http://www.newscientist.com/news/news.jsp?id=ns99994771

Nutrient during pregnancy 'super-charges' brain

NewScientist.com news service

Taking a nutrient called choline during pregnancy could "super-charge"
children's brains for life, suggests a study in rats.

Offspring born to pregnant rats given the supplement were known to be
faster learners with better memories. But the new work, by Scott
Swartzwelder and colleagues at Duke University Medical Center in North
Carolina, US, shows this is due to having bigger brain cells in vital
areas.

Choline, a member of the vitamin B family, is found in egg yolks,
liver and other meats - "exactly the kind of things people were told
not to eat" due to their high cholesterol content, says Swartzwelder.

He believes their results in the rats could translate to humans, and
indeed the US Institute of Medicine added choline to the list of
essential nutrients, particularly for pregnant women, in its 2003
recommendations.

The implications of the study's findings are "potentially huge"
Swartzwelder believes: "If it turns out that it's true in humans and
can make people smarter their whole lives and forestall age-related
memory decline - that's potentially a very exciting prospect."

Behavioural studies have shown giving choline to pregnant rats
improves learning and memory in their offspring. The pups also suffer
significantly less from failing memories as they get old.

However, it was not known whether choline's effects were on the
general brain environment or whether it fundamentally changed the
brain's cells.

"Our study is the first time anyone has shown that prenatal choline
supplementation actually changes the anatomy and physiology of single
brain cells," Swartzwelder told New Scientist. No adverse effects
could be seen in the rats, he adds.

The team gave pregnant rats three to four times their normal intake of
choline for six days. Gestation lasts about 21 days in rats, and the
period during which the rats were fed extra choline roughly
corresponds to the start of the third trimester in women.

The pups born were raised to adulthood and then their brains were
examined, in particular the hippocampus - the area of the brain
critical for learning.

This part of the brain was sliced in a way that preserved its internal
circuitry and kept it alive. A tiny electrode was then used to
recording the behaviour of each cell.

The neurons of rats born to mothers given extra choline fired
electrical signals more rapidly and for longer periods, indicating a
capacity to communicate more easily.

The team then injected a biological dye into the neurons to look at
their shape and structure. The cells from rats receiving prenatal
choline supplements were substantially bigger than those from rats
that did not.

"We are looking at consistent changes in the range of 20 to 25 per
cent," says Swartzwelder. "These are bigger cells with more dendrites,
the areas of the cell specific to receiving incoming signals." He says
the combined changes induced by choline in the physiology and anatomy
of the brain cells would "hotwire" the system.

The team does not know exactly how choline boosts brains, but it is
known to contribute to the building of cell membranes during the
embryo stage of development. "My bet is it has something to do this,"
Swartzwelder says.

Previous work by Steven Zeiser at the University of North Carolina has
shown choline alters a crucial gene by adding a methyl group on to it.
This switches off the gene, CDKN-3, which usually inhibits cell
division in the memory regions of the brain.

There is little information on how much choline women currently take.
"But don't be afraid of eggs," Swartzwelder suggests. "I used to eat a
low fat diet - I've started eating eggs and I'm not even pregnant!"

Journal reference: Journal of Neurophysiology (vol 91 April issue)

Shaoni Bhattacharya

"Diarmid Logan" > wrote in message
om...
> http://www.newscientist.com/news/news.jsp?id=ns99994771
>
> Nutrient during pregnancy 'super-charges' brain
>
> NewScientist.com news service
>
> Taking a nutrient called choline during pregnancy could "super-charge"
> children's brains for life, suggests a study in rats.
<..>
> Choline, a member of the vitamin B family, is found in egg yolks,
> liver and other meats - "exactly the kind of things people were told
> not to eat" due to their high cholesterol content, says Swartzwelder.
<..>
> There is little information on how much choline women currently take.
> "But don't be afraid of eggs," Swartzwelder suggests. "I used to eat a
> low fat diet - I've started eating eggs and I'm not even pregnant!"

'Lecithin, found in foods such as eggs, soybeans, peanuts,
and liver, is the predominant source of choline in the human
diet. The normal intake of lecithin and choline has been
estimated to be approximately 6 grams and 800 milligrams
per day respectively. Commercial soy lecithin is defatted
from soy bean oil to contain dominantly (± 95%) acetone
insolubles- the most important of which are the phospholipids
phosphatidylcholine, inositol and ethanolamine. Commercial
lecithin is about 23% phosphatidylcholine (PC), and PC
contains about 14% choline. Due to space limitations, choline
sources like choline bitartrate and choline citrate have been
used as the predominant source of choline in vitamin
supplements. However, the increasing evidence that lecithin
is a source of choline that may have benefits beyond simply
being a choline source, has provided a reason for
supplementing with both choline and lecithin itself. '
http://www.aabhealth.com/lecithincholine.htm

"pearl" > wrote in message
...
> "Diarmid Logan" > wrote in message
> om...
> > http://www.newscientist.com/news/news.jsp?id=ns99994771
> >
> > Nutrient during pregnancy 'super-charges' brain
> >
> > NewScientist.com news service
> >
> > Taking a nutrient called choline during pregnancy could "super-charge"
> > children's brains for life, suggests a study in rats.
> <..>
> > Choline, a member of the vitamin B family, is found in egg yolks,
> > liver and other meats - "exactly the kind of things people were told
> > not to eat" due to their high cholesterol content, says Swartzwelder.
> <..>
> > There is little information on how much choline women currently take.
> > "But don't be afraid of eggs," Swartzwelder suggests. "I used to eat a
> > low fat diet - I've started eating eggs and I'm not even pregnant!"
>
> 'Lecithin, found in foods such as eggs, soybeans, peanuts,
> and liver, is the predominant source of choline in the human
> diet. The normal intake of lecithin and choline has been
> estimated to be approximately 6 grams and 800 milligrams
> per day respectively. Commercial soy lecithin is defatted
> from soy bean oil to contain dominantly (± 95%) acetone
> insolubles- the most important of which are the phospholipids
> phosphatidylcholine, inositol and ethanolamine. Commercial
> lecithin is about 23% phosphatidylcholine (PC), and PC
> contains about 14% choline. Due to space limitations, choline
> sources like choline bitartrate and choline citrate have been
> used as the predominant source of choline in vitamin
> supplements. However, the increasing evidence that lecithin
> is a source of choline that may have benefits beyond simply
> being a choline source, has provided a reason for
> supplementing with both choline and lecithin itself. '
> http://www.aabhealth.com/lecithincholine.htm
>
mmm...yeah, i read that about lecithin a while back, and picked up some soy
lecithin granules...emulsifiers, so you can mix em' into stuff that you're
cooking for good memory stuff.

"katie" > wrote in message
.rogers.com...
>
> "pearl" > wrote in message
> ...
> > "Diarmid Logan" > wrote in message
> > om...
> > > http://www.newscientist.com/news/news.jsp?id=ns99994771
> > >
> > > Nutrient during pregnancy 'super-charges' brain
> > >
> > > NewScientist.com news service
> > >
> > > Taking a nutrient called choline during pregnancy could "super-charge"
> > > children's brains for life, suggests a study in rats.
> > <..>
> > > Choline, a member of the vitamin B family, is found in egg yolks,
> > > liver and other meats - "exactly the kind of things people were told
> > > not to eat" due to their high cholesterol content, says Swartzwelder.
> > <..>
> > > There is little information on how much choline women currently take.
> > > "But don't be afraid of eggs," Swartzwelder suggests. "I used to eat a
> > > low fat diet - I've started eating eggs and I'm not even pregnant!"
> >
> > 'Lecithin, found in foods such as eggs, soybeans, peanuts,
> > and liver, is the predominant source of choline in the human
> > diet. The normal intake of lecithin and choline has been
> > estimated to be approximately 6 grams and 800 milligrams
> > per day respectively. Commercial soy lecithin is defatted
> > from soy bean oil to contain dominantly (± 95%) acetone
> > insolubles- the most important of which are the phospholipids
> > phosphatidylcholine, inositol and ethanolamine. Commercial
> > lecithin is about 23% phosphatidylcholine (PC), and PC
> > contains about 14% choline. Due to space limitations, choline
> > sources like choline bitartrate and choline citrate have been
> > used as the predominant source of choline in vitamin
> > supplements. However, the increasing evidence that lecithin
> > is a source of choline that may have benefits beyond simply
> > being a choline source, has provided a reason for
> > supplementing with both choline and lecithin itself. '
> > http://www.aabhealth.com/lecithincholine.htm
> >
> mmm...yeah, i read that about lecithin a while back, and picked up some soy
> lecithin granules...emulsifiers, so you can mix em' into stuff that you're
> cooking for good memory stuff.

As lecithin is destroyed by high temperatures, it's best to take it 'raw'.

the village idiot wrote:
>>>>http://www.newscientist.com/news/news.jsp?id=ns99994771
>>>>
>>>>Nutrient during pregnancy 'super-charges' brain
>>>>
>>>>NewScientist.com news service
>>>>
>>>>Taking a nutrient called choline during pregnancy could "super-charge"
>>>>children's brains for life, suggests a study in rats.
>>>
>>><..>
>>>
>>>>Choline, a member of the vitamin B family, is found in egg yolks,
>>>>liver and other meats - "exactly the kind of things people were told
>>>>not to eat" due to their high cholesterol content, says Swartzwelder.
>>>
>>><..>
>>>
>>>>There is little information on how much choline women currently take.
>>>>"But don't be afraid of eggs," Swartzwelder suggests. "I used to eat a
>>>>low fat diet - I've started eating eggs and I'm not even pregnant!"
>>>
>>>'Lecithin, found in foods such as eggs, soybeans, peanuts,
>>>and liver, is the predominant source of choline in the human
>>>diet. The normal intake of lecithin and choline has been
>>>estimated to be approximately 6 grams and 800 milligrams
>>>per day respectively. Commercial soy lecithin is defatted
>>>from soy bean oil to contain dominantly (± 95%) acetone
>>>insolubles- the most important of which are the phospholipids
>>>phosphatidylcholine, inositol and ethanolamine. Commercial
>>>lecithin is about 23% phosphatidylcholine (PC), and PC
>>>contains about 14% choline. Due to space limitations, choline
>>>sources like choline bitartrate and choline citrate have been
>>>used as the predominant source of choline in vitamin
>>>supplements. However, the increasing evidence that lecithin
>>>is a source of choline that may have benefits beyond simply
>>>being a choline source, has provided a reason for
>>>supplementing with both choline and lecithin itself. '
>>>http://www.aabhealth.com/lecithincholine.htm
>>>
>>
>>mmm...yeah, i read that about lecithin a while back, and picked up some soy
>>lecithin granules...emulsifiers, so you can mix em' into stuff that you're
>>cooking for good memory stuff.
>
> As lecithin is destroyed by high temperatures,

Is it? Viscosity is affected by heat, but its chemical properties remain.

> it's best to take it 'raw'.

Katie's granules are dried, possibly by heat, lecithin. Aside from the absence
of moisture, how else are they chemically distinct from liquid lecithin?

the village idiot "usual suspect" > wrote in message
...

pearl wrote:
<..>
> > As lecithin is destroyed by high temperatures,
>
> Is it? Viscosity is affected by heat, but its chemical properties remain.
>
> > it's best to take it 'raw'.
>
> Katie's granules are dried, possibly by heat, lecithin. Aside from the absence
> of moisture, how else are they chemically distinct from liquid lecithin?

' Temperature-sensitive food and pharmaceutical products with the
highest quality standards can be successfully concentrated by thin-film
processors. Diluted feedstocks can be concentrated to final specification
in seconds without recirculation, thereby preserving quality and yield.
As the solids content of the stream increases, temperature sensitivity
and viscosity generally increase, creating the need for short residence
time. Agitated thin-film technology fulfills these needs while inducing
high heat transfer.

Typical applications a
"Drying" of lecithin to 99.5%
Concentration of sugar solutions to99.9%
Concentration of enzymes, vitaminsand proteins;
Concentration of fruit and vegetablepurees;
Concentration of cheesebase;
Concentration of biological solutions;
Stripping of solvents from vegetable and plant extracts;
Removal of water and solvents fromfermentation broths (e.g., antibiotics).

http://www.lcicorp.com/evap/chem%20proc%20paper.pdf

the village idiot pearl wrote:
> <..>
>
>>>As lecithin is destroyed by high temperatures,
>>
>>Is it? Viscosity is affected by heat, but its chemical properties remain.
>>
>>
>>>it's best to take it 'raw'.
>>
>>Katie's granules are dried, possibly by heat, lecithin. Aside from the absence
>>of moisture, how else are they chemically distinct from liquid lecithin?
>
> ' Temperature-sensitive food and pharmaceutical products with the
> highest quality standards can be successfully concentrated by thin-film
> processors. Diluted feedstocks can be concentrated to final specification
> in seconds without recirculation, thereby preserving quality and yield.
> As the solids content of the stream increases, temperature sensitivity
> and viscosity generally increase, creating the need for short residence
> time. Agitated thin-film technology fulfills these needs while inducing
> high heat transfer.
>
> Typical applications a
> "Drying" of lecithin to 99.5%
> Concentration of sugar solutions to99.9%
> Concentration of enzymes, vitaminsand proteins;
> Concentration of fruit and vegetablepurees;
> Concentration of cheesebase;
> Concentration of biological solutions;
> Stripping of solvents from vegetable and plant extracts;
> Removal of water and solvents fromfermentation broths (e.g., antibiotics).
>
> http://www.lcicorp.com/evap/chem%20proc%20paper.pdf

STUPID moron Lesley, that doesn't answer my question, but it is useful. It
further proves you cite sources you don't comprehend. You know why I say that?
Look at the pictures and note that *HEAT* is used to process lecithin from
liquid to granules.

Now try again. With your claims that it is best to consume lecithin 'raw' and
that it is 'destroyed by high temperatures,' aside from the absence of moisture,
how else are lecithin granules *chemically distinct* from liquid lecithin?

the village idiot "usual suspect" > wrote in message
...
> pearl wrote:
> > <..>
> >
> >>>As lecithin is destroyed by high temperatures,
> >>
> >>Is it? Viscosity is affected by heat, but its chemical properties remain.
> >>
> >>>it's best to take it 'raw'.
> >>
> >>Katie's granules are dried, possibly by heat, lecithin. Aside from the absence
> >>of moisture, how else are they chemically distinct from liquid lecithin?
> >
> > ' Temperature-sensitive food and pharmaceutical products with the
> > highest quality standards can be successfully concentrated by thin-film
> > processors. Diluted feedstocks can be concentrated to final specification
> > in seconds without recirculation, thereby preserving quality and yield.
> > As the solids content of the stream increases, temperature sensitivity
> > and viscosity generally increase, creating the need for short residence
> > time. Agitated thin-film technology fulfills these needs while inducing
> > high heat transfer.
> >
> > Typical applications a
> > "Drying" of lecithin to 99.5%
> > Concentration of sugar solutions to99.9%
> > Concentration of enzymes, vitamins and proteins;
> > Concentration of fruit and vegetable purees;
> > Concentration of cheese base;
> > Concentration of biological solutions;
> > Stripping of solvents from vegetable and plant extracts;
> > Removal of water and solvents fromfermentation broths (e.g., antibiotics).
> >
> > http://www.lcicorp.com/evap/chem%20proc%20paper.pdf
>
> STUPID moron Lesley, that doesn't answer my question, but it is useful. It
> further proves you cite sources you don't comprehend. You know why I say that?

Yes, we know- smear is your modus operandum.

> Look at the pictures and note that *HEAT* is used to process lecithin from
> liquid to granules.

How much heat? I wrote 'high temperatures'- in the context of cooking.
Note also 'need for short residence time'.

> Now try again. With your claims that it is best to consume lecithin 'raw' and
> that it is 'destroyed by high temperatures,' aside from the absence of moisture,
> how else are lecithin granules *chemically distinct* from liquid lecithin?

What part of 'temperature-sensitive food' don't you understand, 'usual suspect'?

"pearl" > wrote in message news:...
> the village idiot "usual suspect" > wrote in message
> ...
> > pearl wrote:
> > > <..>
> > >
> > >>>As lecithin is destroyed by high temperatures,
> > >>
> > >>Is it?

'Lecithin is a complex mixture of phospholipids and other materials.
They vary greatly in their physical form, from viscous semiliquids to
powders, depending upon their free fatty acid content. They are
almost odorless and will vary in color from brown to light yellow.
Lecithins are used as dispersing, emulsifying and stabilizing agents.
They will decompose at extreme pH, are hygroscopic and will
oxidize, darken and *decompose at high temperatures*. Lecithin
should be stored at room temperature protected from light.
Refrigeration may cause the material to separate.'
http://www.rx4u.com/lecithn.htm
*emphasis added.

<..>

the village idiot Lesley wrote:
>>><..>
>>>
>>>>>As lecithin is destroyed by high temperatures,
>>>>
>>>>Is it? Viscosity is affected by heat, but its chemical properties remain.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>it's best to take it 'raw'.
>>>>
>>>>Katie's granules are dried, possibly by heat, lecithin. Aside from the absence
>>>>of moisture, how else are they chemically distinct from liquid lecithin?
>>>
>>>' Temperature-sensitive food and pharmaceutical products with the
>>>highest quality standards can be successfully concentrated by thin-film
>>>processors. Diluted feedstocks can be concentrated to final specification
>>>in seconds without recirculation, thereby preserving quality and yield.
>>>As the solids content of the stream increases, temperature sensitivity
>>>and viscosity generally increase, creating the need for short residence
>>>time. Agitated thin-film technology fulfills these needs while inducing
>>>high heat transfer.
>>>
>>>Typical applications a
>>>"Drying" of lecithin to 99.5%
>>>Concentration of sugar solutions to99.9%
>>>Concentration of enzymes, vitamins and proteins;
>>>Concentration of fruit and vegetable purees;
>>>Concentration of cheese base;
>>>Concentration of biological solutions;
>>>Stripping of solvents from vegetable and plant extracts;
>>>Removal of water and solvents fromfermentation broths (e.g., antibiotics).
>>>
>>>http://www.lcicorp.com/evap/chem%20proc%20paper.pdf
>>
>>STUPID moron Lesley, that doesn't answer my question, but it is useful. It
>>further proves you cite sources you don't comprehend. You know why I say that?
>
> Yes, we know- smear is your modus operandum.

Your MO is stupidity. Mine is truth.

>>Look at the pictures and note that *HEAT* is used to process lecithin from
>>liquid to granules.
>
> How much heat? I wrote 'high temperatures'- in the context of cooking.

Cooking doesn't make any difference, either, at least with respect to changing
its state. Lecithin remains lecithin, regardless of heat. All you do is exchange
(add, subtract) moisture.

> Note also 'need for short residence time'.

How long does it take to dry, regardless of method? Heat is applied. It doesn't
destroy any property of lecithin aside to change its physical state from liquid
to granule. The same occurs whether processing lecithin from soy oil or even
cooking (which only puts lecithin in solution with other ingredients) with
lecithin, dummy.

>>Now try again. With your claims that it is best to consume lecithin 'raw' and
>>that it is 'destroyed by high temperatures,' aside from the absence of moisture,
>>how else are lecithin granules *chemically distinct* from liquid lecithin?
>
> What part of 'temperature-sensitive food' don't you understand, 'usual suspect'?

You're the one not comprehending or supporting your claim that "lecithin is
destroyed by high temperatures; it's best to take it raw." The lecithin you
purchase -- liquid or granule -- as a supplement or a food additive has been
subjected to heat. Lots of heat over long periods of time. It's *still*
lecithin, it'll *still* work as an emulsifier in either state, and it *still*
contains choline.

Just how is lecithin separated from soy oil anyway?
Lecithin is a combination of naturally-occurring phospholipids, which
are extracted during the processing of soybean oil. The soybeans are
tempered by keeping them at a consistent temperature and moisture level
for approximately seven to 10 days. This process hydrates the soybeans
and loosens the hull. The soybeans are then cleaned and cracked into
small pieces and the hulls are separated from the cracked beans. Next,
the soybean pieces are heated and pressed into flakes. Soybean oil is
extracted from the flakes through a distillation process and lecithin is
separated from the oil by the addition of water and centrifugation or
steam precipitation.
http://www.talksoy.com/pdfs/SoyLecithinFactSheet3.pdf

Did someone say distillation? That involves heat, LOTS of heat for a LONG period
of time. So does steam precipitation -- that happens at 100c over time:
distillation, process used to separate the substances composing a
mixture. It involves a change of state, as of liquid to gas, and
subsequent condensation. The process was probably first used in the
production of intoxicating beverages. Today, refined methods of
distillation are used in many industries, including the alcohol and
petroleum industries.
http://www.infoplease.com/ce6/sci/A0815646.html
(read the part about distillation processes, dummy)

BTW, I'm surprised you advocate the use of a soy byproduct.
When soy lecithin supplements were given throughout perinatal
development, they reduced activity in the cerebral cortex and "altered
synaptic characteristics in a manner consistent with disturbances in
neural function."
http://www.mercola.com/2000/sept/17/soy_brain.htm

Which loonie source will you rely upon this time? You are the lowest-grade moron
in usenet history.

the village idiot "usual suspect" > wrote in message
...

pearl wrote:
> >>><..>
> >>>
> >>>>>As lecithin is destroyed by high temperatures,
> >>>>
> >>>>Is it? Viscosity is affected by heat, but its chemical properties remain.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>it's best to take it 'raw'.
> >>>>
> >>>>Katie's granules are dried, possibly by heat, lecithin. Aside from the absence
> >>>>of moisture, how else are they chemically distinct from liquid lecithin?
> >>>
> >>>' Temperature-sensitive food and pharmaceutical products with the
> >>>highest quality standards can be successfully concentrated by thin-film
> >>>processors. Diluted feedstocks can be concentrated to final specification
> >>>in seconds without recirculation, thereby preserving quality and yield.
> >>>As the solids content of the stream increases, temperature sensitivity
> >>>and viscosity generally increase, creating the need for short residence
> >>>time. Agitated thin-film technology fulfills these needs while inducing
> >>>high heat transfer.
> >>>
> >>>Typical applications a
> >>>"Drying" of lecithin to 99.5%
> >>>Concentration of sugar solutions to99.9%
> >>>Concentration of enzymes, vitamins and proteins;
> >>>Concentration of fruit and vegetable purees;
> >>>Concentration of cheese base;
> >>>Concentration of biological solutions;
> >>>Stripping of solvents from vegetable and plant extracts;
> >>>Removal of water and solvents fromfermentation broths (e.g., antibiotics).
> >>>
> >>>http://www.lcicorp.com/evap/chem%20proc%20paper.pdf
> >>
> >>STUPID moron Lesley, that doesn't answer my question, but it is useful. It
> >>further proves you cite sources you don't comprehend. You know why I say that?
> >
> > Yes, we know- smear is your modus operandum.
>
> Your MO is stupidity. Mine is truth.

LOL!!

> >>Look at the pictures and note that *HEAT* is used to process lecithin from
> >>liquid to granules.
> >
> > How much heat? I wrote 'high temperatures'- in the context of cooking.
>
> Cooking doesn't make any difference, either, at least with respect to changing
> its state. Lecithin remains lecithin, regardless of heat. All you do is exchange
> (add, subtract) moisture.
>
> > Note also 'need for short residence time'.
>
> How long does it take to dry, regardless of method? Heat is applied. It doesn't
> destroy any property of lecithin aside to change its physical state from liquid
> to granule. The same occurs whether processing lecithin from soy oil or even
> cooking (which only puts lecithin in solution with other ingredients) with
> lecithin, dummy.
>
> >>Now try again. With your claims that it is best to consume lecithin 'raw' and
> >>that it is 'destroyed by high temperatures,' aside from the absence of moisture,
> >>how else are lecithin granules *chemically distinct* from liquid lecithin?
> >
> > What part of 'temperature-sensitive food' don't you understand, 'usual suspect'?
>
> You're the one not comprehending or supporting your claim that "lecithin is
> destroyed by high temperatures; it's best to take it raw." The lecithin you
> purchase -- liquid or granule -- as a supplement or a food additive has been
> subjected to heat. Lots of heat over long periods of time. It's *still*
> lecithin, it'll *still* work as an emulsifier in either state, and it *still*
> contains choline.
>
> Just how is lecithin separated from soy oil anyway?
> Lecithin is a combination of naturally-occurring phospholipids, which
> are extracted during the processing of soybean oil. The soybeans are
> tempered by keeping them at a consistent temperature and moisture level
> for approximately seven to 10 days. This process hydrates the soybeans
> and loosens the hull. The soybeans are then cleaned and cracked into
> small pieces and the hulls are separated from the cracked beans. Next,
> the soybean pieces are heated and pressed into flakes. Soybean oil is
> extracted from the flakes through a distillation process and lecithin is
> separated from the oil by the addition of water and centrifugation or
> steam precipitation.
> http://www.talksoy.com/pdfs/SoyLecithinFactSheet3.pdf
>
> Did someone say distillation? That involves heat, LOTS of heat for a LONG period
> of time. So does steam precipitation -- that happens at 100c over time:
> distillation, process used to separate the substances composing a
> mixture. It involves a change of state, as of liquid to gas, and
> subsequent condensation. The process was probably first used in the
> production of intoxicating beverages. Today, refined methods of
> distillation are used in many industries, including the alcohol and
> petroleum industries.
> http://www.infoplease.com/ce6/sci/A0815646.html
> (read the part about distillation processes, dummy)

Apparently much commercial soy-derived lecithin is rancid.

'Much lecithin on the market is rancid. Thebest form of lecithin
I know is Twin Labs brand "PC 55" - it contains 55% PC and is
always very fresh.
http://tinyurl.com/2rnyl

I wonder if they use a different extraction method for "PC 55".

'Lecithin is a complex mixture of phospholipids and other materials.
They vary greatly in their physical form, from viscous semiliquids to
powders, depending upon their free fatty acid content. They are
almost odorless and will vary in color from brown to light yellow.
Lecithins are used as dispersing, emulsifying and stabilizing agents.
They will decompose at extreme pH, are hygroscopic and will
oxidize, darken and *decompose at high temperatures*. Lecithin
should be stored at room temperature protected from light.
Refrigeration may cause the material to separate.'
http://www.rx4u.com/lecithn.htm
*emphasis added.

> BTW, I'm surprised you advocate the use of a soy byproduct.
> When soy lecithin supplements were given throughout perinatal
> development, they reduced activity in the cerebral cortex and "altered
> synaptic characteristics in a manner consistent with disturbances in
> neural function."
> http://www.mercola.com/2000/sept/17/soy_brain.htm

- in non-human animals, possibly in excess.

I'm not keen on soy products in general, but I think that many of
the problems discovered may have been due to contaminants.

<..>

*the* village idiot wrote:
<...>
>>>>Look at the pictures and note that *HEAT* is used to process lecithin from
>>>>liquid to granules.
>>>
>>>How much heat? I wrote 'high temperatures'- in the context of cooking.
>>
>>Cooking doesn't make any difference, either, at least with respect to changing
>>its state. Lecithin remains lecithin, regardless of heat. All you do is exchange
>>(add, subtract) moisture.
>>
>>
>>>Note also 'need for short residence time'.
>>
>>How long does it take to dry, regardless of method? Heat is applied. It doesn't
>>destroy any property of lecithin aside to change its physical state from liquid
>>to granule. The same occurs whether processing lecithin from soy oil or even
>>cooking (which only puts lecithin in solution with other ingredients) with
>>lecithin, dummy.
>>
>>
>>>>Now try again. With your claims that it is best to consume lecithin 'raw' and
>>>>that it is 'destroyed by high temperatures,' aside from the absence of moisture,
>>>>how else are lecithin granules *chemically distinct* from liquid lecithin?
>>>
>>>What part of 'temperature-sensitive food' don't you understand, 'usual suspect'?
>>
>>You're the one not comprehending or supporting your claim that "lecithin is
>>destroyed by high temperatures; it's best to take it raw." The lecithin you
>>purchase -- liquid or granule -- as a supplement or a food additive has been
>>subjected to heat. Lots of heat over long periods of time. It's *still*
>>lecithin, it'll *still* work as an emulsifier in either state, and it *still*
>>contains choline.
>>
>>Just how is lecithin separated from soy oil anyway?
>>Lecithin is a combination of naturally-occurring phospholipids, which
>>are extracted during the processing of soybean oil. The soybeans are
>>tempered by keeping them at a consistent temperature and moisture level
>>for approximately seven to 10 days. This process hydrates the soybeans
>>and loosens the hull. The soybeans are then cleaned and cracked into
>>small pieces and the hulls are separated from the cracked beans. Next,
>>the soybean pieces are heated and pressed into flakes. Soybean oil is
>>extracted from the flakes through a distillation process and lecithin is
>>separated from the oil by the addition of water and centrifugation or
>>steam precipitation.
>>http://www.talksoy.com/pdfs/SoyLecithinFactSheet3.pdf
>>
>>Did someone say distillation? That involves heat, LOTS of heat for a LONG period
>>of time. So does steam precipitation -- that happens at 100c over time:
>>distillation, process used to separate the substances composing a
>>mixture. It involves a change of state, as of liquid to gas, and
>>subsequent condensation. The process was probably first used in the
>>production of intoxicating beverages. Today, refined methods of
>>distillation are used in many industries, including the alcohol and
>>petroleum industries.
>>http://www.infoplease.com/ce6/sci/A0815646.html
>>(read the part about distillation processes, dummy)
>
> Apparently much commercial soy-derived lecithin is rancid.

IPSE DIXIT, DIPSHIT. HOBOES.COM DOES *NOT* COUNT AS A VALID SOURCE.

> 'Much lecithin on the market is rancid. Thebest form of lecithin
> I know is Twin Labs brand "PC 55" - it contains 55% PC and is
> always very fresh.
> http://tinyurl.com/2rnyl

hoboes.com??? Mondo 2000??? Surely you can do better than some Berkeley dork's
personal zine.

> I wonder if they use a different extraction method for "PC 55".

Yeah, so do I. Not. Lecithin is lecithin.

> 'Lecithin is a complex mixture of phospholipids and other materials.
> They vary greatly in their physical form, from viscous semiliquids to
> powders, depending upon their free fatty acid content. They are
> almost odorless and will vary in color from brown to light yellow.
> Lecithins are used as dispersing, emulsifying and stabilizing agents.
> They will decompose at extreme pH, are hygroscopic and will
> oxidize, darken and *decompose at high temperatures*. Lecithin
> should be stored at room temperature protected from light.
> Refrigeration may cause the material to separate.'
> http://www.rx4u.com/lecithn.htm
> *emphasis added.

Ipse dixit. That site offers no evidence to support such claims. It also flies
in the face of soy processing: lecithin results from a distillate process
followed by centrifuge- or steam-separation from soy oil. So it goes through at
least one stage in which sustained heat is absolutely required, and optionally a
second.

>>BTW, I'm surprised you advocate the use of a soy byproduct.
>>When soy lecithin supplements were given throughout perinatal
>>development, they reduced activity in the cerebral cortex and "altered
>>synaptic characteristics in a manner consistent with disturbances in
>>neural function."
>>http://www.mercola.com/2000/sept/17/soy_brain.htm
>
> - in non-human animals,

So?

> possibly in excess.

Excess according to what or whom?

> I'm not keen on soy products in general, but I think that many of
> the problems discovered may have been due to contaminants.

The feminizing aspects of phytoestrogens are not contaminants.

Rat pups, exposed to high doses of the plant estrogen coumestrol
(found in sunflower seeds and oil and alfalfa sprouts) through
their mother's milk, suffered permanent reproductive problems:
female pups when grown did not ovulate, and males had altered
mounting behavior and fewer ejaculations (2).
[Whitten, P., C. Lewis and F. Naftolin. 1993. A Phytoestrogen
diet induces the premature anovulatory syndrome in lactationally
exposed female rats. Biology of Reproduction 49:1117-21.]

Neonatal and immature rats exposed to coumestrol experienced
estrogen-related responses, such as premature estrous cycles.
Coumestrol also interrupted ovarian cycles in adult female rats
(3).
[Barrett, J. 1996. Phytoestrogens: Friends or Foes?
Environmental Health Perspectives 104:478-82.]

Newborn rats exposed to the phytoestrogen genistein (a compound
found in soy products), experienced altered hormone secretions
and the onset of puberty may have been delayed because female
rats were exposed to the compound as fetuses (3).
[Ibid.]

“In males, levels of 17B-estradiol and testosterone were not
affected, but levels of 3a, 17B- androstanediol glucuronide (a
metabolite of dihydrotestosterone) and dehydroepiandrosterone
sulfate were decreased by 13% and 14%, respectively, after 2-4
weeks of daily soya ingestion.”
[Supported by USPHS CA56273, CA65628, CA45181, John Sealy
Memorial Endowment Fund for Biomedical Research, American
Institute for Cancer Research grant 95B119, and NIH NCRR GCRC
grant M01 RR00073]

All above lifted from:
http://www.cheapbodybuildingsuppleme...estrogen.shtml

Additionally, see:
http://www.t-mag.com/articles/185soy.html
http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/satter6.htm

*the* village idiot "usual suspect" > wrote in message
...
> pearl wrote:
<...>
> > I wonder if they use a different extraction method for "PC 55".
>
> Yeah, so do I. Not. Lecithin is lecithin.

“lecithin” differs from “phosphatidylcholine”, however.

'Supplements labeled as “lecithin” usually contain 10–20%
PC. Relatively pure PC supplements are generally labeled as
“phosphatidylcholine.” PC best duplicates supplements used
in medical research.
http://www.vitacost.com/science/hn/Supp/Lecithin.htm

'Impact of Cooking, Storage and Processing
How do cooking, storage & processing affect choline?
Although consistent information is not available on the effects
of cooking, storage, and processing on the choline content of
food, choline’s participation in cell membranes and in the fatty
portion of food renders it susceptible to alteration by oxygen
and heat. While maximizing choline content would not be a
good reason to choose raw egg yolk over cooked egg yolk
(too many safety risks are involved with raw egg yolk),
overcooking of foods high in choline would be a practice
worth avoiding to help preserve choline content. '
http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?t...trient&dbid=50

> > 'Lecithin is a complex mixture of phospholipids and other materials.
> > They vary greatly in their physical form, from viscous semiliquids to
> > powders, depending upon their free fatty acid content. They are
> > almost odorless and will vary in color from brown to light yellow.
> > Lecithins are used as dispersing, emulsifying and stabilizing agents.
> > They will decompose at extreme pH, are hygroscopic and will
> > oxidize, darken and *decompose at high temperatures*. Lecithin
> > should be stored at room temperature protected from light.
> > Refrigeration may cause the material to separate.'
> > http://www.rx4u.com/lecithn.htm
> > *emphasis added.
>
> Ipse dixit. That site offers no evidence to support such claims. It also flies
> in the face of soy processing: lecithin results from a distillate process
> followed by centrifuge- or steam-separation from soy oil. So it goes through at
> least one stage in which sustained heat is absolutely required, and optionally a
> second.

Lecithin is produced for many different usages, I'm talking
about quality phosphatidylcholine nutritional supplements.

> >>BTW, I'm surprised you advocate the use of a soy byproduct.
> >>When soy lecithin supplements were given throughout perinatal
> >>development, they reduced activity in the cerebral cortex and "altered
> >>synaptic characteristics in a manner consistent with disturbances in
> >>neural function."
> >>http://www.mercola.com/2000/sept/17/soy_brain.htm
> >
> > - in non-human animals,
>
> So?

So they are completely different species with different reactions to
various substances. And you call others pseudo-scientific quacks!

> > possibly in excess.
>
> Excess according to what or whom?

According to a RAT's tolerance, ducky.

> > I'm not keen on soy products in general, but I think that many of
> > the problems discovered may have been due to contaminants.
>
> The feminizing aspects of phytoestrogens are not contaminants.
>
> Rat

Rats are not humans.

<snip cruel time-wasting 'research'>

> All above lifted from:
> http://www.cheapbodybuildingsuppleme...estrogen.shtml
>
> Additionally, see:
> http://www.t-mag.com/articles/185soy.html
> http://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/satter6.htm
>