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OT Gas Prices ( New Information)
Are like the weather - everyone Bitches about it and no one can do a damn thing
about it. Feel Impotent? You are! Dimitri |
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"Dimitri" > wrote in message
m... > Are like the weather - everyone Bitches about it and no one can do a damn > thing about it. > > Feel Impotent? > > You are! > > Dimitri > Trying to cheer us up, are you? -- Peter Aitken |
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My friend with the Jetta TDI doesn't seem to be bitching quite as loud
as all the people with Super-sized McSuvs. Dean G. |
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"Peter Aitken" > wrote in message om... > "Dimitri" > wrote in message > m... >> Are like the weather - everyone Bitches about it and no one can do a damn >> thing about it. >> >> Feel Impotent? >> >> You are! >> >> Dimitri >> > > Trying to cheer us up, are you? > > > -- > Peter Aitken Sure why not - One you accept the facts and realize there is little you can really do about it you can stop the mental masturbation and go on to productive areas of one's life. ;-) Dimitri |
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"Dimitri" in m:
> Are like the weather - everyone Bitches about it and no one can do a damn > thing about it. > > Feel Impotent? > > You are! With all _due_ respect Dimitri such a comment is nonsense, as follows. Not all, but many, people have a say in how much, and what, they drive I know several in the US who moved to efficient gas-electric hybrids in the last five years. Previous petroleum squeezes awoke US consumers and they chose different habits and different vehicles. I posted something on the early newsgroup net.flame (so useful! alas ...) on the practicality of bicycles (23 Sep 1983). People love to deny actual power they exercise incessantly through choices. Other factors operate too. One US economic historian wrote several years ago: -------- As bitterly resented as the gasoline lines of the 1970s were under government price controls, there were widespread predictions of skyrocketing gasoline prices if these controls were abolished. ... Senator Dale Bumpers predicted, "gasoline will soon go to USD $3 a gallon." [Note that's 1970s USD $3 -- I found 2.76 US inflation index 1979 to 2004 so this price represents $8 a gallon in today's dollars.] Airs of condescension pervaded criticisms of those who believed otherwise and who relied on a free market. [Example from New York Times omitted.] [Example from President Jimmy Carter omitted.] ... [Price controls subsquently ended under new President.] Within four months, the average price of a gallon of unleaded gasoline fell from $1.41 to $0.86 . Refineries' average cost of buying crude oil fell from more than $30 a barrel in 1981 to less than half of that by 1986. Contrary to predictions of oil or gasoline shortages by President Carter's energy secretary James Schlesinger, by Senator Bumpers, and others, the world's known crude oil reserves were 41 percent higher at the end of the 1980s than at the beginning. [Not from online. Author cited source data.] -------- "Why don't people learn from such things?" is the real question, I feel. (I wonder also how many in the US now "bitching" bought SUVs when those became fashionable.) -- Max |
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In article > ,
"Dimitri" > wrote: > Are like the weather - everyone Bitches about it and no one can do a damn > thing > about it. > > Feel Impotent? > > You are! > > Dimitri > > Bite me. ;-) I knew that, did not need my nosed rubbed in it. <sigh> So, do you feel better now? Cheers! -- Om. "My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-bitch." -Jack Nicholson |
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"Dimitri" > wrote in message m... > Are like the weather - everyone Bitches about it and no one can do a damn > thing about it. > > Feel Impotent? > > You are! Pretty much, except ... take my neighbors, I like them very much, but they do one errand at a time. I have a friend who is the same way, back and forth to the house and whatever store. A little organization can cut down on the number of trips. Perhaps switch your shopping/whatever sources to places local to each other so you can pick up the cleaning, go to the bank, shop for food, without having to drive all over the place. If you run out at lunch to get something to eat, how about bring lunch and save yourself some gas. Obviously if you can, work from home a couple of days a week; yes, I know, that is not an option for many people. I think most people can make some adjustments to cut down on their gas compsumption. But, for the most part, yup, we're stuck. (smile) nancy |
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"Max Hauser" > wrote in message ... > "Dimitri" in m: >> Are like the weather - everyone Bitches about it and no one can do a damn >> thing about it. >> >> Feel Impotent? >> >> You are! > > With all _due_ respect Dimitri such a comment is nonsense, as follows. Not > all, but many, people have a say in how much, and what, they drive I know > several in the US who moved to efficient gas-electric hybrids in the last five > years. Previous petroleum squeezes awoke US consumers and they chose > different habits and different vehicles. Essentially, the public and drive whatever they want - the effect of the " American Driver" on the price of gas and crude is nil. If we don't buy it the Chinese will and they'll probably out bid us as well. The simple fact is today the demand for petroleum and petrochemical products is insatiable as is our overall desire for energy. Dimitri |
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"Nancy Young" > wrote in
: > Perhaps switch your shopping/whatever sources to places local to > each other so you can pick up the cleaning, go to the bank, shop > for food, without having to drive all over the place. I usually do that anyway. > If you run out at lunch to get something to eat, how about bring > lunch and save yourself some gas. I work downtown. Food providers are all around...no need to drive. > Obviously if you can, work from home a couple of days a week; yes, > I know, that is not an option for many people. Not possible. Job requires constant interaction with fellow employees, clients, resources and managers. > I think most people can make some adjustments to cut down on their > gas compsumption. You forgot: Walk to work if you can. Take public transit. Move closer to your work. If you live in an apartment and your lease is coming up, consider moving closer to work if this is possible. Car pool. When travelling between cities that are relatively close, take the train. Trains are much more economical in fuel consumption than cars, buses or airplanes. If possible switch to a non fossil-fuel based heat source (electricity, biomass...) Encourage soft energy initiatives in your immediate area, particularly wind generators which can alleviate the need to burn fossil fuels for electricity (which I believe still happens in some parts of the US and Western Canada). Also, create cooperatives to distribute electricity to your neighbourhood. Pressure the big poobah to sign the Kyoto Agreement and put measures into place to reduce greenhouse gas emissions. Canada has initiated a programme called the One-tonne Challenge which calls upon citizens to reduce GHG by one tonne per person per year. As the average person creates 5 tonnes of GHG in a year, reducing the consumption by one tonne means cutting back on 20% of GHG producing activities and of course one of them (the big one) is vehicle fuel consumption. http://www.climatechange.gc.ca/oneto...lish/index.asp Of course, like most government programs, it doesn't address the real issue which is that the other four tonnes are still creating a problem, but hey, it's what is called a "prise de conscience" and for some people, it will be a substantial lifestyle change. Back in the 70's, I was a writer for a government sponsored initiative to get people to cut back on energy consumption. To this day, some of the people that were in touch with us still use the measures they were given back then, mostly heating through biomass (wood). Doing the right thing is never wasted, unlike what George suggested. -- "Compassion is the chief law of human existence." Dostoevski, The Idiot |
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Sorry, didn't fill in the story very well. US shifts in vehicles and habits
mentioned earlier contributed to the famous 1980s oil-price collapse, so visible indirectly in places like Texas -- I remember seeing the new office buildings remaining vacant -- owners offering a year free for a tenant who would lease ... The history and the effects of consumer choices are out there, for those who actually want to read about them. |
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"Nancy Young" > wrote in message ... <snip> > Pretty much, except ... take my neighbors, I like them very much, but they > do one errand at a time. I have a friend who is the same way, back and > forth to the house and whatever store. A little organization can cut down > on the number of trips. Forget about gas that's just common sence and a good use of time. > Perhaps switch your shopping/whatever sources to places local to each > other so you can pick up the cleaning, go to the bank, shop for food, > without having to drive all over the place. See above - just make the grocery store last (so the ice cream won't melt) > > If you run out at lunch to get something to eat, how about bring lunch and > save yourself some gas. They poened a costco across the street... > Obviously if you can, work from home a couple of days a week; yes, I > know, that is not an option for many people. Wish I could - I like working in shorts and a T shirt > I think most people can make some adjustments to cut down on their gas > compsumption. You bet - but not till it hurts. > But, for the most part, yup, we're stuck. (smile) > > nancy Boy how I wish I was wrong. Dimitri |
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"Max Hauser" > wrote in message ... > Sorry, didn't fill in the story very well. US shifts in vehicles and habits > mentioned earlier contributed to the famous 1980s oil-price collapse, so > visible indirectly in places like Texas -- I remember seeing the new office > buildings remaining vacant -- owners offering a year free for a tenant who > would lease ... The history and the effects of consumer choices are out > there, for those who actually want to read about them. I remember some of the finest Hotels running at 10% & 15 % occupancy. I would walk into a bar - you'd think I was the King of someplace special the way I was greeted and catered to. Dimitri. |
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"Michel Boucher" > wrote > "Nancy Young" > wrote in >> Perhaps switch your shopping/whatever sources to places local to >> each other so you can pick up the cleaning, go to the bank, shop >> for food, without having to drive all over the place. > > I usually do that anyway. I am sure you do, not everyone does. These were only suggestions on *how* people might cut down on their gas bill. >> If you run out at lunch to get something to eat, how about bring >> lunch and save yourself some gas. >> I think most people can make some adjustments to cut down on their >> gas compsumption. > > You forgot: I'll pretend I'm someone else who does work, because otherwise my answers would be similar to yours, 'doesn't apply to me'. > Walk to work if you can. Out of the question. Even the places where *maybe* they'd have work for me, it would be a stretch to think I could walk there. Never mind it's pretty much a stretch for me to walk to the kitchen these days, but that's another subject. > Take public transit. None. Zip. Zero. > Move closer to your work. If you live in an apartment and your lease > is coming up, consider moving closer to work if this is possible. Don't forget the topic at hand. Gas prices and how to cut them to save money. The subject had to do with the price of gas and how there is nothing we can do about it. So, I fail to see how moving, an extremely expensive undertaking, would benefit me financially. I would never recoup my gas savings. Ever. Never mind I'd now be living someplace I hate, but that, too, is another topic. > Car pool. Very difficult to do with the work schedules and the home schedules of different people who would work where I do. Not completely out of the question, but there are not enough people around here, really, who work out there. > When travelling between cities that are relatively close, take the > train. Trains are much more economical in fuel consumption than > cars, buses or airplanes. Can't argue with that. As much as I dislike public transportation (I grew up waiting for buses and trains and I just hate it), I do try to take the train when going to Manhattan. Even that involves maybe an 8 mile drive to the train station. > If possible switch to a non fossil-fuel based heat source > (electricity, biomass...) Electricity is expensive. We are talking about gas prices. I keep my electric bill lower by having time-of-day service where I can run the pool filter, etc, at night or on the weekends. That to me compares apples and apples in trying to save money on whatever commodity. Save money, not the commodity. Sorry to be a pain, I'm just making sure we don't forget the origin of this thread, it's about saving money on gas. > Encourage soft energy initiatives in your immediate area, > particularly wind generators which can alleviate the need to burn > fossil fuels for electricity (which I believe still happens in some > parts of the US and Western Canada). Also, create cooperatives to > distribute electricity to your neighbourhood. They are talking about windmills in the ocean, there are objections I haven't followed. I'll read it next time the subject comes up. > Pressure the big poobah to sign the Kyoto Agreement and put measures > into place to reduce greenhouse gas emissions. I can't fathom why people think he has the power to decide that, it's a whole big machine behind the guy ... think Wizard of Oz. I know you know that. > Back in the 70's, I was a writer for a government sponsored > initiative to get people to cut back on energy consumption. To this > day, some of the people that were in touch with us still use the > measures they were given back then, mostly heating through biomass > (wood). Then we'll be back to the pollution thing, and even otherwise, that's a whole big thing to get into. |
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Nancy Young wrote on 02 Sep 2005 in rec.food.cooking
> Never mind it's pretty much a stretch for me to walk to > the kitchen these days, but that's another subject. > Psst! I'll meet you in the hall...I have a chair there. -- The eyes are the mirrors.... But the ears...Ah the ears. The ears keep the hat up. |
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On Fri, 02 Sep 2005 18:04:06 GMT, "Dimitri" >
connected the dots and wrote: ~Are like the weather - everyone Bitches about it and no one can do a damn thing ~about it. ~ ~Feel Impotent? ~ ~You are! ~ ~Dimitri ~ Especially since this week my Mom came home from the rehab center, and my sister is in the process of organizing her house for a move up tot he Boston area, so I've been up and back more times than a commuter this week, packing , staying with Mom, watching the prices go up and up and up, and today, finally, most of them went down a few pennies. Glad she's home now, but dang, what a bad time for it. maxine in ri |
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"Michel Boucher" > wrote in message > > If possible switch to a non fossil-fuel based heat source > (electricity, biomass...) The majority of electricity in this country is fossil fuel generated. The tree huggers are fighting nuclear, wind farms and other alternative methods. Solar, however, should be pushed much more. |
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"Dimitri" > wrote in message > > Wish I could - I like working in shorts and a T shirt > I do all the time in summer. So does the president and vice president. I used to have to wear a tie at my last job doing the same work. |
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On Fri, 02 Sep 2005 18:04:06 GMT, "Dimitri" >
wrote: >Are like the weather - everyone Bitches about it and no one can do a damn thing >about it. > >Feel Impotent? > >You are! What I absolutely Do Not Get is, that the gas stations had their big-assed tanks full of gas on, say, Monday, which are still full of the same gas on, say, Friday, and they jack the price up with the same gas in their tanks that they had on Monday? Someone puhleeze educate me on how the gas I bought on Monday at $3.05.9 was $3.25.09 today? (This is SoCal - the home of the USA's highest gas prices, for reasons that escape me - insofar as we have *4* count 'em, *4* refineries in SoCal.), Terry "Squeaks" Pulliam Burd AAC(F)BV66.0748.CA "If the soup had been as hot as the claret, if the claret had been as old as the bird, and if the bird's breasts had been as full as the waitress's, it would have been a very good dinner." -- Duncan Hines To reply, replace "spaminator" with "cox" |
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Squeaks wrote:
> What I absolutely Do Not Get is, that the gas stations had their > big-assed tanks full of gas on, say, Monday, which are still full of > the same gas on, say, Friday, and they jack the price up with the same > gas in their tanks that they had on Monday? > > Someone puhleeze educate me on how the gas I bought on Monday at > $3.05.9 was $3.25.09 today? (This is SoCal - the home of the USA's > highest gas prices, for reasons that escape me - insofar as we have > *4* count 'em, *4* refineries in SoCal.), The gas in those tanks is being sold at a rate commensurate with at least these two figures (though there are probably other things taken into consideration): 1. What it will cost to fill those big-assed tanks when all the gas in them has been sold. 2. What people are willing to pay for gas. In this case, since the gas station owner will have to spend more to fill his tanks, he has to charge more NOW so that he'll be able to afford it. Bob |
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On Fri, 02 Sep 2005 22:49:50 -0700, Terry Pulliam Burd
> wrote: > What I absolutely Do Not Get is, that the gas stations had their >big-assed tanks full of gas on, say, Monday, which are still full of >the same gas on, say, Friday, and they jack the price up with the same >gas in their tanks that they had on Monday? Some places in NYC have been raising their prices several times a day. NYC is going to pass a law that they can only raise them once a day, but it will take time. In the meantime, I saw a difference of 30 cents/gal between two stations across the street from each other yesterday. Coincidentally, I took my long-dormant bicycle to the shop to be made road-ready last week, before all of this happened. (though yesterday was too hot to retrieve it). Gas prices will alter my travel plans, but I'm more worried about winter heating. Sue(tm) Lead me not into temptation... I can find it myself! |
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"Edwin Pawlowski" > wrote in
: > > "Michel Boucher" > wrote in message >> >> If possible switch to a non fossil-fuel based heat source >> (electricity, biomass...) > > The majority of electricity in this country is fossil fuel > generated. Hence the qualifier "non-fossil fuel based heat source". Sheesh. -- "Compassion is the chief law of human existence." Dostoevski, The Idiot |
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"Michel Boucher" > wrote in message ... > "Edwin Pawlowski" > wrote in > : > >> >> "Michel Boucher" > wrote in message >>> >>> If possible switch to a non fossil-fuel based heat source >>> (electricity, biomass...) >> >> The majority of electricity in this country is fossil fuel >> generated. > > Hence the qualifier "non-fossil fuel based heat source". Sheesh. Does not read that way to me. I understand biomass, but the way it is written it is not clear. Putting them together in parentheses makes them look like they are both non-fossil based. |
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"Edwin Pawlowski" > wrote in
m: >>>> If possible switch to a non fossil-fuel based heat source >>>> (electricity, biomass...) >>> >>> The majority of electricity in this country is fossil fuel >>> generated. >> >> Hence the qualifier "non-fossil fuel based heat source". Sheesh. > > Does not read that way to me. I understand biomass, but the way it > is written it is not clear. Putting them together in parentheses > makes them look like they are both non-fossil based. Electricity can be hydro generated, in fact is. No requirement to use fossil fuels there. It can be generated by wind, tides, hydrogen, solar... The current fixation on fossil fuels shows a definite lack of imagination. New England purchases a lot of hydroelectricity from Hydro-Québec during the summer months to cover the demand for air conditioning. No fossil fuels there. -- "Compassion is the chief law of human existence." Dostoevski, The Idiot |
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In article >, Michel Boucher > wrote:
>"Edwin Pawlowski" > wrote in om: > >>>>> If possible switch to a non fossil-fuel based heat source >>>>> (electricity, biomass...) >>>> >>>> The majority of electricity in this country is fossil fuel >>>> generated. >>> >>> Hence the qualifier "non-fossil fuel based heat source". Sheesh. >> >> Does not read that way to me. I understand biomass, but the way it >> is written it is not clear. Putting them together in parentheses >> makes them look like they are both non-fossil based. > >Electricity can be hydro generated, in fact is. No requirement to >use fossil fuels there. It can be generated by wind, tides, >hydrogen, solar... The current fixation on fossil fuels shows a >definite lack of imagination. > >New England purchases a lot of hydroelectricity from Hydro-Québec >during the summer months to cover the demand for air conditioning. >No fossil fuels there. ROTFLOL after PMLOL... If it's anything like around here, there's probably umpteen times more "green energy" sold at premium prices to the gullible than is actually available! The difference is made up by traditional coal-fired generators. (This is not to say the *concept* isn't highly desirable of course.  Cheers, Phred. -- LID |
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In article >,
"Edwin Pawlowski" > wrote: > "Michel Boucher" > wrote in message > > > > If possible switch to a non fossil-fuel based heat source > > (electricity, biomass...) > > The majority of electricity in this country is fossil fuel generated. The > tree huggers are fighting nuclear, wind farms and other alternative methods. > Solar, however, should be pushed much more. > > Convection generators are going to be even better. More bang for the buck. Australia has one in the works and more might be erected later if that one works as expected: http://www.wired.com/news/technology...,54917,00.html Let's pray this pans out. :-) Free electricity except for initial outlay and upkeep! -- Om. "My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-bitch." -Jack Nicholson |
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Regulating peoples actions (no very small cars due to the stupid pills
we take each day)... There are high milage vehicles available. thats the only way to control the price of gas.. BUT of course, it goes down and we buy the big big big HUGE and BIG gas HOGS... NO, we will never learn..... History repeats itself.. I remember 15 cent gas... this is during a gas war when I was a kid... that was about 3/4ths a lifetime back (mid 50s).. The gas is high because of the mergers of oil giants.. no simple way to fix it till the democrats get back into office to fix the greed... sign me republican who knows... On Sat, 03 Sep 2005 03:32:03 GMT, "Edwin Pawlowski" > wrote: > >"Dimitri" > wrote in message >> >> Wish I could - I like working in shorts and a T shirt >> > >I do all the time in summer. So does the president and vice president. I >used to have to wear a tie at my last job doing the same work. > |
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since early 90s there has been a microbe that allows nearly full
conversion from sugar cane to alchol... no special treatment other than running the canes thru a crusher and firmenting the mix.. several places used this and additionally there were several places with huge garbage piles that were going to use those dumps and all the stored energy to convert using this microbe... a month after the article printed i n the local big town news paper, there was no tracks left to even know it ever was written.. there are ways to do this on the cheap.. I do not know why we dont except that the big oil companies have their corporate hands in the government (strings on the politicians) Rambeling on..... other break throughs have been burned at the stake also... MOOSE On Sat, 03 Sep 2005 13:55:46 GMT, "Edwin Pawlowski" > wrote: > >"Michel Boucher" > wrote in message 2... >> "Edwin Pawlowski" > wrote in >> : >> >>> >>> "Michel Boucher" > wrote in message >>>> >>>> If possible switch to a non fossil-fuel based heat source >>>> (electricity, biomass...) >>> >>> The majority of electricity in this country is fossil fuel >>> generated. >> >> Hence the qualifier "non-fossil fuel based heat source". Sheesh. > > >Does not read that way to me. I understand biomass, but the way it is >written it is not clear. Putting them together in parentheses makes them >look like they are both non-fossil based. > |
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On Sat, 03 Sep 2005 14:02:19 -0500, OmManiPadmeOmelet
> wrote: >In article >, > "Edwin Pawlowski" > wrote: YES YES YES, I saw this beast in a dream a few years ago... look for hydrogen conversion technology in 10 years that will blow your mind today.,.. BUL:L not full of it THE Moose > >> "Michel Boucher" > wrote in message >> > >> > If possible switch to a non fossil-fuel based heat source >> > (electricity, biomass...) >> >> The majority of electricity in this country is fossil fuel generated. The >> tree huggers are fighting nuclear, wind farms and other alternative methods. >> Solar, however, should be pushed much more. >> >> > >Convection generators are going to be even better. >More bang for the buck. Australia has one in the works and more might be >erected later if that one works as expected: > >http://www.wired.com/news/technology...,54917,00.html > >Let's pray this pans out. :-) >Free electricity except for initial outlay and upkeep! |
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"bull moose" > wrote in message > The gas is high because of the mergers of oil giants.. no simple way > to fix it till the democrats get back into office to fix the greed... > > sign me > > republican who knows... Yeah, there are no greedy Democrats. |
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Bob wrote: > Squeaks wrote: > > > What I absolutely Do Not Get is, that the gas stations had their > > big-assed tanks full of gas on, say, Monday, which are still full of > > the same gas on, say, Friday, and they jack the price up with the same > > gas in their tanks that they had on Monday? > > > > Someone puhleeze educate me on how the gas I bought on Monday at > > $3.05.9 was $3.25.09 today? (This is SoCal - the home of the USA's > > highest gas prices, for reasons that escape me - insofar as we have > > *4* count 'em, *4* refineries in SoCal.), > > The gas in those tanks is being sold at a rate commensurate with at least > these two figures (though there are probably other things taken into > consideration): > > 1. What it will cost to fill those big-assed tanks when all the gas in them > has been sold. > > 2. What people are willing to pay for gas. > > > In this case, since the gas station owner will have to spend more to fill > his tanks, he has to charge more NOW so that he'll be able to afford it. The stupid **** knows not of what she speaks, So. CA has some of the nation's *lowest* gas prices... most states have no refinery, many not for a thousand miles and more. Noo Joisy is probably about an equal, but except for a couple three bridges CA also has no toll booths... mile for mile So. CA is probably the least expensive place to drive on the planet. Sheldon |
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"maxine in ri" > wrote in message > Just got my "budget plan", up over 30% from last year. You did good, mine is up 48% to 2.359. At the time I thought I was getting screwed, but today the price is already 2.40. > And I cannot take a bus or bike to work, or even carpool, since none > of my coworkers live in my area or keep my hours. Same here. -- Ed http://pages.cthome.net/edhome/ |
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In article >,
"Edwin Pawlowski" > wrote: > "maxine in ri" > wrote in message > > > Just got my "budget plan", up over 30% from last year. > > You did good, mine is up 48% to 2.359. At the time I thought I was getting > screwed, but today the price is already 2.40. > > > And I cannot take a bus or bike to work, or even carpool, since none > > of my coworkers live in my area or keep my hours. > > Same here. Geez. Where are you? Here it's up about 80% This time last year it was about $1.69. Now it's $2.89 to $2.98 Central Texas... -- Om. "My mother never saw the irony in calling me a son-of-a-bitch." -Jack Nicholson |
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"Michel Boucher" > wrote in message ... > > Electricity can be hydro generated, in fact is. No requirement to > use fossil fuels there. It can be generated by wind, tides, > hydrogen, solar... The current fixation on fossil fuels shows a > definite lack of imagination. However, to imagine that all or even the majority of North American electricity requirements can be generated via the above methods at any point in the near future is not realistic. Hydrogen, especially - hydrogen is best seen not as a primary fuel source for generating electricity, but rather as a means of storing energy for mobile uses (e.g., hydrogen fuel cell cars, etc.). Even there, though, it's not yet an especially efficient means of energy storage; to come anywhere close to matching the energy storage of, say, gasoline, on either a per-unit-volume or per-unit-mass basis, requires hydrogen at truly scary pressures, and that requires costly on-board tanks as well. Then there's the inherent inefficiencies of hydrogen production (not to mention distribution and storage) at the present state of the art. These problems *may* be solvable, but not without considerable time and effort. Hydrogen can be produced through the electrolysis of water, although note that that process itself requires more electrical energy than you'll ever be able to generate from the hydrogen which results, there being no such thing as a free lunch. However, MOST hydrogen we produce currently - by far! - is made through the conversion of natural gas, and this is also not an especially efficient process. Bob M. |
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On Sun 04 Sep 2005 10:25:23p, Bob Myers wrote in rec.food.cooking:
> > "bull moose" > wrote in message > ... >> I saw this beast in a dream a few years ago... look for hydrogen >> conversion technology in 10 years that will blow your mind today.,.. > > Using what material as the source of the hydrogen? > > Bob M. Flatulence? -- Wayne Boatwright *¿* ____________________________________________ My doctor told me to stop having intimate dinners for four, unless there are three other people. |
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"bull moose" > wrote in message ... > there are ways to do this on the cheap.. I do not know why we dont > except that the big oil companies have their corporate hands in the > government (strings on the politicians) 1. Figure out how much alcohol (of your choice, but ethanol probably works as well as any) is required to provide an equal amount of energy as is provided through the burning of a gallon of gasoline. 2. Figure out how much gasoline is presently consumed in North America alone. If you like, reduce that number by, say, 20%, if we can assume some rather heroic conservation. 3. Multiply the resulting total by the factor obtained in step #1. 4. Now figure how much of the original bio-sourced input material (I think you mentioned sugar cane, but you can also consider such things as corn, etc., if you can figure out the sugar content of each) will be required to produce this much alcohol. 5. Compare the result to the total production of the crop in question for the time frame assumed for the consumption figure used in #2. There's nothing like a good back-of-the-envelope calculation, ANY time, to inject a little reality into a discussion... Bob M. |
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"bull moose" > wrote in message ... > I saw this beast in a dream a few years ago... look for hydrogen > conversion technology in 10 years that will blow your mind today.,.. Using what material as the source of the hydrogen? Bob M. |
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"Wayne Boatwright" > wrote in message ... > On Sun 04 Sep 2005 10:25:23p, Bob Myers wrote in rec.food.cooking: > >> >> "bull moose" > wrote in message >> ... >>> I saw this beast in a dream a few years ago... look for hydrogen >>> conversion technology in 10 years that will blow your mind today.,.. >> >> Using what material as the source of the hydrogen? >> >> Bob M. > > Flatulence? LOL |
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