Jim uses 300 degrees and uses less time and still gets good results so there
is more than one way to do a good brisket.




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Default Brisket Technique

Al .Cambell wrote:

Hmmmm. I just felt something humpin' my leg.

Must be a bitch in heat.

--
Dave
www.davebbq.com


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Dave Bugg wrote:
> Nonnymus wrote:
>
> Man, please don't top-post; it takes to long to figure out who or what
> you're responding to.
>
>> Now, educate me a little more, if you will. Is the higher temperature
>> needed for rendering out the fat, breaking down the collagen or making
>> the crust? (Yes to all?) The internal temperature of 200f would be
>> something between a misdemeanor and felony if we were talking a rib
>> roast.<grin>

>
> Exactly. A prime rib roast ain't the same cut of beef. Not all meat is
> suitable for bbq.
>


Sorry (again), I occasionally just start typing after hitting the reply
key. It's unintentional and not intended to irritate folks.

Responding to the others as well, I've had brisket at several Texas
places, like Salt Lick and Rudy's while visiting. As I recall, Memphis
Championship here in town does it well, I think. I'm just not a brisket
fan and just go on what others tell me. It's good, and it's traditional
though. In NC, we were mostly pork and chicken oriented, so the primary
beef eaten was a good Ribeye, Porterhouse or Rib Roast.

I cook my butts overnight, typically, and my knee jerk reaction was with
the higher temps and higher meat temps for that long. I guess a 15
pounder would take that long. Wow. Pork collagen liquefies around 160f,
as I recall, does beef collagen differ in that regard? My butts are
typically done at a starting temp of 225f and then ramped down to a
setpoint for the meat and hood temps. at 180f. in about 12 hours.

--
---Nonnymus---
You don’t stand any taller by
trying to make others appear shorter.
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Edwin Pawlowski wrote:

> Brisket is a very tough cut of meat and needs to have a lot of collagen
> broken down, thus the long times at low temperature. Going to an internal
> temperature of 190 to 200 is OK, unlike a good rob roast. It will be the
> most tender piece of meat you ever had. I don't do any basting or mopping,
> but others swear by it.
>
> The time given is for a full packer cut, not for trimmed flats. They are
> more troublesome and I don't do them. You want to leave some fat cap to
> render during the long cooking times.
>
> Just apply the rub of your choice, if any, and cook until tender. Now, Big
> Jim uses 300 degrees and uses less time and still gets good results so there
> is more than one way to do a good brisket.


For a first try on, say, a 12 or so packer cut, what would you suggest
for the hood temperature and the meat temperature? Would I want to take
it off when it reaches the setpoint or would I want to let it ride there
for some length of time? If it a function of time or internal
temperature that tenderizes the brisket?

--
---Nonnymus---
You don’t stand any taller by
trying to make others appear shorter.
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"Nonnymus" > wrote in message
...
>
> Sorry (again), I occasionally just start typing after hitting the reply
> key. It's unintentional and not intended to irritate folks.


I had you in my killfile folder but you now have an new morphing address.

Loser!

Graeme


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Nonnymus wrote:

> Sorry (again), I occasionally just start typing after hitting the
> reply key. It's unintentional and not intended to irritate folks.


No worries :-)

> ...In NC, we were mostly pork and chicken
> oriented, so the primary beef eaten was a good Ribeye, Porterhouse or
> Rib Roast.


Most of the southeast is the same. Pork is KING. A goodly done brisket is a
joy, though. I'm often asked which I like better, the brisket or the pork. I
always answer: 'whichever I'm eatin' at the time'.
>
> I cook my butts overnight, typically, and my knee jerk reaction was
> with the higher temps and higher meat temps for that long. I guess a
> 15 pounder would take that long.


Some folks will do brisket at a much higher temp than pork, and it can turn
out very well.

>.... Pork collagen liquefies around
> 160f, as I recall, does beef collagen differ in that regard? My
> butts are typically done at a starting temp of 225f and then ramped
> down to a setpoint for the meat and hood temps. at 180f. in about 12
> hours.


I cook mine at an average temp of 220F. I pull 'em when they hit about
180 -185 IF they seem tender enough. Sometimes I need to let them go a bit
longer.
--
Dave
www.davebbq.com




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Nonnymus wrote:
> Edwin Pawlowski wrote:


>> Just apply the rub of your choice, if any, and cook until tender. Now,
>> Big Jim uses 300 degrees and uses less time and still gets good
>> results so there is more than one way to do a good brisket.


Ed just gave some damn fine advice. Big Jim's brisket is wonderful.

> For a first try on, say, a 12 or so packer cut, what would you suggest
> for the hood temperature and the meat temperature?


Until someone is comfortable doing brisket, I feel it is best to use a lower
temp: this allows a better chance of success in case problems occur with the
pit, temperature control, or whatever. I measure temperature at the grill,
not the hood. I do my briskets at 220F, but others do 'em anywhere between
200 and 275F.

> Would I want to
> take it off when it reaches the setpoint or would I want to let it
> ride there for some length of time?


I take mine off when the internal temp reaches 180 - 185F. It slices well,
and it is extremely tender and moist. After cooking, I don't wrap it in foil
to hold the brisket, unless I need to take somewhere to slice and serve.

> If it a function of time or
> internal temperature that tenderizes the brisket?


Yes.

--
Dave
www.davebbq.com


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"Al .Cambell" > wrote in message
...
>
> Another great post by the arrogant Dave Bugg.
>
> know it all asswipe.
>
> Do you know anything? Care to share OH great one?
>
>


Just wondering here...

What, exactly, have *YOU* contributed to this newsgroup?

Other than humping Dave's leg, that is. Most of us don't consider that a
contribution, but whatever floats yer boat, I guess.

BOB


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Just put the Nonnymus name in your killfile "sender" list and it should
work.

Nonny

Graeme...in London wrote:
> "Nonnymus" > wrote in message
> ...
>> Sorry (again), I occasionally just start typing after hitting the reply
>> key. It's unintentional and not intended to irritate folks.

>
> I had you in my killfile folder but you now have an new morphing address.
>
> Loser!
>
> Graeme
>
>


--
---Nonnymus---
You don’t stand any taller by
trying to make others appear shorter.
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"Nonnymus" > wrote in message
...

>
> For a first try on, say, a 12 or so packer cut, what would you suggest for
> the hood temperature and the meat temperature? Would I want to take it
> off when it reaches the setpoint or would I want to let it ride there for
> some length of time? If it a function of time or internal temperature
> that tenderizes the brisket?


Both actually, just like pork. As you cook it, the temperature will get to
about 160 in the meat and hold there a long time, then finally go up to the
185+ mark. Personal choice after that. Some people often pull them at 185
or so and wrap them until mealtime later and the temperature will go up,
like any other meat at rest.

Do one right along with your pork butt and they will be done about the same
time.
--
Ed
http://pages.cthome.net/edhome/


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"Edwin Pawlowski" > wrote in message
...
>
> "Nonnymus" > wrote in message
> ...
>
>>
>> For a first try on, say, a 12 or so packer cut, what would you suggest
>> for the hood temperature and the meat temperature? Would I want to take
>> it off when it reaches the setpoint or would I want to let it ride there
>> for some length of time? If it a function of time or internal
>> temperature that tenderizes the brisket?

>
> Both actually, just like pork. As you cook it, the temperature will get
> to about 160 in the meat and hold there a long time, then finally go up to
> the 185+ mark. Personal choice after that. Some people often pull them
> at 185 or so and wrap them until mealtime later and the temperature will
> go up, like any other meat at rest.
>
> Do one right along with your pork butt and they will be done about the
> same time.
> --
> Ed
> http://pages.cthome.net/edhome/


Ed, I've been told that regardless of internal temp, if you can take a two
tine fork, put it into the side of the brisket, and turn it 180degrees
easily, the brisket's done. And that it's not done until you can do that.
Opinions?

>





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"43fan" > wrote in message
. ..
>
> "Edwin Pawlowski" > wrote in message
> ...
>>
>> "Nonnymus" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>
>>>
>>> For a first try on, say, a 12 or so packer cut, what would you suggest
>>> for the hood temperature and the meat temperature? Would I want to take
>>> it off when it reaches the setpoint or would I want to let it ride there
>>> for some length of time? If it a function of time or internal
>>> temperature that tenderizes the brisket?

>>
>> Both actually, just like pork. As you cook it, the temperature will get
>> to about 160 in the meat and hold there a long time, then finally go up
>> to the 185+ mark. Personal choice after that. Some people often pull
>> them at 185 or so and wrap them until mealtime later and the temperature
>> will go up, like any other meat at rest.
>>
>> Do one right along with your pork butt and they will be done about the
>> same time.
>> --
>> Ed
>> http://pages.cthome.net/edhome/

>
> Ed, I've been told that regardless of internal temp, if you can take a two
> tine fork, put it into the side of the brisket, and turn it 180degrees
> easily, the brisket's done. And that it's not done until you can do that.
> Opinions?
>
>>

>
>


Yeah, that works too. Usually around 185-190 degrees that fork begins to
twist.


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On Mon, 02 Jul 2007 10:09:27 -0700, Denny Wheeler
> wrote:

>On Sun, 01 Jul 2007 16:57:36 GMT, "Al .Cambell" >
>wrote:
>
>>Another great post by the arrogant Dave Bugg.
>>
>>know it all asswipe.
>>
>>Do you know anything? Care to share OH great one?

>
>Well, I've eaten Dave's bbq, as have many others here. I've also read
>what he has to say. He does indeed know much about bbq, and shares
>that knowledge pretty freely.
>
>Far as I can tell, your sole contribution is being the ass that gets
>wiped. Two posts--at least under that email address--and you're
>bitching about Dave???
>
>Q: Do your keepers let you cross the street by yourself?
>
>-denny-


I don't think Dave needs any defending by us, especially since he can
'dish it up pretty good too', when provoked.

I also think it's pretty cheesy for a new poster to come in &
immediately start dumping on the current population.

Harry
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Captain Dickweed, otherwise known as Al .Cambell dove headfirst into my
killfile when he wrote:

> Another great post by the arrogant Dave Bugg.
>
> know it all asswipe.
>
> Do you know anything? Care to share OH great one?


You may now share a spot with....nobody! You're in there all by yourself.
Oh, the humanity!



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43fan wrote:
> "Edwin Pawlowski" > wrote in message
> ...
>>
>> "Nonnymus" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>
>>>
>>> For a first try on, say, a 12 or so packer cut, what would you
>>> suggest for the hood temperature and the meat temperature? Would I
>>> want to take it off when it reaches the setpoint or would I want to
>>> let it ride there for some length of time? If it a function of
>>> time or internal temperature that tenderizes the brisket?

>>
>> Both actually, just like pork. As you cook it, the temperature will
>> get to about 160 in the meat and hold there a long time, then
>> finally go up to the 185+ mark. Personal choice after that. Some
>> people often pull them at 185 or so and wrap them until mealtime
>> later and the temperature will go up, like any other meat at rest.
>>
>> Do one right along with your pork butt and they will be done about
>> the same time.
>> --
>> Ed
>> http://pages.cthome.net/edhome/

>
> Ed, I've been told that regardless of internal temp, if you can take
> a two tine fork, put it into the side of the brisket, and turn it
> 180degrees easily, the brisket's done. And that it's not done until
> you can do that. Opinions?


My opinion on that technique is that you're tearing the meat up needlessly.

My technique is to stick a simple 4 tine fork straight into the flat. Then
attempt to pull it straight back out. The fork will pull the meat from the
grate every time you check *until* it's done when it will slide easily back
out.

Think cornbread and toothpick.



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"43fan" > wrote in message
> Ed, I've been told that regardless of internal temp, if you can take a two
> tine fork, put it into the side of the brisket, and turn it 180degrees
> easily, the brisket's done. And that it's not done until you can do that.
> Opinions?


There are variations of that. A few old timers and traditionalists would
never use a thermometer, but it does not beat up the meat like repeated fork
twistings can. Just like you don't need one to tell when the water in a pot
reaches 212 degrees. The old timers can do it from sight by picking up
subtle visual clues.




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On 1-Jul-2007, Cam > wrote:

> On Jul 1, 1:09 am, "Edwin Pawlowski" > wrote:
> > "Nonnymus" > wrote in message
> >
> > > After you take the meat off after 15 hours at 225f, please report back
> > > on
> > > 1) level of doneness, 2) crust depth, 3) the machine used to carve it
> > > and
> > > 4) the reaction of the guests.

> >
> > > Nonny

> >
> > Why do you ask? I always do mine for about that time, usually 250
> > though.
> > Every piece of meat is different, but it should be very tender with a
> > nice
> > bark. Mine slices very easily with a standard kitchen knife. The 1/4"
> > thick slices on the plate are easily broken to bite size with just the
> > fork.

>
> I cooked an 8lb brisket yesterday in my WSM. It took only 10 hours at
> 270 to get the meat up to 196 and fork tender. I only used one chunk
> of hickory because I like light smoke on my brisket. The smoke ring
> was 1/4" the crust had a nice bite and the meat was delicious. I've
> done them at 225 and I don't taste a difference in the results, nor do
> I have the patience or stamina to cook for 15 hours.
>
> Cam


I'm adding nothing new by reiterating my June 16th brisket cook. It does
add to the credence though of the premise that good bbq brisket can
be made under 20 hours using temps higher then a hot date. It was a
12.2# packer cut. I slathered it with CYM and then dusted liberally with
Bayou Blast. It cooked at a nominal 270° for 11 hours. It was a little
overdone at 200°F internal, but it's good brisket nevertheless. Lest
anyone should ask, it is not spicy or garlicky and does not taste of
mustard. The bark itself is quite tasty. My creosote days in 2003 are
a distant memory. For anybody that cares, that 12.2# yielded 6.5#
after resting.

--
Brick(Enforce the law first; change it later if necessary)
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On 1-Jul-2007, Nonnymus > wrote:

> Well, I admit that I must be wrong. I apologize. I'm not very strong
> on brisket, so I guess I have a lot to learn about it. I can hold my
> own on ribs, butt, chicken and seafood, but most of my beef experience
> is with steaks.
>
> Now, educate me a little more, if you will. Is the higher temperature
> needed for rendering out the fat, breaking down the collagen or making
> the crust? (Yes to all?) The internal temperature of 200f would be
> something between a misdemeanor and felony if we were talking a rib
> roast.<grin>
>
> Nonny
>


<snipped a bunch>

First off, there's nothing wrong with cooking brisked at 225°F if your pit
works well at that temp and you have the time to watch over it for 20
hours or so. My pit likes to run at 250° to 275°F and I get good brisket
in 10 to 12 hours that way. And yes, a rib roast cooked to 200° internal
wouldn't make good dog food. Of course I don't know for sure because
I haven't ****ed one up that bad 'yet'. I think I murdered a few pieces of
chicken the last time TFM® and Kili were at my place, but that's about
as bad as it gets. If you're having good success with butts, just cook
briskets the same way and take them off when they're done. It ain't
rocket science.

--
Brick(Enforce the law first; change it later if necessary)
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On Mon, 2 Jul 2007 21:56:22 -0400, "Billy Bong Thornton"
> wrote:

>43fan wrote:
>> "Edwin Pawlowski" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>>
>>> "Nonnymus" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>
>>>>
>>>> For a first try on, say, a 12 or so packer cut, what would you
>>>> suggest for the hood temperature and the meat temperature? Would I
>>>> want to take it off when it reaches the setpoint or would I want to
>>>> let it ride there for some length of time? If it a function of
>>>> time or internal temperature that tenderizes the brisket?
>>>
>>> Both actually, just like pork. As you cook it, the temperature will
>>> get to about 160 in the meat and hold there a long time, then
>>> finally go up to the 185+ mark. Personal choice after that. Some
>>> people often pull them at 185 or so and wrap them until mealtime
>>> later and the temperature will go up, like any other meat at rest.
>>>
>>> Do one right along with your pork butt and they will be done about
>>> the same time.
>>> --
>>> Ed
>>> http://pages.cthome.net/edhome/

>>
>> Ed, I've been told that regardless of internal temp, if you can take
>> a two tine fork, put it into the side of the brisket, and turn it
>> 180degrees easily, the brisket's done. And that it's not done until
>> you can do that. Opinions?

>
>My opinion on that technique is that you're tearing the meat up needlessly.
>
>My technique is to stick a simple 4 tine fork straight into the flat. Then
>attempt to pull it straight back out. The fork will pull the meat from the
>grate every time you check *until* it's done when it will slide easily back
>out.
>
>Think cornbread and toothpick.
>
>

Think toothpick & ribs . . .

Harry
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On 1-Jul-2007, "Dave Bugg" > wrote:

> Nonnymus wrote:
>
> Man, please don't top-post; it takes to long to figure out who or what
> you're responding to.
>
> > Now, educate me a little more, if you will. Is the higher temperature
> > needed for rendering out the fat, breaking down the collagen or making
> > the crust? (Yes to all?) The internal temperature of 200f would be
> > something between a misdemeanor and felony if we were talking a rib
> > roast.<grin>

>
> Exactly. A prime rib roast ain't the same cut of beef. Not all meat is
> suitable for bbq.


Dave's right of course, but that don't mean you can't cook a rib roast
in your pit and get a little smoke on it if you want to. I've done it and
I'll do it again, but I took mine out at about 130°F internal and after
resting a half hour or so it was pretty nice eating. I vacuum packed
some of it and it warmed over okay. I can't say how long it might keep
that way. It didn't last long enough to tell.

--
Brick(Enforce the law first; change it later if necessary)
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Nonnymus wrote:
> If it a function of time or
> internal temperature that tenderizes the brisket?



Internal temp. If you're cookin at say 225-250°F, it's obvious that it'll
take longer to get to the internal temp than say if you're cookin at 300+°F.

Personally, I cook my briskets at 325-350°F which no one seems to turn their
nose up at when it gets on their plate.

-frohe




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"frohe" > wrote in message
...
> Nonnymus wrote:
>> If it a function of time or
>> internal temperature that tenderizes the brisket?

>
>
> Internal temp. If you're cookin at say 225-250°F, it's obvious that it'll
> take longer to get to the internal temp than say if you're cookin at
> 300+°F.
>
> Personally, I cook my briskets at 325-350°F which no one seems to turn
> their nose up at when it gets on their plate.
>
> -frohe
>


Yer a good Man frohe
--
James A. "Big Jim" Whitten

www.lazyq.com


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Big Jim wrote:
> Yer a good Man frohe



Thanks, Big Jim. I'm honored.

-frohe


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"Brick" wrote
> On 1-Jul-2007, "Dave Bugg" > wrote:
>
> > Nonnymus wrote:
> >
> > Man, please don't top-post; it takes to long to figure out who or
> > what you're responding to.
> >
> > > Now, educate me a little more, if you will. Is the higher
> > > temperature needed for rendering out the fat, breaking down the
> > > collagen or making the crust? (Yes to all?) The internal
> > > temperature of 200f would be something between a misdemeanor and
> > > felony if we were talking a rib roast.<grin>

> >
> > Exactly. A prime rib roast ain't the same cut of beef. Not all meat
> > is suitable for bbq.

>
> Dave's right of course, but that don't mean you can't cook a rib roast
> in your pit and get a little smoke on it if you want to. I've done it
> and I'll do it again, but I took mine out at about 130°F internal and
> after resting a half hour or so it was pretty nice eating. I vacuum
> packed some of it and it warmed over okay. I can't say how long it
> might keep that way. It didn't last long enough to tell.
>


BUT...cook that rib roast at much higher than BBQ temperatures.
I start a rib roast at about 400 to 450 degrees on the grate for about a
half hour. Then let the fire die down to about 300 'til the internal meat
temp is about 120. Let it rest as above.
I think that the difference in internal finishing temperature is that I like
rarer prime rib than you and your wife do. ;-)

BOB


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On 3-Jul-2007, " BOB" > wrote:

> "Brick" wrote
> > On 1-Jul-2007, "Dave Bugg" > wrote:
> >
> > > Nonnymus wrote:
> > >
> > > Man, please don't top-post; it takes to long to figure out who or
> > > what you're responding to.
> > >
> > > > Now, educate me a little more, if you will. Is the higher
> > > > temperature needed for rendering out the fat, breaking down the
> > > > collagen or making the crust? (Yes to all?) The internal
> > > > temperature of 200f would be something between a misdemeanor and
> > > > felony if we were talking a rib roast.<grin>
> > >
> > > Exactly. A prime rib roast ain't the same cut of beef. Not all meat
> > > is suitable for bbq.

> >
> > Dave's right of course, but that don't mean you can't cook a rib roast
> > in your pit and get a little smoke on it if you want to. I've done it
> > and I'll do it again, but I took mine out at about 130°F internal and
> > after resting a half hour or so it was pretty nice eating. I vacuum
> > packed some of it and it warmed over okay. I can't say how long it
> > might keep that way. It didn't last long enough to tell.
> >

>
> BUT...cook that rib roast at much higher than BBQ temperatures.
> I start a rib roast at about 400 to 450 degrees on the grate for about a
> half hour. Then let the fire die down to about 300 'til the internal meat
>
> temp is about 120. Let it rest as above.
> I think that the difference in internal finishing temperature is that I
> like
> rarer prime rib than you and your wife do. ;-)
>
> BOB


I and mine like Medium Rare by the accepted definition of "Warm
Center". We do not like a piece of meat that is "COLD" in the middle.
A center temp of 120 going into the cooler would probably please
SWAMBO and I after it had time to sit for half an hour. Frankly, I
don't worry about it that much. Certainly, I wouldn't go to the
trouble of changing temperatures in the middle of a cook.
--
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BOB wrote:

> BUT...cook that rib roast at much higher than BBQ temperatures.
> I start a rib roast at about 400 to 450 degrees on the grate for about a
> half hour. Then let the fire die down to about 300 'til the internal meat
> temp is about 120. Let it rest as above.
> I think that the difference in internal finishing temperature is that I like
> rarer prime rib than you and your wife do. ;-)


Sometime, I might try a small one in the smoker. I can't get the temps
as high as you, but I could always transfer it to the grill to generate
some crust. We agree on the low internal temps. IMHO, the crust is just
as good as the inside, but I still am a bone man. When we do a standing
rib roast, everyone knows that I get first pick of the bones. Then,
after I've gone over them, they go next door to my neighbor's dog, who
is equally appreciative.

Besides S&P and Garlic, is there anything else recommended for the rub?

--
---Nonnymus---
You don’t stand any taller by
trying to make others appear shorter.
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