G'day mates,

My "traditional" salad (i.e. the only one I ever make for myself)
consists of chopped lettuce (strips about... lemme see, better
translate... 3/8" to 1/2" wide by 1/2" to 1" long, cut with a knife)
and the other usual ingredients for a tossed salad (chopped tomato and
onion, grated carrot, diced spuds, sometimes chopped hard boiled eggs,
and so on). So when someone says to use "torn lettuce" I'm left
wondering how much it should be torn.

The question arose with that recent recipe for New Orleans Grapefruit
Salad posted by Victor a couple of weeks back. It says to use "1 head
iceberg lettuce, washed, trimmed, and torn". (The fragments are then
used as a bed for the grapefruit segments on individual serving
plates.)

I realise it probably doesn't matter a tinker's damn how much it's
torn within wide limits; but, just in case there *is* something of an
expectation among diners of a "torn lettuce" standard, I thought I'd
better ask here. (And I checked the FAQ, Vic, but it has neither
"torn" nor "lettuce" on the page. ;-)

Cheers, Phred.

--
LID

On 2005-09-21, Phred > wrote:
> torn within wide limits; but, just in case there *is* something of an
> expectation among diners of a "torn lettuce" standard, I thought I'd
> better ask here.

Only an expectation among those whose sphincter is clenched clear up
to their eyebrows or have so much money and are so bored with life
they make it a point to concern themselves about that sort of thing.

nb

On Tue 20 Sep 2005 07:44:26p, Phred wrote in rec.food.cooking:

> G'day mates,
>
> My "traditional" salad (i.e. the only one I ever make for myself)
> consists of chopped lettuce (strips about... lemme see, better
> translate... 3/8" to 1/2" wide by 1/2" to 1" long, cut with a knife)
> and the other usual ingredients for a tossed salad (chopped tomato and
> onion, grated carrot, diced spuds, sometimes chopped hard boiled eggs,
> and so on). So when someone says to use "torn lettuce" I'm left
> wondering how much it should be torn.
>
> The question arose with that recent recipe for New Orleans Grapefruit
> Salad posted by Victor a couple of weeks back. It says to use "1 head
> iceberg lettuce, washed, trimmed, and torn". (The fragments are then
> used as a bed for the grapefruit segments on individual serving
> plates.)
>
> I realise it probably doesn't matter a tinker's damn how much it's
> torn within wide limits; but, just in case there *is* something of an
> expectation among diners of a "torn lettuce" standard, I thought I'd
> better ask here. (And I checked the FAQ, Vic, but it has neither
> "torn" nor "lettuce" on the page. ;-)
>
> Cheers, Phred.
>

Supposedly, tearing lettuce reduces oxidation of the edges and retards
wilting. When I tear head lettuce I tend to break it into chunks, perhaps
1 x 1-/12 inches. I tear leaf lettuces in somewhat larger pieces. IMHO,
pieces as small as you cut are too small and would be especially small if
torn rather than cut. Many people find torn lettuce more esthetically
pleasing.

--
Wayne Boatwright *¿*
____________________________________________

Not all people are annoying. Some are dead.

Wayne Boatwright wrote on 20 Sep 2005 in rec.food.cooking

> Supposedly, tearing lettuce reduces oxidation of the edges and retards
> wilting. When I tear head lettuce I tend to break it into chunks,
> perhaps 1 x 1-/12 inches. I tear leaf lettuces in somewhat larger
> pieces. IMHO, pieces as small as you cut are too small and would be
> especially small if torn rather than cut. Many people find torn
> lettuce more esthetically pleasing.
>
> --
> Wayne Boatwright *¿*
> ____________________________________________
>
> Not all people are annoying. Some are dead.
>
>

I remember Vincent Price making a Salad on Carson's The Tonight Show...I
think I remember him saying torn lettuce bleeds/bruises less.

--
The eyes are the mirrors....
But the ears...Ah the ears.
The ears keep the hat up.

On Tue 20 Sep 2005 08:59:35p, Mr Libido Incognito wrote in rec.food.cooking:

> Wayne Boatwright wrote on 20 Sep 2005 in rec.food.cooking
>
>> Supposedly, tearing lettuce reduces oxidation of the edges and retards
>> wilting. When I tear head lettuce I tend to break it into chunks,
>> perhaps 1 x 1-/12 inches. I tear leaf lettuces in somewhat larger
>> pieces. IMHO, pieces as small as you cut are too small and would be
>> especially small if torn rather than cut. Many people find torn
>> lettuce more esthetically pleasing.

> I remember Vincent Price making a Salad on Carson's The Tonight Show...I
> think I remember him saying torn lettuce bleeds/bruises less.
>

I used to have Mary and Vincent Price's Come into the Kitchen Cook Book (lost
in a fire). I enjoyed some of those recipes.

--
Wayne Boatwright *¿*
____________________________________________

Not all people are annoying. Some are dead.

Speaking of Vincent Price - enjoy this spoken word excerpt entitled
"How To Cook Small Boys"

http://www.aprilwinchell.com/multimedia/

scroll down to the "Too Weird To Classify" section near the bottom.
There's a ton of other frighteningly bad stuff here too.

On Tue 20 Sep 2005 09:16:07p, morgul the friendly drelb wrote in
rec.food.cooking:

> Speaking of Vincent Price - enjoy this spoken word excerpt entitled
> "How To Cook Small Boys"
>
> http://www.aprilwinchell.com/multimedia/
>
> scroll down to the "Too Weird To Classify" section near the bottom.
> There's a ton of other frighteningly bad stuff here too.
>
>

Great page! Thanks!

--
Wayne Boatwright *¿*
____________________________________________

Not all people are annoying. Some are dead.

On 2005-09-21, Wayne Boatwright > wrote:

> Supposedly, tearing lettuce reduces oxidation of the edges and retards
> wilting.

Horse pucky! While "tearing" gives illusion the salad is the latest
trendy organic/free range/whatever greens, the fact is most salads are
crisped in ice water and dried just prior to serving. Any salad green
can be cut, shot, or mandolined and preserved for 2-3 days in ice
water with little or no degradation and most wouldn't have a clue.
This is common practice.

nb

On Tue 20 Sep 2005 10:23:44p, notbob wrote in rec.food.cooking:

> On 2005-09-21, Wayne Boatwright > wrote:
>
>> Supposedly, tearing lettuce reduces oxidation of the edges and retards
>> wilting.
>
> Horse pucky! While "tearing" gives illusion the salad is the latest
> trendy organic/free range/whatever greens, the fact is most salads are
> crisped in ice water and dried just prior to serving. Any salad green
> can be cut, shot, or mandolined and preserved for 2-3 days in ice
> water with little or no degradation and most wouldn't have a clue.
> This is common practice.
>
> nb
>

I said "supposedly"! :-)

--
Wayne Boatwright *¿*
____________________________________________

Not all people are annoying. Some are dead.

"Wayne Boatwright" > wrote in message
...
> On Tue 20 Sep 2005 10:23:44p, notbob wrote in rec.food.cooking:
>
> > On 2005-09-21, Wayne Boatwright > wrote:
> >
> >> Supposedly, tearing lettuce reduces oxidation of the edges and retards
> >> wilting.
> >
> > Horse pucky! While "tearing" gives illusion the salad is the latest
> > trendy organic/free range/whatever greens, the fact is most salads are
> > crisped in ice water and dried just prior to serving. Any salad green
> > can be cut, shot, or mandolined and preserved for 2-3 days in ice
> > water with little or no degradation and most wouldn't have a clue.
> > This is common practice.
> >
> > nb
> >
>
> I said "supposedly"! :-)

Heheheheh, yup - ya gotta sneak as many qualifiers as possible in huh?
',;~}~



Shaun aRe

On Wed 21 Sep 2005 05:58:55a, Shaun aRe wrote in rec.food.cooking:

>
> "Wayne Boatwright" > wrote in message
> ...
>> On Tue 20 Sep 2005 10:23:44p, notbob wrote in rec.food.cooking:
>>
>> > On 2005-09-21, Wayne Boatwright > wrote:
>> >
>> >> Supposedly, tearing lettuce reduces oxidation of the edges and
retards
>> >> wilting.
>> >
>> > Horse pucky! While "tearing" gives illusion the salad is the latest
>> > trendy organic/free range/whatever greens, the fact is most salads are
>> > crisped in ice water and dried just prior to serving. Any salad green
>> > can be cut, shot, or mandolined and preserved for 2-3 days in ice
>> > water with little or no degradation and most wouldn't have a clue.
>> > This is common practice.
>> >
>> > nb
>> >
>>
>> I said "supposedly"! :-)
>
> Heheheheh, yup - ya gotta sneak as many qualifiers as possible in huh?
> ',;~}~

CYA is very important! :-)

--
Wayne Boatwright *¿*
____________________________________________

Give me a smart idiot over a stupid genius any day.
Sam Goldwyn, 1882-1974

notbob wrote:
> On 2005-09-21, Wayne Boatwright > wrote:
>
> > Supposedly, tearing lettuce reduces oxidation of the edges and retards
> > wilting.
>
> Horse pucky! While "tearing" gives illusion the salad is the latest
> trendy organic/free range/whatever greens, the fact is most salads are
> crisped in ice water and dried just prior to serving. Any salad green
> can be cut, shot, or mandolined and preserved for 2-3 days in ice
> water with little or no degradation and most wouldn't have a clue.
> This is common practice.

Cutting/tearing, it's all BS!

Many times I prepare salads within a half hour prior to eating, then I
find no difference whether lettuce is torn or sliced... when I prepare
salad in advance or prepare enough for the next day (which I often do)
*whether torn or sliced* I squeeze a fresh lemon/lime over and toss
before refrigerating. The citrus acid will prevent browning for at
least three days. Do NOT seal salad greens air tight. Sliced onion is
the only component I prepare and add just prior to serving... I never
have cut onion on hand, if I don't use it all the remains go into the
composter... I purposely purchase a goodly quantity of small onions so
as not to have LOs. Cut onion begins to stink within a few minutes of
cutting.

Sheldon

"notbob" > wrote in message
news
> On 2005-09-21, Wayne Boatwright > wrote:
>
> > Supposedly, tearing lettuce reduces oxidation of the edges and retards
> > wilting.
>
> Horse pucky! While "tearing" gives illusion the salad is the latest
> trendy organic/free range/whatever greens, the fact is most salads are
> crisped in ice water and dried just prior to serving. Any salad green
> can be cut, shot, or mandolined and preserved for 2-3 days in ice
> water with little or no degradation and most wouldn't have a clue.
> This is common practice.
>
> nb

But the tearing of lettuce is far older than any trendy/organic/free range
whatever. I was taught to tear lettuce from way back, when I was helping
Mom with dinner and about all she would let or ask me to do is tear the
lettuce. She told me chopping the lettuce makes the edges brown too fast.
Granted, she wasn't preparing salad greens for a week to be left soaking in
an ice water bath. But I did find when I worked in restaurants, even on ice
the chopped lettuce turned brown on the edges quickly. Restaurants can't
afford to have someone standing there hand-tearing lettuce so they slice and
dice.

Jill

On Wed, 21 Sep 2005 00:23:44 -0500, notbob wrote:

> On 2005-09-21, Wayne Boatwright > wrote:
>
> > Supposedly, tearing lettuce reduces oxidation of the edges and retards
> > wilting.
>
> Horse pucky! While "tearing" gives illusion the salad is the latest
> trendy organic/free range/whatever greens, the fact is most salads are
> crisped in ice water and dried just prior to serving. Any salad green
> can be cut, shot, or mandolined and preserved for 2-3 days in ice
> water with little or no degradation and most wouldn't have a clue.
> This is common practice.
>
Bob, there is some validity to cut edges browning... but I don't keep
"cut" (or torn) lettuce for days, so it doesn't apply to me.

Wayne Boatwright wrote:
>
> Supposedly, tearing lettuce reduces oxidation of the edges and retards
> wilting.

More than 'supposedly' and easily shown by experimentation. Take two
pieces of lettuce, cut one in half, tear the other in half. Put them
down on your cutting board and go away. Come back in half an hour and
look closely at the edges of each piece. The torn edges will be less
wilted and less discolored than the cut edges.

Whether the difference matters is up to you.

> [snip] Many people find torn lettuce more esthetically pleasing.

I do, but again, it's a personal thing. -aem

On 20 Sep 2005 22:36:24 -0700, aem wrote:

>
> Wayne Boatwright wrote:
> >
> > Supposedly, tearing lettuce reduces oxidation of the edges and retards
> > wilting.
>
> More than 'supposedly' and easily shown by experimentation. Take two
> pieces of lettuce, cut one in half, tear the other in half. Put them
> down on your cutting board and go away. Come back in half an hour and
> look closely at the edges of each piece. The torn edges will be less
> wilted and less discolored than the cut edges.
>
> Whether the difference matters is up to you.
>
> > [snip] Many people find torn lettuce more esthetically pleasing.
>
> I do, but again, it's a personal thing. -aem

Tear not cut? LOL! Oh, my god... you're an iceberg lettuce snob!

Wayne Boatwright wrote:
> On Tue 20 Sep 2005 07:44:26p, Phred wrote in rec.food.cooking:
>
>
>>G'day mates,
>>
>>My "traditional" salad (i.e. the only one I ever make for myself)
>>consists of chopped lettuce (strips about... lemme see, better
>>translate... 3/8" to 1/2" wide by 1/2" to 1" long, cut with a knife)
>>and the other usual ingredients for a tossed salad (chopped tomato and
>>onion, grated carrot, diced spuds, sometimes chopped hard boiled eggs,
>>and so on). So when someone says to use "torn lettuce" I'm left
>>wondering how much it should be torn.
>>
>>The question arose with that recent recipe for New Orleans Grapefruit
>>Salad posted by Victor a couple of weeks back. It says to use "1 head
>>iceberg lettuce, washed, trimmed, and torn". (The fragments are then
>>used as a bed for the grapefruit segments on individual serving
>>plates.)
>>
>>I realise it probably doesn't matter a tinker's damn how much it's
>>torn within wide limits; but, just in case there *is* something of an
>>expectation among diners of a "torn lettuce" standard, I thought I'd
>>better ask here. (And I checked the FAQ, Vic, but it has neither
>>"torn" nor "lettuce" on the page. ;-)
>>
>>Cheers, Phred.
>>
>
>
> Supposedly, tearing lettuce reduces oxidation of the edges and retards
> wilting. When I tear head lettuce I tend to break it into chunks, perhaps
> 1 x 1-/12 inches. I tear leaf lettuces in somewhat larger pieces. IMHO,
> pieces as small as you cut are too small and would be especially small if
> torn rather than cut. Many people find torn lettuce more esthetically
> pleasing.
>

Well, my ex-sister-in-law, who fancied herself as a great chef, used to
take me to task every time I chopped lettuce. She was in the catering
business and had been on several "gourmet" cooking courses. She said
that it bruises the lettuce if you cut it with a knife, so I suppose
that's true.....

However, as to the getting it to the right size when tearing.... I tend
to go for "bite-sized". I am sure that really helped

Like your new sig, Wayne, BTW. heh heh

--
Cheers
Cathy(xyz)

On Tue 20 Sep 2005 11:42:30p, cathyxyz wrote in rec.food.cooking:

to go for "bite-sized". I am sure that really helped

I agree with "bite-sized".

>
> Like your new sig, Wayne, BTW. heh heh
>

Thanks, Cathy

--
Wayne Boatwright *¿*
____________________________________________

When everything's coming your way, you're probably in the wrong lane.

On 21 Sep 2005 18:05:33 +0200, Wayne Boatwright wrote:

> On Tue 20 Sep 2005 11:42:30p, cathyxyz wrote in rec.food.cooking:
>
> to go for "bite-sized". I am sure that really helped
>
> I agree with "bite-sized".
>
> >
> > Like your new sig, Wayne, BTW. heh heh
> >
>
> Thanks, Cathy

WAIT.... did you recently steal it from someone? I've seen it a lot
in the past couple of years - not sure if it was you or not.

Wayne Boatwright wrote:


> Supposedly, tearing lettuce reduces oxidation of the edges and
> retards wilting.


That's more or less what Alton Brown said. Tearing causes the pieces to
separate between cells, cutting shears through cells -- leading to more
leakage.

For the most part, what I do depends on the texture I want for the
final result, cut for shreds torn for larger pieces.



Brian

--
If televison's a babysitter, the Internet is a drunk librarian who
won't shut up.
-- Dorothy Gambrell (http://catandgirl.com)

"Default User" > wrote in message
...
> Wayne Boatwright wrote:

>> Supposedly, tearing lettuce reduces oxidation of the edges and
>> retards wilting.

> That's more or less what Alton Brown said. Tearing causes the pieces to
> separate between cells, cutting shears through cells -- leading to more
> leakage.

Hey! That's what I said! Nancy's theory of cell leakage, alert
the media.

> For the most part, what I do depends on the texture I want for the
> final result, cut for shreds torn for larger pieces.

I do cut straight across in maybe 1 inch increments, a whole
fistful of romaine leaves. I eat that salad right away. Well,
after dressing it and maybe adding other vegetables.

nancy

Default User wrote:
> Wayne Boatwright wrote:
>
>
> > Supposedly, tearing lettuce reduces oxidation of the edges and
> > retards wilting.
>
>
> That's more or less what Alton Brown said. Tearing causes the pieces to
> separate between cells, cutting shears through cells -- leading to more
> leakage.
>
> For the most part, what I do depends on the texture I want for the
> final result, cut for shreds torn for larger pieces.
>
>
>
> Brian
>
> --
> If televison's a babysitter, the Internet is a drunk librarian who
> won't shut up.
> -- Dorothy Gambrell (http://catandgirl.com)

Specifically the oxidation of phenols. Same stuff that makes an apple
turn brown.

One time on Usenet, "Seamus" > said:
> Default User wrote:
> > Wayne Boatwright wrote:

> > > Supposedly, tearing lettuce reduces oxidation of the edges and
> > > retards wilting.

> > That's more or less what Alton Brown said. Tearing causes the pieces to
> > separate between cells, cutting shears through cells -- leading to more
> > leakage.

> > For the most part, what I do depends on the texture I want for the
> > final result, cut for shreds torn for larger pieces.

> Specifically the oxidation of phenols. Same stuff that makes an apple
> turn brown.

I wish I could get Miguel (DH) to realize this, but he thinks it's an
urban legend...


--
Jani in WA (S'mee)
~ mom, VidGamer, novice cook ~

S'mee in WA wrote:
> One time on Usenet, "Seamus" > said:
> > Default User wrote:
> > > Wayne Boatwright wrote:
>
> > > > Supposedly, tearing lettuce reduces oxidation of the edges and
> > > > retards wilting.
>
> > > That's more or less what Alton Brown said. Tearing causes the pieces to
> > > separate between cells, cutting shears through cells -- leading to more
> > > leakage.
>
> > > For the most part, what I do depends on the texture I want for the
> > > final result, cut for shreds torn for larger pieces.
>
> > Specifically the oxidation of phenols. Same stuff that makes an apple
> > turn brown.
>
> I wish I could get Miguel (DH) to realize this, but he thinks it's an
> urban legend...
>

Google phenol food brown and rub DH's nose in it :-).
>
> --
> Jani in WA (S'mee)
> ~ mom, VidGamer, novice cook ~

On Wed, 21 Sep 2005 02:44:26 GMT, Phred wrote:

> G'day mates,
>
> My "traditional" salad (i.e. the only one I ever make for myself)
> consists of chopped lettuce (strips about... lemme see, better
> translate... 3/8" to 1/2" wide by 1/2" to 1" long, cut with a knife)
> and the other usual ingredients for a tossed salad (chopped tomato and
> onion, grated carrot, diced spuds, sometimes chopped hard boiled eggs,
> and so on). So when someone says to use "torn lettuce" I'm left
> wondering how much it should be torn.

I tear Bibb/Butter lettuce, but I chop Romaine.
>
> The question arose with that recent recipe for New Orleans Grapefruit
> Salad posted by Victor a couple of weeks back. It says to use "1 head
> iceberg lettuce, washed, trimmed, and torn". (The fragments are then
> used as a bed for the grapefruit segments on individual serving
> plates.)
>
Good grief.... chop head lettuce! Why pretend it's la-tee-dah stuff?

> I realise it probably doesn't matter a tinker's damn how much it's
> torn within wide limits; but, just in case there *is* something of an
> expectation among diners of a "torn lettuce" standard,

I can't understand the mind set that allows people to eat head lettuce
and requires it to be torn. Head lettuce is flavored cardboard, so
cut it.

> I thought I'd
> better ask here. (And I checked the FAQ, Vic, but it has neither
> "torn" nor "lettuce" on the page. ;-)
>
It's a subject that is interesting only to you and me. LOL! To be
perfectly honest, I gauge the culinary state of affairs in areas I
visit by their salad. They can fool you with the main dish, if you
picked it well.... but house salads are supposed to appeal to the
masses. If the salad is composed with head lettuce, I pass judgment
and it's not a good one.

On Tue 20 Sep 2005 09:11:45p, sf wrote in rec.food.cooking:

> On Wed, 21 Sep 2005 02:44:26 GMT, Phred wrote:
>
>> G'day mates,
>>
>> My "traditional" salad (i.e. the only one I ever make for myself)
>> consists of chopped lettuce (strips about... lemme see, better
>> translate... 3/8" to 1/2" wide by 1/2" to 1" long, cut with a knife)
>> and the other usual ingredients for a tossed salad (chopped tomato and
>> onion, grated carrot, diced spuds, sometimes chopped hard boiled eggs,
>> and so on). So when someone says to use "torn lettuce" I'm left
>> wondering how much it should be torn.
>
> I tear Bibb/Butter lettuce, but I chop Romaine.
>>
>> The question arose with that recent recipe for New Orleans Grapefruit
>> Salad posted by Victor a couple of weeks back. It says to use "1 head
>> iceberg lettuce, washed, trimmed, and torn". (The fragments are then
>> used as a bed for the grapefruit segments on individual serving
>> plates.)
>>
> Good grief.... chop head lettuce! Why pretend it's la-tee-dah stuff?

I really prefer it torn into chunks. I just don't like the way it looks
when it's cut. Only exception is when I make a "chopped salad" where all
the ingredients are cut in smallish chunks.

>> I realise it probably doesn't matter a tinker's damn how much it's
>> torn within wide limits; but, just in case there *is* something of an
>> expectation among diners of a "torn lettuce" standard,
>
> I can't understand the mind set that allows people to eat head lettuce
> and requires it to be torn. Head lettuce is flavored cardboard, so
> cut it.

True, head lettuce is rather tasteless, but it's a good foil for a very
good dressing.


>> I thought I'd
>> better ask here. (And I checked the FAQ, Vic, but it has neither
>> "torn" nor "lettuce" on the page. ;-)
>>
> It's a subject that is interesting only to you and me. LOL! To be
> perfectly honest, I gauge the culinary state of affairs in areas I
> visit by their salad. They can fool you with the main dish, if you
> picked it well.... but house salads are supposed to appeal to the
> masses. If the salad is composed with head lettuce, I pass judgment
> and it's not a good one.

I don't mind a small amount of head lettuce added to a salad of mixed
greens, as it does provide a bit of crispness that most lettuce don't have.
OTOH, if the salad is predominantly head lettuce I don't much care for it.

--
Wayne Boatwright *¿*
____________________________________________

Not all people are annoying. Some are dead.

Wayne replied to sf:

>> I can't understand the mind set that allows people to eat head lettuce
>> and requires it to be torn. Head lettuce is flavored cardboard, so
>> cut it.
>
> True, head lettuce is rather tasteless, but it's a good foil for a very
> good dressing.

Iceberg lettuce is low in calories and high in potassium. It's also got a
pleasant texture and a delicate sweetness and fragrance which are often
overlooked by LETTUCE SNOBS LIKE YOU! :-)

To answer Phred's original post, I concur with Wayne's practice of tearing
lettuce (of all varieties) unless I'm making a chopped salad.

Most replies have ignored what I thought was the point of Phred's post: If
you tear the lettuce, how large are the torn pieces? My answer is that I
tear the lettuce into pieces which I think can be easily eaten with a salad
fork. That works out to no dimension being larger than about two-and-a-half
inches or smaller than one inch. But that's just me.

Bob

Bob Terwilliger wrote:
> Most replies have ignored what I thought was the point of Phred's post: If
> you tear the lettuce, how large are the torn pieces? My answer is that I
> tear the lettuce into pieces which I think can be easily eaten with a salad
> fork. That works out to no dimension being larger than about two-and-a-half
> inches or smaller than one inch. But that's just me.
>
> Bob

I'm with ya on the no smaller than 1 inch size. I HATE it when people
chop their food into miniscule pieces. My MIL does this with
everything, my sister and nieceas do it with fruit salad and potato
salad. Ick! Give me big pieces! If I want them smaller, I will cut
them myself!

-L.

On 20 Sep 2005 23:22:33 -0700, -L. wrote:

>
> Bob Terwilliger wrote:
> > Most replies have ignored what I thought was the point of Phred's post: If
> > you tear the lettuce, how large are the torn pieces? My answer is that I
> > tear the lettuce into pieces which I think can be easily eaten with a salad
> > fork. That works out to no dimension being larger than about two-and-a-half
> > inches or smaller than one inch. But that's just me.
> >
> > Bob
>
> I'm with ya on the no smaller than 1 inch size. I HATE it when people
> chop their food into miniscule pieces. My MIL does this with
> everything, my sister and nieceas do it with fruit salad and potato
> salad. Ick! Give me big pieces! If I want them smaller, I will cut
> them myself!
>
LOL! My bad experiences are with pieces that require a knife to
conform them into something you can eat... either that or you get
dressing all over your face when you try to jam it in.

In article >, "Bob Terwilliger" > wrote:
>Wayne replied to sf:
>>> I can't understand the mind set that allows people to eat head lettuce
>>> and requires it to be torn. Head lettuce is flavored cardboard, so
>>> cut it.
>>
>> True, head lettuce is rather tasteless, but it's a good foil for a very
>> good dressing.
>
>Iceberg lettuce is low in calories and high in potassium. It's also got a
>pleasant texture and a delicate sweetness and fragrance which are often
>overlooked by LETTUCE SNOBS LIKE YOU! :-)
>
>To answer Phred's original post, I concur with Wayne's practice of tearing
>lettuce (of all varieties) unless I'm making a chopped salad.
>
>Most replies have ignored what I thought was the point of Phred's post: If
>you tear the lettuce, how large are the torn pieces? My answer is that I
>tear the lettuce into pieces which I think can be easily eaten with a salad
>fork. That works out to no dimension being larger than about two-and-a-half
>inches or smaller than one inch. But that's just me.

Onya, Bob! I should have thought more about it myself -- clearly an
American recipe would call for pieces small enough to eat with a fork
without the aid of a knife, so that would set an upper limit. Around
here, Iceberg is the only type commonly available, so I'm afraid I'll
have to give the more exclusive salad clubs a miss. ;-)

[Thanks too, to all you others who have expressed advice or opinions.]

Cheers, Phred.

--
LID

"Bob Terwilliger" > wrote in message
...
> Wayne replied to sf:
>
>>> I can't understand the mind set that allows people to eat head lettuce
>>> and requires it to be torn. Head lettuce is flavored cardboard, so
>>> cut it.
>>
>> True, head lettuce is rather tasteless, but it's a good foil for a very
>> good dressing.
>
> Iceberg lettuce is low in calories and high in potassium. It's also got a
> pleasant texture and a delicate sweetness and fragrance which are often
> overlooked by LETTUCE SNOBS LIKE YOU! :-)

I agree, I do like iceberg lettuce. I love a nice cross section lettuce
sandwich with mayo in the summer. I can guarantee it does not taste
anything like cardboard.

> To answer Phred's original post, I concur with Wayne's practice of tearing
> lettuce (of all varieties) unless I'm making a chopped salad.

Lettuce is essentially water, when you cut it with a knife, it crushes the
cells and the edges become browned and nasty very quickly. Tearing
it avoids that crushing, and ... going out on a scientific limb here ... it
probably tears along cell walls rather than through them.

It also looks a hell of a lot better, in my opinion.

> Most replies have ignored what I thought was the point of Phred's post: If
> you tear the lettuce, how large are the torn pieces? My answer is that I
> tear the lettuce into pieces which I think can be easily eaten with a
> salad fork. That works out to no dimension being larger than about
> two-and-a-half inches or smaller than one inch. But that's just me.

Aside from the occasional chunk of iceberg, for the most part it bugs me to
get a salad with big pieces so there is no graceful way to eat it. At home
I
have the habit of eating my salad with my fingers so it's not that big a
deal.
Yes, another guilty secret.

As far as the grapefruit salad goes, I didn't see it so I don't know, was it
served on large lettuce leaves, such as you would serve shrimp salad or the
like? Sort of like lettuce cups. That you wouldn't tear into bite sized
pieces,
obviously.

nancy

On Wed 21 Sep 2005 06:39:16a, Nancy Young wrote in rec.food.cooking:

>> Iceberg lettuce is low in calories and high in potassium. It's also got
>> a pleasant texture and a delicate sweetness and fragrance which are
>> often overlooked by LETTUCE SNOBS LIKE YOU! :-)
>
> I agree, I do like iceberg lettuce. I love a nice cross section lettuce
> sandwich with mayo in the summer. I can guarantee it does not taste
> anything like cardboard.

One of my favorite simple salads is a wedge or thick cross section of
iceberg lettuce with a good chunky blue cheese or homemade 1000 island
dressing on it.


>> To answer Phred's original post, I concur with Wayne's practice of
>> tearing lettuce (of all varieties) unless I'm making a chopped salad.
>
> Lettuce is essentially water, when you cut it with a knife, it crushes
> the cells and the edges become browned and nasty very quickly. Tearing
> it avoids that crushing, and ... going out on a scientific limb here ...
> it probably tears along cell walls rather than through them.
>
> It also looks a hell of a lot better, in my opinion.

Yep, there's something just too "institutional" looking about a salad made
of sliced up greens.

>> Most replies have ignored what I thought was the point of Phred's post:
>> If you tear the lettuce, how large are the torn pieces? My answer is
>> that I tear the lettuce into pieces which I think can be easily eaten
>> with a salad fork. That works out to no dimension being larger than
>> about two-and-a-half inches or smaller than one inch. But that's just
>> me.
>
> Aside from the occasional chunk of iceberg, for the most part it bugs me
> to get a salad with big pieces so there is no graceful way to eat it.
> At home I
> have the habit of eating my salad with my fingers so it's not that big a
> deal.
> Yes, another guilty secret.

I think more people share in that secret than you think. The only bad part
is if the dressing runs down your arms! :-))

--
Wayne Boatwright *¿*
____________________________________________

Give me a smart idiot over a stupid genius any day.
Sam Goldwyn, 1882-1974

On Wed, 21 Sep 2005 09:39:16 -0400, Nancy Young wrote:

> It also looks a hell of a lot better, in my opinion.

It's HEAD lettuce. Bah! Cut it already, don't try to be upscale,
becaue it's HEAD lettuce.

Nancy wrote:

> At home I have the habit of eating my salad with my fingers so it's not
> that big a deal. Yes, another guilty secret.

Apropos of that, did you know that the original Cesar salad was meant to be
eaten with your fingers? The salad wasn't tossed; the dressing was poured on
whole romaine leaves. The diners were supposed to pick up the whole leaf and
eat it.

Bob

On 21 Sep 2005 01:02:02 -0500, Bob Terwilliger wrote:

> It's also got a
> pleasant texture and a delicate sweetness and fragrance which are often
> overlooked by LETTUCE SNOBS LIKE YOU! :-)


LOL! I can live with that. I really do hate head lettuce and love
"anything" else ("Spring Blend" is one of my favorites). Of course,
I'm old enough to remember when something other than head lettuce
wasn't a choice for most people, if they didn't have a home garden.
My family ate "butter" lettuce ONLY because a farm that sold it to
high priced Chicago restaurants was in our area. My family was
friends with that family and I remember going to their farm to
purchase lettuce on a weekly basis - during the growing season.

My mother's father lived across the state and gardened every summer.
He raised several kinds of lettuce every summer and none of them was
head lettuce.

"Wayne Boatwright" > wrote in message

> I don't mind a small amount of head lettuce added to a salad of mixed
> greens, as it does provide a bit of crispness that most lettuce don't
have.
> OTOH, if the salad is predominantly head lettuce I don't much care for it.

By 'head lettuce', are you referring to say, iceberg and the like? I
personally really enjoy iceberg lettuce - I just love the texture and
juiciness of it myself! If a salad consisted of little else, then of course
I'd turn y nose up at it, but as a component in a good mixed salad I find it
priceless.








Shaun aRe

sf wrote:
> If the salad is composed with head lettuce, I pass judgment
> and it's not a good one.

Then you haven't had much experience with head lettuce and/or don't
know what's head lettuce as averse to loose leaf lettuce. Iceberg is
not the be-all/end-all head lettuce, far from it. Romaine/cos is head
lettuce, mild but tasty nevertheless, as is bibb, and inbetwixt there's
loose head, like butterhead. And then there are myriad oriental head
lettuces, usually hybidized, many quite sharply flavored... some of my
favorites are mustard, radish, cabbage flavored by different degrees...
and also texture plays an important role, as well as color. I don't
particularly care much for the typical loose leaf lettuces found in US
stupidmarkets, they all taste about the same, mostly taste of nothing,
smell reminescently of freshly mowed lawn, and have no discernable
texture.

Sheldon

sf wrote:
> On Wed, 21 Sep 2005 02:44:26 GMT, Phred wrote:
>
> > G'day mates,
> >
> > My "traditional" salad (i.e. the only one I ever make for myself)
> > consists of chopped lettuce (strips about... lemme see, better
> > translate... 3/8" to 1/2" wide by 1/2" to 1" long, cut with a knife)
> > and the other usual ingredients for a tossed salad (chopped tomato and
> > onion, grated carrot, diced spuds, sometimes chopped hard boiled eggs,
> > and so on). So when someone says to use "torn lettuce" I'm left
> > wondering how much it should be torn.
>
> I tear Bibb/Butter lettuce, but I chop Romaine.

With an oriental dressing I like romaine finely shredded, for a
sieze-her I use the smaller inner leaves whole, for tossed with a
creamy dressing I tear the green off the ribs, the ribs make a nice
cooks treat with whatever dip is going, clam is my fav. I grow my own
romaine... yoose would be amazed at how huge they grow... 18" wide and
3' tall is normal, I kid you not. Romain is one of the easiest
lettuces to grow... the trick is to start teh plants early in a cold
frame and put them in teh ground as soon as therre's no chance of a
hard frost... lettuce does not like hot weather, two days over 80=BAF it
starts to bolt.

Sheldon

On 21 Sep 2005 14:31:40 -0700, Sheldon wrote:

>
> sf wrote:
> > On Wed, 21 Sep 2005 02:44:26 GMT, Phred wrote:
> >
> > > G'day mates,
> > >
> > > My "traditional" salad (i.e. the only one I ever make for myself)
> > > consists of chopped lettuce (strips about... lemme see, better
> > > translate... 3/8" to 1/2" wide by 1/2" to 1" long, cut with a knife)
> > > and the other usual ingredients for a tossed salad (chopped tomato and
> > > onion, grated carrot, diced spuds, sometimes chopped hard boiled eggs,
> > > and so on). So when someone says to use "torn lettuce" I'm left
> > > wondering how much it should be torn.
> >
> > I tear Bibb/Butter lettuce, but I chop Romaine.
>
> With an oriental dressing I like romaine finely shredded, for a
> sieze-her I use the smaller inner leaves whole, for tossed with a
> creamy dressing I tear the green off the ribs, the ribs make a nice
> cooks treat with whatever dip is going, clam is my fav. I grow my own
> romaine... yoose would be amazed at how huge they grow... 18" wide and
> 3' tall is normal, I kid you not. Romain is one of the easiest
> lettuces to grow... the trick is to start teh plants early in a cold
> frame and put them in teh ground as soon as therre's no chance of a
> hard frost... lettuce does not like hot weather, two days over 80ºF it
> starts to bolt.
>
You sound like a real gardener. My grandfather did that sort of thing
and my brother does it now.

<sniffle>
sf
feeling nostalgic

sf wrote:
> On 21 Sep 2005 14:31:40 -0700, Sheldon wrote:
>
> >
> > sf wrote:
> > > On Wed, 21 Sep 2005 02:44:26 GMT, Phred wrote:
> > >
> > > > G'day mates,
> > > >
> > > > My "traditional" salad (i.e. the only one I ever make for myself)
> > > > consists of chopped lettuce (strips about... lemme see, better
> > > > translate... 3/8" to 1/2" wide by 1/2" to 1" long, cut with a kni=
fe)
> > > > and the other usual ingredients for a tossed salad (chopped tomat=
o and
> > > > onion, grated carrot, diced spuds, sometimes chopped hard boiled =
eggs,
> > > > and so on). So when someone says to use "torn lettuce" I'm left
> > > > wondering how much it should be torn.
> > >
> > > I tear Bibb/Butter lettuce, but I chop Romaine.
> >
> > With an oriental dressing I like romaine finely shredded, for a
> > sieze-her I use the smaller inner leaves whole, for tossed with a
> > creamy dressing I tear the green off the ribs, the ribs make a nice
> > cooks treat with whatever dip is going, clam is my fav. I grow my own
> > romaine... yoose would be amazed at how huge they grow... 18" wide and
> > 3' tall is normal, I kid you not. Romain is one of the easiest
> > lettuces to grow... the trick is to start teh plants early in a cold
> > frame and put them in teh ground as soon as therre's no chance of a
> > hard frost... lettuce does not like hot weather, two days over 80=BAF =
it
> > starts to bolt.
> >
> You sound like a real gardener. My grandfather did that sort of thing
> and my brother does it now.
>
> <sniffle>
> sf
> feeling nostalgic

No reason you can't garden too. Right now is bulb planting time in the
northeast. I already put in 300 daffodils, another 300 to go. And I
found a great way to dig the holes:

http://www.leevalley.com/garden/page...3D2,2200,33263

http://tinyurl.com/3zmxc

Sheldon