And boy, does that yeast make a racket!

anyway a wineshop owner I was talking to last friday said I should
completly skip step 2 in the instructions. anyone do this before? I'd
like to hear some comments

"Tater" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> And boy, does that yeast make a racket!
>
> anyway a wineshop owner I was talking to last friday said I should
> completly skip step 2 in the instructions. anyone do this before? I'd
> like to hear some comments

Let me guess (since you didn't say) step two is something like rack the wine
down into a smaller container. Regardless of how insignificant that step may
seem the question is how much of a chance do you want to take on the money
you spent for the kit? Some additional questions come to mind, like, is the
winshop owner willing to cover the loss if the wine goes bad? Did the kit
manufacturer put in step two just to give you something to do? Is there any
reason to NOT do step two? Why take chances on your first venture into
making wine?

Hmmm, lemme guess something else. You don't have the smaller carboy and the
shop owner doesn't have one to sell you at the moment... Am I close?

I'm not trying to be sarcastic, honest. If you've got the gear, do the
step. If you ain't got the gear, get it. If he don't got it, go somewhere
else. From the day you started you've got at least two, proably three weeks.

I don't really know about your kit (which you didn't name), but I'm betting
that step two (which you didn't describe) is to get the must off the largest
part of the lees. Doing that reduces the chance of imparting strange flavors
into the wine from all those dead yeasty critters that have sunk to the
bottom of the fermenter. Especially if the step says something like leave
most of the crud behind.

--
Galwaf ar fy nhgyd-Gymry i sefyll yn y bwlch!

Casey

Ummm.... What's Step 2?


"Tater" > wrote in message
oups.com...
> And boy, does that yeast make a racket!
>
> anyway a wineshop owner I was talking to last friday said I should
> completly skip step 2 in the instructions. anyone do this before? I'd
> like to hear some comments
>

On Mar 26, 6:35 pm, "Casey Wilson" > wrote:
> "Tater" > wrote in message
>
> oups.com...
>
> > And boy, does that yeast make a racket!
>
> > anyway a wineshop owner I was talking to last friday said I should
> > completly skip step 2 in the instructions. anyone do this before? I'd
> > like to hear some comments
>
> Let me guess (since you didn't say) step two is something like rack the wine
> down into a smaller container. Regardless of how insignificant that step may
> seem the question is how much of a chance do you want to take on the money
> you spent for the kit? Some additional questions come to mind, like, is the
> winshop owner willing to cover the loss if the wine goes bad? Did the kit
> manufacturer put in step two just to give you something to do? Is there any
> reason to NOT do step two? Why take chances on your first venture into
> making wine?

yeah, step two is to rack the wine into the carboy with a big
airspace, which is was their concern. the instructions make it sound
like i need a 2nd carboy, which they did have, but suggested that i
would not need as they said i should skip step two. If i was them I
woulda sold me 1 of everything inthe store(they kept telling me "No,
you really dont need one of those")

oh, I for got to say(thought i did) Wineexpert Isalnd mist peach
apricot chardonay.

after re-reading(and re--reading) the instructions, I think i'll stick
to the instructions rather than their recommendations.

Tater wrote:
> On Mar 26, 6:35 pm, "Casey Wilson" > wrote:
>> "Tater" > wrote in message
>>
>> oups.com...
>>
>>> And boy, does that yeast make a racket!
>>> anyway a wineshop owner I was talking to last friday said I should
>>> completly skip step 2 in the instructions. anyone do this before? I'd
>>> like to hear some comments
>> Let me guess (since you didn't say) step two is something like rack the wine
>> down into a smaller container. Regardless of how insignificant that step may
>> seem the question is how much of a chance do you want to take on the money
>> you spent for the kit? Some additional questions come to mind, like, is the
>> winshop owner willing to cover the loss if the wine goes bad? Did the kit
>> manufacturer put in step two just to give you something to do? Is there any
>> reason to NOT do step two? Why take chances on your first venture into
>> making wine?
>
> yeah, step two is to rack the wine into the carboy with a big
> airspace, which is was their concern. the instructions make it sound
> like i need a 2nd carboy, which they did have, but suggested that i
> would not need as they said i should skip step two. If i was them I
> woulda sold me 1 of everything inthe store(they kept telling me "No,
> you really dont need one of those")
>
> oh, I for got to say(thought i did) Wineexpert Isalnd mist peach
> apricot chardonay.
>
> after re-reading(and re--reading) the instructions, I think i'll stick
> to the instructions rather than their recommendations.
>
When you do this first racking, you want to carry over a large fraction
of the yeast, but not heavy gunk. If you don't take enough of the yeast
(and dead yeast hulls), you risk getting a stuck fermentation in step 2
(secondary fermentation in the carboy).

Without some dead yeast hulls (or other light solids) in step 2, the
active yeast tend to settle to the bottom. That's not what you want;
you want the active yeast to have some solids to attach to so they'll
stay suspended throughout the fermenting must.

I've never done a Winexpert kit. Do they suggest doing step one in an
open top container? Or do they suggest doing step one in a carboy?

If you did step one in an open top fermenter, I highly recommend using
the carboy with an airlock for step 2. This will help protect the wine
from oxidizing (due to the intrusion of oxygen from the outside air) as
the fermentation slows down.

If you did step one in a carboy, then just putting an airlock onto the
carboy as the fermentation slows down might would be enough to protect
the wine from oxidation. If I'm guessing correctly, this might be what
the wineshop owner was talking about.

Gene

Casey Wilson wrote:
> "Tater" > wrote in message
> oups.com...
>> And boy, does that yeast make a racket!
>>
>> anyway a wineshop owner I was talking to last friday said I should
>> completly skip step 2 in the instructions. anyone do this before? I'd
>> like to hear some comments
>
> Let me guess (since you didn't say) step two is something like rack the wine
> down into a smaller container. Regardless of how insignificant that step may
> seem the question is how much of a chance do you want to take on the money
> you spent for the kit? Some additional questions come to mind, like, is the
> winshop owner willing to cover the loss if the wine goes bad? Did the kit
> manufacturer put in step two just to give you something to do? Is there any
> reason to NOT do step two? Why take chances on your first venture into
> making wine?
>
> Hmmm, lemme guess something else. You don't have the smaller carboy and the
> shop owner doesn't have one to sell you at the moment... Am I close?
>
> I'm not trying to be sarcastic, honest. If you've got the gear, do the
> step. If you ain't got the gear, get it. If he don't got it, go somewhere
> else. From the day you started you've got at least two, proably three weeks.
>
> I don't really know about your kit (which you didn't name), but I'm betting
> that step two (which you didn't describe) is to get the must off the largest
> part of the lees. Doing that reduces the chance of imparting strange flavors
> into the wine from all those dead yeasty critters that have sunk to the
> bottom of the fermenter. Especially if the step says something like leave
> most of the crud behind.
>
Casey gives good counsel to follow the kit instructions, at least the
first time you do the kit. The second time around is the time to impart
your own winemaking style by not exactly following their recipe. Your
version might be better or it might be worse. But at least then you'll
know how the kit manufacturer intended it to be.

I do have one possible difference of opinion regarding dead yeast cell
flavors. Maybe I've overlooked something, but I'd be surprised if the
wine will pick up noticeable flavor from the dead yeast cells during the
2-4 weeks typical of secondary fermentation. Getting the wine off the
fine lees, in my experience, is only important after the wine has
fermented to dryness (if you don't want a sur lies aging style to add
the yeast notes during bulk aging).

I'd agree that sur lies aging would seem odd for a light, fruity wine
such as Wineexpert Island Mist.
My white wine experiments with the sur lies aging method needed extended
fine lees (dead yeast cells) contact of at least 3 months before I was
able to notice the yeast notes. And in that case, I wanted the yeast
notes to add complexity to my wine.

Gene

Bob Becker wrote:
> Ummm.... What's Step 2?
>
>
> "Tater" > wrote in message
> oups.com...
>> And boy, does that yeast make a racket!
>>
>> anyway a wineshop owner I was talking to last friday said I should
>> completly skip step 2 in the instructions. anyone do this before? I'd
>> like to hear some comments
>>
>
>


According to the wine kits that I have (two of them made by the same
company as tater is using, Step 2 is racking it off from the primary
fermenter into the secondary.

Abby

--
The ChildFree Abby Archives - http://www.dismal-light.net/childfreeabby/

On Mon, 26 Mar 2007 22:49:00 -0300, Childfree Abby
> wrote:

>Bob Becker wrote:
>> Ummm.... What's Step 2?
>>
>>
>> "Tater" > wrote in message
>> oups.com...
>>> And boy, does that yeast make a racket!
>>>
>>> anyway a wineshop owner I was talking to last friday said I should
>>> completly skip step 2 in the instructions. anyone do this before? I'd
>>> like to hear some comments
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
>According to the wine kits that I have (two of them made by the same
>company as tater is using, Step 2 is racking it off from the primary
>fermenter into the secondary.
>
>Abby

It is impossible to skip step #2 with a Wine Expert Kit... You have
to put the must/wine into a carboy at some point. Tater cannot go
wrong by following the instructions that came with the kit. The
manufacturer wants customers to be sucessful, so they give good
instructions.
The Anchorage Fishwrapper and Litterbox Liner Press

On Mar 27, 12:46 am, A. J. Rawls > wrote:
> It is impossible to skip step #2 with a Wine Expert Kit... You have
> to put the must/wine into a carboy at some point. Tater cannot go
> wrong by following the instructions that came with the kit. The
> manufacturer wants customers to be sucessful, so they give good
> instructions.

yeah, I think I've decided on the opinions of the local wine shops
expertise.

I aint gonna trust it. I'll stick to the kits instructions.

in another thread, someone suggested that i listen to the local wine
shop for experience, caveat emptor.

On Mar 26, 6:08 pm, "Tater" > wrote:
> And boy, does that yeast make a racket!
>

oh bye the way, took a sample today. SG of 1.030 (from 1.052) and
definetly a wine like taste, compared to saturdays sample tasting like
juice.

step 2 is supposed to start around 1.010 or less