Hello to all,

Reading some books by Kazuo Ishiguro lately, I noticed a great "fuss"
about the tea and it's way to be served. I don't understand that at
all. As I understand, the "orthodox" English way is to serve (and
take, of course) tea always with milk. Well, esp. in the afternoon I
presume there is mostly a decent Earl Grey or Darjeeling been drunk.
Preferring a nice blend of FTGFOP1 Darjeeling First Flush (and an Earl
Grey from time to time) by myself, I can't imagine drinking those with
milk! So, I hope someone here can enlighten me about the English way
of drinking tea ;-).


Regards,
Dieter



P.S.: Does anybody know something about Ishiguro's tea habits?

(Dieter Folz) wrote in news:96baf1a5.0312210704.682756
@posting.google.com:

> P.S.: Does anybody know something about Ishiguro's tea habits?
He's gotten out of tea, smoke a lot of opium now.

Dieter Folz wrote:
> Hello to all,
>
> Reading some books by Kazuo Ishiguro lately, I noticed a great "fuss"
> about the tea and it's way to be served. I don't understand that at
> all. As I understand, the "orthodox" English way is to serve (and
> take, of course) tea always with milk. Well, esp. in the afternoon I
> presume there is mostly a decent Earl Grey or Darjeeling been drunk.
> Preferring a nice blend of FTGFOP1 Darjeeling First Flush (and an Earl
> Grey from time to time) by myself, I can't imagine drinking those with
> milk! So, I hope someone here can enlighten me about the English way
> of drinking tea ;-).
>
Although my father always drank Russian tea (that is, tea with lemon), I
did my formative tea drinking in England and now always take black teas
with milk. Earl Grey, Assam, Lapsang Souchong, whatever, all with milk.
I rather like the taste. I gather you don't. Fortunately, I am not
bound by your taste.

dmh

On 21 Dec 2003, David M. Harris posted the following to
rec.food.drink.tea:

> Although my father always drank Russian tea (that is, tea with
> lemon), I did my formative tea drinking in England and now always
> take black teas with milk. Earl Grey, Assam, Lapsang Souchong,
> whatever, all with milk.

That's funny. When I was in Russian, I never saw anyone put lemon in
their tea. Then again, I didn't see any lemons while I was there
either.

I did see, on the other hand, people flavoring their tea with
marmelades/jams/preserves, which is a habit I continue to this day.

--
Derek

The downside of being better than everyone else is that people tend to
assume you're pretentious.

(Dieter Folz) wrote in message m>...
> Hello to all,
>
> Reading some books by Kazuo Ishiguro lately, I noticed a great "fuss"
> about the tea and it's way to be served. I don't understand that at
> all. As I understand, the "orthodox" English way is to serve (and
> take, of course) tea always with milk. Well, esp. in the afternoon I
> presume there is mostly a decent Earl Grey or Darjeeling been drunk.
> Preferring a nice blend of FTGFOP1 Darjeeling First Flush (and an Earl
> Grey from time to time) by myself, I can't imagine drinking those with
> milk! So, I hope someone here can enlighten me about the English way
> of drinking tea ;-).
>
>
> Regards,
> Dieter

Dieter:

If you look at the English tea set, you will see- six cups and
saucers, One tea pot, one milk pot and one sugar pot. I guess English
way to drink tea is- drinking tea with a tea set. That means- brewed
tea with milk and sugar.

Tea culture in U.K. & South Asia:

When S. Asia was British colony- the English people started the tea
cultivation around this region because to take some control on
Chinese tea trades. But the tea seed was from Mainland China. However,
in south Asia English tea style is still the elegant way to serve tea.
If you ever been to South Asia you will see- when you go to a house or
in a office, first they will ask you-do you want a cup of tea? If yes
then you also have a choice to say- you want ginger tea or lemon tea
etc. But if you just say yes, that means milk tea. The way tea is
presents here also represent the specific family's or company's classy
taste. Sort of Japan-tea presentation indicates the style. The true
English way is- Brewed tea pot covered with a (nice, hand woven) tea
cozy. cups and saucers numbers depend on the guests numbers. Full
sugar pot(sugars quality also represent the style & status).A full
milk pot with different kinds of snacks(again the quality and amount
represent the style and status)LOL. But no one will ask you like in
US-"Do you want milk 2% milk (I had hard time in US about this 2%(Low
fat milk or full cream milk option LOL). English way milk means-full
cream milk but again not creamer. I had the same experience in UK- tea
with a whole tea set.

Well, about different blends and different teas- When people drink
Darjeeling, a lot of people drink straight even some people put some
milk or lemon etc. I think more then a billion tea drinkers live in
south Asia but few people still know about the SFTGFOP1 grading
system, I guess also in US and UK. But majority people still like full
body, strong tea. That's why TG tips, Marks & Spencer are the most
popular tea in UK. In south Asia Assam CTC dominates the tea cups. But
Masala Cha or Chai Masala is not a UK culture, it's totally a South
Asian tea culture. Though South Asian "Chicken Tikka"(Grilled chicken)
is very popular in UK and as far as I know Masala Cha's popularity is
also growing there in UK.

"English Breakfast"(EB) Blend:- Most of the time it is Chinese Keemun
but sometimes EB can be also only Ceylon OP, example- Sir Tomas
Lipton's EB Blend. Even EB can be a combination of Keemun and Ceylon
OP. Anyway the result is EB blend is a strong blend so some milk and
sugar go fine with it. I never heard any EB has Darjeeling, which is
more kind of a light ,delicate tea. By the way, I had English
breakfast tea in US as Bond Street Blend which was a combination of
Assam and Ceylon.

Irish & Scottish breakfast Blend: Most of the time entirely Assam
sometimes can be combination of Assam, Bangladeshi CTC or Ceylon. But
mostly Assam I guess. Irish breakfast blend is mostly made from CTC
tea.

So you can see most of the English ways of teas are strong that's why
it comes with milk and sugar.

Actually I can write a whole book about English way of tea LOL. I
always love to talk and drink about EB blend or any blend. Because
English way of drinking tea is also our way of drinking tea. It is an
art to have a good cup of tea.

> P.S.: Does anybody know something about Ishiguro's tea habits?

K. Ishiguro is a Japanese-English writer(though both of her parents
were Japanese) but I have no idea about his tea habits, sorry.

Ripon
(From Bangladesh)

Derek wrote:
> On 21 Dec 2003, David M. Harris posted the following to
> rec.food.drink.tea:
>
>
>>Although my father always drank Russian tea (that is, tea with
>>lemon), I did my formative tea drinking in England and now always
>>take black teas with milk. Earl Grey, Assam, Lapsang Souchong,
>>whatever, all with milk.
>
>
> That's funny. When I was in Russian, I never saw anyone put lemon in
> their tea. Then again, I didn't see any lemons while I was there
> either.
>
> I did see, on the other hand, people flavoring their tea with
> marmelades/jams/preserves, which is a habit I continue to this day.
>
"Russian tea" is an English term. My father's father, who was born in
Russia and lived most of his live there, drank his tea with jam, or
sometimes with rock sugar held between his teeth.

dmh

"David M. Harris" > wrote in message >...
[...]
> Although my father always drank Russian tea (that is, tea with lemon), I
> did my formative tea drinking in England and now always take black teas
> with milk. Earl Grey, Assam, Lapsang Souchong, whatever, all with milk.
> I rather like the taste. I gather you don't. Fortunately, I am not
> bound by your taste.

Hm, yes, maybe ... I can't imagine drinking my Darjeeling with milk,
because it's flavour is too fragile. Maybe your blends are more
strongly (esp. according to the remarks of Ripon). So, e.g. also Earl
Grey here on the continent is mostly a blend of fine Darjeeling or a
blend of fine Ceylon and Darjeeling teas, all from leaf teas (TGFOP or
FTGFOP). The only tea strong enough to drink with milk I know is
Ostfriesentee (East Friesian Tea), that is mostly a mixture of Assam &
Darjeeling TGFOP teas or (the stronger variety) a blend of Assam and
Java or Assam and Ceylon BOP teas. In East Friesia the latter is an
every day tea, the fist is a tea for sundays and special occasions
(Sonntagstee). Sometime you can find the Sonntagstee flavoured with
pieces of bourbon vanilla. But these teas are drunk with real cream,
not with milk (and you don't stir the tea after adding the cream! ...
well, see by yourself, if you like:
<http://ostfriesland.ostfriesland-vier.de/index.php?pageId=419&contentmodule_id=1411&listPag e=256>
btw, the two "rocks" in the cup in the first picture is sugar, called
Kluntje).
So, maybe it's a question of the "right" blend, to drink tea the
English way?! So, the question has to be, what are typical English
blends for Darjeeling, Earl Grey etc. and which ones are the
preferred?

Dieter

(Ripon) wrote in message . com>...
> (Dieter Folz) wrote in message m>...
[....]
> Dieter:
>
> If you look at the English tea set, you will see- six cups and
> saucers, One tea pot, one milk pot and one sugar pot. I guess English
> way to drink tea is- drinking tea with a tea set. That means- brewed
> tea with milk and sugar.
>
> Tea culture in U.K. & South Asia:
>
> When S. Asia was British colony- the English people started the tea
> cultivation around this region because to take some control on
> Chinese tea trades. But the tea seed was from Mainland China. However,
> in south Asia English tea style is still the elegant way to serve tea.
> If you ever been to South Asia you will see- when you go to a house or
> in a office, first they will ask you-do you want a cup of tea? If yes
> then you also have a choice to say- you want ginger tea or lemon tea
> etc. But if you just say yes, that means milk tea. The way tea is
> presents here also represent the specific family's or company's classy
> taste. Sort of Japan-tea presentation indicates the style. The true
> English way is- Brewed tea pot covered with a (nice, hand woven) tea
> cozy. cups and saucers numbers depend on the guests numbers. Full
> sugar pot(sugars quality also represent the style & status).A full
> milk pot with different kinds of snacks(again the quality and amount
> represent the style and status)LOL. But no one will ask you like in
> US-"Do you want milk 2% milk (I had hard time in US about this 2%(Low
> fat milk or full cream milk option LOL). English way milk means-full
> cream milk but again not creamer. I had the same experience in UK- tea
> with a whole tea set.

Yes, I think invernting the low fat and even fat reduced milk was a
crime. It is nearly impossible now to buy milk with natural, not
reduced and not technically modified fat!

> Well, about different blends and different teas- When people drink
> Darjeeling, a lot of people drink straight even some people put some
> milk or lemon etc. I think more then a billion tea drinkers live in
> south Asia but few people still know about the SFTGFOP1 grading
> system, I guess also in US and UK. But majority people still like full
> body, strong tea. That's why TG tips, Marks & Spencer are the most
> popular tea in UK. In south Asia Assam CTC dominates the tea cups. But
> Masala Cha or Chai Masala is not a UK culture, it's totally a South
> Asian tea culture. Though South Asian "Chicken Tikka"(Grilled chicken)
> is very popular in UK and as far as I know Masala Cha's popularity is
> also growing there in UK.
>
> "English Breakfast"(EB) Blend:- Most of the time it is Chinese Keemun
> but sometimes EB can be also only Ceylon OP, example- Sir Tomas
> Lipton's EB Blend. Even EB can be a combination of Keemun and Ceylon
> OP. Anyway the result is EB blend is a strong blend so some milk and
> sugar go fine with it. I never heard any EB has Darjeeling, which is
> more kind of a light ,delicate tea. By the way, I had English
> breakfast tea in US as Bond Street Blend which was a combination of
> Assam and Ceylon.
>
> Irish & Scottish breakfast Blend: Most of the time entirely Assam
> sometimes can be combination of Assam, Bangladeshi CTC or Ceylon. But
> mostly Assam I guess. Irish breakfast blend is mostly made from CTC
> tea.
>
> So you can see most of the English ways of teas are strong that's why
> it comes with milk and sugar.

Yes, and I've mentioned it before (in my answer to david, that it's
maybe a question of the blends. Maybe the English way of drinking tea
depends on an English tea blend, even if you drink an Earl Grey or
Darjeeling. So, if the English tea blends are quite stronger than the
ones on the contnent, it's only natural to drink all teas with milk
(and sugar).

> Actually I can write a whole book about English way of tea LOL. I
> always love to talk and drink about EB blend or any blend. Because
> English way of drinking tea is also our way of drinking tea. It is an
> art to have a good cup of tea.

Well, I would buy the book ;-) ... I'm very interested in the English
tea tradition.

> > P.S.: Does anybody know something about Ishiguro's tea habits?
>
> K. Ishiguro is a Japanese-English writer(though both of her parents
> were Japanese) but I have no idea about his tea habits, sorry.
>

So, maybe he drinks litres of green tea per day or he's drinking loads
of coffee (and beer) ;-) ...

Dieter

Hi Dieter, I'm English,tho I've not lived there in more than 25 years.
I do remember that the tea we drank with milk was usually an Assam or
Ceylon tea, my dear old grey-haired granny would never serve her
Darjeeling with milk.

On 21 Dec 2003 07:04:45 -0800, (Dieter Folz) wrote:

>Hello to all,
>
>Reading some books by Kazuo Ishiguro lately, I noticed a great "fuss"
>about the tea and it's way to be served. I don't understand that at
>all. As I understand, the "orthodox" English way is to serve (and
>take, of course) tea always with milk. Well, esp. in the afternoon I
>presume there is mostly a decent Earl Grey or Darjeeling been drunk.
>Preferring a nice blend of FTGFOP1 Darjeeling First Flush (and an Earl
>Grey from time to time) by myself, I can't imagine drinking those with
>milk! So, I hope someone here can enlighten me about the English way
>of drinking tea ;-).
>
>
>Regards,
>Dieter
>
>
>
>P.S.: Does anybody know something about Ishiguro's tea habits?

On Sun, 21 Dec 2003 07:04:45 -0800, Dieter Folz wrote:

> Hello to all,
>
> Reading some books by Kazuo Ishiguro lately, I noticed a great "fuss"
> about the tea and it's way to be served. I don't understand that at
> all. As I understand, the "orthodox" English way is to serve (and
> take, of course) tea always with milk. Well, esp. in the afternoon I
> presume there is mostly a decent Earl Grey or Darjeeling been drunk.
> Preferring a nice blend of FTGFOP1 Darjeeling First Flush (and an Earl
> Grey from time to time) by myself, I can't imagine drinking those with
> milk! So, I hope someone here can enlighten me about the English way
> of drinking tea ;-).
>
>
> Regards,
> Dieter
>
>
>
> P.S.: Does anybody know something about Ishiguro's tea habits?

I stick my head out for a bet that most English people do not know the
term Darjeeling, same as with most Germans. Nothing wrong with that, if I
am correct. I always found it not easy, to say the least, to find
Darjeeling tea, or loose tea generally apart from the Twinings and similar
mass product teas. Single estate teas are a rarity to find in England,
although they exist. Most people, as far as I can tell, have tea bag teas
with milk and/or sugar. Earl Grey is common as well, then without milk.

JB

Because a thing is so now does not mean it was ever thus. Teas also
change with time.
Going back 40 years or so the UK was the major importer of Darjeeling
tea much of which went into the hugely successful Maison Lyons blend,
universally drunk with milk in the English way. However it was not
the Darjeeling tea that you would now recognise as such; it was a
truly black fermented tea with an orange liquor - properly oxidised,
much like a rains Darjeeling is nowadays when hard withers cannot be
achieved (these rains Darjeelings are sold domestically in India - not
exported as).
Then one day Lyons switched their house blend away from Darjeeling -
whose producers had quickly to find another market. North Europe was
targeted but required a lighter cup that would drink in the European
way - without milk. And so the nearly green, hard withered, Darjeeling
tea was developed and became universally recognised as "the"
Darjeeling. But how will it be forty years hence?

Nigel at Teacraft


J Boehm > wrote in message >...
>
> I stick my head out for a bet that most English people do not know the
> term Darjeeling, same as with most Germans. Nothing wrong with that, if I
> am correct. I always found it not easy, to say the least, to find
> Darjeeling tea, or loose tea generally apart from the Twinings and similar
> mass product teas. Single estate teas are a rarity to find in England,
> although they exist. Most people, as far as I can tell, have tea bag teas
> with milk and/or sugar. Earl Grey is common as well, then without milk.
>
> JB

Nigel at 12/23/03


> Because a thing is so now does not mean it was ever thus. Teas also
> change with time.
> Going back 40 years or so the UK was the major importer of Darjeeling
> tea much of which went into the hugely successful Maison Lyons blend,
> universally drunk with milk in the English way. However it was not
> the Darjeeling tea that you would now recognise as such; it was a
> truly black fermented tea with an orange liquor - properly oxidised,
> much like a rains Darjeeling is nowadays when hard withers cannot be
> achieved (these rains Darjeelings are sold domestically in India - not
> exported as).
> Then one day Lyons switched their house blend away from Darjeeling -
> whose producers had quickly to find another market. North Europe was
> targeted but required a lighter cup that would drink in the European
> way - without milk. And so the nearly green, hard withered, Darjeeling
> tea was developed and became universally recognised as "the"
> Darjeeling. But how will it be forty years hence?
>
> Nigel at Teacraft


Nigel, that's extraordinary. Thanks for sharing it. It had never occurred to
me that the Darjeelings I drink might be so new a style. I especially enjoy
Darjeelings prepared in the "oolong" way, as developed for example at the
Gopaldhara gardens. Perhaps, the wave of the future. Who knows.

Also, your explanation might begin to explain a puzzlement: Why Darjeelings
so often classified as "black" tea, when in fact -- currently, as you point
out -- they are not.

Michael

Did anyone see the 1999 National spelling bee documentary on one of the
premium show channels recently where the American raised Indian kid almost
got tripped up over the word Darjeeling?

Jim

"J Boehm" > wrote in message
news
> I stick my head out for a bet that most English people do not know the
> term Darjeeling, same as with most Germans. Nothing wrong with that, if I
> am correct. I always found it not easy, to say the least, to find
> Darjeeling tea, or loose tea generally apart from the Twinings and similar
> mass product teas. Single estate teas are a rarity to find in England,
> although they exist. Most people, as far as I can tell, have tea bag teas
> with milk and/or sugar. Earl Grey is common as well, then without milk.
>
> JB

(Nigel at Teacraft) writes:

> [...40 years ago Darjeeling really was a black tea...]
> Then one day Lyons switched their house blend away from Darjeeling -
> whose producers had quickly to find another market. North Europe was
> targeted but required a lighter cup that would drink in the European
> way - without milk. And so the nearly green, hard withered, Darjeeling
> tea was developed and became universally recognised as "the"
> Darjeeling. But how will it be forty years hence?

Fascinating! I've heard that much of the best Darjeeling now goes to
Japan. If this is true, the switch from black to near-green would
presumably only have helped.

/Lew
---
Lew Perin /
http://www.panix.com/~perin/babelcarp.html

With all due respect, I find that a little bit hard to believe.
That's because during a recent trip to Sri Lanka, all the teas I
could find from the highest growing area (Nuwara Eliya, 2.000
meter above sea level) were "greenish blacks", similiar to
Darjeelings (yet also quite different). I also had a couple of
teas of the same type from the Uva district, which I supposed
were from the highest parts of the district (which goes from mid
to high level). And it's clear that both Sri Lanka's internal
tea market and export market prefers *black* teas, mainly of
broken grades. So for this reason I have thought that tea from
the highest growing areas simply do not get fermented to the
same degree as teas produced in other areas.

Jon

"Nigel at Teacraft" > skrev i melding
om...
> Because a thing is so now does not mean it was ever thus.
Teas also
> change with time.
> Going back 40 years or so the UK was the major importer of
Darjeeling
> tea much of which went into the hugely successful Maison Lyons
blend,
> universally drunk with milk in the English way. However it
was not
> the Darjeeling tea that you would now recognise as such; it
was a
> truly black fermented tea with an orange liquor - properly
oxidised,
> much like a rains Darjeeling is nowadays when hard withers
cannot be
> achieved (these rains Darjeelings are sold domestically in
India - not
> exported as).
> Then one day Lyons switched their house blend away from
Darjeeling -
> whose producers had quickly to find another market. North
Europe was
> targeted but required a lighter cup that would drink in the
European
> way - without milk. And so the nearly green, hard withered,
Darjeeling
> tea was developed and became universally recognised as "the"
> Darjeeling. But how will it be forty years hence?
>
> Nigel at Teacraft
>
>
> J Boehm > wrote in message
>...
> >
> > I stick my head out for a bet that most English people do
not know the
> > term Darjeeling, same as with most Germans. Nothing wrong
with that, if I
> > am correct. I always found it not easy, to say the least, to
find
> > Darjeeling tea, or loose tea generally apart from the
Twinings and similar
> > mass product teas. Single estate teas are a rarity to find
in England,
> > although they exist. Most people, as far as I can tell, have
tea bag teas
> > with milk and/or sugar. Earl Grey is common as well, then
without milk.
> >
> > JB

> If you look at the English tea set, you will see- six cups and
> saucers, One tea pot, one milk pot and one sugar pot. I guess English
> way to drink tea is- drinking tea with a tea set. That means- brewed
> tea with milk and sugar.


I had the mixed fortune of living in the UK for several years, and would
like to share two "English ways" now sadly declining.

One is the honorific given whomever is pouring. In an early James Bond film
(IIRC), there's a scene where someone invites, "Will you be mother?" Most of
the theatre audience looked confused or just missed the comment. (Likewise
when Q, fitting Bond for a magic suit, asks on which side he dresses.)

The other is the eminently civilised practice of putting out a pot of very
strong tea and another of boiling water. People can then mix to preferred
strength. Since I prefer tea that looks like coffee (and coffee that looks
like bitumen), and others a milder dilution, it seems a very polite
treatment.

-DM

(Dieter Folz) wrote in message m>...
> Hello to all,
>
> Reading some books by Kazuo Ishiguro lately, I noticed a great "fuss"
> about the tea and it's way to be served. I don't understand that at
> all. As I understand, the "orthodox" English way is to serve (and
> take, of course) tea always with milk. Well, esp. in the afternoon I
> presume there is mostly a decent Earl Grey or Darjeeling been drunk.
> Preferring a nice blend of FTGFOP1 Darjeeling First Flush (and an Earl
> Grey from time to time) by myself, I can't imagine drinking those with
> milk! So, I hope someone here can enlighten me about the English way
> of drinking tea ;-).

Hi Dieter,

THE English way is:
"What is Darjeeling? I only know some grocery store brands with Earl
Grey tea bags, Tetley and PG Tips, and I always take the cheapest!"

THE English way to prepare and drink tea is:
1. Throw a tea bag in a mug
2. Add hot boiling water
3. Take a spoon, stir, and squeeze the bag, do this for one minute or
so
4. Take the bag out of the mug
5. Add a splash of fresh milk
6. Drink and enjoy

>
> Regards,
> Dieter
>
>
>
> P.S.: Does anybody know something about Ishiguro's tea habits?

Nope, but I would be interested either.

On 30 Dec 2003 11:01:53 -0800, (Matthias Scholz) wrote:

>THE English way is:
>"What is Darjeeling? I only know some grocery store brands with Earl
>Grey tea bags, Tetley and PG Tips, and I always take the cheapest!"

I'm surprised that I seem to be the only Brit-resident Brit around
here. Still, that's not a bad description of the current state of
British tea drinking 8-)


British tea is drunk in several styles these days; Locally they're
known as Builders', Anarchist, ******* and Posh. (I do happen to
know a posh anarchist ******* carpenter, and they generally drink
builder's).


Builder's Tea is the typical drink of the masses. It's made as
Matthias describes - bag in the mug, milk added later. The tea is
cheap nameless dross from the supermarket, but it's usually based on
Assam, to give a strong brew in no time. Real builders will add the
regulation four sugars, but most people don't take it.

Despite its proletarian origins, this is a decent brew. It's made
(unlike American tea) with boiling water and most of our mass-market
tea (PG, or especially Taylors) is quite drinkable. Happy Shopper
brands and Tetleys (arguably) border on the undrinkable.

Builder's Tea is easily ruined by adding the milk to the mug first,
then trying to brew it with the resultant luke-warm fatty water.

True Builder's Tea (amongst builders) exists as a guild ritual as much
as a drink. The labour of preparing it is performed by the most junior
apprentice, who has also had to walk to the nearest garage (where the
British now shop for groceries) to buy milk. Whether the Gaffer
reimburses them for this, and how generously, is a mark of the
apprentice's status and performance - effectively a variable pay
bonus. The Guild Initiates themselves reinforce the mutual bonds by
sharing the single Teaspoon of Brotherhood amongst them. Other guilds,
such as the Lodge of Mechanics may favour other implements, such as
the traditional ring spanner (the perfect stirrer and teabag lifter).


Anarchist tea takes its name from The Proudhon Shop-Lifting Tea Joke.
It's the brew of Grauniad readers - basically Builder's Tea made in
the mug, but the tea is a better grade and usually FairTrade these
days. Milk is semi-skimmed and it's not sugared.


******* tea (sometime Vegetarian Tea) is a derisory term for any
tea-like infusion without tea in it. The fruit infusions that are so
popular in Germany are also popular in the UK, but with a smaller
sector of the population. Don't offer it to people who don't want it -
it's just not thought of as "tea".


Posh Tea is the only one brewed in a pot. It's also the only one where
the ritual still dominates over the beverage - posh tea is as much an
activity as a drink - _really_ posh tea (like what The Queen drinks)
is as complex and stylised as anything in Japan.

Post tea requires utensils, and often the new girlfriend's mother.
It's served on a tray, and perhaps a tablecloth. Although Anarchist
tea can cheerfully be slurped in a reclined positon on the sofa, Posh
Tea must only be drunk whilst seated erect, at a table. You face the
vessel and talk over it, never talking or being distracted whilst you
place the tea down to one side. Surprisingly, proper tea may be
served in a mug (so long as it's brewed in a pot) although it's the
only place where you're still likely to find a teacup or saucer in
use. A milk jug is essential. Serving milk from the bottle used to be
accepted (with some tutting) from bohemians in their early twenties,
but cartons no longer cut it. Similarly for sugar from a storage jar
rather than a bowl, but never the packet.

The tea is chosen for the quality of its label, its distinction from
everyday Assam, yet its reaassuring familiarity. So Darjeeling is
popular, as is the entirely inappropriate Earl Grey. The tea itself
may also be quite disgusting. The different strength of Darjeeling
leaf compared to dust Assam may confuse inexperienced brewers, so it's
sometimes stewed and of excessive strength, to try and colour match
the familiar. An affectation for the rituals of Posh does not signify
any understanding of the culinary aspect.

Biscuits are common, although these will be from a packet (displayed).
More elevated forms serve the biscuits from a storage jar (hiding the
packet to preserve a pretence of home-baking) or offer cake.
Individual biscuits offered on the saucer are ridiculous though, and
seen as a serious failing in understanding the boundaries of good
taste.


There's also Irish Tea. Ireland is the last outpost of traditional
(1950s) English tea-drinking. It's made in a pot, it's usually
assam-based, it's unfeasibly strong and it's drunk with full-fat milk
and probably sugar too.

Non-family members will be forced to eat cake with it (the rituals of
competitive cake-offering potlach outside the tribe could fill a
book). Not regularly home-baking is a major social gaffe. Even elderly
bachelor uncles will be delivered with regular parcels of home-baked
cake, not for their own consumption, but so they can be offered to
passing vets and farm inspectors without provoking comment on offering
"a poor spread".


--
Congrats to STBL on his elevation from TLA to ETLA

On Fri, 02 Jan 2004 16:36:22 +0000, Andy Dingley
> tripped the light fantastic, then quipped:

>I'm surprised that I seem to be the only Brit-resident Brit around
>here. Still, that's not a bad description of the current state of
>British tea drinking 8-)
>
>
>British tea is drunk in several styles these days; Locally they're
>known as Builders', Anarchist, ******* and Posh. (I do happen to
>know a posh anarchist ******* carpenter, and they generally drink
>builder's).

8<- - - Major snippage - - ->8

Very amusing. According to your post, tea is the only posh aspect of
my life; I prefer the pot, cup and saucer, a nice biscuit, and the
ritual of it all. Keep in mind, though, that for lack of a tiara and
frumpy attire, I'll be drinking my posh tea whilst wearing a
sweatshirt and shorts or overalls and a tee shirt.

·.·´¨ ¨)) :¤:
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
Tee
((¸¸.·´ ..·´
:¤: ((¸¸ ·.·

http://www.geocities.com/tee_king
Remove -no-spam- to email me.

Andy Dingley wrote:

> ******* tea (sometime Vegetarian Tea) is a derisory term for any
> tea-like infusion without tea in it.

I like this. The term, "******* Tea", not the drink. Can you really
utter this in mixed company over there?

--crymad

Andy Dingley > writes:

> [...]
>
> I'm surprised that I seem to be the only Brit-resident Brit around
> here.

You aren't, but I don't believe in outing people, so I won't say who
it is. By the way, welcome aboard!

> [...There are 4 styles: Builders', Anarchist, ******* and Posh...]
>
> Anarchist tea takes its name from The Proudhon Shop-Lifting Tea
> Joke.

Please explain!

> It's the brew of Grauniad readers - basically Builder's Tea made in
> the mug, but the tea is a better grade and usually FairTrade these
> days. Milk is semi-skimmed and it's not sugared.

Grauniad?? Would that be a certain topy-afflicted publication?

/Lew
---
Lew Perin /
http://www.panix.com/~perin/babelcarp.html

"crymad" > wrote
...
>
>
> Andy Dingley wrote:
>
> > ******* tea (sometime Vegetarian Tea) is a derisory term for
any
> > tea-like infusion without tea in it.
>
> I like this. The term, "******* Tea", not the drink. Can you
really
> utter this in mixed company over there?

I thought *******s only drink beer?

And I also thought most women drink herbal teas.

Jon

Jon Nossen wrote:
>
> "crymad" > wrote
> ...
> >
> >
> > Andy Dingley wrote:
> >
> > > ******* tea (sometime Vegetarian Tea) is a derisory term for
> any
> > > tea-like infusion without tea in it.
> >
> > I like this. The term, "******* Tea", not the drink. Can you
> really
> > utter this in mixed company over there?
>
> I thought *******s only drink beer?
>
> And I also thought most women drink herbal teas.

Hmmm...then how about "Pussy Tea"? This embraces the female drinking
segment as well as capturing the slack, insubstantial nature of the
drink itself.

--crymad

"Andy Dingley" > wrote
> ... Surprisingly, proper tea may be
> served in a mug (so long as it's brewed in a pot)

And why do Marxists only drink herbal tea? Because proper tea is theft!

(sorry)

ROTFL!

>Builder's Tea is easily ruined by adding the milk to the mug first,
>then trying to brew it with the resultant luke-warm fatty water.

.... this is NHS Tea, consisting of poorly steeped "Senator" bags.

Cheers

Blippie
--
Visit the alt.aviation.safety FAQ online at www.blippie.org.uk

"Jon Nossen" > wrote in news:N3BJb.229
:

> And I also thought most women drink herbal teas.

Why should that be true? I don't know if more herbal tea is consumed by
women than men, but there are plenty of women who drink real (not herbal)
tea.

Debbie

--
Anti-spam advisory: The email address used to post this article is a throw-
away address. It will be invalidated and replaced with another if and when
it is found by spammers.

"Debbie Deutsch" > wrote:
. 97.132...
> "Jon Nossen" > wrote in
news:N3BJb.229
> :
>
> > And I also thought most women drink herbal teas.
>
> Why should that be true? I don't know if more herbal tea is
consumed by
> women than men, but there are plenty of women who drink real
(not herbal)
> tea.

Quite true. I'd say more women than men drink *real* tea
(unfortunately most men seem to prefer coffee and cola). But
it's also my impression that *many* women like to drink herbal
and fruit teas - as opposed to just *******s. I shouldn't have
said *most* women, though...

Jon

It is not too late for someone to reply to this...?

"Jon Nossen" > wrote in news:...
> With all due respect, I find that a little bit hard to
believe.
> That's because during a recent trip to Sri Lanka, all the teas
I
> could find from the highest growing area (Nuwara Eliya, 2.000
> meter above sea level) were "greenish blacks", similiar to
> Darjeelings (yet also quite different). I also had a couple of
> teas of the same type from the Uva district, which I supposed
> were from the highest parts of the district (which goes from
mid
> to high level). And it's clear that both Sri Lanka's internal
> tea market and export market prefers *black* teas, mainly of
> broken grades. So for this reason I have thought that tea from
> the highest growing areas simply do not get fermented to the
> same degree as teas produced in other areas.
>
> Jon
>
> "Nigel at Teacraft" > wrote in
> om...
> > Because a thing is so now does not mean it was ever thus.
> Teas also
> > change with time.
> > Going back 40 years or so the UK was the major importer of
> Darjeeling
> > tea much of which went into the hugely successful Maison
Lyons
> blend,
> > universally drunk with milk in the English way. However it
> was not
> > the Darjeeling tea that you would now recognise as such; it
> was a
> > truly black fermented tea with an orange liquor - properly
> oxidised,
> > much like a rains Darjeeling is nowadays when hard withers
> cannot be
> > achieved (these rains Darjeelings are sold domestically in
> India - not
> > exported as).
> > Then one day Lyons switched their house blend away from
> Darjeeling -
> > whose producers had quickly to find another market. North
> Europe was
> > targeted but required a lighter cup that would drink in the
> European
> > way - without milk. And so the nearly green, hard withered,
> Darjeeling
> > tea was developed and became universally recognised as "the"
> > Darjeeling. But how will it be forty years hence?
> >
> > Nigel at Teacraft
> >
> >
> > J Boehm > wrote in message
> >...
> > >
> > > I stick my head out for a bet that most English people do
> not know the
> > > term Darjeeling, same as with most Germans. Nothing wrong
> with that, if I
> > > am correct. I always found it not easy, to say the least,
to
> find
> > > Darjeeling tea, or loose tea generally apart from the
> Twinings and similar
> > > mass product teas. Single estate teas are a rarity to find
> in England,
> > > although they exist. Most people, as far as I can tell,
have
> tea bag teas
> > > with milk and/or sugar. Earl Grey is common as well, then
> without milk.
> > >
> > > JB
>
>

"Jon Nossen" > wrote in message >...
> It is not too late for someone to reply to this...?
>
> "Jon Nossen" > wrote in news:...
> > With all due respect, I find that a little bit hard to
> believe.
> > That's because during a recent trip to Sri Lanka, all the teas
> I
> > could find from the highest growing area (Nuwara Eliya, 2.000
> > meter above sea level) were "greenish blacks", similiar to
> > Darjeelings (yet also quite different). I also had a couple of
> > teas of the same type from the Uva district, which I supposed
> > were from the highest parts of the district (which goes from
> mid
> > to high level). And it's clear that both Sri Lanka's internal
> > tea market and export market prefers *black* teas, mainly of
> > broken grades. So for this reason I have thought that tea from
> > the highest growing areas simply do not get fermented to the
> > same degree as teas produced in other areas.
> >
> > Jon

Yes Jon, these teas are indeed less fermented "greenish blacks". There
are several ways to make a "green" tea (which is essentially a tea
without oxidation) or a "greenish tea" which is a tea with minimal
oxidation. In a tea factory some of these are purposeful methods,
others the results of poor processing.

The main ways a

1. Inactivate oxidising enzymes before rolling using steam (Japanese
method)= green tea
2. Inactivate oxidising enzymes using dry heat (Chinese panning or
roasting method) = green tea
3. Avoid initiating oxidation by very gentle handling and drying =
white tea (a variant of green).
4. Oxidise for a very short time (minimal rolling, or CTC cutting) -
dry as soon as short rolling or CTC cutting is complete = insufficient
time for full oxidation to black = anything from a green to a greenish
black tea.
5. Oxidise at low temperature - this slows down enzyme action =
partial oxidation only = greenish black.
6. Hard wither (to a very low leaf moisture content) - this inhibits
enzyme action = partial oxidation only = greenish black
7. Insufficient oxygen present during oxidation (fermenting layers too
thick) = partial oxidation only = anything from green to greenish
black

The partially oxidised oolongs fall into group 4. above though they
have other processing inputs (sun withering and leaf agitation and
high firing) that give their unique character.

The "greenish blacks" you find at high elevations in Sri Lanka and
Darjeeling are the result of partial oxidation due to very hard
withers and cool ambient temperature. It is perfectly possible to make
a fully oxidised (black) Uva or Darjeeling, and in fact during the
rains in Darjeeling when a hard wither cannot be achieved, this is
exactly what happens (but these are not exported). Similarly we had
to heat up fermenter air to 90 deg F in early spring in Turkey as the
cool weather gave us a greenish tea - not at all what the Turks like
to drink.

The type of tea and degree of oxidation required is driven by the
market (or the producer's perception of the market). As increasingly
Darjeelings and flavoury high grown Ceylons are bought by non-milked
tea markets, so the dark srong liquors required in the English market
have given way to lighter ones, and the dry leaf shows green colour
rather than jet black . Producers could revert if the market required
- the process is flexible and a skilled manager can alter his teas at
will.

My point (in my previous posting) was to remind tea lovers that a
tea's characteristics may change with time even if the names stay the
same.

Nigel at Teacraft

Andy Dingley > wrote in message >. ..
> On 30 Dec 2003 11:01:53 -0800, (Matthias Scholz) wrote:
>
> >THE English way is:
> >"What is Darjeeling? I only know some grocery store brands with Earl
> >Grey tea bags, Tetley and PG Tips, and I always take the cheapest!"
>
> I'm surprised that I seem to be the only Brit-resident Brit around
> here. Still, that's not a bad description of the current state of
> British tea drinking 8-)

That's quite shocking!

> British tea is drunk in several styles these days; Locally they're
> known as Builders', Anarchist, ******* and Posh. (I do happen to
> know a posh anarchist ******* carpenter, and they generally drink
> builder's).
>
>
> Builder's Tea is the typical drink of the masses. It's made as
> Matthias describes - bag in the mug, milk added later. The tea is
> cheap nameless dross from the supermarket, but it's usually based on
> Assam, to give a strong brew in no time. Real builders will add the
> regulation four sugars, but most people don't take it.
>
> Despite its proletarian origins, this is a decent brew. It's made
> (unlike American tea) with boiling water and most of our mass-market
> tea (PG, or especially Taylors) is quite drinkable. Happy Shopper
> brands and Tetleys (arguably) border on the undrinkable.

I just tasted PG Tips tea bags and I have to admit, it was very much
better than German tea bag teas, but in contrast to a normal loose
Assam, it was quite disgusting.
[...]

> Posh Tea is the only one brewed in a pot. It's also the only one where
> the ritual still dominates over the beverage - posh tea is as much an
> activity as a drink - _really_ posh tea (like what The Queen drinks)
> is as complex and stylised as anything in Japan.

Well, it seems, that this is e.g. the tea, described in some books
(Ishiguro or also in the Sherlock Holmes Stories -- ok, maybe less
'posh' at all).

[...]
> An affectation for the rituals of Posh does not signify
> any understanding of the culinary aspect.

Hm, but there seems to be an old English (non posh) way of preparing
and drinking tea with loose tea. I looked some further and found some
interesting points (mostly referred to the essay on tea by G. Orwell).
So, the old way was, to take an Indian or Ceylon tea (I suppose,
Indian tea means Assam), put six spoons into a pot, add one litre of
boiling water and ... well, ... as I understand it, don't use a
strainer and just leave the tea there in the pot. So, after some cups,
the tea must be really strong?! Maybe this is much like the Irish tea
you mentioned later?!

I also read about a more Builder's like way: put one or two tea bags
(e.g. PG Tips) in a pot, add one litre boiling water and let the tea
infuse for ten minutes, leave the bag(s) in the pot and add some other
half a litre of boiling water after some time.

[...]

> There's also Irish Tea. Ireland is the last outpost of traditional
> (1950s) English tea-drinking. It's made in a pot, it's usually
> assam-based, it's unfeasibly strong and it's drunk with full-fat milk
> and probably sugar too.
[...]

So, after all that, I think I stay with the "continental way". That
is, drinking loose tea, nearly all of it in a light, often more
half-fermented way, drank without milk and, of course, using a
strainer (after app. three minutes infusion time). Maybe the tea more
likely the English way is, using a good Assam, which is strong enough
to drink with milk.

There are also Twinings and Fortnum & Mason teas to buy here, but as I
remember it (I tasted the Breakfast blends and the Assam blends), they
are high priced and of low quality (compared to loose teas you can buy
at the same price in a real tea shop).

I think the point, that nearly all teas despite of Assam are more
half-fermented and lighter nowadays is a good explanation, why you
can't drink them with milk. And I for myself never saw a full
fermented Darjeeling and also never a Darjeeling BOP, which, I
suppose, would be a good idea to take with some milk.

For that, drinking Assam is the only way to come near to "the English
way", because, there aren't the right teas available here.


Dieter

"Nigel at Teacraft" > wrote in message
om...
> "Jon Nossen" > wrote in message
>...
> > It is not too late for someone to reply to this...?
> >
> > "Jon Nossen" > wrote in
news:...
> > > With all due respect, I find that a little bit hard to
> > believe.
> > > That's because during a recent trip to Sri Lanka, all the
teas
> > I
> > > could find from the highest growing area (Nuwara Eliya,
2.000
> > > meter above sea level) were "greenish blacks", similiar to
> > > Darjeelings (yet also quite different). I also had a
couple of
> > > teas of the same type from the Uva district, which I
supposed
> > > were from the highest parts of the district (which goes
from
> > mid
> > > to high level). And it's clear that both Sri Lanka's
internal
> > > tea market and export market prefers *black* teas, mainly
of
> > > broken grades. So for this reason I have thought that tea
from
> > > the highest growing areas simply do not get fermented to
the
> > > same degree as teas produced in other areas.
> > >
> > > Jon
>
> Yes Jon, these teas are indeed less fermented "greenish
blacks". There
> are several ways to make a "green" tea (which is essentially a
tea
> without oxidation) or a "greenish tea" which is a tea with
minimal
> oxidation. In a tea factory some of these are purposeful
methods,
> others the results of poor processing.
>
> The main ways a
>
> 1. Inactivate oxidising enzymes before rolling using steam
(Japanese
> method)= green tea
> 2. Inactivate oxidising enzymes using dry heat (Chinese
panning or
> roasting method) = green tea
> 3. Avoid initiating oxidation by very gentle handling and
drying =
> white tea (a variant of green).
> 4. Oxidise for a very short time (minimal rolling, or CTC
cutting) -
> dry as soon as short rolling or CTC cutting is complete =
insufficient
> time for full oxidation to black = anything from a green to a
greenish
> black tea.
> 5. Oxidise at low temperature - this slows down enzyme action
=
> partial oxidation only = greenish black.
> 6. Hard wither (to a very low leaf moisture content) - this
inhibits
> enzyme action = partial oxidation only = greenish black
> 7. Insufficient oxygen present during oxidation (fermenting
layers too
> thick) = partial oxidation only = anything from green to
greenish
> black
>
> The partially oxidised oolongs fall into group 4. above though
they
> have other processing inputs (sun withering and leaf agitation
and
> high firing) that give their unique character.
>
> The "greenish blacks" you find at high elevations in Sri Lanka
and
> Darjeeling are the result of partial oxidation due to very
hard
> withers and cool ambient temperature. It is perfectly possible
to make
> a fully oxidised (black) Uva or Darjeeling, and in fact during
the
> rains in Darjeeling when a hard wither cannot be achieved,
this is
> exactly what happens (but these are not exported). Similarly
we had
> to heat up fermenter air to 90 deg F in early spring in Turkey
as the
> cool weather gave us a greenish tea - not at all what the
Turks like
> to drink.
>
> The type of tea and degree of oxidation required is driven by
the
> market (or the producer's perception of the market). As
increasingly
> Darjeelings and flavoury high grown Ceylons are bought by
non-milked
> tea markets, so the dark srong liquors required in the English
market
> have given way to lighter ones, and the dry leaf shows green
colour
> rather than jet black . Producers could revert if the market
required
> - the process is flexible and a skilled manager can alter his
teas at
> will.
>
> My point (in my previous posting) was to remind tea lovers
that a
> tea's characteristics may change with time even if the names
stay the
> same.
>
> Nigel at Teacraft

Thanks for a very interesting explanation. Let me just see if I
understand what you are saying.

1) The greenish black teas from Darjeeling, Nuwara Eliya, Uva
(and possibly other high elevations) are less fermented than
other black tea because of hard withers and low temperature
during fermentation, which inhibits or slows down enzyme action.

2) The producers in these districts make greenish black teas on
purpose because of market demands.

Even if this is true for Darjeeling teas, I doubt that it is for
Ceylon teas. In general, Ceylon teas are fully black, which
seems to be what the markets want, and to a large extent of
small particle size (BOP, Fannings and Dust). The highest
elevation districts (Nuwara Eliya and parts of Uva) produce
almost only small particle size, which I assume is because of
market demands. And the market statistics I have seen show that
these days the high elevation districts fetch *lower* prices
than the lowgrown districts. So it's a puzzle to me why they
should make greenish teas on purpose.

On 12 Jan 2004 05:23:34 -0800, (Dieter Folz) wrote:

>Well, it seems, that this is e.g. the tea, described in some books
>(Ishiguro or also in the Sherlock Holmes Stories -- ok, maybe less
>'posh' at all).

Sherlock Holmes was a long time ago, Ishiguro not much less. I'd also
point out that both described tea made by servants for their employer.
Perhaps less formally so for Mrs. Hudson, but it's still not the
self-serving laziness that leads to the "bag in the mug" approach.

OK, you've had the joke. Now the serious response.

There was a time when English tea was brewed in The Proper Way.
Everyone knew the rules, most people stuck to them.

The utensils began with a kettle and a teapot. Kettles were electric
and powerful, for a very long time (an innovation which has yet to
reach America). The mid-century kitchen contained an electric cooker,
an electric kettle and perhaps an electric fridge. The fridge was
wired in through a typical house socket of varying capacity and a
steam iron might have to borrow a light socket, but the kettle would
have its own high-current socket supplied directly from the cooker
supply.

Water came from the tap, but it was freshly drawn.

Teapots were the heavy earthenware spheroids we still see as the
Yorkshire "brown betty". Although glazed on the inside, it wasn't
regarded as properly ready for use until coated with a thick layer of
tannins. It would be regularly cleaned by "scalding" out with boiling
water, but never scrubbed.

Whilst boiling, the teapot would be warmed with a little water from
the kettle.

The the tea would be measured in. Tea was stored in a caddy, a rather
reduced artefact compared to its Bramah-locked Victorian splendour,
but still a utensil of some status in the kitchen. If Disney's "Beauty
and the Beast" had been made in England, Mrs. Pott's consort would
have been the tea caddy (probably echoing something of Anthony
Hopkins' role in Ishiguro). The variety was of the household's regular
blend. With one caddy, there was one blend of tea. What could be
simpler ? English tea (of its mass acceptance) was always blended, but
Assams figured highly. The English cook was as likely to select it for
the grocer's brand as they were for some far-off geography. The tea
itself would be measured with a tea-spoon or caddy-spoon. Not the slim
stirrer of the serving tray, this is a near-circular shallow measuring
spoon. Frequently they'd be decorated with a thistle as a handle
(Scottish themes were always popular in England, so long as they
didn't involve actual Scots) or some other enamelled gewgaw as a
momento of some early-wedded holiday in Aberystwyth.

There was one golden rule for tea measuring; one per cup, and one for
the pot. If poverty tightened your caddy, then you used a smaller
spoon - but there was always one for the pot.

Whilst still boiling, the tea would be "wetted" from the kettle and
the teapot placed on the table. Most kitchens would have some form of
pot stand - once Victorian cast iron, these later became another
manifestation of the English passion for twee holiday souvenirs -
often a printed ceramic tile, set in a metal holder.

Most well-dressed teapots would also wear a tea-cosy, always knitted
by someone's granny. The purpose of the cosy is not for its insulating
properties, but to make the lid hard to remove and thus keep the
impatient menfolk from poking at it with a spoon.

Whilst the tea was brewing, the cups would be laid out. Teacups _and_
saucers, I'll have you know. Not using a saucer is only one step from
the workhouse (*).

Milk would be poured in a round, whilst brewing. Milk jugs are
essential, even in the days of glass bottles. When the first American
films and sit-coms appeared on TV, I was literally amazed to see milk
cartoons publically displayed on the breakfast table. Even that nice
Alan Alda, who even my Mother liked, ate his breakfast with
_a_milk_carton_ in the room ! For some reason, the English middle
classes are ashamed of milk, or at least the industrial parts of its
obtaining. We'll go to insane lengths (see Wodehouse's "The Code of
the Woosters") to obtain that ridiculous device, the "cow creamer",
yet we'll live the lie that there are neither shops nor dairies
involved in supplying our daily milk. Presumably we all keep a cow in
the scullery and milk her directly into the milk jug.

Shortly before the tea was brewed, Father would attempt to pour a cup.
This was simply repressed impatience at having been foiled in his
stirring attempts by the impenetrable tea-cosy. A wrist would be
slapped and the usual fussing made. The precise shade of the tea at
this point is best described by the traditional term of "peely-wally".

No one, outside of an Ealing Comedy, has ever asked "Shall I be
Mother?" before pouring. Tea is poured by She Who Made It, or else
there will be repercussions. If there is an order to pouring, then
I'm afraid I missed it in my ethology.

Strainers are rarely used, only when indulging in posh tea. After all,
how would one read other's fortunes without the leaves ?

I understand that in Georgian times, polite society allowed tea to be
sipped from the saucer. By the mid-20th century this was still
practiced, but only by the uncouth. Toothless crones might even do it
into the '70s, even practicing such bizarre habits as mixing it with
Epsom salts or Andrews liver salts. Now it's just a term of disdain
for in-laws who are rustic farmers.

After drinking the first cup, the pot is frequently topped up. However
an empty pot is _never_ refilled, once emptied. The tea remains quite
drinkable by this technique, the pot retains heat and the unstirred
leaves sit at the bottom of the pot and don't brew enough to become
bitter.

An over-aged pot is described as "stewed". Traditionally stewing is
determined by the precise moment at which tardy men return from the
mill, foundry or pit bottom, too late for the tea which was announced
hours ago (7.5 minutes is the usual metric equivalent unit to the
"hours").

Pre-war, and possibly into the '50s, cold tea was taken from the
breakfast pot and poured into a whisky bottle (conveniently flat) for
consumption cold at lunchtime. Whether it was drunk with or without
milk in this state seems to be a regional variation, but it would
always have been sweetened. The great social historian Orwell
describes the use of jam as a cheaper sweetener.


(*) The teacup and saucer is now extinct, surviving only as a
ceremonial fetish in the ritualistic Posh Tea. I date its demise to
the rise of instant c*ff*e in the '70s, and the warm immediacy of the
mug.



--
Socialism: Eric, not Tony

Andy Dingley > wrote in message >. ..
> On 12 Jan 2004 05:23:34 -0800, (Dieter Folz) wrote:

Hi Andy,

Thank you for these very very interesting informations. But I still
have some questions.

[...]
> The variety was of the household's regular
> blend. With one caddy, there was one blend of tea. What could be
> simpler ? English tea (of its mass acceptance) was always blended, but
> Assams figured highly.

Are there such traditional blends today? Now, we mostly have "blends"
of a single sort of tea (e.g. Darjeeling First Flush) or even single
estate teas. I only know "blends" from East Frisian tea or from some
Twinings and Fortnum & Mason which nowadays is the crap you find in
standard English tea bags (which are at least better than the German
bags, of course).

> The English cook was as likely to select it for
> the grocer's brand as they were for some far-off geography. The tea
> itself would be measured with a tea-spoon or caddy-spoon. Not the slim
> stirrer of the serving tray, this is a near-circular shallow measuring
> spoon. Frequently they'd be decorated with a thistle as a handle
> (Scottish themes were always popular in England, so long as they
> didn't involve actual Scots) or some other enamelled gewgaw as a
> momento of some early-wedded holiday in Aberystwyth.

I saw photos of such spoons on the web (seems to be nice collector's
stuff today). But I suppose, it brings the same amount of tea in the
pot as a normal modern tea spoon, doesn't it?

> There was one golden rule for tea measuring; one per cup, and one for
> the pot. If poverty tightened your caddy, then you used a smaller
> spoon - but there was always one for the pot.

By the way, it seems then, that English tea making meens also to brew
a much stronger tea than (nowadays) on the continent. We use
(depending on the tea) 12 to 13 gr. tea per litre water (for some
Darjeeling often only 10 gr.) to brew our tea (with 2 to 3 minutes of
infusion time). With "one spoon for each cup and one extra for the
pot" it has to be at least about 7 or even 8 spoons per litre, which
must be about 17,5 gr. to 20 gr. tea per litre water?!

> Whilst still boiling, the tea would be "wetted" from the kettle and
> the teapot placed on the table.

So, it is true that the tea leafes were in the pot all the time.
Today we strain the tea completely into another (serving) tea pot
after the convenient infusion time (or we even use permanent tea
infusers which are removed from the pot when the tea is ready).

[...]
>
> Strainers are rarely used, only when indulging in posh tea. After all,
> how would one read other's fortunes without the leaves ?

That's true, but to me it seems a little bit odd (not to say a kind of
distgusting to imagine having tea leafes in the mouth).

> I understand that in Georgian times, polite society allowed tea to be
> sipped from the saucer. By the mid-20th century this was still
> practiced, but only by the uncouth. Toothless crones might even do it
> into the '70s, even practicing such bizarre habits as mixing it with
> Epsom salts or Andrews liver salts. Now it's just a term of disdain
> for in-laws who are rustic farmers.

I Don't understand that? sipping from the sauer? Does this mean, you
put tea out of your cup onto the saucer and drink it from it then?
Why??? That's a strange thing!

>
> After drinking the first cup, the pot is frequently topped up. However
> an empty pot is _never_ refilled, once emptied. The tea remains quite
> drinkable by this technique, the pot retains heat and the unstirred
> leaves sit at the bottom of the pot and don't brew enough to become
> bitter.

That is also a point I don't understand. So, you put tea into a pot,
add boiling water, let the tea infuse for let's say for 3 minutes and
then you pour out the tea into the cups (with this, some tea leafes go
into the cups, maybe a strainer, and are not replaced in the pot)? BUT
at this time, the pot isn't empty? It is, let's say, just half-empty?
And then, you add hot water to fill the pot up again (and you let the
tea infuse again for 3 minutes?)? And know you empty the pot
completely or do you add some more water after each time, the pot gets
half-empty? I still can't imagine, how this tea tastes then? I imagine
it tasting like a second infusion, which is quite disgusting ... and:
I also can't imagine, that there is not a point at which the tea gets
very bitter -- at least, the last cup must be?!

> An over-aged pot is described as "stewed". Traditionally stewing is
> determined by the precise moment at which tardy men return from the
> mill, foundry or pit bottom, too late for the tea which was announced
> hours ago (7.5 minutes is the usual metric equivalent unit to the
> "hours").

After an infusion of 7.5 minutes, the tea is stewed? So, referring to
the practice decribed above, Emglish tea is / was always stewed tea?

[...]

On 22 Jan 2004 04:00:31 -0800, (Dieter Folz) wrote:

>Are there such traditional blends today?

Yes. You'd better ask those in the tea trade around here what's in
them, but the British are much more likely to buy a regular brand of
tea on the basis of a brand name, or shop's name.

At least one of these brands (Taylor's) makes a virtue of selling
different blends in different regions, to account for water
differences - yet the box barely mentions which one you have, or
what's in it. Nice tea though - it's my regular.

If you go to a traditional tea and coffee seller, like Pumphrey's
(Grainger market, Newcastle) then you'll see a range of teas
identified by location and type. In a grocer's though, the most you're
likely to see is either "breakfast blend" or "red label" and "blue
label" (you'd have to taste both to establish your preference).

The tea market is being shaken up a little by the TradeFair movement.
In parallel with this, we're also starting to see some single estate
teas. They're worth trying <www.clipper-teas.com>


>I saw photos of such spoons on the web (seems to be nice collector's
>stuff today). But I suppose, it brings the same amount of tea in the
>pot as a normal modern tea spoon, doesn't it?

They're much bigger - usually the diameter is a little bigger than the
length of a teaspoon bowl, but they're shallow and not heaped highly.
The amount is about one heaped teaspoon.

>must be about 17,5 gr. to 20 gr. tea per litre water?!

I've no idea what "grams" of tea look like, or how they relate to my
own eyeball measures. But we certainly make our tea quite strong.

>So, it is true that the tea leafes were in the pot all the time.

Yes, very much so. Careful pouring keeps them in the pot. Careful
drinking keeps them out of your mouth (it's polite to not drain a cup
of tea)

>(or we even use permanent tea
>infusers which are removed from the pot when the tea is ready).

I have a glass Bodum pot with one of those. I never use it.


>I Don't understand that? sipping from the sauer? Does this mean, you
>put tea out of your cup onto the saucer and drink it from it then?

In Georgian times, I believe that "saucer" meant something larger and
used without a cup. It was like a Scottish tassie, or the French
morning coffee bowl.

I think the coarse use of saucers gets a mention in Dickens somewhere.
They're the English equivalent of Mason jars in Kentucky 8-)


>> After drinking the first cup, the pot is frequently topped up. However
>> an empty pot is _never_ refilled, once emptied.

A pot is usually sized to serve two cups to everyone around the table.
After serving the first one (pot half full) it's left for a while,
then later the kettle is reboiled and the pot topped up. Shortly
afterwards a second cup is poured. Some time later, there's a third
cup for thoe who want it.

It would be unusual to pour the second cup before refilling. The tea
is over-strong at this point and needs dilution, but it's not so
stewed or over-brewed that it's not drinkable.

The tea certainly doesn't taste like leaves that are brewed, drained,
then brewed again. I think the key is that leaves only brew
effectively when they're swirling freely in plenty of water. A pot
that's half-drained and left to sit has the leaves settle out and they
stop brewing.


>After an infusion of 7.5 minutes, the tea is stewed?

I'm joking a little here. The question of whether the tea is stewed
or not is a traditional way of chivvying along those who are slow when
called to the table.



--
Die Gotterspammerung - Junkmail of the Gods

Andy Dingley > writes:

> [...various English tea issues...]
>
> I think the coarse use of saucers gets a mention in Dickens somewhere.
> They're the English equivalent of Mason jars in Kentucky 8-)

Perhaps this isn't known east of the Atlantic, but Mason jars are well
known in Brooklyn tea circles. Whether this antedates jarrage in
Kentucky is, I believe, presently unknown.

/Lew
---
Lew Perin /
http://www.panix.com/~perin/babelcarp.html

Andy Dingley > wrote in message >. ..
> On 22 Jan 2004 04:00:31 -0800, (Dieter Folz) wrote:

> >I Don't understand that? sipping from the sauer? Does this mean, you
> >put tea out of your cup onto the saucer and drink it from it then?
>
> In Georgian times, I believe that "saucer" meant something larger and
> used without a cup. It was like a Scottish tassie, or the French
> morning coffee bowl.

Well, I just learned, that in the bourgeois-philitinistic German
Biedermeier (1815?1848), it was very "posh" and common in those
bourgeois circles (during a "Theegesellschaft"), to drop the hot tea
from the cup onto the saucer and then sip the tea from it.

Lewis Perin > wrote :
> Andy Dingley > writes:
> > I'm surprised that I seem to be the only Brit-resident Brit around
> > here.
>
> You aren't, but I don't believe in outing people, so I won't say who
> it is. By the way, welcome aboard!

Indeed, Andy. From a sometime Pumphrey's- (and Lagavulin- ) drinking
geordie, a somewhat belated "welcome to the group!"

"The Immoral Mr Teas" > wrote in message om...
> Lewis Perin > wrote :
> > Andy Dingley > writes:
> > > I'm surprised that I seem to be the only Brit-resident Brit around
> > > here.
> >
> > You aren't, but I don't believe in outing people, so I won't say who
> > it is. By the way, welcome aboard!
>
> Indeed, Andy. From a sometime Pumphrey's- (and Lagavulin- ) drinking
> geordie, a somewhat belated "welcome to the group!"

I am also a born to tea drinking Englishman.
--
Dave Croft
Warrington
England