On Sun, 7 Sep 2008 16:19:54 -0700 (PDT), Rupert > wrote:

>On Sep 3, 7:52 pm, Derek > wrote:
>> On Wed, 3 Sep 2008 12:27:58 -0700 (PDT), Rupert > wrote:
>> >
>> >So you know perfectly well that I haven't recently changed
>> >my position
>>
>> I've always suspected it.
>>
>
>Well, that's interesting, because I repeatedly told you that there was
>no recent change in position and you repeatedly accused me of lying.

You can't be in favor of providing decent AW and the misnomer
too since they work against each other. If you're finally going to
accept the fact that providing decent lives can be ethically equivalent
or superior to elimination, then it's time you say so and move on in that
direction away from elimination.

>You were just babbling on for the sake of wasting bandwidth, were you?

He has a good point for a change, and it's getting time you face
it. It's past time really. Quit wish-washing around like a goober and
decide whether you're going to move on to support any of the vast
possibilities associated with providing decent AW, or go back to
your stifled little faith in elimination and the nasty little clique that
clings to it. While you battle with yourself as to which way to go
and which way to *turn your back on!*, consider that the AW way
imposes much fewer restrictions and therefore allows much greater
ability to think. In contrast to the misnomer, it also allows you to
think about--and in fact give great thought to--THE ANIMALS.
Just from that fact alone it seems anyone with an open and
thinking mind would want to move away from the restrictions
and distortions etc associated with faith in the misnomer, if the
person had somehow been manipulated into putting their faith
in such a thing at some point during their life. Every minute you
have put faith in it was a waste...every day...every month...
every year... And now every minute you still cling to it--afraid to
turn your back on it and move forward (talk to real life people
you respect about this)--is a waste...every minute...every month
....every year....

(and for WHAT???)

>> >> >> >> In fact, according to your circular logic, in order to be
>> >> >> >> better, do better, have better, we should continue
>> >> >> >> raising animals for food because it is better.
>>
>> >> >> >> "I accept that some nonhuman animals who are raised
>> >> >> >> for food on farms have lives which are such that it is
>> >> >> >> better that they live that life than that they not live at
>> >> >> >> all"
>> >> >> >> Rupert 24 July 2008http://tinyurl.com/5m8t28
>>
>> >> >> >> So, it comes as no surprise to me that you're "exploring
>> >> >> >> the issue of whether [you] ought to be called "vegan".
>> >> >> >> Do it; drop theveganlabel as well. Start doingwhat
>> >> >> >> your uncle William keeps telling you to do; "be one's
>> >> >> >> own harshest critic."
>>
>> >> >> >Derekthe filthy scum has hacked into my email account and has been
>> >> >> >reading my private messages. I will explore whether it is possible for
>> >> >> >me to take legal action against him.
>>
>> >> >> You've got to prove it first. Your uncle Bill, from your father's
>> >> >> side, will tell you that.
>>
>> >> >I do indeed have to prove it, and you're generously helping me out
>> >> >with that. I will be discussing the matter with the police tomorrow,
>> >> >we'll see how we go.
>>
>> >> Okay.
>>
>> >You seem to be in the mood for being smart,Derek. Actually it is a
>> >different relative on my father's side, not Bill,
>>
>> Over here in England, Bill is often used instead of William.
>> I'm talking about William McCallum, that number theory
>> kiddy fiddler who works at the University of Arizona.
>
>Bill is often used instead of William in Australia too, and I was
>assuming that you got that we call him Bill from the McCallum family
>website which is linked to from my website. Surely you must have got
>the fact that he is my uncle on my father's side from there.

And the quote?

>But my
>question to you was, do you know who my other relative is on my
>father's side whom I turned to for help with the legal aspects of the
>matter?
>
>Incidentally I was well aware that it is public information that my
>uncle William McCallum works in number theory at the University of
>Arizona, there are many ways you could have got that.
>
>By the way you're a childish nitwit.

Move on. Don't let them drag you back in. Don't look back
except to share things you learn, and then don't expect them
to be able to comprehend.