In article >,
Cheryl Perkins > wrote:

> I suppose you can lobby your government for a universal system - one which
> pays out regardless of the recipient's financial resources. Countries
> tend to have to social systems that they can more or less afford and
> which are designed according to what most of the citizens will, more or
> less, support.

This is not actually true. Look at the pension problems in Europe
and the Social Security problems in the US. Neither culture can afford
it or sustain it, primarily because there are fewer than one fifteenth
of the workers per pensioner than there were forty years ago. We aren't
producing enough workers (children) to sustain these programs.

Regards,
Ranee

Remove do not & spam to e-mail me.

"She seeks wool and flax, and works with willing hands." Prov 31:13

http://arabianknits.blogspot.com/
http://talesfromthekitchen.blogspot.com/

Ranee Mueller > wrote in
:

> I don't
> think anyone asked that welfare/food stamps be eradicated, but
> that there be limits on what can be bought and that there be a
> means to help those who can work or gain better employment to do
> so, as a way to get them off welfare.

Hate to be bothersome, but *I* didn't say that. I said people who need
help should receive help, period. In fact, I went as far as to propose
a solution (not a popular one here, but luckily rfc isn't a clutch of
decision-makers so it hardly matters) which would see everyone receive
non-taxable guaranteed monthly income. Those not wishing to work would
not be sujected to the overweening opprobrium of the more fuss-budget
minded members of society.

--

"When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why
the poor have no food, they call me a communist."

Dom Helder Camara

In article >,
(Meghan Noecker) wrote:

> On Tue, 21 Mar 2006 12:24:21 GMT, Orlando Enrique Fiol
> > wrote:
>
> >next to none. It's convenient for the middle class to gripe about how
> >food stamps are used, but I see few people offering to care for poor
> >children so their parents can work or voluntarily contributing to
> >medical care funds.
>
>
> Well, if the welfare system paid for the childcare instead of the food
> stamps, the parents could work and earn more than they would have
> received in food stamps. Everybody would benefit.

It did, at least in OK. If I had left my son in daycare, even if I
wasn't working, I would have had it paid for, but by being at home, it
was just food stamps.


> GIve them childcare, help with transportation, and job training. Not
> just a free handout, but actual help in getting off the system.

There is childcare money, and some places do have job training, but
they don't require the job training, and most places don't use them
nearly enough.

> And verifiy that people who are on the system actually need that help.
> Tons of people can beat the system by claiming to be a single parent
> while living with somebody who works full time. If they get married,
> they lose the welfare, so they keep quiet and take the extra money.
>
> The system is really good at keep people on the system.

This is absolutely true. They try to keep you on, even when you are
ready to stand on your own two feet.

Regards,
Ranee

Remove do not & spam to e-mail me.

"She seeks wool and flax, and works with willing hands." Prov 31:13

http://arabianknits.blogspot.com/
http://talesfromthekitchen.blogspot.com/

In article >,
Orlando Enrique Fiol > wrote:

> wrote:
> > They don't have a knife, a frying pan and a saucepan? Because that's
> >all you _really_ need. If they have microwaves to reheat burritos, I
> >bet they have the others.
>
> I bet you don't cook with just a knife and frying pan. One needs
> spices, vinegar, some canned goods and various types of frying, roasting
> and baking pans in order to cook a variety of dishes.

But you don't need them right away to start making food to feed your
family. Spices, vinegar, canned foods would all be included in the food
stamps, btw.

Regards,
Ranee

Remove do not & spam to e-mail me.

"She seeks wool and flax, and works with willing hands." Prov 31:13

http://arabianknits.blogspot.com/
http://talesfromthekitchen.blogspot.com/

In article >,
(Glitter Ninja) wrote:

> "jmcquown" > writes:
>
> >I agree, Ranee. Even kids in a college dorm with a hot plate have a pan or
> >two.
>
> Come on, Jill! If they can afford college then of COURSE they can
> afford kitchenware!

Why do you assume that? Maybe they are there on loans and grants.
Maybe they are working three part time jobs to be broke, like I was.
Maybe they work one term and go to school one term, to pay tuition, as a
lot of my friends did in school. Maybe their parents aren't helping
them with it, like my parents didn't.

Regards,
Ranee

Remove do not & spam to e-mail me.

"She seeks wool and flax, and works with willing hands." Prov 31:13

http://arabianknits.blogspot.com/
http://talesfromthekitchen.blogspot.com/

In article >,
~patches~ > wrote:

> But they aren't spending someone else's money. They are spending what
> the govenment give them to which they are entitled. If you don't agree,
> change the government <shrug> And don't assume everyone here is
> American with American values. I have no idea what food stamps are and
> really don't have the inkling to go searching.

Government money comes from the people, who work and pay taxes, not
some government fairy. As for food stamps, it is what started this
discussion, a friend who was buying junk with food stamps. They are a
welfare payment that is allotted to purchase food.

Regards,
Ranee

Remove do not & spam to e-mail me.

"She seeks wool and flax, and works with willing hands." Prov 31:13

http://arabianknits.blogspot.com/
http://talesfromthekitchen.blogspot.com/

In article >,
Siobhan Perricone > wrote:

> On Sun, 19 Mar 2006 13:47:29 -0500, Dave Smith >
> wrote:
>
> >Glitter Ninja wrote:
> >
> >> This is true.
> >> I dunno, I know most of you are really nice people, but what I'm
> >> seeing in this thread is scary. Do most of you honestly not realize
> >> there are people out there who have had such a bad life that they never
> >> went to school, didn't learn how to read or maybe can't read, struggle
> >> daily, have no money, and no they really DON'T have a frying pan?
> >
> >Sadly, many of us know people who are quite content to sit back and let
> >society
> >pay their way. I knew a family where both parents were university educated
> >(claimed to be), living on welfare
> The problem is in assuming that these cases are the norm, rather than
> exceptions.

They are a much larger exception than you would like to admit, and
they abuse the system to such a large degree that it costs more than the
remainder who don't abuse the system by a significant margin. It is
that to which many of us, including people like me who have had to use
the system, object.

Regards,
Ranee

Remove do not & spam to e-mail me.

"She seeks wool and flax, and works with willing hands." Prov 31:13

http://arabianknits.blogspot.com/
http://talesfromthekitchen.blogspot.com/

In article >,
Ranee Mueller > wrote:

> In article >,
> OmManiPadmeOmelet > wrote:
>
> > I've seen households tho' where every surface in the kitchen was piled
> > with dirty pots, pans, plates etc. :-P Here in Texas, that would be
> > inviting a major cockroach invasion!
>
> You don't want to know the kind of filth you'd have to live in here
> to get cockroaches. I was so grossed out at the cockroaches in OK. It
> was foreign to me that these things could just live there, regardless of
> the state of cleanliness of the home.
>
> Regards,
> Ranee

No matter how clean I keep things, I still see one from time to time
especially in the summer when it gets hot and dry. They come in looking
for water.

The cats love them... and I don't often see live ones. The cats get to
them before I do. ;-) I find dead ones, or pieces if they eat them.

The roaches here are the palmetto roaches. Average is about 30mm (1.5")

GODS I Hate those things! I'll stun them with a fly swatter, then pick
them up with toilet paper and flush them.

Squishing them makes the most disgusting mess you could imagine.
--
Peace, Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-bitch." -Jack Nicholson

In article >,
Christine Dabney > wrote:

> I have often tried to keep my food expenditures within such an alloted
> range, since the time I had to use food stamps. It is a
> challenge...especially in areas where there isn't abundant good cheap
> produce and such. I usually set my food budget for the allotment
> amount......
>
> When I was on food stamps, I was in Kentucky, and it was barely spring
> and hard to find anything really cheap. We didn't have anything like
> Grocery Outlets, or other places to get groceries really cheap.
>
> Just curious as to how many of you would do...

When we were on it, it was $375 (about, it was some weird number with
cents), and that was for two adults and an infant. It didn't include
paper supplies, hygiene supplies, cleaning supplies. We now spend about
$500, more around November, December and Easter, a month, including
those things, for six people.

Regards,
Ranee

Remove do not & spam to e-mail me.

"She seeks wool and flax, and works with willing hands." Prov 31:13

http://arabianknits.blogspot.com/
http://talesfromthekitchen.blogspot.com/

In article 9>,
Wayne Boatwright <wayneboatwright_at_gmail.com> wrote:

> I agree that the eligible income for food stamp assistance is too low to get
> by on unless you have no house payment or rent to pay. It barely allows for
> necessities.

Unless AZ is different, they usually subtract things like housing
payments from your income when figuring it.

Regards,
Ranee

Remove do not & spam to e-mail me.

"She seeks wool and flax, and works with willing hands." Prov 31:13

http://arabianknits.blogspot.com/
http://talesfromthekitchen.blogspot.com/

Ranee Mueller > wrote in
:

> The medical system is a pain, but is an emergency back up thing
> that is good. It doesn't have the wait times that Canadian and
> British health systems do, but that is because they contract
> through insurance companies, rather than letting the state run it
> independently.

Gosh I wish you hadn't pushed this to the level of innuendo. Waiting
times for emergency in Canadian hospitals is fine, as a recent report
from the Canadian Society of Respiratory Therapists points out.

http://www.csrt.com/e_news.php?display&318&item

Delays *may* occur when people need surgery for non life-threatening
illness or conditions. Part of the reason for this is that the US is
stealing away our surgeons because you don't have enough of them. So
if we experience shortages in certain types of surgery, all I can say
is, look in the mirror to see who's the guilty party here.

I went in Dec. 27, 2003, around noon with a heart attack and was
sitting in recovery within three hours of walking into the hospital.
That included diagnostic and a catheterization from my own
cardiologist, and some blood and ECG tests. I received the second
needed catheterization four days later, again from my cardiologist.
The entire cost of my hospital stay to me was 16,95$ for the rental
of a phone. The Ontario Health Insurance Plan paid for the rest.

I walked out of the hospital on my own two feet Dec. 31 and have not
experienced any recurrence of angina or any other symptom of cardiac
difficulty. The last time I had an annual checkup (a month ago), my
cardiologist (a highly reputed cardiologist, I might add) said he
didn't feel it was necessary to see me for two years, my recovery has
been that good. I rejoice in mentioning this because I know it frosts
Wolfie's reproductive nodes something fierce :-)

Our neighbour was hospitalized two weeks ago because of the worsening
of a brain tumour. She was seen to immediately, operated on as soon
as her condition became stable (a week later), and is now recovering
very well.

So given that my experience, the experience of a neighbour and an
organization of health specialists say the contrary, tell me...where
do you get this false information?

--

"When I give food to the poor, they call me a saint. When I ask why
the poor have no food, they call me a communist."

Dom Helder Camara

In article >,
(Meghan Noecker) wrote:

> Right now, she is calling dentists looking for one that will fix her
> tooth. The new plan does not cover dental work, and she has a crown
> that has come loose. She is using orajel to keep the pain down. She
> went to a dentist toda and needs a root canal.

I think you said you lived in W. Washington. Please email me:
raneem at harbornet dot com, if your parents live anywhere near Tacoma,
or if you can get them there. I know of a dental place there that is
very affordable, and works with people who don't have insurance or whose
insurance doesn't cover what they need done.

Regards,
Ranee

Remove do not & spam to e-mail me.

"She seeks wool and flax, and works with willing hands." Prov 31:13

http://arabianknits.blogspot.com/
http://talesfromthekitchen.blogspot.com/

"Dave Smith" > wrote in message
...
> Dave Smith wrote:
>
>>> Exactly; I neglected to mention liability insurance and a business
>>> license.
>>jmcquown wrote:
>
>>
>> > It depends on the way you offer the service. I would think that if
>> > you were hired to cook in the house the liability lies with the home
>> > owner.
>>
>> I'm going with the premise Michael (Archon) posed, which is to be a cook
>> for
>> hire on demand. Contrary to CSI (crime scene investivation) or old Perry
>> Mason episodes, very few people hire people like this. If you are going
>> to
>> cook for someone and you don't live in the household home you have to
>> have
>> liability insurance and a business license.
>
> That's why I suggested that it depends on the way you word your service.
> Make
> sure that you are an employee of the home owners so that the insurance
> liability
> is theirs.
>
Better see a tax accountant on that one, this is a very iffy area.
Janet

jmcquown wrote:

> Dave Smith wrote:
>
>>jmcquown wrote:
>>
>>
>>>>You'd also probably also have insurance/liability costs doing
>>>>something like this...and a whole range of other costs.
>>>
>>>Exactly; I neglected to mention liability insurance and a business
>>>license.
>>
>>It depends on the way you offer the service. I would think that if
>>you were hired to cook in the house the liability lies with the home
>>owner.
>
>
> I'm going with the premise Michael (Archon) posed, which is to be a cook for
> hire on demand. Contrary to CSI (crime scene investivation) or old Perry
> Mason episodes, very few people hire people like this. If you are going to
> cook for someone and you don't live in the household home you have to have
> liability insurance and a business license.
>
> Jill
>
>

If you are taking this food into someone else's home, I would be
concerned about their insurance coverage as well. What if you had a
slip and fall on their property or burnt yourself severely on their
stove? I would also be concerned about their equipment if I were making
anything in their home. Running this as a business could be problematic
but doable. I know from foodtv that people have made this type of
business successful but I would like to be a fly on the wall when they
are talking to their bankers, building the business, dealing with
unreasonable clients, etc. It certainly wouldn't be all fun and games!

In article >,
~patches~ > wrote:

> Ok, still trying to wrap my head around this one. So how can anyone
> look in someones grocery cart then see the card and determine they are
> on assistance or not and especially given that someone could have one of
> those cards without being on assistance?

The card _is_ assistance. It just isn't a direct payment of cash.

Regards,
Ranee

Remove do not & spam to e-mail me.

"She seeks wool and flax, and works with willing hands." Prov 31:13

http://arabianknits.blogspot.com/
http://talesfromthekitchen.blogspot.com/

OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:

> The thread that refused to die...... <lol>
> Well done Kili! ;-D

It sure has been an interesting and educational thread. As long as
Kili's friend doesn't know her online nym, Kili could discretely point
her to the thread. It might be an eye opening experience for her

"Ranee Mueller" > wrote in message
...
> In article >,
> ~patches~ > wrote:
>
>> But they aren't spending someone else's money. They are spending what
>> the govenment give them to which they are entitled. If you don't agree,
>> change the government <shrug> And don't assume everyone here is
>> American with American values. I have no idea what food stamps are and
>> really don't have the inkling to go searching.
>
> Government money comes from the people, who work and pay taxes, not
> some government fairy. As for food stamps, it is what started this
> discussion, a friend who was buying junk with food stamps. They are a
> welfare payment that is allotted to purchase food.
>
> Regards,
> Ranee
The government is also spending your money when it pays for Homeland
Security and FEMA. Those two outfits wasted money hand over fist and to
little purpose. I hope you are equally indignant about such waste of funds
that are intended to benefit you. Don't be sidetracked by those on welfare
assistance buying soda pop -- greater waste and a larger portion of your tax
dollar is elsewhere.
Janet

Ranee Mueller wrote:

> In article >,
> Dave Smith > wrote:
>
>
>>I don't have a problem helping to feed the poor. My problem is with a system
>>that perpetuates a reliance on welfare.
>
>
> Exactly. I haven't read all the posts in this thread, but I don't
> think anyone asked that welfare/food stamps be eradicated, but that
> there be limits on what can be bought and that there be a means to help
> those who can work or gain better employment to do so, as a way to get
> them off welfare.
>

One argument against dictating the types of food people on welfare can
buy is this is against their right to eat as they choose. It's like
saying ok we will help you buy food but it must be healthy. The problem
with this is other resources are not in place to ensure this would
actually work. Others have argued that their food choices are making
them sick so in the end the cost society more with increased medical
costs. I'm all for encouraging someone to eat healthy foods but not by
force or threat.

> Regards,
> Ranee
>
> Remove do not & spam to e-mail me.
>
> "She seeks wool and flax, and works with willing hands." Prov 31:13
>
> http://arabianknits.blogspot.com/
> http://talesfromthekitchen.blogspot.com/

In article >,
Siobhan Perricone > wrote:

> And do you all bitch and moan, and shriek when the rich person buys caviar
> with their social security check? Or the oil companies take a tax break
> they get from our government and use it to build a new facility in another
> country and fire 500 workers in the US.

I would like more accountability in all welfare, yes. And, I would
like a reduction in all of it.

> It's so easy to kick the poor.

You conveniently ignore that some of us who disagree with you _are_
poor, and have been extremely poor.

Ranee

Remove do not & spam to e-mail me.

"She seeks wool and flax, and works with willing hands." Prov 31:13

http://arabianknits.blogspot.com/
http://talesfromthekitchen.blogspot.com/

In article >,
Wayne Boatwright <wayneboatwright_at_gmail.com> wrote:

> And even if they did, so what? Collecting social security and having a
> pension is not the same as being on the public dole. They earned that
> money. OTOH, there are a lot of people on public assistance (at least in
> AZ) that have earned next to nothing their entire life.

That is true. I do know of a woman, a neighbor of ours when I was a
kid, who had other means of retirement income and tried to return her SS
to the government in hopes it could be used for people who were really
poor. They told her that it couldn't be redistributed, and would just
be swallowed up by the government. So, she kept taking her check.

Regards,
Ranee

Remove do not & spam to e-mail me.

"She seeks wool and flax, and works with willing hands." Prov 31:13

http://arabianknits.blogspot.com/
http://talesfromthekitchen.blogspot.com/

In article >,
Siobhan Perricone > wrote:

> Don't give me stories about how things were during the depression or "My
> father walked to school fifty miles a day with a hot potato in his pocket,
> and he was glad to have it". Poverty even twenty years ago is nothing like
> poverty today. With the urbanization of our society, the options available
> to the poor are much much smaller than they were twenty or thirty years
> ago. There are also a lot more poor scrapping and competing for fewer
> low-skill jobs that don't pay anything like a livable wage. Most of the
> jobs that were traditionally done by poorly skilled, lower class workers
> have been moved overseas. And other jobs that they might take that are
> more back breaking are being done by illegal migrant workers (who are being
> horrifically exploited by being barely paid enough to stay alive, and who
> are one illness from dying in a ditch somewhere, unmourned).

And yet so many people think that enforcing our illegal alien laws is
cruelty.

It is much easier to be poor in rural and semi-rural areas. Your
money goes farther, people know each other, there are farms, there
aren't as many costs. People could move 50 miles and do much better,
but it is easier to deal with the devil you know.

Regards,
Ranee

Remove do not & spam to e-mail me.

"She seeks wool and flax, and works with willing hands." Prov 31:13

http://arabianknits.blogspot.com/
http://talesfromthekitchen.blogspot.com/

Cheryl Perkins wrote:

> Meghan Noecker > wrote:
>
> > If you don't work, your employer doesn't pay you. They can even fire
> > you if your work isn't up to standard.
>
> > Not so with the government,. They can waste it all, and we still have
> > to pay. There is very little accountability.
>
> You can fire them at the next election.


Unless the election is stolen like the last two US Presidential elections
were :-(

--
Best
Greg

In article >,
Dave Smith > wrote:

> But Jill, some would argue that they shouldn't have to eat a cheap old pot
> roast just because they were on welfare. Let them eat steak like everyone
> else, and neglecting the fact that most families with kids can't afford steak.

We don't even eat hamburgers. It is far more cost effective to use
ground beef as an ingredient than to eat large chunks of it. We can
feed our whole family with a pound of ground beef, instead of needing
two pounds for hamburgers.

Regards,
Ranee

Remove do not & spam to e-mail me.

"She seeks wool and flax, and works with willing hands." Prov 31:13

http://arabianknits.blogspot.com/
http://talesfromthekitchen.blogspot.com/

In article >,
Dave Smith > wrote:

> Man of the people on the streets are the same who used to be in those mental
> health facilities.

And we did away with those facilities here, because it infringed on
the rights and privacy of those people. So, now they are far better off
on the streets, going hungry. Way to go.

Regards,
Ranee

Remove do not & spam to e-mail me.

"She seeks wool and flax, and works with willing hands." Prov 31:13

http://arabianknits.blogspot.com/
http://talesfromthekitchen.blogspot.com/

In article >,
~patches~ > wrote:

> They brought up the issue that in inner cities actual grocery stores are
> almost non-existent yet there was an abundance of fast food places and
> variety stores.

And the reason is largely theft.

Regards,
Ranee

Remove do not & spam to e-mail me.

"She seeks wool and flax, and works with willing hands." Prov 31:13

http://arabianknits.blogspot.com/
http://talesfromthekitchen.blogspot.com/

In article >,
"Jen" > wrote:

> I truly believe he had a very low self esteem.

Most people have too high a self esteem. I'd rather people worried
about their self-respect and self-worth.

Regards,
Ranee

Remove do not & spam to e-mail me.

"She seeks wool and flax, and works with willing hands." Prov 31:13

http://arabianknits.blogspot.com/
http://talesfromthekitchen.blogspot.com/

In article >,
Siobhan Perricone > wrote:

> Your personal experiences, while valid, are not the only things out there.
> Social security is paid to rich people, too. Rich people who own their own
> business. Rich people with yachts, servants, and more money than is good
> for them.

Rich people who paid quite a bit into that system. They are
receiving their money back. Which is more than will happen for me and
for my children.

If we had been allowed to keep that percentage of our paychecks, even
if we blew it on lottery tickets, it would have done us more good than
not getting a cent of it in 35 years.

Regards,
Ranee

Remove do not & spam to e-mail me.

"She seeks wool and flax, and works with willing hands." Prov 31:13

http://arabianknits.blogspot.com/
http://talesfromthekitchen.blogspot.com/

In article >,
Orlando Enrique Fiol > wrote:

> In more supportive societies, I would be subsidized for my art rather
> than forced to teach anyone willing to pay or take on demeaning gigs
> just to scrape by.

Yes and no. In those societies, the person paying also dictated what
kind of art he would pay for. It's not a trade off I'd make.

Regards,
Ranee

Remove do not & spam to e-mail me.

"She seeks wool and flax, and works with willing hands." Prov 31:13

http://arabianknits.blogspot.com/
http://talesfromthekitchen.blogspot.com/

In article .com>,
"Jeffs/Etc." > wrote:

> This was several years ago...but some of the things that stuck out were
> that she could buy a lot of milk (something like 6 gallons per week).
> But she could not buy fresh fruits or vegetables, and eggs were very
> sharply limited (it worked out to, I think, a dozen eggs every two
> weeks).

That sounds like WIC, not food stamps.

Regards,
Ranee

Remove do not & spam to e-mail me.

"She seeks wool and flax, and works with willing hands." Prov 31:13

http://arabianknits.blogspot.com/
http://talesfromthekitchen.blogspot.com/

Ranee Mueller wrote:

> In article >,
> (Glitter Ninja) wrote:
>
>
>>"jmcquown" > writes:
>>
>>
>>>I agree, Ranee. Even kids in a college dorm with a hot plate have a pan or
>>>two.
>>
>> Come on, Jill! If they can afford college then of COURSE they can
>>afford kitchenware!
>
>
> Why do you assume that? Maybe they are there on loans and grants.
> Maybe they are working three part time jobs to be broke, like I was.
> Maybe they work one term and go to school one term, to pay tuition, as a
> lot of my friends did in school. Maybe their parents aren't helping
> them with it, like my parents didn't.
>

A lot of parents help set their kids up with cooking equipment, furiture
if necessary, and food when they go off to university. BTDTHTTS several
times. Not all parents can or will help their kids though. Grants and
loans allow some kids go to university when their parents could never
afford to send them. With any luck scholarships and bursaries also help
but there's no guarantee of either. I sure wouldn't assume that just
because they are at university they can afford anything. Some have a
hard enough time getting the money up for textbooks.

> Regards,
> Ranee
>
> Remove do not & spam to e-mail me.
>
> "She seeks wool and flax, and works with willing hands." Prov 31:13
>
> http://arabianknits.blogspot.com/
> http://talesfromthekitchen.blogspot.com/

Michel Boucher wrote:

> Gosh I wish you hadn't pushed this to the level of innuendo. Waiting
> times for emergency in Canadian hospitals is fine, as a recent report
> from the Canadian Society of Respiratory Therapists points out.
>
> http://www.csrt.com/e_news.php?display&318&item
>
> Delays *may* occur when people need surgery for non life-threatening
> illness or conditions. Part of the reason for this is that the US is
> stealing away our surgeons because you don't have enough of them. So
> if we experience shortages in certain types of surgery, all I can say
> is, look in the mirror to see who's the guilty party here.
>
> I went in Dec. 27, 2003, around noon with a heart attack and was
> sitting in recovery within three hours of walking into the hospital.
> That included diagnostic and a catheterization from my own
> cardiologist, and some blood and ECG tests.

I was on the ER last summer after slicing my finger to the bone while
cutting an avocado ( please don't drink and cook). I was out in and out
with and hour and a half and it cost me nothing. Three years go I went
in on a Monday evening with a broken collar bone. I was in and out
within an hour and a half, had Xrays, say a doctor.... he was nice enough
to confirm my diagnosis, prescribed some painkillers. I had to pay for
the prescription but was reimbursed by the insurance company, and ER
visit cost nothing.

In article >,
Dave Smith > wrote:

> OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:
>
> > The thread that refused to die...... <lol>
> > Well done Kili! ;-D
> > --
> > Peace, Om.
>
> It has morphed into sub threads. Only the header remains the same.
>

I'm fixin' to killfile it now after I post this reply. ;-)
Enough is enough, and it's gotten boring and is taking up too much
screen space.

Oh well!
--
Peace, Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-bitch." -Jack Nicholson

In article >,
~patches~ > wrote:

> OmManiPadmeOmelet wrote:
>
> > The thread that refused to die...... <lol>
> > Well done Kili! ;-D
>
> It sure has been an interesting and educational thread. As long as
> Kili's friend doesn't know her online nym, Kili could discretely point
> her to the thread. It might be an eye opening experience for her

Maybe, maybe not. ;-)

If anyone answers me in this thread anymore, sorry, it's going into the
killfile so I won't see anymore replies...

Just as soon as I finish what is currently "up".
--
Peace, Om.

"My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-bitch." -Jack Nicholson

~patches~ wrote:

>
> One argument against dictating the types of food people on welfare can
> buy is this is against their right to eat as they choose.

Do your children have that "right" too? My son didn't. He was given proper food
and was not allowed junk food. I never bought it. He did not have enough money of
his own to buy it. Coincidentally, neither do people on welfare.

Ranee Mueller wrote:
> In article >,
> Siobhan Perricone > wrote:
>
>> And do you all bitch and moan, and shriek when the rich person buys
>> caviar with their social security check? Or the oil companies take a
>> tax break they get from our government and use it to build a new
>> facility in another country and fire 500 workers in the US.
>
> I would like more accountability in all welfare, yes. And, I would
> like a reduction in all of it.
>
>> It's so easy to kick the poor.
>
> You conveniently ignore that some of us who disagree with you _are_
> poor, and have been extremely poor.
>
> Ranee

I'm with you, Ranee. I know you didn't abuse your use of food stamps to buy
cookies and soda pop and stuff like that. You are to be applauded for that,
truly. And I'm very glad you were able to take advantage of the food stamps
system to feed yourself with your husband and your (then) one child. You
are the (god I hate to say this) "type" the U.S. system was designed to
help.

Jill

On Fri, 24 Mar 2006, Ranee Mueller wrote:

> In article >,
> Christine Dabney > wrote:
>
>> I have often tried to keep my food expenditures within such an alloted
>> range, since the time I had to use food stamps. It is a
>> challenge...especially in areas where there isn't abundant good cheap
>> produce and such. I usually set my food budget for the allotment
>> amount......
>>
>> When I was on food stamps, I was in Kentucky, and it was barely spring
>> and hard to find anything really cheap. We didn't have anything like
>> Grocery Outlets, or other places to get groceries really cheap.
>>
>> Just curious as to how many of you would do...
>
> When we were on it, it was $375 (about, it was some weird number with
> cents), and that was for two adults and an infant. It didn't include
> paper supplies, hygiene supplies, cleaning supplies. We now spend about
> $500, more around November, December and Easter, a month, including
> those things, for six people.

$80 a month, plus coupons when i was on food stamps. entirely too much,
imho. But then again, the amount of fresh produce i bought was about nil.
still is, truth be told.

lena

On Fri, 24 Mar 2006, Janet Bostwick wrote:

>
> "Ranee Mueller" > wrote in message
> ...
>> In article >,
>> ~patches~ > wrote:
>>
>>> But they aren't spending someone else's money. They are spending what
>>> the govenment give them to which they are entitled. If you don't agree,
>>> change the government <shrug> And don't assume everyone here is
>>> American with American values. I have no idea what food stamps are and
>>> really don't have the inkling to go searching.
>>
>> Government money comes from the people, who work and pay taxes, not
>> some government fairy. As for food stamps, it is what started this
>> discussion, a friend who was buying junk with food stamps. They are a
>> welfare payment that is allotted to purchase food.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Ranee
> The government is also spending your money when it pays for Homeland
> Security and FEMA. Those two outfits wasted money hand over fist and to
> little purpose.

Homeland security has a very directed purpose. I just happen to disagree
with it.

lena

On Fri, 24 Mar 2006, ~patches~ wrote:

> Ranee Mueller wrote:
>
>> In article >,
>> Dave Smith > wrote:
>>
>>
>>> I don't have a problem helping to feed the poor. My problem is with a
>>> system
>>> that perpetuates a reliance on welfare.
>>
>>
>> Exactly. I haven't read all the posts in this thread, but I don't
>> think anyone asked that welfare/food stamps be eradicated, but that there
>> be limits on what can be bought and that there be a means to help those
>> who can work or gain better employment to do so, as a way to get them off
>> welfare.
>
> One argument against dictating the types of food people on welfare can buy is
> this is against their right to eat as they choose. It's like saying ok we
> will help you buy food but it must be healthy. The problem with this is
> other resources are not in place to ensure this would actually work. Others
> have argued that their food choices are making them sick so in the end the
> cost society more with increased medical costs. I'm all for encouraging
> someone to eat healthy foods but not by force or threat.

I'm all for encouraging people to eat right. I just happen to disagree
with most nutritionists -- whose main goal is to get fat people to slim
down, not to actually get people to eat healthily.

Lena

On Fri, 24 Mar 2006, Ranee Mueller wrote:

> In article >,
> Siobhan Perricone > wrote:
>
>> And do you all bitch and moan, and shriek when the rich person buys caviar
>> with their social security check? Or the oil companies take a tax break
>> they get from our government and use it to build a new facility in another
>> country and fire 500 workers in the US.
>
> I would like more accountability in all welfare, yes. And, I would
> like a reduction in all of it.

now that's just stupid. last i checked, folks couldn't _live_ on welfare
in NYC (yes, i've got the citation somwhere...)

lena

Ranee Mueller wrote:

> In article >,
> ~patches~ > wrote:
>
>
>>They brought up the issue that in inner cities actual grocery stores are
>>almost non-existent yet there was an abundance of fast food places and
>>variety stores.
>
>
> And the reason is largely theft.

I would think there are other factors at play as well such as high real
estate costs and delivery vehicle restrictions.